Law

Trump's 'Eastman Memo' Proposed an Unconstitutional Power Grab by the Vice President

A conservative law professor advised Donald Trump that Mike Pence could unilaterally overturn the 2020 election.

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Earlier this week, CNN obtained a copy of a legal memorandum prepared for then-President Donald Trump that envisioned a "January 6 scenario" under which Trump could seek to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election, which he lost to Joe Biden.

Authored by conservative law professor John Eastman, the "Eastman Memo," as it has been dubbed in the press, argued that Vice President Mike Pence, while presiding over the joint session of Congress on January 6, 2021, possessed the sole power to count electoral votes and that Pence should use this power to reject pro-Biden votes and thus deliver the White House to Trump. "Howls, of course, from the Democrats," Eastman wrote. "The main thing here is that Pence should do this without asking for permission—either from a vote of the joint session or from the Court." According to Eastman, "the Constitution assigns this power to the Vice President as the final arbiter. We should take all of our actions with that in mind."

In reality, the Constitution assigns no such power to the vice president. Eastman's scheme is bogus on its face. Indeed, just imagine if Vice President Al Gore had attempted a similar power grab in January 2001 by unilaterally gaveling himself in as the winner of the 2000 presidential election instead of his opponent, George W. Bush. As Case Western Reserve University law professor Jonathan Alder has observed, the Eastman memo is "poor lawyering for a disreputable cause."

Alas, those negatives did not deter Trump, who embraced Eastman's poor lawyering and publicly lobbied his vice president to overturn the election by rejecting pro-Biden electoral votes. "If Mike Pence does the right thing," Trump said. "We win the election."

In the end, Pence did do the right thing. "It is my considered judgment," the vice president said, "that my oath to support and defend the Constitution constrains me from claiming unilateral authority to determine which electoral votes should be counted and which should not."

Trump embraced a number of ludicrous legal theories in his attempt to remain in power after losing the election to Biden. Add the Eastman Memo to that sorry list.

NEXT: U.S. To Continue Cruel Treatment of Haitian Refugees—But Not on Horseback

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  1. So Trump acted on this, and is still President? Or tried to act on it and caused a Constitutional crisis?

    Don’t think so.

    Just another Democratic “What if?” to rile up the base.

    1. Trump did act on it. He put intense pressure on Pence to do it. It was Pence who refused. Attempted coup is still very disturbing.

      1. How intense was the pressure.
        Trump: Hey Mike could you do this,
        Pence: No i cant
        Trump: okay never mind.

        1. It was INTENSE pressure.

          Trump: Mike, do this.
          Pence: Nope. Sorry, can’t.
          Trump: I’m super not going to be friends with you anymore if you don’t.
          Pence: Still not gonna do it.
          Trump: I hate you.
          Pence: Still not doing it.

          I don’t know how Pence isn’t in therapy from all the intensity.

          1. We all saw the retributive hell he unleashed on Tillerson for calling him a moron and resigning. Worse than Russiagate and SCOTUS interroviews combined. Good thing Pence wasn’t a reporter by trade or Trump probably would’ve had him banned from the press corps to this day.

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        2. He publicly bad mouthed his own Vice President in public rallies.

          Are you seriously ignorant of what transpired?

          1. Is that what counts as intense pressure these days? Its amazing anyone had the ability to run against him after all the intense pressure he put on democrats for 4 years

            1. It is exceedingly bizarre for a President to publicly denounce his own Vice President in front of their mutual base of supporters. That is tin-pot dictator purge behavior.

              1. Yes, well, Trump was an exceedingly bizarre president. That’s not illegal.
                I remain unconvinced that Trump wants to be a dictator. He wanted to win the election and couldn’t accept that he didn’t. But that’s not the same thing.

                1. He said anything about illegality?

              2. “It is exceedingly bizarre for a President to publicly denounce his own Vice President in front of their mutual base of supporters. That is tin-pot dictator purge behavior.”
                Is this anything like when President Obama said to a room full of supporters “Never underestimate Joe’s ability to fuck things up.” ? Is it sort of like that, no, not really? BTW, you seriously need therapy for your TDS. You’ve waited until you’re foaming at the mouth.

          2. “He publicly bad mouthed his own Vice President in public rallies.”

            Oh, the HORROR! Trump didn’t act like this asshole’s idea of a daddy!
            And this pathetic piece of lefty shit claims that the protestors were going to prevent the transfer of power to droolin’ Joe, armed with found ny-ties and facial tissues!
            You can’t be this stupid with out real effort!

            1. Don’t forget that fearsome grandma with her American flag and travel mug. Did the FBI ever find that fearsome creature?

          3. It’s not about bad mouthing. He openly encouraged the VP to violate his oath of office and subvert the Constitution.

            1. Did he?
              Quite frankly, my default stance on anything concerning Trump is that it’s probably a lie, or at least horribly exaggerated. After 4 years of near-constant retractions or corrections, this should be your default as well.

              First, Trump thought he had won legitimately. He wasn’t subverting the constitution in his mind, but he stopping others from doing so.

              Second, we have no idea what he actually said or did in private.

              Third, despite having literally all the power in the world, this “horrible pressure” he exerted was harsh language. The man who definitely has an armies of both soldiers and lawyers and probably has assassins at his command, “abused” his authority by shouting, not even by firing people.

      2. “Trump did act on it.”

        Cite?

        And “Trump discussed it with Pence” means nothing, if that’s all you have.

