Can a Post-'Takeover' Libertarian Party Improve on Its Historical Run of 2012–20?
After winning its two highest-ever presidential vote percentages in 2016 and 2020, the Libertarian Party was taken over by activists embarrassed by those campaigns. Will they attract more votes?

After succeeding last weekend in his half-decade-long quest to engineer a "takeover" of the Libertarian Party, Michael Heise, founder and chair of the L.P.'s now-dominant Mises Caucus, crowed on Twitter that the national party had become "the 1st institution to shake off wokism in the country. Now that the party isnt a raging embarrassment we can actually outreach to and funnel so many groups. Bitcoiners, people pissed at schools, the major podcast audiences, etc."
Baked into Heise's optimism is the assumption that the prior L.P. leaders, campaigns, and candidates that the Mises Caucus repudiates—including former three-time national chair (2014–2020) Nicholas Sarwark, the team behind Jo Jorgensen's 2020 campaign, and, above all, 2016 vice presidential candidate Bill Weld—repelled potential voters with milquetoast messaging.
This may indeed be true; political counterfactuals are stubbornly difficult to prove. But what is indisputable is that the Libertarian Party has never had an electoral stretch as successful on the presidential level as 2012–2020:

The M.C.-derided Libertarian presidential campaigns of 2016 and 2020 produced the top two voting-percentage results in party history; the 2012 Gary Johnson/Jim Gray ticket ranks a close fourth behind the well-financed Ed Clark/David Koch experiment in the third-party spike year of 1980. The L.P.'s current streak of three consecutive bronze-medal finishes is the longest of any American third party since before the Great Depression.
The most paradoxically impressive result in that stretch might be the one most recent: Jo Jorgensen, with close to zero national name recognition and very little political charisma ("She put the nation to sleep," cracked comedian Robbie "the Fire" Bernstein during a Libertarian convention-adjacent taping of Dave Smith's Part Of The Problem podcast), produced the party's second-highest presidential vote percentage in a year that was brutal for nonmajor candidates and bested Green Party nominee Howie Hawkins in all 50 states.
Before former New Mexico governor Gary Johnson ran in 2012, the high-water mark for an L.P. presidential nominee's share of the non-Democratic/Republican vote was in 1988, when 48 percent of that electorate pulled the lever for future Mises Caucus hero Ron Paul. Johnson/Gray topped that figure with 56.6 percent in 2012; Johnson/Weld inched upward to 57.2 percent, and Jorgensen/Spike Cohen brought it all the way up to 64.5 percent. The gang that went 0 for 4 against Ralph Nader has, within three election cycles, become the third party in the United States.
Will that streak continue, now that the L.P. has been taken over by a caucus highly critical of the people who produced those comparative successes? Twenty-nine months is an eternity in modern politics; at this point four years ago, the party's top three presumed 2020 candidates were Bill Weld (who would end up running and losing badly as a Republican), John McAfee (who was arrested in Spain on U.S. tax evasion charges in October 2020 and found dead in his jail cell eight months later), and Adam Kokesh, who wound up finishing sixth.
As of this very early moment, the two main potential 2024 Libertarian presidential candidates are comedian/podcaster Dave Smith, who has the strong backing of the Mises Caucus, and former congressman Justin Amash, who in his convention keynote speech trolled the caucus by getting them to boo blind quotes from their namesake economist, Ludwig von Mises. Amash played Hamlet in the 2020 race and then abruptly dropped out just before the nominating convention, citing among other factors the adverse third-party electoral environment created by heightened negative polarization, though many insiders suspected that L.P. dysfunction may have also scared him off.
That external polarization and internal cat-herding may well continue in the 2024 cycle and could yet dissuade Amash from running. He and other prospective non-Mises Caucus candidates may not relish spending two-plus years being asked by reporters to respond to such headlines as "Kentucky Libertarian Party compares 'vaccine passports' to stars Jews wore in Holocaust," and "The Libertarian Party of New Hampshire Ripped for Tweeting 'Libertarians Suffer More Oppression Than Black People.'"
That kind of outré messaging, which correlates strongly with Mises Caucus influence on state affiliates, has already turned some people away from the party, to which the general vibe from the victorious side has been: Good riddance.
"After decades of disappointing presidential campaigns and zero mainstream media coverage, the LP needed a new direction and the Ron Paul Revolution needed an infrastructure to become influential in the political discussion in 2022 and beyond," the anonymous Being Libertarian website asserted in a post-convention victory lap of a post. "It means the Libertarian Party just got a lot less woke….[And] the Libertarian Party will become more friendly to disgruntled Republicans."
Whether there's an untapped reserve of anti-woke Ron Paul fans that can overcome the loss of previous L.P. voters turned off by the party's new messaging will depend in no small part on who ends up winning the Republican and even Democratic nominations. Former President Donald Trump remains the man to beat in the GOP, but his star is waning measurably, while Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis moves up in the polls and prediction markets. It's hard to picture an edgier, more right-leaning Libertarian social media game competing meaningfully against the master; meanwhile, DeSantis grows more Trumpy by the day.
President Joe Biden, meanwhile, is not only old and unpopular; a majority of Democrats and Democrat-leaners want another candidate to run in the 2024 primaries.
On the one hand, you would expect a redux of Biden vs. Trump, with their demonstrated track records of government-expanding incompetence and alienating independents, to be the perfect opening for a youthful and articulate small-government guy like Amash. On the other, Trump is a one-man base-rallier for Democrats; the dark economic clouds on the horizon favor a pendulum swing against the incumbent, and both sides are on the verge of being heavily motivated by abortion politics. If that's not enough to scramble your calculations, close your eyes and imagine a DeSantis vs. Kamala Harris race, with Dave Smith lobbing rhetorical bombs and insult comedy.
Another potential X-factor is competition from other third parties. While the Greens seem relegated to also-ran status as long as lefty voters remember Trump vs. Hillary Clinton, Andrew Yang's centrist Forward Party is starting to achieve ballot qualifications, and the kinda-sorta Christian Democratic American Solidarity Party had an earlier start. There's still plenty of time between now and 2024 for party-building, though the work is a slog, and the Libertarians, for all their foibles, have been stomping the competition for more than a decade now.
For the moment, in the absence of national political attention for the foreseeable future, much will depend on how the Mises Caucus decides to flex its power. Newly elected Party Chair Angela McArdle in her winning pitch to delegates repeatedly stressed the primacy of "bold messaging," particularly on social media.
"Messaging is the face of the party," McArdle wrote. "Social media is usually the first thing someone sees when they interact with us as an organization. Social media has the changed the political landscape. The days of 'reading about something' have been replaced by the experience of 'interacting with something'. Unfortunately, our messaging at the national level has a very self-conscious tone. We need to move away from 'low self esteem' messaging."
Is that a license for outrage-courting edgelordia? Not so fast, McArdle insists: "Simply put, bold messaging is messaging that is not watered down and does not take an apologizing, embarrassed tone about libertarian topics[.] Is bold messaging shit posting? No. Bold messaging is courageous, and it tells the truth."
If in 2012 you were to have told Gary Johnson and retired Judge Jim Gray—decent gentlemen both—that the future success of the party they were then helping bring to the next level would depend in part on the line between "shit posting" and telling the truth, they would have probably looked at you funny. Yet, that is the world that both the Libertarian Party and the rest of the United States find themselves in now.
McArdle and her winning cohort still have some time before the outrage archeologists in the competition and the press start combing in earnest through the old tweets and podcast episodes. We shall soon see how much the new Libertarian Party orients itself around social media controversy and what kind of audience that attracts.
Editor's Note: As of February 29, 2024, commenting privileges on reason.com posts are limited to Reason Plus subscribers. Past commenters are grandfathered in for a temporary period. Subscribe here to preserve your ability to comment. Your Reason Plus subscription also gives you an ad-free version of reason.com, along with full access to the digital edition and archives of Reason magazine. We request that comments be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment and ban commenters for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
Maybe. I'm basically convinced that any gains in the last two cycles were protest votes.
With a large component of media help in becoming spoilers.
I even have made $30,030 just in five weeks straightforwardly working part-time from my apartment. (ghj-17) Immediately when I've lost my last business, I was exhausted and luckily I found this top online task & with this I am in a position to obtain thousands directly through my home. Everybody is able to get this best career & can gain more dollars on-line going this article.
.
>>>> http://xs2g.2.vu/1
Reason of course doesn't see the rise of an active Mises Caucus as a reason for those gains. People actually fighting for liberty instead of running on anti racism and bake the cake. They hate those people. They prefer democrat lite.
Exactly. As Michael Malice said in his interview with Eric July: "They prefer liberty but they believe in the state."
link please
Why not go to Malice's podcast, pull up the episode with Eric which I listened to, and listen for yourself. The endless "link please" is lazy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4opW39ETWxI&t=1990s
About 29:30 in to the video
Hrimnir; Thank you for the link and time.
I even have made $30,030 just in five weeks straightforwardly working part-time from my apartment. (res-32) Immediately when I've lost my last business, I was exhausted and luckily I found this top online task & with this I am in a position to obtain thousands directly through my home. Everybody is able to get this best career & can gain more dollars on-line going this article.
.
>>>> http://oldprofits.blogspot.com
Why isn’t anyone looking at Spike Cohen and Larry Sharpe?
The McCardle MC strategy specifically calls out Spike as an example of the people that the LP should be amplifying.
They are right.
Visit r/murderedbyspikecohen. It’s a master class in trolling just about everybody.
I like Welch and I love The Fifth Column. When totalitarianism came to America in the form of the lockdowns and mandates, a more vigorous response was needed. Especially with people being fired for not taking the jab and small business owners losing their livelihoods. Gary only got the votes he got due to the 2 most unpopular candidates in history. His performance on Morning Joe was simply embarrassing.
John; To most of us here, watching Morning Joe would be "embarrassing".
That's a good goddamn question, because they seem to be the only ones to have a clue. I'm out after seeing the "Mises" Caucus boo Mises quotes - and I stumped for those dudes for years.
If my choices are between the woke and the straight-up uneducated, I'm an independent now I guess. Conforms more to my Rothbardian ways anyway.
This is the most libertarian party post ever.
