Holder Fast and Furious Testimony: "I'm a big guy. I've been in Washington a long time."

Attorney General Eric Holder is getting grilled by the House Judiciary Committee over his Gunwalker/Fast and Furious operation.

Watch it on C-SPAN 3. 

To recap: An American cop is dead because Holder's BATFE sold weapons to known drug lords. 

This dereliction of the most basic law enforcement responsibility – to promote the safety and property rights of Americans – would have led to Holder's resignation already if he were any kind of man.

Here are two comments to the committee from the most prominent accessory to Brian Terry's murder:

"Some people have not let facts get in the way."

"I'm a big guy. I've been in Washington a long time."

Holder is also using his testimony to make the case that you should not be able to have a gun yourself. 

Still going on. Keep watching. 

Comments

[Pro Libertate]

People don't resign anymore unless forced to. Personal honor and integrity have no place here, not even in the sense of pretending to have those virtues.

[PR]

was it Reno that started it, by taking responsibility for Waco by taking no responsibility?

[BigT]

Reno should have been tried, found guilty and executed. A mass murderer.

[Paul]

I wanna see a scene like that one in the Firefly movie... you know, with the agent coming in with his sword where he suggests certain people should start falling on it?

[Tulpa]

We need to bring back duels.

Grassley vs. Holder would be epic. Especially if they used black powder pistols.

[Ted S.]

Especially if they used black powder pistols.

That's racist!

[protefeed]

Not a peep from the MSM I've seen about the attempt to use this as an excuse to take away more 2nd amendment rights.

My wife, who isn't exactly an avid gun advocate, was furious when I told about this fast one Holder's agency was trying to pull. (wordplay intended)

[Episiarch]

If he can slither out of this, there is nothing you can't slither out of any more.

[NewWorldDan]

I don't really understand the outrage. Yes, a cop was killed with a weapon purchased under this program. To treat that as cause and effect, you have to ignore the probability that these criminals would just get some guns somewhere else. I'm a little saddened by this lack of critical thinking by Reason. I'm under the impression that these guns constituted a very small part of the black market for guns. Are there facts that I'm unaware of?

[Montani Semper Liberi]

Obvious Team Blue concern troll is obvious.

[Warty]

Are there facts that I'm unaware of?

Might be, chief. Might be.

[Hugh Akston]

Personally, I am outraged that the government sells guns to anybody. It doesn't matter if they are Mexican drug lords, Iran contras, or ultra-virtuous Israeli soldiers who never do any wrong, the US government should not be arming anyone who hasn't sworn an oath to protect and defend the US Constitution.

[AZ]

A law enforcement arm of government has been actively pushing a black market, with the internally stated goal of developing a narrative to expand its own power and authority.

No matter what the total share of that black market is, or how attenuated you want to make the link between Gunwalker and the specific death of officer Terry, the government's behavior and purpose are odious and merit outrage.

[NewWorldDan]

or how attenuated you want to make the link between Gunwalker and the specific death of officer Terry

I suspect that's a big part of my problem. I see the link as being rather tenuous, which undermines the whole argument. If the problem is fundamentally the black market, can we focus on that? Can we generate an estimate of crime based on adding 500 AK47s and offset that by the value of tracing gun routes through the southwest? Because the coverage I've seen up to this point just has the taste of an emotional witch hunt, which is something I tend to instinctively dismiss.

[AZ]

It undermines none of what matters: that the ATF was a bad actor primarily for the sake of creating a political narrative. You're just hand-waving and offering non-sequiturs.

[Colonel_Angus]

You basically said that you don't give a shit that Holder is a lying piece of shit and the ATF was operating a black market to invent more reasons for the government to interfere with gun owners.

[Paul]

If the problem is fundamentally the black market, can we focus on that?

Sure. I propose we:

1. Get the government out of the black market.
2. Once the government is out of the business of generating, supplying and encouraging the black market, then the government can talk about gun regulations.

Until then, credibility lost.

[Anonymous Coward]

If the problem is fundamentally the black market, can we focus on that?

One, who said it is? Two, when the government is an actor in criminal activity (and as I recall, gun smuggling is a crime), then they deserve the focus they have received.

But of course, the government men are allowed to break the law if they have a REALLY good reason for it, amirite?

[Federal Cop]

We are the law!

