Sotomayor Grills Government Lawyer Over Law 'Criminalizing Words Related to Immigration'
The Supreme Court justice seemed willing to invalidate the federal law on First Amendment grounds.
The U.S. Supreme Court heard oral arguments yesterday in United States v. Hansen, a case that asks whether a federal law that criminalizes the act of encouraging or inducing unlawful immigration violates the First Amendment. In the run-up to the oral arguments, free speech advocates lined up overwhelmingly against the law, with the Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression, the Cato Institute, and the Electronic Frontier Foundation among the groups who filed amicus briefs urging the law's invalidation. Alas, judging by the tenor of the oral arguments, a majority of the Court seemed disinclined to adopt that sort of broad free speech stance in this case.
At least one justice, however, did seem quite open to overruling the law as an overbroad restriction that violated freedom of speech. "Under this statute," observed Justice Sonia Sotomayor, "we're criminalizing words related to immigration. And I thought there were only certain statutes that were immune to First Amendment challenges," such as laws governing "obscenity" or "fighting words," she said. "Otherwise, everything else is subject to the First Amendment and strict scrutiny. So why should we uphold a statute that criminalizes words?"
Sotomayor then pressed Principal Deputy Solicitor General Brian Fletcher to explain whether the federal government's position would criminalize speech by U.S. citizens who tell their unlawfully present family members they are welcome to live with them. What about "the grandmother who lives with her family who's illegal," Sotomayor asked. "The grandmother tells her son she's worried about the burden she's putting on the family, and the son says, Abuelita, you are never a burden to us. If you want to live here—continue living here with us, your grandchildren love having you….Can [the government] prosecute this?"
Fletcher started to say, "I think not," when Sotomayor swiftly cut him off. "Stop qualifying with 'think,'" the justice told the government lawyer, "because the minute you start qualifying with 'think,' then you're rendering asunder the First Amendment." In other words, in the face of a broadly written law that seemingly criminalizes all sorts of lawful speech, why should anybody trust the government to act leniently?
This statute "criminalizes words," Sotomayor stressed yet again. "Shouldn't we be careful before we uphold that kind of statute?"
It was exactly the right question to ask. Regrettably, Sotomayor may soon find herself writing the right answer in dissent.
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Typical woman. Ignore facts for feelings.
The damn law says you can't encourage staying FOR YOUR OWN PROFIT.
You can tell family members, or even friends to stick around with no problem (except maybe an overeager DA or two). A charity can feed everyone.
What you can't do is go to the border and pick up a truck load of illegals to staff your factory and tell them it's OK to say.
FIRE, Cato and the EFF are not known for mistaking "facts for feelings". Based on their briefs, they don't seem to find the limitation in the law that you are alleging above. In fact, the Cato brief calls out that the profit-motive clause is a sentencing enhancement factor, not a limitation on the law itself.
Read the transcript of yesterday's oral argument. Even the DoJ is arguing that speech unrelated to a profit motive can trigger this law. Some of those examples do put family members, friends and charities at risk.
Hansen committed fraud. And ought to be prosecuted for that fraud. But the fact that Hansen's a bad guy doesn't justify this law.
(ii) an offense done for the purpose of commercial advantage or private financial gain, or
Yes, you've successfully quoted the sentence enhancement clause of the law. That clause takes the maximum penalty (not including fines) up from 1 year imprisonment to 10 (or 15 depending on circumstances). That clause does not make non-commercial behavior into a non-crime. The definition of the crime in 8 § 1324 (a)(1)(A)(iv) is not changed by that clause.
The irony is that it criminalizes encouraging something that isn't even a crime. Simply being in the US illegally is a violation, not even a misdemeanor.
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Unlawful presence is a categorical crime, and if you enter under false pretense or with false documentation you've also committed fraud and identity theft. You should try getting your talking points from a DNC PDF that was published less than 18 years ago.
It’s a crime. Specifically, it violates ‘8 U.S. Code § 1325 - Improper entry by alien’.
