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Donald Trump

Trump Asks Supreme Court To Bless Racial Profiling by Immigration Agents

The federal government has embraced unconstitutional tactics and now wants SCOTUS to do the same.

Damon Root | 8.12.2025 7:00 AM

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President Donald Trump in front of the Supreme Court | Illustration: Eddie Marshall | Rena Schild | Dreamstime.com | IMAGO | Yuri Gripas | Pool via CNP | MediaPunch | Newscom
(Illustration: Eddie Marshall | Rena Schild | Dreamstime.com | IMAGO | Yuri Gripas | Pool via CNP | MediaPunch | Newscom)

Normally, when the federal government is credibly accused of violating the Bill of Rights, a government lawyer will tell a federal judge that the alleged misconduct never happened. No way, your honor, the lawyer will protest. No agent of this government ever did anything like that!

But Noem v. Perdomo is not a normal case. Instead of disavowing the apparently unconstitutional behavior at its core, the Trump administration is openly embracing that behavior and urging the justices of the U.S. Supreme Court to do the same. It is the rare case in which both the government and its opponents agree that federal agents behaved in a specific way; the two sides only disagree about whether the specific behavior should count as good or bad.

You’re reading Injustice System from Damon Root and Reason. Get more of Damon’s commentary on constitutional law and American history.

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The specific behavior at issue here is racial profiling. Multiple U.S. citizens have alleged that they were illegally seized by federal immigration agents in Los Angeles based solely on unlawful factors such as their "apparent race or ethnicity," or the fact that they were "speaking Spanish or speaking English with an accent."

And because these citizens (and others) "are likely to succeed in showing" that they were unlawfully seized in violation of the Fourth Amendment, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 9th Circuit ruled earlier this month, the Trump administration has been temporarily blocked from employing such tactics as part of its immigration crackdown in the greater Los Angeles area.

In response, the Trump administration is now asking the Supreme Court to lift the block and let the roundups begin again. And in its latest legal filing, the administration made no efforts to deny that its agents will be relying on racial profiling when they're back in the field.

Indeed, according to the emergency application to SCOTUS signed by Solicitor General John Sauer, "apparent ethnicity can be a factor supporting reasonable suspicion in appropriate circumstances." Translation: If a federal agent thinks that someone "looks illegal," the agent should be free to seize that person based only on his "apparent ethnicity" without setting off any sort of Fourth Amendment alarm bells.

Furthermore, in response to the argument that the federal government's alleged racial profiling has resulted in an overly broad dragnet that inevitably ensnares innocent U.S. citizens, the Trump administration told the Supreme Court that "the high prevalence of illegal aliens should enable agents to stop a relatively broad range of individuals."

Take a moment to let that sink in. The Trump administration wants the Supreme Court to give its blessing to a kind of systematic racial profiling that involves federal agents stopping a "broad range of individuals" based exclusively on factors such as the individuals' "apparent ethnicity." And if the rights of U.S. citizens—such as the Fourth Amendment right to be free from unreasonable searches and seizures regardless of your skin color—happen to get trampled along the way, the Trump administration's message to those victimized citizens is this: tough luck.

To say the least, the Supreme Court has ample legal reasons to rule against the Trump administration's admitted racial profiling on Fourth Amendment grounds. But will the Court rule that way? Alas, the answer to that question is not so clear.

While the current Supreme Court has been a Fourth Amendment defender in some cases, the Court has also been known to tip the scales in favor of law enforcement in others, including even in cases in which it was quite clear that federal agents violated someone's constitutional rights.

So, the outcome of this case will likely turn on just how much deference the Supreme Court chooses to extend to Trump's immigration agenda. For better or worse, we will learn the extent of that deference soon enough.

Start your day with Reason. Get a daily brief of the most important stories and trends every weekday morning when you subscribe to Reason Roundup.

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NEXT: Brickbat: Catch Your Breath

Damon Root is a senior editor at Reason and the author of A Glorious Liberty: Frederick Douglass and the Fight for an Antislavery Constitution (Potomac Books).

Donald TrumpSupreme CourtImmigrationCourtsFourth AmendmentConstitutionLaw & GovernmentCivil Liberties
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  1. Chumby   22 hours ago

    Thought the OJ trial told us that accent, cadence, and tone could not help differentiate race.

    Log in to Reply
  2. Randy Sax   21 hours ago

    The worst thing about racial profiling, is that it works. That being said, still not of a fan of the fourth violations.

    Log in to Reply
    1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   21 hours ago

      All of these raids they are up in arms about have judicial warrants signed. Most often from knowledge of work place violations for employment. It isnt a violation of the 4th.

      Log in to Reply
      1. windycityattorney   13 hours ago

        *citation needed. The case being discussed is not about a workplace raid with a warrant. It's more about so-called roving patrols and if it were so damn efficient, then multiple US citizens wouldn't have been detained in them.

