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Abortion

Judge Blocks Idaho From Punishing Doctors for Referring Women Out of State for Abortions

Plus: More takes on the Trump indictment, Biden's new student loan plan is here, and more...

Elizabeth Nolan Brown | 8.3.2023 9:48 AM

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Idaho Attorney General Raul Labrador | Albin Lohr-Jones/dpa/picture-alliance/Newscom
(Albin Lohr-Jones/dpa/picture-alliance/Newscom)

Idaho can't start prosecuting doctors for referring women to out-of-state clinics where they can get abortions, according to a new federal court ruling.

Judge B. Lynn Winmill of the U.S. District Court for the District of Idaho has granted a preliminary injunction against the state enforcing the law in this way.

Under current Idaho law, abortion is almost totally banned, and doctors who perform, attempt to perform, or assist in performing an abortion can have their licenses suspended and be criminally prosecuted. Idaho Attorney General Raúl Labrador stated in a March letter that the law "prohibits an Idaho medical provider from either referring a woman across state lines to access abortion services or prescribing abortion pills for the woman to pick up across state lines."

"This letter was meant to be private and was not issued as formal guidance, but the anti-abortion group Stanton International obtained the letter and posted it on its website," notes The Hill. "The attorney general later withdrew the opinion and said his letter was 'mischaracterized as law enforcement guidance.'"

Still, Idaho physicians worried that Labrador's private interpretation of the law might still have some weight. Planned Parenthood of the Greater Northwest and two doctors—Caitlin Gustafson and Darin L. Weyhrich—filed a lawsuit, arguing that Labrador's interpretation violated the First Amendment and the Fourth Amendment.

Winmill agreed that criminalizing out-of-state referrals would violate the First Amendment. Doctors and clinics would "be forced to choose between facing criminal penalties themselves and offering referrals and information about legal out-of-state medicinal services to their patients," he wrote. "Simply put, their speech will be chilled."

Winmill's ruling, issued Monday, blocks Labrador's interpretation from being enforced. That means Idaho doctors cannot—at least for now—be prosecuted for helping patients obtain out-of-state abortions.

But Idaho's abortion ban—passed in 2020 and triggered into effect by the overturning of Roe v. Wade last summer—is still one of the strictest in the nation. It makes it illegal for doctors to perform an abortion at any point in pregnancy except in cases where a mother's life is threatened or in cases of rape or incest that have been reported to law enforcement.

"Rather than offering a narrow list of exceptions, as other anti-abortion laws do, Idaho's law simply provides an affirmative legal defense for doctors arrested and charged with performing abortions," as Reason's Emma Camp has noted:

If a doctor can prove by a "preponderance of the evidence" that "[he] determined, in his good faith medical judgment and based on the facts known to the physician at the time, that the abortion was necessary to prevent the death of the pregnant woman," or if the physician has a copy of the patient's police report of rape, such doctors cannot be found guilty of performing an illegal abortion. However, if doctors charged with providing abortions fail to meet this standard, they can face up to five years in prison.

Idaho also bans "abortion trafficking," defined as helping someone under age 18 get an abortion. The law is meant "to prevent unemancipated minor girls from being taken across state lines for an abortion without the knowledge or consent of her parent or guardian," said Idaho Gov. Brad Little. Violations of the law are punishable by two to five years in prison.

The abortion trafficking law also faces a legal challenge, notes the Associated Press. "Attorneys general from 20 states filed a brief Tuesday urging the court to block it."

"The Constitution protects the individual right to travel between states, and Idaho's radical Legislature cannot abolish that right," said Washington Attorney General Bob Ferguson in a statement.


FREE MINDS

More takes on the new Trump indictment. Ken "Popehat" White takes issue with people describing the indictment as "unprecedented":

Nobody's ever been charged with this set of facts because nobody's ever attempted to overthrow the government by fraud like this before. In that sense, this is "unprecedented." But in other senses, that term is misleading. Each of these federal criminal laws — which are broad and flexible by design — has been used to charge a wide variety of fraud and misconduct.

This includes the conduct of which Trump is accused, White argues:

That doesn't mean that it will be easy for the Special Counsel to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Donald Trump had the requisite mental state to violate the law. It means that his actions plausibly violate the law….

Here's the point: there are legal and factual defenses to this indictment, but anyone telling you that it obviously, inarguably violates the law is lying to you.

White also takes issue with National Review editors' argument—which I included in Roundup yesterday—that "the Supreme Court reaffirmed just a few weeks ago, fraud in federal criminal law is a scheme to swindle victims out of money or tangible property. Mendacious rhetoric in seeking to retain political office is damnable — and, again, impeachable — but it's not criminal fraud, although that is what Smith has charged." Writes White:

The Special Counsel charged Trump with defrauding the United States under Section 371. The Supreme Court and lower courts have repeatedly and specifically ruled that Section 371 doesn't require a scheme to take money or property. National Review is referring to the latest in a line of cases interpreting a completely different statute, the wire fraud statute, that includes a "money or property" requirement in its text…

Justice Thomas, in the 2023 case to which National Review alludes, expressly relies on that language to find that the wire fraud statute requires a scheme to take money or (as traditionally defined) property. He does not even mention Section 371, which does not include the "money or property" language and which has a long history of Supreme Court and lower court cases holding that the object of the fraud need not be money or property, but can be interfering with government function.

National Review's Noah Rothman offers "a dissent" from the editors' argument, also challenging his colleagues on points of law and interpretation. "These charges deserve the hearing they are about to receive," Rothman concludes.

Reason's Jacob Sullum also weighs in, asking if Trump really believed, despite so much evidence to the contrary, that the 2020 election had been stolen from him. "After covering Trump's election claims since November 2020, I'm still not sure. Fair-minded jurors are apt to have similar doubts," Sullum writes.

Lastly, the Cato Institute's Walter Olson offers a nuanced look at strengths and weaknesses of the indictment, noting that it "is likely to raise legal issues that are relatively unfamiliar, uncertain, or both." Olson continues:

Few legal commentators are deeply familiar with all four of the statutory bases on which the grand jury filed charges, and intuitions can be deceptive: in applying the law against defrauding the United States, for example, courts have not always construed the elements of fraud in the same way they do in some other fraud areas, and the interpretations have also changed. It is not entirely settled how the elements of obstructing an official proceeding will ultimately shake out in January 6 cases, and so forth.

In other words, caution is called for at this stage in predicting the extent to which judges will trim back the scope of this prosecution, if they do. It is widely agreed that the First Amendment protects some telling of lies for political benefit, and also that it protects (as, in effect, lobbying) some efforts to persuade government officials to carry out acts that are wicked and unconstitutional. It is equally certain that the First Amendment does not protect every act of speech or persuasion that someone might retroactively try to jam into these categories. If you shut down a pending courtroom trial by phoning in a false report of a dangerous gas leak, you cannot get off by arguing that you were just exercising your speech and lobbying rights, nor are you likely to get off by arguing that you knew there was a gas stove in the court cafeteria and were basing your 911 call on a sincere belief that there was an elevated risk of asthma from stray methane.

In short, it matters in law and under the First Amendment whether speech and lobbying intended to obstruct proceedings or nullify rights was taken in good faith or otherwise, and deceitfully or otherwise. That is probably one reason why the indictment cites extensive cause to believe that Trump knew his claims of election fraud to be false, rather than wandering around in some sort of fugue state in which he might reasonably believe them to be true.


FREE MARKETS

Biden's new student loan repayment plan will turn many federal student loans "into glorified grants," suggests Reason's Emma Camp:

The SAVE plan is a revamped income-driven repayment (IDR) plan, introduced last year along with President Joe Biden's original student loan forgiveness scheme—though that proposal was struck down at the Supreme Court in June. While the SAVE plan received less attention than Biden's now-defeated student-loan forgiveness proposal, it stands to do nearly as much long-term damage to taxpayers—and prospective student loan borrowers themselves.

Under the REPAYE plan, the most popular IDR plan currently in use, borrowers' monthly payments are typically fixed at 10 percent of their discretionary income. Discretionary income is calculated as earnings above 150 percent of the federal poverty level. Under this plan, borrowers will have their remaining balance forgiven after 20 years of on-time payments, or 25 years for graduate borrowers. But the SAVE plan radically reduces monthly payments—and the time required before forgiveness. Under the plan, borrowers only pay 5 percent of discretionary income, which is now defined as earnings above 225 percent of the poverty rate. Borrowers only have to make 10 years of payments before forgiveness, if the balance is less than $12,000. Further, interest will not accrue on borrowers' loan balances when their monthly payments are not enough to cover interest.

More here.


QUICK HITS

• Backpage co-founder, veteran journalist, and free speech warrior James Larkin has committed suicide, a little over a week before he was slated to stand trial for his role in running Backpage. A judge has ruled that the trial will still start next week.

• As the Biden administration "prepared to launch speedy screenings at Border Patrol holding facilities this spring, authorities pledged access to counsel would be a key difference from a Trump-era version of the policy. So far, that promise appears unfulfilled," notes the A.P.

• Why middle-aged Americans aren't going back to church.

• New Bureau of Labor Statistics data show "the number of job openings dipped to its lowest point in more than two years" in June, reports CNN.

• Mashable predicts good things for Threads. "Threads is on course to topple Twitter (or X, if you must)," writes Chris Taylor. "Don't be surprised if Threads becomes the go-to place for all things trending by the end of 2023."

• "A bipartisan trio of House lawmakers last week introduced legislation that would allow marijuana users past and present to qualify for security clearances and serve as federal employees," notes Government Executive.

Start your day with Reason. Get a daily brief of the most important stories and trends every weekday morning when you subscribe to Reason Roundup.

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NEXT: Brickbat: Religious Unfreedom

Elizabeth Nolan Brown is a senior editor at Reason.

AbortionReproductive FreedomLaw enforcementLawsuitsIdahoFederal CourtsPoliticsReason Roundup
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  1. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Idaho can't start prosecuting doctors for referring women to out-of-state clinics...

    Sending medical dollars to other states???

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Across state lines?

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    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      Huh? Can you say that again as a compete sentence/thought?

      1. R Mac   2 years ago

        It was dumbass.

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        Fuck off, Sealion.

      3. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

        Here's one: Mike Laursen is an obtuse, passive-aggressive bitch who deserves to get his teeth knocked out while his kids watch.

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago

          His kids have suffered enough by being his kids.

    3. Liberty Lover   2 years ago (edited)

      Only if the state is paying for the abortion.

      This is a difficult question. As a Christian i abhor abortions, as a libertarian, it does not affect my rights, it is someone else's right, so should not be my concern. That leaves me very undecided.

  2. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    More takes on the new Trump indictment.

    Inject these right into my veins, I guess.

    1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

      Obligatory.

  3. JesseAz   2 years ago

    Jack Smith falsely told the courts they handed over all required documents to the defense when they had not. Isnt that one of the crimes he charged Trump for?

    https://justthenews.com/government/courts-law/jack-smiths-team-admits-incorrect-claim-about-evidence-trump-classified

    Special counsel Jack Smith's team admitted to incorrectly claiming to have turned over evidence as required by law in the classified documents case against former President Donald Trump.

    1. Longtobefree   2 years ago

      Team? Team?! More than one??
      That's a CONSPIRACY!!!!!

    2. Nardz   2 years ago

      I mean... Reason's posting an article that celebrates the protection of free speech, including conspiracy, for the purpose of getting around laws that ban child sacrifices while at the same time trying to justify prosecution of political enemies for their speech when it questions the integrity of our government

      1. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

        And the calling in a potential gas leak hypothetical is the old wine of "cannot yell fire in a crowded theater" put in a somewhat new bottle to justify all sorts of limitations on free speech.

  4. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    Nobody's ever been charged with this set of facts because nobody's ever attempted to overthrow the government by fraud like this before.

    DONNIE DREAMY LIBERTARIAN!

    1. Sevo   2 years ago

      Remember that turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
      If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
      turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

    2. R Mac   2 years ago

      You were banned for posting links to child pornography.

    3. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      HEY PLUGGO!
      What did "Donnie" do to try and overthrow the government?

  5. JesseAz   2 years ago

    Jeff and JFree celebrating story if woman denied cancer treatments at hospital because she claimed about the transgender flag.

    https://redstate.com/bonchie/2023/08/02/shocking-woman-denied-cancer-treatment-in-portland-after-criticizing-transgenderism-n786679

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      Jeff must be diamond hard.

