New Survey Data Undermine Trump's Narrative of Rising Crime
According to Trump's preferred source, violent victimizations fell slightly in 2023, although the difference was not statistically significant.

Former President Donald Trump's campaign, which last month falsely asserted that "homicides are skyrocketing in American cities under [Vice President] Kamala Harris," subsequently switched to a more defensible claim, emphasizing the limitations of FBI crime data since it changed its reporting system in 2021. In particular, the campaign noted the sharp divergence between the FBI's 2022 numbers and the results from the National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS), which does not cover homicides but asks about other offenses. That survey's 2023 results, which the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) released last week, complicate Trump's narrative of rising violent crime.
The new numbers indicate that the violent crime victimization rate fell slightly in 2023, although the change was not statistically significant. "Findings show that there was an overall decline in the rate of violent victimization over the last three decades, from
1993 to 2023," BJS Acting Director Kevin M. Scott reports. "While the 2023 rate was higher than those in 2020 and 2021, it was not statistically different from the rate 5 years ago, in 2019."
That observation is inconvenient for Trump, who wants to blame Harris for rising crime during the Biden administration. Leaving aside the plausibility of assuming that a president, let alone a vice president, has much influence on crime rates, Trump's thesis relies on the assumption that violent crime is more common now than it was during his administration. But even according to the data source he prefers, the 2023 rate was statistically indistinguishable from the rate in 2019, his second-to-last year in office.
The NCVS did record a statistically significant drop the following year, when the violent crime victimization rate (excluding homicides) was 16.4 per 1,000 Americans 12 or older, down from 21 in 2019. The rate was 16.5 in 2021, rose to 23.5 in 2022, and fell slightly to 22.5 in 2023. No doubt Trump wants to take credit for the 2020 decrease. But by the same logic, he also should take the blame for the huge 2020 spike in homicides.
Because the NCVS includes crimes that were not reported to police, the Trump campaign argues, it presents a more accurate picture than the FBI's numbers, especially given the decline in the percentage of law enforcement agencies participating in the FBI's system since 2020. That drop in participation required the FBI to rely more heavily on estimates to account for missing data, magnifying the potential for error. But since the NCVS does not include homicides, it is not relevant to the question of whether they are in fact falling, and the downward trend reported by the FBI is broadly consistent with data from multiple sources covering various samples of cities, including AH Datalytics, the Council on Criminal Justice, and the Major Cities Chiefs Association.
When it comes to other violent crimes, however, the truth is harder to pin down. In 2020, the same year that the NCVS recorded a drop in violent crime, the FBI recorded a large increase in aggravated assaults as well as homicides. By contrast, reports of aggravated assault in the NCVS fell, although the two sources both recorded drops in robbery and rape.
In 2022, when the FBI reported an overall 2 percent decline in violent crime, the NCVS results indicated a whopping 75 percent increase. Again, the latter number does not include homicide, which according to the FBI fell by 7 percent in 2022. But it does include respondents' reports of rape, which were up 58 percent, compared to the 6 percent drop estimated by the FBI; robbery, which rose by 47 percent according to the NCVS but only 1 percent according to the FBI; and aggravated assault, which more than doubled according to the survey but fell by 2 percent in the FBI's tally.
That divergence can be only partly explained by a decline in the percentage of crimes reported to the police. According to the NCVS, 46 percent of violent victimizations were reported to police in 2021. That rate fell to 42 percent in 2022, then rose to 45 percent in 2023, according to Table 4 of the latest report.
There are other possible explanations for what happened in 2022. While the FBI's 2022 numbers covered the calendar year, for example, the 2022 NCVS asked about crimes experienced from July 1, 2021, through November 30, 2022. Including the second half of 2021, when crime rates were higher according to the FBI, may have obscured the change between that year and 2022.
What about property crime? According to the NCVS, the property crime victimization rate fell in 2021, rose in 2022, and remained essentially the same in 2023. Last year, the BJS reported, "the number of property victimizations was comparable to that in 2022 but higher than the 12.8 million in 2019." And "from 2022 to 2023, the rate of property victimization in urban areas increased from 176.1 victimizations per 1,000 households to 192.3 per 1,000."
