Jay Bhattacharya & John Vecchione: Biden's Social Media Meddling Was Illegal
Plaintiffs in Missouri v. Biden allege that federal pressure to remove and suppress COVID-19 material on Facebook and Twitter violates the First Amendment.

Today's episode is an audio version of The Reason Livestream, which takes place every Thursday at 1 p.m. Eastern on Reason's YouTube channel.
Zach Weissmueller talked with Jay Bhattacharya, a professor of medicine, economics, and health research policy at Stanford University, and John Vecchione of the New Civil Liberties Alliance. They are among the plaintiffs in the lawsuit Missouri v. Biden, which names the president, the Justice Department, the FBI, and nearly the entire federal public health apparatus as defendants. Attorneys general for the states of Missouri and Louisiana brought the case against the federal government in May 2022 for what they describe as "open collusion with social media companies to suppress disfavored speakers, viewpoints, and content." Bhattacharya and Vecchione say that the government illegally squelched their speech throughout the COVID-19 pandemic and the 2020 presidential election by pushing social media platforms to remove or minimize the reach of heterodox views on COVID-19.
In July, U.S. District Court Judge Terry A. Doughty issued a preliminary injunction ordering the federal agencies to cease meeting with social media companies for the purpose of "inducing in any manner the removal…of content containing protected free speech posted on social-media platforms." Last week, the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals heard arguments challenging that injunction.
Bhattacharya and Vecchione talk with Zach about the state of the lawsuit, what a victory or loss in court would mean for free speech online, the legal limits of government–social media "partnerships," and the ways in which the government blurred the line between private content moderation and outright censorship to suppress or mislabel factual information or opinion as "misinformation" during the COVID-19 pandemic.
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There's no fucking way this article exists.
As long as the headline attributes the notion to a specific set of rabble-rousers on Twitter and stays as neutral as possible, then it can exist.
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And gee wouldn’t it have been nice if this article had been printed in 2020-2022 during the height of the argument, instead of a look-back chin-scratcher? You know, while all those alt-right Darkweb Jordan Peterson-ey/Brett Weinstein types were hosting Bhattacharya on their demonetized podcasts? You know, when Reason was doing that foot-plant thing my dog does when she finds an interesting scent in regards to "corporashuns should be allowed to independently ban anyone and anything they wanted 'cause free markets"?
Bhattacharya was the Tokyo Rose and Axis Sally of the COVID pandemic. They would have allowed them to contimue to propagandize the US in a war. And the COVID pandemic killed more Americans than did WW2.
One might want to consider the difference between treason (later pardoned) and saying something that detracts from the government narrative.
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Do you actually believe the bullshit that you type?
charliehall is SPB2, so no.
Sounded mean enough, so that makes sense.
"And the COVID pandemic killed more Americans than did WW2.
Quick clarification needed: with WW2 or from WW2?
Lol.
+1
Top level comment.
Pretty sure WW2 would have been worse if everybody got a ventilator shoved down their throat and an experimental drug jabbed in their arm.
Masking, universal masking.
"the COVID pandemic killed more Americans than did WW2"
Are there people out there actually claiming this or is it just some hyperbole by Pluggo?
Sadly, not you.
You have to be a parody
"...And the COVID pandemic killed more Americans than did WW2..."
You.
Are.
Full.
Of.
Shit.
I'm guessing sometime in 2026 Reason will discover that Joe Biden was selling influence for millions of dollars as a sitting vice president and write a devastating expose. Unless of course they all reluctantly vote for him in 2024.
Seeing as Weekend at Biden's II is going to happen regardless of who votes for whom, the Reasonistas won't discover that Joe Biden was selling influence until at least 2029.
If the democrats are allowed to say Biden won the 2024 'election', it is likely Reason won't be here in 2026.
While they reasonably follow "the narrative", they are not fully faithful, and they allow comments that are pure heresy, so up against the wall they will go. Only the true faithful will be allowed a public voice.
First it’s something they’ll never say, then when they do it’s too little too late. Heads you win, tails they lose.
People here have been saying it for years while you and reason denied and/or defended it. At the time they were not talking about the censorship. Those you hate were correct. You were fucking wrong. Get over it.
Why did you switch your strawman argument of people saying reason never wrote about a subject (past tense) to will never write about a subject (future tense). Is it because your strawman argument was shut down so you just moved onto the next one?
