The Dismissed Federal Cases Against Trump Involved Substantial Evidence of Serious Misconduct
In response to charges that he illegally interfered with the 2020 election and improperly retained presidential records, Trump insisted that he was entitled to do whatever he wanted based on preposterous claims.

Special Counsel Jack Smith this week moved to dismiss the criminal charges against President-elect Donald Trump in two federal cases based on his alleged interference in the 2020 election and his retention of classified documents after leaving office in 2021. That step is consistent with the Justice Department's longstanding policy against prosecuting sitting presidents. Even without that policy, the Justice Department under Trump surely would have put a swift end to the cases.
As Trump tells it, these cases were politically motivated attempts to prevent his election to a second term, epitomizing the "weaponization of government" that he and his supporters frequently decry. But unlike the New York criminal case against Trump, which resulted in 34 felony convictions based on an iffy legal theory aimed at punishing him for his hush payment to porn star Stormy Daniels, the indictments that Smith obtained alleged serious misconduct that plausibly violated several federal laws.
When the Supreme Court approved broad presidential immunity from criminal prosecution for "official acts" last July, it nixed some parts of the original election interference indictment. In particular, the Court's ruling in Trump v. United States said Trump's communications with the Justice Department, which he pressured to validate his stolen-election fantasy by announcing an investigation of his baseless fraud claims, could not be grounds for criminal liability. But the decision left open the possibility that Trump could be prosecuted based on other actions that he arguably took as a candidate rather than in his official capacity as president.
In a separate decision that did not directly involve Trump, the Supreme Court cast doubt on the viability of charging him with obstructing an official proceeding by plotting to interfere with the congressional ratification of Joe Biden's victory. According to the Court's June 28 ruling in Fischer v. United States, which involved a Capitol rioter who faced the same charge under 18 USC 1512(c)(2), proving a violation of that statute requires "establish[ing] that the defendant impaired the availability or integrity for use in an official proceeding of records, documents, objects," or "other things used in the proceeding, or attempted to do so."
That decision did not necessarily preclude the Section 1512(c)(2) charge against Trump. As University of Richmond law professor Riley Keenan noted at the time, "the obstruction charge against him is based in part on the allegation that he organized slates of electors to certify false election results to Congress," which "may amount to impairing the integrity of the evidence used in the certification proceedings."
The superseding indictment that Smith filed on August 27 still included the Section 1512(c)(2) charge, along with a conspiracy charge based on the same statute. And it still included the two additional conspiracy charges listed in the original indictment: conspiracy to defraud the United States under 18 USC 371 and conspiracy to deprive Americans of their voting rights under 18 USC 241. The new indictment sought to comply with the Supreme Court's presidential immunity ruling by emphasizing the private character of actions that Trump took after the election, including his recruitment of "alternate electors," his persistent pressure on Vice President Mike Pence to recognize those electors and/or reject Biden's, and his attempts to enlist state officials in his cause.
Those efforts, Smith argued, went beyond Trump's official duties and aimed to illegally keep him in power after he lost reelection. According to Smith, Trump knew he had lost, which meant he acted with criminal intent by trying to reverse that outcome. According to Trump's lawyers, he genuinely believed that systematic election fraud had deprived him of his rightful victory and that he was pursuing legitimate remedies for that injustice. In doing so, they said, he was acting in his official capacity by trying to ensure the integrity of federal elections.
These dueling interpretations hinged on Trump's knowledge and intent. But if prosecutors could muster enough evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump knowingly pressed false fraud claims in an attempt to stop Biden from taking office and that he plotted with others to achieve that illegal result, they could have satisfied the elements of the conspiracy charges.
As for the case involving Trump's handling of classified documents, we may never know whether his retention of that material actually endangered national security. But it is clear that he took thousands of government documents, including more than 300 marked as classified, when he left the White House. It is also clear that he resisted attempts to recover those documents, culminating in what looks like deliberate defiance of a federal subpoena. Smith also alleged that Trump sought to conceal his continued retention of sensitive material by instructing subordinates to move documents in and out of a storage room at Mar-a-Lago and to erase surveillance camera footage of those evasive maneuvers.
Trump viewed those documents as his personal property. But under the Presidential Records Act, which says "the United States shall reserve and retain complete ownership, possession, and control of Presidential records," they belonged in the National Archives. And although that statute does not prescribe any criminal penalties, 18 USC 793(e) does.
The latter statute applies to someone who has "unauthorized possession" of "information relating to the national defense" and "willfully retains" it when he "has reason to believe" it "could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation." According to the indictment, which lists 32 records containing national defense information that Trump kept, he "did willfully retain the documents and fail to deliver them to the officer and employee of the United States entitled to receive them."
Trump averred that he declassified the documents listed in the indictment while he was still president—perhaps via a "standing order" that was news to his staff, perhaps just "by thinking about it," or perhaps by the very act of taking the records to Mar-a-Lago. Whatever you make of those claims, they were irrelevant under Section 793(e) because the definition of national defense information does not hinge on a document's classification status.