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        Does that mean he gets to be the Top?

        1. THX1138   2 years ago

          Only if he has a sling and hoist to position himself.

    2. Rev Arthur L kuckland   2 years ago

      Any time this happens I think if the patient killed every single worker in that "hospital" it would be justified

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        At least the ones wearing rainbow pins.

    3. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

      woman denied cancer treatments at hospital because she claimed about the transgender flag...and also being an asshole wannabe victim about it.

      https://thepostmillennial.com/oregon-health-clinic-denies-medical-care-to-breast-cancer-patient-after-she-objects-to-trans-pride-flag

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Oh. We deny medical care for being an asshole now?

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          There goes every Antifa, BLM, gender-queer, eco-warrior, and DEI activist.

          Good.

        2. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

          Just trying to present the whole picture because I think she is a poor martyr to make your case. It's not as simple as she was denied because of her views. She made an issue out walking past a flag and was a jerk to staff even in her own version of the story.

          Oh. We deny medical care for being an asshole now?
          I'm OK with that.

          1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

            Fuck off.

            1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

              Exactly

              1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                Thanks for the link, Quicktown Brix!

                In your link I ALSO see that Asshole Lady wanted an attorney, to HELP her SUE for Her Precious Baby Feelings being hurt by the presence of a FLAG at the medical facility! So now here on these comments, we see "conservatives" in favor of private businesses being FORCED to serve customers who LUST after telling them what to do (and NOT do) with THEIR facilities, and SUING those who do NOT obey right-wing dictates from right-wing dictators and right-wing MARXISTS who lust after controlling YOUR property!

                1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

                  “Mean tweets” should be ignored, but nice flags are an actionable offense.

                  1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

                    The lack of self-awareness in Laursen is strong today. You do realize a Twitter has a "mute" option as you exercise that one here every day?

                    Laursen, do you think they have to bake that cake?

                    1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                      DerangedTrollLogic, did you realize that there is NO "mute function" on lawyers? If Government Almighty provides the courtrooms and judges (and armed goons to back up their findings) after YOU are SUED for hurting MY Precious Baby Feelings by YOU putting up YOUR flag(s) on YOUR property... You fucking fascist-Marxist you... And the court-blessed goons come after YOU... Are you gonna sympathize with MEEE??! Or is it all about "My Tribe, right or wrong"?

                    2. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

                      Sqrlsy, do the letters F and O mean anything to you?

                    3. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                      DerangedTrollLogic is Out of Facts and so must Obey Fascist thoughts about saying Foolish things about Others who are are smarter and wiser than DerangedTrollLogic is!

                    4. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

                      Sqrlsy, do the letters F and O mean anything to you?

                      Unless they have to do with scat, he's not interested.

          2. R Mac   2 years ago

            We all need to expect that when we go get cancer treatment at the hospital, we have to accept left wing political messaging we disagree with, or we don’t get the treatment.

            So yeah, fuck off.

            1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

              You don't need to accept anything. You just need to not be an asshole...Oh I see the problem you're having.

              1. R Mac   2 years ago

                So if hospital employees are wearing MAGA hats, and a cancer patient reacts poorly to that, they should be denied treatment?

                1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                  They should shut the fuck up about their Hurt Precious Baby Feelings, or find a different hospital. That's not asking for much.

                  1. R Mac   2 years ago

                    Does anyone really believe that shitsy would be ok if staff at a public university started wearing MAGA hats and discharged anyone that complained about it?

                    Let’s see how far he’ll go with this lie.

                    1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                      I would (honest to the Government Almighty that y'all SOOO much Love, Adore, and Worshit, so long ass Government Almighty favors YOUR side) be TOTALLY OK if a public school, hospital, or ANY private business refused to serve ANYONE who will NOT agree to sign a release, that says they will NOT sue over their Precious Baby Feelings being hurt over signs, flags, hats, hate-hats, etc.! So long as there are no "true threats of violence", y'all whiners and crybabies have NOTHING to sue about! PS, complain is fine, but if it gets in the way of business getting done... Take your business elsewhere! It is MY business establishment, in a non-Marxist nation!

                      R Mac Who Talks and Snorts Smack, right HERE we have PRIME evidence of YOUR projection! I am NOT a tribalist, so I think your stupid MAGA hate-hat should be EVERY STINKIN' BIT ASS MUCH protected as any gay-pride flag!!! And YOU can NOT believe my TRUTH that I speak, because you can not IMAGINE that I am not a Tribalistic ("free speech for me but not for thee") idiot like YOU!

                    2. R Mac   2 years ago

                      She’s not suing over her feelings. She’s suing because she was denied medical care retard.

                    3. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                      "She’s not suing over her feelings."

                      She WANTS to sue over Her Precious Hurt Baby Feelings... And the hospital smelt it coming from a mile away! Do YOU want to provide services to a customer who spends 3/4th of your time bitching whining and moaning about shit irrelevant to the services that you're providing? Assuming that you can provide ANYTHING of a sort of useful service (other that conservaturd babble) to a willing customer, besides fanatical TrumpenTrolls? And then get SUED for it? In a free market, providers are allowed to say "no thanks!" to such assholes!

                2. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                  So if hospital employees are wearing MAGA hats, and a cancer patient reacts poorly to that, they should be denied treatment?

                  Yes, if they become an asshole to the staff, absolutely.

                  1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                    EMTALA requires every hospital receiving medicaid or federal funding to provide care for everyone. There is no carve put for those being assholes.

              2. Nardz   2 years ago

                Choke on the next dick you suck

              3. JesseAz   2 years ago

                One of the ways cultural conversions have happened in authoritarian countries is implementing a set of conditioned behaviors acceptable even around controversial topics. Think Chinas credit score, ESG, etc. I am against those things. People have a right to be an asshole. But they also have a right to access medical care.

                1. R Mac   2 years ago

                  Apparently the deplorables need to just start their own healthcare system.

            2. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 years ago

              Triggered snowflakes requesting safe spaces must be accompanied?

              1. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 years ago

                Fix: Accommodated, not accompanied.

              2. R Mac   2 years ago

                Getting medical treatment at PUBLIC universities requires you must shut up about left wing propaganda being present?

          3. JesseAz   2 years ago

            I wouldn't call her a martyr but someone denied medical care for being disagreeable. I also don't want to deny medical care (does not include gender transitions) to criminals either.

            1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

              Thanks, Jesse. I appreciate the courtesy and reasoned argument of your response. The situation is complicated by it (probably) being publicly funded. Before Roe was overturned, was it OK for religious based hospitals to not perform abortions? I think they should not be compelled to. And people are free to find other service providers. If this was a private hospital, the situation would be the same in my opinion. Admittedly, taking tax funded money puts us in a gray area though.

              1. R Mac   2 years ago

                The hospital is part of a public university.

                https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_Health_%26_Science_University

                1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago (edited)

                  Duly noted. I’m open to the argument that taking public money requires you to provide service to everyone, including assholes. But, that wasn’t my initial point. My initial point was that she likely wasn’t denied service for her beliefs, but for being an intollerable Karen.

                  1. R Mac   2 years ago

                    She complained about the tranny flag flying behind the reception desk. Far left political flags should not be hanging behind the reception desk at the hospital of a public university.

                    Again, would it be appropriate for a MAGA flag to be flying behind the reception desk of the hospital at a public university?

                    1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                      I agree that niether a pride nor a MAGA flag should be in a public lobby. I disagree that she was denied service for merely complaining about the flag.

                      In my hometown, I patronize many small businesses with Trump signs. It doesn't bother me in the least. In the city where I work, I deal with many left wing signs. I do my business and get on with my day without focusing on how I was victimized by seeing rainbow colors.

                    2. R Mac   2 years ago

                      “I agree that niether a pride nor a MAGA flag should be in a public lobby.”

                      You’ve spent a lot of time arguing for the pride flag.

                    3. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                      True. But there's never a lefty argument left unchallenged on this board and I find little value in adding a "me too" comment.

              2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                The failure in your proposed question is that the Hospital in question provides cancer treatment. They are denying it to one person based on their attitude. Abortion is an entire medical procedure. Not all hospitals provide all procedures. Equating the two is wading into dishonesty. It would be more akin to catholic hospitals not providing heart surgeries to atheists. Which does not happen. Your attempt at a comparative item here is incorrect.

                1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                  It would be more akin to catholic hospitals not providing heart surgeries to atheists.

                  Not a perfect analogy, but I think they should be free to if they so chose.

              3. JesseAz   2 years ago

                A more accurate example of why this is dangerous is China denying bank accounts to people they do not consider to have social credit scores or British banks denying accounts to conservatives.

                Operation Chokepoint is a thing and it must not be allowed to set a foot hold into society.

                1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                  It is my contention that we was not booted for her beliefs, but for her negative interactions with the staff.

          4. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

            We deny medical care for being an asshole now?
            I’m OK with that.

            Careful, that might come back to bite you. Asshole.

            1. R Mac   2 years ago

              I don’t think he’s really thinking about the implications of this position.

              Go to the DMV and roll your eyes at an employee? No driver’s license for you!

              1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                With the DMV, there are no alternative service providers.

                1. R Mac   2 years ago (edited)

                  There’s other offices you can go to. Driving to the next DMV would be a lot easier than finding a new cancer treatment provider.

                  Edit: have you ever been through cancer treatments, or had someone close to you do so? It’s not a simple process to change hospitals in the middle of it.

                  1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                    If you can drive to another DMV, you haven't been denied a driver's license.

                    No I haven't been in or near cancer treatment so you are correct that I am naive about that.

            2. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

              Ok...good one...LOL

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        "OF COURSE WE WON'T LET STAFF TREAT HER! SHE CRITICISED OUR PECADILLOS!"

        You may be retarded monsters, but you're still monsters.

        1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

          Not accepting the conclusion from the title but looking at the details of the story makes me a monster? Or have you just made many assumptions?

          1. R Mac   2 years ago

            You think state funded hospitals should have left wing political messaging, and if anyone complains they should be denied treatment.

            Maybe rethink your position.

            1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

              Your understanding of my position it wrong on both of those points.

              1. Terran   2 years ago

                You wish every individual communicated in line with your values seems to be your point. That just makes you look like a silly goose though.

                Or you could be sillier and say that people shouldn't say what they think, but what will manipulate others around them into giving them what they want.

                1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                  If your assumption is that I think everyone should accept trans ideology, you're wrong. I reject it myself.

                  If your assumption is I think someone should choose another service provider, rather than making a fuss over seeing a flag, insulting the staff and getting lawyers involved, then yeah, I think everyone should be in line with my values.

                  1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                    You should go investigate the harm done to cancer patients when ACA passed. It is not easy for someone in active treatment to just move and change doctors.

                    1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                      Given the imperfections in our system, if I had cancer and was worried about my treatments, I sure wouldn't give a fuck about a rainbow flag in the lobby and I'd sure think twice about siccing a lawyer on my cancer treatment provider over it. Priorities!

              2. R Mac   2 years ago

                Quicktown Brix 2 hours ago
                Flag Comment Mute User

                Oh. We deny medical care for being an asshole now?
                I’m OK with that.

                I think my understanding of your position is accurate. Again, this is a PUBLIC university.

                1. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                  I often struggle to get my point across.

                  1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

                    If it happens often, then maybe the problem isn't everyone else.

                    1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                      Quicktown Brix struggles to get Quicktown Brix's points across to people who WILLFULLY AND STUBBORNLY CLING TO THEIR IGNORANCE AND EVILS!!! Ass it has been for hundreds of thousands of years, and, sad to say, will continue indefinitely and in-daffy-dently into the future...

                    2. Quicktown Brix   2 years ago

                      Admittedly. That is what I meant.

    4. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

      Maybe THIS is why? Women with cancer MIGHT be, or get, preggers, after all!

      https://www.healthline.com/health-news/how-strict-abortion-laws-are-delaying-cancer-treatment

      How Strict Abortion Laws are Delaying Cancer Treatment

      Up to 1 in 1,000 pregnant women receive a cancer diagnosis each year in the United States, reports the ACS.
      Patients in states with anti-abortion laws may face challenges accessing radiation therapy, chemotherapy, or other treatments that can negatively affect fetal development and potentially cause miscarriage.
      Multiple organizations including the American Cancer Society have issued statements urging lawmakers to protect cancer care access for pregnant patients.