If Trump wants to argue, based on the NCVS, that crime is still rising, he could focus on property crime in cities. But the latest survey numbers do not support the claim that property crime in general is on the rise, since the 2023 rate is statistically indistinguishable from the 2022 rate. Nor do they support the claim that violent crime is rising. And they certainly do not support the claim that "homicides are skyrocketing," which cannot be assessed based on the NCVS but is inconsistent with data from various sources in addition to the FBI.
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" . . . violent victimizations . . . "
Say what?
"While the 2023 rate was higher than those in 2020 and 2021"
Sullum, "Trumps LYING! Even if that's what the rate shows." /s
Frankly; the fact that Trump has been shot at twice in the last 8-weeks makes a point in Trumps claim.
New data show that Jacob Sullum is capable of carefully cherry picking and defining "crime" as only "violent victimizations" so as to support his TDS.
Seriously fucked up dude. We all know there's more to crime than "violent victimization". Walk through down town San Francisco and see all the boarded up store windows from smash and grabs, or how many stores in how many cities have everything locked in cages.
Also, why the fuck is this worth MULTIPLE articles? Seriously? One campaign claim, by only one of the candidates, and it's really not much of a deal either way, but it needs a story every couple of days? Aren't there much better things to write about?
Everyone who lives in any of these areas where crime is out of control can see it for themselves. Doesnt take a jOuRNaLiSt to explain it to them.
Violent crime isn't skyrocketing like Trump says? Well then let's move the goalposts to include other types of crime!
Another trust the government narrative statement from sarc. Ignore the victim survey, or just the manipulated version of it. Citizens don't know what crime is. Only the state does.
Yes, yes, the entire government is run by Democrats who are conspiring against Trump the Victim. They conspired against him in the election, they conspired against him in Springfield, and they’re conspiring against him when they compile crime stats. It’s all a Democrat conspiracy against Trump the Victim. And anyone who believes what the conspiratorial Democrats in government say is a Democrat who voted for Biden and hates Trump the Victim.
We know.
All the police departments that are reporting significant drops in homicide rates are run by Democrats? Didn't know that.
Did they contradict Trump the Victim? Yes. That means they’re Democrats, because only Democrats contradict Trump the Victim. It’s not that hard.
Well facts do have a liberal bias.
Act Blue captures another retard from Maine. Good work. What's your commission?
Nice attempt at a strawman. Try again.
Look. It's not paranoia if they really are out to get you.
The conspiracies aren't even hidden. People have campaigned on getting Trump. Look at the discrepancy in how Trump and his opponents were treated on the exact same issues (compare the documents case, where Biden was worse in every possible way: less authority, longer time period, less security).
Is it really so crazy that they got the order "Make the stats look good"? That's something a lot less egregious that explicit things that have incontrovertibly happened
Yes, what about pet eating? Where are the numbers? The government is hiding the truth from us. Thankfully we have JD Vance making up stories to bring the matter to our attention.
Pretty sure Trump’s original claim was just “US crime stats are only going up”. This would encompass all types of crime.
If you take the numbers at face value, he’s wrong (big if), but let’s not pretend that he’s only talking about violent crime.
And then there's overall change versus casual conversation.
This is a political speech, not a peer reviewed statistical essay. Anyone should read it as a casual statement.
"Crime is going up" is still true only if it's segments of crime in segments of the population. Even then, the proper response should be a "not really" or "not universally", not repeated exaggerated claims that Trump is a liar.
“the proper response should be a “not really” or “not universally”, not repeated exaggerated claims that Trump is a liar.”
TDS won’t allow them that level of nuance, it has to be straight to “Trump is the biggest liar of all time. He’s uniquely horrible compared to every other politician ever.”
San Francisco has one of the lowest homicide rates among large US cities.
Homicide is the only crime. This seems to be the consistent narrative.
Most of the people dropping dead in SF are killing themselves with fentanyl.
