The Redacted Mar-a-Lago Search Warrant Affidavit Sheds Light on the FBI's Concerns and Trump's Defense
There are still lingering questions about the former president's criminal liability and the threat posed by the documents he kept.

Because the public version of the Mar-a-Lago search warrant affidavit is heavily redacted, it does not resolve lingering questions about the FBI's justification for searching former President Donald Trump's residence at his Palm Beach resort. But the document does shed some light on the circumstances that led to the August 8 search, during which the FBI seized 11 sets of documents marked as classified, along with unclassified presidential records that belonged in the National Archives. The affidavit—which was unsealed by U.S. Magistrate Judge Bruce Reinhart, who approved the search warrant—also clarifies Trump's defense against possible criminal charges stemming from his retention of those documents.
According to the affidavit, which the Justice Department published today, the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) first requested the return of missing presidential records on May 6, 2021, three and a half months after Trump left office. It "continued to make requests until approximately late December 2021," when "NARA was informed twelve boxes were found and ready for retrieval." Trump's representatives ultimately turned over 15 boxes in January, a year after President Joe Biden's inauguration.
On February 9, after NARA discovered that the boxes contained classified documents, it referred the matter to the Justice Department. NARA reported that the boxes contained "newspapers, magazines, printed news articles, photos, miscellaneous print-outs, notes, presidential correspondence, personal and post-presidential records, and 'a lot of classified records.'" It said "highly classified records were unfoldered, intermixed with other records, and otherwise unproperly [sic] identified."
From May 16 to May 18, "FBI agents conducted a preliminary review" of the 15 boxes. They found "184 unique documents bearing classification markings, including 67 documents marked as CONFIDENTIAL, 92 documents marked as SECRET, and 25 documents marked as TOP SECRET."
Some of the documents had markings requiring special handling: HCS (HUMINT Control System), FISA (Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act), ORCON (Originator Control), NOFORN (Not Releasable to Foreign Nationals), and SI (Special Intelligence). The affidavit notes that HCS and SI fall under the heading of "sensitive compartmented information" (SCI), which refers to "classified information concerning or derived from intelligence sources, methods, or analytical processes" that "is required to be handled within formal access control systems."
The affidavit includes a May 25 letter from Trump lawyer Evan Corcoran to Jay Bratt, chief of the Counterintelligence and Export Control Section in the Justice Department's National Security Division. Corcoran said documents "purportedly marked as classified" were "once in the White House and unknowingly included among the boxes brought to Mar-a-Lago by the movers." He portrayed Trump as completely cooperative with NARA's requests. "The communications regarding the transfer of boxes to NARA were friendly, open, and straightforward," he wrote, adding that Trump "readily and voluntarily agreed" to relinquish the records.
Corcoran urged Bratt to keep in mind "a few bedrock principles." First, "a president has absolute authority to declassify documents." Second, "presidential actions involving classified documents are not subject to criminal sanction."
Under 18 USC 1924, Corcoran noted, it is a felony, punishable by up to five years in prison, for "an officer, employee, contractor, or consultant of the United States" to knowingly remove classified records "without authority and with the intent to retain such documents or materials at an unauthorized location." That provision, he said, "does not apply to the President," who does not qualify as "an officer, employee, contractor, or consultant of the United States." Corcoran also warned that "any attempt to impose criminal liability on a President or former President that involves his actions with respect to documents marked classified would implicate grave constitutional separation-of-powers issues."
Corcoran did not address 18 USC 793(e), one of the statutes that the FBI would later cite in its search warrant affidavit. As relevant here, that provision applies to anyone who has "unauthorized possession" of "information relating to the national defense" that he "has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation" and who "willfully retains" that information and "fails to deliver it to the officer or employee of the United States entitled to receive it."
The definition of that offense, which is a felony punishable by up to 10 years in prison, does not hinge on the defendant's job. Nor does the statute mention classification, although defense information of the sort it describes presumably would be classified.
Corcoran also did not address the two other laws that the Mar-a-Lago search warrant cited. 18 USC 2071 makes it a felony, punishable by up to three years in prison, to conceal, remove, or destroy a U.S. government document. 18 USC 1519 makes it a felony, punishable by up to 20 years in prison, to conceal "any record, document, or tangible object" with the intent to "impede, obstruct, or influence" a federal investigation.
After noting Corcoran's letter, the FBI affidavit mentions a May 5 Breitbart News story in which Kash Patel, a former National Security Council staffer who represented Trump in his negotiations with NARA, asserted that Trump "had declassified the materials at issue." That paragraph is followed by two-and-half completely redacted pages, which might include the FBI's rebuttal of the argument that Trump cannot be criminally liable for retaining sensitive documents because they were no longer classified.
Trump claims he had "a standing order" as president that automatically declassified any material he happened to remove from the Oval Office. It is not clear whether Trump ever actually issued such an order, which was news to John Bolton, who served as his national security adviser for 17 months in 2018 and 2019, and to Glenn Gerstell, who served as general counsel for the National Security Agency from 2015 to 2020.
Even if Trump did declassify the documents he retained when he still had the authority to do so, that would not be relevant under 18 USC 2071 or 18 USC 1519. Depending on how "information relating to the national defense" is defined, declassification might not be relevant under 18 USC 793 either. If we were allowed to read it, the blacked-out section of the affidavit that follows the reference to Patel might clarify the FBI's position on that issue.
On June 8, according to the affidavit, the Justice Department sent Trump's lawyers a letter that "reiterated" the government's concerns about the security of the documents stored at Mar-a-Lago. "As I previously indicated to you, Mar-a-Lago does not include a secure location authorized for the storage of classified information," the letter said. "It appears that since the time classified documents…were removed from the secure facilities at the White House and moved to Mar-a-Lago on or around January 20, 2021, they have not been handled in an appropriate manner or stored in an appropriate location. Accordingly, we ask that the room at Mar-a-Lago where the documents had been stored be secured and that all of the boxes that were moved from the White House to Mar-a-Lago (along with any other items in that room) be preserved in that room in their current condition until further notice."
The New York Times reports that Trump's staff responded to the Justice Department's concerns by replacing the padlock on the storage room. But after obtaining surveillance video from Mar-a-Lago, the FBI reportedly was alarmed by footage of people removing material from that room. And contrary to the Justice Department's request that all of the classified documents be kept in that location, the Times says, the FBI search found some in the closet of Trump's office.
After the affidavit quotes the June 8 letter from the Justice Department, the narrative is again interrupted by several pages of complete redactions. But around the same time, according to the Times, "aides to Mr. Trump turned over a few dozen additional sensitive documents" in response to a federal subpoena. The FBI worried that there were more, and evidently it confirmed that suspicion by interviewing people who had seen classified documents at Mar-a-Lago after the June visit.
Verifying that point would have been crucial in establishing probable cause to believe that a search would find items "possessed in violation of" the three laws that the FBI cited. But the section of the affidavit describing the evidence supporting that conclusion is blacked out, presumably because it would reveal the FBI's sources and compromise its ongoing investigation. Based on that redacted information, the FBI sought and received permission to search not only the storage room but also Trump's "residential suite, Pine Hall, the '45 Office,' and other spaces" at Mar-a-Lago that "are not currently authorized locations for the storage of classified information or NDI [national defense information]."
Because of the extensive redactions, it is still not clear exactly why the FBI decided to take that unprecedented and politically explosive step. The blacked-out passages might include further evidence of Trump's recalcitrance or his sloppy handling of the documents, which would make it easier to understand why the FBI chose a more aggressive and conspicuous approach than, say, trying again with another subpoena.
The missing information also might support the suspicion that Trump willfully retained government documents and deliberately obstructed the FBI's investigation. In Corcoran's telling, Trump's movers inadvertently took the documents to Mar-a-Lago, and Trump promptly took action to remedy the situation when it came to his attention. That gloss seems pretty implausible in light of Trump's protracted negotiations with NARA and the Justice Department. But even if Trump was not as attentive and cooperative as Corcoran suggests, that does not necessarily mean he had criminal intent.
Finally, the unexpurgated affidavit might give us some clue as to the nature of the information that the FBI was trying to protect. We know that it found "scores of additional documents" (per the Times) with markings ranging from "confidential" to "top secret/SCI" (per the search inventory). Trump insists that, despite those labels, he had declassified all of the material that the FBI seized, which implies that he thought it posed no threat to national security. While it certainly would not be safe to trust Trump's judgment on that question (or pretty much anything else), the FBI has not publicly explained why it thought the danger was grave and imminent enough to justify a search that was bound to be enormously controversial.