    5. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

      So Healthcare is not a right for those who are iconoclasts against LGBtQ+ symbols.

      1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

        Well, she COULD have just worn a blindfold so as to NOT see the flag while she accessed her medical care! AND she could ALSO offer to sign a binding agreement to NOT sue the hospital over irrelevant stuff concerning what the hospital does with and on hospital property, which has NOTHING to do with HER medical care! Christ on a Cracker, when are ye whining crybabies gonna STOP crying for your "safe spaces"?

        1. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

          So you are all good with the establishment of the new religion and creation of its Inquisition and dhimmi caste?

          1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

            So if my (CONSERVATIVE, to be sure!) religion hates human hair and thinks that everyone should shave all of it off, you'd be OK with me DEMANDING that all my medical providers either shave, or hide all of their hair, while attending to me? And maybe all of their other customers within eyesight, as well? And I should be able to SUE if my demands aren't met? Just HOW much whiner-crybaby-Karen power piggishness will You and Your Tribe bless, these days?

            1. R Mac   2 years ago

              You’re literally getting everything here backwards dumbass.

              Reminds me of the time you thought a direct quote of section 230 was some right wing extremist’s opinion of it.

              1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                "You’re literally getting everything here backwards dumbass."

                OK then Marxism in the Name of Those Whose Precious Baby Feelings were DEEPLY Hurt, first, and freedom to LIE on court, for TrumpenTurd Lawyers, second, and freedom for property owners, what, ranked around about 59th on the concern charts? OK, gotcha!

                1. R Mac   2 years ago

                  This doesn’t have anything to do with Trump you retarded.

                  1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                    This doesn’t have anything to do with Section 230 you retarded and you demented and you perverted and you defected and you neglected and you purple and you non-noun adjective... STOP being SUCH a sorely abused, abject adjective, willya?!?!?

    6. R Mac   2 years ago

      Seems like quite the organization:

      https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1516627583282069506

    7. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

      My big fear would be waking up in a hospital with a Nazi, Fascist, or Communist flag, or the flag of any nation with Socialized Medicine. That goes way beyond hurt feelz!

  6. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Each of these federal criminal laws — which are broad and flexible by design — has been used to charge a wide variety of fraud and misconduct.

    This isn't about the general unconstitutionality of many federal laws, we're focused on saving democracy here.

  7. JesseAz   2 years ago

    Lawyers on the left and right have now detailed how dangerous and wrong the latest charges against Trump are. Shrike who loves the WSJ has surely changed his mind as their editorial board comes out strongly against it.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/donald-trump-indictment-2020-election-jack-smith-january-6-fraud-e0068c4f?mod=opinion_lead_pos1

    1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

      The WSJ is just behind the NYT in news quality. You can't blame the editorial page for catering to the GOP because at one time the GOP addressed corporate concerns while stupid Democrats ignored them.

      But Obama proved that there is a lot more to corporate well-being than just cutting taxes. Deficits, USD strength, and trade come to mind. The TPP would have been great for corporate America but idiots like Bernie Sanders, Liz Warren, and Fatass Donnie all demagogued it to death.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        You think that because you are a soros loving globalist leftist silly. Imagine at this point in time calling NYT quality. As laughable as your assertion Schiff is the last honest politician.

      2. Sevo   2 years ago

        Remember that turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
        turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

      3. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        "But Obama proved that there is a lot more to corporate well-being than just cutting taxes."

        Oh fuck, did he ever. Corporatism, corporate welfare, corporatocracy, regulatory capture, plutarchy, all sorts.

      4. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

        The WSJ is just behind the NYT in news quality.

        That's... pretty bad then.

  8. Social Justice is neither   2 years ago

    Just give up the charade and charge the doctors with conspiracy to commit murder. ENB and the rest of the progressive left likes to hide themselves away from inconvenient facts but that is what's going on here with these cultists.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      If men could get pregnant they would charge trump for sure.

    2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

      Just give up the charade and charge the doctors with conspiracy to commit murder.

      The Aborto-Freaks won't stop there. Their goal is a police state that regulates all sexual and reproductive activity to insure Gawdliness and Biblical purity.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Good liberal narrative youre pushing for not being a liberal.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          I thought a police state that regulates everything, including sex, was the liberal narrative.

          1. JesseAz   2 years ago

            Think they just want to fund it and make it legal to not be responsible for your own choices.

          2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

            I thought a police state that regulates everything, including sex, was the liberal narrative.

            Then you're not paying attention.

            Cons say the liberal narrative is ABORTION ON DEMAND!

            or

            ABORTION UP TO THE MOMENT OF DELIVERY!

            It is the stupid "Baby Killer" notion.

            Sometimes late term abortion is medically necessary.

            1. JesseAz   2 years ago

              Which the vast majority of regulation contain an exemption for.

              The problem is Planned Parenthood is on record telling women how to get around the regulations through the exemption by claiming depression.

            2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

              "Sometimes late term abortion is medically necessary."

              Which always was, still is, and will remain legal.

              Time to stop lying about your objectives, AbortoFreak.

              1. JFree   2 years ago

                Medically necessary is NOT what those abortion-ban laws are about. They are about ensuring that a priest etc be called into all medical appointments between an obgyn and pregnant patient. That priest is deemed to be the decision maker about 'medical necessity' - with the full force and coercion of the state applied to enforce that.

                1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

                  What the fuck are you babbling about.

                2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                  Do you have an actual example?

                  1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago (edited)

                    These assholes spew out the most deranged conspiracy shit ever, but somehow think that they’re the balanced ones.

                    1. Commenter_XY   2 years ago

                      I just read what JFree wrote.

                      W....T.....F????????

                3. R Mac   2 years ago

                  Cite?

            3. Sevo   2 years ago

              Remember that urd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
              turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

      2. damikesc   2 years ago

        It's not conservatives demanding "EXPLICIT AFFIRMATION" for every single point of the sexual experience.

      3. Sevo   2 years ago

        turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
        turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

      4. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

        To a Leftist: "Don't intentionally kill human individuals without a just cause = You are trying to control every aspect of my sex life! REEE!"

        Quit the melodramatics.

    3. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

      Let's not be too hasty here--I see nothing wrong with blue voters in red states being encouraged to abort their demon spawn. In fact, the proper thing to do would be to offer these women free hysterectomies and sell their eggs to the state, so that there's even less risk that they'll decide to raise a kid someday.

      1. Fats of Fury   2 years ago

        The way blue states are going I expect women to be eliminated and replaced by things with an extra pocket.

        1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

          Replaced as a "bonus hole".

  9. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Biden's new student loan repayment plan will turn many federal student loans "into glorified grants..."

    We're hoping they grant Biden the glory of a second term.

  10. Spiritus Mundi   2 years ago

    And ENB is back to abortion and iNsUrEcTiOn!! At least there was one day were both sides lead her to a libertarian take.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Soft libertarian take*

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        Aka libertine take.

    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      She didn’t say a word about “insurrection”.

      Are you saying you don’t think talking about Trump’s January 6th indictment is topical?

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        So topical it was timed to bury Archers testimony. One of the key witnesses Jack Smith is planning on using, Kerik, doesn't even testify until next week.

        https://justthenews.com/government/courts-law/bernie-keriks-attorney-says-he-has-meeting-scheduled-jack-smith-next-week

        Weird he didn't wait for a key witness for his charges.

      2. Spiritus Mundi   2 years ago

        She quotes "Popehat" to convey her belief Trump was fomenting insurection:

        Nobody's ever been charged with this set of facts because nobody's ever attempted to overthrow the government by fraud like this before.

        Never change dumbass.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          OMG, she quoted someone! How dare she!

        2. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

          Yeah, the simps on the center-right were jerking themselves off to Craphat's stupid take yesterday.

  11. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

    Mashable predicts good things for Threads. "Threads is on course to topple Twitter (or X, if you must)," writes Chris Taylor. "Don't be surprised if Threads becomes the go-to place for all things trending by the end of 2023."

    I thought Mastodon already took over after Twitter "imploded" in late 2022?

    1. Spiritus Mundi   2 years ago

      Buttplug loves mastadon:

      https://www.theverge.com/2023/7/24/23806093/mastodon-csam-study-decentralized-network

    2. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Threads users have already dropped by 70% as people realized it was just curated advertising.

      1. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

        Never even looked at Threads but in fairness I will note Twitter's advertising recently got far more annoying on my setup.

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago

          There were a lot of X posts showing the top threads posts all being posts from corporations. Not even a users friends.

          1. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

            Musk has to try and make money on it somehow. Twitter's been a money-loser for most of its existence, it just got by on VC infusions and stock sales.

      2. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        More than just that. Zuck decided to just make any Instagram user a Threads user by default. Most Instagram users had no desire to be Threads users.

    3. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

      Yeah. Now I remember. Geniuses like Harvard Law's totally-passes-for-a-woman "Esqueer_" predicted Twitter was days away from total collapse in November 2022.

      Isn't it wonderful having an "expert" class full of shameless hacks whose careers don't suffer (and may actually benefit!) when they're hilariously wrong? 🙂

      #MaybeTheyJustHateElonMusk

      1. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

        Big Alex Caraballo (who will never be a woman) is the embodiment of trannyism as a sexual fetish. The dude has nuclear levels of AGP and took the joke "If I was a woman I'd play with my tits all day" way too seriously.

  12. JesseAz   2 years ago

    Progressives continue to project their own racism as group launches a fund to buy AR-15 for all black men to scare conservative gun supporters. Every time they do this right gun advocates applaud them.

    https://www.thesmatteringnews.com/p/breaking-progressives-launch-campaign

    1. Minadin   2 years ago

      I strongly support equal gun rights regardless of race. I do think that some (but not all) of the 2A advocacy organizations could be a bit more vocal in this regard.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Which ones aren't vocal? They all support gun ownership for all races. The only groups that don't are groups like the one in the article.

        1. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

          You DO know the article is satire, don’t you? This guy’s sub stack is basically doing The Babylon Bee type stuff. It’s funny, but it’s not real.

          1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

            I did not know that. But if so good parody as I can post statements from democrats asserting just that.

            1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

              Liberals are confounding all attempts at parody.

        2. mad.casual   2 years ago

          I don't know the details of Minadin's motivations. I do know there are still "Civil Libertarians" for whom "All Lives Matter" was and is a racist slant. Who still criticize the NRA for "not speaking out about the Philando Castille shooting... still.

    2. damikesc   2 years ago

      I assume they are unaware of how incredibly illegal their plan is as well.

      Not permitted to buy firearms for other people.

      You'd think people who demand gun control would know what the laws we have are in the first place.

      But gun rights advocates (including me, who owns zero guns) would welcome more responsible gun owners to the party.

      1. R Mac   2 years ago

        “You’d think people who demand gun control would know what the laws we have are in the first place.”

        No I wouldn’t.

    3. Squirrelloid   2 years ago

      You do realize that article is satire, right?

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        It would be parody and not satire as dem groups have stated just that assertion of the parody. But I was not aware.

    4. Dakotian   2 years ago

      Parody but well done.

    5. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      Ha ha ha hardy har har. JesseAz fucked up.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

        Which I admitted to not knowing. When will you do so Mikey?

        I can post actual statements of democrats making similar claims. Why it was good parody.

        I mean you're still defending turducken as GMO and lab grown.

        1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

          Mike thought it meant Good Meat Only.

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        Okay Mr. Turducken McHO2.

      3. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        Laursen, ever hear of Poe's Law?

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago

          Definitely got me this time.

  13. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Anything on Hunter's business partner to mention, ENB? No?

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Are they traveling across state lines for abortions?

    2. JesseAz   2 years ago

      His Tucker interview was more in depth than the hearings.

    3. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago (edited)

      You mean that convicted felon?

      ENB has ignored OJ too.

      You leave ENB alone. She is great. Remember, female libertarians are rare so they get special treatment.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

        Still amazingly sexist lol. Like most dem men.

      2. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

        It's nice to see you've forgiven ENB for driving a dagger into your heart with "When asked whether Biden or Trump has done 'a better job handling the economy,' 54 percent said Trump and just 36 percent said Biden."

