Looting Is Bad. So Are Curfews.
The California National Guard should be helping to put out fires, not helping to restrict people's freedom of movement.

The California National Guard arrived in burn zones Friday to assist local police "with traffic control and critical infrastructure protection," Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said. Since then, the National Guard has been helping to enforce a curfew from 6 p.m. to 6 a.m. in and around Pacific Palisades and Altadena—the two neighborhoods most impacted by the Palisades and Eaton fires.
Preventing looting is worthwhile. Preventing residents' freedom of movement is not.
The Palisades and Eaton fires that erupted Tuesday were only 14 percent and 33 percent contained, respectively, on Monday morning. As of Thursday evening, 20 people had been arrested on suspicion of looting, according to the Los Angeles Times. Although L.A. County Supervisor Kathryn Barger has said the curfew was not punitive, Luna has promised to book those violating the curfew. He has also said that all who remain in areas subject to evacuation orders are guilty of misdemeanors.
Under the evacuation orders, thousands of residents who are concerned about the safety of their property may not return to retrieve their most valuable possessions without breaking the law—assuming they manage to make it past deputies and national guardsmen stationed at road closures and conducting roving patrols. For residents in areas subject to curfews, it's now illegal to leave their own homes to feed pets abandoned by neighbors.
Theft, vandalism, and other property crimes are wrong, and they deserve to be "punished to the fullest extent of the law," as Los Angeles County District Attorney Nathan Hochman has promised to do. But 20 instances of burglary do not justify redirecting the Guard from protecting critical firefighting infrastructure to enforcing curfews and evacuation orders.
Los Angeles County Fire Department Chief Anthony Marrone said last week that all of the city's fire departments were exhausted, "with no fire apparatus or additional personnel to spare." The Los Angeles Fire Department (LAFD) is stretched to the point of asking all off-duty firefighters to assist, using a protocol that had not been exercised for 19 years. Firefighters from other parts of the state, from other states, even from Canada and Mexico have traveled to L.A. to help.
Of the 600 CalGuard servicemembers deployed by Gov. Gavin Newsom on Thursday, 300 were working with law enforcement with an equal number assisting firefighters. On Saturday, Newsom increased the number of CalGuard to 1,680, more than 1,000 of which were mobilized to assist local law enforcement. Newsom mobilized a thousand more CalGuard servicemembers on Sunday. As long as the fires are raging, the majority of these servicemembers should be working with the LAFD, not the Sheriff's Department.
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Even in times of emergency, or especially in times of emergency, you need to let the proles know who's in charge. That's way more important than diverting 1000 national guard into fighting the emergency at hand.
Guarding houses that are about to be firewood might not be the best use of their time.
No, but making sure who is and isn't in the threat zone has long been a function of the military in time of emergencies. For as long as the military has existed in this country. Fuck, my best friend, when he was a FNG private on active duty was doing this same shit in South Florida after Hurricane Andrew (as a medic assigned to an infantry unit). You see the Guard here in Montana, and back in Idaho where I grew up doing the same exact fucking thing every fucking summer, as well as digging lines. It actually is a huge safety concern for those who are actually on the fucking lines fighting the fires. Criminals have been known to attack firefighters in the commission of their crimes and guess who has to risk their lives when some dumb fuck decides they need to go save their family photo albums, and re-enter an active fire area, and then gets in trouble because the winds suddenly changed directions (which happens a lot in wildland fires) or the fire jumps the line etc. They do this to protect the public and the firefighters. And also to know who is in the active fire areas in case something suddenly occurs and they have to perform an unplanned emergency evacuation. And night time curfews are pretty standard too, for the same exact fucking reason. Nick is actually complaining about something that is not unique to this fire and goes on at every fire the guard or even active duty is called out to, every fucking natural disaster too. Also, just like fighting a war, for every soldier on the line, there's four or five in some form of support role, doing things as unrelated as pay, chaplain services, family communication, cooking, medical, transportation, security, public relations etc. I belonged to a Combat Support Hospital, if my unit had been called up for a national disaster, would it make sense to have us digging fucking fire lines or filling sandbags? I'm betting the majority of the soldiers who are manning these checkpoints and road blocks come from MP units, who are trained in combat traffic control and such, which is almost exactly what they're doing here (and for much of the same reason). In an emergency you need to know who is in danger and limit the number of people who are in danger. It protects not just the public but the emergency workers safety.
And of course they are going to be working with local law enforcement, because guess who is in charge in this situation? Not the Guard. Guess what, the ones digging line, or dropping water from a Blackhawk are also coordinating and under the supervision of the civilian firefighters.