Editor's Note: As of February 29, 2024, commenting privileges on reason.com posts are limited to Reason Plus subscribers. Past commenters are grandfathered in for a temporary period. Subscribe here to preserve your ability to comment. Your Reason Plus subscription also gives you an ad-free version of reason.com, along with full access to the digital edition and archives of Reason magazine. We request that comments be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment and ban commenters for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
I don't know how one is supposed to figure anything out from it when several pages are merely all black ink redacting whatever the hell is there. The entire affidavit should be made public sans redaction. The redaction makes the FBI and the DOJ seem very suspicious in their motives.
Top Men
I am making 80 US dollars per hr. to complete some internet services from home. I have not ever thought like it would even achievable however my confidant mate got $13k only in four weeks easily doing this best assignment and also she convinced me to avail. Look extra details
going to this article… https://changeyourlife4.neocities.org/
I am making 80 US dollars per hr. to complete some internet services from home. (res-02) I have not ever thought like it would even achievable however my confidant mate got $13k only in four weeks easily doing this best assignment and also she convinced me to avail. Look extra details
.
going to this article… https://workofferweb24.netlify.app/
That is where I am....release it all, unredacted. The American people must know 'who' said 'what' and 'why' they said it. This is crucial missing context.
You have to save box tops, to get the secret FBI decoder ring.
B-E S-U-R-E T-O D-R-I-N-K Y-O-U-R G-O-V-T I-S-S-U-E K-O-O-L A-I-D
Wait, huh?!
What a gyp!
That is where I am....release it all, unredacted. The American people must know 'who' said 'what' and 'why' they said it. This is crucial missing context.
Yes, the
MAGA faithfulAmerican people need to know whothose that ratted out Trumpall the witnesses are so that they canstart sending them death threats and otherwise make their lives a living hellbe sure that they were truthful and had pure motives. If Team Trump is under investigation for obstruction, then it is absolutely necessary to have all the information on that investigation possible so that they canobstruct it more effectivelygive a proper defense.It certainly appears to have much more redaction than would be necessary to protect confidential sources.
Cite?
I believe the redaction formula was worked out by Capt. John Yossarian of the 256th AAF.
Reason.com is the official mouthpiece of the U.S. democrat party.
I have logged into reason.com for the last time.
-an official mouthpiece-
See ya!
That tickled your naughty bits, didn't it, you DNC stooge.
People abandoning an ostensibly libertarian magazine because it reads like an ActBlue newsletter, isn't the win you imagine.
Mike’s kinda dumb that way.
Mike’s kinda dumb that way.
The sweet, sweet $.50 gravy train stops if the site he shits on is indistinguishable from Huffington Post.
This comment is kinda dumb.
You know what’s really dumb? —>“Reason.com is the official mouthpiece of the U.S. democrat party.”
You know what’s even dumber? Some fag that comes to an ostensibly libertarian website every day and shills for a far left socialist political party like the democrats. Even though his stupidity is exposed every day with each idiot comment he makes.
If you’re not sure who I’m referring to, look in a goddamn mirror.
What are you, 12?
Given he's aligned with ActBlue it is the win he thinks it is. He's not smart enough to consider where they may go for news next.
Sullum has been a paid shill of the left at least since Trump was elected. While he occasionally writes a somewhat sensible article on other topics, in order to hide his true spots, he is total anti-Trump in every article he writes about Trump.
Long TDS.
Maintaining the innocence of a non-libertarian Republican former president, no matter what evidence turns up, is not an essential quality of libertarians. If this were 1972 instead of 2022, the Trumpers here would be celebrating the Vietnam War, claiming its libertarian detractors were left-wing shills, crypto-Democrats suffering from Nixon Derangement Syndrome, and communist sympathizers.
Are a lot of Democrats afflicted by TDS? Yes. Do they want to nail him to the wall using anything they can dig up? Of course. And Trump is doing his best to help them out. He knows his base of supporters will dismiss ant evidence as fake or, if they can't convince themselves it's fake, then they'll argue his actions were justified. The man brags that he can get away with anything.
At the very least, they need to give this topic to another author, as Mr. Sullim seems to lack any suspicion and wholeheartedly accepts the FBI's claims. This is despite the other articles coming out at the same time talking about false claims from the FBI on warrants and the FBI's personal history with Trump.
Geee. I'm gnna MISSSS that sockpuppet!
The very notion that the FBI and DOJ are deciding what they want to be made public - and assert that they are the ones who are structurally responsible for holding a former President to their idea of what should be made public - is more than a bit disturbing.
As is frankly the notion that a current President should base their agenda on punishing previous officials.
No President - past, present or future - can be considered 'above the law'. But nor imo should a permanent institution consider itself unquestioned 'the law' merely because it is permanent.
The only thing I'm sure of is - DeRps are incapable of anything but making things worse.
Apparently, the President isn't in charge of the Admin branch but only serves the State Apparatus. Woe be to any President that crosses it.
THANKS https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/leadvalet-review-scam-legit-get-more-clients-make-profit-dominate-/
The danger was so grave Garland hemmed and hawed over it for months then the FBI waited days to execute the warrant.
The 'nuclear' documents were probably associated with the Mueller investigation and make the DoJ and FBI look bad - so, nuclear for them. If it was national security in a WWIII sense, the warrant would have been served right away, because the need would have been obvious.
JFC https://newsinteractive.post-gazette.com/anna-de-rothschild-trump-mar-a-lago-security-fbi-investigation/
So a Ukrainian tried to infiltrate and got caught? Not exactly the Eric Swalwell affair.
"a Russian-speaking immigrant from Ukraine"
All Ukrainians are Russian-speaking. Russian is 85% mutually intelligible with Belarusian and Ukrainian.
It's like the difference between Scots English and Standard American English.
A closer analogy is Cockney English and Connecticut English.
The pronunciation, grammar, and spelling are slightly different, but it’s easy for speakers of both dialects to understand each other.
Scots is more different than Cockney English is to American English. It’s not just another dialect; it’s nearly another language, because of hundreds of years of physical isolation.
because of hundreds of years of physical isolation.
y'all know you can walk to Scotland from England, right?
Please, not another dickey-bird!
Not even the ascots can understand Scots English, so that’s not as effective a simile as you would think.
I usually find myself using sub-titles when watching UK programs. Especially Scottish. How the hell do they understand each other?
In the midst of all the black, they cite a CBS news article that reported on moving trucks being at Mar-a-Lago. Does citing news that they most likely planted sound familiar?
Yes. Russiagate started with planted news articles being used to justify spying on Trump and Carter Page.
So, do we got him this time for sure again?
Another bombshell.
We've reached the tipping point.
The walls are closing in.
It's the beginning of the end.
#ItsMuellerTime
Walls closing in on OrangeManBad.
Well, eleven (yes 11) of the Trump Trash have been convicted or indicted. And Rudy hasn't sung yet.
Most corrupt administration ever - no question.
That fucking creep Jared is corrupt.
But Beavis and Butthead Trump - I think Donnie kept them away from his filth. Don't see them going down.
The freak who posted child porn
is indignant?
I wonder how long you would last gen pop.
*in gen pop
Tell us about "gen pop".
How was it?
Whose bitch were you?
You’ll find out what it’s like someday, pedo.
Seriously, what were you in for?
You paid your dues since you are out now.
What crime did you commit?
Wouldn’t you like to know, pedophile.
I feel empathy all of a sudden. I know I shouldn't.
Here I am a privileged college grad who has never been in one iota of trouble slinging insults with an uneducated ex-convict who desperately sees Donald Trump as his "savior" in life.
Kierkegaard, what should I do?
Resign?
There is no victory in defeating an invalid.
I guarantee you never attended college, Shrike. I'm not convinced that you graduated high school.
You can find out when you’re sent there. You are a goddamned pedophile. Turn yourself in, or kill yourself. Or do both. Write a detailed confession as part of your suicide note.
How many of those charges aren’t ridiculous process crimes?
I like how the Trumpsuckers keep trying to avoid the simple point that Trump had documents he shouldn't have had, whether classified or no, and had clearly refused to hand them over.
The argument, "why now?" could have been made at any time when the documents were to be seized and so is worthless.
As for Trump "negotiating" the return - this isn't a contract and there's nothing to negotiate. If your neighbour borrows your lawnmower and hangs onto it you don't expect him to refuse to hand it bacl until you've had negotiations for its safe return.
You should read the court ruling regarding the Clinton's shrike.
Fuck off, peasant.
But if you're going to engage in whataboutism, that's a concession of the legitimacy of this search.
The controlling court case regarding NARA and presidential records is whataboutism?
Not an intelligent argument shrike.
Fuck off and die, steaming pile of TDS-addled lefty shit.
I mean, there's the whole point that a "magistrate Judge" is in no way an actual judge, and therefore the warrant is as constitutionally valid as a warrant signed by a "parking enforcement judge".