        This practice of roving patrols is directly tied to the reported quotas that DHS and Trump's DOJ have tried to implement. I.e, they promised the biggest deportation operation in U S history and therefore have to cut some corners to hit the target number. One of those corners is the 4th amendment.

        Log in to Reply
        1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   11 hours ago

          Wrong again.

          Liberal media and reddit is not truthful not a lawyer. There are not roving patrols randomly stopping people.

          A real lawyer would question what he hears. You aren't one.

          Log in to Reply
          1. windycityattorney   10 hours ago

            So unlike you, I read some of the legal documents and indeed; this case is about roving patrols.

            Hence all the debate about what facts the agents doing the roving patrol can use to detain somebody.

            If it was a workplace raid with a warrant; there wouldn't be a debate. This case is not about that.

            Are you denying roving patrols are an active tactic being deployed right now by ICE? Are you denying the desire to have desired quotas of the number of detentions? ICE's huge budget increase? The building of more facilities to hold all the prospective detainees??? What the fuck man. This info is rather easy to find if you simply look.

            Log in to Reply
  3. MasterThief   21 hours ago

    The vast majority of illegal immigrants are from central/south America and speak Spanish. Why would this not be part of how you sort out and efficiently use limited resources? If I find a guy with a heavy French or Swedish accent in a place known to employ or be visited by illegal immigrants I'd check them too.

    Log in to Reply
    1. SRG2   21 hours ago

      Because such profiling inevitably leads to the seizure of legal immigrants and citizens as well. Duh

      Log in to Reply
      1. Vernon Depner   19 hours ago

        "Seizure"? You and Damon are talking like people are being put in chains and stuffed into a slave ship rather than just asked a few questions.

        Log in to Reply
      2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

        Cite?

        Log in to Reply
    2. n00bdragon   20 hours ago

      The vast majority of illegal immigrants are also human and breathe air. If I find breathing humans in a dark alley, is that probable cause for arrest?

      The answer is no.

      Log in to Reply
      1. sarcasmic   20 hours ago

        You really think that Trump and his defenders consider them to be human?

        Log in to Reply
      2. Azathoth!!   19 hours ago

        So, you claim to know about the non humans?

        But they are not illegal immigrants. One cannot enter this space without using the proper channels --the space doesn't exist otherwise.

        But breathing --whatever mix of gases- is not an identifying trait. Everything alive in this space respires or maintains the illusion of respiration.

        Looking for more specific traits as identifiers, linguistic, racial, cultural and sexual makes far more sense than checking whether a being respires.

        So no, breathing is not a cause for arrest.

        Sharing specific traits with the being or beings sought does warrant further questioning though.

        Log in to Reply
      3. Neutral not Neutered   18 hours ago

        If they are in a spot where known illegal immigrants, gang or cartel members, drug dealers, large amounts of criminal activity is occurring then they will be stopped and questioned.

        I was questioned in my home about 45 minutes after a jewelry store was robbed because I drove past it shortly after the robbery occurred.

        Inconvenient? yes. Illegal and worth screaming about for my loss of time? Should IU be upset because I was profiled for potentially being involved in the crime? Absolutely not. I am glad they acted so quickly to try and catch the armed robbers...

        Log in to Reply
        1. windycityattorney   13 hours ago

          That isn't actually an example of profiling.

          Log in to Reply
          1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   11 hours ago

            Give us the actual factual example you're complaining about not a lawyer. Difficulty. Facts not defense lawyer or activist group claims.

            Log in to Reply
            1. windycityattorney   8 hours ago

              Following up on a lead on a potential suspect to a recent and specific crime isn't profiling.

              This isn't difficult to understand. If 3 different cars all left the scene of the same crime at or near the time of said crime... the cops would be expected to follow up on each vehicle just in case it leads to their actual suspect. If in the same example, car no 2 resulted in them finding and arresting the actual suspect, there would no need to be go on to car no 3 and person in car no 1 was not 'profiled.'

              Log in to Reply
      4. DesigNate   16 hours ago

        I’m not going to claim to know what the solution is to identifying illegal immigrants in order to remove them back to their country of origin, but this is quite possibly a more idiotic analogy than the famous bears-in-trunks.

        Well done.

        Log in to Reply
      5. See.More   13 hours ago

        The vast majority of illegal immigrants are also human and breathe air. If I find breathing humans in a dark alley, is that probable cause for arrest?

        This is a piss poor analogy.

        Being human and breathing are universal characteristics that do nothing to filter the set. Ergo, they are worthless criteria for selecting a subset; that combination of features establishes three subsets of humans: living and breathing, living and holding their breath, and dead. That's it.

        Ethnic characteristics, however, are not universal and, thus, may be useful to define meaningful subsets within the whole.

        Log in to Reply
      6. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

        n00bdragon is a slimy pile of TDS-addled lying shit who can be ignored.
        Fuck off and die, asswipe.

        Log in to Reply
  4. sarcasmic   21 hours ago

    Trump and his defenders fully support masked federal agents dressed up like soldiers roaming the country and grabbing people off the street simply because they're brown and/or talk funny. I wish I could say I'm surprised, but I'm not.