"None of those scottsman are True Scottsmen."
That is the real libertarian movement..... thousands of individual libertarian parties running around pointing out that all those other libertarian parties are not *really* libertarian.
Every true communist swears that Hitler's Christian National Socialism "isn't really" socialism. Anyone with an ounce of sense can read the original LP platform, see how it freed women from Comstockism and is now freeing youth from being shot over plant leaves. OF COURSE both halves of the socialist Kleptocracy seek to infiltrate and destroy the 4 million votes that (before the Knapp no borders, anarchist murders planks of 2020 and now Dred Scott Comstockism deletion) forced looters to consider freedom.
Harminius;
I've noticed the same things from the Feces Caucus;
- needing to be told how to vote on every issue at convention with red or green signs.
- the booing of Mises quotes by Mises "members".
-the paid Feces Party voters, who have their LP memberships, transportation, rooms and meals paid for, so they could be there to vote as they were ordered.
- how they take over county affiliate e-boards by trucking in those same paid voters, then changing their county affiliation to vote for Feces Caucus candidates in another county hundreds of miles away. Then in the following weeks, rinse and repeat till they've taken over the state with the same two dozen illiterates.
I'm looking forward to learning what the Federal Elections Commission finds in their investigation of Mises finances.
Amash/Sharpe/Cohen '24
… for dog catcher.
Guilty of the crime of not being Heise's chosen ones. When Dave Smith in 2024 doesn't do as well as Johnson in 2016 or even JoJo in 2020, I wonder who the MiCaucs will blame. They own and operate the LP now.
Exactly.
Is that you, Nick Sarwark? He is an actual used car salesman!
It is entirely inappropriate to smear the integrity of used car salesmen with a comparison with Sarwark.
True enough, he was engaged in used car sales but the entire profession should not be smeared by the egregious misconduct of one practitioner.
But...but..but.. he's a "lawyer" and will sue you! XD
As I've said before, Nick Sarwark is a libertarian car salesman in Phoenix. I live in Tucson.
They are completely different places.
Don't think there were any gains in 2020, but rather a big loss.
Especially considering the other 2 candidates got the 2 highest numbers of votes ever.
It's not enough to just not gain, you must be actively anti gains...
Bingo
Nardz;
Yep. There were a lot of democrat party voters. They had been practicing too. Just 3 days earlier; they were going door to door, in Halloween costumes, begging for different free stuff.
To BestUsedCarSales, RE your:
"I'm basically convinced that any gains in the last two cycles were protest votes."
I agree with this. Pointing towards Jo's vote getting in an election where quite a number of people were not happy with the D's and R's candidate is rather odd. She got a ton of protest votes including my Son In Law's.
I also heard McArdle on the Michael Malice podcast yesterday. She said she had spoken to Jo and Jo admitted her campaign team sucked bigtime and needed to be more careful on who she surrounded herself with. It's a good podcast and one I recommend listening to. As for Dave Smith, I've heard him on several podcasts and he is fixated on Yeman and little else. Not a fan
I believe that the Libertarian party has caused more harm than good to the country. When the vote is most important they many times vote for their candidate. When Dem/Rep vote is less than 3% split many times in important races, libertarians vote their own at 1.5% to 3% or more. This guarantees that the party farthest from Libertarian Ideals wins an election! Think about that!
We have seen this over and over with third parties for decades. People need to remember that voting is a STRATEGY. Vote 3rd party in primaries. Flood them with votes. But remember IF the 3rd party can NOT or might not win the election to VOTE FOR THE PARTY WHOSE IDEALS ARE CLOSEST TO YOURS. That would exclude the Dems wouldn't it?
Yes, we're wasting our votes, we know... Wouldn't want to upset your precious 2 party system. Sorry. Which team are you? We should all join up for that one huh?
Republicans in the 1930s argued that Christian National Socialism was better than Soviet International Socialism. The got quiet alluva sudden in 1941. Orwell argued the two versions of socialism are the same thing. Any fool --even George Wallace--can see there ain't a dime's worth of difference between the Gee-Oh-Pee and Donkeys. Both party animals are beasts of enslaved burden, ever notice that?
In our previous 2 party system, you need to work within one or the other party to achieve your objectives.
It’s a good system, far better than a multiparty system in which splinter parties end up having disproportionate power.
Additionally, the overton window of other multi-party countries (including one European one where I am from) is so narrow that the US-two-party-system achieves broader discourse and more discussion about a vast spectrum of topics with only two parties.
I call that efficiency.
I'll maybe give you 2020 (at least in regard to libertarian ideals) and a few of the congressional and Senate races over the years. But overall regarding whether or not the Libertarian Party has "caused more harm than good to the country" it's kind of a wash since we've barely been much of a factor.
Our highest vote percentage in 2016 was when Trump got elected. In 2020 we weren't much of a factor, and it was mostly suburban "centrist" types who abandoned Trump. And I don't believe any libertarian worth their salt can honestly defend the GOP nominees before 2016 as being anywhere close to "libertarian ideals." No one was gonna convince me to vote for Dubya or McCain. Though I might've voted for Romney if he had chosen Rand Paul as his running mate.
That would exclude the Dems -- if you are a Republican. If you are a libertarian, you are likely to be as opposed to Dem positions as to Repub positions. There are a lot of Republicans these days who (bafflingly) seem to want to call themselves libertarians.
McArdle doesn't think Taiwan is a country, that NATO is to blame for Russia's invasion of Ukraine, bigotry should not be condemned, and she is an anti-vaxxer. The inmates are running the asylum.
This is another chemjeff sockpuppet, isn't it? Nobody else can squeeze that much CNN opinion into a single sentence.
...and?
Taiwan is the losing side in the Chinese civil war (would the North have tolerated the Confederacy fleeing to Miami Beach and sitting there for 70 years?),
NATO's aggressive expansionism is definitely behind Putin's decision to invade Ukraine,
"Bigotry" is a thought crime that is in the eyes and ears of the beholder and as long as it doesn't involve aggression against another person doesn't violate the NAP,
and all libertarians should be anti-vaccine mandate (while making their own personal decisions about vaccinating).
“Would the North have tolerated the Confederacy fleeing to Miami Beach and sitting there for 70+ years?”
You have the roles reversed - the CCP are slavers, so it’s as if the Confederacy won the US civil war and forced the north to flee. In other words, fuck the CCP slavers and their plans to consume and enslave more peoples.
By the way, what was behind Putin’s invasion of Georgia? It wasn’t NATO, it was the desire for a restored empire. Fuck slave empires, and fuck their apologists too, “Anastasia”.
"By the way, what was behind Putin’s invasion of Georgia?'
Well other than him being a crazy fuck, it could have something to do with the fact that NATO accepted the membership of several new countries a few years earlier in direct contradiction to what NATO had promised them earlier.
I don't think Russia has a right to buffer states, but they do, and it is clear that NATO was doing much to make them think those buffer states would soon become part of the NATO alliance.
"what was behind Putin’s invasion of Georgia? It wasn’t NATO"
Do you have the memory of a goldfish or something? Impending NATO membership was exactly the reason.
"Russia's NATO envoy says offering Georgia membership track would bolster separatists
The Associated Press Published: March 11, 2008
MOSCOW: Putting Georgia on track to join NATO would deepen the divides in the strategically located country and bolster two separatist regions' bids for international recognition, Russia's ambassador to NATO said Tuesday.
The warning from Dmitry Rogozin, in a telephone interview with The Associated Press, appeared to be part of a Russian effort to avert further NATO expansion. It came before an early April summit during which NATO is expected to consider offering Georgia an official route to alliance membership.
https://web.archive.org/web/20080917213218/http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/03/11/europe/EU-GEN-Russia-NATO.php
Also:
"The crisis was linked to the push for Georgia to receive a NATO Membership Action Plan and, indirectly, the unilateral declaration of independence by Kosovo.
Increasing tensions led to the outbreak of the Russo-Georgian War in 2008. After the war, a number of incidents occurred in both conflict zones, and tensions between the belligerents remained high."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Russo-Georgian_diplomatic_crisis
What about Moldova then? They promised not to join NATO ever. And they are too scared of the Russian troops on their territory to attempt a reunification with Romania. Yet Putin is bullying them as well. I don't think Russia's expansionist ideals have to do with NATO, Nazis, or Pride parades. These are merely pretexts.
A more apt observation on your part. It is like Lee defeated Grant and the government headed to Long Island
Fuck military adventurists like you. You don’t belong in the LP.
The desire for what you call a “restored empire” is closely linked to NATO: Russia believes they need many of the former Soviet republics for their security.
Think of it this way: what would America think if Russia or China turned Canada and Mexico into puppet governments and added them to their military alliance?
Canada and Mexico like the US and have many commercial ties with it. Russia's European neighbors, with the exception of Belarus, despise and fear it. Your analogy is not a good one.
The issue isn't whether Russia's European neighbors like or dislike Russia, the issue is whether Russia believes they are threatened if those neighbors are incorporated into NATO.
Would the south tolerate the north fleeing to Nantucket?
Why would the Confederacy want Nantucket?
I hear they have some interesting young men there
because of the myriad rhyming opportunities...duh!
To the first question: if they had done so, would it be appropriate after 70 years of separation to invade them again? Also, you have to give at least some credit to the fact that Taiwan is a reasonably free advanced society and China is China. The specifics matter, just like they did for the US Civil War.
Second, perhaps it does have something to do with Putin getting more aggressive, but once again, who cares? Ukraine wasn't his. They weren't going to join NATO any time soon, but if they did it's their country. It always strikes me as such a weird justification for Putin, to say "well other countries were doing things, could you have expected him not to invade?" Yes, yes I could have. There's questions about what we do in response to it, but it's trivial to say Russia (and China if it invades Taiwan) is wrong. Particularly because you argue from the NAP. So, there ya go. Condemn war.
Bigotry I'm mixed on, as I don't like it. I agree it should not be a political issue. Let folks condemn it as good/bad/neutral/sexy and keep the government largely out of it.
Also, I agree with the last comment.
The Zelinsky govt was prepared (as in they had the physical artillery pieces in position with ammo and orders ready) to massacre thousands of people (Russian speaking ethnic Russians) in the Donbas region within the following week when Russia invaded.