        1. No Trump sat at a rally yelling for the people to go tell Pence to do exactly this ursurpation of power.

          1) Trump was wrong legally.
          2) It was pretty shitty to try and make Pence do this.
          3) And nothing came of it.

          I don’t see how it is really a big deal for people to accept that Trump threw a pretty shitty hail marry that no one would be proud of had it actually worked. And while I don’t believe it amounted to incitement, it was exactly this call for the people to march on the Capital and tell Pence to change the vote, that led to the standoff and eventual riot there.

          It was a foolish move for Trump. It was a mistake. He shouldn’t have done it.

          1. No Trump sat at a rally yelling for the people to go tell Pence to do exactly this ursurpation of power.

            There’s a Constitutional clause forbidding the President from encouraging the public to take peaceful political action one way or the other? It’s not like he sicced the DOJ on Pence’s kids to make him testify against a sitting Presiden… I mean overturn the electoral votes.

          2. Sure. This is so much worse than, well… stealing an election.

        2. https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-attacks-pence-for-not-having-courage-to-overturn-election-2021-1

          Trump’s tweet, after Pence refused to do his bidding:

          “Mike Pence didn’t have the courage to do what should have been done to protect our Country and our Constitution, giving States a chance to certify a corrected set of facts, not the fraudulent or inaccurate ones which they were asked to previously certify. USA demands the truth!”

          You seriously don’t know about this, or don’t remember it?

          1. They’re nuts. They don’t let any fact get into their LoveTrump bubble.

            1. Guess so. How can someone not know about these things?

            2. turd lies. It’s what turd does. If turd posts it , it’s either a lie or there’s a lie in there.
              turd is a pathological liar entirely too stupid to recognize the lies he tells of that everyone else (outside if the idiot Mike) knows turd does nothing but lie.

          2. An after the fact tweet from Trump holds no power over Pence in fact trump can’t order pence to do anything so intense from a man who is always intense gets ignored just like chicken little. have you never dealt with hyperbolic people before

            1. Whatever. You’ll make any excuse for Trump, even though he blatantly tried to undermine American democracy. That is reprehensible on your part.

          3. With the fucking mean tweets again.

            You people are the saddest bunch of emotional girl-babies I have ever encountered in my life. And I have two teenaged daughters.

            Mean tweets are not “undermining democracy.” You what undermining democracy is? Creating a false allegation of “collusion,” faking the evidence, peddling it to the FBI and CIA, shopping it to news networks, falsifying FISA warrants, and spending billions of dollars and years of America’s time on a lie, all to undermine a duly elected president.

            People like you are the reason this country is in the shitter right now. You’re such a giant puss-bag, that you would have voted for literally ANYONE, up to amd including that senile waste of a decent suit who currently holds the office, because you can’t handle mean tweets and Trump makes your feelings hurty.

            1. “because you can’t handle mean tweets and Trump makes your feelings hurty.”

              Says the people who threw a childish hissy fit over clinton’s Basket of deplorables statement which is about the softest of political insults ever hurled.

              1. The hag still lost. Cry some more bitch. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!1!1!!!!

          4. Trump is legally allowed to believe that the election was stolen. I’ll assume for the sake of argument that he genuinely believes that to be the case. In that case, what should he do? Accept an illegitimate election? Seems like that would be the worse thing for democracy.
            It’s not impossible or inconceivable that someday an election might be stolen through fraud. It’s not bad to think about what might need to happen in those circumstances.

            1. David Berkowitz though a dog was telling him to kill people. That wasn’t what got him in trouble — it was the actual killing of people.

              1. Mike believes that people armed with facial tissue can overthrow a republic!
                How stupid do you have to be?

          5. “giving States a chance to certify a corrected set of facts, not the fraudulent or inaccurate ones which they were asked to previously certify. USA demands the truth!”

            Sounds to me like the drum getting beat and the drum that got beat are two different things.

            It’s not as-if Trump asked Pence to make him President but instead asked for time to establish some Election Integrity by the State which according to that statement is outside the hands of the VP or President Trump.

            If that’s right; Ya-all can stuff your deceitful manipulation tactics where the sun doesn’t shine.

          6. Oh no a mean tweet…the absolute horror!!!

      3. He was apparently advised that it WAS constitutional. You just don’t like it. Contrast that with Biden openly admitting that his eviction moratorium was unconstitutional, but he was doing it anyway. Along with so many other unconstitutional, evil things.

        Maybe pence should have done it. We would be infinitely better off.

    2. Trumpists are some of the most stupid people on Earth.

      1. Yet far more intelligent than the typical democrat. It’s all relative.

  2. Shorter Damon Root:

    Exercising constitutionally delegated powers is unconstitutional.

    1. Also, refusing to certify electors and throwing the election to the house is “acting unilaterally”

      1. Don’t get me wrong. It was a dumb idea .

        But you don’t have to lie about it to say it was a dumb idea .

        It is clearly within his constitutional powers. And it is clearly an unmanned ambiguously not a unilateral action .

        Words actually have meanings, surprisingly.

        1. “Clearly and unambiguously”.

          Boy, do I hate last-second autocorrect

          1. unmanned ambiguouslies are the worst of all.

        2. It’s a dumb idea, but it’s a symptom, not the cause. It’s a plague of post-modern hypocrisy of which Root seems to suffer. The DOJ goes on a 4-yr. fishing expedition to depose a sitting President and when the same President makes changes in the same department that is supposed to answer to him, it’s unconstitutional. But when a President openly and publicly suggests an action to a subordinate without even implying any legal ramifications for refusal, Root suddenly discovers that not only does the Constitution not stipulate that the VP doesn’t have that power, but it suddenly abridges the 1A to the point of silencing the President from even speaking publicly about the matter.

