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Abortion

Women Who Get Abortions Could Be Charged With Homicide Under South Carolina Bill

Plus: ACLU sues over low-flying helicopter during protests, Canada's Online News Act, and more...

Elizabeth Nolan Brown | 3.15.2023 9:34 AM

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SC | Abortions Could Lead to Homicide Charges Under South Carolina Bill
(Abortions Could Lead to Homicide Charges Under South Carolina Bill)

Abortion "death penalty" bill doesn't mention the death penalty. More than 20 South Carolina lawmakers are proposing the death penalty for women who get abortions, according to a slew of major media reports making the rounds this week. But the truth—while still very bad—is not quite as disturbing as these articles suggest.

The proposal in question is a bill called the Prenatal Equal Protection Act (H. 3549). It was sponsored by Rep. Rob Harris (R–Spartanburg) and attracted 21 co-sponsors as of March 2—although six of these co-sponsors have removed their names from the bill this week.

The gist of the bill is defining personhood to begin at fertilization. From a legal perspective, this is, quite frankly, bonkers on many levels. People cannot even tell they are pregnant until weeks after fertilization. And the majority of fertilized eggs do not go on to become viable pregnancies; somewhere between 10 and 40 percent will die before even being implanted in a woman's uterus, and upwards of 50 percent may eventually be miscarried. Legally defining personhood as beginning at conception creates all sorts of thorny issues, from the serious (should the state start investigating all miscarriages as potential homicides?) to the odd (can a pregnant woman legally drive in a carpool lane?).

But the idea that personhood begins at conception is not a totally fringe idea: fetal personhood laws have been considered in a number of states and passed in five (Alabama, Arizona, Georgia, Kansas and Missouri). And implicit in this concept is the idea that all laws applying to me and you—including laws against assault and murder—would equally apply to all "unborn persons."

That's what South Carolina's proposed Prenatal Equal Protection Act would make explicit. It would amend the sections of the state code related to murder and assault to say that the term person "includes an unborn child at every stage of development from fertilization until birth." This change would mean that women who get abortions could be charged with homicide, and women who injure a fetus in some way could be charged with assault.

This is a terrible idea—perhaps especially the second part, which would not just affect people who get abortions but anyone who acted in a way that could possibly injure a fetus. It's the type of laws that could lead to increased surveillance, restrictions on, and criminalization of pregnant women across the board. And for women who did attempt an abortion in South Carolina, it could mean prosecution as a murderer.

The bill contains provisions stating that "where the victim is an unborn child and the defendant is the child's mother, it is a defense to prosecution under this article that the mother engaged in the proscribed conduct because she was compelled to do so by the threat of imminent death or great bodily injury," and that "medical care or treatment provided with the requisite consent by a licensed physician to avert the death of a pregnant woman that results in the accidental or unintentional injury or death of her unborn child when all reasonable alternatives to save the life of the unborn child were attempted or none were available does not constitute a violation of this article." Nonetheless, the severe penalties attached to the death of a fertilized egg, embryo, or fetus could make it much harder for pregnant women whose life or health is at risk to get the care they need. And it may make medical professionals slower to take action in situations when a pregnant woman's health is compromised if it puts the fetus at risk.

All of this is bad enough without exaggerating the stakes or the motivations of lawmakers, which seems to be exactly what many in the media have been doing this week by implying that killing women who abort is the bill's intent.

Nowhere in its text does the Prenatal Equal Protection mention the death penalty. And as far as I can tell, none of the sponsoring lawmakers have opined that women who get abortions should be put to death. In fact, Rep. Harris explicitly said that killing women who get abortions was not the bill's intent.

Now, this may be cold comfort, considering it is possible that the law could lead to the death penalty for women who get abortions. The death penalty is one possible punishment for people who plead guilty to or are convicted of murder, and that's certainly worth mentioning in coverage of the Prenatal Equal Protection Act. But there's nothing in the code saying that people convicted of murder must or necessarily should receive the death penalty. And—call me naive, but—I find it unlikely that the state would pursue it in abortion cases, or that courts would uphold this penalty if it tried.

Even without involving the death penalty, people found guilty of murdering fertilized eggs or fetuses could still face extremely severe consequences under the Prenatal Equal Protection Act. The mandatory minimum term of imprisonment for murder in South Carolina is 30 years.

South Carolina Republicans want at least 30 years imprisonment for women who get abortions is certainly a terrifying proposition in and of itself.

People are right to be sounding the alarm—loudly—about this bill and the lawmakers who support it. But exaggerating their motives and the bill's likely outcomes only gives South Carolina Republicans and other abortion opponents room to suggest that they're being misrepresented, that the press is being sensationalistic, etc.…and room for casual observers to conclude that the bill really isn't that bad and they shouldn't trust anything the media says about it. Ultimately, it could detract from serious discussion about the bill's implications and opposition to it.


FREE MINDS 

Low-flying helicopter during 2020 protest "constituted assault, battery, and intentional infliction of emotional distress under D.C. law," alleges lawsuit. "The American Civil Liberties Union has filed a lawsuit against the D.C. National Guard for its use of military-grade helicopters on local protesters during 2020's demonstrations against police brutality," reports DCist. "The D.C. ACLU filed the suit on behalf of 25-year-old Dzhuliya Dashtamirova, a protester who said she incurred injuries from the Guard's low-flying tactics on June 1, 2020, which blew dirt, glass, and debris into the air." (Here's my dispatch from that protest, where I was nearly hit by a big plank of wood the low-flying helicopter sent flying.)


FREE MARKETS 

Meta says Facebook and Instagram will stop allowing people to post news content in Canada if the Online News Act passes. The Online News Act would require social media companies and search engines to pay publishers for links to news. Meta spokesperson Lisa Laventure "says paying for these posts is neither sustainable nor workable for Meta," reports The Canadian Press:

Tech giants like Meta and Google have fought against the proposed law known as Bill C-18, which would require digital giants such as Google to negotiate deals that would compensate Canadian media companies for linking to or repurposing their content online.

Large Canadian media companies and the federal Liberal government argue the bill would level the playing field for news outlets that compete with tech giants for advertising dollars.

Facebook blocked access to news in Australia after a similar law was discussed in 2021, but quickly backtracked after the government made changes to an arbitration mechanism in the bill.

U.S. lawmakers have not outright proposed a "link tax" like this, but they do want to make it easier for publishers to demand such compensation. But if Meta's responses in Canada and Australia (and common sense) are any indication, tech companies would rather scrap news links than pay for them—depriving consumers of an easily accessible source of information and news outlets of the web traffic that search engines and social media drive.


QUICK HITS 

• "A man who has served more than 34 years of a 400-year prison sentence has been released after the state of Florida reinvestigated the case and determined he did not commit armed robbery," reports ABC News.

• How Washington decided to bail out Silicon Valley Bank.

• A new artificial intelligence system, GPT-4, is getting a lot of buzz.

• Sally Satel on "the flawed case for executing the mentally ill."

• Bad booze bills in Utah.

• Meta says it will lay off 10,000 more employees.

• The Department of Justice is now suing Rite Aid over opioid prescriptions. (For more context, see "The Fight To Criminalize Opioid Prescribing.")

• A Texas man has filed a wrongful death lawsuit against friends who helped his wife obtain an abortion.

Start your day with Reason. Get a daily brief of the most important stories and trends every weekday morning when you subscribe to Reason Roundup.

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NEXT: Critics Lose Their Mind as Arkansas Makes It a Bit Easier for Teens To Work

Elizabeth Nolan Brown is a senior editor at Reason.

AbortionReason RoundupMurderCriminal JusticeSouth CarolinaWomen's RightsPregnancyReproductive FreedomDeath Penalty
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  1. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Low-flying helicopter during 2020 protest "constituted assault, battery, and intentional infliction of emotional distress under D.C. law...:

    Stringfellow Hawke hardest hit.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      But shooting an unarmed woman on j6 is still okay right?

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        Was she trying to get an abortion?

        1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

          Unarmed women TRYING to get an abortion should be shot in the twat and on the spot! THIS is twat is needed to protect the lives of innocent Sacred Fartilized Egg Smells! MAN the barricades, full speed ahead, DAMN the WRONG tribe; this is WAR here! Saint Babbitt is WITH us!

          1. Rob Misek   2 years ago

            Don’t murder and you won’t be charged with it.

            Simple for some to grasp.

            1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

              Don't LIE about NAZIs never having mass-murdered Jews! And then you won’t be charged with it.

              Simple for some to grasp (Excludes evil liars and psychopaths, apparently.)

              1. Rob Misek   2 years ago

                Prove it.

                Then you’d have to refute something I said of course.

                1. tayomi   2 years ago (edited)

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              2. Rob Misek   2 years ago

                Running away from the challenge to prove your claims is typical for lying waste of skin cowards.

        2. JesseAz   2 years ago

          Who is advocating for that again? Did someone get medals for doing so?

      2. Nelson   2 years ago

        "But shooting an unarmed woman on j6 is still okay right?"

        Yes. If you don't want to get dead, don't storm a building defended by armed guards.

        1. JimboJr   2 years ago

          Based on this metric the BLM riots would have had thousands shot on site, apparently sanctioned by your ilk based on your response to this.

          Hey, im game if you are. But dont come crying when your brown shirts are piled in the streets.

          1. SQRLSY One   2 years ago

            Don’t fear the revolt!
            (insurrection)!

            All our times have come
            Here, but now they’re gone
            Seasons don’t fear the revolt
            Nor do the wind, the sun, or the rain
            (We can be like they are)
            Come on, baby
            (Don’t fear the revolt)
            Baby, take my hand
            (Don’t fear the revolt)
            We’ll be able to fly
            Baby, I’m your man
            La, la la, la la
            La, la la, la la
            Valentine is done
            Here but now they’re gone
            Horst Wessel and Ashli Babbs
            Are together in eternity
            (Horst Wessel and Ashli Babbitt)

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horst_Wessel

            Horst and Babbs both wanted to grab political power through violence, and got back, what they were dishing out. Karma is a bitch! Live by the sword, die by the sword!

            Refute it, bitch!

            Hopefully Saint Babbitt, in the Great Beyond the Beyond, is looking benevolently down upon the neglectful Reason writers, and, in Her Mercy, She will forgive them!
            In the meantime, perhaps we faithful Reasonoid commenters can make up for the shortcomings of the Reason writers! Here, below, I give you a sample of GREAT, True Devotion to Saint Babbitt, as written by a Devout And Respectful fellow Reasonoid commenter!

            Poor Babbitt. An innocent tourist shot by a cop for no reason while peacefully milling about the Capital. It’s the worst police shooting that ever happened. Ever. Compared to choking people, suffocating them, beating them to death with fists, this is the absolute most egregious action by police to have ever happened in the known history of the universe.
            But She will remain in our thoughts. Before long we’ll erect a statue in Her honor. Saint Babbitt. May She look after peaceful tourists everywhere.

            1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

              Word of advice there, Sqrlsy: don't quit your 50 cent day job.

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            2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

              Don’t forget how the Capitol police guarding the Speaker’s Lobby had perfect knowledge of the state of arms bearing of each and every person on the rioting mob, because they had x-ray vision or something.

              1. JimboJr   2 years ago

                you're right, the cops should shoot whoever they want based on them maybe having weapons. Jacob Blake was cool right?

                1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

                  Not whomever they want, but certainly someone who is attempting to crawl through a broken window into a barricaded-off secure area at the head of a rioting mob.

          2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

            So didn’t St. Kyle do just that to three BLM’ers, much to the approvals of many members of our commentariat?

            1. JimboJr   2 years ago

              Ya, I remember when Babbit hit that cop over the head with a skateboard and 3 others tried to kill him

              1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

                Nothing threatening at all about someone crawling through a broken window at the head of a rioting mob into a barricaded, secure area.

                1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                  This is amazing rationalization of cop murder.

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                  2. Nelson   2 years ago

                    Actually, that is just a description of what happened. She was in a mob trying to breach a barricade protected by armed defenders.

                    You know what the defenders should have done in that situation? Let the rioting mob in. Because they didn't seem dangerous and violent at all. Smashing your way into a secure building screaming about hanging the Vice President is just how sightseers act.

          3. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

            Based on this metric the BLM riots would have had thousands shot on site, apparently sanctioned by your ilk based on your response to this.

            He's fine with arguing that trespassers should be summarily executed on sight by armed agents of the state - no arrest, not trial or due process of any kind - because he knows that standard will only be applied one way.

            Hint: it won't be applied to him or his brown shirts.

        2. JesseAz   2 years ago

          Good to hear trespassing is a capital offense. Hope you remain consistent with leftist riots.

          1. Nelson   2 years ago

            No, it isn't a capitol offense. But attacking an armed guard will get you killed and you will be 100% responsible for your death.

    2. LondynZuri   2 years ago (edited)

      I’ve made $1250 so far this week working online and I’m a full time student. I’m using an online business opportunity I heard about and I’AM made such great money. It’s really user friendly and I’m just so happy that I found out about it. Here’s what I do, .for more information simply.
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  2. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Censorship and damaging the reputation of science (not "The Science").

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2023/03/15/this-censorship-has-damaged-the-reputation-of-science/

    A conspiracy theory. That was what the scientific establishment once called the idea that Covid might have leaked from a lab in China. And it wasn’t alone. The lab-leak theory was dismissed by politicians, damned in the media and censored by Big Tech for much of the pandemic. Initially, elites refused to give it any kind of hearing at all. But no more. Over the past year, the case for a lab leak being the origin of Covid has grown stronger and stronger. And in recent weeks, both the US Department of Energy and the FBI have said that the most likely source of the pandemic is a lab in China – the Wuhan Institute of Virology. So, why are so many influential people now coming around to the lab-leak theory? Why did the establishment try to suppress it for so long? And what does all this mean for the reputation of science?

    1. JimboJr   2 years ago

      Censorship, lysenkoism, and partisan politics.

      The lab leak being 'conspiracy' comes from two main sources:

      1. Trump said it, so they dems couldn't agree with it. Simple as that.

      2. Fauci was their hero, and lab leak had to go away to cover his ass. Lab leak being real turns him into one of the people responsible (true) instead of one of the people supposedly battling the pandemic (narrative)

      Fauci laundering false narratives through scientific journals reveals that 'science' has been replaced by 'the science'. Trust in institutions (rightfully so) has never been lower.

      1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

        Fauci belongs in jail.

      2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        RE point 1: defeating Trump was the most important thing ever. If Democrats had decided that catching COVID would have helped, they would have held mass infection parties and burned down vaccine clinics.

        1. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

          Hence the hyperbolic response to COVID. Whether or not the lab leak was intentional, the histrionics about killing grandma and the authoritarian reaction to shut down the nation's economy was motivated by the old adage of not letting a good crisis go to waste. If this gives us a reason to tank the economy (which even the left had to admit was excellent), then let's go.

      3. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

        I don't get the preoccupation with Fauci.

        But then I never listened to him.

        1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

          It’s not surprising you don’t understand.

        2. JimboJr   2 years ago

          He pushed authoritarian measures based on 'evidence' that wasnt real, and helped craft authoritarian public policy that was politically, not scientifically, based.

          He pushed for 'trust the experts' not because they deserved trust, but just because they know better than you. Even though they kept showing they didn't in fact, know better.

