There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics
Plus: A listener question concerning the key to a libertarian future—should we reshape current systems or rely upon technological exits like bitcoin and encryption?
In this week's The Reason Roundtable, editors Matt Welch, Katherine Mangu-Ward, Nick Gillespie, and Peter Suderman delve into U.S. immigration policy, prompted by the recent lifting of Title 42, a dreadful COVID-era hangover that restricted the ability of migrants to seek asylum.
1:51: Title 42 migrant expulsions finally come to an end.
23:50: The Congressional Budget Office's budget outlook projects a federal budget deficit of $1.5 trillion in 2023 alone.
35:05: Weekly Listener Question
45:53: Donald Trump's CNN town hall appearance
49:04: This week's cultural recommendations
Mentioned in this podcast:
"Is Biden Replacing Bad Border Policy With Worse Border Policy?" by Elizabeth Nolan Brown
"Biden Keeps Another Trump Border Policy in Place," by Fiona Harrigan
"The End of Title 42 Expulsions of Migrants—and What Comes Next," by Ilya Somin
"US Regains Pre-Trump, Pre-Pandemic Immigration Levels," by Ilya Somin
"Biden's New Trump-Lite Asylum Policy Proposal," by Ilya Somin
"A Historic Refugee Crisis Miscast As a Border Emergency," by Stuart Anderson
"Biden's Immigration Plan Lays Out a Tougher Border, New Legal Pathway for Some Migrants," by Fiona Harrigan
"How Immigrants Make America Great Again (and Again and Again)," by Nick Gillespie
"How Mass Immigration Stopped American Socialism," by Alex Nowrasteh and Benjamin Powell
"The GOP's Suicide Pact on Immigration," by Nick Gillespie
"The Debt Ceiling Fight Is a Reminder of America's Dire Fiscal Future," by Veronique de Rugy
"Biden Falsely Bragged About Lowering the Budget Deficit. Now, It Is Predictably Rising Again." by Eric Boehm
"The House GOP Debt Ceiling Plan Would Restore Spending Caps. Good." by Eric Boehm
"Vivek Ramaswamy Is Wrong About the National Debt," by Nick Gillespie
"Nobel Prize–Winning Economist: Democrats Are Committed 'To Spending Other People's Money,'" by Nick Gillespie
"Why We Need To Shrink the National Debt, and Fast!" by Nick Gillespie and Mark McDaniel
"CNN Gave Trump a Megaphone, and He Used It Exactly As You'd Expect," by Elizabeth Nolan Brown
Send your questions to roundtable@reason.com. Be sure to include your social media handle and the correct pronunciation of your name.
Today's sponsors:
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- Andrew Heaton is one of the funny people in Reason TV videos, like "Star Trek: The Libertarian Edition" or "Star Wars Libertarian Special." So it won't surprise you to discover he hosts a science fiction podcast: Alienating the Audience. Alienating the Audience does deep dives into science fiction, like Robert Heinlein's free love libertarianism, the economics of Dune, Kurt Vonnegut and the warfare state, and how Star Wars: Andor loves public choice theory. Guests on the show have included Peter Boghossian on what first contact with aliens would be like, Jonathan Last from The Bulwark defending the Empire in Star Wars, Tim Sandefur of Goldwater Institute on Star Trek's Cold War hot takes, and even Katherine Mangu-Ward has joined to discuss the work of Dan Simmons. If you don't like science fiction, do not listen to Alienating the Audience, as there's an excellent chance your virginity will grow back. But if you DO like science fiction, and with a dollop of politics and economics, served fresh by a mid-level comedian, then check out Alienating the Audience wherever you get your podcasts.
Audio production by Ian Keyser; assistant production by Hunt Beaty.
Music: "Angeline," by The Brothers Steve
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It’s indeed shocking that there is no domestic constituency for tens of millions of foreigners swamping the country en masse
Exactly. I grow tired of "immigration" being synonymous with "unfettered border hopping".
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Even plain old immigration. The arguments in support of such a political movement are a hair's breadth away from granting rather full legitimacy to Putin in Ukraine and Hitler in Europe.
Expecting your own national political party in a foreign country is really all kinds of fucked up by libertarian and "MUH DIVURSUHTEE!" standards.
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The problem isn’t middle class hard working immigrants, you know the ones who built the nation of our dreams and memories.
The problem is the rich immigrants adding to the filthy rich here who could care less if the cost of living destroys the middle class and the American dream.
Illegals aren’t immigrants.
They are if the Democrats give them parole.
Which puts the lie to the headline. The party of out-of-control immigration is the Democrats. The GOP is divided. It's anti-Invasion that has no entire party.
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Exactly immigration is a legal process of moving from one country to another. What is happening is a felonious assault on this country. Every person entering illegally is committing a felony according to our laws. Either we are a nation of laws, and enforce those laws, or we are nothing more than an area of chaos. We don’t need a party of immigration, we just need sensible immigration laws that the government enforces. If our current laws are obsolete or lacking, then Congress needs to pass new laws, the President sign them into law, and the government enforce those laws.
It's what the anarchists smuggled into the platform after Gary's 4M votes scared the Shinola outta the Hitler faction of The Kleptocracy. No Borders reversed our previous trickle of growth. Once the Mises Caucus plank calling for stoning women to death in the public square passes, the Grabbers of Pussy can again rest easy. https://bit.ly/3N5f0ua
https://twitter.com/FistedFoucault/status/1657800230929145859?t=97vfXk8eQ4A5GKF26xNgPg&s=19
The two western countries that saw a populist backlash win key votes (USA Trump and UK Brexit) are now seeing the highest rates of migration ever, alongside Canada.
The elites don't fuck around.
Especially Barack Obama. His goal of destroying our constitutional republican and "fundamentally transforming" it into a one-party communist state is closer than ever to being realized.
https://twitter.com/seanmdav/status/1658271476372389888?t=eSGjDN69O2zu0W0pwfunSw&s=19
While news media were digesting the Durham report’s evidence of FBI and DOJ corruption, DOJ knifed the entire criminal investigative team at the IRS handling Hunter Biden’s case.
[Link]
"BREAKING: A Biden administration whistleblower informed Congress today that the “entire investigative team” working on the Hunter Biden case at the IRS was removed from the case today, and that that their removal was specifically requested by DOJ.
Developing…"
Just read this. Absolute corruption.
Yet...no worries about impending fascism and authoritarianism. Weird.
Get rid of the elites.
They're not "elite" anything. A different word is needed to identify those whose heads need to be stuck on pikes.
The Mayor of San Francisco put up signs after the 1906 earthquake: Looters will be Shot.
You people never seem to tire of outrageously overstating your case. The vast majority of "illegal" immigrants living in this country are hard-working christian family people who are much better neighbors than my fellow legal citizens. Illegal aliens are MUCH less likely to commit crimes and they're willing to do jobs that American citizens turn up their noses at, preferring to eat at the public welfare trough the politicians so generously provide at my expense. Go sell your hatred somewhere else! This is America, land of opportunity for the best people from everywhere else in the world.
Why can’t these “hard working Christian people” obey the goddamn law?
Fuck them, and fuck you.