-jcr
Welp, with all the businesses now shuttered downtown there isn't much left to loot so there's that. the only thing is if you park your SUV anywhere in the city, it will get broken into and robbed, just ask Adam Schiff.
Multiple cities have stopped reporting statistics to the DOJ. The claim that crime is down is not substantiated. If you know the police are not going to respond to a call and even if they do the person committing the crime will have all charges dropped then people stop reporting it. What's the use?
It's much like raising the prosecution threshold for shop lifting to $999 and then claiming shoplifting is down.
Fuck off Sullum.
https://crimeresearch.org/2024/09/new-bureau-of-justice-statistics-crime-data-just-released-violent-crime-rape-robbery-and-aggravated-assault-soaring-under-biden/
Wonder why shrike and sarc skipped over this and jumped straight to crowing about homicides. Hmm...
For those of you who don’t know the kind of dishonest bullshit JesseAz posts:
The website is run by CPRC, and they and Jesse are using the same bullshit technique used by sexual assault advocates, who claim campus rape is soaring by estimating unreported rapes off a survey.
Here are the problems Jesse knows all about but declined to mention:
1. The base data that CPRC used was collected by the very same Department of Justice he claims is utterly corrupt whenever it suits him.
2. Since it’s a survey, there’s no control of whether the people checking the boxes are using the same definitions used in real crime statistics, or just their feelings on whether they've been a victim.
4. The different numbers hinge on the difference between crimes actually reported, and crimes claimed long after the fact with no police report. When someone like Christine Blasey Ford or E. Jean Carrol does this, Jesse would be quick (and correct!) to point out that it’s fishy. But now he’s basing his whole theory of crime on counting people pulling exact the same stunt.
5. Jesse and the lobbying organization have not corrected for whether people taking the survey have been biased by constantly hearing that crime is skyrocketing.
6. Even if it's real, one the most likely reasons a real victim would not go to the police is because it was criminal-on-criminal. Which is real crime but deeply undercuts the purpose of his (and CPRC's) posting, which is to keep people scared.
Are you saying the article he posted isn’t referencing “the Bureau of Justice Statistics’s National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS)”, or just that the NCVS is unreliable?
Because they seem to have used the same document that Sullum used as a rebuttal against Trumps claim.
Unreliable. Garbage in, garbage out.
Like sarc, citizens can't be trusted. Only trust government.
You dumbasses were doing the same thing with unemployment stats, where household surveys diverged from the federal numbers. Which one was closer to reality? Hint. 1M job adjustment towards household survey.
Good job Mike.
So wouldn’t that make it an unreliable source for rebutting the claims?
DemSalad straight to an ad hominem. Shocked. Good work Mike.
According to Trump's preferred source, violent victimizations fell slightly in 2023
Narrative obliterated.
And yeah, let's talk about property crime.
Yeah, property crime is WAY down...
"You got any leads or anything, man?"
Solving property crimes has been a long-known laugh line, and increasingly, a huge amount of it simply goes unreported. Especially when city officials are literally telling business owners to stop calling them and just call their insurer.
amazing water carrying going on here.
Cities stop reporting crime != crime going down.
Sullum must be wrong because according to Trumpstats® homicides are skyrocketing, and Trumpstats® is an unimpeachable source of perfect accuracy.
I mean, the actual homicide rate is not skyrocketing and it is a lie to say it is, but Trumpstats® says it is and that’s what really matters.
Facts are leftist.
The narratives you and shrike are touching sure are.
Trump says crime is up? Let's remove crime statistics until we can find a subset that isn't. Success! Now push that narrative.
The same thing your state is doing with inflation data. Change which products go into the calculation. Success!
Trust government. Never educate yourself. Don't read links or watch videos just above. You're narrative is all that matters.
lol imagine carrying water this hard for the obvious anarcho-tyranny being inflicted on yourself. Extraordinary.
"Hello"
"This is 911, what is your emergency?"
"I'm being attacked by anarchist tyrants!"
"Sir, that seems self-contradictory. Are you sure they're not anarcho-syndicalists or crypto-fascists?"
"Please send an officer immediately!"