          No surprise a lefty like you would not see the problem here

        3. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          Right wingers have a deep need to be outraged about something at all times.

          1. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 years ago

            Lol. Shutting down the world and lying about the reason why, or improper pronoun use. Pick your battles.

            You’re an idiot.

          2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

            You fucking retarded gas-lighter. Which party aligns with hordes of academics who "research" and teach victim culture?

            1. Liberty_Belle   2 years ago

              Is it time for the annual "war on Christmas" yet ?

              1. Nelson   2 years ago

                No, it's "War on Easter" season.

        4. (Impeach Biden) Weigel's Cock Ring   2 years ago

          He's an even bigger, more completely total worthless piece of shit than you are (which is by no means an easy "feat" for any man to accomplish) and deserves to be hanged.

          It's tempting to add "or put to death by firing squad", but that's far more of an honorable form of execution than the guy deserves. Thrown into a woodchipper, perhaps.

    2. Nardz   2 years ago

      They called natural immunity a conspiracy theory.
      Stop treating these clumps of can er like they're capable of good faith.

  3. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Racial totalitarianism.

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2023/03/14/joe-bidens-racial-totalitarianism/

    When the American media discuss ‘culture warriors’, they almost always refer to Republican politicians like Florida governor Ron DeSantis or to parents’ groups protesting against the likes of Drag Queen Story Hour. But in reality, there is no more ardent and powerful culture warrior in the US today than President Joe Biden.

    1. Idaho Bob   2 years ago

      "It is striking that such a far-reaching initiative is being implemented without much notice. There was no signing ceremony, no press conference and little media coverage. This low-profile approach shows that Biden, the Democrats and their friends in the media prefer to wage a silent culture war. They reserve the tag of ‘culture warrior’ for those who dare to object to their radical schemes."

      This is a perfect example of how well-oiled the leftist propaganda machine really is. Constantly framing the bad guy is the one who pushes back on the BS.

      1. JimboJr   2 years ago

        Repressive tolerance

      2. Moonrocks   2 years ago

        It's more than that. They are well aware that their culture war is incredibly unpopular, which is why they work so hard to hide it.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          The current back-pedaling and outright denial is hilarious.

      3. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

        NO ONE IS BANNING GAS STOVES!!!111!!!!1!!!!!

        1. HorseConch   2 years ago

          Since America's favorite loser is on the task, we don't have to worry about that anymore.

          https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/stacey-abrams-gets-a-new-job-after-election-loss-joins-environmental-group-trying-to-eliminate-gas-stoves/ar-AA18CyfA

          1. Nelson   2 years ago

            God, she's such an idiot.

      4. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago (edited)

        It is striking that such a far-reaching initiative is being implemented without much notice. There was no signing ceremony, no press conference and little media coverage.

        That’s because they know full well that if they did their bullshit out in the open many more people will push back on it. They know the things they’re doing are not popular with normal people, so they have to try and stay under the radar as much as possible. Then when anyone does point out what they’re doing they just call them names like “culture warrior” or just go for the old stand-bys (racist, sexist, -phobe, bigot, etc.).

        Edit: should have skimmed the other responses first, Moonrocks beat me to it. Oh well.

  4. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    How Washington decided to bail out Silicon Valley Bank.

    At least taxpayers aren't on the hook. Most of us pay ZERO in bank fees.

    The GOP wants a good taxpayer slush fund like Fatass Donnie's PPP or Dubya's TARP. Tough shit.

    1. Spiritus Mundi   2 years ago (edited)

      Most of us pay ZERO in bank fees.

      You really are economically illiterate.

      The GOP wants a good taxpayer slush

      They are using the slush fund called FDIC.

      1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago (edited)

        I don’t read wingnut.com any more.

        I'm sure there is some nutty CT about how taxpayers are really paying for SVB deposits Kevin Bacon style - six times removed.

        1. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

          We know.

          We also know "wingnut.com" now includes Reuters for daring to imply people have reason to be disappointed with year 2 of this Biden economy you're always gaslighting us about.

          #DefendBidenAtAllCosts

          1. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

            HuffPo is also wingnut.com now.

            1. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

              Can't trust NBC News either.

              Damn, the media just will not stop lying about Biden. 🙁

          2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

            The "economy" is not the market, Sandy Baby.

            One would think a libertarian would know that after all the free-money handouts from Fatass Donnie's term.

            "Free-money" bubbles always burst. But you say the "free money" can just go on forever or until you can blame a Democrat for it.

            That is called Team Red Big Government Libertarianism.

            1. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

              The "economy" is also not Sam's Club closing a few locations. Yet when your party is out of power you react to such news as if it proves we're in another Great Depression.

              The point is, many Americans are financially worse off under Biden. It must frustrate you to realize you're not fooling anyone with your year-plus of pretending inflation is a non-issue and cherry-picking good news like rig count.

              1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

                You do agree with this statement of mine:

                “Free-money” bubbles always burst.

                That is like rule #1 in the Sound Money Handbook.

        2. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

          I don’t read wingnut.com any more.

          Did they stop carrying child porn or something?

      2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

        They are using the slush fund called FDIC.

        Funded by bank fees which most of us don't pay.

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago

          You truly are an economic idiot.

          1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

            I don't pay a dime in bank fees. You idiots do though.

            Go ahead and concoct some silly CT about how Joe masterminded a plan to bail out the libs with taxpayer money while you remain forever silent about Fatass Donnie's $900 billion PPP slush fund directly on the taxpayer account.

            1. Overt   2 years ago

              Let us note that SPB has done the standard slur of trying to imply that if you hold the uncontroversial notion that "money is fungible", why that means you are trafficking in conspiracy theories.

              A few years back SPB posted kiddy porn to this site, and his initial handle was banned. The link below details all the evidence surrounding that ban. A decent person would honor that ban and stay away from Reason. Instead SPB keeps showing up, acting as if all people should just be ok with a kiddy-porn-posting asshole hanging around. Since I cannot get him to stay away, the only thing I can do is post this boilerplate, and link to the evidence of his wrongdoing.

              https://reason.com/2022/08/06/biden-comforts-the-comfortable/?comments=true#comment-9635836
              Don't respond to SPB, just shun him.

              1. Sevo   2 years ago

                Keep in mind that turd lies.

                1. rev-arthur-l-kuckland   2 years ago

                  The lies are annoying, put his pedofilia is unforgivable

              2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                Worse than that. He ignores completely fees get tied into investment rates. As investment rates lower it causes a devaluation of money against inflation. Then again he denies inflation too.

                1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

                  Okay, that is two of the Kevin Bacon Six Degrees. Do four more and you got some real juicy CT working.

                  1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                    It is reality. Again. Youre an economic idiot.

                    1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago (edited)

                      FDIC fees aren’t funded by taxes, jackass.

                      You know that.

                      Now four more degrees for some juicy wingnut CT.

                    2. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

                      That they may not, but FDIC has used taxpayer monies before to aid banks. In 2008, they used money authorized by Congress (TARP) to do so due to the systemic risk in the banking system.

                      https://www.fdic.gov/bank/historical/crisis/overview.pdf

                      As for the financial crisis, its severity was reflected in the size of the government’s emergency response. The Federal Reserve initiated numerous programs designed to provide short-term liquidity to banks and other financial institutions as well as to
                      borrowers and investors. In the six weeks following the September 15, 2008, bankruptcy of the investment bank Lehman Brothers, the Federal Reserve’s balance sheet doubled to about $2 trillion.4 On September 19, the Department of the Treasury announced that it would provide a guarantee for money market mutual funds, standing behind more than $3.5 trillion in assets.5 On October 3, Congress authorized $700 billion to fund the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP), and about $245 billion of that would be used to shore up the capital of financial institutions.6 Ten days later the FDIC announced its Temporary Liquidity Guarantee Program that would eventually guarantee more than $600 billion in debt issued by financial institutions and their affiliates.

                    3. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

                      Shrike, how do fees show up on an accounting ledger? Liability or revenue?

            2. Sevo   2 years ago

              Turd, the ass-clown of the commentariate, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
              If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
              turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

            3. JesseAz   2 years ago

              I was against PPP loans. Go look at the threads. But it was also passed with super majorities from both parties. Care to try again?

              Also lower interest rates is a fee you retarded fuck. It no longer hedges against inflation in any manner.

      3. Minadin   2 years ago

        As Sandra likes to say, beyond parody.

      4. Nelson   2 years ago

        "You really are economically illiterate."

        If you are paying bank fees, you have chosen the wrong bank. It's easy to find one with no fees for savings and checking accounts. I've never paid a bank fee in my entire life because I don't deposit my momey on banks that charge fees.

        I'm thinking the illiteracy isn't where you claim it is.

        "They are using the slush fund called FDIC."

        If you don't understand how insurance works, you are even more economically illiterate than your 'bank fees' statement makes you seem.

    2. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Is there any Biden lie you don't believe? FDIC doesn't have enough to cover the accounts. Biden stated they will recoup losses with higher fees which will be passed onto everyone with a bank account.

      1. Nelson   2 years ago

        So having fractionally higher individual fees on banking (if you choose to keep your money somewhere that charges fees) counts as 'taxpayer funded'? By that definition, everything is 'taxpayer funded'.

        Insurance works the way you are describing. All insurance. This isn't abnormal for insurance. Look at every insurance company after a hurricane wrecks portions of Florida (again).

  5. Spiritus Mundi   2 years ago

    Biden's economy keeps rolling, Moodys changed its outlook for US banks to negative. Why?

    some banks having invested excess deposits in longer-dated fixed-income securities that have lost value during the rapid rise in US interest rates

    US treasury bills are negative assest. Biden is just killing it!

    https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/moodys-silicon-valley-bank-outlook-signature-failure-economy-downgrade-system-2023-3?op=1

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Don’t you dare call a negative asset “toxic”.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        British shrike will show up and get angry.

        1. Spiritus Mundi   2 years ago

          I understand the kneejerk reaction. It is inconceivable to ever think US T bonds would be a negative asset, yet here we are. The amount of destruction being done is unrecoverable. Biden is Nero.

          1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

            Bonds can always drop for buy/sale. Banks shouldn’t be relying on 10 year investments when they need liquidity for customer accounts. Especially at 50% of investments as reported on SVB. And with interest rates at near zero. Doesn't even hedge inflation.

            1. Nelson   2 years ago (edited)

              In a very rare occurance, I agree with Jesse. As she pointed out, it was poor investment strategy and risk management that killed SVB. Maybe not having a corporate risk officer for almost a year had something to do with that? Maybe?

          2. Nardz   2 years ago

            Obama was Nero.
            Biden is Caligula.

            1. Fats of Fury   2 years ago

              Biden is Claudius, a stuttering, drooling old fuck who ate the poison mushrooms his wife fed him.

    2. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

      Biden is just killing it!

      Literally.

  6. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Between a rock and a hard place.

    https://www.thecentersquare.com/national/article_d38f6b94-c330-11ed-bbdf-eba6b0699971.html

    The U.S. Federal Reserve may be less likely to use its key tool to combat inflation because of recent bank failures.

    The Fed has been aggressively hiking interest rates for months to help combat inflation. While inflation has slowed, it remains elevated. Given the recent bank collapses, hiking rates again may be too risky for the Fed.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Is inflation still profit?

  7. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    A man who has served more than 34 years of a 400-year prison sentence has been released after the state of Florida reinvestigated the case and determined he did not commit armed robbery...

    I demand a rereinvestigation.

    1. Outlaw Josey Wales   2 years ago

      I demand a rere-investigation.

      Would that require Judge Aretha Franklin?

      1. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

        Well, well, well.

    2. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 years ago

      Pfffft. Big deal. At least he didn’t serve 300 of his 400 year sentence. They caught the mistake pretty quick.

      1. Nelson   2 years ago

        LOL!

  8. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    How Washington decided to bail out Silicon Valley Bank.

    Backs were no longer itchy.

    1. rev-arthur-l-kuckland   2 years ago

      Hey its not like they were laundering money for Newsome. Ummm... Nevermind

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        That's what crypto is for.

        1. Nelson   2 years ago

          I have him muted, so I don't know what you responded to.

          My guess is 'Keeping money in a bank is how you lose it all.'

          Close?

    2. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      Low friends in high places.

    3. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Think you mean blacks.

      https://thefederalist.com/2023/03/14/silicon-valley-bank-pledged-nearly-74-million-to-black-lives-matter-causes/

  9. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    A new artificial intelligence system, GPT-4, is getting a lot of buzz.

    Skynet will start as a fad.

    1. Nardz   2 years ago

      Should put a lot of people out of work.
      The pajama class trembles

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        The pajama class trembles

        The funny thing is I don't see a lot of those types freaking out over AI like ChatGPT and others. Maybe they just assume AI won't completely replace them but just make their jobs even easier so that they can spend even less time doing real, actual work and more time fucking off.

  10. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Sally Satel on "the flawed case for executing the mentally ill."

    "You don't have to be crazy to die here but it helps."

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      What about the case for electing the mentally ill?

      1. SRG   2 years ago

        Insert obvious Catch-22 here 🙂

      2. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

        It's a representative government.

    2. SRG   2 years ago

      She states a point I've often thought, that juries will hold mental illness against a defendant.

      Any guesses, without looking, which three justices in Atkins were happy to let intellectually impaired prisoners be executed? Yes. Renhquist, Scalia and Thomas, of course.

      FWIW I think that the more firmly one believes in a Christian afterlife, the more relaxed one is about executing the living.

      1. Idaho Bob   2 years ago

        Were the mentally impaired defendants found guilty of murder?

        If so, why should they get a break from riding the lightning?

        1. Overt   2 years ago

          "why should they get a break from riding the lightning?"

          Because SRG is here to slam deplorables and score points for Team Blue. Nothing more, nothing less.

          1. SRG   2 years ago

            I'm a registered independent and am not generally interested in scoring points for Team Blue, though I am happy scoring points against Team Orange, Team KKK, etc.. Any honest libertarian would slam Rehnquist, Scalia and Thomas for Atkins as well. But an empathy-deficient right-winger would certainly support them, particularly because wanting to fry the mentally impaired shows what a tough guy you are

            1. JesseAz   2 years ago

              Team KKK is team blue dumbass. Thought you had no interest in defending them? Which party continues to advocate for segregation?

              Youre team Blue. Youre not fooling anybody British shrike.

              1. SRG   2 years ago

                Get your arguments straight, you cracker POS. According to you If I'm anti-KKK then I 'm not Team Blue.

                Of course, we all know that since the 60s the KKK has been pro GOP not pro Dem, like the rest of the Southern/Confederate bigots, but some people just don't seem to understand that over decades, things change.

                Youre team Blue. Youre not fooling anybody British shrike.

                You do a good enough job at fooling yourself, so no need for me to step in.

                1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

                  I am happy scoring points against Team Orange, Team KKK,

                  Again Team KKK is team blue you fucking British shrike sock.

                  am not generally interested in scoring points for Team Blue

                  Because you’re a leftist British shrike sock.

                  we all know that since the 60s the KKK has been pro GOP not pro Dem

                  A leftist lie you fucking British shrike sock.

                  https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-03-14/ku-klux-klan-grand-dragon-will-quigg-endorses-hillary-clinton-for-president

                  This is a lie told by leftists. I ask again. Which party is still pushing segregation?

                  like the rest of the Southern/Confederate bigots,

                  The party switch thesis is a leftist lie British shrike sock. The southern states didn't switch to red until the 1990s. Again. Youre pushing a leftist lie in defense of them.