Classification likewise had nothing to do with the charges that Trump concealed records "with the intent to impede, obstruct, or influence" a federal investigation, in violation of 18 USC 1519; that he "knowingly and willfully" concealed material facts, in violation of 18 USC 1001(a)(1); and that he "knowingly and willfully" made false statements, in violation of 18 USC 1001(a)(2). Nor was Trump's supposed declassification of the purloined documents relevant to the charges that he induced another person to withhold records from "an official proceeding," in violation of 18 USC 1512(b)(2)(A), and that he concealed records "with the intent to impair [their] availability for use in an official proceeding," in violation of 18 USC 1512(c)(1).
When the original indictment was unsealed in June 2023, Bill Barr, Trump's former attorney general, called it a "very, very damning" description of "reckless conduct." Barr deemed the evidence against Trump "very strong," noting that much of it "comes from his own lawyers." A superseding indictment unveiled the following month made that "very strong" case even stronger, adding the allegation that Trump tried to cover up his cover-up by telling a subordinate to erase incriminating video evidence.
Trump, in short, took a bunch of stuff that did not belong to him, returned it only grudgingly and partially, failed to comply with a federal subpoena seeking the rest, and allegedly connived and lied to cover up his defiance. Leaving aside any potential national security implications, this is the sort of lawless behavior for which people are routinely punished.
In both of these cases, Trump insisted he had done nothing wrong or illegal. But that position was grounded in his conviction that he was entitled to do whatever he wanted based on preposterous claims. We can look forward to more of the same during the next four years.
Editor's Note: As of February 29, 2024, commenting privileges on reason.com posts are limited to Reason Plus subscribers. Past commenters are grandfathered in for a temporary period. Subscribe here to preserve your ability to comment. Your Reason Plus subscription also gives you an ad-free version of reason.com, along with full access to the digital edition and archives of Reason magazine. We request that comments be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment and ban commenters for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
Check out the first comment in today’s Roundup.
Goddam motherfucking nailed it! *drops mobile device*
This is the article that should by all rights get Sullum fired even from a fake libertarian magazine.
Why is Reason paying actual Stalinists?
Yeah, I was thinking: "Reason is a libertarian magazine right?.......Right??" Since when do we entertain articles from authors that promote prosecution of victimless crimes?
How is theft a victimless crime?
How do TDS-addled shit-piles ever learn to type?
Actually, Reason was founded as an ATHEIST magazine, and I have seen little evidence it has ever been libertarian.
The Venn diagrams overlap almost perfectly. The Venn diagrams for mystical bigots and National Socialism overlap no less perfectly. Hitler is an embarrassment to "Christians," and they struggle to evade his evocations of Jesus, Faith and Providence in 9-10th of his speeches and Mein Kampf. So an industry sprang up seeking by lies and repetition to get folks to pay no attention to Hitler, Mussolini and Franco's constant pandering to superstitious bigotry. But really, who else but angry dupes would have them or Trump?
Unlike you, Reason doesn't wake up and go to sleep with Trump's dick in their mouths. I know it's a shock, but yes, your Messiah isn't infallible.
I know right?!
It’s much better to have your tongue up the establishments asshole.
""your Messiah isn’t infallible""
This is part of the reason why the dems lost.
No one believes Trump is the Messiah. It's wording used to demean someone because they support Trump. Dems thought they could just play the hate against Trump card and win.
It’s wording used to demean someone because they support Trump.
Not even support, just don’t seethe with rabid animus over.
Bondi, 2A-wise, is a lukewarm-at-best choice. But she wasn’t his first choice, Gaetz was, but Gaetz was a bit of a 2A non-entity so it’s a bit hard to compare them but, definitively, a Messiah would’ve parted the seas, absolved sins, and gotten Gaetz appointed. All of the above are light years better than Merrick “Spying on parents at PTA meetings.” Garland. Your average ambulance chaser generally has more ethics, or at least awareness of them, than Merrick Garland.
This is the type of material that keeps him working there. You think he likes writing this shit?
Bob and the rest of the cross-dressing Trumpanzee and Jesus Caucus infiltrators use the oldest trick in the book. American ku-kluxers and nazis were infiltated by federal agents acting nazier than thou. Looter states spend fortunes on narcs and spies to infiltrate anyone less than currishly fawning in the laps of their case officers. Small surprise then that masked ignorant bigots strut here as "real" libertarians convincing all that LACK of force-initiating coercion is the "real" problem. It's the social pressure gang trying to stamp out dissent like in the Solomon Asch experiment.
you are the pumpkin pie of the Thanksgiving dinner Reason left for us today. thanks! have a lovely weekend all.
The serious misconduct was by Jack Smith and other prosecutors. Fuck off sullum.
The cancers flat out said they would drop all charges if Trump dropped out of the race.
It was 100% politically motivated.
The fbi Al's said they stashed the photos
Sullum, you retard self can’t die soon enough
Jack Smith tried criminalized speech. His entire case was based on what Trump believed. So many abnormal filings.
Sullum still isn’t aware Jack Smith got lambasted at the USSC 0-8 for his abuses against mcdonnel. Prosecutorial abuses against John Edward’s and Tom Delay.
He is everything wrong with peosecutorial abuses. JS can never be against prosecutors again.
You're absolutely right!