Kill yourself before you rape another child.
Equal application of the law is not whataboutism.
Today in Supreme Court History: August 28, 1958
Under 18 USC 1924, Corcoran noted, it is a felony, punishable by up to five years in prison, for "an officer, employee, contractor, or consultant of the United States" to knowingly remove classified records "without authority and with the intent to retain such documents or materials at an unauthorized location.
Hillary retained such materials at an unauthorized location (private server at home). You don't have love, care, or know Trump to understand that.
Clinton has a shrike?
"Trumpsuckers"
Oh yeah, you're not Shrike at all.
Now explain why you believe the documents marked "classified" aren't the Crossfire Hurricane documents that Trump ordered declassified, and the DOJ is in contempt of court for refusing to release.
Now explain why the use of the word "Trumpsuckers" makes me shrike when everything else I write should make it abundantly clear that I'm not.
And explain why you believe the documents are the Crossfire Hurricane docs. I had no opinion but think that the range of classification including some which cannot conceivably be assigned to Crossfire Hurricane, Has Trump himself or his lawyers claimed as much? Further, why wouldn't Trump have released them by now if they are, and why wouldn't the FBI have moved far more rapidly? You've got bupkis.
Your idiocy above is another clue. Like saying the court case discussing powers between executive records and NARA as whataboutism is standard shrike ignorance.
Also if you read the affidavit it states trump and his team already claimed they had declassified all records and then redacted the response to the argument.
Why do you so often argue from ignorance shrike?
Fuck off, peasant.
Meanwhile, what Trump claims isn't evidence, and classified or no, the documents don't belong to him.
Why didn't he release the Crapshoot Hooligan documents when he had the chance? You still have no fucking evidence, peasant.
So you didn't take the advice above and read the actual controlling court case. Instead you stick with the leftist narrative. Not an intelligent move shrike.
Fuck off, peasant.
What part of "The PRA provides that “diaries, journals or other personal notes serving as the functional equivalent of a diary or journal which are not prepared or utilized for, or circulated or communicated in the course of, transacting Governmental business” should be treated as personal records." do you not understand?
“Peasant”. Clearly a class-appproved DNC insult, fifty-cent fuckface lollinonce.
Clearly a class-appproved DNC insult
If that were true you'd find Democrats here using it. I prefer it to :working-class fascist" or "cattle-truck loaders" or "ignorant and stupid crackers" as it saves time and is more English (cf MP and the Holy Grail)
fifty-cent fuckface lollinonce.
That's almost (modern) Shakespearean - or "Clockwork Orange"
-ish. Seriously - that's excellent, and AFAICT - in a pleasing coincidence, a nonce word.
At least one Democrat operative is using it here, and it reveals a steeping in a typical pseudo-liberal class-conscience social caste stratification where it feels so fucking good to denigrate those who are (and according to pseudo-liberals, ought to be) the lesser classes.
JSinAZ
I am not sure who else is using "peasant" here.
Evidently you feel some outrage over the apparent classist nature of the insult. There, there...
I'm shrike if you didn't know that already.
I like to make up my own compound words. Back in 2006 or so when I started posting here I uses the term "Bushpigs" to refer to the anti-libertarian Bush administration.
"Trumpsuckers"? Never used it. It makes sense and is easy to type..
Speaking of the old days the same dynamic existed. Bush fans defended his every move here. Today every one admits his administration was a disaster.
The same thing will happen with Donnie-boy.
(I lost my email account for 'shrike'. I use burner accounts because some of the scumbags on here have threatened to kill me for insulting Republicans).
If they threaten you, it’s because you posted a link to CP.
Don’t deny it.
Exposing the truth is apparently a threat to shrike.
And never use the word "peanuts".
An editor at Reason derisively called H&R the "peanut gallery" so I pinched it and use it often.
The Peanuts don't like the term made up especially for them.
We know why you use the term ‘peanuts’.
Child porn poster.
Fuck you, you lying retarded half-wit.
Dog shit is better than a person who preys on children.
You're a lying piece of shit, half wit.
You've actually been to prison. Your tell is the way you throw the lingo around.
"gen pop" - you would know.
If that’s true, you should fear me.
Prisoners hate your kind.
What were you in for?
Lol, the lingo comment is rich coming from a pedo groomer who posted links to child pornography on the reason.com comment board. Say, what does the retarded half wit lingo of Sarah Palin’s Buttplug Part 2 Har Har say about your stupid ass?
wow.... i did not realize the BS spin machine had gone this far off the rails.
if it was the crossfire hurricane documents we would not be trying to guess what they were because those documents were actually declassified.
I know that was the only memo you guys could find when searching for some evidence trump declassified everything, but this stretch is just sad.
The affidavit itself states the doj understood the claims were made prior dummy. They have been saying it since he left.
are you replying to the wrong comment, or did you really just not read what I read at all?
*what i wrote
You apparently didn't even realize what you wrote.
you made a typo that you caught yourself.... but i still feel the need to be a douchebag.....
Are you sarc level drunk?
Fuck off and die, steaming pile of TDS-addled lefty shit.
I know that was the only memo you guys could find when searching for some evidence trump declassified everything, but this stretch is just sad.
The affidavit itself claims trump and his team stated everything they took was declassified before leaving. The claim was not specific to crossfire hurricane.
Are you full of so much bullshit you can't even follow it yourself?
"The affidavit itself claims trump and his team stated everything they took was declassified before leaving. The claim was not specific to crossfire hurricane."
the comment i was responding to very explicitly was talking about crossfire hurricane. they asked how we did not know that all the documents were covered by crossfire hurricane....... i was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt that you did not mean to respond to me..... but i guess you are just a fucking idiot.
Jesse is an attack dog. He just attacks, even after being shown he was mistaken and that you agreed with him. Instead of going, "oops, my bad," he'll double and triple down on you. Getting ever more crass in his responses.
No, no, he calls us ‘peasants’ instead of ‘peanuts’. So he’s totally not shrike.
So.... the raid was set up because of a Democrat running NARA who allowed Obama to keep 30 million pages for a 2 million dollar fee, and never criminally went after Hillary.
The FBI opened a criminal investigation the day after NARA recieved the 15 boxes.
The FBI acknowledges trump and his team told him the documents were declassified before he left office but then decided to argue some legal reasoning that is redacted as to why that is apparently not true.
One of the pieces of evidence were moving trucks after Trump left the WH.
Sean Davis
@seanmdav
·
Follow
Biden's DOJ told a federal court that the FBI had to raid Trump's house because a CBS news article saw trucks at Mar-a-Lago when Trump was president.
The FBI also argued classification didn't matter, likely due to the assertions of trumps team they declassified the documents.
https://mobile.twitter.com/bonchieredstate/status/1563204480182927362
So the pieces known show completely unequal treatment based on ourrage from a NARA official.
It also has no mention of Nuclear secrets. Yet Sullum included that in his past articles.
a Democrat running NARA who allowed Obama to keep 30 million pages
Who says that Obama was allowed to keep 30 million pages? NARA says not. The only "evidence" for this is a Trump claim. Unsurprisingly, you believe him.
After all the articles you are still unaware that Obama paid to host a NARA facility at his location for 2 million? It was a hand waive to justify the records to be kept under his control by claiming it was under NARA jurisdiction.
Here is Obama own foundation discussing the coordination with NARA of his records, something not set up or negotiated for Trump like it was for Obama. Obama had local access to his records under a payment agreement where NARA designated an area of Obama under NARA control. This is far different than the NARA calling the FBI because he saw trump leave the white house with a box under his arm.
Discussions of Obama having the records and NARA having digital copies here.
https://www.obama.org/updates/obama-foundation-nara-announce-new-details-obama-presidential-center-structure-operations/
Leftists revel in their ignorance.
Read your own link:
This will help NARA, which retains ongoing control over presidential records, make the records more easily accessible to the public.
And https://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2022/nr22-001
The National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) assumed exclusive legal and physical custody of Obama Presidential records when President Barack Obama left office in 2017, in accordance with the Presidential Records Act (PRA). NARA moved approximately 30 million pages of unclassified records to a NARA facility in the Chicago area where they are maintained exclusively by NARA. Additionally, NARA maintains the classified Obama Presidential records in a NARA facility in the Washington, DC, area. As required by the PRA, former President Obama has no control over where and how NARA stores the Presidential records of his Administration.
Read the response after people already discussed the arrangement NARA granted Obama showing a different level of treatment? I used a 2019 link for a reason shrike.
They are playing narrative control now. The fact is Obama paid NARA to keep his records where nara then claimed the area used was technically under NARA control despite no staff there. This has been revealed in many articles prior to the last 2 months such as the above link.