                  1. SRG   2 years ago

                    More bullshit and lies from you, the very incarnation of White Grievance. You think I don't know about the Southern Strategy?
                    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_strategy

                    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                      Lol. Iiterally called out your use of this fully leftist invented narrative British shrike.

                      When did the southern states turn red? Hint. It is in my fucking post.

                  2. SRG   2 years ago

                    Some research - apparently counties where KKK was most active switched more to the GOP. Funny that.
                    https://www.academia.edu/40376002/Political_Polarization_as_a_Social_Movement_Outcome_1960s_Klan_Activism_and_Its_Enduring_Impact_on_Political_Realignment_in_Southern_Counties_1960_2000

                    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                      The south remained democratic until the 90s you retarded shit. The older generation continued to vote blue until they died off. Holy fuck are you retarded shrike.

                  3. SRG   2 years ago

                    Finally, because you're particularly stupid about this, just because people disagree with your brand of right-wing authoritarian white supremacy bullshit doesn't make them leftist except in your diabetes-impaired vision.

                    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                      Youre literally pushing leftist narratives you retarded shit.

                    2. SRG   2 years ago

                      There's a difference between a leftist narrative and a narrative a leftist might agree with. The Southern Strategy is a real thing, and being aware of it is not leftist. But I guess that as it undermines your position, you have to dismiss it thus.

                      Of course, the modern seppo right-winger like you reflexively thinks that any opinion he doesn't agree with is leftist.

            2. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 years ago

              Lol. So you’re against the irrelevant KKK?

              Stunning and brave, SRG.

              1. SRG   2 years ago

                KKK are still out there, though, and as long as people like JesseAZ and you pretend they're irrelevant while basically supporting them, one can't assume that they're no threat at all. Of course, if I'm wrong and you think that the KKK are vile and likewise other white supremacy movements, then I'll apologise to you.

                1. JesseAz   2 years ago

                  While supporting who shrike? I just showed you who they endorsed. Did you miss it?

                  Which party is still pushing segregation? You keep avoiding this central question.

                  1. Nelson   2 years ago

                    No one is pushing segregation.

          2. Super Scary   2 years ago

            He's just trying to protect his people. You know, the mentally impaired.

        2. SRG   2 years ago

          Because they were mentally impaired? Duh! Read the majority decision.

    3. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

      Just call it "involuntary Medical Assistance in Dying", that will get the social Left back on board with capital punishment.

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        “involuntary Medical Assistance in Dying”

        iMAD? I like it, they'll probably just assume it's a new overpriced Apple iShit toy to sperg out over.

        1. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

          It would be "iMAID", but yes, that is the gist.

  11. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Gerrymandering through the courts.

    https://www.thecentersquare.com/north_carolina/article_409e87a4-c2ac-11ed-baf8-2f4a5b762e8e.html

    The North Carolina Supreme Court did not have the authority to invalidate maps created by the General Assembly for the state’s Senate and congressional districts, attorneys for legislative leaders argued Tuesday.

    On Election Day in November, Republicans won every statewide race – including taking a 5-2 majority on this bench. Justices in December, before exiting, issued a controversial ruling that prompted the rehearing. Another rehearing comes Wednesday on voter identification at the polls, a constitutional amendment approved by voters in fall 2018 with more than 55% of the vote that has been tied up in litigation since.

    1. SusanSantana   2 years ago (edited)

      Google is by and by paying $27485 to $29658 consistently for taking a shot at the web from home. I have joined this action 2 months back and I have earned $31547 in my first month from this action. I can say my life is improved completely! Take a gander at it what I do…..

      For more detail visit the given link……………….>>> http://www.jobsrevenue.com

  12. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Backsliding into corruption.

    https://www.illinoispolicy.org/illinois-house-backslides-toward-madigan-era-rules/

    Illinois House members two years ago were eager to separate themselves from the corruption of the Mike Madigan era, so they changed the rules so bills would get a fair hearing rather than being killed at the House speaker’s discretion.

    March 10 was the Illinois House of Representatives’ deadline for bills to be heard in substantive committees to be vetted in public before being passed into law. But unlike in the previous General Assembly, many if not most of the bills filed in the House were not assigned to a substantive committee to get a hearing. That is because this session, the House rolled back the modest reform made to symbolically distance themselves from Madigan’s legacy of corruption.

  13. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

    Low-flying helicopter during 2020 protest "constituted assault, battery, and intentional infliction of emotional distress under D.C. law"

    As the ACLU knows, our nation was founded on the principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of limitless emotional coddling.

    1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

      the pursuit of limitless emotional coddling.

      Especially when you're in the process of committing felonies.

  14. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    Banks in flyover country can suck it:

    https://twitter.com/sunnyright/status/1635999785827049472

    The Wall Street Journal
    @WSJ
    ·
    14m
    The failure of Silicon Valley Bank is causing concern for climate-tech startups, who worry that lenders won't fill the gap for projects that need a lot of capital. @ahirtens explains. #WSJWhatsNow

    1. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

      https://twitter.com/unusual_whales/status/1635966823891095552

      BREAKING: California Governor Gavin Newsom lobbied the White House and Treasury on the bailout of Silicon Valley Bank, without disclosing that his private wineries had reportedly been the bank's clients & he may have even had a personal account at the bank, per the Intercept

      1. JimboJr   2 years ago

        Imagine if Desantis did anything 1/100th this corrupt

      2. Commenter_XY   2 years ago

        Nothing to see here....

        unreal.

      3. JesseAz   2 years ago

        The number of democrats who got campaign contributions from SVB is also pretty amazing.

      4. Nelson   2 years ago

        If I'm not mistaken, only the depositors are being protected. SVB, the company, isn't getting anything.

    2. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      The chutzpah on these bastards. Most scammers would be happy to get away with what they've managed to scam, but these guys are lamenting the fact that people may be on to their scam.

      1. Nardz   2 years ago

        When the citizenry won't revolt at even the most egregious crimes against humanity, why bother trying to hide the corruption anymore?

  15. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Bad booze bills in Utah.

    "You might take it with however many grains of salt you wish, but the brown liquor that is circulating around us is not specifically too good. It’s suggested that you do stay away from that."

    -Mormons

    1. Longtobefree   2 years ago

      Three days of peace, love, and music.
      Good times.

      1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

        If you remember it, you weren’t there.

      2. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago (edited)

        And Kosher Bacon handled by half-a-million Hippies.
        🙂

  16. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    Meta says it will lay of 10,000 more employees.

    Elon, what have you done???

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      That's just that systemic racism stuff.

      1. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

        Silicon Valley Apartheid!

  17. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/RBPundit/status/1635973286726184960

    Wait.

    They even warned the Hyatt BEFORE the show that they could be in violation of the liquor license terms?

    And the Hyatt did it anyway?

    Anyone complaining about this should have their conservative credentials revoked.
    Quote Tweet
    Just Mindy ????
    @just_mindy
    ·
    11h
    For those concerned taking the liquor license of a Miami hotel accused of allowing minors in a sexually explicit holiday show, here is the entire brief. It’s clearly explained. Fascism isn’t enforcing the rules of a liquor license.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      The law utilized allows charging of a misdemeanor. DeSantis could have charged a number of people.

      This group had penetration, exposed silicon breasts, etc.

      It was not a normal drag singer type event.

    2. Fats of Fury   2 years ago

      Hyatt = Pritzker

  18. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    The pothole from Hell: IDOT's shame. This thing opened up Monday in the morning rush hour and is still not fixed properly.

    https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/two-lanes-on-i-55-in-bolingbrook-remain-closed-due-to-giant-pothole-delays-expected/3095647/

    It was a hole about the size of a large garbage can through the bridge deck.

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      That’s the biggest problem Chicago has.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        It's indicative of the neglect of infrastructure in blue state Illinois (and maybe other blue states) in favor of pensions and other pet projects. The damn bridge is almost more patch than concrete at this point, and I'm damn sure we might see a bridge collapse in Illinois not too far in the future due to the neglect.

        1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

          It’s indicative of the neglect of infrastructure in blue state Illinois (and maybe other blue states) in favor of pensions and other pet projects.

          Last week (I think) there was a pick-up truck hauling a trailer that hit a pothole on I-70 in the mountains here in CO. There was dash-cam video from a Tesla driving behind him where you could see the pot hole going across basically an entire lane (couldn't quite tell from the video how deep it was). The trailer spun out causing the truck to spin out as well and blocked the whole highway. The Colorado DPS (highway patrol) actually fined the driver (of course).

          I heard CDOT did go out and fix the pothole a couple days later, so I guess we're slightly better than IL. We'll see how much longer that lasts.

        2. Nelson   2 years ago (edited)

          “It’s indicative of the neglect of infrastructure in blue state Illinois (and maybe other blue states)”

          Your belief is that poor infrastructure is a blue state problem? That red states have great infrastructure?

          Check out the roads in Oklahoma or Kansas. They can’t even keep roads in shape, let alone bridges.

    2. JesseAz   2 years ago

      Unless more minorities ran unto the pothole more than whites, I literally can't care.

      1. Idaho Bob   2 years ago

        Minorities are disproportionately underrepresented as automobile owners. The fact that less minorities hit the pothole is a prime example of systemic racism.

        1. JesseAz   2 years ago

          Fuck youre good at CRT.

        2. rev-arthur-l-kuckland   2 years ago

          Ahhh but they are vastly over represented in car "borrowing"

        3. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 years ago

          Lol. “Hardest hit”, indeed.

    3. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

      Actually northbound I55 is not too bad up there. Southbound is a disaster.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        Tell me about it. Saw the southbound lanes on the way into work, and they were backed up a pretty good distance (at least as far as Lemont Road - 4 miles away). It's been a bitch going around this shit on the way home though. Last two days, it's been backed up from I-294 to there, a distance of 10 miles southbound in the evening rush.

        Most potholes get cleared up pretty fast, but this one is notable for its size, and the duration of IDOT's repair work, and that it is indicative of the decrepit state of our infrastructure here.

        1. Nelson   2 years ago

          I grew up in Western Springs. I was reading your post and thinking, "Damn, I know exactly what he's talking about and that is a looooong way.".

          I know it wasn't your intention, but thank you for giving me a nostalgic moment.

    4. Longtobefree   2 years ago

      It will be repaired as soon as the kickback bidding closes and a contractor is selected.

  19. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/Heminator/status/1635996608784375814

    "At trial, U.S. prosecutors redacted Hunter Biden's name from court exhibits and did not explore evidence of his lucrative dealings with the Chinese national."

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      What about dick pics?

  20. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    The Department of Justice is now suing Rite Aid over opioid prescriptions.

    There is never anyone at the counter to service prescription customers at my local Rite Aid so I support his suit.

    1. Fats of Fury   2 years ago

      Everyone quit Rite Aid to make $600 dollars an hour online.

    2. Its_Not_Inevitable   2 years ago (edited)

      They all left Rite Aid to work online.

      Edit: Damn. Should've refreshed and I would have seen Fats comment above.

  21. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    A Texas man has filed a wrongful death lawsuit against friends who helped his wife obtain an abortion.

    He has no parental rights, only obligations.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Equity!

    2. Lester75   2 years ago

      It was his ex-wife. Emphasis on the EX. This is just a grievance lawsuit.

      1. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

        Would she have come at him for child support, I wonder.

    3. TJJ2000   2 years ago

      Throwing seed in someone's yard doesn't grant anyone ownership of it.

  22. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Suspicious activity, the White House, and Hunter and Joe. No, it's not about dick pics.

    https://nypost.com/2023/03/15/house-panel-set-to-review-biden-family-suspicious-bank-reports/

    The House Oversight Committee’s staff on Wednesday will finally examine suspicious activity reports sent by banks to the Treasury Department alerting of potential criminal activity involving President Biden’s family.

    The committee’s long-awaited review is expected to accelerate Republican committee Chairman James Comer’s investigation of Joe Biden’s links to ventures in places such as China, Russia and Ukraine.

    1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

      They might find out who his dealer is.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Defend crackhead at all cost if it defends Biden at all costs.

        Whats your thoughts on the SAR information released yesterday of multiple Bidens getting large sums from China not attached to any employment right after Joe left office?

      2. Sevo   2 years ago

        Turd, the ass-clown of the commentariate, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
        If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
        turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

    2. Super Scary   2 years ago

      Are we finally going to find out who "The Big Guy" is?

  23. Fist of Etiquette   2 years ago

    More than 20 South Carolina lawmakers are proposing the death penalty for women who get abortions...

    Normally I would say this is an insane interpretation but there are no doubt prosecutors who would run with any loophole provided for them.

    1. Overt   2 years ago

      I am morally opposed to abortion. I am also morally opposed to giving the state these powers to prosecute women.

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        ^This^

        It's possible to think abortion is morally wrong while also thinking this is a shitty law.

    2. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      prosecutors are the lowest form of human life so, yeah, they will destroy people just for scoreboard. you have to make the statues crystal clear otherwise a lot of people gonna get ruined.

  24. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Democrats are hooked on censorship.

    https://nypost.com/2023/03/14/censorship-addicts-democrats-seek-to-squelch-speech-on-banks/

    Concerned about your money after recent bank failures? You might want to keep those thoughts to yourself.

    While some rushed to get their money after the collapses, at least one leading Democrat is pushing for censorship of those who do not have faith in the banking industry.

    The Democratic Party for more than a decade has alienated many of us in the party with its embrace of censorship and speech controls.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Totally not fascists.

      1. JimboJr   2 years ago

        The people who are constantly telling others to STFU or else, for the good of the collective, are living in an Orwellian world where the people they are silencing are the fascists for being angry about it

    2. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      It's become so mainstream in western leftist thought that it's literally the first thing they think of when they hear about something.

    3. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Above all, don’t mention toxic assets.

    4. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      They are so used to having such complete control of the narrative that they didnt' even think this might look bad.

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        ... they didnt’ even think this might look bad.

        Or they simply don't care how bad they look because they believe the gig is up and there's nothing anyone can do to stop them.

  25. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

    Parody is obsolete: Exhibit #115

    I assume @WSJopinion and @NRO will not only come out strongly against DeSantis on Ukraine, but also discuss whether being on the wrong side of the defining foreign policy issue of our time isn’t disqualifying for the presidency. Or are they merely the tail to Tucker’s dog?

    The same guy (KMW's former coworker) who wrote an entire book promoting the Iraq War is acting high & mighty about other people "being on the wrong side of the defining foreign policy issue of our time."

    #NeoconsHaveNoShame

    1. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

      So the voters don't get a choice on "the defining foreign policy issue of our time"

      1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

        Voters need to stay in their lane.

      2. Nardz   2 years ago

        Honestly, this might all be a work.
        DeSantis really didn't come out all that hard against the Ukraine insanity.
        He called it a territorial dispute, which is a good start. But otherwise he just said we shouldn't give the F16s or a blank check with no oversight...
        Not exactly a definitive or bold stance.

        1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

          Trump is positioning himself as the anti war candidate. If DeSantes is distancing himself from the Neocons even tepidly at this point I'm glad to hear it.