    Log in to Reply
    1. Spinach Chin   20 hours ago

      Homan has repeatedly said on record that ICE doesn't arrest using race as the sole factor.

      But apparently you're retarded.

      Log in to Reply
      1. sarcasmic   20 hours ago

        You do know that people in government, especially law enforcement, lie for a living, right?

        Log in to Reply
        1. Spinach Chin   19 hours ago

          So you would have me believe the liars you support instead.

          Log in to Reply
          1. sarcasmic   19 hours ago

            I would trust legal filings over anything Thomas Homan says. The guy is in law enforcement, so I wouldn't trust him to tell me the time of day let alone be honest about what ICE does.

            Log in to Reply
            1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   19 hours ago

              Yet you supported shooting trespassers in the face.

              Log in to Reply
            2. Spinach Chin   18 hours ago

              The DOJ also submitted legal filings. By your logic, that's what we should believe.

              You're bad at this...

              Log in to Reply
              1. sarcasmic   18 hours ago

                Apparently you are unaware that there is a difference between something is in writing, and something that comes out of a liar's mouth.

                Log in to Reply
                1. Spinach Chin   17 hours ago

                  Now you're simply flailing

                  Log in to Reply
                  1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   17 hours ago

                    Pro tip: sarc is always flailing.

                    Log in to Reply
                  2. sarcasmic   17 hours ago

                    Project more.

                    Log in to Reply
            3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

              Legal filings by whom? Activist legal groups? They've never lied lol.

              Log in to Reply
        2. SCOTUS gave JeffSarc a big sad   18 hours ago

          As opposed to lying recreationally, like you?

          Log in to Reply
        3. Neutral not Neutered   18 hours ago

          You lie apparently for shits and giggles and to simply be obtuse. What's you excuse, are you in law enforcement or a politician?

          Log in to Reply
          1. sarcasmic   18 hours ago

            You lie apparently for shits and giggles and to simply be obtuse.

            Only if you define "lie" as contradicting the lies that my hate club says about me.

            Log in to Reply
            1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   18 hours ago

              Poor sarc. Such a victim.

              Log in to Reply
        4. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

          Just not the BLS right sarc? Not D.C. police and crime statistics right sarc? Just not Jack Smith right sarc?

          Seems your argument changes based on the who.

          Log in to Reply
    2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

      Sarc has gone full Maddow.

      Log in to Reply
  5. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   21 hours ago

    This is an utterly dishonest and untrue article. How far reason has fallen.

    Race can be a factor in an investigation.

    "Witness saw a white shooter wearing a black hoodie."

    Stopping white people in black hoodies is perfectly legitimate.

    What the fuck is wrong with reason

    Log in to Reply
    1. Chumby   21 hours ago

      Iirc during the DC beltway sniper case, the (likely) race of the shooters was known and the woke police chief kept those cards close to his chest.

      Log in to Reply
    2. n00bdragon   20 hours ago

      That's a description of a specific person. Rounding up all the brown people standing near a Home Depot is not a search for specific people. It's just good old fashioned racism.

      Have some awareness of what you're defending.

      Log in to Reply
      1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   20 hours ago

        What about the innocent white guy in the black hoodie?

        Log in to Reply
        1. Chumby   20 hours ago

          He gets arrested while the guilty black guy gets to continue on with his life:

          https://www.lolcaption.com/epic-fail-pics-funny-failure-pictures/fail-pic-abc-newsreader-looks-like-rapist-in-the-police-sketch/

          Log in to Reply
          1. Bruce Hayden   18 hours ago

            And the illegals picked up at HD and detained because they are Hispanic, and don’t speak English, get deported.

            Which is exactly what is going on, and why supporters of illegal immigration are up in arms - because it makes it easier to pick up and deport illegals. Yes, some legal aliens, and maybe even citizens get inconvenienced. But very few. It’s the scooping up and deporting of illegals that is driving this, and everything else is just there to obscure this.

            Log in to Reply
            1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

              Cite missing, TDS-addled shit.

              Log in to Reply
      2. Spinach Chin   19 hours ago

        That's not what's happening though.

        Log in to Reply
      3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

        And your post is pure ignorant retardation. Every sweep has been backed by warrants dumbass.

        Log in to Reply
  6. TJJ2000   20 hours ago

    There's a massive difference between...

    "*seized* by federal immigration agents"
    ...and...
    "enable agents to *stop* a relatively broad range of individuals"

    You need to figure out which is which Damon ROT before you write an article or you might just be selling your own agenda-driven BS. Which frankly; I totally believe this is since most of Reason thinks trespassers somehow have a 'right' to the USA.

    Log in to Reply
    1. windycityattorney   13 hours ago

      A detention, however brief, still implicates the 4th amendment. The main question to ask is whether the person being detained has the right to simply disregard the officers questions and walk away.

      If the answer is "no" then the 4th amendment is most surely implicated and questions of the detention's legality (or lack thereof) are paramount.