        #HowCouldSheIgnoreRigCount

        1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

          Forgive her? I applaud her for linking to a legit poll.

          Perception is not reality, you know. Every wingnut in America keeps saying that this is the worst economy ever.

          And the dumbasses that believe them quickly forgot 2008 when 750,000 lost jobs a month, $147/bbl oil, three million foreclosures and bank bailouts all over the country.

          Now = 13 million new jobs, $80/bbl oil, almost no foreclosures and no bank bailouts needed.

          1. Sevo   2 years ago

            turd, the TDS-addled shit pile, lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
            turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

      3. sarcasmic   2 years ago (edited)

        Dude, you know that what people don’t do or say is so much more important than anything they actually do or say, because that way ML and his fellow retards can make up the reasons for the former while ignoring the latter.
        “They deliberately ignored such and such, and based upon absolutely nothing that means they think this and believe that that I just made up! Anyone who disagrees is a liar!”
        Fucking retards.
        Based upon the latest Trump charges, it makes me wonder if they are liars perpetrating fraud, or so fucking delusional that they believe their own nonsense.

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

          Still doesn’t know what selection bias is.

          Please give us your libertarian or legal analysis of the charges.

        2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          Have you noticed how Sarcasmic tries extra-hard to copy me with these posts?

          He's like a retarded monkey or parrot.

          1. JesseAz   2 years ago

            I finally admit youre on top of the list. I'll try to do better.

      4. Sevo   2 years ago

        turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
        turd lies. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

        1. Syd Henderson   2 years ago

          And you should know turds you piece of walking excrement. Goodbye.

  14. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    A judge has ruled that the trial will still start next week.

    Unconnected widgets come and go, but that conveyor belt never stops.

  15. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Why don't they stop fucking around with pretenses and just shoot him?

    The New Charges Against Trump 'May' Carry the Death Penalty

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

      561 years and possible death penalty. Kids gloves according to Brandy.

      The law for deprivation of rights was literally created to go after the KKK. Democrats using it to go after their enemies is ironic.

    2. Nardz   2 years ago

      I kinda hope they do.
      Something has to be worth reaction one of these days, yet they keep crossing lines without it

  16. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    And so it begins.

    We Need a Limited Military Draft

    Everyone with a little Ukrainian flag next to their name should go first.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Wanna bet that the Venn diagram of people who posted Ukrainian flags and people who would dodge the draft is a circle?

    2. creech   2 years ago

      I don:t think volunteering should be an issue. A columnist in today's paper claims a "supermajority" supports backing Ukraine. Maybe that changes when one's number (or one's kid's) comes up in the draft?

      1. rbike   2 years ago

        With a son in the reserves, NO is all I can say.

    3. Kungpowderfinger   2 years ago

      Imagine the look on winemom’s face when Chloe and Chandler get their notices

  17. JesseAz   2 years ago

    National Pulse has recieved the interview with Capitol officer that got Tucker fired.

    https://thenationalpulse.com/2023/08/02/exclusive-capitol-police-chief-called-jan-6-events-a-cover-up-in-tucker-carlson-interview-hidden-by-fox-news/

    “Everything appears to be a cover up,” says the decorated police chief, explaining that most things to do with his department were political, specifically because he reported to politicians including then Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi. “Like I said, I’m not a conspiracy theorist,” Sund explains, “…but when you look at the information and intelligence they had, the military had, it’s all watered down. I’m not getting intelligence, I’m denied any support from National Guard in advance. I’m denied National Guard while we’re under attack, for 71 minutes…”

  18. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    The woman who once said "American women should be lining up with their presidential kneepads on to show their gratitude" toward womanizer Bill Clinton is deeply concerned about RFK, Jr.'s womanizing.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Which wave feminists are these? I can't keep up.

      1. Ska   2 years ago

        Blue wave?

        1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

          Crimson Tide?
          🙂
          😉

          1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

            Deacon Blues.

            1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

              Only if menses is in a vacuum.

      2. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

        Retard wave.

    2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago (edited)

      This is why Democrats are clueless. No woman ever went looking for her kneepads for Old Joe. They need to dump him and KamKam. All Dems need is a candidate women want to blow.

      Gavin Newsome would trounce any Republican.

      Right, Sandy?

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Well bookmarking the one true Newsome supporter.

      2. damikesc   2 years ago

        Only Dems confuse their politicians for sex symbols.

        1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

          No, it is independent women you want. You want them to swipe right on your candidate. Yes, women are that shallow.

          Progs and Cons will vote party line every time.

          1. damikesc   2 years ago

            Racist and sexist.

            Shocker.

          2. Sevo   2 years ago

            turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
            turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

      3. Sevo   2 years ago

        turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
        If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
        turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit.

        1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

          Shut up, Sevo. You're fucking boring.

          1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

            Was anything Sevo said false? You lie, and you're a kiddie diddler. You're also pretty damned stupid.

          2. Sevo   2 years ago

            turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
            turd lies. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

          3. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
            turd lies. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

      4. Kungpowderfinger   2 years ago

        All Dems need is a candidate women want to blow

        SPB isn’t exactly wrong about women Democrats.

        However, that wasn’t the demographic Boy Gavin needed to appeal to when he became mayor of San Francisco.

    3. Nardz   2 years ago

      https://twitter.com/AuronMacintyre/status/1687082193363869697?t=PXNn-KsVRsCprRwrahxNlA&s=19

      Milk, exercise, and the OK sign are all secretly racist but a song about killing white people is just misunderstood

      [Screenshots of msm headlines]

      1. R Mac   2 years ago

        Never give up your guns.

    4. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago (edited)

      Democrats are suddenly very concerned about a Kennedy tomcatting around while he’s married. If it's one thing the Kennedys are famous for, it's their unwavering fidelity to their wives.

  19. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    As the Biden administration "prepared to launch speedy screenings at Border Patrol holding facilities this spring, authorities pledged access to counsel would be a key difference from a Trump-era version of the policy...."

    When one thinks of speedy, attorney involvement always comes to mind.

  20. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

    Another great headline in the Bee: Trudeau's Divorce Leaves Nation In Shock That He Was Married To A Woman

    Meanwhile, millions of Canadian women (and gay guys everywhere) are crashing Ottawa servers with sexts and marriage proposals.

  21. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Mass formation psychosis

    New Study Uncovers Dramatic Shifts in Sexual Identity

    The study’s key findings show:
    Sexual identity mobility is higher among young people aged 16–24 (7.9%) and older adults aged 65 and over (7.4%), compared with those aged 25–64 (5.0–6.2%).
    Sexual identity mobility is 10.3% less likely among men (5.7%) than women (6.3%).
    Sexual identity mobility is three times more likely among non-white ethnic minority individuals (15.5%) than among white people (5.0%).
    Sexual identity mobility is more likely among the less educated.
    Sexual identity mobility is more prevalent among those who self-identified as bisexual, had other sexual identities, and preferred not to disclose their identity, compared with those who self-identified as heterosexual, gay or lesbian.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Hey, if you wanted to cull the human herd, what better way than to greatly reduce reproduction. Gender change propaganda and universal abortions might do the trick.

      1. R Mac   2 years ago

        Sanger just didn’t go far enough for today’s left.

    2. JesseAz   2 years ago

      If sexual identity is mobile then it isnt genetic. Yet the activists will continue to lie about it being genetic to force insurance to pay for it.

      1. rbike   2 years ago

        Yes. What happened to "Born this way"?
        My 1982 high school biology teacher stated that there could be no genetic selection for homos as they did not reproduce. He was a pretty based guy, lumber jacking during the summer break. I never believed it was genetic but I am just a redneck engineer. I could certainly believe it is a mental defect though.

        1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

          Soooo...Do you guys practice Genetics, Psychology, Psychiatry, and Mind-Reading in between work with the chainsaw?
          🙂
          😉

  22. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    "Threads is on course to topple Twitter (or X, if you must)," writes Chris Taylor.

    Move over, Jim Cramer.

  23. JesseAz   2 years ago

    This is CNN.

    "When I first learned about the indictment, I had a long conversation with a friend of mine, Ryan Reilly, and I told him how proud I felt to be an American at that moment. Much in the way that I did when I learned that our military had killed Osama bin Laden. I just felt incredibly proud."

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Cunt News Network?

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        Cult News Network.

  24. But SkyNet is a Private Company   2 years ago

    “Attempted to overthrow the government by fraud” - Ken Duncehat White

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

      Just cheering criminalizing thought crimes and wrong think now.

      1. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

        On the bright side, this novel interpretation could criminalize politicians lying while campaigning illegal in general.

        That is a joke, as such a precedent would be prone to incredible abuse and selective prosecution.

  25. Krokko   2 years ago

    Each of these federal criminal laws — which are broad and flexible by design — has been used to charge a wide variety of fraud and misconduct.

    Wait, aren't "broad and flexible" statues BAD?

    1. R Mac   2 years ago

      Not as bad as Orange Man.

  26. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    A bipartisan trio of House lawmakers last week introduced legislation that would allow marijuana users past and present to qualify for security clearances and serve as federal employees...

    All the legislators know someone who partakes but still can't bring themselves to legalize it. Prohibition is just too lucrative. Easier to open a loophole for themselves.

  27. Longtobefree   2 years ago

    "(or X, if you must)"

    You damn well MUST!!!

    If I have to pretend a man is a woman just because he thinks so, you have to admit the truth of a corporate name change.
    Damn that Humpty Dumpty.

    1. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

      It's a pretty half-assed name change. The domain is still twitter.com. When you go to the page, it asks if you want to "search Twitter." Up until like yesterday, messages were still called "tweets."

      1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

        It sure does seem like Elon gave the job of updating the product name to a summer intern.

  28. damikesc   2 years ago

    Man, I remember when Popehat was readable and occasionally interesting.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Almost a decade ago at this point.

      1. Sevo   2 years ago

        TDS strikes again.

    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      And now he is not because he said things against The Donald?

      1. damikesc   2 years ago

        He's not because you know his take before you read it. Never interesting.

        1. damikesc   2 years ago

          It's like Ilya Somin at Volokh discussing any immigration issue. You know what will be said before you read the first word.

    3. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

      Him leaving Twitter in a snit embodies everything that's wrong with the center-right these days.

  29. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Assaults on democracy.

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2023/08/02/the-prosecution-of-trump-is-an-assault-on-democracy/

    There is a bigger problem with the indictment and the discussion around it, too – namely, the role of politics and double standards. For one thing, Trump is certainly not the first politician to have lied to voters about election interference.

    Consider the so-called Russiagate scandal. After losing the presidential election in 2016, Hillary Clinton and her supporters alleged that Russia had interfered in the election to gift the presidency to Trump. House Democrats then commissioned special counsel Robert Mueller to investigate the claims. Yet when he delivered his report in 2019, Mueller concluded that the evidence ‘did not establish that members of the Trump campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government’. In other words, Clinton and others propagated a false narrative about Trump owing his election win to the Russian state.

    The timing of the new Trump indictment is significant, too. Trump is right to find it suspicious that prosecutors have waited for over two years to indict him, and yet now special counsel Jack Smith is pushing for a ‘speedy trial’. This means the trial could end up taking place during the presidential elections.

    We should always be worried when the judicial system comes into conflict with the democratic process. We cannot pretend that Trump is just like any other defendant. He is the presumptive Republican nominee for the next presidential election. Putting him on trial is bound to distort the campaign (although, if his current success in the polls is anything to go by, it might also work in his favour).

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Why are you posting a libertarian style analysis here?

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        LOL! Maybe because some of us in the commentariat are actual libertarians (not to be confused with "the one true libertarian").

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago

          He took an online poll!!

        2. sarcasmic   2 years ago

          Actual libertarians have principles other than "Trump good, Biden bad. Grunt. Grunt."

          So count yourself out.

          1. JesseAz   2 years ago

            What principles are you using to defend cops shooting unarmed people and thought crimes against Trump?

          2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

            Do "actual libertarians" care about how government power is used or misused, or just about desired outcomes?

            1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

              It's pretty clear that the self-proclaimed "actual libertarians" (ITL, JA and friends) have decided what outcomes should be, process be damned.

              1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

                So proclaims the "one true libertarian".