Oh, and yes, they WERE going to join NATO anytime soon, so that NATO could put nukes there that would be less than 5 min away from Moscow. Bush 43 started all this with the withdrawal from the INF treaty.
The US MIC is as pure an evil as has ever existed, and nothing they say should ever be believed.
If your country were in Russia's neighborhood, you would rush to get into NATO as well. Russia has been known to be expansionism and its people to support aggression and violence against "Nazis" (that being defined as anyone who won't be Russia's bitch).
No, China has no right to Taiwan. It’s also not our problem to fix. If you think it is, you don’t believe in the NAP.
The North is Stalin? Mao?
If you believe that she is wrong that NATO goaded Putin into invading Ukraine, you're a Republicrat. McArdle is mainstream LP.
A) Wrong.
B) Fuck the "mainstream LP."
Not wrong. Read some history.
Go vote Republican, then, neocon.
NATO goaded no one into invading anything. Putin has a long term plan to reconsolidate the Old Soviet Empire and seize the oil/wheat fields of Ukraine. He has said it numerous times over the years. That surrounding countries watch what he is doing and try to protect themselves does not seem like an unhinged action to me. Waiting passively to be invaded does.
And if you think it is America’s job to stop this, you simply are not a Libertarian. There is no room for debate on this.
Yes, Putin had that long term plan because he believes that Russia without many of the former Soviet republics is indefensible.
In any case, whatever Putin does to his neighbors for whatever reasons, it’s not our business.
AMF
When has she said these things? Is this based on her interview with Michael Malice? She certainly didn't say any of these things in her interview.
She said that the tweet "Taiwan is a country" is bad messaging for the LP Twitter account, NOT that it wasn't true. She was right. Just tweeting that message with no other context implies that the U.S. should go to war with China if China invades Taiwan. That is not a libertarian stance. You can both think that Taiwan is a country AND want to avoid the political implications of that statement.
She said that pushing for peace is not the same as shilling for Russia. Right again. She mentioned "entangling alliances", which are not libertarian. The peace process will inevitably have to address NATO's expansion.
She didn't say that bigotry should not be condemned. She has a problem with the word "bigotry", as well she should. Its definition has become fluid and controlled by the Left. She herself is not "bigoted" in any way.
Do we own our bodies or does the State own them? If you think that children can be mandated vaccines, then you think the State owns our bodies. Yes, you do. That is not a libertarian position. You can also BOTH think that most vaccines have a positive effect on health and should be recommended, AND be against mandates. She did not speak as to whether vaccines are bad or good. Many mothers, even straight-line Democrats, are starting to question the aggressive vaccination schedules imposed on their children. Where the State quashes debate, there is an opportunity for the LP.
Fucking nailed it. Just showing themselves to be the bad faith actors they are. Deceive and obfuscate, misrepresent, and when pushed back on their bullshit, they engage in sophistry.
Damn straight. I would encourage everyone to listen to that podcast before making claims about not only what went on at the convention but what some of the major actors in the LP have been up to especially in New Hampshire, her stance on numerous issues and where she see's the LP going. Not wild speculation but from her own mouth.
Excellent post. A lot of Republican-Lites around here to refute. Even worse, a few Democrat-Lites.
So basically you are a warmonger and should be voting Republican, anyway. Lindsay Graham really needs your support.
Taiwan isn’t a country. Even Taiwan agrees on that.
Depends. Will a Hillary surrogate be the Lib VP candidate again?
It's too bad the Libertarians are going the way of the Republicans. I feel like we have enough stupid already.
Ahh yes. We should emulate and gain votes from democrats. Can’t go wrong with fucking kids and hormone blockers at 3
Your concern trolling is noted. Libertarians should be ineffectual and join democrats instead.
"Let's be hostile to the Republicans who we share some ideas with, and try to appeal to voters of the most fascist, authoritarian, anti-speech party to exist in the West since the forties."
Open borders Uber alles.
The stupid thing is the Democrats aren’t actually for open borders. Not in any libertarian sense at least.
No. They want massive ILLEGAL immigration as a source of slave labor.
Do you actually believe your comment?
The Republicans, being an essentially infinitely more liberty focused party than the Democrats, who are very little removed from the CCP, it makes sense that there would be similarity. The only real problems with Republicans is too many of them are in bed with the MIC and that many are statists in general.
It is interesting that Welch thinks 2 data points is a trend. But if it is a trend, then a trend of what?
"The most paradoxically impressive result in that stretch might be the one most recent: Jo Jorgensen... produced the party's second-highest presidential vote percentage"
That isn't IMPRESSIVE. It was a massive catastrophe. It was a 50% loss of support between elections. If you are to believe that Johnson and Weld were so successful as to build 3% support for Libertarians, then you have to conclude that Jorgensen *lost* that support.
This whole, "She doesn't have name recognition" nonsense is just that: nonsense. 1.5% of the population didn't just forget that the Libertarian party existed. They knew about the party- decided to support it in 2016, and 4 years later decided not to.
If you looked at a company's sales and saw that they were reduced in half year over year, you would not accept someone saying "We don't need a change! We had the second highest revenue ever last year!"
I also like that losing 2/3 of the votes from 2016 was still the second best run for the Party. It's borderline pathetic.
It's not borderline
But Welch might be! Zing!
It's called lying. It's pretty popular trend among the Reasonistas these days.
It's the smell of elitism being brought low. And it smells like heaven.
And you're being generously isolationist in your analysis. If you look at Samsung, Huawei, and Apple competing in the cellphone market and 2016-2020 Samsung comes back with better numbers, Huawei beats them with an unprecedentedly historic sales jump, overall cell phone sales were up 2016-2020, and Apple *still* reports a 50% loss, Apple *should* be doing something drastic or thinking about closing up shop.
This whole, "She doesn't have name recognition" nonsense is just that: nonsense. 1.5% of the population didn't just forget that the Libertarian party existed. They knew about the party- decided to support it in 2016, and 4 years later decided not to.
*raises hand*
Yep.
Me three.
No joke. I was going to vote for Johnson until I walked into my polling place and was essentially confronted by Demofascists telling me who to vote for (which is supposed to be illegal). I voted for Trump just as an FU to those harpies (and because my vote in NJ didn’t matter anyway)
In 2020 I was out as soon as Jojo’s zoomer media runner told me I had to be a Neo-Racist.
All I know is I'm absolutely enjoying the salt mining. It's delicious.
We had the second highest revenue ever last year!
More days in first place.
It’s motivated reasoning from Welch.
Hate to break this to you Welch, but Weld wasn't a libertarian and neither are you or the new Reason and Cato crew. Illya Shapiro was the last ,and you clowns just turfed him.
Fortunately the LP rank and file didn't want to watch the same sort of progressive takeover of the party, and rejected your group.
Always relevant tweet:
"Now would be a good time to throw a big cocktail party in New York or Washington, and invite every single conservative writer you know. #RedWedding2"
https://twitter.com/mattwelch/status/1102654202545913857?s=12
Agreed. If the sub human scum at reason and Cato want to be taken seriously they need to go back to first principals
I'm good with that.
Welch and his totalitarian leftist friends aren't going to fare well when their guests come expecting a fight.
Who exactly are the new Reason and Cato crew? Welch has been here for decades.
He's been with Reason for thirteen years. I'm not up on Woke math so maybe you can explain to me how that equals "decades".
Speaking of Shapiros, Ben Shapiro is more of a Libertarian than Welch. That hurts.
Oh and one other thing: I can count on one or two hands the number of times that Reason actually bothered to cover the internal politics of the LP outside of the presidential election cycle. Usually, it is a single article dryly reporting on what happened at the convention. No opinions or concern trolling, just reporting.
The fact that the MC has gotten Welch suddenly concerned about the best way to build the LP brand is evidence enough that the party needed a shake up. Reason writers regularly discuss the wonkish internal politics of the GOP and DNC- opining on Speaker of the House nominations, and party leadership. They talk about it all the time.
If Reason is ostensibly a libertarian rag, then you would think they'd spare at least nearly as much time worrying over the minutia of politicking in the Libertarian Party. But they couldn't give two fucks until MC suddenly took over. And that says something. Maybe the problem isn't the Mises Caucus. Maybe the problem is that that the existing leadership, and their like-minded, Urbanite, Blue-State peers at Reason have been living in a bubble for 10 years, and need to spend some time outside of DC, New York, and Chicago.
Well said Overt.
Speaking of which,
What the fuck is up with the CA Libertarian Party?
The people running for Senate right now are the biggest crop of losers I've yet seen run, and there's not a single libertarian among them, big "L" or small.
The LP is always going to be an also ran until it can appeal to more than us contrarian cranks who will debate ad nauseam about the NAP. So, instead we get square dance caller champions as our candidates. I'm not a registered libertarian, but voted that way in both past presidential elections.
Look, I joined the LP back in the 70's, cast my first votes as a Libertarian, was a serious activist for a couple decades.
We always recognized that we were in a dangerous position as a third party, because we were trying to displace the parties that were writing the rules. We had to grow so fast that, by the time they recognized we were a threat, we'd be too big to easily rig things against us.
We didn't grow fast enough. They saw the threat while we were still small, got together, and rigged things up the wazoo. Campaign finance laws to starve us of funds. Ballot access laws to waste our money just getting on the ballot while they got on automatically. Persuading pollsters to stop including us in the numbers. Kicking the League of Women voters out of running the debates because they included us. When we qualified for matching funding they just arbitrarily changed the rules. They don't even report how many votes we get on election night, we're being airbrushed out of existence.
The last two Presidential elections were different in only one way: The Democrats, and the establishment Republican party, saw the LP as a useful spoiler to harm Trump's chances.
If they don't need a spoiler in 2024, we'll be thrown to the back of the bus again.
And, you know, when all this became apparent, a lot of serious Libertarians decided they were wasting their time, and jumped ship, leaving the LP to be run by grifters and people content to be big fish in a small pond.
Maybe serious people can recapture the LP from the grifters, but that won't change the fact the Democrats and Republicans are making the rules.
*applause break*
Yeah that pretty much sums it up.