Because the law is idiotic, counterproductive, and designed to protect politicians, union jobs, and "Made in America" flag-waving reactionaries. If you legalized immigration and focused on actual crimes we would all be better off. But instead you're spouting mindless slogans.
What is idiotic is unfettered open borders into a welfare state. But most socialists aren't intelligent so I see why you don't know better.
Just for the record, immigration is, and always has been, legal.
But we aren't talking about immigration, we are talking about criminally crossing a border in violation of those laws.
Pure bullshit! If you're one of the 99,000 people who want to work in the United States after the 1,000 people who entered legally entered the United States, immigration is ILLEGAL for you! Try your lying half-truths on your fellow neanderthals, some us aren't willfully ignorant like you.
So if we let in a million legally, then the 99 million who want to come should be able to?
I yield to your impeccable logic and unimpeachable citations.
Post your address, bootlicker
Why don’t you post your address first pussy.
*Not advocating violence. Just pointing out what a coward Nardz is.
Faggot can’t even come up with an original name. Pathetic.
Bigot can’t even come up with a reply that’s not an insult. Cowardly.
Kill your self, faggot.
You wouldn’t face him. Odds are you would SWAT him, or so,e other chickenshit crap that leftists like to pull. Your kind are the pussies. I’ve never seen one of you that could handle a straight up fight.
So crawl back under your rock, you piece of shit.
I’m not the one advocating killing people like you and Nardz are dummy.
You’re also free to post your address.
Coward
Pot v. Kettle. Reason needs to let individuals with verifiable identities comment, and sent the rest back to Alabama, Saudi Arabia, National Socialist Review and Syria
Sorry, this is the 21st century and we just don't need droves of illiterate peasants who refuse to follow laws.
It makes sense if you’re a billionaire who needs slaves for his resource colony
Yeah! American high schools are already doing that at an impressive rate USA! USA! USA!
Yeah, instead we need droves of highly-educated barristas and Mickey Dee hamburger flippers with bachelors degrees in English literature and gender studies. I can't believe how many Cro Magnons we have commenting on an otherwise interesting website.
That's a statistical trick based on the fact that on average, they simply haven't been in this country nearly as long as US citizens have. Plus, most crimes occur within communities, and when you live in a community residing in the country illegally, you tend to avoid reporting anyone to the police except for the most severe offenses.
If Central Americans were indeed a law-abiding group, then crime rates in Central America would be far lower than here. But the opposite is the case.
So you enjoy having a servile underclass that doesn't get a fair wage? Go sell your hatred somewhere else!
Yes, but it also has finite space and finite resources. And we already take in more legal immigrants every year than any other country in the world. By a wide margin.
"... but it also has finite space and finite resources" which we have never even remotely approached in the history of the United States!
"... we already take in more legal immigrants every year than any other country in the world." Totally irrelevant to the issue. When jobs became temporarily scarce during COVID, illegal immigration dropped - temporarily - to record lows. As far as I know there have NEVER been any shortages of "resources" in the United States for people who are supporting themselves while living here; but if you have some REAL evidence to the contrary, by all means spew it here! If you want to terminate the welfare state with extreme prejudice, you will certainly have my blessing. But don't try to use the welfare state as an excuse for illegalizing immigration.
finite space and finite resources” which we have never even remotely approached in the history of the United States!
Well that will be news to the entire Southwest region of the United States (which happens to get the largest numbers of migrants), with water tables and major reservoirs at historic lows. As of April, Hoover Dam’s water level was at 1,049 feet. The minimum level to generate power is 950 feet. At 895 feet it hits deadpool, which means the river will longer be flowing. And that’s just one example out of many.
No, it's not. The frontier closed over a century ago and we don't need any Guatemalans, etc., diluting our patrimony. If you think your neighbors will be improved by replacing Americans with them feel free to move there.
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There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics
THE
PTALIBERTARIAN PARTY HAS DISBANDED!?The Libertarian Party is a smoking, burnt-out husk of even the marginally functional party it once was. Thanks, Mises Caucus!
Cry harder, homo.
"Ya, why cant libertarians continue to spout off about freedom, and then roll over and just give in to whatever the neoliberal order wants for the vague promise of weed legalization sometime down the road, maybe"
We need more cultural marxism like anti racism and bake the caked in the LP.
Sure, edgelord tweets from the national chair aren’t empty spouting off about freedom.
You aren’t even an interesting moron.
Go jump off a bridge.
How long has it been since a Marxette jumped out of a cake on the head table of a Libertarian inaugural ball?
How dare principles be returned back to the LP.
"Thanks, Mises Caucus!"
This is absurd, and Mike knows it.
Let's note that Mike has in the past said he left the LP many years ago- long before the MC gained control of the party. And while he was off harumphing about how "barely functional" it was, people in the MC were busy doing the hard work- going state by state, identifying like-minded people and electing them. So if he has anyone to thank, perhaps it is himself for abandoning the party he again gives a shit about.
I would truly be curious to understand what it is that the MC did in the short 8 months since assuming power that has rendered it a smoking hudk. They weren't responsible for the catastrophic loss of votes between 2016 and 2020. They weren't responsible for the LP failing to be a strong voice of liberty during the rise of the COVID State. Indeed, it is largely the LP's tepid response to lockdowns and mandates (and the MC's resistance to the same) that gave the Mises Caucus the necessary votes to carry the day.
And see, that is why Mike is really upset. He couldn't explain to us what "burnt out husk" means, because he isn't thinking of any metric around fundraising, membership or votes. No, when he says husk, he means "won't social signal and bleat about things that I care about for my tribe."
The Democratic Party has become uniquely authoritarian, and they are also Mike's tribe. And as much as he may dislike this authoritarian turn, he dislikes people criticizing his tribe far more. So it is much easier for him to shit on the people actually defending liberty, than to reconcile the fact that his tribe has become the baddies.
"The Democratic Party has become uniquely authoritarian, and they are also Mike’s tribe. "
Notice how much he comes around specifically to defend the democrats from attack. Imagine my shock the he hates the MC so much, who like to shit on the left's authoritarianism.
"Take the punches, never fight back" - ideal LP party motto for some around here
“Notice how much he comes around specifically to defend the democrats from attack.”
Umm, if you are talking about me, I “came around” to comment on the Libertarian Party. Nobody was discussing Democrats, but nice try.
I mean you just trashed the current LP party because the MC is making it libertarian.
It’s still far better than your Marxist democrat party.
There is no point in the Libertarian Party continuing as long as the two-party, district-based, winner-takes-all election system continues. Until libertarians succeed in implementing proportional-representation election systems in every state there will be zero chance of changing anything of importance politically.
As an alleged libertarian why aren’t you advocating for the restoration of the constitution instead?
Oh, that’s right, you’re just a lefty fuck.
Your advocacy and $5 will get you a cup of coffee in Seattle. When you can't think, you mouth vulgarities. I fought to restore the Constitution with the Libertarian Party for forty years before I realized it was doomed to fail. But by all means dress up in colonial militia costumes and cosplay your political fantasies instead of doing something that at least has a chance to work. When libertarians are ten percent of Congress and every state legislature, then we can have some impact ... and not until then.
The Libertarian is the no-drug-enforcement party, and that's it.