The irony is that it criminalizes encouraging something that isn’t even a crime.
"8 U.S. Code § 1325 - Improper entry by alien
(a)Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection; misrepresentation and concealment of facts
Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both."
That sure sounds like a crime, doesn't it?
That’s part of the law. The part at issue for being overly broad is:
iv) encourages or induces an alien to come to, enter, or reside in the United States, knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such coming to, entry, or residence is or will be in violation of law
Damn, Tom Delonge, SETI, and half the History Channel can be prosecuted
Not to mention the entire city of Roswell, NM.
Hey now! She’s a ‘wise Latina’. Whatever the fuck that’s supposed to mean.
It means she's out of step. Everyone knows it should be wise Latinks.
Picking people up at the border in a truck is not speech. Wouldathunk that was obvious.
That's already covered, anyway.
8 U.S. Code § 1324 - Bringing in and harboring certain aliens
(ii)knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that an alien has come to, entered, or remains in the United States in violation of law, transports, or moves or attempts to transport or move such alien within the United States by means of transportation or otherwise, in furtherance of such violation of law;
It's a crime to knowingly employ #IllegalAliens, bring them to the US, induce them to come or remain in the US, transport them, and conceal, harbor, or shield them from detection.
8 U.S. Code § 1324 - Bringing in and harboring certain aliens https://liicr.nl/2J1fUo9
This statute "criminalizes words," Sotomayor stressed yet again. "Shouldn't we be careful before we uphold that kind of statute?"
Hey, words are violence, doncha know?
Ackshully, "pistols at dawn" could quickly reduce the number of Trumpanzee sockpoopettes around here, and that may be the reason none of the brave girl-bulliers stand up for practical 1A +2A exercise of rights à la Lysander Spooner. The Texas Totalitarian Constitution is many times normal length in part because the first chapters make sure nobody can challenge its bought politicians, judges or bureaucrats to try conclusions on the field of honor.
How’s that advancing senility treating you? Have you gone full Hihn yet? When you get to Hell, tell him I said ‘hi’.
I really hope that if I ever end up as senile as Hank or Hihn, and you guys do me the favor of letting me know it's time to kill myself, I won't be so far gone that I don't listen.
Though I'm not sure that actually is Hank. That's "carriage return libertariantranslator space space space space space" according to the unmute dialogue. I was curious what had brought about such a virulent response.
I’ve been to his website. This is how he talks.
https://libertariantranslator.wordpress.com/who-is-hank-phillips/
Eat Drano.
I'll meet you any place in the contiguous United States Hanky. Not a joke, so don't run you cockholster unless you fucking mean it. Put up or shut you worthless Nazi piece of shit. Make it pistols or anything you like - I'm happy to accommodate whatever manner of death you like. Again, not a joke. Name the address, the date, and the weapon. I will be there.
You're probably extremely short.
If so, he'll be sad if Nuthouse Hank picks sledgehammers in six feet of water.
My innocuous post generated your reply which generated a bit of a thread, so I unmuted you to see what all the fuss was about. Ok, so you are insane, and I am reminded of why I muted you in the first place.
So what about encouraging people to commit murder or rape?
You mean *Illegal* murder or *Illegal* rape or are you just trying to criminalize any word related to regular murder or regular rape (, you bigot)?
Well what I was getting at is how do we apply such standards to those crimes.
Yes, The "Wise Latina" seemed to omit what is another of those "speaking" illegalities - conspiracy - which seems to fit into what this statute prohibits.
What I was getting at is Sotomayor is a terrible Justice. A bleeding heart telegraphing her bias and ruling on emotion. If you want the law struck down, she isn't your champion. If you want the ruling reversed later, she's your justice.
The term is *illegal* immigration. Nobody's criminalizing, "Get a job, get a work Visa, come hang out. It'll be great." Words related to immigration aren't being criminalized any more than words related to sex are being criminalized when we convict a group of people for conspiracy to commit rape. The specific part of the term, "illegal", the term that it's her job to address, she's brushing aside in the typical agitprop fashion. Along with "Abuelita" below, she's telegraphing.