Which "cancers" said federal charges would be dropped if Trump left the race? Not Merrick Garland, not Jack Smith -- you know, the people with the authority to drop charges. And if you think J6 or classified docs charges were "politically motivated," you simply were not watching. Notice too that hundreds of people other than Trump, NOT candidates for office, from lawyers to self-appointed foot soldiers, were also charged. Where's the political motivation there? Trump called his volunteer goons to Washington on J6; Trump told them "we're marching on the Capitol." When informed that many were armed, Trump replied "so what, they're not coming for me." Then he continued watching on TV for hours after pleas from inside and outside the WH that he call off the dogs. If you don't charge conduct like that, you are a derelict prosecutor.
Is it possible to be less accurate in a single post than this?
Hint: Imprisoning a bunch of people does not make it a "non-political" prosecution. Stalin imprisoned thousands. All political. Biden and Garland are in lovely company.
True believer? Retarded?
Fuckhead, none of them were armed dipshit. Stop fucking lying. When you're whole post is lies, we know exactly what you are. A fucking partisan troll and a not very bright one at that.
It's amazing isn't it, in this great information era, we have even less reliable information than ever in some cases. If you read the narrative from the Left about the Jan 6 riots, it reads like an armed insurrection by hundreds stormed the capitol, held senators hostage and some people were killed (or "there were deaths").
If you listen to the narrative on the Right about the Jan 6 "riots," it sounds like a small group of concerned citizens, unarmed, that were concerned about election tampering and wanted a tour of the capitol to watch the process in action. One story had capitol security escorting them inside. The single death was attributed to one of the capitol police having a heart attack. Tragic to be sure, but its unlikely you could fully blame the "stress of the riot" as the sole cause (you might as well name Dominoes as a co-defendant. I'm guessing here; don't get me wrong, I love pizza.)
So which is it? The Left's version? The Right's version? Something in-between? Neither version seems very specific on the details of what happened. Armed? With what exactly? How many guns? How many total people? Exactly what were they trying to accomplish? What caused them to leave? When you look at some of the other actual "riots" around the same time, they only left when scores of police were called in; and in the case of BLM in some cities, not even then but instead put up barricades and finally left when they got tired lol.
The "evidence" tying Trump to this ambiguous "insurrection" is even more tenuous. A general statement doubting the legitimacy of the vote count hardly counts as a call to overthrow the government. Yes he may have said something more specific, however no matter how he phrased it exactly, if he said "use any means necessary", that could still be taken to mean "any legal means necessary", such as looking into shady voting practice, or demanding a recount. The Dems came out of this looking bad, to the American public in general, IMHO. That started on Jan 7th, when it apparently became a crime to even question the legitimacy of the vote count. You mean it's even illegal to suggest that there could have been voter fraud?? Gee, how the hell do you go about reporting a crime if it's a crime to do the reporting? But instead of embracing logic, the Dems doubled down and kept piling stack and stacks on their already impressive pile of steaming dog doo. Appointing "special prosecutor" Jack Sparrow..I mean Smith (who the hell was he again?) to really stretch and twist obscure financial laws into something to use as a noose to entrap Trump; laws that had never been used in this way before. Nah, not politically motivated at all lol. To me (and I find I'm usually in agreement with the most Americans) I suspect it's the case this time; that this dog & pony show looked like a bunch of (pardon the pun) trumped up charges, motivated by nothing more than wanting to keep the orange man out of the WH next election cycle. Almost worked too, if it weren't for those blasted meddling kid.. No wait, wrong cartoon. 🙂
Seriously, the Left really shot themselves in the foot on this one. I'm still amazed at the outcome. I'm amazed that the Right would nominate & run Trump. I'm amazed the Left would run Harris. I ask now, as I have for the last few elections; You mean these two are the absolute best the two major parties could find in the whole United States, to be the next president?? Seriously? Geez. I could almost see a Libertarian candidate winning. Now that Would be a good thing.
You mean these two are the absolute best the two major parties could find in the whole United States, to be the next president??
Don’t think for a minute the RNC wanted to run Trump, they had no choice due to his popularity. As some very prominent leaders of their party with their impeachment BS had to find out the hard way.
Shit, a serious argument could be made that Kamala running was just Biden’s FU to the DNC and their soft coup. Anybody heard from the Obama’s and Kamala lately? Not that much is happening in the world.
Geez. I could almost see a Libertarian candidate winning
Chase Oliver would beg to differ. Yeah, you could say the LP own goaled with that clever choice, no one to blame but themselves.
""Anybody heard from the Obama’s and Kamala lately?""
Perhaps Harris is taking a page from Hillary and working on a book to talk about how it's everyone else's fault.
The single death was attributed to one of the capitol police having a heart attack. Tragic to be sure, but its unlikely you could fully blame the “stress of the riot” as the sole cause (you might as well name Dominoes as a co-defendant.
While some on the have marginalized the Jan 6 riot at the Capitol, those who have chosen to exaggerate its significance are far more guilty of making it into something it never was. Case in point, the confusion about the police officer, Brian Sicknick, who fell victim to a stroke the following day, not during or even immediately following the riot. It was misreported so many times that I can hardly blame people for getting wrong. Many people still believe he was killed by bashing in his head with a fire extinguisher.
They did more than shoot themselves in the foot. They got caught in outright lies, contradicted by copious amounts of video footage. Then they put on the dog and pony show in Congress and followed that by prosecuting hundreds of people who did not participate in any violence.
