TikTok Goes From Silly to Serious
The Chinese app has become a magnet for every possible cultural concern.

"Most sectors of the economy are a conspiracy between the big incumbents and their punitive regulators," venture capitalist and software engineer Marc Andreessen tells Reason this month (page 48). Asked to identify pockets of relative freedom and competition, he offers what he calls "the cynical answer": There's still innovation "in the spaces that don't matter. Anybody can bring a new toy to market. Anybody can open a restaurant."
Social media is the latest industry to transition from a free, fun space that "doesn't matter" to a sector the state deems too important to be left to the market. At first, the justifications for intervention were numerous and rapidly shifting: Early calls to regulate or break up Facebook and Twitter were often framed as concerns about exclusion from speech in the public square or the spread of misinformation. (Largely absent from this argument was any acknowledgment that these are private companies or that, as it turns out, the government was pressuring those companies to do some of the very exclusions and misinformation peddling that the government promised to remedy.) Another strong contender for concern was the sheer size of the firms, which could open the door for antitrust action. And then there's the ongoing debate over whether the costs to teen mental health are so high and age verification so difficult that perhaps access to social media should be limited or eliminated for everyone.
Those regulatory efforts continue apace, but their appeal has paled in contrast to a shiny new target.
After a variety of feints at Facebook and Twitter, Congress has found fertile ground for political point scoring with TikTok. Once dismissed as the home of silly dance videos, TikTok became a magnet for every possible cultural concern as it grew in popularity. After alarmists tried worrying about political extremism, viral pranks, and the normalization of twerking, a bipartisan coalition settled around a dominant bogeyman: China.
Several bills have been introduced to counter the Red Menace that TikTok allegedly represents. The RESTRICT Act, which has the most momentum at press time, is written so vaguely that it could potentially make illegal all manner of online entanglement "between persons in the United States and foreign adversaries" such as China, Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Russia, and Venezuela. The bill also allows the secretary of commerce to expand this new digital axis of evil "in consultation with the Director of National Intelligence" as well as giving that official wide latitude to "identify, deter, disrupt, prevent, prohibit, investigate, or otherwise mitigate…any risk arising from any covered transaction by any person, or with respect to any property" that the secretary determines to pose "an undue or unacceptable risk."
The bill provides for civil penalties of up to "$250,000 or an amount that is twice the value of the transaction that is the basis of the violation" and criminal penalties of up to 20 years in prison. While the RESTRICT Act's authors claim these penalties would not be applied to casual American TikTok users, they also say that anyone "interfering in, or altering the result" of a federal election would potentially be covered. Given the ever-expanding definition of election interference, users might be forgiven for feeling wary about online political speech in that environment.
Restricting the use of a platform that facilitates speech sounds constitutionally dubious to begin with, and police powers to enforce such restrictions will not be easy to contain once unleashed. Attempts to control or ban TikTok follow an unfortunately increasingly common pattern, in which lawmakers acknowledge that their plans are likely unconstitutional but decide to shoot their shot anyway and let the courts decide later—the legislative equivalent of "kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out."
Many of the risks posed by TikTok's relationship with China sound serious, but are hypothetical or too narrowly defined. Lawmakers say they are concerned about the ways Chinese ownership puts American users at risk of having their data collected and shared with the Chinese government. Similar concerns have been raised about American-owned social media platforms such as Facebook and Twitter, and there is currently a robust secondary market in such data, so the focus on foreign ownership seems to be a red herring.
Opposition to TikTok may be based on a false political premise: Cracking down on TikTok may seem to Congress like a cheap way to signal toughness on China. But like the dog that manages to catch the car, legislators may end up with more than they bargained for if they actually shut down the app in the U.S., with millions of disproportionately young users inclined to be outraged when their favorite toy is taken away.
TikTok is still a relatively new player in the social media world, and its distinctive features may be unfamiliar and intimidating to some lawmakers. This was evidenced by a March hearing in which some congressmen made embarrassingly uninformed comments about the app.