[Mike G]

By your logic, it's not really any big deal that Sandusky was screwing 10-year-old boys in the locker room of Penn State because he could have found them somewhere else, like Thailand. So why get mad at Joe Paterno?

[wylie]

I'm a little saddened by this lack of critical thinking by Reason.

Drink!

[alienrants]

Are there facts that I'm unaware of?

More than you'll ever know.

[Michael]

If I am arrested for selling you drugs, the fact that you would have gotten them somewhere else, will not get me off the hook, even if I could somehow prove it. Nor should it get me off the hook, except in the sense that the law arguably should be different. But even then, it wouldn't be your inevitable obtaining of the drugs that would get me off the hook, but rather the fact that there would be no hook in the first place if drugs were legal.

[Diomasach]

Let's see...
A gun dealer sells a gun to known drug gangs - he goes to jail.

The ATF sells guns to known drug gangs - it's all hunky dory?

[cynical]

I'll remember to use that line of reasoning if I'm ever on trial for providing material support to foreign terrorist groups. "Oh come on, they'd probably have just got it somewhere else."

[James Ard]

Policy efforts like writing new gun laws don't originate from middle management. They come down from the top. Holder knew about the plan all along and is lying his ass off.

[Mensan]

Definitely from the top down. If Obama didn't order it himself, then he at least knew about it on by March 30, 2011 when, according to the Washington Post, he told Sarah Brady:

"I just want you to know that we are working on it," Brady recalled the president telling them. "We have to go through a few processes, but under the radar."

[cynical]

"Not a peep from the MSM I've seen about the attempt to use this as an excuse to take away more 2nd amendment rights."

CBS doesn't count anymore?

[Colonel_Angus]

Scumbag.

[wylie]

you're too kind.

[fish]

Hey it's cool he's TEAM BLUE.

[juris imprudent]

It's more than that - he's black and BLUE.

[Dr. Sam Johnson]

He said the Attorney General's near.

[Mainer]

I lol'ed

[Randy]

I too, lol'd.

Should we give him a laurel and hardy handshake?

[juris imprudent]

If the Repubs on the committee are smart they immediately follow Holder's testimony with appearances by the co-workers, supervisor and wife of the dead Border Patrol agent.

[Rich]

Does anyone know that dude sitting behind Holder and helping him be evasive?

[Stoft Chesibred]

I think it's Nixon's younger brother.

[Tulpa]

To recap: An American cop is dead because Holder's BATFE sold weapons to known drug lords.

Half the people around here would consider that a good thing.

[Abdul]

I was wondering who would be the first jackass to say "Dead cop? Great!"

[Pip]

I nominate Tulpa for First Jackass.

[Tulpa]

I'm not even married.

[Pip]

And neither is the First Trombonist.

[Montani Semper Liberi]

Actually, what Tulpa is saying is that he assumes half the people hear think killing cops is great even though no one has said that. He likes to make things up.

[Spoof Dunphy]

Oh, I say all the time that people here hate the police. I've got this little survey that PROVES they are wrong.

ROOL of LAW!!1!

[fish]

...and yet John Corzine still [gambols] around a free man!

[dunphy]

btw, surveys don't prove reasonoid bigotz are wrong when they hate police.

it proves they are wrong, when they speciously claim or imply that this is a widespread feeling amongst americans.

most americans like/love andor respect cops and polling data continually supports that

[Barely Suppressed Rage]

"most Americans" also are ignorant of a lot of the actual incidents that go on all over the U.S. every day - I have informed a lot of people about the rampant cop-shoots-dog syndrome, and every one has been completely surprised to learn that it even happens at all. I see at least one new story every single day - some days multiple new stories.

The fact that some poll or survey "shows" that "most Americans" are "in favor" of something usually overlooks the facts that those same "most Americans" are mostly ignorant on the topic and thus are not sufficiently well-informed to have developed a valid opinion based on fact or empirical data.