You can disprove this by showing a Chicago based NARA facility prior to 2016 shrike. Hint. You won't find it.
Fuck off, peasant. NARA had control of the docs. :I guess changing your mind is too hard, astonishing given how little you have to change.
"Fuck off, peasant."
Scratch a leftist and find a wannabe 17th-century French aristocrat.
So youre saying I am correct and you are ignorant. Got it.
Obama paid NARA to pretend they were in control as he said he would digitize the documents. He still has not done so. Basically he paid for NARA to claim his control was really theirs.
Trump's simply a whistleblower.
Dawg-whistle blower? Reminds me of that joke: Two conservatives are walking down the street and they see a XXXREDACTEDXXX "...but I'm afraid he'd bite me."
Just change the name of this site to Salon already.
Sad but true.
I am creating eighty North American nation greenbacks per-hr. to finish some web services from home. I actually have not ever thought adore it would even realisable but (any-211) my friend mate got $27k solely in four weeks simply doing this best assignment and conjointly she convinced Maine to avail. Look further details going this web-page.
.
---------->>
With fecal matter like this spilling out of Sullum, it might as well be Salon.
The swamp is protecting itself, and Fuck You, That's Why.
"otherwise unproperly identified."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXFGy10b7Js
So, redacted quite heavily as expected. Unredacted portions only point to documents that have classified markings without addressing whether they're actually still classified.
I liked this line: "There is also probable cause to believe that evidence of obstruction will be found at the PREMISES." Evidence of obstruction, huh? Prior to doing a criminal investigation, you know that when you get there, you're going to find evidence of obstruction of your criminal investigation that you haven't started yet.
The FBI knows how process crimes work.
Yeah, the only thing they left was the bullshit that would make you assume there's a 'there' behind the boxes. Disgustingly political.
Whoever having unauthorized possession of, access to, or control over any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, instrument, appliance, or note relating to the national defense, or information relating to the national defense which information the possessor has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation, willfully communicates, delivers, transmits or causes to be communicated, delivered, or transmitted, or attempts to communicate, deliver, transmit or cause to be communicated, delivered, or transmitted the same to any person not entitled to receive it, or willfully retains the same and fails to deliver it to the officer or employee of the United States entitled to receive it;
If that statute can be read as applying to declassified information, it's so overwhelmingly broad that you could prosecute literally anyone in the government for it. And I, for one, think that would be a good start.
I mean how do you read "unauthorized possession" of government documents and think it can apply to anything declassified? Declassified government records are subject to the FOIA with VERY few exceptions, so they belong to the public.
Right, so we are to believe Trump had a blanket policy of declassifying any document he looked at in the White House, so any document he had at Mar-a-Lago can be requested under FOIA.
How can Trump apologists believe that is true, and not realize it implicates Trump as being a incompetent Chief Executive, who is completely unqualified to be re-elected to the office.
Sullum is the one who says documents don't even have to be declassified for him to be charged under the statute he cited. My reading of it almost has to apply it exclusively to classified documents, even if the statute doesn't explicitly say so, because otherwise those documents should be public record.
Yes, I understand your reading. I made a tangential observation.
An idiotic one. Youre claiming government abuse of an ex president is fine. As you believe he is an imbecile.
Now you've done it. An entire shrewdness of Trumpanzees will be scratching it's chinny-chins wondering if tangential alludes to something demeaning, like Tangerine Hitler...
The key word there is 'unauthorized'.
Attachment B makes it seem like the raid was to pick up any document, presidential or not, classified or not, and would explain how things like passports that he acquired as a private citizen prior to becoming president, aren't classified, and shouldn't even needed to have been picked up (if the DHS lost copies of his/everyone's passports, that's their fault) did get picked up.
This is worse than that time Trump committed literal treason with the Russians.
What a bunch of XXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXX can XXXXXXXX my ass if XXXXXXXX that XXX believes that.
Knew you were guilty.
So probably nothing bad enough other than to give Trump a slap on the wrist.
And also maybe there WAS bad stuff, but we cant show you because classified.
So it might have been super bad, and probably was, but we cant tell you why, but trust us bro.
But also we got a loose pretense to look for J6 evidence.
So another FBI invasion aimed at trump, another nothing burger.
Probably the most investigated man in the history of the country, and still not a charge. Apparently Trump is the most innocent man in history.
A year in prison for the Con man.
The statute says "up to 20" but that won't happen.
A year would be great. I'd take six months realistically.
How long should you be locked up for possessing child porn?
There are better ways to deal with rabid dogs….
"The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall XXX be infringed."
"Hey. This redaction stuff works pretty well", say Democrats.
I know you are joking, but I'm reminded of some stories in the SCP foundation (essentially, a men in black style fictional work). They have a redacted version that says one story, seemingly normal and then a non-redacted version that changes the entire meaning. It's a lesson in how even minor redactions can completely change the meaning of the document.
Dr. Jill's husband apparently found it hilarious that Trump thinks the President of the United States is the ultimate authority on what can and can't be classified. Heck, everyone knows that only a former Secretary of State can do that.
There’s no record that Trump declassified these documents when he was still President.
Cite?
No law requires one. Obama and Bush even pushed EOs excluding the president from the process.
Do you always argue from ignorance?
*pinches nose to get whiney voice*
WHATABOUT WHEN THEY DID IT!?!?!?!!?!
Shut up faggot.
Eat shit, retard.
Seriously, you are dumb as shit. You never post anything remotely resembling an argument, a witticism, a clever remark, nothing.
Do you want to just sling insults and shit up the thread?
Go ahead. I got 50-70 reply insults. Shit the thread up, moron.
So, sarc shares your love of molesting children. Gross.
You're QAnon Trump trash, you retarded half-wit.
Pray they never catch you pedo.
Shrike: "Do you want to just sling insults and shit up the thread?"
Also Shrike: "You're QAnon Trump trash, you retarded half-wit."
Absolutely amazing.
that is most of them.
Sounds like they dug up the affidavit they didn't use to investigate Hillary Clinton's emails, filed off the serial numbers, and recycled it for Trump.
“I will caveat all of this by saying we can only see what we can see. But the first thing that jumped out to me is that the probable cause statement focuses on the nature of the documents, and where they are. But it doesn't, at least in the unredacted portion, address the main element of the criminal federal statutes that they cite,” said Brock, a respected three-decade agent who rose to become the bureau’s first intelligence chief under Director Robert Mueller.
“The FBI should not have participated in this investigation…. It is something that needs to be settled along established roots in that regard that we traditionally used,” he added. “There was no need for law enforcement involvement in this. And there was certainly no need for an invasive search for the residence. I think they're going to regret this. “
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/all-things-trump/fbis-former-intel-chief-raid-trump-home-i-think-they-are-going
According to what I read in the Daily Mail, most of the blackened text is to protect the names of the people involve from harm because their names would be part of a conservative fatwa if they were made public.
conservative fatwa
Praise Be Unto Him!
A political fatwa, not a religious one. Though if you made a Venn diagram of Trumpistas and Christians the former would be a splat into the latter with no edges to stream in daylight.
Kinda sucks. I was a Christian once. But they've gone overboard.
I’m surprised you didn’t become a catholic priest.
How do you know he not?
Next thing you know, they'll be rioting and burning the cities!
Sarc is now so desperate for attaboys he is seeking it from pedophiles. Yikes.
I believe you misspelled "alter boys."
"I was a Christian once. But they've gone overboard."
So your religious beliefs weren't centered around Christ and his message, but your perception about how cool or not other Christians were?
That's our sarcasmic. Even high school in his religious practices.
A political fatwa, not a religious one.
To conservatives (whether of the US Christian or Islamic type) they are one in the same because there is no separation of church and state.
Is that the alcoholism or the syphilus talking?
Shrike's the kind of constituitional expert that deliberately likes to forget the "or prohibiting the free exercise thereof", bit.
How much CP is on your hard drive?
Fuck you, you lying retarded half-wit.
Try again, pedo.
I’m too old for you.
You're QAnon Trump trash, you retarded half-wit.
Oh, that hurt. Lol.
Try harder pedophile.
You posted kiddie porn links here, you lying, ban-evading fuck. The Wayback Machine still preserves the thread that you got nuked.
I appreciate every time Overt shares it.
When I look at the document, though, there is way more black than one would need to accomplish that goal.
Shouldn’t you reserve judgment until you have all the facts?
Not fear of Libruls kicking sand in their Orange Coppertone?
Jonathan Turley
@JonathanTurley
·
Follow
Having read the redacted affidavit, it leaves most questions unanswered. It also raises further doubt over the Court's acceptance that the DOJ found the Goldilocks point of getting this "just right." The DOJ released what was largely already leaked or known.