"I need to know the nature of the emergency."
"But I'm being attacked!"
"With what exactly?"
"Dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire."
Just destaff police department interfacing with citizens and you too can lower reported crime.
https://katu.com/news/katu-investigates/improvements-planned-for-portland-911-center-as-average-wait-times-hit-high-in-2021
Look at shrike go back to only looking at homicides like a good little leftist. Glad that is the only crime that exists. But hey the retard sarc backs you up lol.
Actual homicide rates are plummeting all over the US. So say most local police departments. In Philadelphia and Boston the drop is on the order of 40% to 50%. And most cities saw huge *increases* in homicide rates while Trump was President. MAGA is basically claiming the police are lying.
And yet, the anti-gun cult wants stricter gun control laws.
Charlie is a proud member of that cult.
Again. There are a few more crimes than homicides.
BLM and antifa committed numerous crimes during Trump’s presidency, often with support from Donkeys, many unreported, yet these idiots try to blame Trump.
What about rape, burglary, assault, home invasion, auto theft, shopliftging, mugging, armed and unarmed robbery, to name a few?
I mean attempted assassination is up over 200% under Biden/Harris.
Contradicting Trump = Defending Biden
Trump said crime was up. Not homicides dumdum.
But look at you switch the argument and push the preferred liberal narrative like a good soldier.
Look at the guy who spends hours a day cherry picking and misconstruing what people say get all buthurt and go on the attack when he thinks someone did that to Trump the Victim.
What's he whining about now?
Trump the Victim said crime is up, not specifically violent crime. So claiming that violent crime is down is double-leftist. It’s leftist because that’s not what Trump the Victim said, and because only leftists cite government numbers (unless they confirm what Trump the Victim said, then they're unimpeachable).
He even admits to pushing the leftist strawman and defends it. Amazing.
Also didn't bother reading the link above about the totality of crime as he defends the dem narratives. Amazing.
Totality of crime? Man, the lengths you guys go to to defend Trump the Victim are truly impressive.
Lol. Look at your boys Charlie and shrike above retard.
You jumped on their narrative. What is the only crime they are mentioning?
"New Survey Data Undermine Trump's Narrative of Rising Crime."
1. Evidently Sullum hasn't been to such paradises as Baltimore, Chicago, LA, NYC or DC.
2. Sullum believes Biden's DOJ numbers?
Really?
Then I have a bridge in Brooklyn, I'd like to sell him.
Cash only.
NYC is in fact a very safe city today. I have lived here for 23 years and there is today not a single block I would not walk down day or night.
That can't be true. The defenders of Trump the Victim say that crime has never been higher, and it's all because of illegals shipped in by Democrats. Are you contradicting them? Hope not, because that would make you a Democrat.
Hey more strawman arguments from the retard leftist narrative pusher.
https://nypost.com/2024/09/14/us-news/murders-soar-60-on-nyc-subways-nearing-record/?utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=nypost&utm_medium=social
Whoops.
How’s the subway Charlie? Decent people won’t ride it anymore.
Are you aware that it’s possible for crime to be higher in one or two cities and lower elsewhere? It would appear not.
If Sullum had any integrity he would not have reported on this survey, because reporting is the same as agreeing. He should have found a survey that made Trump the Victim look good to prove he's not a Democrat.
He would have reported on the entirety of the survey like the link posted above. The one you'll refuse to read.
I genuinely believe the reason they want to incite violence against trump is to incite counterviolence once he's offed and give them the excuses they need.
How did the Democrats react to an assassination attempt against pretty much all the top Democrats? Did they promote violence, or pass laws akin to the PATRIOT Act or when Biden got in did he write special executive orders?
How did the Democrats react to an assassination attempt against pretty much all the top Democrats? lolwut
He thinks J6 almost killed every democrat in DC.
Shrike is a retard.
It seems that Cesar Sayoc's name has vanished down the memory hole.
That was in your dream—you'll have to tell us.