We aren't going to get a rule clarifying what exactly does and does not constitute "conspiracy to immigrate illegally". We're going to get what feels right for one specific kind of immigrants that everybody supports until it gets applied to a different kind of immigrant or illegal immigration activity that everybody hates. Then it will be, "That's not what we meant!"
"How To Retire Early Running a Ring of Coyotes" or "How To Get Rich Forging Passports and Influencing Elections on Twitter" will be the speech the "Wise Latina" never saw coming because she's got Ninos and Abuelitas dancing in her head.
I think it is Ok if there is a WOODCHIPPER involved.
Nope. Marquis de Queensbury rules do not allow those.
I would be perfectly fine beating Marxists to death with my bare hands.
Generally permissible. The bar for a "true threat" or incitement is very high.
Thank you.
So encouraging someone who wants to illegally immigrate would qualify as similar to “true threat” would it not?
America is great, everyone should come here
Vs
Heard you want to cross illegally, here is how to avoid the BP, here are maps, etc.
Solicitation includes encouraging someone to break the law. Although it suggests a specific person not undirected, general encouragement.
https://www.justia.com/criminal/offenses/inchoate-crimes/solicitation/
And specifically for violence.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/373
"(a)Whoever, with intent that another person engage in conduct constituting a felony that has as an element the use, attempted use, or threatened use of physical force against property or against the person of another in violation of the laws of the United States, and under circumstances strongly corroborative of that intent, solicits, commands, induces, or otherwise endeavors to persuade such other person to engage in such conduct, shall be imprisoned..."
You mean like commenters here?
You're fortunate waving a PANIC flag isn't illegal, asshole.
Wasn't some woman jailed for encouraging someone to commit suicide?
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Yes. It was covered extensively on Reason. There was even a docudrama made about the case,
I said she shouldn't go to jail back then and still stand by that.
Austin's Uranium Savages would all be in jail if the rednecks could make THAT stick. As it is, making fun of Houston PD murderers got the Kleptocracy to find a judge to order a whole stack of their "Live at Soap Creek Saloon" albums burned. This is am honor the Klan usually reserves for them furrin' Beatles! Every libertarian owes George Majewsky a vote of thanks for creating that libertarian venue.
Yes, but what of the spoiler votes, hank? Don’t hold out on us, buddy!
And what of Comstock? And all those stolen LP planks?
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This statute "criminalizes words," Sotomayor stressed yet again. "Shouldn't we be careful before we uphold that kind of statute?"
Oh my god you Obama appointee! We are at war! We're being invaded by a Latin horde! The Constitution doesn't matter when you're at war!
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We’re being invaded by a Latin horde!
The always play salsa music just before they attack.
"La Cucaracha, La Cucaracha,
El no puede caminar!
Por que no tiene, por que le falta,
Marijuana que fumar!"
Judy Garland sang that on film in 1935. Bert Hoover appointee Harry Anslinger put her on the "make it look like suicide" list right away quick-like. http://bit.ly/3M2g6rx
Well with that voice you kinda can't blame him.
You make history come alive, hank.
You saw that one in first release at a movie theater, didn’t you?
Spanish
La cucaracha, la cucaracha,
ya no puede caminar
porque no tiene, porque le falta
marihuana que fumar.
English
The cockroach, the cockroach,
can't walk any more
because it doesn't have, because it's lacking
marijuana to smoke.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Cucaracha
Wanting, as in respect for the Bill of Rights is wanting among politicians these days, as it was in those.
Thanks for the translation bro! JESUS CHRIST IT'S EVEN FUNNIER NOW! CAN YOU BELIEVE NOBODY BESIDES YOU EVER HEARD LA CUCARACHA BEFORE?!?!?!?! I HAVEN'T LAUGHED THIS HARD SINCE THE 832ND TIME I WATCHED MEAN GIRLS!