      So the question we can speculate on: if a masked agent stops a person in public for being brown or speaking in Spanish and begins interrogating them... what do you think that officer would do if they refused to answer and began simply walking away?? Would the agent let them go? Or would they escalate the brief detention and cuff the person or throw them in a car? Because that is no longer a detention but an arrest and arrests require probable cause that a crime is being committed. What facts support that determination when its a random person on the street and a roving patrol of ICE agents??

      Log in to Reply
      1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

        "A detention, however brief, still implicates the 4th amendment."

        So, in a difficult situation, only perfection is acceptable?
        Fuck off and die, TDS-addled slimy pile of lying shit.

        Log in to Reply
      2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   11 hours ago

        This is more evidence you're not a lawyer as there are different detention rules by state.

        Log in to Reply
        1. windycityattorney   8 hours ago

          Nah that is not actually the case at all and if you went to law school instead of Trump University you would know that. The US Sup Ct interprets the 4th amend rather regularly and its been incorporated against the states. State's can provide more protection than the US Sup Ct/US constitution 4th amend dictates but they cannot offer less and some state's have...typically by adding an explicit right to privacy in their state constitution. But go on. Lecture me. Maybe a course on buying scam NFT's of Trump in lingerie would be a good investment? Trump bible??? Shoes?? Heard the steaks are no good but maybe the cologne will be a hit???

          Log in to Reply
          1. TJJ2000   6 hours ago

            "protect against invasion" isn't a State duty FYI.

            Log in to Reply
  7. sarcasmic   20 hours ago

    Trump and his defenders want all non-white people to live in constant fear of being grabbed by federal agents. I wonder what his non-white supporters think of this. Heck, they're probably defending him. TDS is indeed real. Trump's deranged supporters are mentally ill.

    Log in to Reply
    1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   20 hours ago

      You aren’t going to make it through the next 3 years.

      Log in to Reply
      1. tracerv   18 hours ago

        We can only hope.

        Log in to Reply
    2. TJJ2000   19 hours ago

      Did you think non-white people are above the law?
      Of course you do ... because that's the BS the left preaches.
      Leftard Racist entitlements 101.

      Log in to Reply
      1. sarcasmic   19 hours ago

        Whenever I think you've hit peak retard, you once again prove me wrong.

        Log in to Reply
        1. Pepin the short   19 hours ago

          Says the homeless weasel.

          Log in to Reply
        2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

          You are literally peak retard buddy. And now peak Maddow.

          Log in to Reply
    3. Bruce Hayden   17 hours ago

      All non-white people? How about just non-whites whose first language wasn’t English (of some sort)? That cuts it down significantly. 2nd, 3rd generation Hispanics are very easy to distinguish from 1st generation, by their speech.

      This might surprise you, but polling shows that deportation of illegals is more popular in Hispanic, Black, etc, communities than in the general population.

      Log in to Reply
      1. sarcasmic   17 hours ago

        They still have to live in fear of being accosted because of how they look.

        Log in to Reply
        1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

          Why do you claim to not be a retarded leftist?

          Are you so fucking racist you dont understand legal Latinos voted and support what he is doing? Ever heard about Cesar Chavez and operation wetback?

          Youre such a retarded leftist.

          How about instead of being an average white liberal racist with a savior complex, you go an talk to an actual Latino.

          Log in to Reply
      2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

        How about you just fuck off and die, shitstain?

        Log in to Reply
    4. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

      Please explain why he just deported a bunch if white Irish that overstayed their visa Rachel.

      Log in to Reply
  8. Nobartium   20 hours ago

    Despite the sturm und drang of profiling, it always narrows down potential suspects. Therefore, unless SCOTUS wants to make policing harder than necessary, they will likely uphold.

    Log in to Reply
  9. Social Justice is neither   20 hours ago

    I absolutely expect Damon to lose his shit over the racial profiling in police line-ups. How dare considerations like race or sex be applied anywhere in law enforcement. In these cases there were specific violations and these people were detained temporarily because they fit the description of the specific criminals, sorry if race was part of it, not sorry for using relevant descriptions.

    Log in to Reply
  10. Spinach Chin   20 hours ago

    Bullshit.

    Root apparently refuses to recognize the difference between "sole factor" and "a factor". They have said repeatedly that ethnicity is never the sole factor in making an arrest, but Root dishonesty states that "If a federal agent thinks that someone "looks illegal," the agent should be free to seize that person based only on his "apparent ethnicity""

    Log in to Reply
  11. Fu Manchu   19 hours ago

    Libertarians for violating people's rights.

    Log in to Reply
    1. TJJ2000   19 hours ago

      Reasons 'peoples rights' clause, "You can't stop me! I'm non-white!" /s

      Log in to Reply
      1. Fu Manchu   18 hours ago

        No retard, you can stop illegals. If there is reasonable suspicion. Speaking "Mexican" or being short and brown is not reasonable suspicion. Otherwise it's "papers please" which I can't believe self proclaimed libertarians are advocating for. Actually I can believe it because you morons are in a cult and your dear leader told you to believe it. Hopefully you all do the world a favor and drink some flavor-aid.