It's the same false premise "BOWF SIDEZ!" bullshit just moderated slightly in order to give the impression of being slightly less retarded, while packing in the same or more retardation.
Nobody anywhere "on the Right" said it was just a tour group of concerned citizens that just wanted to witness the certification first hand. Nobody denies Buffalo Hat Man, nobody denies 'feet on desks', nobody denies that they wanted to stop the certification of the EC votes. The "tour" aspect is only invoked inasmuch as Lt. Byrd was exceptional and many officers had no direct or indirect fear of anyone involved, much less fear motivating deadly force.
He tells The Left's narrative relatively straight; allegations of armed citizens, allegations of beatings by rioters, allegations of statesmen fleeing for their lives, or being holed up while being evacuated, but he has to inject his own retardation into a narrative that no one on The Right held in order to make it seem like BOWF SIDEZ!
This idiocy feels very sarcasmic.
Looky. Musk finally put a Trumpanzee fanboy AI on Xitter!
"Notice too that hundreds of people other than Trump, NOT candidates for office, from lawyers to self-appointed foot soldiers, were also charged. Where’s the political motivation there?"
Running up the numbers?
What did the Democrats actually prove in their Jan 6 impeachment hearing? That it was bad? I don't remember any smoking gun evidence, just a lot of "Look, and then something bad happened! And the, another bad thing happened! Insurrection!"
Why didn't ANYONE point out that all the Democrats so-called evidence was modified? They literally added a soundtrack to silent CCTV footage (the Capitol CCTV cameras don't have microphones), the professional TV producer they hired to 'doctor' the evidence added that...
Exactly right on every point. Best summary yet (which likely means forever) on the key issues.
At least JS has the act blue fans still.
FOAD, TDS-addled steaming pile of shit.
Uhm, you just posted lies above so forgive me if I doubt your propensity for identifying facts.
It's probably Sullum samefagging his own article. Whenever a little used account suddenly comes and starts plumping for the article you know something is up.
You can tell he was guilty because they dropped the case.
Good lord each writer has their own "beat" that they are irritating at best about it seems.
I anxiously await the next interesting Sullum piece. Only been 4 or so years.
They tried every dirty trick to stop him and they didn't work too, bad bitches.
For far too long Democrats tried to beat Trump by saying how bad Trump was, but the public wasn't buying it, and now we know Democrats didn't mean it - you have 2 hour meetings with Hitler to discus how you are going to put Hitler in power. You don't come out after losing an election to Hitler, the man you swore was going to rip up the constitution and shoot his political opponents in the street, and calmly tell your supporters "everything will be alright" before getting on a plane and heading off to an island vacation.
Democrats only beat Trump in 2020 by convincing America if someone else were President during Covid, 1.6 million people wouldn't have died.
Boot licker Jacob is back in action.
Sucking up to the government is what makes one a libertarian, it seems.
Only a certain flavor of government (mostly collectivist authoritarianism managed by global elitist oligarchs).
What is in the indictment is the unvarnished truth right? Not some biased summary of the facts with a few unimportant details left out.
I mean why even have a trial? We have an indictment!!!!
Sarc says if you get arrested that means you are guilty.
Except when CPS gets called on you or you are an illegal alien.
Don't forget federal worker. Even firing them is wrong.
Even if they look like a cop?*
* The piece of shit that shot and killed Ashli Babbitt of course not only should have remained employed but also deserved the promotion he received some time thereafter.
The proper remedy for Jan 6th was not criminal prosecution but the impeachment. Nancy Pelosi however sabotaged the trail in the senate by withholding crucial evidence from the House Managers (prosecutors). Pelosi thought that if Trump were not convicted, then he would run amuck in the GOP party and he could face lots of criminal trials. The results, as Pelosi thought would be the dominance of the DEM for the next several election cycles. Pelosi was certain that her Woke DEI agenda would cause all the minorities to vote DEM.
See Unchecked -- the Untold Story Behind Congress's Botched Impeachments of Donald Trump by Bade and Semirhian
Impeachment is a political tool to remove someone from office. It’s not legal or criminal. So impeaching him during his last month on the job makes no sense.
What was the point of impeaching him during his last week in office?
instead of sending in the national guard she sent in her daughter and a film crew for what became a HBO show ... the Pelosi's have never traded on inside information before
Link, please.
Ironic that the Section 1512(c)(2) charge mentioned is somehow used as supporting argument, yet it is exactly what the problem is. That to “get” someone, like Trump, prosecutors can scour the laws for something they can stretch and contort into a “crime”. Also piling on many duplicate charges for the same incident to make it seem like a more serious matter.
I’m no fan of tRump but you have to be skeptical of cases brought by democrats in democrat venues and democrat judges. Especially by those who ran on getting him, somehow, and a zealous prosecutor appointed by democrats.
That said, the documents case is the only one that seems to have merit. However, it is a stretch to consider the circumstances a crime and tRump and his lawyers have a different view that is equally important to consider. The reality is that the case really belongs at the Supreme Court as it does relate to a former president, and a disagreement over valid possession of the documents. Enough of a question and disagreement to where tRump defied the requests of the next Democrat administration.