  26. Commenter_XY   2 years ago

    Stanford University...The inmates now rule the asylum.

    https://legalinsurrection.com/2023/03/the-stanford-law-school-culture-not-the-diversity-dean-is-the-problem-but-i-repeat-myself/

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Build the wall!

      1. JimboJr   2 years ago

        Can we do a 1:1 swap where we accept the illegal immigrants for a guaranteed deporting of a marxist? It would be a good trade

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          I suggested that last year. Seems fair, for locals who support immigration AND want socialist and/or anti-capitalist government.

  27. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    This doesn't look good.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/credit-suisse-sparks-global-de-risking-after-top-investor-bails

    As we detailed earlier, Credit Suisse Group AG's shares reached their lowest point ever, dropping by as much as 10%. This is the eighth consecutive session of decline, which comes in the wake of restructuring issues, delays in submitting its annual report due to 'material weakness' flagged by the SEC last week, and a broader industry selloff following the collapse of Silicon Valley Bank. In addition to these challenges, the troubled Swiss bank now faces a new problem: its top shareholder has said they will not invest any further due to the sharp decline in valuations.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      But what about their ESG program?

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Top rated like every other failing bank.

      2. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

        "we have assembled the most diverse team ever to lose all your money"

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          At least progressives can feel good about their losses.

    2. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Would anyone dare say they are holding toxic assets?

  28. SRG   2 years ago

    From the ABC Florida story:
    “We have one rule here at the Broward State Attorney’s Office – do the right thing, always," Pryor said in a statement.

    So that's another attorney on DeSantis's "to remove" list.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Don't you have to get ready for drag queen story hour?

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Shrike is busy practicing his British accent. He doesn't have time for that.

        1. SRG   2 years ago

          Not shrike, you cracker POS

          1. JesseAz   2 years ago

            I know. Youre "British shrike." *wink*

            1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

              That Brit is honing in on my action!

              Typically a classic liberal is immediately banned on a wingnut site so this one is quite entertaining.

              You know - wingnuts don't allow free speech on their sites.

              1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

                The word is "horning", not "honing".

              2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                No they aren't. They fill fox, nro, and others. Of course I mean leftist as you aren't a classical liberal.

  29. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/ByronYork/status/1635962255966707712

    In 2014, after Russia took Crimea, the NYTimes was oh-so gentle as it excused President Obama's inaction. 'Suggestions from the right that Mr. Obama should somehow use the military, or at least the threat of it, against Russia over Ukraine are irresponsible, to put it politely.'

    1. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      Russian Agents!

    2. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      They were being on the wrong side of the defining foreign policy issue of our time.

    3. Nardz   2 years ago

      Actually correct.
      Don't get tricked by all this "Putin didn't attack Ukraine when Trump was an office" or "Obama didn't send lethal aid" bs. That's the most insidious part of the psyop.
      US shenanigans in Ukraine, like sponsoring a coup in 2014, are wrong and offer no possible benefit to the American people. There are ONLY downsides and risk, no reward nor virtue.
      Criticizing Obama or Biden for being "weak" on Ukraine is walking right into the trap.
      They're manufacturing consent by giving you a political weapon bound to backfire, the use of which not only distracts from the actual wrongdoing (US involvement, and manipulation of, Ukraine), but also strengthens their case for escalating conflict and further vilifies Russia.
      It's induced psychosis.

      1. Nardz   2 years ago

        Reposting here because somehow this came up in the abortion article yesterday:

        Russia doesn’t want direct conflict with the US/NATO.
        This couldn’t be more obvious.
        The US has, and continues, committed dozens of acts of war over the last 13 months. Most of them blatantly and/or clumsily. At least once a week you have some dumb broad (like Lindsey Graham) from a NATO government saying we’re at war with Russia, we must win the war with Russia, Putin has to be overthrown, etc.
        Mucho cassus belli.
        Yet Putin acts like Russia is only at war with Ukraine, without denying US/NATO involvement. He’s limited combat to Ukrainian forces (who are definitely often foreigners) and infrastructure.
        Why?
        Much the same reason Trump told Iran “DON’T RETALIATE” when he obliterated Suleimani in Iraq:
        There’s no benefit to Russia of a wider war at the moment, much like Trump saw there was no benefit to war with Iran.
        What’s there to gain?
        Russia is accomplishing its goals probably even better than expected. Putin doesn’t want to possess western Ukraine- its utility is strictly as a borderland, thus buffer. Russia has established a line they’ve been fortifying that marks new borders, securing Crimea and the Donbass. Ukraine has lost the bulk of its fighting force, to the point they’re kidnapping teens and elderly people off the streets and in their homes. Ukraine’s and NATO’s equipment and weapons stockpiles are utterly depleted.

        Putin is so hated by the leaders of the “Liberal World Order” because he’s much smarter than they are. He consistently refuses to defer to their rules, and he knows their rules very well.
        He understands that the “democratic” west has to justify going full war, and he won’t give them enough to do that because it’s not in his/Russia’s interest. I’ve been watching him frustrate the hell out of anglosphere politicians for years because he knows passive-aggressive assaults rely on the target to defeat itself by submitting, and he stymies them by simply refusing.
        It’s hilarious.

        We could learn from Putin.
        He’s able to refuse their crybullying because he knows he’s not guilty and that his opponents, and the arguments used against him/Russia, aren’t in good faith. He has no delusions about that. Thus they’re rendered largely impotent because they don’t have the capacity of direct self assertion.

        Meanwhile most commenters here still haven’t learned that lesson, no matter how many times they get pissed on and told it’s raining. We still see people arguing here about what Reason should write about, or pointing out leftist hypocrisy, or arguing the logical/scientific merits.
        All that shit is incidental because the arguments put forth by Reason/chemjeff/Laursen/leftists aren’t being made in good faith. They aren’t representing themselves or their interests/concerns, in good faith.
        The point is the accusation, in much the same way as “the process is the punishment”.
        You don’t win by proving your point, you win by rejecting their legitimacy.
        Feel free to make all the arguments you want, but the most appropriate response to someone like spb is: “Begone, pedo”.

        Stop pretending leftists are real people with legitimate desires or genuine concerns. They are not.

        1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

          Well said. We're also witnessing a realignment of trade and currencies that does not bode well for the western world thanks to the economic war on Russia. Love him or hate him Putin is not stupid and he's exposing the Neocons as the idiots that they are.

        2. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

          "R-r-r-r-r-rubles! Sweeeeet Rubles!"
          --Mikhail Baryshnikov in White Nights.

    4. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      Those Putin apologists!

  30. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    This can't be good.

    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/3/15/us-accuses-russian-jet-of-downing-us-drone-what-we-know-so-far

    US and Russian officials have given conflicting accounts of what occurred on Tuesday over the Black Sea between the MQ-9 Reaper drone, valued at more than $30m and packed with sensitive US spying technology, and two Russian Su-27 fighter jets that were deployed to intercept the US aircraft.

  31. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/nypost/status/1635757335736995843

    Stacey Abrams takes new job at environmental group pushing for gas stove ban

    1. JimboJr   2 years ago

      "no one is trying to ban gas stoves"

      - progressives

    2. Super Scary   2 years ago

      How am I supposed to cook my bugs if I can't properly pan fry them?

      1. Longtobefree   2 years ago

        Set the pan out in the sun until it is hot enough.

      2. JimboJr   2 years ago

        ironically, where people actually cook bugs, they also burn dung as a fuel source. Surely they just havent been educated on how it isnt carbon neutral, and they will be changing their ways shortly

        1. Longtobefree   2 years ago

          Once food animals have been outlawed, where will they get the dung?

          1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

            Have more children.

  32. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Xi's influence is apparently greater than Biden's.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2023/03/15/does-chinas-role-in-saudi-iran-rapprochement-represent-a-new-order-.html

    When arch-rivals Saudi Arabia and Iran announced they were restoring diplomatic relations, much of the world was stunned — not only because of the breakthrough after years of mutual animosity, suspected attacks and espionage between the two countries, but because of who brokered the deal: China.

    1. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      Part of it is the detente with Iran and cooling of relations that SA anticipates from the Biden regime. They're diversifying their own foreign relations in response.

    2. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Fist bumps all around!

      1. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

        Among all the leaders who think a fist solves all problems. It's the rise of Islamo-Communo-Revanchism!

        Well, Fred Sanford had a reply to them:

        Fred Sanford Knock Out Reel
        https://youtu.be/vM6e3_RXiis

        And a special one for the Islamic Holy-Rollers in Iran and Saudi Arabia
        https://youtu.be/OqEo0eY8IFk

        🙂

    3. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

      They're all in cahoots! And of course, Russia is back together with Red China, so it's The Sixties, Seventies, and Eighties all over! Cold War II!

      Now who's the Churchill to announce a New Iron Curtain?

  33. JesseAz   2 years ago

    Julie Kelly shows documents showing the judge from the PB J6 trial refusing to allow the defense to show evidence of the DoJ spying on the defense teams strategy emails and the FBI destroying and hiding records.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/julie_kelly2/status/1633816908754567168

    Judge is a former member of the DoJ.

    1. Social Justice is neither   2 years ago

      So spying on the defense isn't relevant for the jury but should be looked at for a mistrial. The destruction of evidence can't be anything but relevant to the jury.

  34. JesseAz   2 years ago

    42000 federal employees fail to regularly file taxes. Apparently rules are in place to stop investigations of these tax practices.

    https://justthenews.com/government/federal-agencies/treasury-inspector-general-audit-42000-federal-employees-repeatedly

    1. Dillinger   2 years ago

      laws for thee not they. repeal the 16th.

  35. sarcasmic   2 years ago

    "The American Civil Liberties Union has filed a lawsuit against the D.C. National Guard for its use of military-grade helicopters on local protesters during 2020's demonstrations against police brutality,"

    There's so much wrong with that statement. First of all, the only peaceful protest was on J6. Every single "demonstration" by the left was in fact a full-blown riot. Every. Single. One. They destroyed property and killed police, yet not a single person was ever charged with a crime. How fair is that? It's not. So they deserved whatever they got. And why isn't there an article about Saint Babbitt to even out the biased reporting on the leftist riots? More proof that Reason hates Republicans.

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Poor sarc.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago

        Poor strawman too. Dead on arrival.

    2. sarcasmic   2 years ago

      At this point I'm surprised nobody is claiming that J6 never happened, that it was a deep fake, and the people arrested are just random Trump supporters.

      1. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

        Why are you surprised? Nobody ever claimed that. Just a lie you’ve invented. Done so you can ignore the violation of liberties by the government you support when it attacks the right.

        1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

          Your stupidity and dishonesty never ceases to amaze. I expressed surprise that nobody is claiming something, and your response is to call me a liar for claiming what I just said nobody claims. The cognitive dissonance makes my head hurt.

          1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            "At this point I’m surprised nobody is claiming that J6 never happened, that it was a deep fake"

            Watch 30 seconds of this J6 body cam footage, you obnoxious little retard.

            Then tell us how everything you claimed about it wasn't a lie.

          2. sarcasmic   2 years ago

            Oh look. It's the Canadian Cunt who, upon accidentally finding proof that I was indeed being impersonated, declared that it never happened because he'd rather push a lie than ever tell the truth. Do the world a favor and go die in a fire.

            1. JesseAz   2 years ago

              Cite?

              1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

                I don't hoard links like a pathetic mean girl. Sorry.

                1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

                  But you do lie like one caught with the neighbor boy and her pants around her ankles.

                  I gave you all the links and reposted them over multiple days, and every single time you ghosted the thread. And after several days of running and hiding every time you saw them, you decided to proclaim you were mute-banning me so you could continue to pretend you hadn't seen them.

                  You're like a fucking cartoon character.

                2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                  So you can't back up your lies and assertions?

          3. JesseAz   2 years ago

            Why are you surprised nobody is claiming something nobody has claimed?

            You've pushed this lie before like when you claimed Carlson said it. Which was a lie.

            Seen here: https://reason.com/2023/03/07/studies-link-marijuana-legalization-to-all-sorts-of-positive-public-health-outcomes/?comments=true#comment-9956429

            Nobody is pushing your invented strawman you've used repeatedly and you seem shocked that nobody is pushing your invented strawman. Why?

            You are literally lying about what people have said about J6 buddy.

            1. sarcasmic   2 years ago

              Your reading comprehension skills are terrible.

              1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

                Your writing skills are terrible.

              2. JesseAz   2 years ago

                What was wrong? You literally say

                Tucker claims everything was totally peaceful.

                Which he never said. You lied about it. Then admitted to not watching the videos to confirm.

                So what did I misrepresent buddy?

  36. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    Fuck California. Fuck Silicon Valley. Let them eat cat food in the dark.

    https://twitter.com/it_is_fareed/status/1635255953032617986

    Tech guys when the startup has money: "Our AI will crush you under its heel. We are rendering you, teeming human biomass, irrelevant. I am become death destroyer of worlds."

    Tech guys when the startup money is gone: "I'm just a rural farmer, farming my code. I'm a family man"

    1. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      farmers

      What were these assholes saying when farmers were getting trampled underboot by governments seeking to Reduce Emissions?

      1. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

        Where are they? They're buying up the farmland at cut rate prices.

      2. Super Scary   2 years ago

        So basically, we just need to tell all these tech bros to "learn to farm!", right?

        1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

          Yes. They didn't give a shit about other people losing their livelihoods so I feel no need to give a shit about them.

  37. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    The City of Rats and Shit, yet still might smell better than Versailles during the rule of Louis XIV.

    https://news.sky.com/story/paris-resembles-dump-as-more-than-5-000-tons-of-rubbish-festers-on-streets-following-binmen-strike-12833599

    Paris has been overwhelmed by more than 5,000 tons of waste as binmen remained on strike for a ninth consecutive day.

    The French capital has felt the malaise of overflowing bins, black bags, cardboard boxes, empty crates and rotting smells which are permeating its streets.

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      .. binmen…

      Who knew there was so much sexism in Europe?

  38. mad.casual   2 years ago (edited)

    Abortion “death penalty” bill doesn’t mention the death penalty. More than 20 South Carolina lawmakers are proposing the death penalty for women who get abortions, according to a slew of major media reports making the rounds this week. But the truth—while still very bad—is not quite as disturbing as these articles suggest.

    Wow. Fair. A, or some significantly better grade than Scott “Don’t Say Gay” Shackford, for effort.

    The gist of the bill is defining personhood to begin at fertilization. From a legal perspective, this is, quite frankly, bonkers on many levels. People cannot even tell they are pregnant until weeks after fertilization. And the majority of fertilized eggs do not go on to become viable pregnancies;

    Agreed. That’s why I, and many other moderates are in the 8-12 week, “heartbeat and brainwaves” camp. In the vein of good faith, clarity, and accuracy:

    somewhere between 10 and 40 percent will die before even being implanted in a woman’s uterus

    “Fail to attach” and/or “fail to form a viable blastula” (an *actual* clump or sack of cells without a heartbeat or brainwaves), not “die”. See how this mutual respect and good faith thing works?

    The bill contains provisions stating that...
    ...And it may make medical professionals slower to take action in situations when a pregnant woman's health is compromised if it puts the fetus at risk.