        Log in to Reply
        1. Bruce Hayden   17 hours ago

          But Hispanic looking and not having English as a first, or early second, language greatly increases the odds of the person not being here legally. We have lived in majority Hispanic subdivisions, and it’s fairly easy to tell the 1st, 2nd, 3rd+ generation by their speech. And for the most part, we are talking Hispanic looking 1st generation. Many don’t even speak Spanish that well.

          Log in to Reply
          1. Fu Manchu   16 hours ago

            You don't know they don't have English as a first language just because they're speaking Spanish. And even if they're not citizens, what if they're on a tourist visa? Should all Mexicans visiting the US be subject to search at any time?

            Case law establishes that reasonable suspicion requires "specific and articulable facts" which means evidence specific to that particular person and not a broad demographic. These stops are clearly a violation of precedent.

            Log in to Reply
    2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

      Shrike like most leftists here doesn't understand the law or constitution.

      Log in to Reply
      1. Chumby   9 hours ago

        Or age of consent.

        Log in to Reply
    3. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

      TDS-addled lefty shit for lying.
      Fuck off and die, asswipe.

      Log in to Reply
  12. Longtobefree   19 hours ago

    I know there are three justices who would rule cops have to stop one white male for each POC female.

    Log in to Reply
  13. Vernon Depner   19 hours ago

    Because white guys speaking perfect American English working at the bank are just as likely to be illegal aliens. Idiots.

    Log in to Reply
    1. sarcasmic   19 hours ago

      This is not and has never been about illegal immigration. It's always been about race. We're just seeing the mask start to come off.

      Log in to Reply
      1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   18 hours ago

        Ackshually, people from Central America are not a separate race.

        Log in to Reply
        1. Vernon Depner   18 hours ago

          Most people from Mexico and Central America are mixed race.

          Log in to Reply
          1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   17 hours ago

            So, not a separate race then.

            Log in to Reply
            1. Vernon Depner   15 hours ago

              So, not "white" as that term is generally used.

              Log in to Reply
      2. TJJ2000   18 hours ago

        "It's always been about race."
        ^For *YOU* it has been.
        Course you're so self-centered you don't know how to comment without self-projecting your own racist mentality.

        Log in to Reply
        1. sarcasmic   18 hours ago

          I've never seen Trump nor any of his defenders complain about white immigrants. I've seen constant complaints about brown people from south of the border, blacks from Haiti, and non-white Muslims. But white people? Nope. Never heard a single complaint. Sorry bub, but I'm not the one with racist views here.

          Log in to Reply
          1. Spinach Chin   18 hours ago

            Are white immigrants causing problems?

            You see a pattern here? Stop with the fucking gaslighting.

            Log in to Reply
            1. sarcasmic   18 hours ago

              Trump is creating illegal immigrants by revoking visas and parole for non-whites. Were they causing problems? You see a pattern here?

              Log in to Reply
              1. Spinach Chin   18 hours ago

                Aren't the revoked visas mostly Chinese students? Are Chinese people brown?

                Log in to Reply
                1. sarcasmic   17 hours ago

                  Thank you for confirming that you fully support revoking visas for non-whites who weren't doing anything wrong other than not being white.

                  Log in to Reply
                  1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

                    And violating the terms of their visa. The key part retard.

                    We even posted about a Russian who violated her visa trying to illegally import materials fucking leftist shit.

                    Log in to Reply
              2. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   18 hours ago

                You get you visa revoked for breaking the law or terms of the visa, not skin color.

                Log in to Reply
              3. Z Crazy   17 hours ago

                He is keeping us safe.

                Remember Rachel Morin!

                Log in to Reply
              4. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

                How long is temporary in your world?

                Log in to Reply
              5. DesigNate   13 hours ago

                That is the inherent problem with the temporary status.

                Log in to Reply
          2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

            Post these complaints dumbass.

            The argument has always been legal status. Youre just a leftist retard.

            Log in to Reply
      3. Bruce Hayden   17 hours ago

        Very much disagree. We are talking exactly about illegals being scooped up for deportation, with race combined with speech (and maybe looking for day labor in the HD parking lot) being a good first cut, suggesting further investigation. You are just trying to generalize, to change the discussion from what is actually going on.

        Log in to Reply
        1. sarcasmic   17 hours ago

          Just to be straight here, you're saying that talking funny and having skin that is not white is reasonable grounds for being arrested, thrown into a detention center, and denied due process. Is that about right?

          Log in to Reply
          1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

            Violating immigration law is you dumb retarded alcoholic.

            Log in to Reply
          2. Jefferson Paul   16 hours ago

            Can you define "due process" in this situation?

            Log in to Reply
            1. sarcasmic   16 hours ago

              What doesn't happen after they're put into a concentration camp because the federal officer with absolute immunity didn't like their skin color and accent.