I agree with JasonAZ.
Both Welch and Smith have been on Kennedy several times. Don’t know if they were ever on at the same time. But the seethe coming from Welchie boy is delicious.
Bring back Kemle Foster(sp)!
He's a raging lefty psychopath with a stupid looking Howdy Doody face.
^THIS
Cheers
I'd bet good money none of the Reason fugazis were even there at the convention. If the MC hadn't won they probably wouldn't have even mentioned the story at all.
And since voting is a waste of time and America’s failed-fixed system is unaffected by anything libertarians do or believe…
I said it then and I'll say it now. It's an unequivocal fact that Ron Paul came closer to winning the Presidency in 2016 than any LP candidate in the last 50 yrs.
As ENB likes to say, good riddance to the Ron Paul racists. Ignore that he ran actual libertarian principles and brought many into the party.
No. Good riddance to racists.
Go vote for Democrats, Fascist loser.
Stop trying to make your spooning partner Justin Amash a thing Matt.
Oh Jesus. I didn't even read far enough in to realize they Walsh fellated Amash in this article. He then goes on to say Amash doesn't want to be bothered with questions about the parallels between vaccine passports and "Papieren, bitte." or explaining how we've had a black President, but not a libertarian President. JFC, regardless of how you feel about the MC, you're effectively saying Amash won't run because he doesn't want to be bothered with defending libertarianism. Fine, GTFO. Go run with Bill Weld.
Amash is about as Libertarian as Bill Weld...
I say this, because neither generally espouse libertarian ideas, unless doing so as an attack against Republicans.
Seriously, how can anybody see Bill Weld as a serious Libertarian candidate? Weld and Amash are just TDS suffering idiots. No surprise that Welsh and Reason support them both!
Sad thing is Trump was probably the closest we’ve ever had to a Libertarian President, too. Closest, don’t misconstrue me here. But he was for smaller government, less regulation, and wasn’t against gay marriage or marijuana. He also didn’t start any new wars for the first time since…. I can’t actually remember the last President not to start a war.
The bump stock ban was garbage.
The only reason he did the bump stock ban was that the NRA leadership had decided to throw bump stock owners under the bus, and told him it was OK to do it. I can blame him for wanting to, I never thought he was particularly principled, but I blame LaPierre for telling him to go ahead.
That's practically libel. You're still butthurt that Amash voted to impeach Trump for obstruction. [Insert bullshit MAGA talking point about him opposing Trump and Trump's tariffs only because he's getting rich off Communist China.]
It's evident that Amash is more consistently and philosophically libertarian than Weld, Johnson, or Barr. As a Republican House member, he was the most libertarian person in Congress---more libertarian than Rand Paul, more libertarian even than Thomas Massie---and he explained his votes in detail to his constituents for transparency's sake.
Unfortunately the immediate future of the LP has been taken from people like Amash, Sharpe, and Cohen, and placed in the hands of Hoppean edgelords, sovereign citizens, and alleged comedians who "understand the concerns" of actual alt-right nationalists.
You're still butthurt that Amash voted to impeach Trump for obstruction.
I didn't say anything about "Trump!". By all means, continue to sacrifice 50% of your popularity on the altar, clinger.
Republicans dislike Amash. Most Libertarians like him or are fine with him, except those who despise any ex-Republican former officeholder that enters the party and those who actually bought the Trump/Meadows talking points. Amash's libertarian credentials are solid.
That's 50% of what popularity, sacrificed on whose altar, Filthy Casual?
The only obstruction there was against Trump. Biden was up to his armpits in Ukrainian corruption for his own personal enrichment. Quid Pro Joe is the one who needs impeaching.
If we wanted to impeach Trump it should have been for his unconstitutional bump stock ban.
No, they got him on obstruction because, despite no "Russian collusion," they knew Trump wouldn't be able to resist interfering in the Mueller investigation. It's his way.
The new LP has already lost my support by dropping abortion rights from its platform. I'll vote for the Democrats if that's what it takes to keep the state from forcing women to bear unwanted children.
Oh well.
Same here. But I can't bring myself to vote for Democrats. I think I will have to sit things out.
There are incorruptible libertarians and voting for them still repeals bad laws. By all means, let Jeremy's parents donate his allowance, and for the anarcho-facist Mises takeover? Not a penny!
It is quite interesting that Abortion is the only reason people tended to support the LP.
As a pro-life libertarian who isn't a fan of the Mises Caucus, yeah, I don't get it. People have their sacred cows.
Your concern trolling is noted. Please return to the DNC.
You’ve always been a democrat. Stop lying.
Why would you be an LP party member for the abortion rights only?
Anything that helps get rid of the Nixon party, as taken over by the Prohibition party in 1920, the Klan in 1928, George Wallace racial collectivism in 1972 and economy-wrecking asset looting in 1986 can't be all bad, but voting looter ain't that thing. I'll vote for select libertarian candidates, and never trash another vote on either looter soft machine. Leverage, the thing that makes the income tax rot economies, also multiplies small party clout.
I’m confused here. Nixon was a Republican; George Wallace and the Klan were always owned by Democrats.
If you’re willing to vote for those totalitarian assholes over the right to kill your kids, then you weren’t a libertarian. Fuck, just abstain from voting.
I too am so appalled that the Libertarian Party may no longer oppose criminalizing murder that I am tempted to vote for the people who openly want to take away my right to armed self defense.
Yup yup.
Nothing fills me with more rage than someone telling me that I have to give up my guns because ~10 kids a year die in school shootings, but that the most important thing, actually, is that Planned Parenthood be allowed to kill > 600,000 kids a year.
Ok murder supporter
Is it too hard to admit that egalitarian ideals are incompatible with libertarian ones?
Is it too hard for you to stop hiding behind weasel words like "egalitarian ideals"?
Libertarians strongly defend equality under the law; libertarians strongly oppose making equality of outcome the objective of government policy.
Oh sod off. This was in reference to a conversation I had with our resident individualist. The egalitarian ideals I'm cheering the death of was the statement in the charter that read: "we condemn bigotry".
Well, why don't you say what you mean then, instead of using weasel words like "egalitarian ideals"?
Because that was how he described himself.
Expecting people promoting equality to defend your liberty is like buying your coke from a guy who cuts it with Drano.
Libertarians are against artificial state privilege. We are intellectually descended from the English Levellers. We believe strongly in equality before the law. So, yes, contrary to people such as Hoppe, libertarianism is in an important sense egalitarian.
Who gives a shit? The L party will always be ineffective and weird.
History is full of weirdo takeovers of countries.
Or I could put it this way: You know who else was an ineffective weirdo?
Sadly, all I got out of this article was that the author doesn't want to see mean tweets. What kind of light-weight is this Welch guy?
Lighter than David Spade.
Welch is a republican infiltrator.
Welch is a Republican? Uh, yeah……. Ok.
Says the Objectivist.
Seems more like a Democrat to me
Hardline proggies and Randians can sound very similar on some issues, abortion in particular.
I think his point was that mean tweets will repel any potential converts to Libertarianism from among current Democrat voters.
Why? Democrats have the meanest tweets that would be fodder for defamation cases if wonderful DC judges didn’t decide that members of congress can defame anyone they want.
He's certainly not a libertarian. I don't understand why he is a contributor to this publication.
Only here is 3% winning,
Bikers take pride in being part of the 1%.
The two campaigns closest to the Mises Caucus ideal, 1988 Paul/Marrou and 2005 Badnarik/Campagna, had popular vote totals of less than half a percent.
Now I dearly love Ron Paul, but no way is his 0.47% better than Gary Johnson's 0.99% and 3.28% results. Not even the Woke's New Woke Math can reverse those.
The problem is that while libertarian purism may sell to the edgelord choir, it does not sell to the average voter. The idea that a Dave Smith campaign can bring in all the voters is fucking stupid. Not while the purity police are out and about trying to find witches. Might pick up some votes from the authoritarian alt-Right who confuse libertarian for contrarian, but the popular vote will stink worse than Barr/WAR's 0.40%.
The cultural contrarians have taken over. They're not libertarians, just they automatically gainsay anything vaguely mainstream.
Why would you even care since you're just going to vote for whoever the democratic candidate is anyway?
Presidential runs are the wrong way to do it anyway. There's no chance of a party with no representation elsewhere in government taking the presidency.
The LP, and Reason as well, doesn't want to focus on the small races that can ultimately have real change though. Non-federal governments. It's harder because it's more diffuse, but that's also really the point of parties. The ballot access thing is important, and the system is stacked against them, but I hope they can push to at least get people running. Get a LP candidate running in as many elections in the US as you can.
The ballot access thing is important, and the system is stacked against them, but I hope they can push to at least get people running.
And, with the Gary Johnson/Jo Jorgensen/Justin Amash contingent, ideology (or lack thereof) is against them as well. You can't be a pro-minority/pro-equality/pro-BLM party and catering to the same demograhic(s) in NYC, Portland, Atlanta, and everywhere in between. Hell, you can't even do it between Staten Island, Manhattan, and The Bronx.
Saying you're an individualist while holding up your fist and shouting "BLM!" neither wins friends with individualists or BLM. They're mutually incompatible concepts.
Being more clear: Scott Shackford's messages about gay rights may resonate in New York and San Francisco, but is going to fall flat anywhere that can even loosely associate with Memories Pizza in Walkerton, IN or Gibson's Bakery in Oberlin, OH.
Depends what gay rights are. Most Americans think gay people have the right to live and marry whomever they want (over the age of consent). A lot of us are just tired of being told we’re bigots for not celebrating the gay lifestyle 24/7.
It is noteworthy that this is one of the main planks of McCardle's strategy as LP Chair: finding candidates in winnable races and putting the resources behind them to win elections.
There's no such thing as winnable races. There are winnable candidates. These are people active and prominent in their community, often with ties to government via the legal profession or to existing office holders, who are really interested in the nitty gritty of politics and politicking, and willing to devote years of their lives to it and usually find it fun. For the most part, such people have no interest in minor political parties, and in fact the Libertarian Party selects against people with such profiles.
Sure, but that is just semantics. Call it what you will- their point is that even a very charismatic person probably won't win a senate race in a battleground state. However, as AOC proved, sometimes the right person in a third party can challenge the incumbents that take their seat for granted.