As for the president having immunity from prosecution for some actions as president, it was a very important question to be resolved. Obama ordered a drone strike on an American citizen and he might be charged with murder if not for the ruling. I use Obama as an example, though I can go back to each President in my lifetime and find some “crime” that was committed with honest intent and as part of the presidential duties.
Do you know what documents the Presidential Archives was looking for? Trumps “sharpie map” and the letter from the North Korean dictator… those were among the vital document the armed assault team that crashed into the former Presidents secret service secured residence looking for.
In that context, isn’t it obvious this was politically motivated?
It is to me and anyone else not brainwashed.
I can't agree on the documents. The Clinton Sock Drawer case from 2012 seems as clear as crystal. When you are the president, you have absolute control of documentation and secrecy. And these physical documents were unquestionably taken when Trump was president.
People quibble about details, but I still haven't seen a valid counterpoint.
I've said all along that until the USSC makes a ruling on the President's powers over classification/declassification Trump didn't do anything illegal. Even after a ruling is made, he's still done nothing illegal. The person who DID commit a crime involving classified documents was Biden. I find it funny how the DOJ stated that they wouldn't prosecute Biden because of his mental state. Didn't the DOJ just come out and say that they won't prosecute a sitting President? Why was it necessary to make the statement about Biden's mental state?
Trump had the ultimate power to classify and declassify documents, but he did not follow the process to do so while he was still President. So I insist he be punished severely, just like Sandy Berger, Hillary Clinton, and Joe Biden.
Of course, those policies and procedures don’t constrain what the sitting President can do, or how he does it. It’s mostly here EOs by previous Presidents, and maybe some rule making by bureaucrats from previous Administrations.
Retaining classified documents...
Here's a couple questions I would like answered:
Where were these documents ACTUALLY found, not where were they photographed? We all know, and DOJ admitted they 'staged' the photos from the raid, so there wasn't a big pile of them on the ballroom floor. They were most likely found in random banker boxes stored all over Trumps FL residence.
Who packed those banker boxes? When you or I move, either we pack our stuff up ourselves, or we hire movers to do it. In Trumps case, GSA workers packed those boxes and moved Trump's possessions out of the Whitehouse.
When the boxes were packed, where were the papers found? The packers packed those boxes inside the whitehouse, while Trump was still President.
As President, did Trump gave the right to have those documents in the residence quarters of the Whitehouse? Of course he did.
Please explain to me why Trump is criminal and Biden, who had classified SCIF-level documents in boxes in his unsecured garage and scattered about his various offices up and down the East coast, including (SCIF) documents he NEVER had authority to possess out side a SCIF, isn't a criminal? Because Biden had dementia? That absolves him of decades of mishandling top secret government documents? Really?
The Trump charges were a fishing expedition - I've never seen proof that Trump in any way 'organized' January 6th... the congressional investigation didn't find any either, they just bullshitted everyone with a dramatic soundtrack attached to the most violent bits of CCTV video they could find, and kept yelling "Orange Man Bad!"
Sarc said it was ok because Biden cooperated.
Biden cooperated after getting caught.
When you catch a bank robber and he hands you back the money stole, that doesn't exonerate the bank robber...
It does if the bank robber is too old and addled to understand what he has done or stand trial.
In that case you just let the guy go and continue to do his job.
Right? I think that's the lesson we are supposed to learn from that.
In that case you just let the guy go and continue to do his job.
Which specifically includes giving Zelenskyy carte blanche to open fire on Russia with US provided missiles, two months before the end of his presidency.
Remember when media laugh boys used to suggest Dubya was so stupid he might sit on “the football” by accident?
I can only hope that Putin has Trump's cell-phone number and there are discussions taking place.
We have no functioning POTUS and Trump has to step in.
Here's the alternative; can you imagine Putin dealing with this basket case?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSn73KbgBG0
I remember when they put forth Kerry as the better educated, more intelligent alternative and it turned out that he went to the same school as W at the same time and had a lower GPA.
The meme around here about no matter how much you despise the media, it's not enough? Yeah, that shit's been going on for the entire 21st century. Always cover for the D, always attack everyone else.
They've just become more naked in their very obvious partisanship. The Obama worship really was insane, but now they're shameless.
Joe also shared classified information with his biography, admitted on tape.
Joe also shared a shower with his daughter.
“When the boxes were packed, where were the papers found? The packers packed those boxes inside the whitehouse, while Trump was still President.”
“As President, did Trump gave the right to have those documents in the residence quarters of the Whitehouse? Of course he did.”
Most, if not all, of the documents were probably never in the Residence Quarters. They came straight out of the Oval Office. The way it apparently worked was that Trump would have a meeting or a phone call. Then, when he was done, his desk would be cleared off into banker’s boxes, that were sealed when full. This allowed him to go onto the next phone call or meeting with a clean desk. Most, if not all, of the (formerly) classified documents were found commingled with other related documents and the like from specific meetings or calls. This is part of why the DOJ/FBI mixing up the contents of the boxes was so critical - shuffling the contents of the boxes was spoliation of evidence. Was it negligent? Or intentional? With this crew from the DOJ and FBI (both groups heavily involved in Crossfire Hurricane, RussiaGate, etc, I would almost guess the latter, but they are skilled enough not to leave a smoking gun. In any case, it would have been interesting to see how Judge Cannon remedied it. Suppression of anything found in any box with jumbled order? Or a jury instruction that the order would have shown that the (formerly) classified documents were stored with the related documents from the same meeting or call? We are highly likely to ever know now. Another takeaway is that neither Trump nor his attorneys knew what were in those boxes until they were unsealed and searched.
js;dr
js; TDS-addled steaming pile of shit.