              Log in to Reply
              1. Jefferson Paul   16 hours ago

                I should have known not to expect a serious answer from you.

                Log in to Reply
                1. sarcasmic   15 hours ago

                  I am serious. People are being denied due process for being suspected of being in the country illegally. Citizens have been deported because of this lack of due process. That should strike fear into the hearts of anyone who looks or sounds like someone an ICE officer, who has absolute immunity from civil and criminal law, says or does. And I believe that the intention is to make people afraid. By people I mean anyone who isn't white and has an accent.

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                  1. Jefferson Paul   15 hours ago

                    What US citizens have been deported and what was the due process that was lacking? You still haven't answered that question, but instead just lobbed more allegations. And I don't accept that a deported mom choosing to take her anchor baby kid with her is the US deporting a US citizen, when the mom was given a choice regarding her kid.

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                    1. sarcasmic   15 hours ago

                      You deny that U.S. citizens have been deported, then provide an example of that happening?

                      You just ruined any argument you might make. "You're right, but I don't accept it so you're wrong!"

                      Toodles.

                    2. Jefferson Paul   15 hours ago

                      I reject your premise that that's deporting US citizens. You haven't reconciled how a non-citizen mom choosing to take her minor, citizen child with her meets the definition.

                      If, hypothetically, ICE tells a 40 year old non-citizen man that they can remove him from the country or he can stay, is that deportation if he says, "Yes, please send me to Guatemala." The choice, in my opinion, makes it not deportation. The mom has the choice to leave her kid in the US or to take him with her.

                      But let's be real here. You don't want any illegals deported, so you are twisting every situation to paint immigration enforcement as wrong or evil. If DHS said all deportees would not have the option of taking their kids with them, you'd then be railing about how Trump is breaking families apart. That would then be your angle. Because the details don't seem to matter to you other than your complete opposition to immigration law enforcement.

                    3. sarcasmic   13 hours ago

                      But let's be real here. You don't want any illegals deported, so you are twisting every situation to paint immigration enforcement as wrong or evil.

                      Nope. Though that is a favorite trope of my hate club. If you would like to know what I really think you can ask. Though I doubt you will. That could start an actual conversation, and from what I can see Trump defenders would rather rant against narratives than discuss ideas like civilized men.

                    4. Jefferson Paul   12 hours ago

                      Get off your high horse, sarc. I asked repeatedly what US citizens were deported and what the "due process" should have been. Instead of engaging honestly, you went on a rant about it being a concentration camp.

                      I preemptively challenged the idea that the deported mom choosing to take her kid with her was deporting US citizens. Instead of actually arguing the merits of your argument that it is, you took your ball and went home.

                      So do you want illegals deported or not? I've read your comments for five years, and my summary is that you don't want deportations--that you think freedom of movement is an inherent right, and it's wrong for the US to stop people who "just want a better life and to work hard" from coming into the country.

                    5. SQRLSY   12 hours ago

                      https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a-look-at-the-u-s-citizens-who-have-been-deported-by-the-trump-administration-so-far/ar-AA1EfDov

                      A Look At The U.S. Citizens Who Have Been Deported By The Trump Administration So Far

                      You look and speak like an illegal sub-human to MEEEE!!!

                    6. Jefferson Paul   12 hours ago

                      So three children who are US citizens that their parents, who were deported legally, decided to take with them. I've already explained why I don't consider that deporting US citizens when the parents CHOSE to take them with them. The rest of the article I didn't read when it was made clear these weren't deportations, but detainments.

                      If the parents decided to take a vacation outside the US and brought their kids along, would you say the parents deported their own children?

                    7. SQRLSY   12 hours ago

                      "If the parents decided to take a vacation outside the US and brought their kids along, would you say the parents deported their own children?"

                      If the USA Government Almighty will SNOT allow you and your children to cum back to the USA that you peacefully left, and peacefully tried to return to, and the USA Government Almighty tried to deport any of you or your children instead of allowing you to peacefully return to restore the PEACEFUL status quo ante... Then I would call the USA Government Almighty an evil, Satanic power pig! For the first 150 years or so of the USA's existence, NONE of this power piggery and "Papers Please" magic-papers-worshitting Dick-Tator-Shit existed!

                  2. DesigNate   13 hours ago

                    The citizens weren’t the ones deported, their parents were. I know that seems like a quibble, but it is a valid distinction.

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      4. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   17 hours ago

        They just deported a bunch of white Irish people dumbfuck.

        Log in to Reply
  14. Gaear Grimsrud   19 hours ago

    Well as far as the 4th is concerned the key is whether or not the stop is "unreasonable". The constitution is silent on ethnic profiling. The government's argument is only that these stops are reasonable and not a constitutional violation. And that sounds reasonable to me.

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  15. John Rohan   18 hours ago

    Saying "apparent ethnicity can be a factor" is a far cry from simply stopping anyone who speaks Spanish, as this article implies. We can't ignore the fact that the vast majority come from nations south of our border.