Jonathan Turley
·
Aug 26, 2022
@JonathanTurley
·
Follow
Replying to @JonathanTurley
...Yet, the affidavit confirms a couple points that appeared in leaks. The affidavit does not establish that the Trump people were wholly uncooperative or non-communicative while noting that they were asked to turn over material and did not do so.
Jonathan Turley
@JonathanTurley
·
Follow
...It is confirmed that the FBI told the Court that Trump was claiming to have declassified the documents. However, there is little else on those communications, particularly after June 9th.
Given that the declassification requires nothing more than an decision of the president (everything else is formality and communication of the fact) and he move out of the White House with the boxes while still president, I don't see any possible counterpoint to his assertion that they were declassified. In fact, the assertion is literally all he needs.
So at worst, he's guilty of poor communication and refusing to talk to people. Given the DOJ's treatment of him, I can hardly blame the man.
It's more edited out than watching Friday on tnt
More like REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE-dacted... amirite?
it was redacted to the point of pointlessness. i honestly think it would have been better to release nothing, because then at least we would not have another article with no point beyond rehashing the same partisan bickering in the comments.
You could have skipped Sullum’s article and spent your time baking sourdough bread, watching a baseball game, riding your bike, just about a zillion possibilities. Nobody is forcing you to read another Sullum article about the Mar-a-Lago document seizure.
How could you possibly know that for a fact?
well.... i didn't have a starter ready for sourdough bread....
Nobody’s forcing you to squawk like a bird, yet here we are.
*****Counterintelligence***** and Export Control Section in the Justice Department's National Security Division........
If you don't know exactly what 'Counterintelligence' is; it's time to find out....
Wow..... Tried to find a web-link; seems it's been cleaned up really well in the last 20-years.
But traces of it still exist.. "deceiving that enemy", "designed to frustrate enemy", "an organization engaged in counterintelligence", "counterintelligence achieved by banning or deleting any information of value to the enemy".....
Just start from 'Intelligence' def - "1. The ability to acquire, understand, and use knowledge" and then Counter that.... It's an entire organization to LIE and FRUSTRATE knowledge (i.e. It's a propaganda unit).
Wikipedia 'Cointelpro' (Counter Intelligence Program) ---
Many of the tactics used in COINTELPRO are alleged to have seen continued use including; discrediting targets through psychological warfare; smearing individuals and groups using forged documents and by planting false reports in the media; harassment; wrongful imprisonment; illegal violence; and assassination. According to a Senate report, the FBI's motivation was "protecting national security, preventing violence, and maintaining the existing social and political order".
A secret army organization that still exists and is used against USA citizens and is controlled by who-ever controls the Defense Department. And I'd place bets the left has 100% control of that UN-American unit today.
As Trump was publicly warned, "Don't mess with the intelligence community..."
While it certainly would not be safe to trust Trump's judgment on that question (or pretty much anything else),
Journalism? Or hot piece?
You go, judge
It’s what’s called an “analysis” of current events. And he is right, by the way, about Trump’s poor judgement.
It's called shitposting and brown-envelope journalism.
Being skeptical of Trump's motives is 'shitposting'. Being skeptical of the FBI's motives is 'sensible'. Got it.
It’s almost like Trump said they were spying on him and everyone laughed at him, and then we find out they lied to a FISA court to…spy on him. And they continue to spy on him. And lefties like you celebrate the IC spying on a president because Orange Man Bad.
Saying he has bad judgment on everything isn’t being skeptical. It’s being a whiny TDS douche canoe.
Somebody new came down with Tony Derangement Syndrome? A panderangement?
Eat shit and die, TDS-addled lefty asshole.
Bet you wouldn't trust trump around a fire extinguisher.
"Pull, Aim, Squeeze, Sweep" sounds like awfully complicated directions. For either the former president or the current one.
Trump judged he could dissuade illegal immigration by talking tough. It worked.
Trump judged he could defang NoKorea. It worked.
Trump told NATO to bolster defense and don’t rely on Russia. He was right.
Trump passed the reduction n corp tax from 35 to 21%. The economy boomed, unemployment set record lows while labor participation rate set record highs. (Current low unemployment is at very low lpr).
Trump dropped a couple of big bombs on Syria to keep Russia et al off balance. It worked, no war.
Admittedly he was foolish to claim he won in 2020 after no evidence was forthcoming. A minor flaw.
Remember that time when the left wing mob that Jeffy and Dee support tore down statues of confederate generals and Trump said they’ll eventually come for other peoples statues and everyone said he was crazy?
Really? Exactly what did Trump do to “defang” North Korea? Other than having a short attention span and forgetting all about them after he got bored with them.
"Trump judged he could dissuade illegal immigration by talking tough. It worked..."
Fuck off and die, TDS-addled lying pile of shit.
"It’s what’s called an “analysis” of current events. And he is right, by the way, about Trump’s poor judgement."
His preferred candidate fucked up Afghanistan, fucked up the US economy, had well more than 500K dead on his watch, and just decided to use an emergency he claimed was not one to justify making me pay for other people's student loans.
Trump has far better judgment than the blithering pool of monkey semen we have now.
It’s called bullshit opinion.
But this time they've got him.....
Someday someone will attempt to apply libertarian principles to analysis of these events.
But it is not this day.
Nor this publication.
Go ahead.
This doesn’t seem to be a series of events that hinges on issues of liberty. It’s all about secure record keeping.
FBI shill.
"Trump's word is gospel" is not a libertarian principle.
What happened here seems obvious: Trump just doesn't care about the rules governing classified documents or national security secrets. He wants to be able to do whatever he wants whenever he wants. So when NARA found a bunch of classified documents mixed in with all of the newspaper articles in those boxes of documents, it alarmed them that he was being so careless with state secrets.
And sure they could have continued to negotiate with Trump to return them all. But why? From NARA's point of view, every minute they continued to negotiate meant one more minute that one of those top secret documents carelessly stashed at Mar-a-Lago could accidentally find its way into the wrong hands.
And why should they take Trump at his word anyway, that he was negotiating in good faith? Why should they? Because they treated Obama and Bush and everyone else that way? But Trump is not Obama nor Bush. Trump trashed and vilified them, unlike the others. Trump objectively demonstrated by his careless handling of documents that he didn't give a shit about the rules, unlike the others. If I were in NARA's shoes I would play hardball too. What is the point of continuing to negotiate with someone who hates you and doesn't give a shit about the rules? It would be as if Jesse were holding documents that rightfully belonged to me. There would be no point in me trying to negotiate with Jesse to get the documents back because he very obviously hates me and would rather play games instead of doing what is right. Same deal here.
Funny stuff.
Presidents shouldn't be above the law when it comes to dealing with government documents.
But anyone who thinks raiding the private home of your political opponents is an acceptable tactic is just inviting banana-republic style juntas to take over. There used to be honor among government thieves.
Given that the President has absolute and total control over classification...they ARE the law alone. Nobody can override them.
He's not the president - Joe Biden is - and there has been no evidence presented that he declassified any docs found at Maggot-Lago when he was. If if he had, those docs are the governments, not his, and he walked off with them for god knows what reason.
Biden is not going to like these new rules. He will have his clearance yanked at 12:01P on 1/21/25 and he should prepare for a very invasive investigation of him at 12:02P on 1/21/25.
Yeah, if that happened, which it didn't. The NARA could care less who they are dealing with. Their only job is securing and maintaining records. This was their fight to begin with, not the FBI or DOJ who's job it is to investigate and prosecute law breakers like Fatso.
Joe Asshole lies. Do not engage the lying pile of lefty shit which is Joe Asshole.
Fuck off and die, Asshole.
That's because as president, he doesn't have to care.
That argument is total b.s. Mar-a-Lago is under 24/7 secret service protection. On top of that, neither NARA nor the FBI were in any hurry to actually recover the documents, taking months to do so. Finally, it's not NARA's business to concern itself with whether information is classified.
Fatso is not the president anymore, Joe Biden is. Further, no president has the right to remove anything - classified or not - that is a record of official duties. There is no feasible removal of these records from the WH - unless they are strictly personal - which would not be illegal.
Correct: we have a corrupt, rapist, racist imbecile as president now.
Ah, this is from the "Joe Friday Made It All Up" federal statute. You are as dumb as our current president.
"The Presidential Records Act of 1978 established that all presidential records are owned by the public and automatically transfer into the custody of the National Archives as soon as a commander-in-chief leaves office. All presidential libraries and museums are part of the National Archives. Former President Barack Obama’s presidential library will be the first to be fully digital.