    2. But it is not. The Constitution does not give the VP that power. Go read it.

      1. The constitution says very little about certification and the process.

        1. Of all the extra-constitutional exertions of authority to howl about over the last 3, 4, or 5 Presidents, this is one of the dumbest.

      2. I’ve read it. The Constitution doesn’t specify what should be done if the process it specifies to produce the envelopes to be opened by the VP is not legitimate. It doesn’t specify the power grab in Marbery vs Madison, either, but here we are.

        The process in MI certainly looks illegitimate to me, Assuming I am not persuaded that similar thing happened in enough other States to flip the election I think it would have been entirely salutary for Pence to refuse to open the MI envelope, Biden would still have won, but the shenanigans would have been called attention to.

        1. “it would have been entirely salutary for Pence to refuse to open the MI envelope”

          Oh, sure, the Vice President should usurp the role of the Judiciary branch during what is well established as a ceremony.

        2. I’ve read it.

          No you haven’t. Either that or you do not understand what the word ‘all’ means.

          The Constitution doesn’t specify what should be done if the process it specifies to produce the envelopes to be opened by the VP is not legitimate.

          It is the electors of each state who certify that state’s result. Congress has ZERO authority to certify anything. The only thing they are allowed to do is count. If the legitimacy of the elector certification from a particular state is in contest, then that is a matter for the judiciary not Congress.

          The process in MI certainly looks illegitimate to me,

          Who the fuck cares what you vomit?

    3. Also shorter Root: Presidents do not really need advice.

    4. It’s from the ‘but Trump!’ provision of the constitution. Further supported by the doctrine of ‘no more mean tweets’.

  3. I don’t know how a Lawyer could come up with this idea. I’m no legal schollar and know pence couldn’t do that. the VP is only there to preside of proceedings and break ties nothing more. it makes me wonder if this lawyer did this to set up Trump.

    1. The lawyer was being an idiot. The VP does certify the electoral votes, but he does so in full cooperation of the congress. He in no way has the power to decide which votes get certified and which do not. The clause is clearly procedural minutiae, and not a grant of ultimate power.

      We don’t know of Trump ordered Pence to decertify, but we DO KNOW that Trump ordered several state level Republicans to “find me the votes”. So I suspect Trump actually did issue that order, and Pence had to decide in his heart of heart whether to follow Trump or Jesus. I think Pence’s religious faith saved us.

      1. There is a process stated in the Constitution for putting Electoral votes in envelopes and a process for counting them, but if the former is not legitimately done what to do about that is unspecified. This “certification” that you speak of is imaginary.

    2. Lawyers are paid to tell you what you want to hear, and to give you a legal reason to do what you want to do.

      No Lawyer was ever retained by a client to write a letter that surveyed all the relevant legal data to come up with an opinion on whether some course of action was legal or not. They are retained by their clients and told “tell me how I can do this legally” and then go searching for that path however they can.

      1. Yes, I know that. But tell that to the Guiliani fans.

    3. “I’m no legal schollar(sic) and know pence couldn’t do that.”

      or

      “I don’t know what I’m talking about but I KNOW…”

      No, you don’t.

      1. You don’t have to be a legal schollar to know enough get over yourself or do you think Pence could have overturned the election and please cite where in the constitution it says that.

    4. Well, given Tribe’s opinions on what is and what is not legal, I have no problem buying a lawyer coming up with any asinine idea.

      1. The first thing we do is kill all the lawyers. With woodchippers.

    5. the VP is only there to preside of proceedings

      preside
      intransitive verb

      1: to exercise guidance, direction, or control

      Again, it was a dumb move on Trump’s part, but no dumber than trying to impeach a sitting President without the Chief Justice overseeing the proceedings.

      1. To be fair, I’ve seen similar shenanigans when some Ron Paulers tried to take over the Los Angeles County Republican Central Committee. They failed of course, but their legal shenanigans were also based on spurious readings of election codes and odd phrasings in Roberts Rules of Order. They of course got their efforts smacked down hard in the courts.

        This kind of legalizing is what I call “Cargo Cult Legalism”. They have no idea how the law works, but like the Cargo Cults of New Guinea, think that if they go through what they perceive to be magical incantations, then they too can compel cargo plans to arrive on the island, or get their way in court. You can usually recognize these guys by their propensity to quote from Blackstone’s Commentary on English Law. But Blackstone’s Commentaries are not the law any more than Strong’s Concordance is the Bible.

        Sidenote: My county got several Ron Paulers elected to the central committee (myself included) because we… wait for it… wait… ran for the open positions and won.

  4. So, are you guys gonna do a story about how Nancy Pelosi sought the support of the Joint Chiefs of Staff for what amounts to a coup at this point?

    1. Oh, that’s not a big deal.

      Because libertarians have no enemies to their left.

      1. This would be why our country is so badly (and sometimes violently) divided.

        If you consider those who differ from you, politically, as your enemies rather than your opponents it leads to a very dark place.

        The nature of politics is that sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. Accept it, move on, and prepare for the next bill/election/white paper.

        Very few things in politics, short of civil war, are an existential threat to the Republic. Even if the dumbasses on January 6th had succeeded, it wouldn’t have destroyed America.

        Accept that we all have slightly different worldviews and sometimes yours wins and sometimes yours loses.

        1. The problem with that idea is that progressive ideology is fundamentally opposed to individual rights. While politics can be debated, individual rights are properly placed outside the realm of democracy–to make the debate over politics possible. Progressives won’t do that.