[dunphy]

+10 me

[Tulpa]

They may not type so, but they do so desire in the darkness of their blackened anti-cop hearts.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

I'll type so.
I HATE COPS.
There, that was easy.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

Poor threading. I don't wish them to be killed, but as a group, I hate the police. I hate everything they stand for. I hate their silent acceptance of the lawbreaking that goes on by their fellow cops. I hate their double-standard when it comes to enforcing the law. I hate their draining of the states' treasuries because their union strongarms negotiations. I hate their willingness to break the law to uphold the law. I hate their willingness to put Constitutional protections on ice for expediency's sake. I hate that they regularly lie to coerce confessions of innocent people. I hate how they follow orders for the sake of following them and refuse to take principled stands. I hate how they are tied at the hip to prosecutors that are afraid to take them on. I hate how they are not financially held accountable for their misdeeds. I hate how they are not criminally held accountable for their misdeeds. And I hate how they patronize my children because they equate authority with righteousness.

[Pat Paulsen]

Picky, picky, picky.

[BigT]

Sloopy - do you hate it when someone paints an entire group with a broad brush, eg all conservatives are racists because a few are racists? We can and do hate all of those actions, but not every cop is guilty of even one of those. You undermine your own credibility with loose talk.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

Find me a majority of cops that do not fall into one of those groups, and not only will I take it back. I'll come and publicly kiss your and dunphy's ass.

[Libertymike]

Big T falls prey to "there's a rotten apple in every bunch" logical fallacy. It is raunchy ratiocination (Tulpa, I did note your use of this word recently; however, I knew this word at 17-SAT prep!).

[BigT]

Bigot: a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Sloopy, that's you

[capitol l]

Cops are a 'racial or ethnic group'?

[dunphy]

it says AS a racial or ethnic group, it is not exclusive to same

reading comprehension: get some

(you see when a definition, etc. gives an example it often does thusly "as" ...

or "as in"...

that means these are examples, but are not an exclusive list.

hth

[MDC]

I think you need to spend some time where police really ARE corrupt (I'm in Afghanistan right now). You know, gain a little perspective. Unless you can pony up some statistics to support your "feeelings" about the marority of police, I think BigT and Dunphy should be baring their butts for a little kiss or two.

[dunphy]

all the canards and rubbish assumption within sloopy's bigoted tirade, i appreciate his honesty

first, he demonstrated intellectual honesty vis a vis a previous point he had falsely claimed about an alleged IA decision

and now he outs himself as the bigot i have always said he is

i will give him props for honest.

cognition, analytical reading, and psychological stability are still in the dumps, but maybe he can level up if his mama increases his strength with more HOT POCKETS!!!

[me/dwc]

The only legitimate role for the police is to protect our liberties. Anything other than, beyond that is mere tyranny.

[OO=======D]

GIVE ME A LITTLE SUGAR!

[NWA]

We consider this a good thing.

[Shakespeare]

The first thing we do, let's kill all the academics.

[Tonio]

Holder is toast. Guarantee he won't still be AG by election time.

This is huge - Watergate huge. The scandal has something for everyone to hate, regardless of political leanings.

The real question is: will Holder take the fall for this or will it go up the chain of command.

Only possible downside - a few months of President Joe Biden.

[Stoft Chesibred]

Guarantee he won't still be AG by election time.

May I ask your thoughts on his heir apparent? Perhaps, dare I say, it: Janet Napolitano?

[wylie]

Has anyone inquired into Hitler's availability for the position?

[under da radar]

Hitler's pretty tied up with the History Channel. Don't think he's got time for this.

[ThomasD]

The dude is so stuck in permanent Downfall Hell on Youtube he barely has time for HC.

[fish]

Only possible downside - a few months of President Joe Biden.

We get a sitcom out of it!

[Paul]

Only possible downside - a few months of President Joe Biden.

And vice president Holder.

Remember, this is Washington. Nothing succeeds like failure!

[Voice of Reason]

No, watergate involved spying on democrats, it was therefore way bigger.

This just involves coverups, murder, and arming murderous foreign drug cartels. It will blow over.

[sage]

Let him keep talking. It's like he's Joe Biden's black, mustached, younger brother.

No racist.

[Joe Biden]

Clean. Articulate.

[Fist of Etiquette]

"I'm kind of a big deal."

[Greek Chorus]

"Hubris, hubris, hubris..."

[dunphy]

cue: the appearance of HOLDERMAN!

[Tulpa]

So was bin Laden.

[Mensan]

Hmm ... you can't spell bin Laden without bi den.

[wylie]

Holders's office smells of fine leathers and mahogany.

[Grey Flannel]

What am I, chopped liver?