Probably. His original strawman got burned to a crisp.
Except it is a topic Reason has written about, while certain commenters here would die before acknowledging.
Before or after defending it as private companies for 3 years Mike? Notice the years from the original post that started the back and forth. You are free to "cite" an example.
But then again you call these "conspiracies" and "republican victimization."
All the information was there and discussed and you as well as Reason ignored it for years.
That comment was all over the place, and lacking in any recognition of nuance.
I'm not here to play childish games, bro.
Oh, Laursen, but you play them all the fucking time. You, sir, are probably the biggest hypocrite on the board.
Or it isn’t passionate enough.
Your argument by discussing the behaviors of others instead of discussing a topic is strange.
Why are you more concerned with tone than you are substance?
If I’m commenting on the behavior of others, I’m merely commenting on the behavior of others. Unlike others here, I never use it as a technique to try to “win” commentariat debates or as a copout to extract myself from a debate.
Very good point.
Your dog does that?!
Whats hilarious is you denied censorship was happening for 7 years claiming those telling you these things are conspiracy theories abd facts changed.
The lack of self awareness you possess is astounding.
If sarcasmic had made that comment three or four years ago he wouldn't have sounded like such a retarded douchebag.
He's like an Stalin apologist after the 20th Party Congress in 1956 saying "See, we talked about some of his crimes".
And like most Stalin apologists, Sarcasmic will definitely become a DNC Tankie.
SRG had the balls this morning to call RFK Jr antisemitic even though shrike openly supports Soros who helped the Nazis. They have no shame.
Somehow criticism of Soros is antisemitic but his attacks on Kushner totally aren't. That hypocritical fuck doesn't even believe his own bullshit, he'll just say anything he can to deflect and redirect.
Joining the nazi youth, finding hiding jews, and stealing there stuff doesn't mean soros is a bad person
Can we at least kind-of-sort-of admit that that it kind-of-sort-of violated the principles of libertarianism? Or are we going to stick hard that while it might have not been censorship-censorship, it was still censorship?
Diane, they don't know what the principles of libertarianism are. They're all NYC or beltway progressives.
It's only censorship to them if you remove it from an elementary school curriculum.
I.e. censorship that offends Democrats.
Sure, right. Nick Gillespie has no idea what the principles of libertarianism is.
Holy shit. I agree with Mike.
Stopped clock right twice, etc.
No no no! What happened to amnesty for the response to the pandemic? Look, we all made mistakes. Let's just move on.
What happened to amnesty for the response to the pandemic?
They forgave the PPP loans, now we should forgive them. What? You didn't get a PPP loan? Fine. File for an ERC credit. You don't have a business? Then why should they care about you?
YouTube no longer requires private communications from government actors telling them who to censor. Any medical information that is not explicitly endorsed by government actors is by default deemed "misinformation" and banned. Problem solved!
https://off-guardian.org/2023/08/18/inside-youtubes-new-medical-misinformation-policy/
Have they even heard the counter argument of muh private company?
We need a libertarian publication willing to step up and defend the first amendment right of private companies to censor on behalf of government.
I know of a certain "libertarian" magazine that isn't afraid to stand up for a corporation's right to obey unconstitutional government orders.
How dare you forget the first amendment rights of government agents.
I've actually heard that used as a serious argument, Jesse.
Yeah. Mike had made it multiple times. So had Jeff.
Sqrlsy uses it every time the social media censorship requests get brought up.
Oh, I don't see SQRLSY anymore.
Sqrlsy is here and there, probably when Sarc feels like trotting his nutty ass out of whatever bottle Sarc finds himself in.
Like spiked
Excellent summary of the bestest election ever.
https://americanmind.org/salvo/debunking-jack-smiths-latest-indictment-against-president-trump/
"When the Supreme Court denied the State of Texas’s lawsuit in December of 2020 to challenge the integrity of that year’s general election for lack of Article III standing, there already existed an overwhelming trove of evidence of procedural abnormalities and statistical anomalies that pointed to fundamental questions about the legitimacy of the election. Well over 155 million votes were allegedly cast in that year’s cycle—the most of any vote total in presidential history, surpassing 2016’s previous record-setting high by a whopping 28 million votes. Moreover, the 2020 election not only saw the highest percentage of votes cast either by mail or absentee ballot in modern American history, but it was the first time in which election day voting represented a minority of all methods of casting ballots: fewer than one third of voters who cast their ballots in the 2020 general election did so in person on election day.