An open borders immigration policy is generally unpopular with a majority of voters across partisan lines. Even people who are in favor of legal immigration want some control and regularity to immigration policy. Therefore the political parties are incentivized to not say they accept mass immigration as official policy.
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The Democratic party however supports foreign invasion by literally millions of uninvited guests.
The democrat party must be ended.
Clearly, political priorities need to change. First, we gotta give foreigners the vote. Then, they can change immigration policy.
The vote and reparations for having to walk here.
I try to remain civil but with trash people like you spout it's not hard to figure out why liberty has such a bad name. I would gladly exchange you and your ilk for a dozen hard-working "illegal" immigrants any day of the week. You did nothing whatever to earn your seat at the table but you want to keep everyone else from benefiting from what you were handed by someone else's hard work.
Liars like you don’t deserve respect.
When you moving out, communist simp?
Would be wonderful if you took jfree with you.
"Did nothing to earn my seat" other than having been born of legal immigrants who showed up back before the revolution and have fought in every war since. And yes, in the case of the Civil War that means on the side of the North, against slavery.
Eat a bowl of dicks. Like, seriously, go find a facility that performs "gender affirmations" and eat a giant, heaping, bowl of sauteed leftover cocks.
If these people are such a fucking benefit to society then aren't we doing their home countries a disservice by depriving them of their excellence?
You did nothing whatever to earn your seat at the table but you want to keep everyone else from benefiting from what you were handed by someone else’s hard work.
Did you just discover a priori? I feel bad for you learning this lesson late in life.
All Marxists should be cleansed from America. They have no right to exist.
Who is this "we"? I don't "gotta" do anything of the sort.
There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics
You'd think libertarians would at least understand supply and demand. As there's no demand, nobody is going to be dumb enough to attempt to supply it. Libertarians excepted, of course.
I see this is under the heading of Asylum.
Perhaps Reason should talk a little more about why/if they really need asylum and the condition of their countries that produce the need for an exodus.
Living in a poor country?
Can't find employment?
Gangs running the state?
None of these are reasons for asylum.
If you were an interpreter that worked with troops in Afghan or Iraq and the current regime is actively hunting you down. That could be a reason. But they seem to deny many of those.
Why would we want people that are enemies of their own country?
There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics
Yeah pretty much. The two major parties are instead:
Let's restrict immigration, but be mean about it; or
Let's restrict immigration, but with a smile on our faces
You don’t know much about the world do you?
Jeff is literally, not figuratively, cancer.
A tumor rather than a person.
Empty threats from an empty brain.
You afraid he’s going to bombard you with radiation, sissy?
It is actually the Jewish Space Lasers that we should REALLY fear!
/Right-wing Nutters
ChemoJeff sounds like a decent plan, actually. I'm sure he could bear it.
Accurately describing Jeff is not a threat by any definition of the term.
Jeff's continued existence certainly is though.
Did Jeff spin a bearing when he heard that?
Hopefully it'll be a stroke or heart attack next time
You have a lot of anger. I’d recommend seeing a therapist or something. Be prepared for them to tell you the voting fraud nonsense and other crap you constantly bitch about is not true.
Don't learn much from the basement.
"Let’s restrict immigration, but be mean about it; or
Let’s restrict immigration, but with a smile on our faces"
The dentist can tell you "this root canal is going to kind of suck" or gaslight you and tell you "not only is this root canal not going to suck, its going to be great, and actually, its not a root canal at all!"
Sometimes, people need to grow the fuck up and be adults, realizing there are consequences and responsibilities to be taken care of. Instead, we get the politicians that set up sanctuary cities and support unlimited immigration and pretend this is totally fine and will never have consequences...then have a massive meltdown when faced with even the smallest fraction of a consequence from it.
Ill side with the party of adults, some choose to side with the party of magical unicorn fairies.
I see help wanted signs everywhere. Too bad it's illegal to hire illegals.
Please don’t tell us what you’d hire them for.
As of July 2022, Maine's labor force participation rate is 58.8%,
Yeap. No workers in Maine. 100% employed.
we have cities overrun with homeless, who have nowhere to go, and live on public land, sucking up public resources. All of whom actually have the ability to fill those "help wanted" positions. We already have a massive surplus of "people who can do jobs"
Adding a massive influx of people who also dont have homes, or places to go, and dont speak the language surely wont cause any problems. Nope, they surely wont suck up any societal resources that we already dont have enough of for Americans as it is.
Or did those people in NYC, Chicago, etc make it all up? Because they changed their tune from "hey, lets be nice humans and just let them in! They dont cost us anything, they are a net gain! Immigration is good!"...to..."Our social safety net is OVERRUN!!!" about 5 minutes after the tiniest fraction of immigrants that border states see, showed up at their door.
Why do you think they changed their tune so quickly sarc? Its almost like they thought 100% of the consequences would be paid for by someone else (classic socialists) and the bill would never come to them. I for sure believed them that they would be celebrating in the streets, that the help wanted signs would all be taken down, labor market booming, with no cost, in fact, a net GAIN for their economies. Imagine my disappointment to see they sounded like evil icky republicans the second they saw a shoeless Guatemalan.
You would be shocked to learn that sarcs own state is under the strain of illegal immigration costs despite seeing so little of the problem.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/maines-largest-city-strains-under-asylum-seeker-influx-11548601200
More people illegally crossed the southern border last year than there are US citizens in New Mexico. And we're not a wealthy state. Chicago can eat my ass on this topic.
No welfare for invaders.
We already have a massive surplus of “people who can do jobs”
Can? Sure. I suppose. But that doesn't matter if they're uninterested and unwilling.
Great, more welfare bums then.
Odd you advocate for more immigrants at cost instead of advocating for a reduction of the welfare state to get people to work, no?
Your plan exacerbates the issue on one generation. The libertarian plan of lowering the welfare state lasts much longer.
But you again defend the policy of the left.
The dentist can tell you “this root canal is going to kind of suck” or gaslight you and tell you “not only is this root canal not going to suck, its going to be great, and actually, its not a root canal at all!”
But BOTH statements are false. Not every root canal is terrible. Likewise, while root canals are hardly pleasant, they are not "great" either.
It is not true that immigration is uniformly terrible. It is also not true that immigration is uniformly wonderful. Immigrants are people, just like you and me. Some are good people and some are not. They are not all monsters and they are not all saints either.
How about this as a first draft for immigration reform: Anyone who presents him/herself at a port of entry undergoes a health screening and an international criminal background check. If that individual passes both, then the individual gets a work permit to legally have a job in this country. The work permit is not the same as a green card and not the same as naturalization papers. It is just a work permit. That individual can then live in this country and contribute to it without constant fear of deportation, pay taxes, and move freely across the border. No voting since there is no citizenship attached with the work permit. Sound reasonable to you?
It would get rid of all of the bullshit quotas, and it would also get rid of all of the bullshit asylum claims as migrants wouldn't have to try to claim asylum in order to try to bypass the legal immigration system, because the legal process would be so much more streamlined.
Sometimes, people need to grow the fuck up and be adults, realizing there are consequences and responsibilities to be taken care of.
There are consequences to freer migration, but there are also benefits.
Ill side with the party of adults, some choose to side with the party of magical unicorn fairies.