[Appalachian Australian]

So how long until the Brady campaign starts publishing statistics on how many murders have been committed by these "crime guns"?

[Tulpa]

I fully support the Brady Campaign's demands that the perpetrators of this illegal gun dealing operation be punished to the fullest extent of the law.

[juris imprudent]

You of course realize that will fall on the hapless gun shops that went along with what the govt agents told them to do.

You citizen do what Special Agent Horiuchi did and you might be allowed to plead voluntary manslaugter (if you're lucky).

[Eric Northman]

This is why the Japanese invented hari kari.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

Exactly. Somebody ought to offer him use of a closet and place a loaded pistol or sword on his table and ask him if he would like a 15 minute recess.

[Gray Ghost]

If Sandusky hasn't done it by now, what makes you think that Holder would?

That sort of thing went out of fashion with Rommel.

[junyo]

And 14 minutes later, a Mexican drug dealer would show up looking for the gun someone had listed on craigslist.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

We have a winnar!

[Paul]

Exactly. Somebody ought to offer him use of a closet and place a loaded pistol or sword on his table and ask him if he would like a 15 minute recess.

I prefer the scene from Enemy at the Gates where Kruschev slams a pistol down on the desk and says, "I have to report this to the boss. Perhaps you'd prefer to avoid the red tape!"

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

I thought he said that in Who Framed Roger Rabbit.

[Paul]

Kruschev made several films...

[Mensan]

Just picking nits here, but:

This is why the Japanese invented hari kari [seppuku].

Harakiri is only used as the spoken term, it's seppuku when written.

[Me Myself and I]

This is why the Japanese invented hari kari.

Best announcer the Cubs ever had.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

Do what?

[EDG reppin' LBC]

Best announcer the Cubs ever had.

Steve Stone?

[Pro Libertate]

I used to do a Caray impersonation (while living in Chicago) that basically was him saying, "I'm so fucked up, Steve Stone."

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

Those bastards just don't know. Growing up hearing "Hamilton" Joe Nuxhall say "This is the old left-hander. Roundin' third and headin' for home" drunk out of his mind right after the Big Red Machine put a beatdown on the Cubs...just can't be beat.

Harry Carey was decent, but it was all schtick. Nuxhall called a great game.

[Old Man With Candy]

Meh, he couldn't shine Chuck Thompson's shoes.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

I'm too young to remember, but I still find that hard to believe. Does he have a statue of him in front of Camden Yards?

[Libertymike]

How about Vin Scully?

Or Joe Castiglione?

The late Ned Martin?

The late Ken Coleman?

How about the late Bob Prince?

Or Mr. Baseball himself, Bob Eucker?

[dunphy]

phil rizutto ftw.

also, had a starring role in a meatloaf song. doesn't get any better than that

[EDG reppin' LBC]

Caray on WGN when I was a kid was the best. Drunk and sloppy, and always entertaining. Now of course, I am blessed with the dulcet tones of Vin Scully. I'm not a Dodger's fan, but I will tune in when I'm driving, just to hear Vin call the game.

[Libertymike]

Isn't Vin a treasure? Of course, any Red Sox fan say 33 or older, will never forget, "there's a little roller.........

[BigT]

Bob Prince > Ernie Harwell > Nuxhall > Caray >> Scully for bringing the excitement and drama of the game. All a joy, except Scully puts me to sleep.

[James Ard]

The beauty of Caray was he was usually buzz peaking at about 4:00 PM. Just in time for the Cubs to almost come back and win.

[Me Myself and I]

This is why the Japanese invented hari kari.

Best announcer the Cubs ever had.

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

OK, thanks.

[BigT]

Best announcer the Cards ever had.

[Jim]

Best announcer White Sox ever had (maybe next to Bob Elson and Jimmy Piersall).

[BigT]

Caray did the Disco Demolition - he split his time between TV and radio for the Sox

[P Brooks]

According to Reuters*, this whole thing is just an attempt by Republicans to score political points against the White House.

*I'm too goddam lazy to go back and make a link.

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

I'm sure that's why Repubs are pursuing it. But that doesn't mean it shouldn't be pursued.

[James Ard]

Tim, I hope you didn't miss the part where Bob Goodlatte asked Holder if Chu informed him about Solyndra's default on the loan. As usual, Holder said he didn't know. I don't think Chu us off the hook yet.