Three different representatives called the social media app "Tic Tac" at the hearing, suggesting that this Congress is not well-suited to parse technical questions. Congress, like the nation as a whole, has been steadily aging since the 1980s, and it is now the most elderly it has ever been. The median age in the Senate is 65.3 years old. In the House, it's 57.8.
The RESTRICT Act, as its authors don't hesitate to admit, is designed to force a sale of TikTok to an American company, not to ban the app. But its dramatic constraints borrow from a playbook perfected by China itself, which currently bans Facebook, Instagram, WhatsApp, Google, YouTube, Twitter, Snapchat, Tumblr, Pinterest, Slack, Twitch, Discord, Dropbox, Quora, Wikipedia, and SoundCloud—in other words, nearly everything that makes the American internet novel and interesting.
In China, there are tight constraints even on the domestic version of TikTok, including time limits on kids' use, and much of the platform is cluttered with propaganda.
It's perfectly reasonable to limit how much time children spend on social media. But only if they are your own children. None of this has stopped the state of Utah from passing a law imposing similar limits, which will also face legal challenges going forward. We will not beat China—if "beating China" is even an appropriate goal—by becoming more like China.
"The road to hell is paved with good intentions," notes Andreessen, describing an eternal hopefulness that this time policy makers might craft "very carefully calibrated, well-thought-through, rational, reasonable, effective regulation." He then smashes that hope. "We don't get the abstract theoretical regulation, we get the practical, real-world regulation….Regulatory capture. Corruption. Early incumbent lock-in. Political capture. Skewed incentives."
Regardless of how this plays out, relatively unfettered online markets have already lost. Social media have been dragged, kicking and screaming, out of the zone of the economy that enjoys benign neglect from lawmakers, regulators, and security hawks, and into the sphere of industries deemed critical infrastructure, central to national security, or possible intelligence risks. At best, TikTok will emerge from this battle cowed and cautious—exactly the opposite of what we want in our social media. And then a new competitor will rise in its place to panic the policy makers once again.
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The concern about data collection is silly because people live in a world of big data and their personal data is being collected and sold constantly. The only thing the Chinese government would be doing is eliminating the middleman, by collecting data directly rather than buying it on the secondary market.
Manipulating people by content is a more interesting question, but that is always the problem with media. If you argue that Russian influence in elections is minimal can you really say that Chinese influence is more significant. Manipulating people is a big business, it is called advertising, or the news, or something else. What is needed is not to ban Tik Tok but rather to hardness are mind to manipulation. In the same way people need to be defensive drivers on the road, they need to be defensive in looking at things on the screen.
In the same way people need to be defensive drivers on the road, they need to be defensive in looking at things on the screen.
In the same way being defensive driving isn’t the only key to successful driving, interstates with billboards in the middle of lanes, overrun with undercover officers, chock full of FBI speed traps, with privately operated, government-regulated checkpoints at every on and off ramp should be generally avoided if not actively prevented.
What information can the eeeeeeeevil Chinese get from TikTok that they can't just buy from Facebook, Instagram, YouTube...?
I was talking about roadways being, publicly and privately, mismanaged to the point of being unfit for purpose and not disintegrating under their own weight fast enough. If you've got a problem with the eeeeeeeevil Chinese, you should be more clear about your specific indictments.
This has been coming for years. For all recorded history the elite have manufactured and maintained the human culture of censorship and propaganda to solidify their entitlements of wealth and power.
The internet and social media happened too fast for their decentralized selfish interests to coordinate a response and maintain the illusion of free speech. It is the equivalent of their pandemic.
You will be masked UNLESS we force our government to recognize that the internet aka social media is a public place, our town square, where our freedom of speech is GUARANTEED constitutionally.
The is the ONLY solution at this point.
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Kids these days with their TikToks and bell bottoms and their jazz music, amirite? I say just ban it all, make everybody just shut the hell up so I can get 5 minutes of peace and quiet around here. And get off my lawn, you tree-hugging, dope-smoking, granola-munching, dirty, smelly hippies!
YEAH!! You tell them!! (Great post!)