          Here’s an example of what I’m talking about:

          Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

          —-First Amendment

          “Congress shall make no law” means something as fundamental as democracy shouldn’t even apply to these individual rights. To the extent that progressives achieving power means an assault on our individual rights, placing a discussion of our rights within the realm of politics makes the acceptance of progressive power practically impossible. And this isn’t peculiar to our culture or our time in history. This is true cross culturally and throughout history.

          The First Amendment, on religion, specifically, reflects the basics of the Peace of Westphalia, which held that the princes were free to choose their own religion independent of the Holy Roman Emperor, and the people were free to practice their own religion–regardless of what religion their local prince chose. The point was that once people were free to choose their own religion–regardless of what the emperor or their prince chose–they no longer found it necessary to wage war against the emperor or their local prince as the only means to enjoy freedom of religion.

          ISIS had the same problem in more modern times. Once it became clear to people of other religions in Iraq and Syria that ISIS would eventually kill them unless they converted to ISIS’s interpretation of Islam, they became willing to fight ISIS to the death to preserve their rights. It’s hard to hold power under those circumstances. Here in the United States, the consequences of the progressives wanting to violate our rights aren’t as extreme, but the universal equation still works the same way: Because you’re obsessed with violating people’s rights, people refuse to accept your legitimacy (legitimacy is the willingness of the people to accept your right to exercise power).

          Religious rights are one issue, but progressives aren’t just hostile to our religious rights. They’re also openly hostile to freedom of speech, freedom of association, gun rights, property rights, etc., etc. Being progressive is all about using the coercive power of government to force individuals to make sacrifices for the greater good as progressives see it. The differences between that and being fundamentally hostile to individual rights are mostly semantic–is it any wonder people refuse to accept their legitimacy?

          Unless they’re truly ignorant, there’s no good reason for progressives to pretend they don’t understand this. Complaining about people being reluctant to accept the authority of those in power who are openly hostile to them and their rights is like complaining about water being wet. Progressives have spent the last eight years convincing average Americans that progressives hate them for being xenophobic, homophobic, misogynistic, and racist–and they’ve consistently advocated violating their individual rights in various ways. If those average Americans are extremely reluctant to accept the legitimacy of a one-party progressive government under those circumstances, it’s probably because they’re smart.

          1. ^THIS ———– EXACTLY! And why most (prob all) Democrats are the treasonous Democratic-Nazi-Regime. A complete show of ignorance as to what the USA really *is* (being defined by the U.S. Constitution)

        2. “The nature of politics is that sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. Accept it, move on, and prepare for the next bill/election/white paper.”

          Not always. Sometimes Hitler gets selected as Chancellor. Sometimes it’s one man, one vote, one (last) time.

          1. Yes, sometimes Palpatine gets elected and dissolves the Galactic Senate. We sort of missed that bullet with Trump. But don’t think for a minute he didn’t ponder it.

            Which is why are defense is to defend the processes of democratic rule rather than try to usurp them every time and election doesn’t go our way.

              1. Tell us more about your amazing mind reading abilities, fuckwit.

            1. The USA isn’t founded on !! democratic rule !! – dipsh*t..
              It’s a !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CONSTITUTIONAL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Union of Republican States.

              People like you who have NO CONCEPT of what nation you live in are the reason it’s turning into a Democratic-Nazi-Regime (def; National Socialist). GET EDUCATED on the very basics PLEASE…………………. OR JUST DON’T VOTE OR RUN FOR OFFICE AT ALL……… Sick of these Nazi-Supporters pretending to be ‘officials’ of the USA when they are really a TAKE-OVER of the USA.

            2. please heed Steevie’s advice!

            3. Nah instead you waste a bunch of time and taxpayer money doing shame investigations and impeachments.

          2. Hitler wasn’t elected. Like Trump he ever won the popular vote, but unlike Trump was successful in parlaying his minority into a dictatorship.

            We have a democracy if we can keep it, and tribal BS like Ken is selling could be the end of it.

            1. Hitler wasn’t elected.

              This is ignorant. This is factually incorrect. Hitler was elected and formed a coalition government. He was appointed chancellor when a subsequent government failed to form a coalition in Germany’s multiparty system. Hitler was elected again subsequent to the Reichstag fire. You have no idea what you’re talking about.

              1. His second paragraph is spot on.

                1. We don’t have a democracy at all.

                  We have–or had a republic.

            2. We have a democracy if we can keep it — WRONG YOU F’WHIT!!
              The USA is a Constitutional Union of Republican States.

              Article IV – Section 4
              The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government

        3. Actually Ken, Libertarians are America’s biggest enemy. We are a democracy, which means the government represents the people, yet Libertarians hate the government and therefore they hate the people.

          2 people can play your infantile and self aggrandizing argument but it leads nowhere. You should listen to Nelson and learn something.

          1. Markets are people making choices. Markets allow people to represent themselves. Representative democracy is insufficiently democratic, and that’s why the government should be replaced by markets whenever possible. The reason progressives hate market solutions is because representative democracy allows them to inflict their opinions on the unwilling. This is both the essence of elitism and the essence of progressivism, which is all about using the coercive power of government to force individuals to make sacrifices against their will. Only libertarian capitalism cares enough about the people to give them the freedom to make choices for themselves free from the coercive power of government.