Neither team is "the party of adults". One team behaves as if freer migration will lead to a utopia of diversity. The other team behaves as if freer migration will lead to a barren hellscape. Neither one is correct. If we had freer migration, it wouldn't be all unicorns, but it won't be all apocalypse either. There will be costs and there will also be benefits, and we'll learn to adjust to the costs and we will grow to appreciate the benefits. Just like any change that takes place.
We have a legal immigration system Jeffrey. It would be improved with a skills based system instead of a family lotto system. Oddly you never advocate for that.
And there is currently a huge cost to low skilled illegal entry. You know this. You just pretend not to. Major BLUE cities crying uncle over what the border sees in a week. So screw off.
Not all bears in trunks are dangerous!
Progressives see oppressed peoples fleeing their oppressors, conservatives see an invading horde bent on destroying civilization, and libertarians want government to protect everyone's rights while otherwise letting people mind their own business.
Do you ever not repeat yourself, you damn freak?
He thinks his idiocy sounds intelligent. It is fucking funny as he'll.
Just keep pretending that anyone can stop illegal immigration. Talk about "magical unicorn fairy" thinking! Trump promised a big beautiful wall and we still had 30 million illegals living and earning a living here in America. Then Biden promised to control immigration and that had zero effect too. You shouldn't even WANT to prevent immigration! If the 30 million illegal immigrants were to disappear suddenly *poof!* tomorrow idiots like you would likely starve to death before you figured out where the food was coming from.
Mine fields and machine guns, motherfucker.
Build the wall out of MWAocdoc's corpse. Would be the first time his existence ever produced value.
You sure complain a lot and use a lot of violent rhetoric. However, you never actually do anything.
*Not advocating violence. Just pointing out what a giant pussy Nardz is. He is a small, sad little child.
I think Nardz has a new girlfriend.
Why are you telling me? Tell Nardz you have a crush on him.
I won’t stand in the way of your crush.
You got burned. Just take it like a man and stfu. Don’t be a pathetic obnoxious coward like your crush Nardz.
If you have to tell someone they got burned... they didn't. Try again.
Not my fault the cowards on here are so stupid.
Their ideas for controlling immigration are generally ludicrous and cannot work, or they are authoritarian as fuck and should not be tried.
Such as: BUILD THE WALL, IT WORKS, JUST LOOK AT ISRAEL! Okay, but also, let’s look at the BERLIN WALL…. furthermore: walls only work if: (1) they are continually manned and maintained; and (2) they are defended with lethal force if necessary. No one in the history of the planet has ever attempted to continually man a 2,000-mile long wall, and there is no way any president is going to authorize using deadly force against penniless Guatemalans for nothing more than scaling a wall. If the wall ever does get built, it will wind up being like the Great Wall of China: a giant waste of money that is easily circumvented.
Such as: DEPORT ALL THE ILLEGALS! Okay, so how do you find them all? And the answer generally is either: (1) institute a ‘Papieren, Bitte’ regime (Nazi as fuck) or (2) make life so miserable for them that they self-deport. Such as, cutting off medical care or essential services for anyone without the correct papers. So, deliberately impoverishing and ghetto-izing an already marginalized population just because they don’t have the right papers. That is simply cruel, and unenforceable to boot - you are not going to convince large numbers of decent people that it is permissible to let a sick man die just because he lacks papers.
Such as: PUNISH THE EMPLOYERS WHO HIRE ILLEGALS! Okay it is already illegal for an employer to hire an illegal immigrant. But most of the penalties are civil penalties. What could be tried are CRIMINAL penalties, actually throwing business owners in jail. And I guarantee, if this were to happen in any serious way, the first class of business owners that would be targeted would not be the giant agribusiness or meat packing companies, but the small mom-and-pop businesses. And I guaran-damn-tee, the moment that a few hundred of these small business owners are frog-marched to jail, they will suddenly become “victims” of “political persecutions” for an “innocent mistake” – they were just trying to cut costs by hiring illegal labor because they had no other choice because of all of the regulations Democrats impose on the economy, you see. They would become “political prisoners” just like the Jan. 6 rioters are now. And that policy would end real quick.
Open borders into a welfare state is straight idiotic. You've been backed into a corner and admitted it prior. Yet always seem to forget that part.
Cloward Piven, baby!
We naturalize over a million people per year. We’re very generous already. Now fuck off with your open borders bullshit Groomer Jeffy.
Adding 5 million 3rd worlders per year should help this environment
https://twitter.com/ppv_tahoe/status/1658178237220937736?t=wzmNM8Z8TXHZEhZK3iyGqg&s=19
[News] Oakland, California.— Woman held up by 2 carloads of robbers off Park Blvd in Trestle Glen neighborhood. The video shows a woman walking towards Park Boulevard before the robbery occurs. As she’s walking by a home two vehicles pull up and several masked men get out. The woman attempts to run but is surrounded, her purse and other personal belongings are ripped from her body.
[Video]
There are zero costs to illegal immigration. They are such a source of economic growth every country they leave goes from top of the indices to the bottom. Or something.
I mean... it's Oakland. I'm not sure that can be blamed on illegals.
Nobody's blaming it on illegals.
But what do you think the influx of millions more illegals does to an environment already producing such events?
Nah, I get it, I just like dunking on Oakland.
Tis a shithole
Oakland’s not as bad as Jacksonville. It’s obvious you don’t like Oakland because you hate blacks, but most Americans would prefer it over being surrounded by racist, fat, inbred southerners like yourself.
They needed funding to start the food truck, and the racist banks wouldn’t loan them the money. So who’s the real victim here?
Think Dave Smith said this when talking about the idiocy of open borders, especially those comparing it to inviting someone into your home.
Youre free to invite someone over to jerk off in your house. It doesn’t mean the country has to let them jerk off in libraries and public places.
What's up, Peanuts?
Popped in to taste some good-ass salty Durham tears. You know, the biggest political scandal in history.
They don't make Russian assets like they used to.
Your internet search history alone would get you the death penalty.
You’d know about Russian assets, liar.
Your party lost to a handpicked opponent in 2016.
Someone with zero political experience.
A goddamn game show host.
As if that wasn't funny enough, this humiliating loss caused millions of you #Resistance dorks to have a psychotic break. Couldn't admit Hillary was just that terrible. No, you found it more comfortable to live in a bad spy novel in which aaaaaaactually Clinton really won! But Russia — the country Saint Obama dismissed as a threat just 4 years earlier — interfered to such a degree that it made the winner lose and the loser win.
If you had any self-awareness at all you'd realize bringing up Russia only makes your team look ridiculous.
She lost with the entirety of media and fabricated IC work product supporting her.
If he had any self awareness he would kill himself so his unholy impulses didn’t lead to another child being victimized.
https://twitter.com/Doc_0/status/1658091317212135433?t=1m3_yCIV6Cj1vbQrLHujRQ&s=19
More than any president before him, Barack Obama understood that administrative power is vital to winning a hybrid cultural and economic battle like the War on the Middle Class. Admin trumps legislative power because you can simply refuse to enforce laws you don't like.
...
[Thread]
https://twitter.com/LMFireSystems1/status/1657877353740091393?t=-cEUGwscQoIC3Vgsqhr0Vw&s=19
Do you want to know where all the illegals w Biden phones are at?