                1. sarcasmic   2 years ago (edited)

                  So tell me, Mister Actual Libertarian, how you consider yourself and your buddies to be "actual libertarians" when you all oppose free trade, support draconian immigration restrictions, support trade wars, support industrial policy and protectionism, support people needing permission from the government to work, oppose police reform, and are otherwise at odds with what anyone outside these comments considers to be libertarian views?

                  1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                    Man those are a lot of assertions here. Mostly based from ignorance.

                    Ignoring abuses of the market by actors is not free trade. Just because you're ignorant doesn't magically change the current state of the market.

                    1.5M legal immigrants a year is not draconian. Recognizing the costs of illegal immigration and forcing taxpayers to pay 10s of billion a year is draconian. Again your preference is based on ignorance and not principles.

                    Trade wars subsumed by first response.

                    Who here besides you with silicon valley has supported government industrial policies? The ones you bane are the biggest criticizes of Bidens industrial policies and regulations. You ignore those policies while criticizing Trump for his deregulation efforts. Kind of funny.

                    Permission to work? You mean acknowledging government costs of illegal immigration. You again argue from ignorance.

                    Police reform? You laugh about cops killing an unarmed woman and defend all the political prosecutions from the DoJ while defending institutions such as the increase to the IRS.

                    Want to try again?

              2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                ML, I take back my above concession. You didnt even make his list here.

  30. GroundTruth   2 years ago

    Prosecuting doctors for referring women to out-of-state clinics where they can get abortions is B.S. law that should never have been passed; contrary to both First Amendment and the (original meaning of the) Commerce Clause.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Now do gun control laws.

      1. GroundTruth   2 years ago

        Non sequitur?

    2. Social Justice is neither   2 years ago

      Absolutely, if I want a parasite like you dead I should be able to get a local referral for a hitman from another state without consequence.

      1. GroundTruth   2 years ago

        Definite non sequitur.

  31. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Pushback and concern.

    https://www.thecentersquare.com/national/article_9e162e96-3147-11ee-8346-0f3d57461e8d.html

    “This is nothing more than the latest corrupt chapter in the continued pathetic attempt by the Biden Crime Family and their weaponized Department of Justice to interfere with the 2024 Presidential Election, in which President Trump is the undisputed frontrunner, and leading by substantial margins,” Trump said.

    “Yesterday was yet another dark day in America as Joe Biden continues to weaponize his corrupt Department of Justice against his leading political opponent Donald J. Trump,” U.S. Rep. Elise Stefanik, R-N.Y., said on social media.

    Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., and House Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries, D-N.Y., released a joint statement responding to the indictment, saying it “illustrates in shocking detail that the violence of that day [Jan. 6, 2021] was the culmination of a months-long criminal plot.”

    “But why did they wait two and a half years to bring these fake charges, right in the middle of President Trump's winning campaign for 2024?” Trump said. “Why was it announced the day after the big Crooked Joe Biden scandal broke out from the Halls of Congress? The answer is, election interference!”

    “We've become completely accustomed to seeing President Trump indicted for ‘crimes’ while Joe Biden skirts the law every single day,” U.S. Rep. Lauren Boebert, R-Colo., said on social media. “No politically-motivated indictment is going to change my mind.”

    1. ElvisIsReal   2 years ago

      Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., and House Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries, D-N.Y., released a joint statement responding to the indictment, saying it “illustrates in shocking detail that the violence of that day [Jan. 6, 2021] was the culmination of a months-long criminal plot.”

      LOL it does no such thing.

  32. Rev Arthur L kuckland   2 years ago

    Any time this happens I think if the patient killed every single worker in that "hospital" it would be justified

  33. Cyto   2 years ago

    Speaking of driven to suicide
    .....

    https://twitter.com/bariweiss/status/1687101960745553920?t=JA22PWl9mMbbo70nUyI-mw&s=19

    1. Ska   2 years ago

      I was pleasantly surprised that the farcical "died by suicide" phrasing wasn't used in the links or that post.

      As if suicide is some outside influence that kills you and not a deliberate act (outside of accidental death). Deliberately removing agency from suicide is insulting.

    2. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

      *Nick Gillespie Voice* Like, what even are the stakes, man...

      1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

        That was pretty good.

  34. Rev Arthur L kuckland   2 years ago

    Okay just so everyone including retard evil Ken white:
    The doj already committed fraud in 2016 and 2020 to "get" trump, this includes lying under oath, manufacturing evidence, and cesership.

    Fuck off and kill yourself you cancer

  35. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Consequences.

    https://www.thecentersquare.com/illinois/article_3c178eda-30a0-11ee-b0b5-8f428274ecb2.html

    Jeffrey Clayton, executive director of the American Bail Coalition, said prosecutors, judges and public defenders haven’t received funding to hold the hearings, so he sees complications.

    “How’s that going to happen? Are prosecutors just going to file motions to detain in all eligible cases and let the chips fall where they may or are they going to have to pick and choose?” said Clayton to The Center Square. “Are they going to have the resources to file in all the cases they feel are eligible or not, so yes, I think there’s major implementation questions.”

    There are concerns that Illinois’ new system of release and very limited detention without bail will embolden hardened recidivist criminals, as seen in New York state. While New Jersey eliminated monetary bail in 2017, it changed its constitution and spent nearly a billion dollars for prosecutors to perform detention hearings and to create a statewide system of pretrial criminal supervision, including GPS monitoring and house arrest. However, the plan for Illinois is to release criminal defendants, notwithstanding the criminal charges which first led to their arrest.

    “So the question now is what is the detention list, and I’ve been able to obtain a copy from the prosecutors and I can tell you that there are going to be some really serious offenders who are not going to be going to jail,” said Clayton.

  36. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

    I love how Popehat is so anti defendant. “Yeah, thia has never happened before but it’s because Trump is guilty.”

    He’s the lawyer who would be leading the lynch mob. “Normally I disapprove of this sort of extra-judicial measure without a trial, but this animal did rape those two women!”

    1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

      As opposed to thinking minds that have already decided Trump is innocent of everything without even knowing what the charges are?

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

        Can you show us an example of a libertarian supporting novel criminal construction to go after a man that relies on government determining the state if someone’s mind as the basis for the charges. Even fucking Sullum saw the issue with that. But not the one true libertarian.

        List of what the one true libertarian has supported:
        Killing of an unarmed woman
        Espionage Act
        Going after a man to find a crime
        Australian covid camps
        Government applied vaccine mandates
        Thought crimes
        Censorship

        I'm sure I missed a few.

      2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

        Remember, they said OJ was guilty too.

        1. Sevo   2 years ago

          turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
          If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
          turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

      3. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

        I know what the charges are, how can you claim I don't know what they are?

        The first count should be dismissed because Trump did not commit fraud nor conspire to commit fraud. The alternate electors did not attempt to deceive Congress, they presented themselves as alternates in the possibility that Congress audited the vote and found sufficient fraud to alter the results of the election. Trump's attempts to get Pence to refuse to certify was legally dubious, but it was an untested legal theory and not asking him to do something illegal.

        The second and third counts should be dismissed based on the First Amendment because it goes to free speech and freedom of assembly. You have the right to organize a protest and to speak out against the government, and yes, to claim a government is committing election fraud.

        The fourth count should be dismissed because Trump believed there was actual fraud, and he wasn't throwing to throw out legal votes, only ones he believed were fraudulent. In his mind, he was investigating cases of believed fraud in order to protect the rights of other voters who would be affected by voter fraud.

        A judge should slap this out of court. However, this is going to be adjudicated in the DC Circuit, so the politics of the judge are likely to be in play.

        The whole case stinks horribly because it's a current president wielding the power of the criminal justice system against a political rival in advance of an upcoming election. And this is a DOJ and FBI that has a documented history of people fraudulently advancing cases against this same defendant. They've lied and falsified court documents before in order to advance investigations against him and that diminishes my faith that they're going to be honest when dealing with the same defendant going forward.

        1. sarcasmic   2 years ago (edited)

          I’ve got to disagree on count 4. Before the election he urged his supporters to vote in person, knowing that that would result in more mail-in votes for his opponent. That way if he lost he could claim fraud by pointing to jump in votes for his opponent once the mail-in ballots were counted. He knew exactly what he was doing.

          For example there are 1000 voters split evenly between the candidates. Half of them plain to vote by mail. At Trump's urging, 100 of his supporters who would have voted by mail decide to vote in person.
          250 Biden voters vote in person, while 350 Trump voters vote in person.
          250 Biden voters mail in their ballot, while 150 Trump voters mail in their ballots.
          In the end it's still even, but Trump claims fraud because of the uneven split in the mail-in ballots that he knew would happen if his supporters did what they were told.

          1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

            Hey Don't look at me, there's the math you fucking retarded retard.

            1. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

              Ideas!

              1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

                The first time I tried to explain this Don't look at me said I was stupid because he couldn't do the math. I always find it amusing when stupid people say I'm the stupid one when they lack the mental capacity to understand something.

                1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

                  The problem is your assertion as the basis of your claim is fucking wrong.

                  Trump himself voted by mail. He told supporters multiple times to vote by mail. But you take his warnings of the possible fraud as him not doing so. Because you believe government to be honest and fraud free.

                  Your numbers are also bullshit. Your claim that Biden got so many in person votes is laughable. You ignore the election day issues throughout the country caused by the groups discouraging in person votes.

                  You ignore batches of Biden votes in the mid 90% which is just a laughable statistical anomaly.

          2. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

            Before the election he urged his supporters to vote in person, knowing that that would result in more mail-in votes for his opponent. That way if he lost he could claim fraud by pointing to jump in votes for his opponent once the mail-in ballots were counted.

            That's you reading into his motivations. An alternative possibility is that he believed mail-in ballots have more complicated chains of custody and are more ripe for fraud, and he believed bad actors would lose or defraud ballots from Republicans or from Republican areas. The reason he gave that instruction is probably because he was concerned about fraud prior to the election, and he made numerous comments to back this up.

            You believe one thing about his intentions that's criminal, but there's another plausible interpretation, with evidence to support it. Benefit of the doubt goes to a criminal defendant.

            He knew exactly what he was doing.

            That's your own bias. YOU know exactly what YOU think he was doing. But no matter how much you dislike someone, he still has rights.

            1. sarcasmic   2 years ago (edited)

              An alternative possibility is that he believed mail-in ballots have more complicated chains of custody and are more ripe for fraud, and he believed bad actors would lose or defraud ballots from Republicans or from Republican areas.

              You’re buying the bullshit. By creating a situation where there would be more mail-in ballots for his opponent, he was setting the stage to claim everything you just said in the case that he lost.

              Trump is many things, but stupid is not one of them.

              1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

                People were calling this before the election even happened. And they were right.

                1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

                  Sarc are you even aware it was democrats warning about election fraud you ridiculous shit weasel?

                  https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/democratic-senators-warned-of-potential-vote-switching-by-dominion-voting-machines-prior-to-2020-election

                  https://www.npr.org/2019/09/04/755066523/cyber-experts-warn-of-vulnerabilities-facing-2020-election-machines

            2. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

              and he believed bad actors would lose or defraud ballots from Republicans or from Republican areas.

              And Trump wouldn't be wrong in assuming that. It wouldn't be the first time any shenanigans happened with ballots on the way to the county building. In 2006, the Cook County Board Presidency was up for grabs between Tony Peraica (R) and Todd Stroger (D) (filling in for his father, John Stroger, Jr.). Ballot boxes from NW Cook County, a heavily Republican area came into the Loop very late. The boxes for those ballots were damaged, and the seals on them were broken.

            3. mad.casual   2 years ago

              That’s you reading into his motivations.

              Overarchingly, it's a deliberate miscarriage of justice and arguably part of an underlying anti-democratic and anti-human ethos. That is to say, longstanding jurisprudence and modern, American equality before the law, would recognize that if Trump were guilty of manipulating the election in such a fashion, then anyone/everyone manipulating the election in favor of mail-in voting in the belief that it would cause them to win is directly and equally guilty. Which has been my point from the start. Whether you're rigging elections by employing or opposing mail-in voting, you're still rigging elections. The only way not to be doing so is to have agreed on the rules ahead of time, including the how, when, why of deviating from that and sticking to it. *Any* deviation is rigging.