            1. That’s all fine, but can you for once admit that Trump tried to undermine American democracy?

              1. No faggot. But you can admit what Milley did was undermining democracy and what the intelligence agencies were up to sure hell wasn’t legal. What did Butt Fuck Schumer say about the intelligence agencies having six ways from Sunday to get back at you? Stop crying about Trump so much. I’ve never seen a bigger group of “Libertarians” go on and on about a fucking celebrity politician. He’s gone, you can pull the fucking covers down already.

          2. We are a democracy
            WRONG…………………………

          3. your sock-puppetry is obvious

        4. Great, go back in time about 40 years and tell that to your buddies on the left. Once they started living by the “the personal is political” mantra then every policy difference became a personal attack for them.

    2. Right after the article about how the Clinton campaign, in concert with the FBI and CIA, an as yet unnamed Tech Exec, and a university, fabricated the existence of a “secret server” to discredit Trump, and then continued the lie for the next 4 years to delegitmizd the president, based on a complete fabrication.

      Which will come immediately after their article on how the election was “fortified” by using lawfare and unconstitutional changes to election laws, in order to ensure the “correct” outcome.

      1. Didn’t Nick write this article yesterday?

        1. Sort of, Nick had to write a general article about Both sides bad to include any of it, though.

      2. Sarcasm is sometimes hard to detect for sure in print.

        I assume this article about “Trump’s Memo” did not actually come after those?

    3. It is not a coup if your efforts are aimed at ensuring that the properly elected government goes into office.

      1. Um, yes it is, when you have no place in the chain of command, no operational control of the military, and are not part of the nuclear protocols, like both Milley and Pelosi.

        1. Are you really aware that you just implied that if you ARE “part of the nuclear protocols” (M & P are that, how, btw?) conspiring to prevent the President in office from exercising the powers of his office is NOT a coup?

          Seriously?

          If Trump went crazily off the reservation, as Milley seemed to think was likely, it could be a justified coup. But that’s not remotely the same as NOT a coup.

          And it is of course Milley who is the nut.

      2. Actually, seeking the support of the military while actively pushing for someone to usurp the power of a sitting president is an attempt at a coup, and that’s what Nancy Pelosi did.

        She was well within her rights as Speaker of the House to seek the impeachment of the president, but there isn’t anything about being the Speaker of the House that makes it okay to try to have a sitting elected president declared insane, trying to replace him with someone you like better, and seeking the support of the military–and that’s what Nancy Pelosi did.

        Trying to connive with the military to support replacing the elected sitting president is an attempted coup–and that’s what Nancy Pelosi did–and if you supported her attempted coup, that doesn’t mean it wasn’t an attempted coup.

        1. Yeah, this is the sticking point to me. If you felt that the coup was justified, then make that argument- and there may be an argument there, even if I would reject it. But to insist that having the military remove a sitting president isn’t the definition of a coup is pretty absurd.

          1. Molly’s dedication to the constitution is pretty much a one way street.

            1. She wouldn’t be alone in that. There are many Trump apologists around here who would gladly flush the constitution.

              1. You’re supposed to put “!!!11!!” after a flatulent whataboutery like that.

      3. It is if it illegally removes the sitting president from office in order to ensure the properly elected government goes into office.

      4. Well in this case the properly elected government DID get into office. It just wasn’t the electoral outcome you wanted.

    4. When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside: And no Person shall be convicted without the Concurrence of two thirds of the Members present.

      Remember Roots’ cries of ‘Unconstitutional!’ when they impeached Trump despite Roberts’ refusal to participate?

  5. >>which he lost to Joe Biden.

    still out on that.

    1. Apparently you have trouble accepting facts. Even the shitshow Cyber Ninjas made in Arizona confirmed it. As did every other audit of every other state. Just stop.

      1. data analysis relies on proper data entry.

      2. You are apparently imagining audits that didn’t happen.

        Consult a mental professional.

      3. What CRAZY is no-one is actually denying the election wasn’t fraud-ed. State’s used E.O.’s to illegally change the voting process IN multiple States for MORE mail-in ballots. That’s an illegal use of Governors.

        And due to that un-refuted election fraud what gave Biden the win???? ILLEGAL main-in ballots.

        Ya; who apparently cannot accept the facts again???

      4. Even the shitshow Cyber Ninjas made in Arizona confirmed it. As did every other audit of every other state.

        Well, no.

        The preliminary recount, the one done by the audit team prior to the audit showed that Biden ‘won’–eve enlarged his lead a little bit.

        And that’s what the media have latched on to.

        When those votes were audited, however, it was discovered–even after the Democrats who control the election board disallowed signature matching– that over 50 thousand votes could not be verified.

        And that was just in Maricopa county.

        Biden’s margin of victory, even the one expanded by the preliminary recount, was less than 15 thousand votes.

        Biden did not win Arizona.

        In Georgia, where signature verification WAS allowed, the discrepancy was also very obvious.

        Biden did not win Georgia.

        The count was obfuscated and standard verification methods were destroyed or altered illegally in the process the left calls ‘fortification’

  6. So a lawyer wrote a memo that Trump found attractive, politically, and then pressured Pence to act on it, but nothing actually ever came of it except Trump being pissed off and the vote being certified anyway, and now we have a different president?

    How did our democracy even survive this attack?

    1. Because Mike Pence, after standing by and watching (if not actively aiding) Trump’s election bullshit, finally put country over party and stood up for America.

      1. Because we all know those scumbag Republicans can’t be trusted to do the right thing when their party is in power. Both sides!

      2. So the constitutional system of government worked just fine despite Trump?

  7. god look at these comments. You all should be ashamed.