One of the maps published as part of the Heritage report, showing the movement of cell phone locations over the span of a month from migrant facilities in the U.S. near the border with Mexico to other parts of the country
[Map]
There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics
There is a Party of Immigration in Ukrainian Politics.
There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics
FIONA/SHIKHA 2024!!!!
noooooooooooooooooooooo
Don't worry. Fiona is too young to be on the top of that ticket. You have to be 35.
https://twitter.com/CrimeInNYC/status/1658220675188895745?t=JdeuX2vcR81qO9gkrFCX_g&s=19
At least six more public schools in Brooklyn are set to start temporarily housing migrants in their gyms.
Some parents at Brooklyn’s MS 577 in Williamsburg have already threatened to at least temporarily pull their kids out.
MS 577 shares a gym with PS 17 — one of five Brooklyn elementary schools to soon have "asylum-seekers" [could we stop with this already?] living out of their gymnasiums.
The other targeted elementary schools are PS 18 and PS 132, both in Williamsburg, PS 172 in Sunset Park and PS 189 near Prospect-Lefferts Gardens. PS 17, 18, 132 and 172 all house kindergarten through fifth-grade, while PS 189 goes from kindergarten through eighth grade.
PS 17 and MS 577 were preparing to host busloads of migrants — potentially single male adults — starting as early as Tuesday.
[Link]
Good. They need it to hurt. They need to cry uncle as loud as they can, and then it needs to hurt them more. And then no one should help them.
They shit up their own bed, best we tuck them in and lock the door behind us...
Oh, and send them a couple more buses after that.
and then it needs to hurt them more
So you want the migrants to hurt Americans in New York public schools?
NYC declared themselves a sanctuary city no? Amazing how you leftists always support policies as long as you dont bear any costs.
/homonym intentional.
Bear with him, he'll have a witty rejoinder any century now!
What makes you think the immigrants will hurt children ?
Those are his favorite immigrants
I want Americans in cities who support policies that were naturally going to hurt them, to hurt.
We told them this would happen, and they demanded it happen.
100% of border crossers should be shipped to a sanctuary city or state, effective immediately. The people who get tired of it can move out to better areas. The shitlibs can fill up the cities and enjoy their sky high rent, homeless shit / needles on the street, and unlimited migrants complete with diverse food truck supply. Ill be content to have my kids able to freely walk outside or down the street or go to school without having to pass through a 3rd world country on the way there.
> 100% of border crossers should be shipped to a sanctuary city or state, effective immediately.
I have a CDL, and will volunteer to drive a bus. Brownsville to Brooklyn Express, baby!
It is interesting that when it comes to migrants, you only seem to see the negatives. You see extra crime and higher housing costs.
What about the fact that migrants pay taxes, but don't receive the same benefits as citizens? So they are contributing tax revenue to programs that they themselves will never benefit from, but YOU just might.
What about the fact that they stimulate demand for all sorts of goods and services? Migrants have to eat too.
What about the fact that they provide a wider talent pool for all sorts of industries? They do jobs that Americans literally won't do (like the homeless bums in your previous example).
And let's not forget that places like Texas and New Mexico have unique cultures literally because of migration. Half of "Tex-Mex" is Mexico.
You seem to take these benefits for granted, since there is no front-page story in the newspaper declaring "Migrant Buys Food At Grocery Store, Helps Local Business Become Profitable". Instead you see stories about migrants causing trouble. And let's not forget the effect of right-wing media, which has made a deliberate choice to emphasize stories on immigration that cast migrants in a negative light. There was a story back in 2016, interviewing Steve Bannon when he ran Breitbart at the time, in which he said out loud that yeah, he ran immigration stories because he knew it would fire up Trump voters and make them angry. So you live in a world in which the only news you hear about migrants is bad news. So it's understandable that you want to kick them out and get rid of them. But, it is not the "adult" thing to do, that is the reactionary, knee-jerk, emotional thing to do.
So if you TRULY wanted to "act like an adult" when it came to the topic of immigration, you would acknowledge BOTH the costs AND the benefits of migration, in an adult, sober manner.
Here is a starting point: Here is a paper describing the effect of immigration on the wages of low-skilled native labor.
https://carnegieendowment.org/files/Effect-of-Low-Skilled-Labor-Working-Paper-1.pdf
It offers many different sides to the topic. The bottom line is that if you look at the most pessimistic estimate, increasing the low-skilled migrant share of the population by 1% reduces the low-skilled native wages by about 0.3%. To put this into perspective, adding 1,000,000 migrants per year (about 0.3% of the total population), assuming that they are ALL low skilled, means that the low-skilled native wages are reduced by 0.09%. So an annual salary of $20,000 becomes instead $19,982. That is the effect of immigration on the wages of low-skilled labor. And that is from Borjas, the most conservative economist and most immigration restrictionist one in the field. And reality is surely not THAT pessimistic.
So: is there a cost to immigration? Yes. There it is, right there (one of them). Should we blow it way out of proportion? No.
Your paper is from 2014. The surge of illegal immigration is much higher retard.
They’re not migrants you fatfuck. They’re illegals. Stop lying.
""What about the fact that migrants pay taxes,""
We can talk about immigration in general or the situation at hand. Immigration in general isn't a bad thing. It's what made America the great country it is. It's when the law is being ignored it becomes a problem. Liberals want to pass gun laws. Can we just ignore those too? Would liberals have a problem with undocumented guns?
I don't see the migrants coming to NY, paying taxes. They are being given everything. Even free nights in a hotel in NYC. NYC and NY are spending way more money they are collecting.
Yeah. I really have no fucking sympathy there.
Taking bets on how or if Reason will cover the Durham reporting.
My take is old news, FBI put in reforms. No harm no foul.
I get paid more than $140 to $170 per hour for working online. I heard about this job 3 months ago and after joining this I have earned easily $10k from this without having online working skills . Simply give it a shot on the accompanying site…
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The USA has the #1 spot of large nation immigration.....
Some psycho-libertarians just won't be happy until it's entirely invaded.
It’s almost like they have cards they aren’t showing.
That’s ok, I won’t be happy until every Marxist is driven from our shores.
"There Is No Party of Immigration in American Politics"
Awwwwwwwww Koch-funded libertarians are upset the dementia patient they want in the White House hasn't quite opened the border 100% like their sugar daddy demands. 🙁
#CheapLaborAboveAll
Trump Sexual Assault Fallout:
Lawsuit Accusing Trump of Raping a 13-Year-Old Girl Reemerges After Trump Loses Case Against E. Jean Carroll
.
One encounter was described as a “savage sexual attack.” Allegedly, Johnson “loudly pleaded” for the former president to stop when he started “violently striking Plaintiff in the face with his open hand and screaming that he would do whatever he wanted.”
.
In the allegations, Jane Doe said she was not allowed to tell anyone or would disappear like Maria. She explained that Maria was a 12-year-old girl also allegedly violated by Trump, never to be seen again.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/lawsuit-accusing-trump-of-raping-a-13-year-old-girl-reemerges-after-trump-loses-case-against-e-jean-carroll/ar-AA18DunI?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=5728bb22361d411aa82fa88ead9b30b4&ei=17
You really are an evil faggot.