Cesar Sayoc. Sent bombs to Soros, Hillary, Obama, Holder, Maxine Waters, Biden, Harris, Booker and others. Admittedly it's not clear whether he was incompetent or didn't intend the bombs to go off, but sending explosive devices certainly seems like attempted assassination.
And he's been forgotten about. I wonder why.
"he was incompetent or didn’t intend the bombs to go off"
You answered your own question.
Nah- People might have recalled after prompting that there was something about some guy and bombs that didn't go off - but in this case, it's as if he never existed.
Because there was no real threat and the story was a nothing-burger.
What Sayoc did was considered as an act of terrorism. He sent these people (essentially) an inert bomb.
Using your logic, the shooting on gabby gifford was assassination. Back then, they blamed Sarah Palin for violent rhetoric.
The democrat party has a long and illustrious history of promoting violence in response to perceived threat or injustice. How Republicans screamed "Infitada" on college campuses? In fact, they pretty much OWN political violence in this country. I came to this country in 1991 and a few years later there was a riot aimed at my people.
But you're a partisan hack, so of course you choose to be blind.
I genuinely believe that many Trump supporters want him to be assassinated because they imagine participating in a purge.
You believe that because you're a leftist retard lol.
Why don't you go back to arguing about conservative violence again.
I believe that because of Sevo and Nardz practically saying it, and you and ML’s boiling, vitriolic hatred everyone who doesn’t defend Trump.
I get it. I got caught up in talk radio hatred a decade or so ago. I was convinced that anyone who votes for Democrats is an enemy. Like they want to do me harm through government so that would justify harming them first.
Then I wised up.
I'm sure you're right. They want to incite a civil war, confident they will quickly put down the insurgents, and then they'll have their excuse for permanent martial law.
looks like the comment engine will censor any post with the word “kill” in it? edit: i guess not
cil my landlord.
The anti-gun cult believes crime is increasing.
That is their argument for common sense, sensible gun legislation.
There was actually a study a few years back showing shootings were increasing but deaths from shootings were decreasing due to better medical care.
how they gonna make Colors II with those figures?
Tell that to the people of Chicago. 393 homicides from shooting.
The anti-Democrat anti-immigrant cult believes crime is increasing…
PLEASE give this up, Jacob. We've pointed out repeatedly why you're full of shit on this. Don't be a Jeffy.
C'mon Sullum. Crime really is WAY UP. We know this because of all the Facebook posts stating that crime is way up.
When government suppresses the real information, we have to rely on other sources.
What is it with this guy - Sullum? Is he serving as the token lefty idiot?
Reason has a lot of tokens if that's the criteria.
lol cites the Gaslighting Arsons and accepts paycheck.
Jakey Jakey News Is Fakey doubles down on his selective reporting.
Let’s take the numbers at face value that they’re true. So what’s driving the perception?
Homicides: “Nine cities experienced increases, ranging from 5% in St. Louis to 26% in Buffalo.”
“But shoplifting was a different story. A crime that has received extensive attention from the media and policymakers, reported shoplifting incidents increased by 24% in 23 study cities during the first six months of 2024.”
“…while carjacking, a crime that is relatively uncommon but began to spike shortly after the onset of the pandemic, was 68% higher.”
“…more nonresidential burglaries (+14%) and more shoplifting (+10%) in the first half of 2024 compared to the first half of 2019. Motor vehicle thefts more than doubled (+66%) during that timeframe.”
These are all crimes that have a high likelihood of people actually witnessing them or their aftermath. The persistence of the perception isn’t that hard to understand given the stats.
Everything I’ve read says crime was declining prior to the lockdowns, spiked during them, and is now back on the decline.
The problem with that is that it contradicts the narrative that claims Democrats and immigrants are causing crime to dramatically go up.
So anyone who contradicts that narrative must be attacked.
Those 4 quotes are from the CCJ document that Sullum linked to. The last two paragraphs I quoted they were comparing the first part of 2024 to 2019. So those crimes, at least, do seem to be on the rise, even while other crime is supposedly falling (again, taking all the numbers at face value), thus confirming “the narrative”.