              As to the anti-democracy and anti-human, democracy is pretty straightforward. Woven into the founding fabric of the nation was that the crown couldn't simply whimsically change governance and/or representation specifically in such a fashion (i.e. call votes tomorrow before representatives could be present nor delay votes until forgotten or convenient). As far as anti-human goes, the fundamental argument is that motive is of primacy over action, essentially that since it's OK to murder some people for the right reason(s), there should be no law against murder.

            4. Mike Laursen   2 years ago (edited)

              Whether Trump was genuinely concerned with mail-in fraud before the election or not, it was deceitful for he, Giuliani, and others to then play his followers by insinuating there was fraud behind the vote surge that was predicted well in advance.

              1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

                It was pretty fucking obvious when he urged his supporters to vote in person and not trust mailed ballots. This meant there would be a surge of Biden votes when the mail-ins were counted, and he'd already planted seeds of doubt in preparation to claim fraud if he lost.

                Very clever and shrewd.

                Does that rise to the level of criminal activity? I don't think so. Shameful yes, criminal no.

                1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

                  "Shameful yet, criminal no."

                  Agreed.

              2. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

                I told ya so!!!!

                The Sad Saga of the Stolen Erections

                And lo, it came to pass, that Tim the Enchanter blew upon His Magic Flute, and led me to a secret cave (the Cave of Caerbannog), whereupon mystic runes carved into the very living rock foretold of a day to come.

                This sad, sad day has now manifested itself, just as foretold. The Promised One had been delivered to us, and was to fertilize His Queen, Stormy Daniels, in an amazing scene; a glaze of Vaseline. Their offspring were to be called Strumpets… Which is a concatenation of Stormy and Trump. They were to number in the millions… About 332 million; enough for all residents of the USA to be issued one Strumpet per each resident, to sit on his or her right shoulder, and make sure that each resident stayed WAAAY Righteous. Each Strumpet was to progressively exert more and more Righteousness Control over each resident, by covering them in Strumpet Vines.

                Sad to say, the Bad Bider-Grunch stole Trumpsmas AND Trump’s Erections! The stolen erections prevented the birth of the 332 million Strumpets, in the world’s WORST mass murder (genocide) so far! Even Saint Babbitt could NOT save the Strumpets!

                This is the Sad Tale of the Demise of the USA!

          3. JesseAz   2 years ago

            It is amazing how much you rely on ignorance. I have given you a half dozen links of Trump telling crowds to vote by mail. Youre literally pushing a false narrative invented by the left.

      4. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

        A Thinking Mind has always been more of an emoting mind.

      5. MT-Man   2 years ago

        If we are trying to be true to past ideals/precedents of the nation, Isn't it innocent until proven guilty a concept we should be following from the constitution and amendments rather than guilty until proven innocent?

        1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

          Tell that to the IRS!

        2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          In the courtroom, yes! And since this is a criminal, not civil, trial, just one juror can stop Trump from being convicted of the charges.

          However, Popehat is upfront that he dislikes Trump, and he’s allowed to say so.

    2. mad.casual   2 years ago (edited)

      I didn’t get that he was specifically anti-defendant as much as he was acknowledging/restating the point that he disagreed with. IMO:

      More takes on the new Trump indictment. Ken “Popehat” White takes issue with people describing the indictment as “unprecedented” – As told by ENB
      (No goats were *harmed* in the making of this clusterfuck)

      There are writers impartial, technical, and careful enough to accurately capture and portray what Ken White or any other lawyer is saying. ENB is not one of those authors.

      1. mad.casual   2 years ago

        No goats were *harmed* in the making of this clusterfuck - A Ken White/George Bernard Shaw mashup:

        "Never wrestle with a goatfucker, even performatively. One way or the other you're going to have to put yourself between the goat and the goatfucker and the goatfucker is gonna enjoy it."

        1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

          Tell us more about your family gatherings.

          1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

            Casually Mad IS the product of RAM-pant, ram-it-into-yer-pants goat-fucking!!!

  37. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Vivek: Trump 2.0? Excerpts of an interview with Barri Weiss.

    https://www.thefp.com/p/vivek-ramaswamy-bari-weiss-honestly-interview

    VR: "To me, it does not mean bloodshed and violence, but it means a revival of the ideals that set this nation into motion in 1776. I do think we live in a 1776 moment. I think that the American bargain was built on the idea that we, the people, determine how we settle our political differences through free speech and open debate in the public square where every person’s voice and vote counts equally. That is self-governance. And I think that there is the Old World vision now rearing its head in multiple forms that says, no, we the people cannot be trusted. The citizens of a nation cannot be trusted to determine what’s actually good for them—so we, the intelligentsia, must make that determination centrally at large. I stand on the side of the American Revolution, the ideals that birthed this nation."

    BW: "But if I’m an Always-Trumper, why am I going to vote for you when I could vote for Trump? Why would I go for New Coke when I could just have Coke?"

    VR: "Do you want a two-liter bottle that’s been in the fridge, and doesn’t have the same fizz that it did when you first popped the cork? I’m sticking to your analogy, not mine! But that’s really the question. I’ve got fresh legs. I’m 37. I’m going further than Trump did."

    1. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

      Vivek will be tolerated as long as he doesn't rise beyond Herman Cain levels of support. Once he starts getting close to Trump or Perot levels, watch for the sudden flood of hit pieces.

    2. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

      The irony is that people initially thought New Coke was better-tasting than Coke, because they'd done the blind taste-tests on it. The whole product was inspired by the fact that Pepsi was kicking their ass on those things beforehand, Pepsi just didn't have the same brand loyalty.

      1. Commenter_XY   2 years ago

        I want to hear more of what this Vivek Ramaswamy guy has to say.

  38. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    Alright, in celebration of Fatass Donnie's 4pm official indictment I am going to mix a celebratory happy hour drink.

    Thinking a White Russian is appropriate.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      Knock yourself out there, Pluggo and get so drunk you pass out for a few days. It'll improve the comment section while you're gone.

    2. Sevo   2 years ago

      turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
      turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

    3. Cyto   2 years ago

      Underlining the fraudulent attempt to use the government to overturn an election with your drink of choice was an excellent application of irony.

    4. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      Wait, you are Peter Suderman?

  39. Sevo   2 years ago

    "Doctors sue California medical board to halt implicit bias training mandate"
    [...]
    "A pair of doctors and a group that says it is determined to protect health care from “radical, divisive ideology” sued the Medical Board of California on Tuesday to stop it from enforcing a state law that requires doctors to study the role of implicit bias in treatment.
    The lawsuit filed in U.S. District Court in Los Angeles targets a 2019 state law that describes implicit bias in health care as unconscious “attitudes or internalized stereotypes” that can lead to disparities in care among ethnic groups and by gender or sexuality even when medical complaints are similar..."
    https://www.sfchronicle.com/health/article/doctors-sue-california-medical-board-halt-18260018.php

    The mandate simply assumes universal racism and requires 'study' of that. PLF is the 'group' and they are doing some fine work.

  40. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    DEI doesn't pay.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/new-disney-board-eliminates-diversity-equity-and-inclusion-programs

    "Today, District Administrator Glenton Gilzean announced the abolition of all DEI programs at the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District," the district said in a public statement on Aug. 1.

    "The district's DEI committee will be dissolved and any DEI job duties will be eliminated. CFTOD staff will also no longer be permitted to use any staff time to pursue DEI initiatives.

    "Our district will no longer participate in any attempt to divide us by race or advance the notion that we are not created equal.

    1. Longtobefree   2 years ago

      (filling in for Paul Harvey)

      https://thefederalist.com/2023/08/02/desantis-appointed-disney-board-axes-illegal-and-unamerican-dei-initiatives/

  41. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Facebook takes orders from Big Brother.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/biden-admin-ordered-facebook-change-algos-suppress-conservatives

    In one meeting on April 14th, 2021, Flaherty asked Facebook if it was possible to artificially promote outlets such as the New York Times and the Washington Post, instead the Daily Wire and Fox News, particularly commentator Tomi Lahren.

    “If you were to change the algorithm so that people were more likely to see NYT, WSJ, any authoritative news source over Daily Wire, Tomi Lahren, polarizing people,” Flaherty asked.

    “We have to explain to President, Ron [Klain], people, why there is misinfo on the internet, bigger problem than FB,” said Flaherty, according to the typed notes from Facebook executives.

    “What are the things driving hesitancy on your platform? What is it? How big is the problem? When you are intervening, how are you measuring success?” Flaherty repeatedly grilled the Facebook executives in one meeting.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Saving democracy.

  42. creech   2 years ago

    Biden will not fall until and unless there is conclusive evidence that he took bribes and didn't pay taxes on the ill-gotten gains. What is needed to launch a team of forensic accountants to "follow the money?" Is it a Special Counsel?
    Assuming the "Big Guy" got 10%, where is the money? Did he buy real estate with it? If so, that should be traceable. Is it sitting in an off-shore account?
    If so, what is Joe using it for? Why take bribes if it can't be used for personal spending? If the "Big Guy" is not touching the money and is
    simply building up an estate for his heir's use, then why not let Hunter get 100% in the beginning and avoid any impeachable offenses?
    Of course, even a "smoking gun" isn't going to convince some Bidenistas, and their media toadies, that Joe is a crook.

    1. Ska   2 years ago

      Many people simply have real trouble letting go. I can't tell you how many times someone who is 75 years old starts discussing estate planning. They were wealthy for 30+ years but they don't want to give up control of their assets

    2. Nardz   2 years ago

      LOL at thinking evidence matters

    3. Cyto   2 years ago

      The smoking gun has been on the public record for several years.

    4. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      This. This is what Comer’s committee needs to do next.

      Someone was pointing at “commingling” of Hunter and Joe’s bank accounts as solid evidence of corruption. It isn’t all that solid a smoking gun until some accountants do the boring forensic work of calculating if the net cash flow went toward Hunter or toward Joe, all “gifts” were reported for tax purposes, etc.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

        I thought you had me on mute Mike. I’m the one who brings that point up here. Lol.

        There is also a long judicial review of coming long if accounts for politicians. Try education over assumption.

      2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

        Go away, ankle-biting little gnat who doesn’t know a parody news story when he sees one.

  43. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Not an illusion or magic trick.

    https://johnkassnews.com/the-illusion-of-access-to-joe-biden-for-chumbolones/

    In the trick called “The Vanishing Bird Cage,” the audience sees and hears the magician slamming black lacquered boxes flat—the canary disappears—and the magician keeps slamming and searching, but the canary is gone!

    Which reminds me of the latest iteration of the Joe Biden story on pro-Joe CNN, which appeared after left-wing media finally got its story straight, following the closed-door Congressional testimony of Devon Archer, who once was presidential son Hunter Biden’s business partner.

    “Former business partner says Hunter Biden sold ‘illusion’ of access to Joe Biden, source says”

    Well, because, Hunter Biden only sold the “illusion” of selling access to Joe, at least according to Democrat Dan Goldman.

    Trump’s most recent indictment was purely political. His crime, believing the 2020 election was “rigged.” Democrats like Hillary Clinton and Stacey Abrams are encouraged to believe in rigged elections when Democrats lose and say so publicly, in speeches, in op-eds of woke newspapers, on MSNBC and to Joe and Mika and lionized as heroes in news columns penned by Bolshevik suck-ups.

    Whew! Democrats must sleep better knowing that “business was never discussed,” even though that really doesn’t matter. Business was never discussed? Really? You believe that? Are you all a bunch of chumbolones? Must you not only wear the fright wig and floppy shoes but all the trappings of a clown, too? And wet your pants for cheap laughs?

    “I said, ‘You’re not getting the billion.’ I’m going to be leaving here in, I think it was about six hours. I looked at them and said: ‘I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money,’” Biden recalled telling Poroshenko. “Well, son of a bitch, he got fired. And they put in place someone who was solid at the time.”

    The way Biden said “son of a bitch” was fascinating, like the way he angrily challenged an Iowa voter to a pushup contest in his dog-faced-pony-soldier phase. How many tough guys tell you they’re tough? Zero.

    If old Joe escapes and keeps the grift going, he’ll snicker at the American people, smirk and consider them fools. Because, as he said himself, “Nobody F’s with a Biden.”

    Especially not even a chumbolone.