My Spanish is rusty. Don't know the difference between why and because.
Why is two words and because is one.
You don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigration or what a Cuban sandwich is, so don't sweat it. It's not like you need to speak Spanish in a state that's 95% and doesn't have any spics with their ethnic cuisine, right drunky?
He also hasn’t figured out ‘ad hominem’.
I Shazam music when I'm at the Fryeburg Fair. The Mexicans running the rides blast some cool shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=na9HK2ntfiA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj1I2LmPgQ8
Man that's some sick spic mumble rap! You're so hip and with it, sarcasmic! Totally down with those records the kids are spinning!
Brief reminder that sarcasmic lives in a state that's 95% white and claimed he never heard of Cuban sandwiches despite being a professionally trained gourmet chef because there's no spics in Maine.
Brief reminder that sarcasmic supports nuclear engagement with Russia on behalf of a kleptocratic totalitarian shit hole with no-shit Nazis in the government and conscription for 60 year old men.
This statute "criminalizes words," Sotomayor stressed yet again. "Shouldn't we be careful before we uphold that kind of statute?"
Shouldn't we be careful about the definition of "words"? Are displaying a Confederate flag or wearing a T-shirt with a fetus image considered "words"?
I used to work with a guy who got fired for displaying a "Kill a Queer Fetus for Jesus!" sticker on his truck in response to the hiring of a gay manager.
Honestly, I'm surprised Reason didn't do a 4500 word article on it.
Maybe they did. It was in 1995. Way before I'd heard of the magazine.
Now I remember his other sticker: "Smoke Crack and Worship Satan!"
I don't think he was trying to make friends.
especially since christians are generally against abortion - looks more like he was trying to conflict his christian coworkers with that first one.
Generally permissible.
While the CRA says an employer can't punish you for your religion, it does not say that your employer must tolerate harassing behavior.
Which would be relevant if a bumper sticker on someone's car was actually harassing behavior, but you knew that. Your wittle faggot feewings being hurt doesn't constitute harassment you AIDS-riddled little bitch.
Meh. Now, "Nuke The Baby Seals!" THEM's fightin' woids in Austin!
"Discourage Inbreeding - Ban Country Music!"
Hmmm….. I wonder what we could come up with to mock other genres?
“Discourage Pimping and Illiteracy - Ban Rap!”
"Discourage sarcasmic from soliciting blowjobs from Tulpa in the men's room of a shitty local concert venue - Ban Ministry!"
Cool story bro. Was he one of the Michelin starred chefs you trained with, or was that when you were doing your graduate studies in computer science in between stints of homelessness and your felony conviction?
Was his name Corn Pop?
So glad criminalizing posting memes has no 1st ammendment issues.
not if they are pro-trump memes, doncha know?
Yeah this looks like a poorly written statute that SCOTUS should dump. But their are far greater threats to free speech out there right now including the meme prosecution, the prosecution of non violent j6 protesters, harassment and prosecution of pro life protesters, harassment of disfavored journalists like Taiibi and a whole lot more. But Reason libertarians don't actually give a shit about free speech. They are obsessed with promoting illegal immigration and this case gives them an opportunity to do that in their trademark tiresome fashion. Transparent and pathetic.
What about "the grandmother who lives with her family who's illegal," Sotomayor asked. "The grandmother tells her son she's worried about the burden she's putting on the family, and the son says, Abuelita, you are never a burden to us. If you want to live here—continue living here with us, your grandchildren love having you….Can [the government] prosecute this?"
I wonder why only one word of that sentence got left in the, supposedly, shared or native tongue and that word was "Abuelita", not "Nonna" or "Großmutti" or... "Babushka". Weird.
She think it's weird that a Hispanic woman used "Abuelitta"?
Who's she?
I'm saying it's weird for someone charged with protecting people "without regard to their race, color, religion, sex or national origin" and to approach the case without prejudice to break from the default language in such a specific and relevant way.