    Wait. This specifically exempts mothers and healthcare workers? That makes it sound like this bill is more aimed at 3rd party attackers who cause the death of a fetus or miscarriage otherwise and other cases of abuse. That the only "real" "threat" is healthcare workers, who've had no problems imposing wholly illegal and immoral bullshit COVID science on people for the last few years, will suddenly become squeamish about providing medical care to people in a process that *may* run afoul of the law? Maybe the good faith earned above was misplaced...

  39. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    Look who are women again:

    At Wellesley College, Students Vote to Admit Trans Men
    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/14/us/wellesley-college-trans-nonbinary.html

    Students supported a nonbinding referendum on Tuesday that calls for opening admission to all nonbinary and transgender applicants. Opponents say the school’s mission is to educate women.

    1. mad.casual   2 years ago

      Opponents say the school’s mission is to educate women.

      They voted to get educated good and hard.

    2. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      Those dudes are gonna slay.

      1. Outlaw Josey Wales   2 years ago

        Will Transplaining be the next big complaint?

    3. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      If any students claim rape they are transphobic, right?

  40. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    George Conway says we're looking at 3 possible indictments for Donald Trump — but those won't stop Trump from running for president

    https://www.businessinsider.com/george-conway-trump-indictments-georgia-mar-a-lago-stormy-daniels-2023-3

    Stupid progs wasting their time.

    As Sandra has taught us Fatass Donnie is above the law. He is more Teflon than any ex POTUS in history.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      Conway was married to Kellyanne Conway, a senior Trump aide, for 22 years. The two announced earlier this month that they are splitting up.

      Some bad blood and a bit of anger there, George Conway?

      Trump congratulated Kellyanne Conway after the announcement, writing on Truth Social: "Congratulations to Kellyanne Conway on her DIVORCE from her wacko husband, Mr. Kellyanne Conway. Free at last, she has finally gotten rid of the disgusting albatross around her neck."

      Trump and George Conway have had an acrimonious past. In one tweet in 2019, Trump referred to Conway as a "husband from hell."

      Conway is now a vocal critic of Trump. In November, he said Trump is bound to lose in 2024 because "too many Americans would crawl on broken glass to vote against him."

      Yep, George Conway is definitely a reliable source there, Pluggo.

      1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

        Is "stupid prog" not clear enough for you?

        1. Sevo   2 years ago

          Turd, the ass-clown of the commentariate, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, a TDS-addled shit-pile and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
          If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
          turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

          1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            ^this

      2. Sevo   2 years ago

        "...Conway is now a vocal critic of Trump. In November, he said Trump is bound to lose in 2024 because “too many Americans would crawl on broken glass to vote against him.”..."

        TDS-addled shits are certain everyone shares their dementia.

    2. Sandra (formerly OBL)   2 years ago

      You #Resistance schmucks have been regurgitating bombshell tipping point walls closing in beginning of the end for half a decade now. It's gotten to the point where even if Trump finally goes to prison you don't deserve credit for accidentally being right.

      #BrokenClock

      PS — Don't ignore the fact that Democrats know Biden sucks and could benefit from a weak 2024 opponent like Trump.

      #PiedPiper2ElectricBoogaloo

      1. mad.casual   2 years ago

        It’s gotten to the point where even if Trump finally goes to prison you don’t deserve credit for accidentally being right.

        Blackstone's Ratio: Better to let 10 guilty men go free than to punish one innocent man.
        Garland's "Ratio": Just keep prosecuting innocent people and eventually we'll get Trump.

    3. Super Scary   2 years ago

      "George Conway says we’re looking at 3 possible indictments for Donald Trump"

      Is this it? Are the walls finally closing in? Surely this time, it'll work.

      1. Sevo   2 years ago

        A late library book return and two unpaid parking tickets - biggest crook ever to walk the streets!

      2. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        Are the walls finally closing in?

        No, but it is "the beginning of the end." For real this time!

  41. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    I wish those idiots would add WWI to the list.

    https://twitter.com/RyanGirdusky/status/1635504130004340736

    Liberals have only three references for history

    1) WWII - someone is literally Hitler
    2) Civil Rights Era - mutilating a child’s genitals is literally civil rights like MLK
    3) The Red Scare - Republicans are literally Joseph McCarthy trying to silence people

    1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      Their history doesn't go back as far as WWI. If it's not 1941 or later, they don't know of it.

      1. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

        Don't forget the nation being founded in 1619.

      2. Mr. JD   2 years ago

        Their history doesn't go back to 2022 if they don't want it to.

        "What, no, nobody ever tried to mandate COVID vaccines!"

    2. rev-arthur-l-kuckland   2 years ago

      Their history starts at year 0

  42. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    https://twitter.com/Oilfield_Rando/status/1635517044958306304

    You’re exactly right. Republican governors should be doing any and everything to remove deep blue city politicians from power and disenfranchise their voters. Turn them into vassal regions.

    I’m not even kidding. Blue state governors are doing it to their rural voters. Let’s go!

  43. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Moral lectures from failing banks and others.

    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/tucker-carlson-getting-moral-lectures-banks

    Most people got poorer during the COVID lockdowns, probably poorer than they realize. They're finding out now, unfortunately, but the tech companies got a whole lot richer and it's simple. Why? Politicians forced the entire population indoors at gunpoint. Millions of people had no choice but to live out their lives in the lonely hell of the internet. That turned out to be a disaster for America as rising suicide rates now attest, but for Silicon Valley, it made for an epic payday and that epic payday was soon reflected epically on the balance sheets of its biggest local lenders, which was called Silicon Valley Bank.

    So, we're getting moral lectures from the banks and we're getting a lecture on capitalism from some Ukrainian oligarch in a sweatshirt. OK, now.

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      Other peoples money:

      Silicon Valley Bank Pledged Nearly $74 Million To Black Lives Matter Causes

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        Meh. That's reparations for only 25 people.

  44. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    “You are erasing our trans babies” – Florida Democrat Anna Eskamani
    https://twitchy.com/amy-313134/2023/03/14/you-are-erasing-our-trans-babies-florida-democrat-anna-eskamani/

    1. mad.casual   2 years ago (edited)

      OK, I might need someone to help walk me through this. If Roe were reinstated, we’d be returning men who dress as women their human right to erase trans babies, correct? And without Roe, women who can actually get pregnant are unable to exercise their human right to erase trans babies, correct? So ending Roe to prevent the erasure of trans babies by women was the right decision, correct?

    2. mad.casual   2 years ago

      Oh, shit! You left off the best part:

      “Anna is why we lose,” one top Democrat, speaking under the condition of anonymity, told The Florida Standard.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        It remains unclear what exactly “trans babies” are and who is “erasing” them. Democrats, Republicans and members of the public alike are mystified at the meaning of Eskamani’s outburst.
        The Florida Standard reached out to the Florida Democratic Party but was unable to get an explanation.
        But privately, Democratic leaders fumed at Eskamani after the strange act.
        “Anna is why we lose,” one top Democrat, speaking under the condition of anonymity, told
        The Florida Standard.

        WTF is a "trans baby" anyway? If it's from a transwoman, then how does one abort a crap?

    3. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      this is just proggie word salad. It doesnt have to make any sense, it just needs to include enough approved sacred terminology to signal to the team, like a bat signal for bolsheviks.

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago (edited)

        ^This^

        In fact, when it comes to Progressive Word Salad, the less sense it makes to us normal people, the better. Then they can sit back and pat themselves on the back being so super-duper smart, or some shit.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          But it does reinforce wine-box women's white guilt and make soy boys all quivery.

  45. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

    Abortion is the most important right.

    People cannot even tell they are pregnant until weeks after fertilization. And the majority of fertilized eggs do not go on to become viable pregnancies; somewhere between 10 and 40 percent will die before even being implanted in a woman's uterus, and upwards of 50 percent may eventually be miscarried.

    So charging, much less convicting someone with proof of malice beyond a reasonable doubt, should be nearly impossible in such instances.

    But the idea that personhood begins at conception is not a totally fringe idea

    The fact that you're implying that it might be a fringe idea, though, shows you are thoroughly ignorant on the teachings of most major world religions.

    South Carolina Republicans want at least 30 years imprisonment for women who get abortions is certainly a terrifying proposition in and of itself.

    Wait, are women independent beings with moral agency or are they delicate flowers who need a man's protection and can't be held accountable for their actions? I'm just trying to keep up.

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Women should be granted superpowers to decide the fate of the unborn, but men must be saddled with support payments.

      1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

        "If you can kill this motherfuckerer, I can at least abandon 'em. It's my money, my choice," - Dave Chapelle

        1. Outlaw Josey Wales   2 years ago

          That was a funny line. Provocative.

        2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          Sorry, Dave. All money belongs to the state, er, people, er collective.

      2. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        Back to the BAD law justifies BAD law narrative?

    2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      "The fact that you’re implying that it might be a fringe idea, though, shows you are thoroughly ignorant on the teachings of most major world religions."

      And medical textbooks. Conception is pretty obviously the starting point of an individual human being.

      "B-b-but only the birth canal fairy can confer 'personhood' you know"

      1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        LOL...
        individual: [noun] a particular being or thing as distinguished from a class, species, or collection.

        Apparently your medical books have no idea about word definitions.
        Since the unborn unicorns of a pregnancy are still part of a collective unit.

        1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

          individual: [noun] a particular being or thing as distinguished from a class, species, or collection: such as. a single human being as contrasted with a social group or institution. ----> a single organism as distinguished from a group <------. a particular person.

          Should've posted the whole definition it just gets better from there.

          1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            So you're arguing that embryos and fetuses aren't that? Did you even graduate middle school science?

            Hell, fetuses born prematurely at only four and a half months have survived and are now going to school. What makes them people and not a fetus aborted later at five months?

            Frankly you're a fucking monster for even trying to defend this shit.

            1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

              And thus was the very 'reasoning' behind the Roe v Wade at 21 weeks.

  46. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

    Meta says it will lay off 10,000 more employees.

    Damn that Elon Musk and his embrace of free speech!

  47. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    Great. I'm a white male cis slob - I guess I'm anti-racist now.

    Progness is just weaponized self loathing; you hate yourself, you can only feel good about yourself by trashing others.

    https://twitter.com/CollegeFix/status/1636004337536102404

    Tidy kitchens are 'racist' according to one professor.

    'What lies beneath the surface of this anti-messiness, pro-niceness stance is a history of classist, racist and sexist social structures.'

    1. Moonrocks   2 years ago

      Minorities are inherently dirty

      These people literally disgust me.

    2. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Plus, a dislike for cockroaches.

    3. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      https://www.thecollegefix.com/clean-pantries-are-racist-and-sexist-loyola-marketing-scholar/

      Clean pantries and tidy houses have “racist,” “sexist” and “classist” roots according to a marketing professor at Loyola University-Chicago.

      So, we have sexism and racism from the professor in insinuating that minorities and men are inherently filthy and dirty, and unable to maintain a clean house. Woke progressives keep showing off how they are the most racist, classist, and sexist people in the world.

      1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        The sheer contempt they have for the people always shows through. And then they wonder "Why are they voting against their best interests?" when the proles want nothing to do with them.

    4. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      ‘What lies beneath the surface of this anti-messiness, pro-niceness stance is a history of classist, racist and sexist social structures.’

      At this point, just embrace it.

      Yes. My kitchen is classist, racist and sexist. So?

    5. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

      You know who else was a notorious germ-a-phobe?

    6. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Guess what happens when we subsidize retarded insanity?

  48. Ra's al Gore   2 years ago

    Fuck Germany. Another decade or two of this and they'll welcome Putin's tanks.

    https://twitter.com/ClimateDepot/status/1636014618752475136

    Berlin faces climate referendum that could grant officials ‘immediate dictatorial powers’ – The ‘Climate Protection Council’ could limit car & airline travel | Climate Depot

    1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

      Meesa propose that the senate give immediately emergency powers to the Supreme Chancellor.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        The Germans did that in 1933. It didn't work out so great for them.

        1. DRM   2 years ago

          On the other hand, it worked out really well a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, right up until some idiot farm kid, radicalized by a religious fanatic, blew up more than 1.2 million people in a single terrorist attack.

  49. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

    A Muslim nation off the coast of Ecuador probably has some bitchin' food, though.

    https://twitchy.com/artistangie-313138/2023/03/15/newark-new-jersey-became-a-sister-city-with-a-fake-nation-and-we-cant-stop-laughing/

    1. mad.casual   2 years ago

      In fairness, I'm going to need to see proof that Newark is an actual city and not just some socialist shithole that everyone pretends is a city.

      1. HorseConch   2 years ago

        That's what happens when you are surrounded by diversity hires.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

          Geography is racist.

  50. Brandybuck   2 years ago

    Pro-Life Advocates 2020: "We don't want to throw mothers into prison!"

    Pro-Life Advocates 2023: "Throw them all in prison!"

    Not actually joking here. I am pro-life myself, but I kept hearing from pro-lifers that the goal wasn't to imprison people, only to stop the abortions. I kept responding that bans always lead to prison. But no, they only wanted to make abortions illegal, not to actually throw anyone in jail.

    Now it's 2023, and the second story this month about throwing mothers in jail. That's what "wrongful death" means. That's what "homicide" means.

    1. JesseAz   2 years ago

      The mother was not part of the charges.

      Try again brandy.

    2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      I am pro-life myself, but I kept hearing from pro-lifers that the goal wasn’t to imprison people

      It's my goal.
      Lazy sluts who have their kids ripped to shreds because they have a cruise to Ibiza booked in the spring, deserve the same sort of penalty as one who drowns them in the bathtub.

      1. raspberrydinners   2 years ago

        Man, you're gonna do just fine in hell.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          Is that where you send the baby-killers, or the people who think it's wrong, Tony?

      2. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        What kid? Pro-Lifers live in an imaginary indoctrinated land of psychotic BS.

        Don't kill my unicorn!!!! /s

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          It's not a unicorn until your magical birth canal fairy turns it into one.

          1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

            Then there is absolutely no reason at all not to support a right to Fetal Ejection now is there?

      3. Brandybuck   2 years ago

        My experience with pro-lifers is largely church and religious related. You just seem like an angry secularist. A pro-life Hitchens. The goal isn't to punish people the goal is save lives. Voluntary persuasion one on one with the mothers, not massive government intrusion with cops and jails and gallows.

    3. raspberrydinners   2 years ago

      How long until they stone them?

      You know it's on their minds. Hell, look at fuckface lament's comment replying to yours. These people are demented.

      1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        Yes, because believing it's okay to kill someone if the birth-canal fairy hasn't granted them "personhood" totally isn't demented.

        1. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

          This is the thing the ardent abortion fanatics dont get. You dont have to believe in Jesus to still have some concerns about the sanctity of human life and when it applies to the fetus.

          1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

            FREE the Fetus or just STFU!
            If you want to pretend out in lala land it's an individual then MAKE IT an individual for F'Sakes. You don't get to pretend it's an individual while F'EN refusing to allow it to be an individual.

            If you cannot support ?baby? freedom.
            UR supporting Gov-Gun FORCED reproduction.

            1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

              Evolution made it an individual and biology says so.
              Take your science-denying ass to Wikipedia or Gray's Anatomy (no, the medical textbook, not the TV show) and do some reading.

              "FORCED reproduction"

              99.9% of the time nobody forced them to fuck without contraception. People know what happens when you fuck unprotected. They made their choice.