“The National Archives and Records Administration is the official record keeper for the United States government,” Ryan Guthorn said. “Only about one to 3% of the records are considered permanent records, and those are the documents that are essential to understanding the rights and entitlements of U.S. citizens, that hold our elected officials accountable for their actions, [and] document our history as a nation.”...."
https://www.voanews.com/a/why-presidential-papers-don-t-belong-to-presidents-/6694170.html
This does not mean that the former president can't take copies with him home. As you can tell from what you quote: even Obama's records are "fully digital", which means that NARA keeps digital copies. Furthermore, violations of the Presidential Records Act are not criminal, and records remain the property of the president.
And the Presidential Records Act has nothing to do with security classification, which is the ostensible justification for the raid.
So, under the Presidential Records Act, transfer of documents is a process that is negotiated between the former president and NARA, not something where the FBI raids the former president's office and just takes what they want.
"Correct: we have a corrupt, rapist, racist imbecile as president now."
You talking about Biden or Trump?
I am obviously talking about Biden.
It really isn't obvious. Trump could be described as a "corrupt, rapist, racist imbecile," and a third of the country is convinced he's the current president.
The word "now" is pretty unambiguous.
Yes, but the description would be wrong; with Biden, it applies.
"...;Trump could be described as a "corrupt, rapist, racist imbecile," and a third of the country is convinced he's the current president..."
TDS-addled steaming piles of lefty shit could make this claim and BELIEVE it, steaming pile of TDS-addled lefty shit.
Not even to Stop The Steal? To save the Undead? To git them Assassins of Youth?
PS Maggat-Lago is not sufficiently secure for classified documents. It is a place of business which allows foreign nationals and those without security checks to join and enter. In fact known foreign nationals have been there and a few might have been spies.
Mar-a-Lago is a big place. Trump's residence and office not only have top of the line private security, they are protected by the secret service.
I'm sure there have been foreign spies at Mar-a-Lago. I'm also sure they have had no access to secret information.
That's more than I can say for Pelosi (employed a Chinese spy as a driver for years), Swalwell (had a sexual relationship with a Chinese spy), or Hillary Clinton (secret documents found their way into unauthorized mailboxes).
Doubling down on BS doesn't make it true NYOB.
Truer words were never spoken, Joe. You should take them to heart and stop spewing such b.s.
There was an interesting analysis of the redactions I read this morning (unfortunately, I’m having trouble finding it again) that argued that the heavy redactions imply that the DoJ doesn’t plan to pursue any charges against Trump now that NARA has the documents back.
It’s a distinct possibility that nothing more is going to happen. No prosecution. Politically, it would be the smartest move on the Democrats part. All the grousing from Trump defenders would all be about a non-existent persecution of Trump.
Amazing.
The raid was clearly carried out as a fishing expedition. You're right that there will be no further charges since they obviously haven't found anything. That doesn't make the raid itself any more acceptable.
But let's hope that this sets a precedent and that Biden will be raided next when he's out of office. Pelosi, Swalwell, Nadler, and Schumer also seem like excellent targets for such fishing expeditions, and unlike Trump, it's likely that there will be evidence of other crimes.
Reason has become a coward's page. They've gone from liberty for everyone to liberty for the progressive elites only, everyone else is guilty until proven innocent. Jacob is nothing more than a boot licking fascist, cheering for the government based on his leftist bias and bigotry.
He simply wrote a recap of what’s been going on. A tad sensitive to anything that reflects negatively on Trump, aren’t we?
It has nothing to do with Trump. We are concerned about Democrats turning into totalitarians and fascists.
Democrats will abuse the power of government and target and destroy anybody who gets in their way, as they have proven time and time again.
Nobody knows as much about that subject as a girl-bullying nationalsocialist sockpuppet behind a mask, fer shoor! I'll bet Jacob's feelin's're so hurt he won't be able to produce investigative journalism for at least an hour!
Reason: "Pardon Assange, Reality Winner, and Snowden!"
Also Reason: "Trump broke the law by mishandling classified material! Or maybe it wasn't even classified but he still broke the law!"
Whether declassified or not - and there is no record that they were - they aren't his, they're the governments, and he's breaking the law hanging on to them.
Lock him up
Now do Hillary.
And fuck what-aboutism. How about we jail both for many years?
i am down with jailing both.
Fuck off and die, steaming pile of TDS-addled lefty shit.
Hillary violated criminal law and obstructed justice.
Trump did neither.
That is incorrect. The former president has exclusive legal custody of the records; the National Archives merely provide "courtesy storage".
And violations of the Presidential Records Act are not criminal violations and do not result in penalties.
That sounds awfully familiar... rings a bell, ackshully... where did I hear something like that before, I wonder? Aleppo! That's where!
Boy, aren’t we sensitive to any criticism of Trump. All Reason has done is blog posts recapping and analysis of what is going on, with no advocacy whatsoever for prosecuting Trump.
Caw caw!
R Mac always a-nipping at my ankles.
Well maybe you shouldn’t be such a cunt then.
"...it is still not clear exactly why the FBI decided to take that unprecedented and politically explosive step."
Really? WTF?
I guess this is Reason coming out as state-sponsored propaganda.
Reason wants the FBI to be allowed to choose to you can elect and who you can’t.
Fuck alleged nuclear secrets. I think the important question in all of this is "When are we going to see the affidavit in the case of the missing Ws?"
Nuclear secrets:
Trump : “I lik E mc Donald’s”
FBI: it’s right there E=mc2, the fundament nuclear secret!
What an idiot (Trump). An 22 year old lieutenant in the Army is trained to take better care of classified documents, and knows taking them home is completely illegal. Claiming he made a "standing order" to declassify everything he brings home is utter nonsense. I'd bet money there is no such written order, and I have a hard time believing it'd be legal anyway. The findings of the amount of classified documents show he has complete disregard for the law and national security.
Well, it’s not utter nonsense in the sense that he probably has the power to do it. Thing is, there’s no record whatsoever that he had any such order.
Whether he has the power or not without there being some record o it, THEY ARE NOT HIS RECORDS TO TAKE HOME, CLASSIFIED OR NOT! He can only claim records pertaining to his personal life, which of course anything classified would not meet that standard.
Fuck off and die, steaming pile of TDS-addled lefty shit.
NOW DO OBAMA TAKING 30 MILLION DOCUMENTS AND PROMISING TO DIGITIZE THEM AND DOING JACK SHIT SO FAR YOU RETARDED DEMOCRAT KNUCKLE DRAGGER!
Doofus, Obama's docs are all in the possession and guard of the NARA. Cripes, read a fucking newspaper some time. The NARA responded immediately to this BS charge by Trump on the same day he made it 2 weeks ago.
We have no idea whether "all" of Obama's documents are in NARA's possession.
All we know is that NARA archived the documents Obama gave them.
There's every bit as much record of Trump's order as there is for the Birchin Birth, the existence of a historical Jesus, the resurrection of Lazarus and the stains on the Turin Shroud in which Jesus was theoretically swaddled a millennium after the crucifixions which the fake news of the Year Zero covered up and kept out of print. If all of God's Children all over the world will close their eyes and say "I Do Believe In Trump, I do, I do!"... then all of this goes away, Trump is reinstated, girls go back to coathangers and nonwhites off to jail.
Texan Tyler Kent counted on his American citizenship and hatred of communist atheism for immunity. His London lodgings were found crammed with pilfered Most Secret documents in May 1940. His czarist galpal Anna Wolkoff leaked contents to God's Own Popolo to please Jesus. Nearly 2000 secret documents found in a search sufficed to arrest, strip of immunity and secretly sentence the jew-baiting spy to 7 years. Later deported to the US, Kent was still being investigated when Lee Harvey Oswald shot John Connally.
Tyler Kent was 29 when he was busted for espionage.
Just my two cents but it has reached the point where the stuff the FBI took from Trump's house better contain pix of the aliens who crashed at Roswell and secret pix of the shooters on the knoll who killed JFK or everybody is gonna be unhappy.
There are two abutments to the bridge at Dealey Plaza. A case can be made for three shooters: one shot JFK from the Post Office parking lot with his back to the sun. Another evidently shot Connally on the second try from the 6th floor window. A third has confessed to shooting the President from the picket fence opposite from the Post office, at the parking lot-the dramatic shot filmed by Zapruder. A flash on footage shot from the Post office lends some credence to the purported hitman's confession. Ford and Arlen claim magic made Oswald do it all.
Roswell was already crawling with aliens in 1943. It was a POW camp stocked with pure-bred nazis. To the north, across the valley east of Los Alamos was a campful of wily Nipponese gentlemen. Two more camps held
enemy aliensundocumented detainees closer to El Paso and Lordsburg NM. Nazi U-boat crews abducted in Close Encounters with the USN lived next to Phoenix. Pictures of them are everywhere.Committing a crime requires "mens rea", an intent to commit a crime. Classified papers put together with magazines and other junk don't look like somebody was intentionally collecting them for a removal. More likely, they just took piles of papers and quickly shoved into boxes (bad job, Ivanka!) and then the boxes were stored somewhere without ever looking through the content. If you live in a big mansion, you can afford to store a large number of boxes without cleaning for years. And I bet, Trump himself has no clue what he de-classified, what he did not. But being clueless and messy doesn't qualify for "willfully" (as repeated several times), it's the opposite.