I admit it's not like she attended a Washington Nationals game before getting nominated or may've found a curly hair on a Coke can, but it's in the context of a line of questioning about a specific case before her.
I mean, if we were talking about profiting off publishing works encouraging illegal Nazi activity or illegal Russian activity and Justice Schmidt or Justice Romanova said, "The grandmother tells her son she's worried about the burden she's putting on the family, and the son says, Großmutti (or Babushka), you are never a burden to us." it seems like it would at least raise some eyebrows.
Considering she's a judge in an official proceeding wherein English is the official language, and that she spoke no other Spanish during any part of written or oral arguments, and that she used the English-language term "grandmother" twice before she got around to Abuelita, yeah, it's kind of weird for a supreme court justice to lapse into stronk chicana pidgin Spanish.
Actually, it's kind of racist to presume the illegals are Spanish speakers.
So I'm overseas for a little over a week, and I get news of some hearings where the former CDC director testifies to the lab leak, explains carefully how "jumping from animals to humans" is complete bullshit, how he discovered he was sidelined by Fauci only by reading them in the emails recovered from the freedom of information act... something that might be THE biggest government malfeasance story in the history of humanity.
What's on the docket today:
Open borders
Tariffs on baby formula
Netflix taxes to pay for failing infrastructure in a hopelessly corrupt political district that will never, and can never be saved.
Tik Tok
*flip*flip*flip*
Libertarian Utopia
*flip*flip*flip*
I got nothing here.
something that might be THE biggest government malfeasance story in the history of humanity
Well, we'll just have to see what the *experts* say about that!
The Bulwark will weigh in and Reason will run with it.
Well apparently Reason has adopted the "Don't Say Gay" rule and don't say Nashville either.
It's always open borders with Reason. This dismantling immigration law, one case at a time is extremely important to whoever pays the bills here.
https://reason.com/2023/03/20/robert-redfield-interview-fauci-lab-leak-covid-nih-raccoon-dogs/
Well, thank goodness such a small story is mercifully short.
should be 8 other robes agreeing with Soto
If you're welcoming in illegal aliens, it must be because you hate America and we all know hate speech isn't covered by the First Amendment. That's why expressing homophobia and transphobia and Islamaphobia is right out. Misogyny is fine.
So does Sotomayor have an issue with RICO statutes or “conspiracy to commit” crimes, or is this just motivated reasoning for immigration law issues?
^ it is motivated reasoning. it's always motivated reasoning with the big gov wing of the court, especially Sotomayor who is not very bright.
That said, it's correct this time.
Um, she seems to be using an "as applied" hypo to get a facial challenge done.
So, is encouraging any violation of any law, criminal or not, something that can legitimately punished with significant fines and imprisonment? I really don't think we want to go down that road.
If what Sotomayor is saying about criminalizing words is a principle rather than case specific reasoning, then, yes. If it case specific reasoning, then it can be ignored.
The "wise [sic] Latina" strikes again. A phone conversation between a person and their relative in another country, "You should come here however you can." is not actionable. "You should come here; you can live with me; I'll get you an off the books job." is actionable.
This isn't hard.
“I’ll represent you in court.”
“I’ll sell you groceries.”
“I’ll rent you a place to live.”
“I’ll let you use my laundromat.”
Basically, any business that doesn't say "Legals only" is committing a crime.
Your point is?
667, neighbor of the beast!
Without the mark, I mean papers, you're not allowed to participate in society. Anyone who knowingly does so is a criminal.
Revelations, man! And you're asking for it! Ha ha!
Whatever. Next time take your meds.
I just think it’s funny. Passing laws like this penalize anyone doing business with an illegal. At least they aren’t forced to use separate bathrooms. That would be illegal.
Then there's that old religious book nobody reads that talks about the end times, and anyone who doesn't share the mark will basically die because they can't get a job or buy anything. Just shut them out of society and let them wither away.
Like what you'd like to see happen to illegals.
You like to talk big shit. Which is funny, because you’re such a little bitch. Crawl back under your rock, you drunk little pussy.