It's not just semantics. There are certain persons who have the inclination and aptitude to do well in politics. Yes, there are far more of them running for low-level offices, simply because there are far more of such offices than there are high-level ones. And it's not just government offices, but influential posts outside of government, such as in major political parties, organizations like the PTA, labor unions, and chambers of commerce, from which they might either enter government, influence those who do, or attract mass or elite followings who then might influence government. And if they don't win this election, they might win the next one for the same or another office, or one after that. However, these personality types tend to be anti-ideologic and uninterested in philosophy generally.
AOC is an actor hired by Justice Democrats who got too big for them.
This is true, and people have been shouting this at the party for decades now. I've walked precincts for local Libertarian Party candidates, and they win. And then they go to state LP conventions with the talk of "How I Won as an LP Candidate" and the gist of the answer is "I walked precincts and got other people to walk precincts as well".
I'm also friends with an former Republican office holder in a major Democrat city. His explanation for how he won: He got volunteers out to every single precinct in the city.
But the LP now thinks the secret to winning it doing a Hail Mary pass with Dave Smith. Damn.
Not even the Woke's New Woke Math can reverse those.
You're using The Woke's New Woke Math to make your argument. The only two people on that list that can claim as having rightfully scored a point in any Presidential election are Ron Paul and John Hospers. The rest are just team mascots that were more/less popular with the fans.
John Hospers did get an electoral vote. Ron Paul never got any. Sure he got elected, repeatedly, but never as a Libertarian Party candidate, only as Republican. Therein lies the problem.
"The problem is that while libertarian purism may sell to the edgelord choir, it does not sell to the average voter."
Here we have another example of this game that Brandy likes to play. In another article he'll complain that the MC is pandering to the right by (say) de-emphasizing Abortion and Anti-bigotry social signaling. In this article, he'll claim that they are being too doctrinaire.
The only way that works is if doctrinaire libertarianism is basically conservatism. But he doesn't mean that at all, he is just choosing the argument that is most convenient at the time.
He does that a lot. Must be a tic.
And the job of the LP is to change the average voter's mind.
Actually, they are libertarians; you are not. You are a progressive and a populist.
Brandy is definitely not a populist.
He's a shallow dimwit who likes to signal to leftists, and one of the main ways of doing that is by touting e parts and repeating whatever the establishment sentiment is.
> And the job of the LP is to change the average voter's mind.
The job of the LP is to get libertarian candidates elected. Part of that is ideological outreach, but the other part is actually getting people elected. Endless purity pogroms do not do that.
If the impure are unacceptable then stop being a party and reform as a debate club.
The job of the LP is to advance libertarianism. Libertarianism isn't a tool to get LP candidates elected. If the only way to get Libertarian candidates elected is to abandon libertarianism, I say shut that sucker down, it has no purpose for existing.
People oppose totalitarian leftism.
Sorry that's happening to you.
You know who the LP is never going to peal votes from?
Woke ass Democrats.
utterly cluelessly
Another reason article complaining that libritarianz are taking over the Libritarian party
As of the MC takeover, the LP was on the ballot in 36 jurisdictions (35 States plus DC). Alabama and Iowa were added just before the Convention.
MC, your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to get LP Ballot Access for the remaining 15 States for both the 2022 and 2024 National Elections. That will prove that you are on a par with the previous Administrations, who routinely achieved 50 State plus DC Ballot Access in Presidential Election years.
You claim you can do better? Prove it!
Why?
What has the LP ever won?
You seem to think the purpose of the LP is to win elections, that is, to win enough votes to gain office.
In this belief, you are in agreement with the mainstream media, who endlessly ask third party candidates, “You can’t win, so why are you running?” and “Aren’t you just a spoiler?”
This completely misunderstands the actual historical role of third parties in American politics, which is to win enough hearts and minds that a major Party will adopt their most popular position(s) in hopes of acquiring their voters.
Read respected historian Eric Foner. “Free Soil, Free Labor, Free Men” to learn how the Liberty Party begat the Free Soil Party begat the Republican Party begat the Civil War and freed four million slaves.
Or just read the Wikipedia entries for the Liberty Party and the Free Soil Party.
Go look at the first LP platform of more than 50 years ago. How many ideas have been adopted by one or both major parties? Gay marriage. legal marijuana (27 States and counting), privatization (thanks largely to Bob Poole, who coined the word), and so on. Stay tuned, there will be more.
When Ben Shapiro describes himself as “a libertarian on that particular issue”, he and his audience both know what the word means, and they respect it, even if he’s not a libertarian on every issue.
And that is a huge victory, even if we never elect anyone.
We’ve changed the culture — and that’s more important tan any number of votes.
Please rethink your position.
Ah, so you're taking credit for gay marriage and weed.
Ok, cool.
However I notice the federal government has grown immensely more powerful in the time the LP has existed, to the point we're now on the brink of totalitarianism that's further reaching than any in human history.
The LP bragged about taking enough votes from Trump to throw the election to the totalitarian left, which has destroyed most of this country in just 16 months.
The LP's most well known message from the 2020 election cycle was an endorsement of race essentialist marxism.
The LP is destructive to its stated goals at a national level.
If they genuinely want to increase liberty, they'll give up the presidential vanity pursuit that can only serve to sabotage the candidate most aligned with their supposed goals, and look for municipal and county offices to fill.
Why not pick a couple counties and cities and try to get in a number of libertarian candidates. Show what a libertarian controlled government can do.
10/10
This is too bad. I do think there is a real desire for a fiscally conservative, socially liberal party. Now is a time that message could make gains with the former President having an oversized influence in the Republican Party. I don't think the LP could get the Presidency, but it could gain Congressional seats in Republican leaning districts where the Republican nominee is a nut case.
I think the evidence is that people want a socially conservative, fiscally liberal party more than anything.
There may be such a desire, but that's not libertarianism.
It’s a damn sight closer than what we have today.
No, it's not. Libertarianism stands for limited government and personal responsibility.
Whether you are "socially conservative" or "socially liberal" is your personal choice, and you'll have to live with the consequences of your lifestyle choices.
Furthermore, limited government means very low taxes and very low spending, while "fiscal conservatism" merely means balanced budgets at whatever level of spending is considered politically desirable.
Personal responsibility? Like wearing a mask during a pandemic?
Or staying home from work while you're sick with a contagious disease? Or telling your employees to stay home from work while they're sick with a contagious disease?
No, "personal responsibility" does not mean that some yahoo pulls some causal relationship out of their ass and tells you what to do... or else.
What "personal responsibility" actually means is that whatever choices you make, you accept the consequences of your choice and don't try to socialize the cost of your choices.
The science on masks reducing covid transmission is well established. A quick search brings up lots of other studies supporting this.
We're not discussing the efficacy of masks, we are discussing personal responsibility.
Personal responsibility means you make the decisions and you live with the consequences. Sometimes, those decisions are going to be wrong and the consequences are going to be bad.
That is, personal responsibility (in the libertarian sense) doesn't mean "making the responsible choice", it means "taking responsibility for your choices".
Let's stipulate that that is true. The question is: so what? Reducing COVID transmission merely means that instead of getting COVID within three months, you get it within six months.
In fact, reducing COVID transmission without preventing is likely a bad idea. That's in addition to the serious costs and consequences associated with mask wearing.
And that's the problem with half-wits like you: you parrot scientific factoids without any clear understanding of what they mean or imply.
That study is about how a mask might work with no real world data. It does not show at all wearing a mask reduces risk or infection. Only RCT trials can show that. And all of the published RCT trials involving mask use show no statistically significant difference between mask and no mask.
The science on masks reducing covid transmission is well established as literally not having an effect. Cherry pick more, please.
Like wearing a mask during a pandemic?
No, that's virtue signaling. Instead do things that matter.
Your mask fetish is collectivism, and as far from personal responsibility as it gets
Oh fuck off.
You are way off base. Socially liberal means fewer government regulations. It means government doesn't pick your recreational drugs, it doesn't regulate your reproductive health, it doesn't tell you who to love, ect.
Fiscal conservative means you pay for the services you get. No more putting it on the credit card. When people have to pay for services they can decide if you really want them.
What "socially liberal" means in the US political system is mandated support for socially liberal views: anti-discrimination laws, socialization of the cost of drug abuse/promiscuity/obesity, government financed abortions, among other things. That is not libertarian.
Libertarianism says that these are not valid government policies. Instead, under libertarianism, private mechanisms and personal responsibility end up dealing with those issues. And the resulting society ends up rather socially conservative in practice, because if the government doesn't bail you out, you cannot engage in most of those "socially liberal" practices because you simply can't afford to pay for the consequences.
Libertarian societies don't impose social conservatism as a matter of policy or law, they just end up in practice imposing social conservatism because the costs of social liberalism can't be socialized anymore.
Correct. And that is not the same as small government. For example, many European nations are fiscally conservative, but they have high spending and high taxes. That is not libertarian.
Well said.
Problem is that I think your idea of a small government is similar to the government of a third world nation. Can you provide an example of a first world nation that does not have a large government? The closest you might find is the Disney Area in Florida, but the government is attempting to take that over.
I think that socially liberal people do take responsibility for their actions. Alcohol is a legal drug and we expect people to use it in an acceptable way. Why not do the same with other drugs. Say it is the person's responsibility to use them in an acceptable manner. Same with abortion. If a person is not ready to be a parent let them end the pregnancy. What is irresponsible about a person chose to live life with the person they love or to be the person they feel they are.
Government spending as percentage of GDP was less than 5% in most first world nations until WWII.
Democrats and progressives do not.
What you "expect" is irrelevant. What matters is who picks up the cost for the consequences of your choices. The fact is that the costs resulting from lifestyle choices like alcoholism, promiscuity, drug addiction, and gluttony are all socialized. In a free market, your insurance rates would increase severalfold for any of those behaviors.
Yes, same with abortion: other people shouldn't be forced to pay for it, you should have to disclose when asked about it, you will have to accept the fact that health insurers are likely going to greatly increase your premiums after an abortion, and you will have to accept that private employers and landlords may discriminate against you after an abortion.