Hey now, there's no need to impugn the character of homosexuals by associating them with SPB.
By “faggot” I meant “retarded”.
There’s no need to impugn the character of retards by associating them with SPB either.
Try, like, “botflies”, or “giardia”, or “sewer rodents”.
Shit gargling cum dumpster fires? Putrescent, feculent infections?
Basically, "anything actually human" rates higher than SPB.
"Faggot" is derived from the Latin "fasces" which was what the rods lictors were authorized to beat the plebs with in the Roman Republic were called, because they were made from a bundle of smaller sticks.
Thus you get "faggot" referencing the sticks bound together, while the term "fascist" was chosen both for the "stronger together" connotation and as assertion of State authority.
The word "faggot" is just fun to say. I see no reason it should be reserved for homosexuals. Indeed it is more apt as a pejorative applied to authoritarian collectivists, and this use needs to be brought into fashion (especially considering that it was often used as a general insult not specifically referring to gays).
The left loves to project and call their enemies fascists, despite the left displaying the fundamental qualities of fascism (excepting only the nationalist ideal).
We must remind the left that they are the true faggots.
Also we must remind racist, homophobic, white trash, inbred, hook worm infested southern pieces of shit like you that you are not welcome here. The country would have been better off if we hung all your racist, treasonous conservative, confederate ancestors. We won’t make that mistake again. Keep talking about civil war. We both know you’re too much of a coward to do anything yourself, but if your violent rhetoric riles enough people up you will regret it. All you racist, homophobic, treasonous, conservative, neo-confederate traitors will be tried and executed for treason.
Commie shitbag, this country belongs to us, not you, get out before you end up in a landfill. It’s where your fellow travelers are headed.
Or stay, it will be amusing to see you dealt with.
Just as believable as trump in a department store.
I wonder if he took them on an airplane ride too.
At this point, I would settle for a Libertarian Party (or even a libertarian Magazine) that is willing to talk about the nitty gritty of this issue rather than offer platitudes. As we saw in the Airlines post earlier this afternoon, government's tentacles are into everything, and that means these often simple "principled" viewpoints actually lead to unprincipled outcomes. For example, opening up markets to foreign airline competitors (simple fix!) will kill off several domestic airlines who are hamstrung by OTHER federal laws that make them less competitive (unprincipled outcomes).
I believe whole-heartedly in the freedom to travel, associate with others and believe that right exists whether you are an American Citizen or not. I don't believe that the US Government has the right to restrict the labor market to subsidize certain Americans at the cost of many other Americans who have to pay these higher rates.
But there is quite obviously an additional cost of immigration- a cost that is imposed by other government acts. If such costs- these negative externalities- didn't exist, even "sanctuary" cities like New York and Chicago would not be objecting to handfuls of immigrants showing up in their borders. Seriously- if these liberal bastions really did their homework and believed that every immigrant is a "net benefit", then why are they complaining about the costs?
I think a principled approach to immigration by libertarians means recognizing how just "letting people in" brings second order costs and effects similar to letting foreign airlines compete with domestic airlines. And we cannot whistle past those differences.
I acknowledge that it is wrong for a government to prevent a person from coming into this country. But one must also acknowledge that it is also wrong for a government to take homeless, jobless people and just deposit them in a community, forcing the community to care for those people, or taxing others in order to buy up housing off the market for those people to live in.
In a country where people are free to associate as they please, people would happily self select and settle in communities that they prefer. The government has removed the ability for people to self sort as they choose. They are using subsidies, public accommodation laws, eminent domain and taxation to tell communities and individuals that they cannot self sort, that these immigrants will be deposited in this hotel, whether they have a sponsor or not. They will be allowed to work under the table at a competitive advantage for others.
This environment must be viewed as a whole. And when you do view it as a whole, it becomes much harder to just paint objections to unfettered immigration as general xenophobia, bigotry or racism. And the complaints from New York, Chicago and other blue enclaves demonstrates this. They did not suddenly become racist. They merely started bearing some of the costs that border states have been bearing for years. And suddenly, they are realizing this is a problem after all.
And lastly, if anyone looks at the Biden administrations actions and doesn't see it as 100x worse on border policy than even the Trump administration, they need to check themselves. Not only has Biden failed to do anything meaningful to advance immigration reform (despite having 2 years of Federal control), he is openly driving people into a quasi legal state where they are always in fear of government action. He has done NOTHING to improve freedom in anything close to libertarian principles. The administration has created 3 million shadow citizens forever looking over their back. It is disgusting and everyone- democrat, republican, independent, libertarian- should be disgusted with how the Biden administration treats these people.
At this point, I would settle for a Libertarian Party (or even a libertarian Magazine) that is willing to talk about the nitty gritty of this issue rather than offer platitudes.
I agree, that would be a good thing. I'm sure there was a Soho Forum debate on the topic at some point.
I think a principled approach to immigration by libertarians means recognizing how just “letting people in” brings second order costs and effects similar to letting foreign airlines compete with domestic airlines. And we cannot whistle past those differences.
Yes and no - we have to be adults and recognize that the costs exist, but at the end of the day, what distinguishes us libertarians from everyone else is that we value liberty for its own sake, despite the costs. So yes we should be honest, but we should not fall into the Team Blue trap of subjecting liberty to a cost/benefit analysis.
And lastly, if anyone looks at the Biden administrations actions and doesn’t see it as 100x worse on border policy than even the Trump administration, they need to check themselves.
I don't know if it's 100x worse (at least there are no kids in cages, or family separation *as deterrence*), but it is certainly bad, and certainly NOT the 'open borders'.
liberty for its own sake, despite the costs.
The cost, as Overt is implying, can be less liberty.
Or in some actual cases, death.
A cost that's been proven to be the case over the past few decades
Well, that makes no logical sense. Expanding liberty cannot have reducing liberty as a cost.
Now, it could be that expanding liberty in one area could lead to an exacerbation of a liberty-reducing problem in another area. But the problem is what is reducing the liberty in that other area, not the expansion of liberty in the first place.
“But the problem is what is reducing the liberty in that other area, not the expansion of liberty in the first place.”
Yes the problem is the government. They are reducing peoples’ liberty to invite or exclude people as they choose. They created the problem, and attempt to make up for it by giving liberty to some immigrants. That does not help the people whose liberty was removed.
Again, think of this from the perspective of private property rights. If we were all together in a gated community, through the democratic process we would determine how finite resources like the Community pool would be managed. If you "expand the liberty" of some random non-resident to let them use the pool, it was at the cost of the liberty of others- the owners- to moderate who may access that pool. There was a cost.
Yes and no – we have to be adults and recognize that the costs exist, but at the end of the day, what distinguishes us libertarians from everyone else is that we value liberty for its own sake, despite the costs.
The libertarian case for welfare. Lol.
No. Liberty doesn't require bearing thr costs of others through force of the state. That is a leftist and socialist position.
Liberty includes the freedom of failure. State induced recovery is not liberty as it takes from one to give to another. If you want to help others, donate to charities. I bet you, like most socialists, have never considered donating your own money to others, demanding it solely of others.