God knows I do love to bash the left, and especially a greasy slimeball wannabe tyrant like Newsome, but Nick is pretty far off base here against a catcher with a strong and accurate arm.
maybe we can do both considering the looting gangs have been patrolling the area I say the guard is needed since the local cops are being paid off by the gangs
also note I see the local cops in N.C. have been doing some looting as well.
Be a shame if anything happened to them.
Anybody but you would be surprised if that did not happen.
This is HIllary Clinton thinking. Good people do X and bad people do Y. Almost never the case in the real world. Take 5 or 6 traits a certain type of person should have and you will find in any population only a teeny group will have all those traits.
No, the cops are not paid off by the gangs. I've lived in LA for over 50 years and I've been involved as an activist for over twenty years. I know who is corrupt and how they are corrupt, but today's LAPD is not taking bribes from gang members.
The Woke Mayor, however, does interfere with the LAPD arresting members of the BLM and the fired DA, Gascon, would not prosecute. Bass is still Woke, but our new DA Hochman, is not Woke.
but today's LAPD is not taking bribes from gang members
We’ll have to agree to disagree on that:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rampart_scandal
There’s no way the culture that cooked up this a mere twenty years ago has changed, just because they arrested a few of the pieces of shit.
Yep. Wouldn’t need such an emphasis on restricting movements if there weren’t so many scumbag looters in democrat cities.
If I recall correctly, there are some Korean business owners in that city with experience dealing with looters.
>>it's now illegal to leave their own homes to feed pets abandoned by neighbors.
lol fuck you, shoot me.
Headline after curfew and no-go rules removed.
“173 dead after being caught by fire while trying to recover their family pictures in areas of uncontrolled blazes.”
Those are "good" deaths.
"With" COVID
On the topic of 1800s San Francisco arson fires, where citizens did patrol the city. All of this has happened before in California
http://www.sfmuseum.org/hist10/6thfire.html
No, it is not illegal. The cops and fire fighters will feed you pets if you tell them your address.
Are your neighbor's pets so finicky that a daytime feeding is out of the question? Or are you taking responsibility for the randos that come throug the neighborhood opportunistically looking for shit to steal?
There is an actual emergency that, given the lower trust society we have, necessitates some level of restriction to actually safeguard personal property.
Nothing says 'traffic control' like an assault rifle.
Right?
Is it OK to violate the curfew if you're fully vaxxed and practicing social distancing?
Only if you have reservations at the French laundry.
And only if the wait staff is masked.
It was an early dinner.
Wake up you jerk-off! People are dying and thousands have lost everything they own and you make fun of the people who are working 24/7 to save lives and property. The Devil Winds will start blowing this evening and the authorities are trying to do everything they can to prepare.
Terrible mistakes were made in LA going back decades, but the rank and file police and fire fighters did not make those horrible decisions. LA Fire Chief Crowley will be fired because she told the TRUTH to a reporter who asked whether the $87 Million cut in her budget hampered her department. She said YES but Mayor Bass lied and said NO. What Bull shit, Losing $87 Million made no difference. Get real! Then, Chief Crowley went father and told the absolute truth that the problems started way back in 2010.
I agree with you.
What about mask mandates, vaccine mandates and national lockdowns?
FYI, remember, this is the state that voted for curfews, voted hard, and re-elected curfews several times, and vociferously and decisively rejected the alternative when it was offered up to them.
My curfew protects you. Your curfew protects me. Am I doing this right?
No.
"Preventing looting is worthwhile."
Nothing in the real world can "prevent" crimes. The most anyone can do is try to catch looters in the act and punish them for their crimes. Whether catching criminals in the act deters other would-be looters from trying to commit crimes or not may be subject to scientific analysis - or not. Until then having patrols is not a convincing way to prevent looting.
Idiot.
You prevent looting by having armed guards standing between the looters and what they want to loot.
Well, there goes you're invitation to write for this rag. 10,000 examples of looters running amoch may not override Reason's 1969 "fuck the pigs" Booomer horseshit.
Enforcement does reduce crime just as non-enforcement increases crime. LA has gone through years of non-enforcement of criminal laws especially against members of BLM, see Jason Reedy who stalked, assaulted and battered a city councilmmember due to the 100% false story that he was anti-Black. Mayor Bass made certain that Reedy was not even arrested even though we all saw it on TV. She protected the pro Hamas forces who were attacking Jewish students at UCLA.
SOme legerdemain you perform there with misuse of words.
You absolutely do prevent further crime if say you send away a drug abuser before he becomes an addict, becomes a pusher, becomes someone who kill people so he can get money for the next fix.
Can you make someone a saint? No. but that works both ways.