No, not really, since US citizenship isn't a mark required for participation on society or economic activity in the places where they legally live. However, very much like what you spent 3 years clapping like the retarded trained seal you are for anyone who didn't get a COVID mRNA therapy and at least 2 rounds of followup.
Amazing how much you love them po' ol' spics up there in Maine with a 95% white population where you defended yourself against not knowing what a Cuban sandwich was despite being a trained master chef by claiming there's no spics in Maine.
Yes. That's how immigration law works pretty much around the world. Why shouldn't it work that way here?
Declare your enemies to not be fully human, and abuse them on that basis. This is YOUR method forward? Because it has worked SOOOO well, so far?
Illegal aliens are as human as any crook or thief. And like any crook or thief, they should be punished.
"Whatever. Next time take your meds."
All of those who disagree with MEEEE are… Mentally ILL!!! YES, this! Good authoritarians KNOW this already!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_abuse_of_psychiatry_in_the_Soviet_Union
All of the GOOD totalitarians KNOW that those who oppose totalitarianism are mentally ill, for sure!!!
No, deranged babbling psychopaths who post inane nonsense and 25 paragraph copypasta repeatedly on a daily basis for 10+ years are mentally ill, sarcasmic. Hope that helps.
Hi Tulpa!
“Dear Abby” is a personal friend of mine. She gets some VERY strange letters! For my amusement, she forwards some of them to me from time to time. Here is a relevant one:
Dear Abby, Dear Abby,
My life is a mess,
Even Bill Clinton won’t stain my dress,
I whinny seductively for the horses,
They tell me my picnic is short a few courses,
My real name is Mary Stack,
NO ONE wants my hairy crack!
On disability, I live all alone,
Spend desperate nights by the phone,
I found a man named Richard (Dick) Decker,
But he won’t give me his hairy pecker!
Dick Decker’s pecker is reserved for farm beasts,
I am beastly, yes! But my crack’s full of yeasts!
So Dear Abby, that’s just a poetic summary… You can read about the Love of my Life, Richard Decker, here:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/10/11/farmers-kept-refusing-let-him-have-sex-with-their-animals-so-he-sought-revenge-authorities-say/#comments-wrapper
Farmers kept refusing to let him have sex with their animals. So he sought revenge, authorities say.
Decker the hairy pecker told me a summary of his story as below:
Decker: “Can I have sex with your horse?”
Farmer: “Lemme go ask the horse.”
Pause…
Farmer: “My horse says ‘neigh’!”
And THAT was straight from the horse’s mouth! I’m not horsin’ around, here, no mare!
So Richard Decker the hairy pecker told me that, apparently never even realizing just HOW DEEPLY it hurt me, that he was all interested in farm beasts, while totally ignoring MEEE!!
So I thought maybe I could at least liven up my lonely-heart social life, by refining my common interests that I share with Richard Decker… I, too, like to have sex with horses!
But Dear Abby, the horses ALL keep on saying “neigh” to my whinnying sexual advances!
Some tell me that my whinnying is too whiny… Abby, I don’t know how to fix it!
Dear Abby, please don’t tell me “get therapy”… I can’t afford it on my disability check!
Now, along with my crack full of yeasts… I am developing anorexia! Some are calling me a “quarter pounder with cheese”, but they are NOT interested at ALL, in eating me!!! They will NOT snack on my crack!
What will I DO, Dear Abby?!?!?
-Desperately Seeking Horses, Men, or ANYTHING, in Fort Worth,
Yours Truly,
R Mac / Mary Stack / Tulpa / Mary’s Period / “.” / Satan
If you are not in the country legally, yes, you are not allowed to participate in society. That is the way national borders work, and that's the way they are supposed to work.
And, as indicated, his retardation is a distraction. Nobody, but nobody is criminalizing "I'll buy groceries and let you use my laundromat." and there is a very valid case that the "Where to Dump the Bodies" chapter in the book "How to Forge Passports, Encourage Illegal Immigration, and Win Elections" is almost certainly skirting one or more laws. Shreeks of "You're criminalizing grocery lists!" don't do either side any favors.