Your position is not one of a libertarian. This is why you are accused of being a leftist socialist.
"what distinguishes us libertarians from everyone else is that we value liberty for its own sake, despite the costs."
But I am talking about a cost in liberties. So we cannot just say "doesn't apply."
In a libertarian society, if you are not invited onto property, you can't just go there. You must have a sponsor. There must be consent. With private property, this is of course simple. Find the owner, get consent. Even in a small private community, such as an HOA, you must have consent. You may not use the club-house or community park unless you are invited by one of the owners, and they must take responsibility for your conduct.
Since we do not live in a libertarian society, the government has subrogated our property rights (both physical land, and also certain rights to travel and easement) for a democratic process. The government has said, "We are taking this land, and these property rights, and instead of you people exercising control, we will control it through laws placed by the Democratic process."
Put another way, the bargain was, "Relinquish property rights to a pool, and in return you get a say over how the collective rights are managed." You don't get this road, but you get a say in how the roads are used.
But a curious transformation happens here. Through the magic of transferring these rights to the government, we lose the ability to fully exercise them. A private property right includes the right to exclude others from your property. Band together into a private covenant and it is still moral for you to closely restrict who accesses your collective property.
And yet, the standard libertarian argument is that the democratic process for managing an HOA's exclusion rules is transformed when the government appropriates that same process. As a private community, no libertarian would argue I am immoral for (say) requiring that anyone on the property be sponsored by another resident. And yet the standard libertarian line says it is immoral to do exactly this democratic process to restrict people from the country.
And this is essentially what the government is doing. It is saying, "You don't get to choose who is coming into your community. We people 1000 miles away do. And it is your job to deal with how that impacts your town." And when that local community objects and tries to change the process, libertarians are there wagging their finger saying those townspeople don't get to use the rights of exclusion that were subrogated to the democratic process.
So yes, there is a cost of liberty. And it is one that only makes sense when you look at the entire process as a whole.
Based on that, I think that- if we are going to have a government control of immigration- there needs to be a way to balance the rights of individuals who have the right to exclude. My first thought is that would be addressed by requiring sponsors for every immigrant.
Well, IMO it is not appropriate to analogize the government to a giant HOA. For starters:
“We are taking this land, and these property rights, and instead of you people exercising control, we will control it through laws placed by the Democratic process.”
Yes, that is true. But the REASON for the government to be taking this land and those property rights is to further the mission of the government, which is:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed
That's the mission statement of government - to secure our rights. (At least in an idealized sense.) So while an HOA and a government are both beholden to their separate constituencies, the HOA is free to enact any majoritarian rule that it wishes, but the government is not. Even if an overwhelming majority demands that the government use its public property to violate the rights of a minority, it would be an impermissible act of government to do so.
So an HOA (composed of fully private land) may, if its membership so wishes, declare: "No firearms may be transported in the neighborhood. This is a gun-free zone!" But a government cannot do the same with regards to public roads because that would violate the Second Amendment rights of the people.
So one libertarian rationale for public roads, is to secure our rights to freedom of association. If all land were private, then you could be completely surrounded by private property owners who could legally prevent you from leaving your own property by forbidding you to travel on their land. Hence why total anarchism is a bad idea.
Viewed in this way, migrants should be permitted to travel on public roads, without needing a sponsor, because it is the government's job to secure freedom of association for all people. (Migrants have inalienable rights too, and citizens have the right to associate with migrants.)
Based on that, I think that- if we are going to have a government control of immigration- there needs to be a way to balance the rights of individuals who have the right to exclude.
I really don't like "balancing tests" for fundamental rights. That smacks too much of a utilitarian approach to liberty and that just offends me. You ought to be free to exclude migrants from your own private property. You ought to be free to not pay for the social services that migrants specifically consume. But as for the public roads and other public services that migrants as well as everyone else uses, that are put in place pursuant to government's mission to secure our rights - yeah, we all have to pay for that, and that IMO is a legitimate form of taxation.
So the consent of the governed is; Nobody wants "open-borders".
Maybe there's a reason a Union of States government for a strong National Defense against invaders. Maybe flipping crap on it's head is why you get called out on your BS so often. It's the same crap the left has used to void the Constitution. Oh; here's some cherry-picked words we can use to destroy the USA... /s
"That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"
How is this inconsistent with an HOA or with any other private contract? There are private HOA security departments. Those HOAs have rules that determine how disputes between people, including their property rights, will be managed. You have not explained how the US government is somehow special, or how that sentence makes my analogy functionally different.
"So while an HOA and a government are both beholden to their separate constituencies, the HOA is free to enact any majoritarian rule that it wishes, but the government is not. "
You have not shown this fact. Indeed it is absolutely false. The Constitution provides for pretty much any "majoritarian" rule people are willing to put up, just as long as they follow the process. That's how we got prohibition.
"But a government cannot do the same with regards to public roads because that would violate the Second Amendment rights of the people."
But that's where you are wrong. Repealing the Second Amendment is a remedy for those people who want to do so. While the particular details differ between changing the Constitution of the United States and an HOA, the distinction you are trying to draw is completely false. Both systems of governance have mechanisms to make changes.
"So one libertarian rationale for public roads, is to secure our rights to freedom of association."
That is not a libertarian rationale, but please do go on.
" But as for the public roads and other public services that migrants as well as everyone else uses, that are put in place pursuant to government’s mission to secure our rights – yeah, we all have to pay for that, and that IMO is a legitimate form of taxation."
The Federal Government is not merely securing our rights. It is certainly not doing that when it airlifts immigrants and drops them in communities thousands of miles away.
For example, opening up markets to foreign
airline competitorssubsidized ship builders (simple fix!) will kill off several domestic airlines who are hamstrung by OTHER federal laws that make them less competitive (unprincipled outcomes).FTFY. Or… lemme guess; nobody at Reason is talking about repealing *just* the Jones Act and even if they were, your point about airlines competing with each other is just too many cartwheels away from being comparable to air freight companies competing with sea freight companies.
Edit: Or I guess there’s the third and most abjectly retarded, “Oh! I didn’t know ‘cabotage’ meant air *and* sea *and* land!” option.
Uh oh. Poor Rudy. Looks like he's been caught selling pardons.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/rudy-giuliani-trump-pardons-lawsuit-b2339431.html
Former aide hearsay vs Biden bank accounts. You believe the former and not the latter. Do you find that odd?
No, he bearly thought about it at all.
A bunch of trunked up charges.
He wants all of the receipts time stamped and notarized for the very concerning CIA collusion to interfere in the 2020 election, but when its an accusation against the Trump world, the 2016 Russiagate standards (read: tabloid journalism, fan fiction, and laundered info from anonymous FBI sources) are more than enough for him.
I wouldn't be surprised if this piece of evidence alone was enough to convince Jeff a third impeachment was in order.
Biden bank records, and the Durham report.
...to name just 2.
Unfounded accusations = caught
/jeff
Psst: there is more evidence that Rudy was trying to sell pardons, than there is that Joe Biden accepted Chinese cash into his personal bank account.
In there case of Rudy, there are two eyewitnesses who claim to have seen it happen.
Cool story bro. Got anymore democrat fan fiction?