This is what I don't understand, For all his Trumpish behavior he never was successful in what he was trying to accomplish. Pence didn't fold, the Georgia electors didn't fold. Seems very un-libertarian to me to accuse someone of something based on no harm. OK the guy's an asshole, braggart, whatever you want your readers to think but I am still in the no harm no foul camp.
And remember Clinton and yes, even Barney Frank? Their sexual peccadilloes were excused as private action by the same people who are trying to link payoff money to a campaign donation violation. Good luck.
And BTW I feel that the white house is the people's property and they had every fight to go charging in there and express their disgust with the actions of their government. Do I care that legislators were terrified. Nope.
js;dr.
Why is a never Trumper like Sullum even on Reason's staff? He should be on MSNBC screaming "HITLER!!" Orange Man is flawed but he is vastly preferable to a vacuous empty suit like Harris.
In response to charges that he illegally interfered with the 2020 election and improperly retained presidential records, Trump insisted that he was entitled to do whatever he wanted based on preposterous claims.
I stopped counting at 2 FLAT OUT LIES in that sentence.
“The Dismissed Federal Cases Against Trump… Were Dismissed.”
FTFY.
They could hardly keep up the charade after the voters told them to go straight to Hell with their unequal justice. I guess by that we can safely assume the voters are more libertarian than this supposedly libertarian magazine.
Shit like this article, full of a one sided, snarky, pro-prosecution of politicians you don’t like, extremely unAmerican and unlibertarian, is a exactly why in the first time, I voted for Trump and not the LP candidate. Good job Jacob, you moron. Hope you have room for turkey with all that vitriol and cope you're stuffed with.
Seriously, this article is beyond the pale for this magazine. Just disgusting. Reason pre-2012 would kick the living shit out of Reason 2024 if it could see it.
The libertarian case for politically motivated prosecutions.
This article is not the work of a libertarian. A libertarian writer would be appalled by the existence of the laws that were claimed to be broken. They would write about their misuse, not analyze how they can be interpreted to jail an enemy of the state.
Consider the alleged evils and how they can be used against libertarians:
"...persistent pressure on Vice President Mike Pence...." (Exercise of free speech, since the "pressure" was rebutted by Pence simply exercising his speech by saying "No".)
"...knowingly pressed false fraud claims...." (Exercise of free speech again, which is proven by the fact that they were, as Sullum notes, just "claims" that many others could weigh and accept or reject. If this was a crime, why would it not be a crime by any other citizen?)
"...knowingly pressed false fraud claims in an attempt to stop Biden from taking office and that he plotted with others to achieve that illegal result...." (This is a circular argument: the thing that allegedly makes the result illegal is the alleged "false fraud claims". On one decision branch the people who must judge the claims are not convinced, so no "illegal" result transpires. On the other branch the judging people weigh the claims and any evidence on their own and are convinced. Both decision branches flow through a process whose final product is considered "legal" by definition of the process. Whether the proponent of the claim knows it is false is expected, by design, to be ignored by the process. And it was the legal and political process Trump was acting within - he employed lawyers and advisors, not police or military, toward his desired goal. Same as available to any citizen, whose mere employ is not considered subversive or illegal.)
"...this is the sort of lawless behavior for which people are routinely punished."
(Vice President Biden wasn't, among others.)
"...his conviction that he was entitled to do whatever he wanted based on preposterous claims. We can look forward to more of the same during the next four years." (As a pragmatic anarchist I look forward to any and all use and abuse of his presidential power in chopping away at the state.)
"This article is not the work of a libertarian..."
BOOM!
"A libertarian writer would be appalled by the existence of the laws that were claimed to be broken..."
BOOM!
"They would write about their misuse, not analyze how they can be interpreted to jail an enemy of the state."
BOOM!!! BOOM!!!
Dead on target on all counts! Bravo!
I sullumly swear you are correct.
Ironically in regards to hunter gun charges, sullum literally wrote about how the law was bad. He has different standards for different parties.
Meh. The 2020 elector thing never went beyond talk.
And the documents thing is something every president has done. Biden too, but he was cleared because he is old and confused.
It's kinda silly to think that one day a president can have access to documents, then the nextday, no more access to them and it's illegal.
I mean, if they were current records, he should have no new access, but they were old stuff
And the documents thing is something every president has done. Biden too, but he was cleared because he is old and confused.
Well, no.
Biden took the documents when he was a senator and VP --when he had no right to take anything, when he could declassify nothing.
Biden was cleared because he's a Democrat because what he did was an actual crime.
What Trump did was not.
It’s kinda silly to think that one day a president can have access to documents, then the nextday, no more access to them and it’s illegal.