    1. We’re not you, so why we should be ashamed id not as obvious as in your case.

    2. Impeach Joe Biden! and GFY!

  8. Biden has been a disastrous president for the past nine months.

    So of course, the terminal TDS sufferers at Reason continue writing/publishing anti Trump screeds.

    1. You guys didn’t support coup, so you get what you deserve!

    2. SLOPPY PULLOUT!

      1. Informing us about your sick fantasies isn’t really necessary, Buttplug. TMI.

    3. Too bad he whipped Trump, because you’re right. He has been appallingly awful. And he’s ripe for an ass kicking in 2024.

      Instead the right is addicted to the poison that is Trump.

  9. Somehow this article on “Trump’s memo” omits is argument, so here goes the basics: The 12A reads “The Electors shall meet in their respective states, and vote by ballot for President and Vice-President, one of whom, at least, shall not be an inhabitant of the same state with themselves; they shall name in their ballots the person voted for as President and in distinct ballots the person voted for as Vice-President, and they shall make distinct lists of all persons voted for as President, and of all persons voted for as Vice-President, and of the number of votes for each, which lists they shall sign and certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the government of the United States, directed to the President of the Senate;— The President of the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the certificates and the votes shall then be counted;…”

    Eastman’s memo was, as I understand it, about what Pence (as President of the Senate) could do IF he questioned whether the process resulting in the envelopes he was presented with was a legitimate version of that specified. That he had no choice but accept and open any envelopes he was given is non-obvious. If his doubts were merely pretextual then of course it would be illegitimate for him to refuse to proceed, but it’s unclear to me that that is what was advocated. How about providing a quote from him to that effect?

    1. Pence made a statement:

      https://www.npr.org/sections/congress-electoral-college-tally-live-updates/2021/01/06/953995808/pence-says-he-doesnt-have-power-to-reject-electoral-votes

      “It is my considered judgment that my oath to support and defend the Constitution constrains me from claiming unilateral authority to determine which electoral votes should be counted and which should not.”

      Trump was pissed at this, and tweeted: “Mike Pence didn’t have the courage to do what should have been done to protect our Country and our Constitution, giving States a chance to certify a corrected set of facts, not the fraudulent or inaccurate ones which they were asked to previously certify. USA demands the truth!”

      1. That is not what I asked for. Let’s try again and see if you can do better: “If [Pence’s] doubts were merely pretextual then of course it would be illegitimate for him to refuse to proceed, but it’s unclear to me that that is what was advocated. How about providing a quote from [Eastman] to that effect?”

        1. Engage in all the casuistry you wish. I’m done playing along.

          Anyone who still supports Trump after he tried to undermine American democracy is morally bankrupt.

          1. Republicans haven’t had anything to do with morality since 2016.

            1. Brandyshit hasn’t had any acquaintance to adulthood that I’ve ever seen.

            2. To all the candidates who think that Donald Trump is telling the truth, I think you have lost your way. As to the Republican Party, if we do not reject this way of thinking clearly, without any ambiguity, we will have lost our way. We will have lost the moral authority, in my view, to govern this great nation.

              Sen. Lindsey Graham – July 2015

              1. Haha. Nobody but Sean Hannity gives a shit what Ms. Lindsey thinks. Nice try retard.

          2. Without resorting to falsehoods, how did Trump try to “undermine American Democracy”?

          3. Any Republican that supports Trump
            after he threw the Georgia senate races and gave control of the senate to the progressives is just a wimp.

            If it weren’t for Sinema and Manchin we would already have a bunch of ruinous spending on terrible programs shoved up our asses. We’ll still be lucky to dodge it until the midterms.

            1. bevis the lumberjack is a TDS-addled piece of lying shit.
              Fuck off and die; make your family proud, asshole.

  10. What Trump could have done, but didn’t.

    What Biden is doing.

    What Clinton / Obama did.

    Which is more important?

    To reason, apparently the first.

    1. “What Trump could have done, but didn’t.”

      Trump _did_ try to execute the plan. Mike Pence refused to do his bidding.

      1. Yes Trump did. that said it is not illegal for Trump to ask based on so called legal advice. it may have been illegal for Pence to carry out or at least would have gone to court to make a determination of legality and wether it was a criminal act or just a breach of protical which may not be a crime in its self.

        1. When did I say Trump committed a crime?My only claim is he is a complete asshole.

          1. Who happened to be the best POTUS we’ve had in a century, and infantile pieces of shit like you whined that he wasn’t a good father-figure!
            Fuck off and die, asshole.

  11. If we’re talking unconstitutional power grabs I have a long list.

    1. And this one even falls under the ‘mostly unsuccessful’ column. A year after the memo was written and Trump is out of office but, almost a decade later, we’re, all of us, natives, immigrants, and foreign nationals alike, still getting fucked over by DACA.

  12. Given that it’s all projection with the Democrats and every goddamn thing they accuse their opponents of planning is exactly what they themselves are doing, it scares the shit out of me that they claim Trump may have been planning to start a war with China as a means of claiming the right to remain in power indefinitely. Is Sleepy Joe aware of the fact that his handlers are planning to go to war with China some time in mid-2024 simply in order to declare an emergency and cancel the election?

  13. Why is this news, and why is Reason wasting an article on this compared to anything else?

      1. Orange Man really was bad. He tried to overturn the results of an election that he lost.

        1. Mike is really stupid. He makes a public ass of himself daily.

    1. Because news stories about the Eastman memo just broke, like, yesterday.

      What, is there a limit on the number of blog posts that can be put up on the Reason website?