Even if there was absolutely no evidence of election fraud, the fact that more votes were cast than in any other election in American history—the majority of the ballots having been cast prior to the official election day by mail, a method of voting historically recognized as being rife with fraud, not only in the United States but other Western democracies—meant that extreme diligence and precautionary care ought to have been taken to minimize the high probability of outcome determinative error in an election of such complexity."
Much more.
That's called switching the burden of proof. It's easy to prove fraud. It's impossible to prove no fraud to someone who refuses to believe there wasn't any.
It’s certainly impossible to prove fraud to someone who approves of it.
As you approve of imprisoning people without charging them just because you hate their politics.
Keep drinking till you die.
In the morning thread you claimed bit only was there was zero fraud, despite documented convictions, but also claimed there were absolutely zero court cases won by Trump despite results like in Wisconsin or Pennsylvania.
https://apnews.com/article/2022-midterm-elections-biden-donald-trump-wisconsin-supreme-court-05166e3f3ef970b5cde8ac15cd30e18b
There are a multitude of completed court cases regarding illegal election rule changes yet you claimed this morning zero cases were ever won.
Why should anyone take your biased opinion devoid of truth as an argument? Your argument is just repeating common democrat narratives as even the media admits there were election challenges won by Trump and other conservative challenges. They also admit there was fraud as evidence by convictions. Yet you deny both and pretend to be non biased.
There are also ongoing court cases threatening any non government actor who tried to investigate fraud. So your entire thesis based on ignorance and a blind faith in institutions. Yet you claim to be a libertarian.
Nobody takes Sarcasmic seriously. He's a worthless buffoon who comes here because he enjoys shitting in the punch bowl and being abused for it.
Then he drinks the punch.
After spiking it with everclear.
Even if there were fraud, it wasn't enough to change the outcome. So why bother dwelling on it? To rally Team Red?
Unlike some Facebook ads in 2016, right?
I like how you morons flitter between arguments so easily whenever your original arguments are refuted.
There is a reason states are going after groups trying to look into fraud. I get why you refuse all investigations jeff. If nobody ever is allowed to look, nothing will be found. Your only care is dems winning elections. No matter how.
Why did you have to get another sock account jeff?
I had you muted because you don't argue in good faith and ignore evidence presented. But here you are outside of your little gray box. Before I send you back I will point out that the article I posted doesn't allege any specific fraud. It simply points out that by every measure the 2020 election was an unprecedented historical aberration in both the process and the outcome. And that changes to the process, many of which have been found to be illegal and unconstitutional, created multiple opportunities for fraud and were designed to prevent any accurate audit. You don't have to believe that massive fraud changed the outcome to understand that the election was rigged. Now off you go to your little gray box.
Those "changes in the process" would have helped Biden if anything. Because Trump urged his followers to vote in person, that means a higher percentage of mail-in ballots would have gone to Biden. It's simple math. My understanding of concern over these rule changes is that legit absentee ballots may not have been counted. Well there's a higher probability that those absentee ballots would have gone to Biden than to Trump. So you're complaining about something that likely helped Trump.
I see you're CNN educated, but legit absentee ballots would be mostly rank and file overseas military voters who would have been solid for Trump.
Out of curiosity figured I’d unmute the Canadian Cunt to see what lies or fallacies it’s peddling today.
By using the word “legit” to describe a small percentage of the total absentee ballots, it eliminates the vast majority from consideration. Even though they’re all treated the same on election day.
This, folks, is called moving the goalposts. It’s a common fallacy used by liars who change the premises of an argument midstream in order to change the conclusion.
Thus ends this edition of why this cunt’s posts are not worth reading.
Back on mute it goes.
Expect a long string of gaslighting (you don’t know what fallacies are), lies (you hate the troops), personal attacks / ad hominems (you’re get all your news from CNN), and other comments containing the word “you,” because the cunt and it’s cunty friends always talk about the person, not what the person says.
Edit: right on cue....
Oh look, one of his buddies is impersonating jeff. The mendacity knows no bounds.
To be fair it made you look pretty dumb.
Well. He can't help it. Sarc is dumb.