I heard Rudy told Trump he was selling them for only $1 million and pocketing the difference.
I’m sure this is as true as the Steele dossier.
should we reshape current systems or rely upon technological exits like bitcoin
Bitcoin as a "technological exit".
Certain mega-donor funded news and commentary sites promoting ideas that don't reflect majority American preferences might want to look in a reflecting surface, such as a mirror, pond, or shiny toaster, before criticizing mega-donor funded political organizations for promoting ideas that don't reflect historical American values.
Clearly.
U.S. immigration policy, prompted by the recent lifting of Title 42, a dreadful COVID-era hangover that restricted the ability of migrants to seek asylum.
And tennis players to play tennis! And beachgoers to beach-go!
All those millions of asylum-seekers who died of COVID...
Just like that non-socially-distanced, least-hygiene-having, unlocked-down, co-morbidity-having homeless population!
If the reporting is true, it seems that undocumented immigrants from Honduras are responsible for the majority of fentanyl dealing in San Francisco, run by cartels. And because San Francisco is a sanctuary city, they have commitments to never turn over anyone prosecuted for serious or minor crimes to immigration. This seems to most to just be unreasonable policy; a policy which most countries around the world would never adopt.
“they have commitments to never turn over anyone prosecuted for serious … crimes to immigration”
That is wildly untrue.
Is it "wildly untrue", if our supervisors Ronen, et al, do not want to break SF sanctuary policies even in cases of murder and child rape? https://www.kqed.org/news/11941173/sf-supervisors-split-on-details-of-citys-sanctuary-policy-shielding-immigrants-from-deportation
Your own link doesn’t support your exaggerated claim:
“Under San Francisco’s current policy, local law enforcement can honor an ICE request to hold someone if that person is facing a violent felony charge and was previously convicted of a violent felony — including murder, rape and arson — in the previous seven years, or of a serious felony — including robbery and carjacking — in the previous five years.”
That is not “never” turning anyone over for serious crimes.
This isn't a gotcha, just typical social media behavior. Again, it's not wildly untrue. It is what most of my local supervisors believe. They have said it out loud clearly.
So... everybody gets to have their own nation except white folks?
Where are the demands that Israel (credit to OBL/Sandra for consistently hitting that point), Japan, South Korea, UAE, Mexico, Brazil throw open their borders?
Now I'm not a big believer in the US as a "white" nation (though the English and Europeans have legitimate claim), but white people were the vast majority of residents in the colonies and these United States for roughly 4 centuries and are now a rapidly diminishing percentage of the population.
Is this good?
If so, why is it good?
What other ethnicities would you like to see replaced in their native countries?
Why would it be wrong to desire the US have a white supermajority?
Why are you uncomfortable even thinking about these questions when literally no other ethnicities/races would be bothered by it?
Indigenous peoples have more of a claim.
“ Now I’m not a big believer in the US as a “white” nation”
followed by:
“ Why would it be wrong to desire the US have a white supermajority?”
To answer that most Americans would say something like:
It’s wrong because we should treat people not by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.
I really hope the alphabet agencies are monitoring this comment section. Violent, racist, anti-government, treasonous extremists like you need to be monitored. Most intelligent and reasonable Americans would agree with me.
Most intelligent and reasonable Americans would agree with me.
“I don’t know any intelligent and reasonable people, but if I did, most of them would agree with me.” – Nardz Leftist Kill Count: 0
Sad.
Yet that principle applies everywhere except for Europe.
England back to the Picts!
To clarify, there is no party of LEGAL immigration. Those parties that say "we're only against illegal immigration" are lying to you, because their actions show they are opposed to all kinds of legal immigration as well. Even when they say they are hunky dory with it, they do NOTHING to reduce the restrictions in place to come here legally.
Both Republicans and Democrats. And the Libertarian Party after it gotten taken over by the anti-immigration Mises Caucus (old Ludwig is spinning in his grave so fast he's generating a magnetic field). And it aint' the Green or Constitution or even the Rent Too Damn High parties.
Just one party that is friendly to the idea of immigration, that's all I ask. Doesn't mean I would vote for them, but it would be nice to see a pro immigration plank back on the table, instead of assuming all immigrants are criminals.
I'm confused what a pro-immigration plank would look like. Both major parties support immigration in principle, and year after year the US is already the most generous nation in the world when it comes to immigration, by a wide margin.
Only if you are measuring absolute numbers of people -and only if you are including direct kin of citizens.
By % of population, the US is not close to the highest % - all the Gulf Arab states (ranging from 30% to 90% immigrant), all the city-states, all the refugee hosts, Germany, Canada, Australia, Sweden, Switzerland, New Zealand, Israel are significantly higher. We are in the next tier with Austria, Greece, UK, France, Spain, Norway, etc. Exclude the direct family migrants and the US is two tiers below that (Eastern Europe).
That’s really misleading, and frankly outright dishonest in the case of the Gulf Arab States.
Yes, the Gulf countries have a huge % of foreign born, but they AREN’T immigrants! They are temporary guest workers. They is no path to residency or citizenship for them, they aren’t allowed to bring their families, and they must leave when their time is up. They are there solely for the cheap labor they provide, not because the Gulf States are so welcoming.
In the case of Europe and some other western countries, you are technically correct, but only because those countries jumped on the immigration bandwagon long after the US did, most of them in the 1960s, and made up for lost time. The US has been doing it much longer, and also, unlike those other nations, children born to foreigners in the US are automatically US citizens, so that also greatly reduces the % of foreign born, using a legal definition.
Personally I would like to see an immigration reform that is a bit more bilaterally welcoming.
Countries that already have a reasonable mix of both emigrants and immigrants – we should be highly open.
Countries that have few immigrants compared to emigrants – we should treat as basically refugee determination. More generous than existing refugee determination – less generous than those countries who currently take advantage of our proximity to treat us like a safety valve or a remittance economy. With the latter, we should be emphasizing trade not people dumping.
Bilateral migration/trade/commerce agreements was how we did it in the 19th century as well. Eg 1829 agreement between Austria-Hungary and the US
Good catch. That one wasn't proclaimed until 1831, and its coastwise restrictions were amplified and included in the US Jones law nearly a century later. Morphine was entering Asia's coatwise opum trade, the East India company was wearing out its welcome. It's invitation to depart China or else would in 1837 coincide with a bad Panic in These States.
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Biden signed a new order. Wretches fleeing the economic wreckage of prohibitionism exported by Biden, Reagan, Bush and Kerry in the 1980s wrecked all of South America by 1992. Now that the CDC rule is out, the new rules refuse all chance of asylum or even entry to any who--along the path Statesward--fail to apply for asylum in intervening countries. Also, failure to use a cellphone app to request permission to approach creates a presumption of inadmissibility. These folks could be welcomed as doctors, engineers, physicists with visas had the Kleptocracy not ruined their economies these past 37 years.
and there shouldn't be IF you really want to help immigrants.
Thomas Sowell made this point about Blacks. We started helping them and the family broke down, abortions skyrocketed. education plummetted.
When something makes sense you do it, but when you put it under a microscope and isolate it and treat like the rest of the world doesn't exist (Hillary did this all the time) you make bad decsions and all the extremists come out driven by the laser focus on the topic.
Truth