    2. Anything to protect Biden. No matter how bad Biden is they can be counted on to imagine some hypothetical action Trump could have carried out that if looked at in a certain light might be just as bad.

  14. The end of every day is the perfect time to let your imagination run wild and declare yourself to that special someone. A simple goodnight message can bring a smile, but a very passionate and romantic phrase is even better!
    https://bit.ly/2Wmynso

  15. It’s amazing seeing conspiracy theorists turn themselves into pretzels to avoid connecting the dots between Trump’s actions, the legal memo and the rioters chanting “Hang Mike Pence!” and “Bring out Pence!”

    The comment section here used to be somewhat interesting, and now it’s just spam and nutjobs.

    1. You’re all conspiracy theorist nutjobs for not connecting the dots the way I do!

      LOL

      1. I wouldn’t say that. I’d just say the vast majority are either fascist or fucking stupid. Perhaps both but who could say the layout of the Venn diagram on it.

        1. I wouldn’t say that.

          I wouldn’t say it either, but he did. And I wouldn’t call him stupid for doing so, but it was exceedingly self-unaware.

    2. Bubba Jones is full of shit.

  16. Oh look, here come the fascists to defend their attempted overthrow of the government.

    See morons? It wasn’t “his tweets are mean.” And the more you ignore the blatant power grabs and attempts to weaken our institutions you only make more Americans think (correctly) that Republicans are fucking crazy and a threat to our republic.

    1. See, shitfordinner, lefty assholes like you will grab any excuse at all to prove that your raging TDS is nearly fatal, asshole.
      Fuck off and die.

    2. GFY, dumbass.
      — Red Forman

    3. Oh look, here come the fascists to defend their attempted overthrow of the government.

      The thing I love best is that when you people say this you seem completely clueless that you’re the ones doing the defending.

      On January 6th, patriots went to DC to support the sitting president AGAINST the coup that was taking place using the ‘fortified’ election results.

      They did not succeed because they still thought they were playing a game with knowable rules.

      Since then you guys have been endlessly trying to legitimize you coup.

      If it enforces like a coup, oppresses, like a coup, and denies being a coup like a coup, it’s a coup.

  17. Authored by conservative law professor John Eastman, the “Eastman Memo,” as it has been dubbed in the press, argued that Vice President Mike Pence, while presiding over the joint session of Congress on January 6, 2021

    Can I get a quick rundown of every crazy memo handed down by a whitehouse lawyer in history?

    1. Not the point. The big point is Trump acted on the memo, following its advice.

      1. So what’s the crime? Acting on a memo?

        1. Telling the Vice President what to do? Imploring the public to reject a dissident VP? Rejecting the outcome of an election?

          1. Making TDS-addled asshole Mikey MAD!

  18. So when does the house hold the 3rd impeachment vote, legal scholars?

  19. The attempted, but lame, excuses here for Trump’s despicable and treasonous behavior is revolting. With a few exceptions, supposed Libertarians commenting in a magazine called Reason, try to justify Trump’s numerous attempts to corrupt out electoral process because he is too vain and too cowardly to be man and maintain our now 250 years of peaceful transfers of power. He began months before the first votes by softening up his cult followers to the idea he was going to lose – he could read the polls – by claiming it was rigged back then. After the election he made calls to party apparatchiks in an effort to get them to undermine the normal process of certifying the vote and to their disgrace, many GOP “leaders” – actually cult stooges – went along, including most of the GOP House members. Fortunately enough did not on the state level, even after personal calls for our Infant in Chief. For more than month after the elction he refused the normal shaing of information and offices to the incoming election, cranked up his cult followers for a “fight” on Jan 6, tried to get the DOJ involved, and finally, lacked the gonads or respect for our country and government to show up at Biden’s Inauguration. F..k, Hillary showed up for his in 2016, and not being in office, had no obligation to do that.
    This man is a load of infantile and selfish need with no loyalty to any people, principle, or country.

    Let’s see what the House Committee finds out

    1. Impeach Joe Biden!

    2. “The attempted, but lame, excuses here for Trump’s despicable and treasonous behavior is revolting.”

      Not nearly as lame as the comments from fucking TDS-addled lefty assholes. TDS-addled lefty asshole.
      Fuck off and die.

  20. Sum up:
    TDS-addled lefty assholes have found yet another reason to prove themselves TDS-addled lefty assholes.
    Yawn…

  21. The republican special pleaders and bad losers in Arizona came up with more Biden votes and less Trump votes, but are still crying. If the vote was rigged, let’s see some congressman elected in 2020 step down until it’s cleared up. Fat chance. One way investigations with a heads I win, tails you lose formula are a bad joke and hopefully the Republicans in office with principles stick to them. Here’s one:

    “The Republican who is now Maricopa County’s chief election officer, Stephen Richer, published a 38-page broadside last month in which he rebutted fraud claims and excoriated Republican politicians who have remained silent in the face of efforts to undermine the November results.

    “More than any moral code, philosophical agenda, interest group, or even team red vs. team blue, many politicians will simply do whatever it takes to stay in office,” he wrote. “Right now, a lot of Republican politicians have their fingers in the wind and think that conforming to Stop the Steal, or at least staying quiet about it, is necessary for re-election in their ruby red districts or a statewide Republican primary. So that’s what they’ll do.”

    “It’s disgusting,” he added.