    No kid from Chicago grows up dreaming of being a chumbolone someday. A chumbolone is an idiot, a fool. The word was popularized years ago by a corrupt Chicago cop who served the gangsters in the Chicago Outfit’s Chinatown crew.

    But anyone who believes that Biden was merely offering an “illusion” of access clout involving your government is a certified Chumbolone and cannot possibly wear a No Chumbolone hat like me. I wouldn’t allow it. It would not be allowed under The Chicago Way.

    Besides, they probably don’t even know how to look at a magician’s stage for evidence of that canary, or if you prefer, pigeon once lived an adventurous life in show-biz. And now that old Joe Biden has put that rope around his own neck, bragging that he and Obama got rid of the prosecutor who was causing Hunter Biden’s benefactors so much grief, there will be more pigeons and canaries making music.

    The Democrats know this. You know who doesn’t know it? The Chumbolones. They’re oblivious until the cage slams shut.

    1. mad.casual   2 years ago

      No kid from Chicago grows up dreaming of being a chumbolone someday. A chumbolone is an idiot, a fool. The word was popularized years ago by a corrupt Chicago cop who served the gangsters in the Chicago Outfit’s Chinatown crew.

      Call me an old, but I still prefer the term "mook".

    2. damikesc   2 years ago

      Ironically --- Archer never said "illusion of access". Rep Goldman is the only one who did.

  44. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

    Nobody's ever been charged with this set of facts because nobody's ever attempted to overthrow the government by fraud like this before.

    This is utterly embarrassing.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Just ignore all previous election lawsuits and he has a point.

      1. Nardz   2 years ago

        And the Time article bragging about "a cabal" doing exactly that

      2. mad.casual   2 years ago (edited)

        Ken goes on to say pretty much exactly this. He goes on to be considerably more wrong (essentially saying because of all the other lawsuits, this one should proceed despite being even more shaky/implausible), but this particular quote is about as valid as ‘Rudy Giuliani admits he was lying’, ‘Trump’s testimony about circumstantial non-crimes proves he knew he stole documents’, and ‘Ted Cruz hates liberal democratic values’.

        Again, there is a person or a magazine who could honestly and credibly present this statement of Ken White’s as a mere restatement of the premise he disagrees with, ENB and Reason are not those people or magazine.

  45. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    She's not a chumbolone.

    https://nypost.com/2023/08/03/crystal-clear-that-joe-biden-was-involved/

    Just in case it wasn’t clear what Hunter Biden was doing when he put his dad, then-Vice President Joe Biden, on the speakerphone during business meetings, even Hunter’s former business partner Devon Archer calls it an “abuse of soft power.”

    According to designated Democratic apologist Rep. Dan Goldman (D-NY), Joe Biden had no idea who was on the speakerphone in Paris or Dubai or Lake Como, or wherever it was that Hunter introduced his father to shady foreigners who were showering him with millions of dollars and lavish gifts like a $50,000 Hublot watch, which Archer says Hunter got from the Ukrainians.

    Archer was careful choosing his words to the Oversight Committee on Monday and in a subsequent interview with former Fox News host Tucker Carlson. Facing a one-year prison sentence over a fraud conviction, Archer has been bombarded with death threats since news broke that he was cooperating with congressional investigators. The father of three has tried to tell the truth while trying to survive at the center of a brutal tug-of-war between Congress and the White House.

    As he told Carlson, it’s “categorically false” that Joe Biden had no role in his son’s business or knowledge of it: “He was aware of Hunter’s ­business. He met with Hunter’s business partners.”

    He described how Joe was “the brand” of his family “business” and was used to send “signals” of power, access and influence, whether on speakerphone or meeting in person. There were dinners at Café Milano in Washington, DC, with Hunter’s benefactors from Ukraine, Russia and China, breakfasts at the vice presidential residence in DC, handshakes on the sidelines of Beijing meetings. Ultimately, it was this access to VP Biden that sent millions of dollars flowing into Biden family coffers.

    He was asked by Carlson about an urgent email sent to him and Hunter on May 12, 2014, from Burisma executive Vadym Pozharskyi demanding to know “how you could use your influence to convey a message, signal, etc., to stop what we consider to be politically motivated actions.” At the time, Burisma was aggressively being investigated by Ukrainian Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin.

    Archer explained what “signal” means in a corrupt country like Ukraine. “It’s almost like, you know, the shakedown … they’re using a common term to them and sending back here to us and say, ‘I hope we’re protected’ kind of thing …

    Ultimately, said Archer, “I do believe that, at the end of the day, Burisma wouldn’t have stayed in business so long if Hunter was not on the board.”

    Ain’t that the truth. By Joe Biden’s own admission, he flew to Ukraine a few days after that fateful Dubai speakerphone call, and threatened the Ukrainian government that he would withhold $1 billion in US aid unless Shokin was fired. Three months later, Shokin was gone, and as Archer said, ­Burisma was off the hook.

    1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

      Joe admitting he got Shokin fired is the smoking gun, the DNA and the eyewitness testimony. It is a straightforward quid pro quo. The email, money trail and Joe's on camera confession are proof positive.

  46. raspberrydinners   2 years ago

    I'm sure all these "pro-life" people won't give a shit once women start dying en masse due to not having proper healthcare available.

    "It was god's will" says the culpable.

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      dying en masse..

      How on earth did humans ever survive before abortions?

      1. mad.casual   2 years ago (edited)

        Some might call me a “scientist” or “atheist” for saying this but despite dinners’ fervent religious beliefs, clumps of cells with XX (or XY) chromosomes do have mass.

      2. Mike Parsons   2 years ago

        These people think genuine merited criticism of transgenderism = genocide.

        They are histrionic children who arent attached to reality, and thus dont have the ability to make reasonable judgements, especially with respect to scale.

        Hence you get a literal SCOTUS justice who put in the record that “For high-risk black newborns, having a black physician more than doubles the likelihood that the baby will live, and not die.”

        Their world is shaped by propaganda and lies. Its what their brain floats in all day. They arent to be taken seriously, certainly never literally.

    2. Mike Parsons   2 years ago

      "once women start dying en masse"

      Ya, that 99.9998% survival rate is a real bitch. Bodies piled up everywhere.

      Thanks for illustrating why we your kind shouldn't have a seat at the table, you are clearly incapable of rational thought.

    3. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

      Just like how "pro-choice" people did not give a shit once girls and women started becoming infertile after they had to take a vaccine to keep a job at an employer that had more than fifty employees?

  47. Nardz   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/Oilfield_Rando/status/1687105092942786562?t=dod6Brw_lq-VALOMpGd5ww&s=19

    Basically GOP leadership gave Biden an infrastructure bill that gave Mayor Pete a slush fund for DEI initiatives.

    [Link]

  48. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago (edited)

    Why middle-aged Americans aren’t going back to church.

    1 Corinthians 13: 11
    When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
    🙂
    😉

    1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      As I was taught as a teenager forced to sit through born-again Christian sermons, the devil is an expert at quoting scripture. So, get thee behind me, TRE!

      By the way, this is how we know Donald Trump, the Lord’s champion, is not the devil: he couldn’t quote a Bible verse to save his life.

      1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

        LOL! Many Atheists have said the quickest way to become an Atheist is to actually read the "holy" writ of various religions.

        Examining the texts for internal contradictions, contradictions with other "holy" texts, contradictions with the larger context of human knowledge outside the texts, reading them for absurdities and moral atrocities, as well as for literary style and occasional profundities...is all a great exercise of the mind.

        To anybody who does this, I say get thee before me and teach me more!

        Rest assured, Donald Trump wouldn't relate to the above verse at all, since it involves giving up foolish things...and it involves only 1 Corinthian and not 2 Corinthians walking into a bar.
        🙂
        😉

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          It's not even reading The Bible with intent to find flaws and contradictions.

          People are taught in church to try to be a good person, and that leads sometimes to the very people who take the goal of being good seriously scrutinizing The Bible with intent to better themselves, but the scrutiny makes them see disturbing things.

          1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

            Decent, thoughtful human beings who happen to be religiously affiliated are better than their professed creeds.

            1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

              Yes, it is often so.

        2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          The quickest way to become an Atheist is to not actually read them, but get the Cliffsnotes version from Youtube channels and r/atheism.

          1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

            Sooooo...Is Strawman Voodoo Doll-Making part of Theology and Apologetics?
            🙂

      2. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

        It's starting to make sense.

        Behind every liberal is just a 'fuck you dad' kind of kid who didnt like going to church

    2. mad.casual   2 years ago

      Weird, this is tone-specific to the schtick that Public Entelectual has adopted. Almost like you're really the same person... right down to the SuedohEntelectual/AuntEyeCogitation handle.

      Which would be great if you guys, combined, were even half as intellectual or cogitative as even an ardent flat earther.

      1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

        Fret not, Dr. Clayton Forrester. Your Crow T. Robot foil has no Robot clones or cybernetic extensions running around loose in this Satellite of Love called the Reason Comments.

        As for Flat Earthers, those are religion's version of Jim Henson's Muppet Brain Babies, not sired by Secular, rational science.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          I've always believed Flat Earthers must be trolls.

        2. mad.casual   2 years ago (edited)

          Fret not

          I don’t recall Crow T. Robot projecting his worry about "*F*lat *E*arthers" onto Dr. Forrester for comedic or other effect. Your version of MST3K sounds a lot more sad rather than clever or funny.

          1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

            Crow didn't worry about anything. He just smart-assed back at stupid, absurd, annoying things and people and had laughs, just as I do.
            🙂

  49. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

    Mashable predicts good things for Threads. "Threads is on course to topple Twitter (or X, if you must)," writes Chris Taylor. "Don't be surprised if Threads becomes the go-to place for all things trending by the end of 2023."

    HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Actually, that pretty much sums up my reaction to this morning's entire Roundup.

    1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      HAHAHAHAHA sums up my reaction to JesseAz — you know the guy who always touts how he is so much better informed about what is REALLY going on because he goes to true sources of truth, never MSM — linking to a story he didn’t realize is parody.

      1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

        Said the “turducken is GMO “ guy.

      2. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        What's that about HO2, again?

      3. JesseAz   2 years ago

        I am better informed than you. How do you know o talk about reading primary sources if you muted me?

    2. Mike Parsons   2 years ago

      Right in line behind mastadon. I wonder if these same folks were flocking to myspace back in the day too

    3. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      the desperate cope is amazing to watch

  50. MWAocdoc   2 years ago

    "... these federal criminal laws ... are broad and flexible by design ..."

    And they, like all of the other four thousand plus broad and flexible federal laws, are unconstitutionally broad and vague and should be struck down! There should be a very few actual federal crimes which should be very specific about the proscribed ACTIONS and clearly define criminal INTENT. If a prosecutor has a lot of "flexibility" in deciding whether to file charges or not, it shouldn't be a law. Otherwise the door is wide open for politically-based "weaponization" of the law and endless feuding with tit-for-tat partisan attacks.

    1. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

      Especially as these laws encroach on freedom of speech.

      Freedom of speech is broad and flexible by design; exceptions are explicit and narrow.

    2. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

      Nothing quite like reading a defense of "broad and flexible by design" federal laws on an ostensibly libertarian site.

      1. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

        Popehat was being quoted.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          Popehat, David French, Bill Kristol.

          Reason became a neocon fanzine so slowly I barely noticed.

        2. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

          I realize that, but it was quoted without any rebuttal or commentary offered by ENB. If she disagreed with his take I would have hoped she would have said something. In the past when she's included pull quotes from other people she disagrees with she's done that, which would seem to imply she agrees with Popehat's analysis. Also, Ken White used to be considered a "libertarian" as well, so to see a supposed libertarian make an argument in favor of "broad and fliexible" laws is still disappointing (although not surprising anymore).

          1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

            Got it. Not allowed to simply quote someone without interjecting one’s own opinions. If yourefrain from stating your own opinions, the commentariat will fill them in for you.

            1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

              Literally what you're doing in your post, hypocrite. Self-awareness isn't your superpower.

  51. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    The HUNTER BIDEN FAKE BRIBERY SCANDAL! has now devolved into the OLD JOE DISCUSSED CHINA BIDNESS WITH HUNTER!

    They want to gin up a scandal so badly.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      You really are desperate to #DefendBidenAtAllCosts.