              1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

                Exactly; It has nothing to do with 'killing' anything.
                It has EVERYTHING to do with someone's religious moral standard.
                The USA wasn't founded on legislating the [WE] mobs religious standards.

      2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        Agreed! Stoning is only suitable for hate-speechers and anyone else who makes some snowflakes feel threatened. Also, capitalists.

    4. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      Also with all laws, there is no way around putting people in prison if you actually want the law enforced.

      Most uniparty members on left or right side fail to understand this.

      This is how you end up with cops killing people in the park for selling single smokes and women getting the chair for having an abortion two weeks after the deadline.

      It's the statism, yo

      1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        +100000 Exactly..

      2. Brandybuck   2 years ago

        > Writer Freddie deBoer attempts a thorough (but critical) definition of woke politics.

        Precisely. I keep trying to explain this to my mother. She doesn't want to throw gays in jail, but at the same time she says "but it's not right, it should not be legal", as if waving the magic wand of legislation makes it all go away peacefully and gently into the cornfield. Ditto for abortion. Ditto for prostitution. Ditto for transsexuals.

        I htink drugs are bad, m'kay? Doesn't mean I want drug prohibition. Morality is not legislation and legislation is not morality. The Duopoly voters don't understand this. Cultural conservatives don't understand this and neither do the Progressives.

    5. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

      “We don’t want to throw mothers into prison!”

      Technically, it's the women who aren't mothers who get thrown into prison. The way to avoid prison is to become a mother.

      1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        Gov-Gun FORCED reproduction.......... As I've said all along.

    6. mad.casual   2 years ago

      Not actually joking here.
      Lie or foisting stupidity on others.

      I am pro-life myself,
      Lie or foisting stupdity on others.

      but I kept hearing from pro-lifers that the goal wasn’t to imprison people, only to stop the abortions. I kept responding that bans always lead to prison. But no, they only wanted to make abortions illegal, not to actually throw anyone in jail.

      The goal of football isn't to get injured and playing football doesn't always lead to injury and, indeed, many of the rules of football are designed and have been demonstrated to prevent injury but, of course, you knew this.

      Now it’s 2023, and the second story this month about throwing mothers in jail.

      You mean the story that even Elizabeth Nolan Brown in her first paragraph delineates is hyperbolic?

      That’s what “homicide” means.

      No it's not. Plenty of people who commit homicide walk free. Whether the justice system can't identify them or does and errs on the side of caution or other, they walk free all the time.

      That’s what “wrongful death” means.

      Above, rather literally, x10.

      But, of course, you know all of this and aren't actually trying to encourage freedom or thought or conscious reflection or virtue, you're just trying to deceive and misdirect people. Whip them up to oppose whatever vague conception of The Republic of Gilead that exists in your head and whatever society needs to be established and defended to prevent it, because that's what Crusaders do.

      1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        Intended death is murder; making the day after pill murder.
        We've seen the sugar-coating "it's not that bad" long before throwing out Roe v Wade (the 4th and 13th Amendments rights).

  51. Sevo   2 years ago

    "San Francisco Region Set to Ban Gas Appliances — But Not Stoves"
    [...]
    "The San Francisco Bay Area is poised to ban new home furnaces and water heaters that burn natural gas — but not gas-fired stoves — as states, cities and political parties fight over the fuel’s future.
    The region’s air pollution regulators are scheduled to vote Wednesday on the proposed ban, which would take effect in several stages from 2027 through 2031 depending on the size and type of equipment. Notably, the proposal does not target gas-burning stoves, which have emerged as a cultural flashpoint in the debate over phasing out in-home use of the fossil fuel..."
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-15/san-francisco-region-set-to-ban-gas-appliances-but-not-stoves?leadSource=uverify%20wall

    Did the emperor grant this agency the power to do so?

    1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

      Month or so ago our electric went down due to an ice storm. Down in the 20s overnight. Burned up the firewood in the house and fired up the stove burners. Toasty warm all night.

      1. Sevo   2 years ago

        When a lot of the Sierra lost power, quite a few cranked up gas-powered gensets. Never underestimate a government agency's ability to fuck up.

        1. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

          portable generators are set to be banned in california come 2024.

          I got my dual fuel behemoth last year. When the earthquake comes i will be a generous god to my neighbors.

          1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

            Will you demand sexual favors?

            1. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

              naturally

  52. Super Scary   2 years ago

    Anyone notice Biden tried to pull the "from the mouth of babes" trick that democrats love so much?

    https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1635713664782041095?cxt=HHwWjoCw-ay6nLMtAAAA

    1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      I'm kind of curious as to what the "P.S." part of the letter said as someone erased it and then blurred it out.

    2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      From the comments:

      "Yes, a 4 year old girl named Charlotte is writing the president letters about her concern with the “gender pay gap.”

      “Alex, I’ll take stuff that never happened for $800.”

      1. mad.casual   2 years ago

        +1

      2. mad.casual   2 years ago

        @POTUS
        13.3M Views 50K Likes
        @CollinRugg
        344K Views 30K Likes

        LOL.

    3. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      this 4 year old girl is gonna be in for a shock as she gets older.

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        Learn to code! Or pole dance.

    4. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

      Someone needs to file a report with CPS-that 4 year old is being abused if people are making her worry about these things.

      1. mad.casual   2 years ago

        "For the ladies"? "Even I'm a child"?

        Personally, I think it sounds like a 40 yr. old who's never been around children is trying to ape the style of a 4-yr.-old and doing a poor job. Assuming they're the least bit honest, the letter literally sounds like a 4 yr. old is being forced to copy down and regurgitate someone else's list of demands that they don't understand, like a POW or a hostage.

  53. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

    Meta says Facebook and Instagram will stop allowing people to post news content in Canada if the Online News Act passes.

    Oh no.

  54. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    Well, Trump Is Now Suggesting Ron DeSantis Is a Pedophile
    The 2024 Republican primary isn't going to get ugly — it already is

    It was only a matter of time.

    https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-suggesting-ron-desantis-pedophile-1234675596/

    1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

      Against a man who has not declared if he is running or not for the Presidency. Plus, Rolling Stone kind of gave up credibility years ago.

      1. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

        Rolling Stone... *snicker*

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          It’s just quotes from TRUTH Social, so all easily verifiable. In fact, it is old news from about a month ago and reported in several other outlets.

      2. Dillinger   2 years ago

        loved RS in the 80s. still have several.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          I have only read Rolling Stone maybe two or three times, but someone left an issue around back in the 90s, with a naked blonde on the cover (not the Jennifer Aniston one, but some other blonde), and I remember I ripped the cover off and kept it.

          1. Dillinger   2 years ago

            I kept some choice issues ... u2 was a fave

    2. Sevo   2 years ago

      Turd, the ass-clown of the commentariate, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
      If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
      turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

    3. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

      You were banned from this site for posting links to child pornography. Go eat shit.

  55. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    JUST IN: Body cam footage emerges from inside the senate chamber, rebuking the narrative created by the J6 committee..

    Absolutely everything they told us was a lie. At this point I wouldn't be surprised if video emerges showing that it was actually Pelosi that shot Babbitt.

    1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

      Sullum will explain all of this tomorrow.

    2. A Thinking Mind   2 years ago

      Trigger warnings for AOC, she might be traumatized by having to re-live the moment she wasn't there for.

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        A rape-fantasy fantasy?

  56. Dillinger   2 years ago

    >>use of military-grade helicopters on local protesters

    "sorry guys, somebody let JAFR take the stick."

  57. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    US Intel Agencies Need to Focus Intensely on ‘Diversity, Equity, Inclusion,’ Intelligence Chief Says

    Beats having them organize coups at home and censoring the internet. Hopefully future agents will have the usual level of talent found in diversity hires.

  58. SRG   2 years ago

    Looks like a real Bubba-fest today. Don't forget your insulin shots!

  59. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

    More than 20 South Carolina lawmakers are proposing the death penalty for women who get abortions, according to a slew of major media reports making the rounds this week. But the truth—while still very bad—is not quite as disturbing as these articles suggest.

    In other words, they were lying. How hard is it to just say it?

    1. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

      When it's the Team Blue, impossible. If it was a deplorable, that'd be her go-to.

    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      No, they weren’t plainly lying. They were assuming a worst case scenario that IS actually possible. The blog post above explains that subtle point.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        Cite?

        1. EscherEnigma   2 years ago

          A: The bill makes abortion (in many cases) homicide.
          B: Homicide is a death-penalty offense in South Carolina.

          A + B: The bill makes abortion (in many cases) a death-penalty offense in South Carolina.

          Brown trying to hide behind "it doesn't mandate the death penalty" is a ridiculous bar that make it a "lie" to call any offense a "death penalty offense", since in all cases prosecutors have the option to pursue a lesser punishment.

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        They were assuming a worst case scenario that IS actually possible.

        No it isn't, and you and they both know it, you lying fuck.

        1. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

          Everybody knows that technically true/ only true from a certain point of view is the best kind of "true."

        2. EscherEnigma   2 years ago

          South Carolina Code of Laws, Title 16, Chapter 3, Article 1, Section 16-3-20 A:

          A person who is convicted of or pleads guilty to murder must be punished by death, or by a mandatory minimum term of imprisonment for thirty years to life

          The proposed law in question will make many cases of abortion into homicide cases. Homicide cases are death penalty cases.

          This isn't complicated.

    3. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      Many of Cynicals’ comments today illustrate what I have said many times about many of the commenters here: Reason displeases them, not because Reason takes the wrong positions or does the wrong analysis, but because Reason’s editorial style is calm and rational, never engaging in diatribes or condemning people. If you are someone who is looking for confirmation of your passion and outrage, Reason doesn’t satisfy that need.

      1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

        Why do you continue to defend a publication that is nothing more than something to read over coffee?

      2. JesseAz   2 years ago

        I can point you to the DeSantis, j6, nuclear secret articles if you want me to.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          Don't show him proof, you jerk. Are you trying to force poor Mike to mute you again?

      3. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

        Cite? lol

  60. Dillinger   2 years ago

    >>the idea that personhood begins at conception is not a totally fringe idea

    lol 2000 years of generations of Christians all on line 2

    1. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

      What're the Muslims, chopped liver?

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        I was going to put alone after Christians but rethought because I didn't know the Islam stance on conception.

    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      The Catholic Church’s official position that life begins at conception dates back to 1869 when Pope Pius IX issued the Apostolicae Sedis.

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        lol. seven generations of Catholics dating back to 1869 and Islam all on line 3.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          Did you not claim “2000 years” above?

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        And it was an unofficial position for 2000 years. Surgical abortion not being a thing an "official" position was unnecessary.

        Protestants too - “The fetus, though enclosed in the womb of its mother, is already a human being and it is a monstrous crime to rob it of the life which it has not yet begun to enjoy.” - John Calvin, 1569

      3. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

        Man, you sure showed him, Mike!

      4. Cronut   2 years ago

        Even prior to that, the church's official position was that abortion is a grave sin as it goes against the natural law. You won't find that on wikipedia. You have to actually read Aquinas.

    3. EscherEnigma   2 years ago

      For most of history, Abrahamic faiths have largely agreed "ensoulment" (and person-hood) happens at "quickening", which is well after conception.

      1. Super Scary   2 years ago

        "happens at “quickening”, which is well after conception."

        Wait...we're all Highlanders?

        1. Dillinger   2 years ago

          I hope so I'm totally in on the who wants to live forever thing.

      2. Cronut   2 years ago

        And most Abrahamoc faiths also hold that the question of ensoulment is irrelevant to the issue of abortion. Abortion is always wrong either before or after ensoulment, because it goes against the natural law.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          Cite?

        2. EscherEnigma   2 years ago

          You can argue that most Abrahamic faiths today hold that position.

          But historically? Nah. Pre-quickening is fine, so-goes the traditional view.

    4. Mr. JD   2 years ago

      Literally everyone everywhere for almost all of history is on line 2.

      Most of the world TODAY is with them.

    5. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      Oh, yes. I remember that verse in the New Testament where Jesus tells us how we should think about abortion.

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        you're gonna throw down Jesus as a conception argument.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          Are you saying His opinion doesn’t count because he was immaculately conceived?

      2. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

        My favorite part is how you somehow think you're winning your argument with these statements.

      3. Cronut   2 years ago

        Of you think Jesus was ever ambiguous about abortion, perhaps you should stop talking about Jesus.

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago (edited)

          Please quote a New Testament verse about abortion for me.

    6. SRG   2 years ago

      Well, Judaism has generally taken the view that a fetus isn't a person until birth - and for example, in the Mishnah it was permitted to execute a pregnant woman until the greater part of the baby's head had emerged. Naturally there are disagreements and no categorical universal position

      1. Dillinger   2 years ago

        ya thanks. I tiptoed around Judaism & Islam

  61. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Most of our proggy commenters here (Mike, Sqrlsy, Hank, etc) are over 65, so this comes as no surprise.

    AARP’s History of Promoting “Family Friendly” Drag Events

    1. Social Justice is neither   2 years ago

      Their target age group is when men have a collapse of testosterone and are prone to such.

  62. Dillinger   2 years ago

    Nonetheless,

    if Nonetheless is necessary immediately after the paragraph explaining how the bill works ...

  63. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    "But the idea that personhood begins at conception is not a totally fringe idea"

    In the 1800's slaves and women were acknowledged as human but weren't regarded as "persons" under the law.

    Conferring and withholding "personhood" from certain humans was always any evil idea pushed by evil people in order to do evil things.

    1. Mr. JD   2 years ago

      "Not a totally fringe idea" in this article refers to an idea that the majority of the world's population holds and which was virtually universal until recent history.

    2. Cronut   2 years ago

      Yeah, this is the grossest part of the whole argument- the idea that personhood can be assigned by other people, based on "scientific" criteria.

      If it weren't so evil it would be funny, because in one breath, they want to assign humanity according to their own criteria, and on the other, they cry about how conservatives "dehumanize" trannies, gays, blacks... Whoever they're crying about today.

      1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

        “the idea that personhood can be assigned by other people, based on ‘scientific’ criteria.”

        What’s the alternative? Religious criteria? Completely arbitrary criteria?

        1. Dillinger   2 years ago

          agency through existence.

          1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

            Unfertilized eggs and sperm exist. If existence is the bar then shouldn’t we bestow personhood on them, too?

            1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

              Do eggs and sperm have a complete genetic code? If you leave sperm in your ballsack and don't rip it to shreds will it eventually leave, get a drivers license, a wife and a watch for retirement? Does masturbating into your sock break tiny bones, shred organs, stop brain activity and a heartbeat?
              I'm becoming increasingly convinced that you abortion fanatics are so because you don't understand basic biology.

              After your HO2 fiasco one might think you'd steer clear from pontificating on science, but I guess not.

    3. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      Just wondering: what's the correlation of people who demand unrestricted abortion and also demand we stop eating animals because they are living creatures?

    4. TJJ2000   2 years ago

      Ironically Pro-Life doesn't seem to recognize the Women-Slaves they are creating AT-ALL since their entire Unicorn-Fairy-Tale focus never acknowledges that "person-hood".

      Funny; Why it's almost exactly how the [WE] mobsters kill all Individual rights. Because in [WE] gangs; YOU don't exist.

      If you cannot support ?baby? freedom.
      UR supporting Gov-Gun Forced reproduction.