If you’re looking for the place to stop taking KMW seriously:
Early calls to regulate or break up Facebook and Twitter were often framed as concerns about exclusion from speech in the public square or the spread of misinformation. (Largely absent from this argument was any acknowledgment that these are private companies or that, as it turns out, the government was pressuring those companies to do some of the very exclusions and misinformation peddling that the government promised to remedy.)
Katy, to act like, at this point in the game, *nobody* replied to “MUH PRIVATE KORPORASHUNZ!” by pointing out that the companies were essentially facilitated at the bedrock level by S230 protections, founded and operated with government money, were staffed by former party members Soviet Union-style, and refused to carry stories of specific ideological interest to conceal is beyond Boomer-levels of out of touch.
The Conspiracy Theorists weren’t right enough, so far, for your libertarian sensibilities? Cram your “libertarian” propaganda up your ass sideways.
Edit: "as it turns out" - Fucking LOL. Even now that it's *known* that the most prolific censorship and propaganda campaign in American history *thus far* was 110% true, KMW's take is "Mostly true." 'As it turns out' McCarthy may've silenced some dissenters, but nobody acknowledges some of his supporters were private actors. What. A. Fucking. Joke.
FFS, 1.1 million people died while they were deciding between mask vs. no mask propaganda vs. silence relatively large groups of renowned, licensed dissenters on whichever day ended in ‘y’. Despite hard evidence that they did so fully knowingly and at levels beyond even their own projected levels of amoral incompetence and nobody has stood in front of a single jury for it… and Reason, as it turns out, seems to be not just dismissive of, but slanderous of "conspiracy theorists" in favor of it? Fuck that.
No one remembers the conspiracy theories that were wrong.
I don't even know what to make of this statement. Proving KMW hasn't reached peak detachment from all reality, I guess.
You guys have hundreds of conspiracy theories and a few turned out to be right. You guys belittle those who didn’t buy into the few that were right, while still believing in hundreds that are still wrong. Then you lecture others about being detached from reality? Please.
Which ones turned out to be wrong sarc?
You justifying why YOU were wrong is all this post is.
Post your list.
This is your problem. You have mental issues that disallow you to admit to being wrong even when glaringly wrong. You pretend to be justified morally and intellectually for being wrong. Every fucking time. Then you attempt to attack those that were right.
So post your examples. Back up your glaringly bald assertions.
Also more you statements which you claim to hate and never do. Admit you’re a hypocrite while you’re at it.
Your entire post is detached from reality.
Which ones turned out to be wrong sarc?
Even wrong or not clearly correct ones, not necessarily advocated by the same people who argued suppressing COVID and Hunter Biden information was a no-shit government cover up, are still remembered. I've mentioned it before, my kids understand the meaning and context of 'the missing 18.5 min.' without anybody sitting down to make sure they learned it or understood its specific meaning. Even ChatGPT can give a relevant rundown, auspiciously tabula rasa.
Nice how dipshit switches the burden of proof. That's one of the uncountable reasons to ignore the dishonest piece of garbage.
One major difference between conspiracy theorists and non-conspiracy theorists is that the latter can change their minds as the known facts evolve.
You made a bald assertion. Burden of proof is on you retard.
Nice how dipshit switches the burden of proof.
JesseAz didn't impose any demand or burden of proof of anything. If you read an imposition of a burden of proof into my comment to him, it's you imposing your own burden of proof.
Which ones turned out to be wrong sarc?
That's the definition of switching the burden of proof. Conspiracies have no proof. Demanding proof that something without proof is wrong is, well, moronic. I expect it from JesseAz. I thought you were smarter than that.
edited)
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You guys have hundreds of conspiracy theories and a few turned out to be right.
You made the bald assertion retard.
I thought you were smarter than that.
Ah, so in my reply to him actually refuting his imposition, you replied about him with a vague euphemism. My fault for not being able to keep up with all the people, real or imagined, that you assert being the victim of.
Accepting the parts of reality that can be independently verified as true while rejecting those that cannot is more generally recognized as cognition.
Further, being meta-cognitive, humans generally recognize that other humans, or themselves, don't actually or always erase The Steele Dossier, Jet fuel melting steel beams, or Second Gunmen from their consciousness, they just consider and variously categorize them with regard to veracity and contextual pertinence.