LINCOLN found your line of argument disgusting.
"good men, men who love tranquility, who desire to abide by the laws, and enjoy their benefits, who would gladly spill their blood in the defense of their country; seeing their property destroyed; their families insulted, and their lives endangered; their persons injured; and seeing nothing in prospect that forebodes a change for the better; become tired of, and disgusted with, a Government that offers them no protection; and are not much averse to a change in which they imagine they have nothing to lose. Thus, then, by the operation of this mobocractic spirit, which all must admit, is now abroad in the land, the strongest bulwark of any Government, and particularly of those constituted like ours, may effectually be broken down and destroyed--I mean the attachment of the People. Whenever this effect shall be produced among us; whenever the vicious portion of population shall be permitted to gather in bands of hundreds and thousands, and burn churches, ravage and rob provision-stores, throw printing presses into rivers, shoot editors, and hang and burn obnoxious persons at pleasure, and with impunity; depend on it, this Government cannot last. "
ALEM Ore. (KPTV) - After Oregon sent 300 firefighters and 75 engines to help fight the Los Angeles fires this week, rumors began circulating that equipment and crews had been stopped for California emissions testing.
According to Oregon and California officials, each truck was given a routine safety check in Sacramento to make sure each engine was equipped, mechanically sound, and able to respond.
Fucking California.
Was it a check mandated by CA? Fire engines rarely travel hundreds of miles. I could imagine that they wanted to check after a long drive before they go into the danger zone. Though I guess it's another hundreds of miles from Sacramento to LA.
Because emissions from a few dozen firetruck is the most important thing right now.
""engine was equipped,""
What do you mean hoses were not in the truck?
Don't prosecute me for shooting the looters and you won't have to patrol or implement curfews. Putting in curfews and not patrolling to shoot the looters is unacceptable.
LA is reaching rooftop Koreans mode.
IMO, looting is worse than curfews.
And Nicastro, the point of everything that has happened in CA is to be able to clamp down harder.
If I caught someone looting my business, I would put them down. No questions asked.
Look. We have 20 confirmed cases of burglary, unknown numbers of others due to people being unable to return home as well as some of the evidence being literally burned.
And that is not counting the cases of arson. At least two people were caught lighting fires with the apparent motive of looting homes and businesses
That last bit is a very important point that your deliberately omitted.
If I had a gazillion dollars and owned one of those burned out houses, I’d pay someone to roll up a fifth wheel on the back of an old pickup with a filled long gun rack on the back. The family would live in the camper, set up some camping furniture and patrol 24/7.
What a shitshow
You win for the dumbest posting of the year.
Whew! Good thing we no longer have a militia based emergency response system that can deploy quickly and then demobilize quickly when it ends.
Because clearly it is more libertarian to move 1800 semipermanent soldiers from one place to another. Rather than to deploy up to a few million quickly.
Uhm, the curfew is from 6 pm to 6 AM, is Nick suggesting we allow unknown people into an active fire area, after dark, unsupervised? What is the safety implications for those allowed in and for the firefighters in the area? Because who is going to have to go in when those people get in trouble, and save them? How will we know who is in trouble if we don't monitor who is and isn't going into the danger zone? It's not just a freedom of movement or a crime thing, it's about basic safety, for everyone. Yeah, curfews sound bad, and focusing on the looting issue to sell them makes it seem more anti-liberty than otherwise stating, we are restricting movement in the danger zone so we can protect life, both the publics and the firefighters. As for the National Guard conducting road blocks and such, they do that always in emergency mobilizations. Some are used to fight fires, others are used to control crowds and to control who enters and leaves the threatened area. This isn't something new (shit, I wasn't in the Guard and we trained to do this shit too and my best friend was deployed to South Florida following Hurricane Andrew, while on active duty, and part of his time was spent doing the same fucking thing). You'll find the Idaho Guard and Montana Guard doing the same thing, along with digging line, just about every summer too. Fucking Nick just discovered something that the military has been doing, especially the militia and it's descendants, have been doing since it's foundations. Hey, Nick, maybe next you can write on how some of the National Guard is being used to feed firefighters, deliver supplies and treat firefighter injuries too, instead of fighting the fires themselves. Especially those whose MOS involves things like transportation, medical, or cooks.
Oh, and some of those who were activated are doing such non-fire fighting things like making sure all the other guardsman are getting their pay and benefits, that their families are receiving their benefits, and can contact their soldiers. Some are also offering 'gasp' religious services to their fellow soldiers and any firefighters that may want to partake of them. And some are working on coordinating public relations (which is actually their damn MOS). Nick just discovered that in any military operation for every one on the line, there's four or five others doing other duties. Fucking clueless.