Thanks for being retard-level with your dishonesty. It makes my job easier.
“By using the word “legit” to describe a small percentage of the total absentee ballots, it eliminates the vast majority from consideration.”
I literally used the exact phrase you wrote two posts up because you were talking about “legit absentee ballots”.
“concern over these rule changes is that legit absentee ballots may not have been counted”
Are you that drunk and ready to troll that you can’t remember the words you used in your own argument two posts up? Amazing.
This, folks, is called moving the goalposts. It’s a common fallacy used by liars who change the premises of an argument midstream in order to change the conclusion.”
This, folks is Fetal Alcohol Syndrome in action sixty some years later (And not knowing when moving the goalposts is applicable but desperately wanting to call counter claims fallacious).
Now that's hilarious. He is always doing that to himself which makes him this place's accidental comedian.
I'm providing this here as sarc is accusing you of doing literally what he did. From yesterday.
sarcasmic 18 hours ago
Flag Comment Mute User
Every single case has been thrown out. Every. Single. One. Either every court and judge in the country is organized against him, or he’s a sore loser grasping at straws. I choose door number two.
Now today he seems to admit that trials did conclude and ruled on illegal election changes. So he moved his own goalposts then accuses others of doing so.
Moving the goalposts is you yesterday claiming the right won zero election trials and there was zero fraud then moving to admitting it occurred but no widespread fraud as you continue to dismiss evidence.
Again various states are going after groups seeking answers. You trust government blindly to audit themselves.
So you admit the illegal election changes reviewed by the courts helped Biden. Yet yesterday you said Trump won zero of his lawsuits. Are you walking that claim back? Are you agreeing democrats illegally changed election rules to benefit them? That is far from what you stated yesterday.
As far as your new claim that was heavily pushed by the left but a quick review of his speeches shows different. I have seen you being given these links prior but facts don't seem to matter to you.
Trump himself voted by mail. He told supporters to vote anyway they could.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/08/04/trump-backtracks-mail-voting-florida-391373
Here is saying to simply make sure mail ballots were counted.
https://www.voanews.com/2020-usa-votes/follow-your-vote-trump-tells-mail-ballot-voters
Both of these examples before the election but you choose to push a false narratives of the media. I have seen you do this often.
My understanding of concern over these rule changes is that legit absentee ballots may not have been counted.
This is just a plain lie meant to hide you being wrong yesterday. The concern is collection of fraudulent ballots as argued in courts prior to 2020. The concern is massive mail in voting operations by the left to register and vote as someone else. We just had a story yesterday from MTG about her husband being denied his in person vote in GA being told he already voted by mail. They had to use lawyers and FOIA to prove it happened. Georgia admitted he never registered to vote by mail but showed they accepted a vote from him by mail. These documents are available when you question the story. On top of that in 2021 there were 40k people in GA who signed affidavits saying they had the same issue. But they didn't have political connections or money for lawyers to fight it.
You have been wrong on every argument you've made despite all the evidence you have been given. Your source of "facts" seems to be mainstream media narratives.
Can you counter any of these arguments above?
Trump himself voted by mail.
Oh, please. Trump contradicted himself on numerous topics, including mail-in voting. You are ignoring all the times Trump cast apersions on mail-in voting as if nobody will notice what you are leaving out.
You have a cite and link for that, Laursen?
Hold on. Your link goes to a story about a change in rules for dropping off ballots form two years after the 2020 election, affecting future voting only, not involving any Trump lawyers, where there was no allegations of or finding of fraud.
Why are you trying to pass it off as an example of a Trump court case victory proving there was fraud in the 2020 election?
And this is where you show your dishonesty Mike. When did the lawsuits start? You focus on when they ended, not when they started. It is weird how you try to misdirect. You are free to see the history of the lawsuit, but facts don’t matter to you. It is amazing to see.
This is probably why people call you dishonest.
I also notice you never call out sarc when he is wrong, which is often. Almost like you are biased.
Right. I'm dishonest.
You didn't address at all that the lawsuit alleged no fraud and there was no finding of fraud.
Yes, you are dishonest, Laursen. Thanks for admitting it.
Biden do something illegal? Unpossible. As both High Priest and Dear Leader, Uncle Joe can do no wrong. Anyone who suggests otherwise (looking at you SCOTUS) is asking to be found guilty of heresy and sent to the camps.