People will still insist that "Where to Dump the Bodies" is criminal speech that hurts people and people trying to get here (il)legally will still have murky waters about who they can say what to because rather than ruling on the actual issue, "Wise" retards ruled on speech no one was really or principally contesting.
Did any of your examples know they were illegally here or encourage them to illegally enter?
Retarded stuff sarc.
Next thing you know they'll pass some fascist law saying you can't even negotiate a fair and equitable labor contract with a minor or open your apartment for business as a nightclub!
If they do so knowing that you are in the country illegally, they may well be. And that's the way it should be.
Again, nobody’s criminalizing “I’ll sell represent you in court.”
If a native lawyer tells a native “Perpetrate a crime. I’ll represent you in court.” they have committed a no-shit crime for which they can be at least disbarred (MUH PAPERZ!).
If “I’ll represent you in court.” is clearly legal, immigration or otherwise, clarify where and how in the latter two-sentence phrase, a crime or ethics violation has been committed. “Maybe you commit a crime, maybe you don’t, I’ll represent you either way.” is not new and is the exact same speech that furthers “Sure is a nice immigration business you have there, it would be a shame if something happened to it.”
Edit: *OR* strike down criminal conspiracy more broadly. Trying and convicting natives for saying "Maybe you commit a crime, maybe you don’t, I’ll represent you either way." while letting immigrants off the hook for the same isn't equality before the law.
Then once the hook is set, the first example mystically transubstantiates into actionable, the way Martin Luther's Ghawd had intended all along. Conservatives can't reproduce well because females avoid girl-bullying nazis. Race suicide's the price they pay for being cowardly superstitious oaves nobody is gonna miss. These are the same faeces who sent thousands of kids to millennia in jail over plant leaves, twigs and seeds. Bye!
'“You should come here however you can.” is not actionable.'
Are you sure about that? Or do you think it's OK for an abusive prosecutor and can accommodating judge (who used to be an abusive prosecutor) to put people through three years of hell before a higher court finally steps in?
The notorious RBG would never have gone along with this.
I hear she’s working on finishing her rituals to achieve full Lich status.
We invite comments and request that they be civil and on-topic.
You didn't say "for citizens only". Sounds like you're encouraging illegal immigration. To jail with you!
"Hey Smitty! He done gone looked at your woman!"
"Is he legal?"
"I don't think so. Let's go kick his ass and see!"
Was Smitty the name of the guy your "cunt" wife started fucking after she finally left you, got custody of the kids and got granted a restraining order because of your history of abuse?
That’s not fair. You know damn well those people are figments off his imagination. Sarc is basically a drunk, nastier version of Oscar the Grouch.
Hey cytotoxic, remember that time when you let the mask drop and actually literally said that illegals should get welfare and citizens shouldn't because illegals work harder? Lmfao. That was funny shit. Back then you were just a seething Canadian faggot losing your mind over Hillary Clinton losing and hadn't even outed your pedophile persona.
Why? Is there fear there are enough immigrant-hating right-wing bigots on the Court to rescue this statute?
No, because there's zero.
Stop projecting.
If only we would fix our immigration system so that people could come to our country legally without having to wait 10 years most of this would be moot. Well that and stop Biden from inviting every person living south of our border to cross illegally. What a moron.
Stop exporting laws, bribes and hidden persuaders to pay mystical caudillos to shoot their own kids over plant leaves. Freedom brings prosperity by the same coin wherewith coercion brings bank failures, crashes, liquidity crises and poverty. Inflation is how the Kleptocracy paints lipstick on the pig of prohibitionism. Mark Twain wanted to import South American plant leaves back when it was legal as sea salt. Where were the rampaging killers? Where were the banking panics? Great Depression? South Americans need their individual rights back! (https://bit.ly/3BXGagN)
free Matt Taibbi!