Kinda like, you know an actual investigation of an actual crime, I understand an investigation if you apprehend some foreign national with secret documents stuffed down their pants and the only way they could've gotten ahold of them was if an ex-president was handing them out or sloppy with keeping them. But they overtly and deliberately played this bullshit game backwards (you'll have to tell us what's in the documents before we can tell you who we think is guilty of having that information) in public.
Trump's actions were payback for preposterous claims against him.
https://reason.com/2023/05/16/for-6-5-million-durham-report-finds-fbi-didnt-have-solid-dirt-on-trump-and-russia/
Surely you have heard of the concept of payback.
The people who created and promoted the Trump:Russia collusion and prosecution would never launch a politically motivated federal case against Trump.
Of course they would. The documents case was orchestrated and initiated by Jay Bratt, deputy special counsel and the DOJ’s Counterintelligence and Export Control Branch (CECB) chief. They, and their sister organization, the FBI’s Counterintelligence Division (CD) were the organizations that lied on each of the four FISA warrant applications to get FISA warrants on Carter Page, who turned out to be a CIA asset, and not a Russian spy. They forced LTG Flynn to resign as NSA, through A § 1001 perjury trap (despite the DOJ knowing that the relevant document was not material, because the FBI agents involved had (illegal) copies of transcript of the call between Flynn and the Russian Ambassador, as well as by criminalizing FARA. and initiated the Midyear (Trump/Russia) investigation and, yes, the MAL raid was run by people from the FBI’s CD.
In cooperation with a "5 eyes" partner, Australia.
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/timeline-how-australia-was-dragged-into-the-trump-russia-probes-20191001-p52whk.html
""26 April 2016
Related Article
Alexander Downer is Australia's high commissioner to the UK.
'Romantic encounter' set off Australia's role in triggering Donald Trump investigation
Joseph Mifsud, an academic with links to the Russian government, meets George Papadopoulos, one of Trump's foreign policy advisers. Mifsud says the Russians have "dirt" on Hillary Clinton in "thousands of emails"."'
If asking Russians for dirt on a political opponent is wrong, what does that say about the Steele dossier?
Sullum seems to be a sort of token employed by Reason to ... what? Wind up the readers? Offer counterpoint. He's predictably silly - consistently silly.
He is a DEI hire, he suck lots of government cock. His pronouns are bent/over.
Yawn. Another masked sockpuppet belching up caudillo scripts to undermine the Reason reporter with the most integrity. None of these simians criticize National Socialist infiltrators like the Lizard, Zach and Jesus Girl. By their lights licking the whiting off of Trump's golf shoes is the sign of a true libertarian--that and voring to enslave pregnant women.
This is a brilliant summation by Jacob Sullum. Perhaps for his next in-depth expose, he could prove, once and for all, how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.
One has to suspend disbelief, and any semblance of intelligence, to conclude that any of this horseshit is about the law and the constitution, and not about banana republic politics. Do you know the difference between how Nicholas Maduro, Vladamir Putin and Joe Biden practice politics? Neither do I.
The confirmation process of the electoral vote is not a ceremonial photo op. It is the last, final means to assure that the elections were legit. Trump is not the first to challenge, not by a longshot. That people believe that Trump did something illegal or unconstitutional is a testament to progressive brainwashing.
https://individualistsunite.substack.com/p/the-myth-of-honest-elections?r=z324w
Jacob, it’s over. You are taking too long to leave the party. Say good-night. See you in four years.
Reason, please put the comment box at the top. I like reading comments but not ALL of the comments. Thanks
Sullum, fuck off and die. You lost, loser, as you are a pathetic, TDS-addled steaming pile of lying shit.
Again, fuck off and die, asshole.
Seems TDS is not a treatable condition, sorry boot licker jacob.
ANOTHER tranny for Trump?
You can feel the intolerance and hate in boot licker jacobs words.
JS;dr
Jacob Sullum even you know if you are being honest, that the legal proceedings were politically motivated. If there was a single case, you might have an argument, but we have repeated cases that have rather similar situations where the opposition to Trump was not charged. In addition to the "coincidences", most of these cases are using brand new or never used legal arguments.
The reality, regardless if you like Trump or hate Trump is the legal system was weaponized. While I really don't like Trump, he isn't the threat to democracy or our republic, but rather the people who weaponized the legal system are the threat.
I fully expect that Trump will be the same mediocre president he was in his first term and the corporate media and apparently Jacob Sullum will continue to be detached from reality and exhibit their derangement.
Like I said, I really don't like Trump, but he's not the existential evil that they portray him to be and they present more of a threat with their wiliness to stoop the depths of the gutter with all the dirty tricks and lies. Trump is just a narcissistic loud mouth which is not uncommon among our political leaders from both parties.
A bit off topic, but still:
Suppose I were awaiting sentencing for a conviction (never mind the validity of the conviction), and suppose I had lined up a new job. Suppose I went to the court and asked the sentencing to be indefinitely deferred because it would interfere with my new job.
What do you suppose the court would have said?
Was your old job a fry cook at McDonald’s?
never mind the validity of the conviction
Fuck that. That's the issue here.
An elected position is not just a "job". The will of the People supercedes a ruling by a judge.
The will of the People supercedes a ruling by a judge.
To say nothing of the will of a politically and unethically motivated prosecutor.
Suppose I went to the court and asked the sentencing to be indefinitely deferred because it would interfere with my new job.