Probably a good place for this.
sarcasmic 2 weeks ago
Flag Comment Mute User
Why wouldn’t there be? Despite all his faults, at least Biden recognizes the Constitution. Can’t say the same about Trump.
It really is happening. The current propaganda is anyone who suggests otherwise is guilty of insurrection and racketeering whereas during the Obama Administration it was just IRS targeting.
Is there a plausible RICO case against FJB?
Do we need a snap impeachment to find out?
If you think about it - just about everyone who has been elected was part of a conspiracy to defraud the American people - lots of RICO act violations in politics. Congress is a model for how to do organized crime. The DNC and RNC are the biggest conspirators of them all.
There is no possible doubt that government officials "collaborating" with private information platforms was and still is unconstitutional interference in the freedom of the press. If you accept that having a chilling effect on the exercise of a constitutionally guaranteed right is illegal, then leaning on news media and online services to get them to "collaborate" with government certainly qualifies. If a privately operated platform chooses to limit content posted by its customers then it's not censorship and not forbidden by the Constitution. If a Congressional committee "investigates" penalizing a private service for posting disfavored opinions, that is also clearly crossing the line into censorship - the quid pro quo is blatantly obvious: stop hosting posts that disagree with the official party line or we will find a way to punish you! If an official of the CDC "discusses" misinformation or disinformation with online platform employees it is not significantly different from a Federal prosecutor "offering" a suspect a plea bargain while threatening to "investigate" a family member. It's thinly disguised abuse of power and we must put a stop to it.
Nothing new on Reason yet today? Was there some team-building event last night (parking cars and serving drinks at a Koch family gathering)? Or is there some new age holiday on the calendar today?
Beats me. Usually they have the Saturday food article up by 7 am CDT.
Arrest, indict, convict, and imprison the perjurious thieving criminal, "Doctor" Anthony Fauci.
Impeach Garland.
Impeach Mayorkas.
And last but most certainly not least, impeach the scumbag puppet Commander-in-Chief Robert L. Peters, aka "Robin Ware", aka "J.B. Ware", aka "Sleepy Joe Biden".
What are you waiting for Speaker McCarthy, do you need Peters to blow someone's brains on on live television or something? Let's fucking go and get it done already!
Now we finally know why Chemjeff disappears for a bit now and then.
Taxpayer-Funded Minneapolis Art Center Holds 'Family' Class on Summoning Demons
He has been here in heart. I mean socks.
"It’s back to school time! What better way to get the year off to a great start than by taking the whole family to a demon-summoning class? Summon a few demons, sell your soul, and then head out for some last-minute shopping for school supplies. Then ice cream for everyone!"
Do these demons include white privilege and oppressive MAGA patriarchy? Sounds like a similar grift.
he disappears now and then because it's his day off from his deep state job where he is paid to rile up opposition. His primary job is to generate work for the FBI.
Imagine the disappointment of summoning some great evil to serve your family and curse your enemies... and Jeff waddles out of your goat blood pentagram.
Does it include a blood sacrifice of the youngest member of the family?
How about a tax-supported revival meeting held in the name of "art"?
No, that would violate separation of church and state.
Emails Show Hunter Biden Hired Specialists to Quietly Airbrush Wikipedia
Better dick pics?
Wikipedia is the most trusted source of information. Ask Mike, sqrsly, or shrike.
What about Mastodon and CNN?
Given how Wikipedia is edited, this doesn't really surprise me.
People don't give Biden enough credit for brokering a peace deal between the US, Japan, and South Korea.
Chris D. Jackson
@ChrisDJackson
·
Follow
???? Wow. History is being made right now at Camp David as President Biden brokers peace and cooperation between the United States, South Korea and Japan.
.
Who is president matters, folks. These things just don't happen. This is because of the decades of experience and wisdom of… Show more
Lost the link, and that's got to be parody.
https://twitter.com/ChrisDJackson/status/1692624013363662923
Chris D. Jackson
@ChrisDJackson
Dad, Husband, Public Servant, 16 Years Elective Office, Fmr. Democratic Party Chair, OG #TeamJoe, Strategist, Animal Advocate, #GBO ????
Wow... it's not parody.
"This is definitely the most impressive thing Robert L Peters has done in his entire career.
Brokering peace where no one even thought to look."