Fixing it would require NARA employees to make an appointment and look though all this mess (you don't want to leave it to MAL employees with no security clearance)... but why would they bother if they can allege a crime and involve the FBI? There is always an emergency! (well, when it's convenient, nobody cared for 1.5 years)
I'm glad that a presumably libertarian site tacitly advocates for a more invasive government and punishment for crimes not committed.
Not that clear cut Julia and especially since willful negligence - the raid was the 3rd effort - not counting discussions prior to the 1st visit to the site. BS about nothing was classified is just bad faith crap given that classified or not he can't keep official documents, i.e., anything not of a personal nature.
NARA spent an inordinate amount of time on this and Trump cannot uses as an excuse that he was ignorant of the law after months and months of discussion. He has lawyers.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it's what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Eat shit and die, Asshole.
Again, Trump has not been charged with any crime.
In fact, Trump's boxes were packed by the federal government, specifically the GSA.
This must be some of that foolish consistency little statesmen and divines prefer to truth, justice and schadenfreude. The pompous ass and his party followed Hitler's dictum that "If we do one day achieve power, then we will hold onto it, so help us God." Turns out god is as fictitious as the mens rea of a hippie passing a joint, or of an individual woman exercising a right to NOT reproduce like chattel. Give me schadenfreude over fake concern with mens rea from the party that helped Nazis to power while jailing Jews for wine.
The high level of classification of some of the documents is for things like names of agents and assets and methods used to gather information on adversaries as well as secrets regarding where our missiles are and such. These kinds of things likely should not ever be declassified without serious debate among those directly responsible for classifying them in the first place. Whatever legal authority the President has to declassify things, so many Trump supporters are just assuming that if Trump really did declassify them, that it wouldn't hurt for adversaries to get the information. Or, perhaps they didn't even think of that at all, and are just reflexively defending Trump.
Fuck off and die, steaming pile of TDS-addled lefty shit.
I'm simply assuming that a locked storage room in the basement of an ex-president under top-notch private security AND secret service protection is sufficiently secure for any US government documents.
In fact, given that the federal government has been leaking like a sieve for the past half dozen years, it is likely that Mar-a-Lago is more secure than pretty much any government facility.
I'm simply assuming that a locked storage room in the basement of an ex-president under top-notch private security AND secret service protection is sufficiently secure for any US government documents.
The DoJ had gotten video surveillance footage from the hallway outside that storage room, and reports are that they were "alarmed" by something unspecified in that footage. That video was apparently part of what led to the warrant. Your assumptions do not seem at all justified to me.
It was a little more specified than that: they saw people moving boxes in and out of the storeroom.
Yes, people moved boxes in and out of the storeroom because the government was pestering Trump's legal team to review the documents!
Vague statements like that are meant as a political hit job, and gullible people like you fall for it.
That lying pile of lefty shit will invent any and all means to lie about Trump.
The perpetual victim complex here is astounding. Trump had a couple dozen boxes full of records that he wasn't supposed to have. He and/or his lawyers spent several months delaying before giving some of them back. When the NARA realized that the records they did receive included documents that were marked as being classified, including some with the highest levels of classification that never should have been stored outside of secure government facilities, they referred the matter to the DoJ. Trump's lawyers spent more months delaying and the DoJ finally subpoenaed more records. Trump lawyers had claimed that Trump had declassified them, but if that were true, then there would be documentation of that.* A Trump lawyer in June had signed a statement that "to the best of [her] knowledge" everything marked classified had been returned, which we know to be untrue.
As usual, Trump is his own worst enemy, requiring subordinates to do and say things in his defense that are false and just plain ridiculous. Why anyone believes anything he says or would work for him is beyond me.
*There were multiple court rulings during 2020 regarding Trump tweets about declassifying things, and Chief of Staff Mark Meadows even made a sworn statement regarding one of those cases stating that such tweets were not "self-executing" declassification orders. Declassifying something, even as a practical matter, rather than a legal one, would entail notifying everyone else that has access to the information that it was now declassified, and aides would have to physically change the marking on the documents so that people would know that were now allowed to see them.
No, his lawyers spent several months disputing that he wasn't supposed to have those boxes. How records from the presidency are divided up is something that is negotiated between NARA and the former president. It's not something that NARA or the FBI can unilaterally determine.
Trump is under no obligation to document that he declassified something. Furthermore, there is no reason for him not to have classified documents since he still has security clearance and his offices are secure.
There is nothing "perpetual" about it, nor does this have to do specifically with Trump. Fact is that over the last dozen years, Democrats have been increasingly abusing the power of government to persecute their political opponents. And it won't end well for Americans if it continues.
No, his lawyers spent several months disputing that he wasn't supposed to have those boxes. How records from the presidency are divided up is something that is negotiated between NARA and the former president. It's not something that NARA or the FBI can unilaterally determine.
Are you saying that when an employee of the government leaves their job, that they can take home whatever they want from their office and then spend months negotiating which things were their personal property and which were government property? Some things might legitimately be debatable whether they were government documents or not, such as the "no quid pro quo" notes, but certainly, anything that was ever classified would be, even if declassified. The Presidential Records Act is a law. Most people don't get to negotiate with the government about whether they need to follow the law in the way that the government interprets it. But Trump is special, I guess.
Trump is under no obligation to document that he declassified something. Furthermore, there is no reason for him not to have classified documents since he still has security clearance and his offices are secure.
I already explained why it would be important that declassifying information needs to be documented. In addition to that, if nothing else, it needs to be documented that he declassified these particular documents, or else why should we believe that he really did? It would be totally self serving to claim that now, and Trump does not have a record of being trustworthy with the truth.
As for security clearance, I could be wrong, but the President might not even have a security clearance simply because it is irrelevant. The President would be able to view any document and know anything relating to national defense with no restriction. No official security clearance would be necessary. A President certainly should follow proper protocols in handling classified information, simply because that would be smart and safe. But in case you keep forgetting, Trump isn't President anymore and hasn't been since Jan. 20, 2021. He no longer has any right to keep written classified information. Anything he knows that is classified, he would have to follow the law regarding keeping it secret just like anyone else that ever had access to classified information. And his offices are not "secure", at least not nearly to the same extent as a building where classified information is normally kept, especially the TS:SCI documents included among the many records the DoJ recovered from Trump.
There is nothing "perpetual" about it, nor does this have to do specifically with Trump. Fact is that over the last dozen years, Democrats have been increasingly abusing the power of government to persecute their political opponents. And it won't end well for Americans if it continues.
I don't find it credible for Republicans to truly be concerned about this, given how many of them have shown eagerness to turn that same authority onto Democrats should they take over Congress after this year's election and the White House in 2024. (Or the half dozen congressional committees that launched investigations into Benghazi that all wound down after the 2016 election, for some reason, if you're looking at the last dozen years.) Nor do I accept Republicans really believing in the rule of law in general, after their virtual silence as Trump pardoned his associates, only one voted to convict him for trying to extort Zelensky's help in going after Biden, among so many other things.
There is a lot about our current politics that won't end well for Americans if it continues, and Democrats investigating Republicans would only be one of many, even if I were to concede that it is happening illegitimately.
Anyone is welcome to parse that pile of shit directly above, but understand your addressing a fucking. lying pile of lefty shit willing to justify murder to keep folks from, maybe, putting their feet on the assholes JasonT20 worships:
JasonT20
February.6.2022 at 6:02 pm
“How many officers were there to stop Ashlee Babbitt and the dozens of people behind her from getting into the legislative chamber to do who knows what?...”
No, just the president.
Well, yes, you think that. How is what you think relevant to Trump's actual legal obligations?
And I pointed out that former presidents retain clearance and are frequently consulted on national security matters.
You accused me of suffering from a "perpetual victim complex". I am telling you that I, personally, are deeply concerned about the abuse of power, corruption, and lies coming from Democrats.
Yes: progressivism is the initial stage of fascism, and you are an incipient fascist.
I frankly don't have any idea what to do about a country being taken over by fascists like you, but telling you that you are a f*cking evil fascist is probably a good start.
Well, yes, you think that. How is what you think relevant to Trump's actual legal obligations?
He can't simply claim something and provide no evidence that it is true and expect to use that as a defense. That is how it is relevant to his legal obligations.
And I pointed out that former presidents retain clearance and are frequently consulted on national security matters.