Wrong. Your medical history is your private business. You should never be required to disclose it involuntarily.
In a free/libertarian society, you would not be "required to disclose it involuntarily"; you would be required to disclose it voluntarily as part of entering into a voluntary contractual relationship in which the other party makes disclosing such information a condition of entering into the contract.
It is socialist/progressive ideology and policies that interferes with such free, private contractual relationships. And this is one of the mechanisms in which medical costs are socialized and in which people are forced to bear the costs of other people's irresponsible behavior.
Then I don't want to live in your "free/libertarian" society. It should not be possible to sign away one's basic human rights in a "voluntary contractual relationship".
You're not "signing away" anything, you are entering a contract. As part of this contract, the other party (a health insurer) "If you want us to insure you at a low-risk rate of $500/month, you must certify that you have never had an abortion, have never smoked, have never had an STI, and are of normal weight; if you are unwilling to certify this, or if you experience these events after entering the contract, your insurance rate will be $2000/month to reflect the higher risk you represent".
What you want is to force companies to disregard such relevant information, forcing people who live a healthy lifestyle to pay the same insurance rates as people who make risky choices, with the inevitable consequence that the costs of risky behavior are socialized. The ACA, in fact, explicitly prohibits using such information to set insurance rates, despite the demonstrably much higher risks that people who experience such events represent.
Of course you don't want to live in such a society because you favor socializing the cost of risky behaviors, because your mind has been warped by Marxism, because you despise free markets, and because you resent the idea that people should be responsible for the consequences of their actions and choices.
Well you come up with a small government first world nation 80 years ago. Lots of things have changed since then. Could you come up with a government example more recent. Maybe something where car and air travel are common place, where people use computers, where doctors have antibiotics to treat infections?
Yes: economic growth has stagnated, liberty and privacy have been destroyed, Europe has been run by socialists and fascists, and the US has been run by progressives.
Transportation and healthcare are two areas in which big, progressive government has had the most pernicious and harmful effects on the market and the well-being of citizens. So, I'm not sure what your point is.
America has no socially liberal party. Only a socially totalitarian one. The other party just doesn’t want freaks trying to fuck their children, or brainwash them into mutilating their genitals.
"I do think there is a real desire for a fiscally conservative, socially liberal party."
Sure. But if you talk to actual libertarians/Libertarians, that's never been you guys. Doesn't look like it's the new guys either.
There is a need to repeal cruel and coercive laws. Libertarian spoiler votes do that. That's the whole reason for looters infiltrating and assassinating the party.
I'd also call out that the Libertarian Party failed to become that party, or to express its values.
Understand that "Socially Liberal" means tolerating all social beliefs. That may mean tolerating things like drug use, promiscuity, and even racist bigotry. That is what it truly means to be liberal- it means to allow all these things liberally.
The Libertarian party of the last 10 years has not been Socially Liberal. It has been a "Pick Me!" kid of leftist contrarians. They haven't been interested in pushing the notions of liberty- which include the right to be wrong. Instead they have been right there with the Left being obsessed with Bigotry and shouting "Bake the damn cake" as if religious freedom is an inconvenient thing to be kept quiet.
In the last 10 years, the LP has harmed the cause of liberty by 1) declining to find a message that preaches the primacy of liberty and 2) amplifying the deeply authoritarian message of the Left. ("Just bake the cake!", Weld essentially endorsing Clinton).
The net result of this confusing message from the LP was that we lost an entire generation of potential libertarians. Instead of showing left leaning kids that tolerance and free market decisions can create a better world, told kids that the leftist rage against Racism and Bigotry was absolutely correct while failing to support what the left (and these kids) know is necessary to institute that agenda (mandates, and anti-discrimination legislation). Instead of showing right leaning kids an alternative path, the Libertarian party showed them that they would be branded racists no matter what they say, and that the libertarian party would rather join with leftists in calling them names rather than build a coalition. And so those right-leaning kids were destined for MAGA land.
The Libertarian Party has claimed that one of its key purposes is to educate people about the cause of liberty. No one can look at the statements from Bill Weld in support of Clinton and think that they did that in 2016. Rather than acting like the mature one, telling the kids to stop play in the mud with Republicans and Democrats, the Libertarians spent too much time acting like Referees- referees who had an enormous soft spot for the left.
Baked into Heise's optimism is the assumption that the prior L.P. leaders, campaigns, and candidates that the Mises Caucus repudiates—including former three-time national chair (2014–2020) Nicholas Sarwark, the team behind Jo Jorgensen's 2020 campaign, and, above all, 2016 vice presidential candidate Bill Weld—repelled potential voters with milquetoast messaging.
Well, as a member of John Q Public, and being the customer or "poll subject" to be more to the point, is the Poll subject ever "wrong" and is his answer to be discarded to get the better result? If your answer is "no" then here's my perception of the Libertarian party and Movement in general: Yeah, it seemed like it wanted to lean woke to appeal to that desired demo, young people. And Jo Jorgensen's pandering to BLM-- (a now wholly discredited organization that has essentially
stolendiverted millions of dollars to the personal bank accounts of its shady founders with zero accountability, while stoking riots which burned several American cities, killed people and did nothing but divide Americans) --- certainly turned me off from voting the LP candidate.Having pathetic opposition in the Democrat and Republican parties is really no measure of success.
2016 we had Trump and Hillary
2020 we had Trump and Biden
The fact that the LP didn't actually take the presidency in those two elections shows that something needed to change.
Having a libertarian presidential candidate is a waste of time and money. They need to build a constituency. Why don’t they put the mm eh k to getting some LO candidates into congress. They ought to be able to flip a house or two each election cycle. That adds up. Maybe there will be a vulnerable senate seat at some point.
I agree here. If the LP party focused on Congress, they could get seats. If they had enough seats, greater than the difference between two major parties, they would have powers. They could go to either party offer their votes on a bill if it includes items they want.
The laws. Idiots think changing the geezer in front of the teleprompter is important. Cops shoot people because of what bad laws say, not confused geezers. Libertarian spoiler votes force looters to repeal murdering laws. Bad laws teach people of Sopaters IQ that the initiation of force is goood. Then turn around and use the results to argue against the Bill of Rights
President Joe Biden, meanwhile, is not only old and unpopular; a majority of Democrats and Democrat-leaners want another candidate to run in the 2024 primaries.
Well durr...
If you spent 2019 reading the Dem-leaning zeitgeist (aka, the media) then that was obvious in... 2019. Biden was a placeholder. When the Spanish propped El Cid on his horse and sent him onto the battlefield, they didn't actually believe he'd run the country for the next four years after that.
For the past couple of decades, the LP has been dragging libertarianism through the mud; I don't want those people to win elections.
Now, if only Reason and Cato would be kind enough to stop pretending that they are libertarians...
Reason is a joke, and I think I trust Kate Kaelin more than I trust Cato.
Ugh, another thing:
"Newly elected Party Chair Angela McArdle in her winning pitch to delegates repeatedly stressed the primacy of "bold messaging," particularly on social media."
This is, frankly, horseshit. But it is exactly the horseshit Welsh wants to fling at the Mises Caucus. He wants readers here to think that all McCardle put forward was a teenager's ramblings on using TikTok for likes. Whether you like or dislike her strategy, this is such a terrible take that one almost HAS to assume Welch is being intentionally malicious.
Here is the strategy:
https://angelamcardlecom.files.wordpress.com/2022/03/angela-4-lnc-chair-strategic-plan-table-book-1.pdf
Let us note that it is 40 Pages long, though it has large type. "Bold" appears 9 times in that paper, and only because one (of several) strategic pillars is to "Find and amplify candidates who use bold messaging".
And this isn't just "We're gonna use Social Media." It is a deliberate focus on identifying these candidates who punch above their weight in winnable elections and getting their message amplified for the future.
Now again, you may say that is a good strategy or a bad one, but McCardle also calls out several other things, including:
1) Setting a real set of strategic goals in place. For example "10% of the vote by 2030, and one congressional seat".
2) Creating coalitions built around single issues like "Anti-Mandates" that allow them to draw large groups of people from across the political spectrum.
3) Develop national training programs for candidates to help them navigate the election process.
4) Align the party's resources behind the specific issues and candidates.
Further, she has plotted out the committees that the national party needs to push forward, and has identifies the many skillsets that must be on each committee.
This is not a full plan, but she has assembled a plan for a plan, and it is pretty fucking comprehensive. To demean it to being just about "bold messaging" is not only distasteful, but it is a great example of Welch not knowing what his fucking job is here at Reason. (Hint: Your job is to inform people of the issues, not shape fact narratives.)
This is why I spend at least 2x the amount of time reading the comments as the article itself. The article is usually nothing more than a long headline. The comments are where actually facts, data, substance, and analysis come in.
Thanks for the reporting!
Only 2X?
^ Well said.
Welch is proving that the LP, a party that was supposed to be about long-term, post-partisan thinking, has become click-bait. And not even the good kind of clickbait where "Reason number 4" actually does kind of surprise you a little. The kind of clickbait where go in expecting to get a handful of life hacks and wind up with with an article about systemic racism, an ad for "The Gay History of Washington DC" disguised as an article, and a not-so-well disguised article for Kim Kardashian's new line of lingerie that's a not-so-well disguised rebranding of 50s and 60s era control top and slimming underwear.
And not even the good kind of clickbait where "Reason number 4" actually does kind of surprise you a little.
Ok, I actually laughed out loud on that one.
Man, posts like this are the only reason I slog through here anymore. Well done!
"But what is indisputable is that the Libertarian Party has never had an electoral stretch as successful on the presidential level as 2012–2020"
But it was still a miserable, total failure, during a period when it should have been a resounding success.
Exactly. Why vote for Johnson/Weld and lose when you could vote for Hillary and be part of the (presumably at the time) winning team?
Why vote for JoJo when you could vote for Biden/Harris and be both woke AND a winner?
Why vote for a party that never takes a strong stance for liberty when you could at least vote for Trump as a clear F.U. to the enemies of liberty (that does not make him a friend, mind you... just an eventually push-back against anti-liberty people... he was the only person speaking out against Dem craziness, doesn't mean he was also sane, though)?