Wow. There are dems like Mike in the comments defending the historical achievement.
When does Hunter get more corporate board appointments in Japan and South Korea?
You mean we now have to be friends with South Korea and Japan?
Woaaaah. We just stopped being at war with them. Hold off on the friends talk. Thats the talking point for the election.
San Diego State University subjects cancer biologist applicants to DEI litmus test
The school requires individuals applying to the cancer biologist position to complete a ‘building inclusive excellence’ form.
In order to be considered for the job, a candidate must satisfy criteria such as having ‘research interests that contribute to diversity and equal opportunity in higher education.’
IT'S NOT HAPPENING!
IT'S A GOOD THING!
In their defense, it is San Diego State. Always a top 10 party school, overcrowded, and a lot of commuters. In my day it typically took 7 years to graduate for a combination of not able to get classes and just having to work part time to pay for it.
Basically, the best thing you can do with a degree from SDSU is laminate it and throw it on your dash so you can park in handicap spots.
Hillary is coming to fix some of that - - - - - - - - - -
https://babylonbee.com/news/deaths-caused-by-hurricane-hilary-to-be-labeled-suicides
People who get cancer from smoking don't deserve treatment. Black people are more likely to smoke. Therefore Black people don't deserve cancer treatment.
Did I pass?
Not a chance.
You need at least 300 pages of why cigarettes are wrapped in white paper, and that is another continuation of the white male patriarchy etc, etc.
You know, since the wrapper is most of the cigarette, and the brown filter has to collect all the bad things and is only a small part of the product - - --
Well, you can go on from there, right?
So the brown tobacco is wearing whiteface?
What If There Had Been No Covid Coup?
https://brownstone.org/articles/what-if-there-had-been-no-covid-coup/
Before Covid, the guidelines for dealing with a new outbreak of a flu-like virus were clear:
avoid panic,
search for cheap, widely available early treatments that may reduce the risk of serious illness,
plan to increase healthcare capacity if necessary,
help local and state medical personnel to identify and treat cases if and when the virus causes serious illness,
and keep society functioning as normally as possible.
This was the approach used in all previous epidemics and pandemics. The guidelines are detailed in the planning documents of the WHO, HHS, and EU countries.
When the military and national security agencies took over the response, these guidelines were replaced by a biowarfare paradigm: Quarantine until vaccine. In other words, keep everyone locked down while rapidly developing medical countermeasures. This is a response intended to counter biowarfare and bioterrorism attacks. It is not a public health response and is, in fact, in direct conflict with the scientific and ethical underpinnings of established public health principles.
Had we adhered to the public health protocols that were initially followed in the early months of 2020, life in the United States and around the world would have looked like life in Sweden during the pandemic, with even less panic: no masks, no school closures, no lockdowns, very low excess deaths.
I personally wouldn't have even noticed anything was going on. I don't know anyone who had more than a cold that year, and nobody that was hospitalized or died. For a number of people it would have been a bad flu season.
Nurses would have had less time to dance.
Law Prof Jody Freeman Resigns From ConocoPhillips Board After Activist Environmental Group Pressured Harvard To Fire Her.
"We need more women in high positions of academia and business!!"
"Fire that woman!"
Does she thinks that's going to save her?
Climate Change Severely Impacting Disney Theme Park Attendance
Yeah, yeah, climate change. That's the ticket.
Disney went hard on the vaccine passports. I don’t feel the need to ever give bigots like them another dime.
With inflation maybe they need to consider some price cuts. They are just too expensive. Families are fooled into going the first time. They are in the price level with one of Hunter’s cocaine fueled hooker binges.
They should also consider hiring good writers for thier shows.
How long until the narrative tells us that COVID was caused by climate change? And how Disney visits are a human right, and deserve to be subsidized by the feds--as long as they properly support the narrative?
Government backed loans to cover the cost of visiting Disney.
Said loans to be forgiven if one or more of your kids later transition?
Having Princess Harry as a greeter didn't help either.
Nothing to do with hiring trannies to dress up as princesses and pushing sex cult grooming though.
Little girls want to meet a real princess - not some icky boy.
It's fucking Florida. In the summer. But never waste a good fake crisis, right? How else can the DNC/WEF/Illuminati convince kids who can't read yet that totalitarianism is the only way to save man, er, human, er, being-kind?
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