Again, this is true even at the basal level of AI and Turing Machines. Maybe you strive to be less generally cognitive or intelligent than idle hard drive of your nearest Flat Earther but, even then, that doesn't mean everyone else does.
Conspiracy theorists see a lack of evidence as proof that they are correct. On the rare times when evidence emerges to show them to be correct, many who didn’t buy the theory before will actually change their minds. For that they get attacked, mocked and belittled by the true believers who say they should have believed without evidence. Then the true believers accuse those of us who want proof to be akin to Flat Earthers. Oh the irony…
Like vaccines and masks working?
Like there is no censorship on social media?
Like trump russia?
Like cleanest elections ever?
Like quarantine camps including those not infected are just fine?
Like J6 defendants committed an insurrection?
Like lockdowns worked?
Like Biden is a moderate?
Like Biden cut the deficit?
For that they get attacked, mocked and belittled by the true believers who say they should have believed without evidence.
Nope. They're getting mocked and belittled because empirical evidence in support of limited claims was provided and dismissed, repeatedly until now that overwhelming evidence in direct support of the bulk of claims is available for all to see, they passively assert an even more preposterous conspiracy-theory-within-a-theory the way Young Earthers argue things like the devil putting dinosaur bones into the rocks to deceive mankind.
People who were actually interested in dialog and changing minds don’t attack people who change their minds. Which tells me you are in no way interested in convincing people. You’re just an asshole.
Changing ones mind requires one to admit they were wrong prior. Instead you declared those who looked at the evidence and came to a conclusion as conspiracy theorists. You do again in this thread. No where did you admit you were wrong. You actually instead attacked those who were right. That is the issue dum dum.
Is this where you deride all the commenters who pointed out that this was a massive state/corporate/ngo censorship industrial complex facilitated by a revolving door of deep-state apparatchiks inside the hallowed halls of private corporations, a lab leak that turned out to be a lab leak, masks that were mere talismans (despite Jacob Sullum's protestations to the contrary), that they were in fact going to come after our gas stoves, the vaccines were neither effective nor 100% safe, that the Steele Dossier was horseshit, that the federal government as directed by the Obama administration spied on an opposition presidential campaign, that the Hunter Biden Laptop was in fact a Hunter Biden Laptop-- and then conflate that with *checks notes* microchips in vaccines-- and continue to refer to this last-in-the-list duct-taped-together group of commenters as "you guys"?
Yes.
Catch your breath yet?
Too many assertions. I’ve changed my mind on a lot of what you mentioned, though a lot of it still bull. I’m not going to respond point by point. Let your imagination fill in what you think I believe. Pretty sure you’ll do that regardless of what I say so it would be wasted effort on my part.
No need for point-by-point. If you believe anything in my list before microchips in vaccines is a conspiracy theory, you're wrong.
The I guess I'm wrong.
None of those are assertions and the receipts have been provided multiple times over the last several years.
Still no specifics. Still you claiming anyone who was right prior to you changing your mind were conspiracy theorists.
Kmw is a retarded. It takes about 4 sentences of this shit article to figure that out
Not even retarded, evil. 2-3 yrs. ago wrt to COVID, both as a phenomenon or artifact and as a news/information topic, “as it turns out” was applicable. Now, it’s borderline ‘as it turns out Hitler may’ve killed some people and covered it up’, Holocaust-denial-level stupidity.
+1
Twit KMW is a bought and paid for shill impervious to reason.
relatively unfettered online markets have already lost. Social media have been dragged, kicking and screaming, out of the zone of the economy that enjoys benign neglect from lawmakers, regulators, and security hawks
Social media isn't an online market. Facebook *begged* to be regulated. The space of advertising to consumers is not a market. Consumers *never* say "I'd buy more magazines if they had more ads." or "I'd pay more for cable or streaming TV if it had more ads." or "I'd do more Google searches if they put more paid promotion links at the top." The opposite is and was true, consistently. Me telling you "You should drink more Bud Light because they support diversity." isn't a market action, especially if I'm doing it unpaid because somebody else told me I should support diversity.