Nick, like most of the Reason staff, doesn’t appear to bright.
Obviously reality is failing their theory of human nature so reality needs to change.
I'm actually surprised at how small the ratio between those actively fighting the fires and those doing other duties is. That's a better parity than most military operations, where is more likely 1 to like 9 or 10.
This author is a fool. He obviously knows nothing about Los Angeles or the areas near the EATON Fire. Looting is a terrible problem due to the Woke administration. Many of South American gangs who came here to loot LA homes months ago are still here. Let's drop the DEI garbage. If Blacks live near your neighborhood the chances of being looted are much higher. WOKE Major Bass is opposed to any BLM being arrested or prosecuted. Hopefully, the new DA, Hochman, will ignore Bass. We may find out today. The WOKE LA media is still concealing the race of those who have been arrested for looting. Remember in LA Wokeism, telling the truth is a sin.
Letting people into the areas is a huge danger. In many places they can be trapped again and burn to death. There are still power lines down. Other places have the air filled with toxic chemicals like 9/11. Everyone is LA feels the air problem. I feel it and I live 20 miles inland! N-95 masks are supposed to help but due to the massive amount of right wing false info about masks during Covid, thousands of people disregard the warnings.
Do NOT Write about stuff where you are vastly ignorant of the conditions!
What exactly right wing false info would that be exactly? Please expound on what was said that was wrong and how it applies to smoke particulates. You actually had a good point right until you went off the fucking partisan rails.
What a silly post.
IF all your mask dreams were fulfilled there would be MORE particulates. IF your ass is on fire is it better to put it out or to buy asbestos underwear.
The inconvenient truth is that these are Scrooge Mcduck regions of the state burning down. Given that thieves in LA have stolen fire hydrants (ironic) to sell to junkyards, even the most burned down parts might hold something of value.
It's also a tacit admission on the part of Gavin Newsom crew that left unchecked, looting will become crisis unto itself. Newsom has many invisible reasons to make a huge public deal about protecting and rebuilding the fire ravaged areas, to the point of removing the very red tapes that caused problems like this.
The other truth is this is a pretty common action by the national guard/military during natural disasters and stopping looting is only a small part of why they do it. This isn't unique to California, it's far from unordinary behavior, there's actually some very solid, non crime, public safety reasons to have curfews and control who enters an area of a natural disaster that have nothing to do with decreasing crime and the local emergency services, including the police are usually the point agencies in charge.
Theft, vandalism, and other property crimes are wrong, and they deserve to be "punished to the fullest extent of the law,"
That's a pretty hard preaching point when D.C. itself has become the biggest THEFT/looting outfit in the nation under the excuse of [Na]tional So[zi]alist ?Justice? Warriors.
When the stated mission, to ensure Individual Liberty and Justice for all, gets lost it's surprising how fast government turns into a [WE] gangsters criminal outfit.
So according to this rag near total lockdowns in service of dubious apocalyptic predictions are perfectly fine but curfews in the face of actual disaster and looting are beyond the pale...
If you didn't parody actual views you might convert somebody.
Maybe both positions are wrong !!! Surprise.
From this I only get that you shoud be in charge of
predictions
what constitutes 'actual disaster"
and what is beyond the pale.
But ,wait !! suppose youare in Africa having a wondeful time avoiding your duties ????
But 20 instances of burglary do not justify redirecting the Guard from protecting critical firefighting infrastructure to enforcing curfews and evacuation orders.
lol, they're not there to "protect critical firefighting infrastructure". What the heck is that even supposed to mean as far as the NG is concerned?
They're there to STOP LOOTERS. Hopefully by shooting them in the face. Bonus points and commensurate pay increase if the corpse identification turns up an illegal.
For residents in areas subject to curfews, it's now illegal to leave their own homes to feed pets abandoned by neighbors.
*eyeroll*
The pets will be fine. They know to run from fire and how to forage for food when the need demands. Stop trying to play that stupid angle.
But 20 instances of burglary do not justify…
You’d have to be Cosmo stupid to believe that number. I guess it’s back to believing “official” crime stats from deep blue cities again
I remember the study
The report also highlighted that 27 of the top 30 cities with the highest murder rates as of June 2022 were run by Democratic mayors, except for Lexington, Kentucky, and Jacksonville, Florida, which are run by Republican mayors, and Las Vegas, which has an
independent mayor.
We are saying that mayor and top civil officials and governor are criminally negligent. But we feel competent to judge about NG and looting and curfews. So who voted for Newsom and Bass, two people of such obvious vain immoral self-promotion .
So you vote stupidly but become brilliant on REASON ?