Really? How often do you think Trump consulted Obama and George W. Bush and Bill Clinton on national security matters? You're making an assertion here without evidence. At least I am admitting that I don't actually know whether former Presidents have security clearance. I am making guesses that are consistent with the assertion that they can classify and declassify things at will while in office, though.
No, just the president.
I think you mean just Trump. Can you name any other former President that spent months negotiating with the National Archives about whether to give back documents he took from the White House?
I frankly don't have any idea what to do about a country being taken over by fascists like you, but telling you that you are a f*cking evil fascist is probably a good start.
Which ideology do you think fits this better? Progressivism or Trumpist conservativism?
So just what are the differences between Theodore Roosevelt's Bull Moose Progressives and The Don's Grab Opposition Pussy mystics? Both believe Comstockism should coerce women with deadly force lest they use birth control, both support prohibition fanaticism to please Communist China, both endorse, the Manifesto income tax, both figureheads strutted and posed to curry favor with the Methodist White Terror and both tried to reduce Latin America to vassal peonage. Quid interest?
Again, that is your opinion, not legal fact.
Well, then I suggest you look it up! It's not my f*cking job to give you an education.
Those characteristics indeed fit contemporary progressives and Democrats much better than "Trumpist conservatism".
In addition, progressives and Democrats advocate fascist ideology (collectivism, strong government control over the economy, economic fairness, etc.) and historically favored European fascist regimes until WWII, when that became politically untenable.
You are not seeming to understand that your feelings about an issue are irrelevant in the face of the facts about the same issue.
No one said that Trump consulted Obama. What was said is that former presidents ARE consulted frequently about matters of national security.
And there is plenty of evidence of it. Just watch Obama commenting on Trump's national security policy for proof.
But again, you are letting feeling overrule rationality. You do not know--and refuse to research--whether ex-presidents retain clearance. Because doing so would xompletely undermine your stance. So you adopt a pose of intentional ignorance and refuse to check. This suggests to all reading that you know you're wrong.
Obama. Bush. Clinton, Reagan, Nixon.
But you won't check. For the same reason you won't check if ex-presidents have clearance.
Progressivism doesn't have to be adapted to 'fit' fascism, it's a step along the way. 'Trumpist' conservatism is diametrically opposed to it.
"So just what are the differences between Theodore Roosevelt's Bull Moose Progressiv...oth tried to reduce Latin America to vassal peonage. Quid interest?"
Stuff your TDS up your ass, shit-pile. Your head wants company.
Well, then I suggest you look it up! It's not my f*cking job to give you an education.
Unbelievable. You made the claim that former Presidents retain security clearance, yet I am supposed to do the research if I doubt that. I've been wasting my time.
Those characteristics indeed fit contemporary progressives and Democrats much better than "Trumpist conservatism".
I don't think that either you or Azathoth even read what was in that link.
Basically all this sheds light on, all it could shed light on, is what claims the FBI thought it necessary to make to obtain the warrant. They could be honest claims, they could be pretext, it will be a long while before we know; The FBI has a history of making both in warrant applications.
True. However one thing which predisposes one to think that the affidavit was legit was that the raid found what the affidavit said it would find, which is more likely than if the affidavit was made up out of whole cloth.
No, what allows you to lend any credence to is your raging case of TDS, asshole.
Likewise, we know what they said they found, not what they actually found. Don't acknowledge that they sometimes lie, and then immediately forget that again.
SRG is a BELIEVER, don't harsh his mellow.
She's also a lying pile of TDS-addled lefty shit, claiming that FDR was a better POTUS than Trump, so you are excused if you assume s/he's full of shit.
MAGA: My Aides Getting Arrested
MAGA: My Attorneys Getting Annihilated
MAGA: My Associates Giving Allocutions
MAGA: My Ass Getting Arrested
MAGA: My Allies Getting Apprehended
Carry on, culture war casualties. So far as your betters permit, of course.
Asshole bigot: They got someone how knew Trump!!!!!
For an unpaid parking ticket and a alate library book return...
Up yours with a running rusty chainsaw, lying asshole bigot.
keep in mind "a few bedrock principles." First, "a president has absolute authority to declassify documents." Second, "presidential actions involving classified documents are not subject to criminal sanction."
So Jimmy Carter is free to disclose the Siege of Mecca to the American People now? Carter is a FORMER president, tossed out after a single term by 10 to 1 in the electoral college and 4 to 3 in the popular vote--in favor of a party that STILL wants the Constitution to force women to reproduce at gunpoint as in Islamistan. Trump was defenestrated twice in the popular vote and once by the electoral college. I'll bet cash that makes him no longer the president.
As a steaming pile of TDS addled lefty shit, were you so stupid as to hope this would get ignored or so 'clever' you hoped no one else would notice?
"So Jimmy Carter is free to disclose the Siege of Mecca to the American People now?"
Trump declared those de-classified when he WAS POTUS, asswipe.
The entire narrative is wrong. The raid of Mar-a-Lago was purely political and everyone knows that it was purely political. This does not mean that Trump is squeaky clean.
With every president there are disputes with the National Archive and the former president regarding documents. Arguments that this is anything different is a failure to acknowledge history.
Raiding the home of a former president is unprecedented and after decades of claims of voting irregularities it is very unwise and dangerous. Trump received over 70 million votes, more than any other president previously. Biden may have received more, but the reality is that a ton of people voted for Trump.
Do you really want to stoke discontent by raiding Trump? With the raid, Biden, DOJ and FBI are exposing themselves of having toxic partisanship. Understand that I despise and have never voted for him. I don't want Trump to be president again either, but saying this I have come to despise the likes of Biden, DOJ and FBI even more.
I no longer have faith in the honor of "our institutions" because I do not believe that the are "our institutions" any longer. These institutions no longer serve in the interest of the citizens, but server themselves and their endless lust for power.
While Trump may even be guilty of laws that probably should be repealed anyway, but the reality is that the raid of Mar-a-lago (de-facto third impeachment) is purely political.
I'm not sure reform is good enough any more unless 3/4 of the federal government is dissolved and power returned to the citizens at the local level. Not the state level and many states are way too large to faithfully represent their citizens, but rather the local level.
I can walk down the street and talk to the mayor. I can't get close to the governor and you forget talking to a president unless you represent a special interest group with a wad of cash.
My mayor is much more inclined to listen to the needs of my community that the governor who only listens to large voter blocks and then disregards the real differences between urban and rural.
Presidents don't listen to the citizens at all, but only to the special interest groups with agenda that rarely reflect the interests of the citizens. For example teacher unions over the actual student.
The reality is that urban new york has little in common with rural iowa. What makes common sense for urban new yorkers, simply is impossible to implement and ineffective in rural iowa.
There are real differences and voting results reflect this. We are roughly a 50-50 country due to having two major political parties. If we delve deeper, there are multiple factions within each of the two major parties.
The two major parties have failed the citizens and this failure has resulted into giving the voters two terrible options. The time has come for the rise of third parties and the breakup of the two major parties. If we want change and believe this hot mess can be fixed, then avoid both major political parties and vote third party.
"...This does not mean that Trump is squeaky clean..."
Strange.
He's been "investigated" by every TDS-addled prosecutor in the US for the last 6 years, every one of them willing to toss his ass in jail for not signing on page 31, and yet, nada.
If that ain't "squeaky clean", it'll do until something better comes along. Pretty sure most of us wouldn't have come out of that process minus some charge or other.
As pointed out by Viva Frei and Robert Barnes...Judge signed the order via WhatsApp, which is insane. Also means that Facebook, which owns WhatsApp, has an unredacted copy. Somebody should subpoena them for it.
This is some of the best investigative reporting since the "Love Canal" piece. But since when does "does not necessarily mean he had criminal intent" have any bearing in American law? Lysander Spooner indicated Mens Rea is important. But God's Own Pussygrabbers seek to jail, rob, shoot, even execute harmless people over plant leaves, birth control, declining involuntary servitude or a thousand other unintentional slights to superstitious shibboleths. Why the special treatment for a prohibitionist girl-bullier?
Fuck off and die, steaming pile of TDS-addled shit.
Only a libertarian could believe that a document with most of the text blacked out sheds light on anything.
What a mucking foron.
"But even if Trump was not as attentive and cooperative as Corcoran suggests, that does not necessarily mean he had criminal intent."
intent has nothing to do with it. those provided access to classified or NDI material have an affirmative responsibility to protect it, including being able to recognize when it is not properly protected, and to take action to return it to proper control. criminal intent is not required - simple negligence is sufficient, and anyone in the rank and file of government employees who failed in that responsibility would not only be facing prosecution, but would be in confinement awaiting the indictment, unlike Trump, Clinton, Petraeus, etc. with their political connections.