KMW’s take is “Mostly true.”
Needs context.
Amazing how the government can get Americans, especially conservatives, to drop to their knees and beg to have freedom taken away simply by invoking the China Boogeyman.
One of the biggest purveyors of Trump russia projects.
especially conservatives. Especially!!!
Especially amazing. Yes. Because they're supposed to be smarter than that.
I actually find it really entertaining that even in the geo-political landscape, Americans have to factionalize. The right has deemed China the main enemy of the west while the left continues to push Russia in that role.
I mean, we've become so divided that we can't even agree on foreign enemies anymore. I remember back in the day when at least we could all agree on what country to wrongly invade.
...but not a food truck, since we've seen articles about incumbent restaurants conspiring with their regulators...
Reason writers, once again, breathlessly writing "anyone can open a restaurant" while "NY State Bans Gas Stoves" sits at the top of their current edition and in the same week "Home Based Bakers Shouldn't Have To Choose Between Pets And Business" graced their landing page.
It’s like Reason is out of touch with even it’s own presented reality, let alone the fascist oligarchy within which they reside.
(Edit) I mean the US federal government is a fascist oligarchy for clarification if needed. Not sure if everyone is looking at reality correctly yet. We can pretend that the anarchic individual nature of human beings still accomplishing trades is free markets, but why bother. The regulatory set up has landed us in fascism. Winners and losers picked everyday.
The guy quoted is also a venture capitalist, so when he says "anybody," he means "anybody with enough money and lawyers to navigate the regulations." These spaces don't matter to him, but they DO matter to the people trying to open the restaurant or food truck, else they wouldn't be doing it...
Like how the Rundown mentions TikTok banning anyone who shows clips of the Jimmy Lao documentary? Totally not run by China!
Here is a great example of how silly TicToc is now being used for the purposes of "cultural warfare;" one present said this was the most dangerous situation they have ever been in:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p83X2JvgTLw
Tick tok is a chink psy opp. If you think that's okay or good move your cunt self to bejing
>>At best, TikTok will emerge from this battle cowed and cautious
I look forward to the 80s-style montage of TikTok retreating to the mountains and taking on arduous programs of San Da and Shaolin Kung Fu
The RESTRICT Act, which has the most momentum at press time, is written so vaguely that it could potentially make illegal all manner of online entanglement "between persons in the United States and foreign adversaries" such as China, Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Russia, and Venezuela.
Is there a section 230 buried in it?
Breaking: Dee Snyder (yes, he's still around) just got dropped from San Francisco's pride parade because he agreed with Paul Stanley in saying that we shouldn't rush to start cutting parts off kids while they're trying to figure things out.
I don't know who this Offspring Guitarist is, but he's clearly retarded. Like in need of homecare and special needs education retarded.
Response from "right-wing media" and criticism from *checks article* "others".
There are two sides to this issue of cutting off the dicks of 9 yr olds:
Right-wing media and everyone else.
>>Stanley, “who wore high-heels, makeup, & teased up hair his whole career,” questioning gender-affirming care.
lol wholly misinterpret KISS there, Noodles
Noodles is a combination of oblivious retard and sexism, rolled into one dim-witted package.
Edit: I can’t help but imagining *checks article* Noodles smirking, thinking he “Pwned” Paul Stanley and immediately high-fived his band mates upon making such a completely disconnected-from-human-reality remark.
The guy, supposedly, got into the band because he was old enough to buy alcohol. My imagination has him going up top only to be conspicuously left hanging. And I don't think it's entirely my imagination either, they don't appear subtle.
There is no doubt that we as a society love our boogeymen.
I don’t know about Tik Tok. I do know that shining path Maoists are trying to rewrite the constitution and collapse Peru in real time. I do know that Brazil is now the CCPs little lap dog. I do know that our borders are open, and all of a sudden, school districts are completely out of fucking control. It’s chaos. The department of education and teachers unions need to know that the hand that feeds them isn’t Xi, it’s free market capitalism. It might be a real national security concern judging by the Peru terrorists.
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