[P Brooks]

they do so desire in the darkness of their blackened anti-cop hearts.

Take a moment, and adjust those knickers; we'll all be more comfortable.

[James Ard]

The best part is at the end, when Holder asks Issa have you no shame? Dude just lied for four hours in front of Congress and has to gall to ask that?

[juris imprudent]

You don't understand. Holder knows he has no shame and he was just curious if Issa did.

[PR]

Leave Eric Holder alone.

At least until his butt-buddy is out of office and has no pardon power.

[Gojira]

"I'm a big guy. I've been in Washington a long time."

What on earth does his genital size have to do with anything? OK, I get it, you're black, you don't have to rub our faces in it!

[capitol l]

...rub our faces in it!

Gross, Jim. Really gross.

[Gojira]

Gross, Jim. Really gross.

Only if you're...A HOMOPHOBE!!!

[capitol l]

I think that you're the homophobe for implying that gay dudes wouldn't be grossed out by having Holder's little attorney general rubbed in their face.

You'd have to be some kind of monster to enjoy that kind of abuse...

Like this lady perhaps.

[Ska]

Someone needs to basically make this into a sketch with Boxy Brown replacing Holder. Yes, using both his voice and likeness, but adding some of that bonus Boxy attitude to the replies.

[Boxy Holder]

(To Issa): I just a WHAT, bitch?

[Poet Laureate sloopyinca]

Korn abandon Obama. World doesn't notice.

[Gojira]

The comments are awash with dems talking about terrible their music is and how bad Jonathan Davis looks.

One of them said he looks like a garbage hobo.

I want to register just so I can post pics of OWS-types right under that comment.

Then again, I'm not sure liberals are intelligent enough to get "irony".

[capitol l]

Those comments were the fuckin' tits, man.

The left has finally let the civil libertarian mask fall, haven't they?

One guy commenting says that we shouldn't listen to the Korn guy's Obama criticism because he's on his second wife(!) who happens to be a pron star(double!). Remind me again why socons are so bad, Mr. Fancypants.*

And the whole "Don't listen to entertainers' political opinions cause they're just bunch of drugged out geetar stringers" is straight out of the Bill O'Reilly handbook.

I really have no hope for this fucking culture.

*not that I have an extra fuck to give for korn or the socons

[Gojira]

I wish I knew how to quit you, cap l.

[capitol l]

Slow down, Jim.

I ain't no Eric Holder, so don't get your hopes up.

[dunphy]

the point is why should one give a performer any more attention as to his opinion vs. anybody else?

if anything , performers tend to live in a fantasy world. they should get LESS credit, than your average steelworker, dockworker, firefighter, stock broker, etc.

[Tulpa]

His wikipedia page says he has three sons, all of whom have the same middle name as he does. WTF?

And that's before we get to their first names. What a disaster! Pirate and Zeppelin?

[capitol l]

I thought Jim's son's names were: Mothra, Data, and Episiarch.

[Gojira]

Pfft, you're dumb.

My sons names are Rodan, Quark,...and Episiarch.

[capitol l]

Have fun with this:

Star Wars vs. Star Trek

dorks.

[Gojira]

I have the DVD episode of that from an A&E series they used to have where they contrast competing franchises.

There are two great things in it. First, there's this weird cutaway of a guy dressed like a Klingon laughing. I guess whatever he had to say was cut in editing, but they kept the cutaways to his laughing, so there's just this random Klingon laughing at random points in the show.

Then, there's one cutaway of a scene in one of the Trek movies where it just shows George Takei saying, "San Francisco!" is this supremely happy voice. Since the show was made before he came out, it's hilarious.

[arrestwanted]

What is all this talk of resignation? Shouldn't he simply be arrested for perjury? Someone should post him to ArrestWanted! http://ArrestWanted.com/

[Don't Bother Holder]

You will distract him from his door-busting pothead raids.

[Hoystory]

If I were a Congressman, this is what I'd say:

http://hoystory.com/?p=7366

Shameless self-promotion.

[ThomasD]

If Barack Obama were any kind of man he'd have fired Holder by now.

[cicero]

Thanks Tim, for voting for Obama and giving this absolute abortion of a justice department. You are part of this problem, you ignorant fool.

[Name]

http://www.c-spanarchives.org/program/302569-1

[Nike Dunk Shoes]

thanks