Carjacking and shoplifting have immediate, visible consequences that is going to contribute to your everyday person’s perception of the crime rate. It doesn’t help when DA’s in some of the most populous cities (and thus seen by a crap ton of people) refuse to prosecute, or even charge criminals.
Crime stats are no longer valid. They've stopped arresting people for all sorts of things and when they are forced to arrest people, they've started doing things like: Labeling black people as white when they book them so that black crime appears to be going down.
The stats for shoplifting are down because they've stop arresting shoplifters.
Drug arrests are down because they've stop arresting people openly using drugs on the street.
Indecent exposure arrests are down because they've stop arresting people for walking around naked or exposing themselves - even to children.
Do I need to go on?
When criminal acts become normalized the liberals will claim crime is down.
Even when some child molesting trans pedo targets your child.
"According to Trump's preferred source, violent victimizations fell slightly in 2023, although the difference was not statistically significant."
To those not being TDS-addled shit-piles like Sullum, "crime" has a bit larger definition.
The leading cause of fatal violent crime for minors in America is gun violence. The GOP obsession of letting any crazy person buy a weapon of war is the cause. In Trump's case, both scenarios were white citizens who took advantage of lax gun buyer laws in open carry states with no red flag laws. So violent gun crime will not go down with a Trump Presidency, it will likely get worse as it did last time. Violent offenders, addicts and people on psychiatric drugs should not posses or be allowed to buy guns. Those selling them or giving them guns need to be held accountable.
Fuck off, slaver.
Why?
Fuck off and die, slaver.
So where do these individuals get their firearms? Not from an authorized dealer. They are stolen, bought illegally or handed to them.
Furthermore the main problem is gang related although there are plenty of idiots out there willing to murder just about anyone that irritates them.
Even though as federal government agencies routinely have a habit of cooking the books such as related to the economy, Jacob Sullum wants us to believe that the very FBI that assisted in perpetrating multiple Russia Hoax's is above board related to crime statistics.
The reality is that prices are higher and more of the average citizens wages go to needs versus wants. In many areas crime is bad and is not the rosy picture that the Current Vice President Kamala Harris is running away from pretending that she is not part of the current regime.
I don't trust Trump.
I don't trust the Kamala Harris machine
I don't trust the corporate media.
I don't trust the FBI or a majority of our federal agencies.
I believe that the corporate media, the Kamala Harris machine, and elements of our federal agencies are threatened by the presence of Donald Trump. As these groups stoop lower and lower, bypassing rules and morality because they believe that anything is justified to take down Trump, they become the embodiment of what they claim that Trump is.
In reality Trump is just a mediocre populist politician and was a mediocre. Trump is was not the ultimate disaster that Biden is, but is and was not the second coming of Hitler as he is often portrayed. Vice President Kamala Harris should not be re-elected and likewise neither should Donald Trump be elected.
I wonder how many times Reason will write the same article? This is the third or fourth iteration of it in the last few weeks, I think.
Reminds me of those YouTube videos showing 13 different network reporters repeating the exact same lines word for word.
Independent media probably was washed away with "Journalism Grants".
LOL.
"The
beatingsassassination attempts will continue untilmoraleyour political narrative on violent crime improves." - Jacob SullumChicago to date:
Shot and killed: 393
Shot and wounded: 1855
Total Shot: 2248
Total Homicides: 446
This week in progress:
Shot and killed:6
Shot and wounded: 32
https://cwbchicago.com/2024/09/hes-the-25th-person-charged-with-killing-or-trying-to-kill-someone-in-chicago-this-year-while-having-a-felony-case-pending.html
Total shot: 38
Total Homicides: 6
More than twenty homicides during the DNC's week of joy and progress.
Crime up, crime down, crime up ... But crickets about the suicidal slaughter of young black males by other young males continues in our cities -- roughly 5,000 a year or 150,000 in the last 30 years. https://clips.substack.com/p/2023-another-year-of-slaughter-for?utm_source=publication-search
You aren't this stupid, right sullum?
All police departments are still reporting crime stats?
The first sentence of this article FLAT OUT LIES about what source Trump relies on.