If the Libertarian party can't get people energized during a period of international lockdowns by so-called liberal western Democracies, you're never going to generate interest in Liberty.
I don't know what the LP's position was during the Trucker protest in Canada, for instance, but the fact that I DON'T know what their position was during the Trucker protest tells me all I need to know about how willing to get messaging out they were.
This article appears to miss the point. With the heavy biases against 3rd parties built into the system, Libertarians can't win a major race. It just isn't going to happen. So the vote totals are of little importance. What is important is the opportunity to get libertarian (small L) messaging in front of the masses with a campaign. If we can get enough people interested, then we might see some of the restrictions relax and then have a fighting chance.
then we might see some of the restrictions relax and then have a fighting chance.
Whatever, I don't want to talk about Vaccine passports and national lockdowns. Those are distractions from the real danger: Trump.
Your candidate's known message in 2020 was stumping for BLM/marxism
To be fair, there is such a thing as Libertarian Marxism, so... maybe she was one of those.
Jumbo Shrimp, etc.
Libertarians won every major race except the one with the anarchist on the ticket. Every pregnant lady who did not die from coathanger abortions, every young person not shot to death over plant leaves, the halt of federal payroll growth were all Libertarian wins. Parasites naturally imagine "winning" is getting their gang a hand in the till.
The first thing to do is get rid of the silly NAP. The existence of government already violates the NAP.
Gorbag: "We need to destroy libertarianism to save libertarianism."
See? Anarcho-fascist equivocation, just as Ambrose Bierce explained it over a century ago. Anarchists wrecked the LP.
I hope I am wrong, but I foresee the Mises takeover as pretty much being the end of the LP. The defining characteristic of the Mises group was their adherence to absolute rigid ideological purity. Unfortunately this has led them to adopt an "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" policy and their enemy is ALWAYS the government. So anybody willing to say anything negative about the government is automatically brought into the fold. So on Rockwell.com we got to hear from the Herman-Hoppes and the North's who would trash the federal government right up to the day they would take away all of our freedoms with a King of the Bible. Or even worse from a long line of medical quacks who had on common that they didn't like the FDA and vice versa.
In 2022 aligning with everyone who doesn't like the government is a recipe for disaster. You're going to get the motliest assembly of anti-Vaxxers, crypto-enthusiasts, flat-earthers, election faruders, Southern Priders, and the worst of them all, paleo-libertarians who have really been indistinguishable from Conservatives all along.
Good riddance then. The "LP" that existed before the takeover did not deserve to exist; it gave libertarianism a bad name.
Simultaneously deriding the MC for their ideological purity and the fact that they'll wind up as a motley crew of misfits in the same post is exactly what I'd expect from Tony... and the LNC.
With the MC's ideological purity we might wind up with Ben Shapiro, Joe Rogan, Thomas Sowell, *and* David Duke all under the same tent and we can't tolerate that kind of ideological purity!
Those are four people I can do without. No thanks.
Yes, a racist and anti-Semite like you would hate Sowell and Shapiro.
No one cares.
Who's Tony?
I don’t necessarily agree with you, but I like this username. Kudos!
I joined the LP and Mises Caucus last year because of the Covid regime and Dave Smith. My local Mises meetup group has people with a range of opinions. We don't reject each other for having different views. I have not been rejected for being openly gay. I don't agree with everything the Caucus or the Party stands for, but I agree with the most important stuff. We hate the warfare state. We want sound monetary policy. We (the Caucus and now the party) oppose divisive identity politics.
One of my personal values is freedom of conscience, and that is a Mises Caucus value. In the preparation for the California state convention, Angela told us to vote our consciences, and she meant it. The Mises Caucus is strong because we have discipline when it counts, but we also have tolerance for differences of opinions, as opposed to the authoritarian Left.
The Mises Caucus people I have met are almost always conscientious and accomplished. Some have the committed the sin of being somewhat conservative or even (gasp) Christians. Some of them enjoy crude jokes, like certain comedians who make self-directed Jewish jokes. I know, I know - we should just call off the whole thing now rather than foster such deplorables. How can a coalition of crude-comedy-loving young men and conservative home-schoolers possibly function together as a cohesive group? As it turns out, pretty damn well.
People need to wake up to the fact that the vote totals for Libertarian nominees hardly ever have much to do with anything those nominees or their backers say or do. "Libertarian" is just a catch-all voting category for the disaffected who know enough to not want to vote for a Green, etc. nominee. People should stop trying to do analyses of what the Party or its people are doing right or wrong; it doesn't matter! And this is just one reason the LP (not just as currently constituted, but any conceivable way nearly anywhere in the USA) is a waste of the libertarian movement.
Republican Roberta knows the GOP will die rathr than quit bulying girls and shooting hippies blacks and latinos over plant leaves--especially now that Biden's asset forfeiting has bought every cop union in the Union. LP spoiler votes are what repeal bad laws.
There is no good reason in the USA for self-identifying libertarians to have their own political party. 50 years ago it seemed like it might have been a good idea, and it might be so in some other countries, but experience has shown it's not useful in the USA. And especially not right now, when the alignment along libertarian-authoritarian lines, which was not striking 50 years ago, is so salient between the Republicans and the Democrats, from their candidates on down to their rank and file, as shown by a great many polls. Don Ernsberger even so concluded in the middle of the 1990s, and if you don't trust Don Ernsberger's analysis, whose could you trust?
Any chance at all that the low numbers come from people curious about libertarianism that read the comments here and go register as whatever else they can find?
Given that the LP is not actually libertarian, and given that people here keep pointing that out, I would say: mission accomplished.
I sure hope the fainting couch was nearby when Welch wrote this.
I kinda hope it wasn’t.
The main result of these "successes" was the defeat of republicans who were way closer to libertarian ideas than the democrats we helped to elect
The whole point was to cause both Kleptocracy halves to repeal bad laws. It worked.
I'll grant you the 2020 Presidential election. But the Presidential elections before that.....yeah no. Before 2016 the GOP's nominees Mr. Romneycare, John McCain (nuff said), and Dubya, no libertarian should ever feel bad about "costing" those guys votes. And Trump in 2016 won almost in spite of himself.
The LP wrote Roe v Wade in its first platform and ended 50 years of mystical Comstockism with under 4000 votes. We then increased vote share by 12% a year till 1976. Then infiltrators added child molesting planks and gutted the defense of women's rights that repealed cruel Texas law forcing involuntary reproduction. Paul was an anti-choice infiltrator to make us look Republican. The uninspected entry of foreign criminals plank plus vigilante murder reversed our 2016 gains and helped anarcho-fascism to inject Republican girl-bullying much like the Dred Scott decision. Matt elides all this.
I've found two types of "libertarians" generally. Those who Ron Paul's sound money, free market, limited govt, and peace appealed to them. Often with hard science or engineering backgrounds, MBA's, small business types who learned "economics" from reading Hayek or Mises or similar. Most not what I would call "cosmo wokes" and not obsessed with virtue signaling they are not "racists" and not a threat to the liberal establishment. I'm in this group.
The second are the Sarwarks/Reason "rise of the independent" brigade. Libertarianism to them is open borders, abortion, and pot. They almost always live in DC, NYC or some very large coastal city and live in a very urbanish world. Usually with some wooly liberal art degree they feel threatened with the "Hick rubes" in the Mises caucus (even though they will admit they don't know much about economics or hard science/engineering). They crave acceptance by their WaPo/Salon friends. What they really want is to be the "cool guy" who shows up at his DC party in the Peugeot when everyone else is driving a Volvo. Never show up in a Ford F-150! They also have a bizarre need to show they are pro LBTQ to the point were having Trans "therapists" roaming schools to convince little Billy to get chemically castrated because he plays with his sister's Barbi Fighter Pilot doll is "libertarian."
Lastly, the presidential race is irrelevant...it is local wins that will turn the corner for liberty and end the authoritarian woke threat to the republic.
Matt's snarky tone is what I would expect from the loser....opps Reason brigade.
It's NOT a takeover.
It's a RESTORATION to the party of David Nolan, Ron Paul, and Harry Browne.
Read the original LP platform, the one that increased our votes by 12% per year.
Something is wrong with the figures posted for 1992. It's not possible to get more of the total vote than of the "3rd Party" vote.
You're missing the column in between. It *is* impossible to get more of the total vote, more of the 3rd party vote and still come in less than 3rd. It's rather pointed about the specific election (and, IMO, the whole premise in general), as 0.28% of the popular vote went to Marrou and 99.9% of the third party vote went to Ross Perot (who would, to my point about the absurdity of the article's premise, popularly beat Gary Johnson and Jo Jorgensen combined but, in terms of electoral victory *still* fall behind Paul and Hospers).
Gr... It *is* impossible to get more of the total vote, more of the 3rd party vote and still come in
less than 3rdgreater than 4th.My view of the Libertarian Party and presidential hopes is simply to note that being President of the United States is not an entry level government position. I will never vote for President for someone that has never successfully held any prior office, and a few terms in the House isn't enough for me to think that Amash could handle the job either.
Basically, if the LP ever wants to be more than a place for people casting protest votes, it needs to build up candidates with actual successful experience governing.
But Trump did exactly what you seem to think infeasible. And so recently, too!
Nice headline, Matt! Here's some alternative text for you:
"No."
Saves a lot of wear and tear on the fingers!
The trouble with the Libertarian Party is that it is a sort of club for people who don't play well with others. When you get a large group of people who don't play well with others together, well, they don't play well with others.
No, the trouble with libertarians is that they are knowledgeable and honest about how the world works, and that they do "play well with others"--in their family, in churches, civic organizations, clubs, etc.
The trouble with progressives is that their leaders are psychopathic liars out for power and their followers are needy, gullible fools and loners who believe the promises of their leaders and are willing to vote for psychopaths in hopes of short term gains.
The trouble with the libertarian party is that they don't play well with others, unlike the Nobel Peace Laureate who perpetuated his predecessor's wars and started a couple of new ones.
But Obama played very well with others… big donors, authoritarians, and privileged American elites that is, and those are the people who count when it comes to power in the US.
The Looter Kleptocracy, on the other hand...