    2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      "OLD JOE DISCUSSED CHINA BIDNESS WITH HUNTER!"

      Devolved? That's mind-bogglingly unethical. Do you even understand what you're typing?

      Your boss at the fifty-cent factory is going to kick your ass over that one.

  52. Nardz   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/AuronMacintyre/status/1687077803420680192?t=GPwa4y852MexrBysozHfqQ&s=19

    The best part is that MSNBC chose to clip this because they thought it was a good look

    "@MSNBC
    “We’re looking at American history”
    “Can you imagine our reading that James Madison or Thomas Jefferson tried to overthrow the government so they could stay in power?”
    “This is narcissism with steroids”
    -⁦@TheRevAl⁩ on ⁦@Morning_Joe⁩
    [Video]"

    1. mad.casual   2 years ago

      I thought the "This is not a man who's facing a situation because he believed in a political position or a political policy or cause. I've seen people go down the wrong side for a cause." was hilarious.

      It's like he's never heard of C.S. Lewis or Christopher Nolan... or he has and presumes no one else has.

  53. Dillinger   2 years ago

    >>Idaho can't start prosecuting doctors for referring women to out-of-state clinics where they can get abortions

    here yesterday state agents didn't have 1A rights. which is it?

    1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      What story from yesterday are you referring to?

      Are doctors “state agents”?

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        who do yours report to?

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          Most of my doctors report to a big conglomerate "health system" company that owns several hospitals and clinices, and recently launched their own health insurance company.

          And both the doctors and the "health system" have to comply with a ton of regulations, many of which big conglomerate health companies drafted and lobbied for.

          What was I supposed to answer?

          1. Dillinger   2 years ago

            I love when we're on the same page.

            1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

              Like fookin’ soulmates we are.

  54. Dillinger   2 years ago

    Popehat, Noah Rothman, and Sullum walk into a clown college ...

    1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago (edited)

      And Professor Dillinger welcomes them to “Clown Clique Membership Signaling 101”.

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        clique?

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago (edited)

          Yes, in the case of your comment, “Popehat, Noah Rothman, and Sullum walk into a clown college …”, you were signaling your membership in the conservative, Reason-bashing clique, which has a lot of overlap with the Mean Girls clique.

          1. Dillinger   2 years ago

            not that I require validation from anyone here, but you seem to be my biggest fan

            1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

              I don't believe for a second you don't want validation from the Mean Girls and "unReason" cliques. There's no other reason to have post that comment.

              1. Dillinger   2 years ago

                this is the one place on the interwebs I voice my opinion. if someone reads it, gracias.

                there aren't like ... meetings or box socials ... or if there are I'm not on the list

                1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

                  You’ll have to try harder to get invited.

              2. Red Rocks White Privilege   2 years ago

                LOL, save your insecurities for your therapist, shithead.

              3. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

                "signaling your membership in the conservative, Reason-bashing clique... There’s no other reason to have post that comment."

                Mike's so incredibly bien pensant he can't imagine that someone might reject orthodoxy for any other reason than to be part of an orthodoxy.

                1. Dillinger   2 years ago

                  lol. orthodoxy rejects good name for garage band

    2. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

      a clown college ...

      Which one? Princeton? Harvard? Cal Berkley? Details, man! Paint a picture.

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        I'll hasten you to not refer to Princeton that way ...

      2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

        Another Popehat quote, from today (yeah, from Mastodon!):

        https://mastodon.social/@Popehat/110826155145302918

        Looking at the six co-conspirators, only one — Kenneth Chesebro - went to Harvard or Yale Law. This is disappointing. In this great nation’s history and culture, Harvard and Yale have played prominent and indispensable roles in destroying the Republic. Letting me down here.

        Yes, two went to Georgetown Law. Nice work Georgetown. Way to get on the board! It’s a good start but see if you can start a few wars or overthrow something and get back to us.

  55. MWAocdoc   2 years ago (edited)

    If a criminal charge against a former President requires “a nuanced look at strengths and weaknesses of the indictment” then the law is a very bad law and should be struck down. If lawyers have serious, legitimate disagreements from all angles over these indictments and almost all of them conclude that a fair jury would have problems convicting the former President, then how would an ordinary, non-lawyer citizen know if their actions violated the law? My own non-nuanced opinion is that it is impossible to “defraud” the government by saying you think the election itself was fraudulent. One might defraud the government by contracting to sell grapefruit to the army and then delivering it grapefruit seeds. One cannot, in my opinion, defraud “the government” by agitating to overturn an election in a political or legal process.

    1. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

      The maxim that ignorance of the law is no excuse relies on the presumption that there exists a fair chance to understand what the law requires, forbids, or both. If a law is unconstitutionally vague, then this defeats that presumption.

  56. MWAocdoc   2 years ago

    "Idaho can't start prosecuting doctors for referring women to out-of-state clinics where they can get abortions"

    Although it might be tempting to take this law out of context and believe that Idaho legislators and the Governor actually believe in a total ban on abortions, I believe that this should be considered in the context of the culture wars. A total ban and violation of First and Fourth Amendments is the only way to get the Supreme Court's attention after years of legislation from the bench by "liberal" Judges. Eventually I think the "conservative" Court will settle down the culture wars with more reasonable decisions. In the meantime I STILL don't want to be forced to pay for someone else's abortion!

  57. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

    Nobody's ever been charged with this set of facts because nobody's ever attempted to overthrow the government by fraud like this before

    Sure we have.
    The Durham Report shows how the Justice Department attempted to overthrow the government by fraud.

    But in other senses, that term is misleading. Each of these federal criminal laws — which are broad and flexible by design — has been used to charge a wide variety of fraud and misconduct.

    Ah, broad and flexible by design.

    In other words, unconstitutionally vague.

    Of course, with these broad interpretations of fraud, the whole "Trump Colluded with the Russians®™ to Steal the 2016 Election" propaganda campaign was a conspiracy to defraud the United States.

    1. MWAocdoc   2 years ago

      I usually try to avoid "whataboutism" on this forum, but in this case you're absolutely right. When the prosecutors apply one standard to politicians of one party and a different standard to politicians of the other party, it means that "equal justice under the law" is long gone.

      1. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

        One of my longtime Usenet allies, Christopher Charles Morton, wrote this about General Mark Milley.

        https://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=379970&p=4515565#post4515565

        If Milley won’t be punished for TREASON, why should he be punished for telling the truth?

        The UCMJ has simply ceased to exist by way of its blatantly arbitrary, discriminatory and partisan application.

        The “leadership” of the U.S. military has forfeited all respect, and the destruction of respect for military law was merely collateral damage.

        As long as Milly’s not stretching a rope, the UCMJ is an utter nullity.

  58. SRG   2 years ago

    Noah Rothman's article is good - but it won't prevent lots of Trumpsuckers posting how the indictment is double jeopardy (conflating the impeachment charge with the unrelated charges in the indictment), the charges are not real crimes, or the offences are contrary to 1A, etc.

    As he says, which is enough to get him accused here of being a leftist:

    Donald Trump’s many failed legal challenges of 2020’s election outcomes and the many Americans he deceived created the conditions that erupted in violence. He lied repeatedly, brazenly, and likely knowingly. He suborned others to lie. He sought to obstruct the proper workings of government. And his behavior begat one of the darkest days in this country’s history.

    All of which is to say: These charges deserve the hearing they are about to receive.

    In the demotic, "what he said"...

    1. Michael Ejercito   2 years ago

      Donald Trump’s many failed legal challenges of 2020’s election outcomes and the many Americans he deceived created the conditions that erupted in violence.

      How would these failed legal challenges cause violence?

      1. damikesc   2 years ago

        Also, is he opining that using legal challenges that you have is somebody wrong if others do bad things?

      2. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        How would these failed legal challenges cause violence?

        Apparently Trump supporters don't have any agency, they just do whatever the Trumpenfuhrer/ OrangeManBad tells them to do. Although by that "logic" they should have all gone home after he told them to.

        1. SRG   2 years ago

          Who said anything about lacking agency? Trump supporters individually got pissed off of their own volition and decided to resort to violence. If you get someone fired up by lying to them, they're still acting volitionally even if they've been misled and even if the person misleading them knows their propensity for getting fired up.

      3. SRG   2 years ago

        They wouldn't by themselves. Read what Rothman actually said: "created the conditions that erupted in violence."

    2. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Why did Noah ignore the cases trumps team won shrike? Did Gores failed legal challenge in 2020 deserve to have him locked up?

      1. SRG   2 years ago

        Still not shrike you lying fuckwit.

        And you keep on misrepresenting the nature of the cases that Trump won.. Almost none of them were attempts to overturn the election outcomes - and those cases were the ones that mattered. But you know this, you just can't be honest about it.

  59. Commenter_XY   2 years ago

    One take I have not read in these comments, today. What to make of VPOTUS Pence's recent comments wrt his old boss. He was very unsparing in his analysis.

    Not sure about the rest of you, but I personally place great weight on what VPOTUS Pence has to say. Mike Pence is a man who acted with personal integrity and honor on January 6th, and therefore, is worthy of being listened to closely, which I am doing (along with many others, I suspect). He is about as honest as you will ever get in Washington DC.

    When your top subordinate is saying some of the things he is saying....it gives me pause.

    Tell me....why should I not listen to this honest* man (VP Pence).

    *Look, he is a politician. He is 'honest' by DC standards.

    1. Nardz   2 years ago

      "but I personally place great weight on what VPOTUS Pence has to say."

      You also simp for Ukraine, so sucking off a corrupt liar who loathes the American people is no surprise

    2. Dillinger   2 years ago

      >>great weight on what VPOTUS Pence has to say

      HW hated Reagan too.

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        HW hated Reagan too.

        Most VPs are people who were also running for the top job but lost the nomination. Which is bound to create some friction. I suspect most VPs have secretly, or in some cases not so secretly, hated their boss.

        1. Dillinger   2 years ago

          absolutely. I think in '80 they stuck the Langley guy in to keep tabs on Ronnie though

    3. Nardz   2 years ago

      Let's review:
      Pence was behind the firing of Flynn and supported destroying his life by framing him and family members for crimes.
      Recommend corrupt, swamp intel officials.
      Spearheaded to covid hoax.
      Lied about both the law and his intentions to screw over the American people by supporting an illegitimate election.

      What the fuck is wrong with you?

      1. Commenter_XY   2 years ago

        Pence was behind the firing of Flynn and supported destroying his life by framing him and family members for crimes. = Whut??? You sure you did not dyslex Biden for Pence?

        There is nothing wrong with me. VPOTUS Pence acted rightly on January 6th. I do not think there is a serious dispute about that. Nardz, VP Pence simply did not have the legal (or moral) authority to overturn an electoral result, in his capacity. I don't think he was very happy with the electoral result - he did the right thing anyway.

        We disagree on VP Pence. My estimation of the man is very different than yours.

        1. Nardz   2 years ago

          Which proves your moral weakness.
          It's either weakness or evil.
          Take your pick, and stop stabbing good Americans in the back.

        2. Nardz   2 years ago

          No.
          This is fucking evil, you back stabbing collaborator.

  60. Nardz   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/SuburbanJihadi/status/1686980197651042304?t=76yzyXpO5SR3EFyyj7LzjQ&s=19

    every immigrant in this picture is a male between 18-30

    [Link]

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      No, no. They're definitely children. Some kids just age super quickly.

    2. mad.casual   2 years ago

      Age aside, all are clearly Mexicans with precisely zero safe countries between the US and their respective countries of origin. Maybe a couple so persecuted in their home countries that they took a direct flight from there to the US, presumably without paperwork, to be sure.

  61. damikesc   2 years ago

    Ben Shapiro indicates he might sue Facebook and the Feds for violating his and his company's First Amendment rights.

    1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      Good luck with his suing over Facebook's moderation of his free-of-charge account for which he clicked on a ToU agreement authored by Facebook's lawyers.

  62. Jerry B.   2 years ago

    Backpage co-founder, veteran journalist, and free speech warrior James Larkin has committed suicide… A judge has ruled that the trial will still start next week.

    So can we try John Wilkes Booth for shooting Lincoln? He’s dead too.

    1. mad.casual   2 years ago

      The insurrectionist who initiated the conversion of The Party Of Lincoln to The Party Of Trump? I give it a 50/50.

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