  64. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

    Low-flying helicopter during 2020 protest "constituted assault, battery, and intentional infliction of emotional distress under D.C. law," alleges lawsuit. "The American Civil Liberties Union has filed a lawsuit against the D.C. National Guard for its use of military-grade helicopters on local protesters during 2020's demonstrations against police brutality," reports DCist. "The D.C. ACLU filed the suit on behalf of 25-year-old Dzhuliya Dashtamirova, a protester who said she incurred injuries from the Guard's low-flying tactics on June 1, 2020, which blew dirt, glass, and debris into the air."

    Oh fuck off, ACLU, is this really where you're going to put your energy with everything that happened between 2019 and 2023?

    1. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

      Of course it is. You must be confusing the ACLU with some sort of organization that gives a shit about civil liberties over perpetuating the progressive narrative.

    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      How much do you contribute to the ACLU, again?

      1. Don't look at me!   2 years ago

        Why would that matter?

        1. Derp-o-Matic 6000   2 years ago

          Clearly you do not appreciate the depths of Mike's genius

          1. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

            Yep, his genius is about as deep as the Platte River during a drought.

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        Mike says you can't criticize anyone unless you give them money. I guess Mike can't talk about the Republicans anymore...

        Hey Mike, you dirty thief, you whine about me constantly. Pay up.

        1. Super Scary   2 years ago

          It's unreasonable to ask a lefty to live by the standards they impose on others. You're being unreasonable.

    3. mad.casual   2 years ago

      military-grade helicopters

      Sure as shit you click the link and there's the helicopter: white field with a red cross emblazoned on the side.

      So, not a case of black helicopters or people being snatched up into unmarked vehicles but a no-shit medivac from a location where people were rioting and throwing shit.

      I'm only modestly surprised they didn't blame the Swiss.

      1. Super Scary   2 years ago

        "white field with a red cross emblazoned on the side."

        You've seen what they did to ambulances during those protests; they hate those things. If anything, putting a red cross on the helicopter makes it worse!

  65. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Transparency Review Links Gov. Gavin Newsom and Silicon Valley Bank

    1. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      Because of course

  66. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

    Meta says Facebook and Instagram will stop allowing people to post news content in Canada if the Online News Act passes.

    Um... you know who else wasn't able to post news content in America in the complete absence of an American Online News Act?

    1. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

      And by the way, I can't think of a more effective way to choke off misinformation than this policy.

    2. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

      A few people who privately-owned social media sites judged to be posting misinformation or being abusive in their communications.

      1. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

        privately-owned social media sites judged

        Wow, could you get more wronger?

        1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago

          How so? Now hand waving or gaslight-y insinuations, please.

        2. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

          Can you imagine being dumb enough to believe that these sites were just simply acting on their own accord ?

          It would be like believing the hunter biden laptop was russian misinformation , or that the wuhan virus came from bat soup.

          Or..... you'd have to be fedposting.

      2. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

        Reason's own Robby Soave.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          If White Mike says it happened, you can safely bet against it. If Mike declaims against it then you can bank on it.
          I've never seen someone as consistently wrong as him.

          1. Minadin   2 years ago

            Paul Ehrlich hardest hit.

          2. Super Scary   2 years ago

            If Mike said the sky was blue, I would go outside to check.

      3. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

        Define "misinformation", fascist.

  67. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Survey: 3 in 5 American Workers Fear Sharing Religious, Political Views in Workplace

    I bet I know what political persuasion that the two who don't hold.

    1. Diane Reynolds (Paul.)   2 years ago

      Don't ask, don't tell.

    2. Super Scary   2 years ago (edited)

      I’m a millennial and even I know the “big three” of things you shouldn’t talk about at work (and the dinner table) are religion, politics and your paycheck. Of course, things have shifted a lot and now it’s more about hiding your beliefs instead of just trying to have polite conversation.

    3. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

      I don't know. How many evangelical leftists actually work?

  68. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Mike has a sad, Jeff inconsolable.

    Florida to revoke Hyatt Regency Miami liquor license after ‘sexually explicit’ show with children

    Apparently waving dildos at kids and Santa humping "Screwdolph the Red-Nippled Reindeer" was just a bit too much for the prudes and religious freaks in Florida.

    1. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

      Drag shows for children are the most important thing EVAR!

      Florida is ERASING trans people!

    2. Social Justice is neither   2 years ago (edited)

      Too much depravity for Florida man? Is there even a circle of hell that deep?

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

        What about Florida trans-man?

  69. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Every single conspiracy theory coming true.

    That was 5 years ago. Surely Bill Gates has changed since then.

    Another citation for our resident sealion: HCG Found in WHO Tetanus Vaccine in Kenya Raises Concern in the Developing World

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      Related: Non-Consensual Research In Africa, The Outsourcing Of Tuskegee

      1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

        It's a shame Margaret Sanger isn't around to see this.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          We have Shrike and Tony. They're similar.

    2. Gaear Grimsrud   2 years ago

      Amazing replies by people who think this totally cool because there are too many Africans on the planet destroying the environment or something.

    3. Super Scary   2 years ago

      Like with "racism," the left has deluded the meaning of a "conspiracy theory" so much that it is a meaningless label now used only to attack enemies.

    4. mad.casual   2 years ago

      HCG Found in WHO Tetanus Vaccine in Kenya Raises Concern in the Developing World

      I've pointed it out before, but *this* is what public health should be about. *If* you injected *every* 10-yr.-old in a/the country with a drug that worked like this, it wouldn't necessarily be until they were 18-20 yrs. old that you would know the full breadth and depth of it and, by that time, everyone involved in the action would've had ~10 yrs. to cover it up (not that they would've necessarily needed to but, the future is hard to predict sometimes).

      Instead of a public health organization that even tangentially recognizes "Keep Calm and Carry On"-style stoicism/conservatism, we get the one that jumps on board with vaccinating every last 10 yr. old by law within 1-2 yrs.

  70. EscherEnigma   2 years ago (edited)

    Now, this may be cold comfort, considering it is possible that the law could lead to the death penalty for women who get abortions. The death penalty is one possible punishment for people who plead guilty to or are convicted of murder, and that’s certainly worth mentioning in coverage of the Prenatal Equal Protection Act. But there’s nothing in the code saying that people convicted of murder must or necessarily should receive the death penalty. And—call me naive, but—I find it unlikely that the state would pursue it in abortion cases, or that courts would uphold this penalty if it tried.

    Okay, you’re naive.

    The law would make abortion in most cases murder. The death penalty is on the table for murder cases in South Carolina. Ipso facto, the law makes the death penalty a possible punishment for abortion.

    Does it mandate it? No. But that’s a ridiculous caveat to slap on. Death penalty cases are not defined by whether or not the law requires prosecutors to go for the death penalty, but whether they can. Ignoring this is more then naive, it’s duplicitous.

    1. Mr. JD   2 years ago

      Yours is the ridiculous position. You may as well complain that vehicular homicide "could" result in the death penalty.

      1. raspberrydinners   2 years ago

        I think it's a perfectly valid argument, especially as you see just how much more extreme they're going after Roe v Wade was overturned.

        Don't blame someone for seeing clearly the cliff they are driving towards at a fast rate.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          Of course you would, Tony. Shrill alarmism despite obvious indicators of the opposite has always been your schtick.

      2. EscherEnigma   2 years ago

        I mean, only if you didn't check South Carolina's laws first.

        They specify, quite clearly, that vehicular homicide (and it goes on for a paragraph defining that) is punishable by fines, imprisonment, and losing your driver's license.

        It's kinda like criminal codes actually specify what punishments are tied to which offenses.

        1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

          Yet vehicular homicide doesn't include pre-planned homicide.
          Pro-Life is very much aimed at prosecuting women who refuse to reproduce.

  71. Mr. JD   2 years ago

    Imagine believing that people who murder should be charged with murder.

    Then imagine that criticism of this position doesn't address whether it is murder, nor does it address the fact that most of the world regards it as murder and through nearly all of history it has been regarded as murder.

    1. Mike Laursen   2 years ago (edited)

      “through nearly all of history it has been regarded as murder”

      I’m going to have to ask for a cite on that claim.

      1. I, Woodchipper   2 years ago

        Cite bro strikes again!

      2. Mother's Lament   2 years ago (edited)

        “The fetus, though enclosed in the womb of its mother, is already a human being and it is a monstrous crime to rob it of the life which it has not yet begun to enjoy. If it seems more horrible to kill a man in his own house than in a field, because a man’s house is his place of most secure refuge, it ought surely to be deemed more atrocious to destroy a fetus in the womb before it has come to light. – John Calvin, Commentary on Exodus 21:22, 1563 AD

        “You shall love your neighbor more than your own life. You shall not slay a child by abortion. You shall not kill that which has already been generated” – Non-canonical Epistle of Barnabas 19.5, 130 AD

        “Do not murder a child by abortion or kill a new-born infant” – Didache 2.2, c. 100 AD

        “In [the] Buddhist view, both having an abortion and performing an abortion amount to murder. Those involved in abortions will face distress in both this life and the next because their sins will follow them.”
        – Phramaha Vudhijaya Vajiramedhi

        Traditional Buddhist embryologies describe conception as the union of the male and female sexual fluids with the transmigrating consciousness in the mother’s womb during her fertile period

        1. Dillinger   2 years ago

          cite! love it.

        2. TJJ2000   2 years ago

          Please demonstrate how this 'human being' has an INHERENT right to life?

          1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            Go be stupid somewhere else. White Mike was claiming pro-life stances were modern, I provided citations proving otherwise.

            1. TJJ2000   2 years ago (edited)

              Citations to…. “what-about the science???”
              That completely contradicts *reality*?

              Sounds like a leftard position to me in all shapes and forms.
              More Gov-Gangster-Guns in people’s life’s will save everyone!/s

              P.S. Nice avoidance of the question.
              You know the answer; There is no *inherent* right to life.
              And because it's not inherent it's not a right at all but an *entitlement*.

          2. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

            That human beings are an end in themselves is a basic premise of classical liberalism and the idea of universal human rights. If that premise is wrong then libertarian philosophy is wrong on its face. You can argue that for reasons the right to life does not apply during the conception to birth phase of a human life, but you have to make an argument, not just advance it as a given.

            1. TJJ2000   2 years ago (edited)

              It’s flat out REALITY…

              INHERENT meaning: 1. existing as a natural or basic part of something: 2. existing as a natural or basic part of…

              If said organism cannot have LIFE without *entitlement* to someone else’s womb then it has no INHERENT right to life. The USA isn’t founded on principles of *entitling* some at the EXPENSE of others.

              It's a violation of the 4th and 13th Amendments.

    2. SRG   2 years ago

      the fact that most of the world regards it as murder and through nearly all of history it has been regarded as murder.

      Bullshit.

      1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        How so, Shrike?

        If I give you twenty citations predating 1000 AD, will you promise to fuck off and go punting on the Thames instead of trolling here?

        1. SRG   2 years ago

          Still not shrike, and, as I've said before, I punted on the Cherwell, not the Thames.

          You may well have plenty of references, from Christian sources, but that was not the claim. We already know

          Meanwhile, as you've insisted I have the same style, etc. as shrike, this is easy to test. Paste some of my posts into a word document, and use the document stats function to note readability stats - index, grade level, sentence length, etc. Then do the same for Shrike's posts. You'll find that they're not even close. And you can't claim that, "ah, you're deliberately writing in a different style" because you've already stated that our styles are identical.

          And anyone else can do the same test - so if you do decide to test, and then lie about the results, which on current evidence you might well do, they can check

          1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            Cherwell is a tributary of the Thames and becomes the Thames proper at the University College Boathouse, an actual Oxfordian would know that.

            " from Christian sources, but that was not the claim. We already know"

            Which is why I also gave two Buddhist ones.

            How about the same deal, but I only use Buddhist, Hindu, Greco-Roman Pagan and Zoroastrian sources? And instead of 20 I'll give 40.

            1. SRG   2 years ago (edited)

              Cherwell is a tributary of the Thames and becomes the Thames proper at the University College Boathouse, an actual Oxfordian would know that.

              I do know that, of course. A tributary is not the actual river. And further, because you’re a dishonest cunt, if I had said I’d punted on the Thames, you’d have responded, “oh, but the river at Magdalen Bridge is the Cherwell, obviously you’ve not gone to Oxford”.
              And here's the link to my college photo:
              https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GUM6EuvPuhDH4hiAWyZBjorfJAY9cAdL/view?usp=share_link

              There may be an alternative explanation for why I would have such a photo, but even you will, or should, concede that the likeliest is that it's mine. I can also supply two photos from the annual dinner for the Queen's Bench (the Queen's College law society).

              How about the same deal, but I only use Buddhist, Hindu, Greco-Roman Pagan and Zoroastrian sources? And instead of 20 I’ll give 40.

              Still insufficient. The claim is about “through nearly all of human history”. Showing 10, 20 or 30 sources from say Buddhism doesn’t extend it through all of European, Asian, African,etc history, or that a particular Greek claiming that it’s against this Greek tribe’s practice extends to all Greece. If you claimed that most of the posters here were leftists, and cited 100 posts to prove it, all of which were from Sevo, it wouldn’t prove it.

      2. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        +10000
        Second that --------> Bullshit!!!!

  72. Moderation4ever   2 years ago

    Ms. Brown is correct that issues are too often discussed on the basis of the most absurd consequences of a law. But this is America today and people cannot critically discuss anything. The idea of women being given the death penalty for abortions is absurd, but so is the idea that women can get abortions in the 9th month. As noted, the idea of a fetal personhood bill is full of bad consequences, and it would be good to discuss the bill on those terms. But would require time and thought and a simple sentence seem to be better at getting people attention. That is too bad, but it is also our own choice.

    1. EscherEnigma   2 years ago

      To the contrary, refusing to rectify the "most absurd consequences" in a law, because "surely no prosecutor would actually [...]", is the sign of a bad legislator.

      And needing to rely on prosecutorial discretion in order to make the law a "good law"? Is the sign of a bad law.

      A good legislator says "oh, that is a problem. Let's fix that, either by changing the draft or passing an amendment to the law".

      A good law will exclude foreseen consequences that are unintended.

    2. TJJ2000   2 years ago (edited)

      LOL… Right…. “That is too bad, but it is also our own choice.” Where Democrats got their Democracy GOOD and HARD.

      Funny; But USA patriots recognize and honor a US Constitution and the Pro-Life’s threat to the 4th and 13th Amendments. Funny how the very Party that WROTE the Roe v Wade did everything they possibly could to destroy it not even 50-years later.

  73. raspberrydinners   2 years ago

    Distinction without a difference.

    They're so pro-life they'll kill you (or get damn close!)

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      Would you eat a fetus, Tony, if properly cooked?

      1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        One of the best signs of a BS argument is it's inability to stay on topic.

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

          How about you? Dead fetus capsules work better than viagra apparently.

          Bizarre craze behind smuggling of pills containing the powdered flesh of babies

          They're not "persons" so it's okay, right?

      2. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        How about a 30-year prison sentence for anyone who picks out a bugger and eats it during class?

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  75. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

    "The gist of the bill is defining personhood to begin at fertilization. From a legal perspective, this is, quite frankly, bonkers on many levels."