Gary Johnson was an outlier, as was most of the 2016 campaign. I think the more relevant question as far the LP performance in the election is how much more votes he could have gotten if not for his gaffes and some head scratching behavior. "What is Aleppo" Not good.
Most of the country is still center rightish, and the two parties are starting to lose favor, so the libertarian party has become a more palatable destination for independents. But it doesn't amount to much. It's like the 300 Spartans getting an additional reinforcement of 50 more soldiers before the bloodbath. And most of the action is coming from a small group of likeminded people. Donald Trump (of ALL people) made inroads with non white demographics. The LP is near non entity in that demo, trust me no one in my immigrant circle had the faintest idea who Jorgensen is.
If you want enthusiasm from your supporters and any shot at growth, you need charismatic candidates who's not afraid to take a side and take action. "What the hell do you want me to do, they're private companiez" is not a winning message. Half the country embraced Elon Musk for this twitter acquisition and got behind him against the obligatory left wing smears. Reason did the most cursory coverage of these development. You want to win elections, you need to know what motivates the electorate.
The main reason for the electoral successes of the Libertarian Party, is less the figure heads we have ran, than the electorate's dissatisfaction with the the other two parties.
If we manage to put on a respected, name recognitioned and good campaigning-ability candidate, that would just inflate our electoral successes even more.
...AND cause the looters to back away from even more coercive legislation. We know the elections are rigged and have been since Hayes counted more bayonets than Tilden. Ask any looter whose party lost, or read the 1880 Dem platform. By making the worst looter (as decided by voters) lose, the LP delivers on the fraudulent claims made by con artists selling "ranked" elections that ABSOLUTELY exclude the best outcomes.
Most people are too wrapped up in the left/right paradigm to vote anything else. They would rather chose the Washington DC uni-party's lesser of two evils than give anyone else a chance. Only once in recent history did that happen, and that was Ross Perot. Until that changes the uni-party will rule. With the two parties political elites it is all about power, never about the good of the USA or it's citizens. Only one recent President tried to change that, Trump, and look what at the extend the political DC insiders went to vilify him with lies and innuendo. The really sad thing is Reason bought into all the lies.
Pee tape.
Russian Collusion
Bounty-gate
Impeachment and Senate trial
Gained riches from being President
DC riot was a staged as a photo op
Find the fraud.
Incitement
Another failed impeachment and trial
Naming him a Dictator
Sham Jan. 6th investigation
Political harrasment from Federal and stage AG's.
Well now we have a real wannabe dictator Biden, whose corruption and graft enriched himself, his son and his brothers. that we know from his daughters diary and verified by the FBI took inappropriate shower with his young daughter, issues dictatorial executive orders making new agencies trying to destroy the first and second amendments, has made us energy dependent, whose polices have fueled inflation and emptied shelves and gotten us involved in more foreign wars. Has the government police harassing dissenting citizens and has opened the border to all kinds of evil entering our country.
Does anyone still believe Biden was the lesser of two evils?
No, just stop already. Libertarian as a party is a bad idea and a complete failure. Libertarian Party is an oxymoron. I threw my LP card in the trash where it belongs and registered independent.
So what's these great new ideas going to be? More better nekked dancing fat guys? A better understanding of what a Aleppo is? More cringe worthy candidates like Weld? More guys who are so dumb they can make Samantha Bee look smart?
No, put a cork in it, it's done.
"Well now we have a real wannabe dictator Biden"
Yeah, but at least no more mean tweets, right Reason staff? Don't forget to vote Democrat, again...
There's always the party of prohibitionists eager to send men with service pistols to capture women and make them reproduce by involuntary servitude. Oh, and wreck the economy via asset forfeiture looting... Listen to what the looter parties say about each other while trying to do away with LP spoiler votes.
Yesterday my wife and I spent 6 hours grocery shopping. Why? Because in order to survive these days and keep part of your former life style, under mean tweeters, like the evil Tumputin, you have to. Talking to meat cutters in grocery stores to see if they have anything on special, so you can still eat meat. Looking at the price of every single thing on the shelves and comparing can save you, a LOT. We never used to do that, ever, seemed not worth it. I was in one very popular local grocery yesterday, on a freaking Saturday, and the store was practically empty. Seriously, not of food, of PEOPLE, because they cannot affored these prices. FJB and democrats HATE poor people. I don't mean that they look down on the peasants with disdain, which has always been the case, they HATE them, as in want them to die. Anyone who votes for Democrats is anti-human.
But it is important to not upset the far left and DC establishment. Libertarians are with you on sending taxpayer funded "experts" into your govt schools to ensure your ten your old son who likes to play with his sister's Barbie Fighter Pilot doll is given puberty blockers", supporting the marxist BLM movement, open borders with all the tax dollars necessary to support the single mom from El Salvador with six kids, and abortion right up to birth of the "parasite."
"We agree with you and are not racists/bigots/ whatever" was the LP narrative. Thank God the Von Mises Caucus took it over. Time to focus on liberty and not some weird obsession with gender.
You voted for looters. Looters made money into paper to buy votes from fools. Fool you twice, shame on you!
oh Matt, the last 2 press campaigns were great? come on. is biden is the most popular president ever since he got most votes ever? lol
ok lp tried the nice guy alternative to 2 creeps in 2016 but the pro blm nonsense in the 2020 run was ridiculous, even I as a lifetime lp member couldn't vote for her
Bill Weld was, is and always will be a shit stain.
Bill Weld made Shrillary and Trumpanzees cry like babies. All he did was smile, and not offer to ban government and legalize murder. By not being a Boot-headed anarcho-fascist he helped pro-choice Gary more than triple our spoiler vote clout. Trumpanzee tantrums, over losing the popular vote, like commie Dem tantrums over getting beat, are icing on the cake.
Funny that they call "most votes ever" a success.
Imagine a single woman who, following the high standards she was taught by her mother, complains that she's a virgin at age 30 and is tired of being alone every night.
Determined to get laid, she goes out with her girlfriends, gets completely wasted, and gets gangbanged by every guy at the party.
Was this her most successful night ever? Well yes, if you go by count. No if you go by how she felt about it in the morning.
Libertarians should not celebrate maxing out their votes by completely trashing their standards. Of course it's easy to appeal to more people if you throw away your principles.
This lying Brooklyn shitbag doesn't really give a rat's ass how many votes the libertarians get in the next election, or ever. He has openly admitted on more than one occasion that he's not really a libertarian, and I promise you he has never attended on e single libertarian party even in his pathetic life. He's an insincere gaslighting troll who's butthurt that the party is returning to its roots, nothing more.
Given the current party leader's weird association with the "Jews chose the holocaust" click-cash troll NH Karlyn Borysenko (even retweeting her juvenile garbage), the new party will just end up another also-ran. Sad.
The LP has suffered these ridiculous swings for decades, probably since the beginning. "The American people are ready for a change, success is just around the corner, if only we nominate a ideologist/celebrity/establishment candidate." And every time, about 1% of the vote, and much recriminations. The US has a two-party system, and nothing other than voting reform (e.g. Approval Voting) will change that (look up Duverger's Law if you don't understand that). In 2001 a bunch of us recognized the LP's futility and formed the Free State Project. It is that successful concentration of libertarian power that led today to the LPNH tail wagging the national LP dog.
The LP has a “180 degree” problem - instead of focusing on moving the voters 10% on current issues into a more libertarian direction. Solutions that have a realistic effect in the near term, the LP seems to focus on ultra-longterm ideals 180 degrees from existing current policy. Also racism and bigotry has no place in 21st Century America.
For example: if a citizen works hard their entire life and saves money but can then go bankrupt overnight for simply being getting sick or injured - something is fundamentally wrong with that healthcare free market. Whether the monopoly or cartel is private or government. What does the LP propose in the next 12-24 months (not 50 years) to correct this problem?
Elections are about issues “popular” with voters. Seems like policies moving 10% in the right direction would win more votes. Issues like Pro-Choice, gun rights, requiring judicial warrants for government snooping, etc. are somewhat libertarian, so voters of both parties have support for some libertarian values.
Reason used to chide journalists and politicians for shoddy polling and statistics
unReason trumpets them to call a loss of 2.10 percentage points a good thing.
"It means the Libertarian Party just got a lot less woke….[And] the Libertarian Party will become more friendly to disgruntled Republicans."
The first part is a good thing. The second part, we'll have to see. A lot of those disgruntled Republicans start getting hung up on the foreign policy issues when it comes to libertarians unless they're J.D. Vance types who are open to "non-interventionism."
As for past Presidential election results, I think it's pointless to look at the prior totals in the Presidential races because most of those votes were protest votes (especially in 2016). The thing to focus on is local races and ballot access laws (fighting to keep the two parties from tying ballot access to Presidential election results). The Libertarians fighting to keep ballot access open along with building up local candidates is really our main path forward at this point.
I’ve only voted LP for president in the past two elections as a protest vote and will continue to so long as the DeRps keep running shitty candidates, so for the rest of my life in other words.
The only trend in that data is that, when sorted chronologically, almost every gain is followed by an immediate decrease. Almost like voters see libertarians as feckless losers not worth voting for....
Oh, and Reason, you're not going to make Amash happen. Ever. So just stop.
Well, they've lost my vote with this dive into the deep end of the pool of nonsense. Most people in this country are centrists, and any move that takes the party far to one side is bound to be a loser.
Eh, that sounds conspiratorial. I think BLM was what it was, a simple organizations founded by a couple of grifters who, when they went viral and were confronted by millions in donations from Dumb Rich White People, they had no plan or desire to help anyone, because up to that point they were pretty much a Twitter hashtag with a Marxist webpage.
They simply considered that a salary and enriched themselves.
But who knows, I think I'm up to 3 conspiracy theories this week that came true, so why not a fourth.
And no one will believe you. And you will be right.
BLM is largely a creation of the Ford Foundation ($100,000,000 in donations), and the FF is very, VERY closely aligned with deep state intelligence. Obama came out of FF.
Wokism is a very convenient distraction from the merging of the populist right and populist left, ala Occupy Wall Street.
Probably far more often than we'd like to believe. Prison sex is just Ghetto Sex or Trailer Park Sex with males portraying the bitches.