    Just my anecdote, but I used to work at DHS. One of my co-workers was a retired INS/ICE agent who was also originally born in Mexico. He told me they raided places like Home Depot parking lots all the time. He claimed it was so obvious who was illegal and who wasn't, that in his entire career they never mistakenly detained a US citizen or a legal immigrant. He said occasionally one of them had a temporary stay for various reasons and they would let them go, but that was about it.

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    1. sarcasmic   18 hours ago

      He claimed it was so obvious who was illegal and who wasn't, that in his entire career they never mistakenly detained a US citizen or a legal immigrant.

      Never once made a mistake? Sounds like something a cop would say.

      Log in to Reply
      1. Bruce Hayden   17 hours ago

        Maybe. But it also suggests that their profiling is very accurate, more than sufficient for Reasonable Suspicion.

        Log in to Reply
        1. sarcasmic   17 hours ago

          Dude, police lie about everything. They are legally allowed to lie to people in order to trick them. It's part of their training. They are trained to lie on reports as well. When they speak in court they jokingly call it "testilying," and everyone except the jury knows that they're lying. The system depends on them lying. For them lying is a way of life. It becomes pathological. If you believe anything that someone in law enforcement says you're a fool. Ask them for the time of day and they'll lie to you. They can't help it.

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    2. John Rohan   18 hours ago

      I should add - honestly, Central Americans tend to be really short, almost shockingly so, and when you see them together as a group it's obvious they didn't grow up in the US.

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      1. Vernon Depner   15 hours ago

        That helps them to pose as "unaccompanied minors".

        Log in to Reply
  16. Truthteller1   18 hours ago

    Root's hyperbolic bleats are comforting, but where is Sullum?

    Log in to Reply
    1. Vernon Depner   18 hours ago

      He was seized at random and sent to El Salvador.

      Log in to Reply
      1. Don't look at me! ( Is the war over yet?)   17 hours ago

        He made the mistake of getting a nice tan and went to Home Depot and was thrown into an unmarked van and was never seen again!

        Log in to Reply
      2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

        REALLY! Great! Did they stick his sorry TDS-addled ass in a prison?

        Log in to Reply
  17. MWAocdoc   18 hours ago

    Except when the Supreme Court has fearlessly led the way on social legislation from the bench, they have shown a distinct cravenly lack of spine in protecting us against unconstitutional tyrannical officials. I am disgusted.

    Log in to Reply
    1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

      You're also a fucking TDS-addled lying pile of shit, asswipe.

      Log in to Reply
  18. Neutral not Neutered   18 hours ago

    Anyone can be stopped and questioned. It's not like a hood is being thrown over their heads from behind and folks are kicked in the back of the legs, hand cuffed, slapped upside the head, drugged and taken to a black site, beaten and water boarded.

    But maybe if this did start happening more would self deport?

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    1. MWAocdoc   15 hours ago

      "Anyone can be stopped and questioned"

      Not without probable cause they can't! So you're just wrong. While the level of ignorance of the law has always been high in the United States, it's especially irksome when flaunted by the ignorant in public debates.

      Log in to Reply
  19. GOD OF PENGUIN ISLAND   17 hours ago

    I blame red SUVs.

    Log in to Reply
  20. Z Crazy   17 hours ago

    If it saves one life, the inconvenience of racial profiling is worth it.

    Log in to Reply
    1. MWAocdoc   14 hours ago

      Just because some people are willing to forfeit their rights doesn't mean that the rest of us don't still have them.

      Log in to Reply
    2. Liberty_Belle   13 hours ago

      "That it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape, than that one innocent Person should suffer" --- Benjamin Franklin

      https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Franklin/01-43-02-0335

      “It is more important that innocence be protected than it is that guilt be punished, for guilt and crimes are so frequent in this world that they cannot all be punished.

      But if innocence itself is brought to the bar and condemned, perhaps to die, then the citizen will say, 'whether I do good or whether I do evil is immaterial, for innocence itself is no protection,' and if such an idea as that were to take hold in the mind of the citizen that would be the end of security whatsoever.”
      ― John Adams
      https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/26445-it-is-more-important-that-innocence-be-protected-than-it

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      1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

        "It is better that millions of those here illegally not be detained than that one innocent person suffer a bit of discomfort"

        TDSs-addled pile of lying slimy shit Liberty_Belle

        Log in to Reply
        1. Liberty_Belle   13 hours ago

          If you ever find yourself in disagreement with the Founding Fathers, you are wrong.

          Take your meds and go back to bed, boomer.

          Log in to Reply
          1. KARate kid   10 hours ago

            I’m pretty sure Sevo is not a boomer. He’s greatest generation.

            Log in to Reply
            1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   9 hours ago

              Absolutely certain KARate kid is a brain-dead TDS-addled pile of lefty shit.

              Log in to Reply
              1. KARate kid   9 hours ago

                Where can I purchase your books?