You are not making the point you think you are.
The "new job" in this case entailed a plurality of the national electorate voting for a man convicted by a group of 12 in a venue specifically selected as the most likely to reach that verdict. The biggest jury in the history of the country convened and nullified the verdict. The court has no choice but to acknowledge that.
^+1
"...(never mind the validity of the conviction)..."
You.
Are.
Full.
Of.
Shit.
The law says whatever you can get a court to say it says. Ask your self this: How many German judges indicted Adolf for invasion or genocide BEFORE April 1945?
If true, so what ??? Are you admitting it was a fishing expedition?
WE don't allow that under the Constititution. Else Pelosio and Hillary would be in jail
alternate electors are legal and been done before.
Bussing people to protest is legal and done by every politician.
Having document stored in house that national archives told him to take, entrapment.
Talking to lawyers about legal means is legal and not a conspiracy.
Note many J6 protesters were charged with conspiracy on the grounds they texted friends to go and protest. thats not conspiracy or illegal its a right to assemble
Sullum, charges were brought therefore he is guilty
charges are not proof of guilt and there was nothing in teh charges that showed proof of guilt only allegations that needed to be proven. lets not forget that Jack Smith was working illegally since he was never authorized as a special counsel, this was already determined by a court but somehow he was allowed to continue. he was the neighborhood Karen who had no authority
Don't tell Emma or Fiona that. They'll kill themselves with the sudden shock of their complete uselessness.
ATF should know about complete uselessness... Looter thugs hide their identities from Reason for a reason.
FFS. Where's Biden's rope for his detainment of FAR-MORE illegal documents (as VP) scattered around his garage?? Yeah; stupid-TDS dipsh*t. It most definitely was nothing but lawfare stunts.
This is a new low for the delusional and incurious regime cuck Sullum. Mental illness is a feature TDS.
Number 1: There was widespread fraud in the 2020 election and Trump was cheated out of his second term. Trump had every constitutional right to challenge the election results in any state. Number 2: How is it that Trump, who was President and could declassify documents at his discretion, was charged with mishandling of classified documents he stored in a room at Mar-a-Lago, while Biden, who was Vice-President and had no discretionary power to declassify anything, was not charged with anything, even though he had boxes of classified documents sitting in his garage next to his Corvette?
Not Biden's Corvette. The documents were in the trunk of his drug-addicted son's Corvette, in an unguarded garage. That's far more insecure than Trump's house, guarded by the Secret Service. And the only excuse the FBI could think of for not prosecuting Biden is that he's mentally defective now - not when he stole those documents - and unfit to stand trial. And yet according to whatever shadowy un-elected persons are actually running the Democratic party and the Biden administration, he is fit to run our nation. Or perhaps that word should be "ruin"...
Hey, Jakie-Poo. This is toddleresque.
The American people knew that. The American people didn't give a fuck. You can beat this dead horse until you are blue in the face and give yourself a hernia. Its not going to change a damned thing. They voted, and it's done. The man won and, I suspect, he's going to run the board with dismissals.
You can bitch about it. I can bitch about it. We can both not like it. And, guess the fuck what? Its fucking done. Unless you can build a new case we don't have a damned thing to do about it. It's time to grow up and act like adults. Elections have consequences. Welcome to Trump 2.0.
Ban abortion, shoot hippies and latinos over leaves, but at LEAST make electricity and oil legal. Let the Dems observe and learn that helping hostile totalitarians is a non-starter, even if embellished with promises the totalitarians always moot once in power. Let libertarians guard against Jesus Caucus Trumpanzees infiltrating the party and blotching its platform.
I was taught (and shown in examples ) that stupid foolish people in an argument will almost always resort to some fictional tag for opponents Only a moron would feel briliant for capping a poor argument with " Jesus Caucus Trumpanzees"
Christian National Socialist republicans are diluted nazis, just as the looters in the Dem half are diluted communists. All they do is backpedal Hitler, Lenin with George Wallace and Bernie sound-alikes. Nothing bothers these identical looter altruists like libertarian spoiler votes that say no to aggression while toppling some expensive campaign for sinecures and boodle. Gary covering the gap in states casting 127 electoral votes scared them crapless. Hence the Jesus Caucus anschluss after years of schaißtposting by masked zombies posturing to set us straight.
Sorry, but you are a moron.
I will bet that in the whole US not one person self-identifies under all 4 (!!!!!!) of those lablels, which logically leads to the real possibility that you also ignorant about what a NAZI is.
And the word is 'deluded' , not 'diluted' --- you should sue your grammar shcool and high shcool for letting you graduate
Kamala lost because her party still insistes on banning electricity because Misanthropic Climate Sharknado Warmunism. Communism wins if the fascists have no electric power. Her dad being a Liberation Theology communist all over newsprint back in the day only helped the Nazis sell their version of coercive mystical altruism. Outside of altruism totalitarians can only imagine a no-man's strand called democracy in which suckers can be induced to place guns in their hands--as in 1917 Russia and 1933 Germany. That's the role of masked anonymous Orangopoxers here.
So what? True or false either you, reporter, accept the law or you don't. Even under your view, he is innocent until proven guilty and you admit there is no current 'gullty' ruling.