    I suppose the presumption that individual human organisms are people has often been considered bonkers over the centuries. It has even come to violence at times, such as around 160 years ago. However, it is kind of one of the central propositions of classical liberal philosophy.

    "People cannot even tell they are pregnant until weeks after fertilization. And the majority of fertilized eggs do not go on to become viable pregnancies; somewhere between 10 and 40 percent will die before even being implanted in a woman's uterus, and upwards of 50 percent may eventually be miscarried."

    So if a particular demographic group dies at a prodigious rate, that means they are not persons? What is the threshold rate at which this applies? For instance, humans with gender dysphoria attempt suicide at a rate of 40%. Does that mean they are not persons under the principle ENB is proposing? I would not say so myself, but I am not suggesting demographic death rates as way of determining personhood.

    "Legally defining personhood as beginning at conception creates all sorts of thorny issues, from the serious (should the state start investigating all miscarriages as potential homicides?) to the odd (can a pregnant woman legally drive in a carpool lane?)."

    Does the state investigate every adult death as a potential homicide? If not, I do not see the point of this line of thinking. and the carpool lane argument is going to the surreal.

    These are hoary, old, sophomoric questions that are the start of a bad faith argument.

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

      "the majority of fertilized eggs do not go on to become viable pregnancies; somewhere between 10 and 40 percent will die before even being implanted in a woman’s uterus, and upwards of 50 percent may eventually be miscarried."

      Wait until ENB learns the natural death rate in retirement homes approaches 100%. She'll have to start arguing seniors aren't 'persons' too.
      Everything is sophistry with these people.

      Anyway, aside from that the stats she quotes are bullshit.

      1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

        I know lets pass legislation that demands retiree's get shoved up and must stay inside their daughters vagina!!! /s

        1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago (edited)

          That doesn’t even make sense. The sophistry is toddler level. Do you imagine somehow that seniors don't require assistance and care?

          1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

            Excellent; Now your starting to unfold your own twisted belief on this.

            It is incorrect to use Gov-Gangster-Guns to FORCE healthcare. (That is universally accepted to be true of anyone but a Democrat). But the Pro-Life lobbyists take this one step even more so by Gov-Gun FORCING a persons body be used for healthcare. It is exactly the same as Gov-Gun FORCING organ donation to save a life.

            I'm not even close to supporting the legislating of body parts even if it is to save a life. That is FAR too personal and there can't be a 4th Amendment "The right of the people to be secure in their persons" when government is legislating 'parts' of the people.

            1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

              And to top of the complete idiocy.
              "to save a life" isn't even possible Pre-Viable.

              And that's where the 'unicorn' theory has to take its place by pure imagination.

    2. Lester75   2 years ago

      Yea Mickey Rat. You're lucky you're not a woman of child-bearing age. The extension to the personhood stuff is that all women of child-bearing age can't smoke or drink or they may be arrested for child abuse as soon as their ex-husband discovers they are pregnant. If they have cancer they can't take their anti-cancer meds until a hospital board full of theocrats determines that they are in imminent danger of death.

      1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        There's a billion contraceptive products available aside from not fucking to begin with.
        Don't make out like they just spontaneously get preggers.

        1. JasonT20   2 years ago

          There’s a billion contraceptive products available aside from not fucking to begin with. Don’t make out like they just spontaneously get preggers.

          This might actually be a persuasive point if the same politicians that want to restrict abortion were all in favor of ensuring adequate access to the most effective and reliable methods of contraception for each woman and comprehensive sex education to make sure all young women know about them.

          As Lester75 points out, it isn't just about avoiding pregnancy either. Suppose a woman that did want to be pregnant finds out at around 15 weeks that she has cancer. The oncologists tell her that she has a 90% chance of beating it if she starts chemo soon. But, if the fetus is a person with a full right to life, would she then be required to put off chemo for another 5 months or so in order to carry the fetus to term? What if that lowers he chance of survival to around 70%. Is there going to be up to politicians and government bureaucrats going by laws written by anti-abortion groups to decide whether she can have an abortion to start chemo ASAP? Or is it going to be entirely her choice as to what level of risk to take?

    3. JasonT20   2 years ago (edited)

      So if a particular demographic group dies at a prodigious rate, that means they are not persons? What is the threshold rate at which this applies?

      Like others, you seem to be deliberately misunderstanding the argument in order to try and make it seem absurd, when the point is fairly clear to those of us that don’t share the anti-abortion position. The proper questions to be asking is what makes a human person’s life more valuable than the lives of other living organisms, such that we place obligations on people to respect the right to life of human beings? Does a fertilized egg have those same properties?

      Those questions are the point of bringing up the estimates of fertilized eggs that fail to implant and miscarriages. Since no woman ever knows when one of her eggs was fertilized until it implants and her body begins to change to support a pregnancy, none of those lost zygotes are ever mourned the way a person is. And a miscarriage of a wanted pregnancy usually does result in very strong emotions, often like that of mourning, it is not a person being mourned, but the potential of one. There are no memories of a person’s smile and laughter, photos to keep those memories solid, or birthdays to remember.

      Arguing that a fertilized egg is equal to a born human being in value and rights requires more than just pointing to DNA or potential. I rarely even see those that are anti-abortion even try in any logical or systematic way.

      1. Mickey Rat   2 years ago (edited)

        No, I am pointing out that it is a bad argument, which does not prove what it sets out to prove or proves far too much. If you propose a high rate of death as a reason to dismiss a human organism from personhood then it must be based on some criterion. The fact that you object to naming a criterion shows that it is not a serious argument for your position.

        You have to make an affirmative argument why a specific class a human organism is written out from having moral value (i.e. rights), you cannot just assume this as a given.

        1. JasonT20   2 years ago

          You have to make an affirmative argument why a specific class a human organism is written out from having moral value (i.e. rights), you cannot just assume this as a given.

          It is those that want to force a woman to remain pregnant that have to make an affirmative argument that an embryo or fetus, let alone a fertilized egg, has a right to impose its needs upon that woman's body. That is a greater right than any born human being has. My right to life does not impose any physical obligations or risks upon any one person to support my needs. Anyone that aids me in a time of need or puts themselves at risk to help me survive some danger does so entirely voluntarily in that moment and without fear of legal punishment if they fail to help.

          Pregnancy involves inherent risk, even for a young, healthy woman. Why does a developing human life at those early stages get to impose those risks and physical burdens upon a woman when no born human being could do so?

  76. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    How masking came to be in 2020, and the NYT's role in it.

    https://disinformationchronicle.substack.com/p/unmasking-the-new-york-times-zeynep

    Parading across social media with her latest New York Times headline, Columbia University professor Zeynep Tufekci announced to a planet weary of pandemic advice that she had single-handedly solved one of the world’s knottier public health questions: can masks stop COVID transmission? Since we’re talking about an essay in the New York Times, the answer was as effortless and clear as it was predetermined: “Here’s Why the Science Is Clear That Masks Work.”

    1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago (edited)

      Ever since the New York Times declared that pygmy Ota Benga wasn’t human and belonged in the zoo, it’s been the world’s leading purveyor of misinformation.
      The newspaper soft peddled the Nazis in the 30’s and hid a genocide for Stalin calling whistleblowers “conspiracy theorists”.

      It’s always been a force for evil.

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  78. TJJ2000   2 years ago

    A persons pregnancy (i.e. Reproductive System) is NONE of the F'En Gov-Gangster-Guns business!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Pro-Life is 100% IN-LINE with leftard agenda.
    Sell your Individual souls to the [WE] foundation; because YOU don't own YOU; [WE] own you!

  79. Davy C   2 years ago

    It's the type of laws that could lead to increased surveillance, restrictions on, and criminalization of pregnant women across the board.

    It's illegal to kill your infant, too. Does that mean the government surveilles parents of infants?

    ... OK, sometimes, but that's after they get some indication that something is wrong. Same here. If they get an indication that a woman wants to hurt her unborn kid, the government might act, just like they would if they get an indication she wants to hurt one of her born kids.

    1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

      What infant?
      Pro-Life has literally gaslighted you all into calling a seed an apple tree.

      One bushel of apples for $10... Here's your seed.

      1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

        A germinated seed is an apple tree, so is a seedling and a sapling. All part of the organism's life cycle.
        You guys really aren't cool with biology, huh.

        1. JasonT20   2 years ago

          A germinated seed is an apple tree...

          So, I can pick a ripe apple from a germinated seed? It can give me shade when I feel like laying down after working in the hot sun?

          1. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

            So you're saying an apple tree is only an apple tree when it's bearing apples? It's not a tree in winter when it has no apples and can't give shade? Or when it's a sapling.

            Conversely, five-year-old girls and a post menopausal women can't ovulate or get pregnant, the animal biological equivalents of flowering and producing fruit. Does that mean they're not human?

            You guys don't really think very much, do you.

            1. JasonT20   2 years ago

              I would accuse you of the being the one not thinking, but I believe that you are thinking. You are thinking very hard how to dodge the point and turn things back onto those arguing against you.

              A germinated apple seed isn't an "apple tree" because the word "tree" will conjure up an image of something with a solid trunk, many branches, a substantial root system to anchor it against wind and rain, and so on. At least, it will for anyone being honest and arguing in good faith. That germinated apple seed might have the DNA and potential to grow into an apple tree, but to equate the two beyond that is not at all reasonable. You charged someone with sophistry above, but that is a good example of it right there.

              Go beyond the superficial aspects of a fertilized egg or embryo or even a fetus that makes them part of the human species and actually think about why a born person has a right to live and what level of obligation that places on other people to support that right. Once you've established that, then see what prenatal stages of human development would share that right.

          2. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

            An apple tree is a means to an end. A human being is an end in itself. An apple tree has no rights, its existence can be decided on utilitarian arguments. A human being's cannot, else you throw out the entire concept of inherent human rights. Your analogy is flawed and inappropriate from the start.

            1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

              There is NO *inherent* right to life for pregnancies.
              Pro-Life's premise was OFF long before it ever started.

              Keep dishing out faulty premises..... The infant, the baby, the inherent right.... Blah, blah, blah ... It's *ALL* FALSE and everyone without a Nosy Gov-Gun-Loving Power-Mad Trip knows it. Because that is REALITY not 'unicorn' fart-brain imaginations.

              1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

                If you cannot support ?baby? freedom (i.e. Fetal Ejection)
                You're supporting Gov-Gun Forced reproduction.

                It doesn't get any more OBVIOUS than that.

                1. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

                  If you cannot support your children, then kill them. This is a wrong solution on its face.

                  1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

                    What children? You just keep spouting BS FALSE premises.
                    Either make that child appear or take your fantasy land BS and stuff it.

              2. Mickey Rat   2 years ago

                There is no thought behind that logic except "I need this to be true to get what I want", much like a slaver needing his potential slaves to not be considered fully human.

                1. TJJ2000   2 years ago

                  My finger is a slave of me! Oh; the horror!! /s
                  Oh Pleeeeaaaseee....

            2. JasonT20   2 years ago

              Your analogy is flawed and inappropriate from the start.

              It wasn't my analogy. It was Mother's Lament's analogy, so you should direct that comment to him.

  80. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Bridge.

  81. JesseAz   2 years ago (edited)

    Shrike claimed this sock was an Oxford educated Briton the other day. But he never changes his views. Still pushes the same narratives.

  82. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Coal mining? Petroleum? Anything else they're trying to shut down?

  83. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Maybe he was over at Huffpo first.

  84. Fats of Fury   2 years ago

    He only posts when he's on weekend parole.

  85. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    Jeffy probably doesn't have his talking points yet. Must be lost in cyberspace.

  86. SRG   2 years ago

    Continue to fuck off. I am not shrike and I am an Oxford-educated Briton.

    And fwiw Shrike's and my views don't perfectly overlap, and our knowledge bases don't either.

  87. SRG   2 years ago

    No. You've been misinformed by JesseAZ's idiocy. In an early posting of mine I called followers of Trump "Trumpsuckers", so he concluded that I was a shrike sock. He's never come up with any evidence for the accusation (and oddly, the real shrike has never used the term "Trumpsucker"). But being the cracker POS that he is, he's continued, and Mother's Lament and other dishonest POSs have continued, to claim I'm shrike.

  88. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    Poor Shrike.

    Maybe if your style, content and prose weren't in constant imitation of a certain fifty-center from Georgia, we may be more inclined to believe you.

  89. JesseAz   2 years ago

    You pushed the exact same narratives of shrike. Defense of wrf/leftist goals, generally ignorant statements. You have the exact same arguments British shrike.

  90. SRG   2 years ago

    @Mother's Lament: our writing style is not remotely the same, and if you were honest you'd concede that. But as I've previously noted, you're a dishonest POS.

    @JessAZ: what narratives are those, aside from a mutual dislike of Trump and right-wing authoritarian types like yourself?

    @R Mac: because I did a random sampling of threads for the previous months to see whether anyone else had used the term, in a vain attempt to point out to JesseAZ that he was mistaken. But JesseAZ and Mother's Lament, being the two POSs that they are, are either convinced, despite evidence on one side and lack thereof on the other, that I'm a shrike sock, which makes them malignly gullible, or they're simply lying, as a wind-up, in which case they're dishonest.

    They're cunts in either case.

  91. JesseAz   2 years ago

    Your narratives just above with the southern strategy lol.

    When did the south stop voting dem? It was when the older generation died off moron. Which party pushes segregation? Still the left moron.

  92. Mother's Lament   2 years ago

    "because I did a random sampling of threads for the previous months to see whether anyone else had used the term"

    Lol.
    You've convinced me. You're actually White Mike.

  93. A Cynical Asshole   2 years ago

    Anything else they’re trying to shut down?

    Bingo!

  94. Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2   2 years ago

    I am a lowly UGA grad.

    A-Thens, Georgia. (The locals drag out both syllables).

  95. JesseAz   2 years ago

    I know "British shrike." *wink*

  96. Jerry B.   2 years ago

    You live in New York?

  97. InsaneTrollLogic   2 years ago

    I think that was either Mike or Jeffy. I think Mike.

  98. Nardz   2 years ago

    Yes, the NYT are hypocrites.
    No, they don't care.
    No, pointing out hypocrisy doesn't accomplish anything.
    Yes, despite the hypocrisy it still moves us toward war.
    One of the only things Obama deserves credit for, with a GIANT asterisk, is not going full war with Russia over Syria and Ukraine.

    GIANT ASTERISK: the US IC under Obama administration started the risk/destabilization by implementing color revolutions in both countries, so the credit Obama is due for not getting in a shooting war with Russia is pretty small

  99. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 years ago

    Ukraine?

  100. TheReEncogitationer   2 years ago

    My only boner is for getting Putin out of Ukraine and into the bunker to finish himself off with the Makarov. War is just the bitter necessity for getting there, which Putin could end anytime.

  101. SRG   2 years ago

    LOL. Best fish and chips I ever had was in Blackpool. In general the best chippies were run by Cypriot Greeks but I don't know if that's still the case, as I've not spent much time in Britain for the last few years.

  102. Nelson   2 years ago

    Why? Hunter Biden is a scumbag. He's not even a special kind of scumbag, just a run-of-the-mill sleaze.

    Basically he's Alex Murdaugh without the family-annihilator part. Although I guess he actually traded on his father's name (sleazy, but legal) rather than embezzling. But a similar flavor of sleazy.

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