                Maybe if I read your books I wouldn’t be a “brain-dead TDS-addled pile of lefty shit?”

                Log in to Reply
                1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   8 hours ago

                  Maybe you should just admit to being a brain-dead, TDS-addled pile of lefty shit, and then fuck off and die, asswipe.

                  Log in to Reply
          2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   9 hours ago

            "If you ever find yourself in disagreement with the Founding Fathers, you are wrong."

            You know quite a few of them were slave-holders, right, ass-wipe?

            Log in to Reply
            1. KARate kid   9 hours ago

              “You know quite a few of them were slave-holders, right, ass-wipe?”

              Holy shit! Sevo’s gone woke!!!

              Log in to Reply
              1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   8 hours ago

                KARate kid is amazed, since the slime bag has never read history!
                Fuck off and die, asswipe.

                Log in to Reply
                1. KARate kid   8 hours ago

                  Maybe I would be more knowledgeable about history if I read your books?

                  Where can I purchase them?

                  Log in to Reply
                  1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   8 hours ago

                    Fuck off and die, asswipe.

                    Log in to Reply
                  2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   6 hours ago

                    "Maybe I would be more knowledgeable about history if I read your books
                    Where can I purchase them?"

                    BTW, did your mommy suggest that was some sort of 'adult' response, or are you just an imbecilic piece of shit?

                    Log in to Reply
  21. Rick James   17 hours ago

    Let me guess, ICE is disproportionately arresting Guatemalans, Venezuelans, El Salvadorans and Chinese more than it is the Irish, the Polish, the Scots and the Welsh...

    Log in to Reply
    1. middlefinger   16 hours ago

      They’ve deported a lot of pedo polish illegals in Illinois.

      Up next on Reason:
      “The case for libertarian child sex work and the relationship to food trucks on GDP”

      Log in to Reply
      1. Vernon Depner   15 hours ago

        "Guatemalan children: Doing the sex work American kids won't do." Next month in Reason.

        Log in to Reply
  22. Dillinger   17 hours ago

    >> the argument that the federal government's alleged racial profiling has resulted in an overly broad dragnet that inevitably ensnares innocent U.S. citizens

    overly broad would be a bunch of ensnared Scandinavians

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  23. questioner7   15 hours ago

    "if the rights of U.S. citizens—such as the Fourth Amendment right to be free from unreasonable searches and seizures regardless of your skin color" -- why only of U.S. citizens? The Fourth Amendment protects "the people".

    Log in to Reply
    1. windycityattorney   13 hours ago

      +1

      Log in to Reply
      1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

        ^-2
        Fuck off and die, shitstain.

        Log in to Reply
    2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

      "the people"? You mean "the people" protected by the Constitution; the US citizens?

      Log in to Reply
      1. Liberty_Belle   13 hours ago

        You do know the Constitution protects non-citizens as well ? Or are you being obtuse on purpose ?

        https://scholarship.law.georgetown.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1302&context=facpub#:~:text=The%20Constitution%20does%20distinguish%20in,apply%20to%20%22the%20people.%22

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        1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   9 hours ago

          You know it's not quite as clear as brain-dead slimy piles of TDS-addled shit would make it:
          https://www.heritage.org/border-security/report/due-process-and-aliens-what-they-are-and-are-not-entitled-immigration

          Log in to Reply
  24. Liberty_Belle   13 hours ago

    Can we go back to hunting down pedos in Washington ? We were on a pretty good streak for a minute.

    Log in to Reply
    1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   13 hours ago

      How about we go back to ignoring with imbecilic bleats of asswipes like you?

      Log in to Reply
  25. mad.casual   12 hours ago

    When we say "racial profiling" are we specifically talking about the descendants of the Mayans and the Aztecs or the Mexicans, Venezuelans, and Guatemalans who are as European as Charlie Sheen or Nick Gillespie? ...Or is the argument just yet another pile of stupifying, dishonest horseshit from the same shit-stupid, dishonest, divisive, racist asshats who think we shouldn't have voter ID laws because they think black people are too stupid to know where their local DMV is or how to use the internet?

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  26. CharlieG   11 hours ago

    Why is it that the vast, vast majority of the arrests made ICE are of illegal immigrants? That indicates the raids are targetted specifically at illegal immigrants, not just people with brown skin and who speak Spanish.

    "Indeed, according to the emergency application to SCOTUS signed by Solicitor General John Sauer, "apparent ethnicity can be a factor supporting reasonable suspicion in appropriate circumstances." Translation: If a federal agent thinks that someone "looks illegal," the agent should be free to seize that person based only on his "apparent ethnicity" without setting off any sort of Fourth Amendment alarm bells."

    Your translation indicates you're illiterate, or a functional illiterate. You fail to comprehend the part of the statement that addresses the appropriate circumstances, which are additional things that are other indicators of illegal immigrant status.

    Why in an article about immigration enforcement didn't you mention that the vast, vast majority of people arrested by ICE are illegal immigrants?

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