Sotomayor is surrounded by National Socialists. With that handicap in plain view, she is doing a bang-up job--especially compared to those gringo cristianofascista jihadists against individual rights.
(https://tinyurl.com/2kjdt6t2)
Go down to Mexico, set up shop without telling anybody, and then get back to us about the “cristianofascista jihadists against individual rights”.
I’ve heard that they’ve got mystical girl bulliers down there too. Go hank, they need you, now!
Hank better watch his step. I bought Stephen Strange’s book ‘Mystical Girl Bullying in 10 Easy Steps’. So now I have magic powers. Some of which can be employed against deranged old fake libertarians like Hank.
By the hoary hosts of Hoggoth! So mote it’s be!
Considering you were alive when actual national socialists existed, you'd think you'd be more precise with the term you senile decrepit old bootlicking Nazi piece of shit.
Look who's talking: our little fascist little faux-libertarian.
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Let’s see if she expresses the same views when confronted by speech that progressives dislike.
How is saying "I will pay your rent and give you money if you can illegally get into the country" legally distinct from saying "I will give you money if you can illegally terminate a few priests"?
Discuss.
Meta: How is imposing (not just discussing) the distinction itself not a violation of equality before the law and punishment fitting the crime? If you discriminate between "I'll house you and give you money if you criminally obstruct an abortion clinic." or "I'll house you and give you money if you criminally breach the perimeter at The Capital." and "I'll house you and give you money if you illegally cross the border.", you're discriminating favorably based on Nationality (and, in one case, against religion).
Show me the victim.
The wise Latina of the Supreme Court doesn't need any "grounds". If she can help people violate US immigration laws and help them become a burden on US tax payers, then she is damned well going to rule accordingly! That's why she was made a justice after all! It's all about the feelz!
Why do you point out that she's latino? Racist much?
I mean, if you look one paragraph above in 8 USC 1324(a)(1)(A)(iii), the law prohibits harboring an illegal alien, so they're already committing essentially the same crime anyway, just by having her there. So maybe that's not the best example?
One law criminalizes conduct. The other law criminalizes speech. If you can't see the difference, don't even think about practicing law in the USA.
""Under this statute," observed Justice Sonia Sotomayor, "we're criminalizing words related to immigration."
She's certainly sticking to the party line on ILLEGAL immigration, which is to never, ever admit that laws targeting ILLEGAL immigration aren't aimed at LEGAL immigration.
Reason, too, has signed up to follow that party line, so they can't take note of it.
And, as indicated, exacerbates the problem. They don't want to clearly define what an illegal immigrant or foreign national is and what rights and benefits they enjoy. They want to continue to insist that Mexicans telling each other how to gain illegal entry and employment is free speech, but Russians being charged for posting on Twitter is just how elections and equal protection work. Their position is, rather obviously, an obfuscation to keep the political football in play and on their opposition's end of the field.
I say illegal immigration all the time. Democrats might bitch about it, but it's not outlawed so you're setting up some kind of weird straw man here that doesn't fucking exist. Lame.
Sotomayor is going to bat for the 1st amendment and free expression? Good for her.
The Dems must be furious!
That's a stupid take when your hero Republican politicians try to ban the right to do what you want with your body and force you to be Christian lol . Both parties suck big ol' donkey dicks and don't have a clue and only pick those parts of the bill of rights that suit their agenda.
When I read that she was defending freedom of speech I knew something was wrong.
I would love to ban people who want to ban free speech and thought but alas that would be self contradictory, so let's let them go, but let's not let them outlaw free speech. I don't think these types of laws usually last long.
My question is, how is this example stated by Justice Sotomayor any different from harboring or offering to harbor fugitives? How is the language offered any different than that of conspiring to do any other illegal act?
I think I would have answered "Yes" to her question under those rationales.
It seems logical that even foundational rights used to engaging in other lawbreaking doesn't create any sort of constitutional issue, lest death threats and a broad array of conspiracy becomes "legal" under Sotomayor's logic.
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