    By the way, elsewhere on this board, Ken has been opining on how Progressives – whoever that may be – are the incorrigible enemy of real Americans and our system, while ignoring what his team is trying to do to the vote – you know, an individual right – in the interests of keeping power with a minority of Americans. They have won 2 presidencies with a minority, have kept Senate control – with the filibuster when they didn’t actually have a majority – when they have represented a majority of Americans once since 1996, and now a SC with5 of the justices inserted by loser presidents. In 2020, a majority of GOP House members tried to steal the election for President on the House floor, for a guy who lost by 7 million votes and 4%. That’s a landslide in modern times, and also the 7th time in 8 elections when the Democratic presidential candidate won the popular vote. When you are losing ground in a democracy you make better arguments and run better candidates (anything would be a step up from Trump), but Ken’s party thinks you just cheat.

    1. Fuck off and die, Joe; make your family proud, the world a better place, and it you mark your grave first, a place for your dog to take a shit.

      1. Thank you, my friend “Sevo!” You and all of my other cultists, I mean, supporters, here, are true American patriots, unlike the little coward Mikey Pence, who deserves to be….well, you know, what our fellow patriots were screaming on January 6th. Keep up the good work! More specifically, keep hijacking the term “libertarianism” and Reason magazine.

    2. The republican special pleaders and bad losers in Arizona came up with more Biden votes and less Trump votes, but are still crying.

      You need to read the whole report, not the CNN propaganda version.

      If the vote was rigged, let’s see some congressman elected in 2020 step down until it’s cleared up.

      Huh? What do “congressmen” have to do with any of this?

      In 2020, a majority of GOP House members tried to steal the election for President on the House floor

      Bullshit. What the GOP wanted was an audit.

      for a guy who lost by 7 million votes and 4%. That’s a landslide in modern times, and also the 7th time in 8 elections when the Democratic presidential candidate won the popular vote.

      We don’t elect the president by popular vote, and for good reason.

      The 2020 election was decided by a handful of heavily Democratic locations with questionable election processes.

      But Democrats won and the country will have to live with it. Americans get what they deserve for letting this happen: a senile idiot as president whose policy agenda is set by racists and socialists.

      1. Huh? What do “congressmen” have to do with any of this?

        Uh, they were on the same ballots that the Trump side claims are fraudulent and shouldn’t have been counted. Republicans made gains in the House in 2020. The Democrats managed to steal the election from Trump but neglected to rig the House races?

      2. Bullshit. What the GOP wanted was an audit.

        Then they should have requested a real one done by professionals with a trustworthy track record in election audits. Instead, they chose a company by the fucking name of Cyber Ninjas that had never done that kind of audit before (what kind of audits had they ever done?) and a CEO that had made statements in public about the election being rigged before they were hired. The Arizona GOP didn’t want a real audit, they wanted results that would justify whatever voting law changes they think would help them in the future, and, of course, to please Trump and his base.

      3. We don’t elect the president by popular vote, and for good reason.

        As Joe Friday pointed out, the winner-take-all EC votes that 48 states and D.C. use skews the presidential race toward a handful of swing states. States with lopsided voter registration one way or the other are basically ignored in the general election, and it’s rare (by design) for the nomination to still be undecided by late April, so the last states to hold primaries are rather pointless for that also. Even Maine and Nebraska do their EC votes in a poor way. They don’t have many to begin with, so giving 2 for the statewide total in reflection of the Senate seats isn’t proportionate, and dividing up the rest by House districts just further incentivizes gerrymandering. Going winner take all like this just makes Republicans in deep blue states irrelevant and Democrats in deep red states irrelevant. Voting for a single member of the Senate or for a governor or other statewide office is good and expected. But an office like the President that represents the whole country should need to appeal to every voter in the country, just like a Senator or governor needs to appeal to every voter in their state.

        Those that insist on giving extra weight to smaller population states via the EC formula (2 Senators + # House seats, and 3 for D.C.), should still want to see the EC votes awarded proportionally to the vote total in each. That way, every voter in every state matters.

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  23. I voted for Trump (and might again), but that would have been insane.

  24. First, the election was stolen. Despite the many commenters who can’t grasp facts and run with talking points about the Arizona audit (read the executive summary, you don’t have to rely on MSNBC), a proven pattern is beginning to emerge, and will continue to emerge. It will confirm what we all watched happen IN FRONT OF OUR OWN EYES.

    History will show this election was stolen. Please tell me about the clause in the constitution addressing stolen elections. Hint, there isn’t one. There was no constitution in 1776. The constitution is becoming irrelevant, as large percentages of leaders, judges, and citizens are willing to pervert its structure. A stolen election is outside the structure. In such context, a memo just doesn’t bother me much, sorry my TDS friends.

    Trump was entirely justified and I would have cheered if he refused to step down. As we know, Podesta war gamed this scenario, the thieves knew it might happen, including Milley. Trump STILL did the right thing. His team really should have make those free throws in the first quarter, once the buzzer has gone off and the crowd is screaming, it’s too late even if you are right.

    Given the above truths, Trump failed, Barr failed, Pence failed, and Republican legislators have failed, and the Democrat Marxist machine has made bitches of them all, and America is in peril as Biden has his way wrecking the country.

    Unfortunately for creepy Uncle Joe, stealing elections has consequence. They are afraid, can you feel it, it’s delicious. Remember when Khadafy got stabbed in the ass? It can happen fast.

    1. Please tell me about the clause in the constitution addressing stolen elections. Hint, there isn’t one.

      That’s right. That means that there is no constitutional mechanism to “reinstate” Trump or any of the other fantasies still being floated by his most fervent believers. The Framers didn’t put in a way to deal with a “stolen” election because it was left to the states to figure out how to deal with election disputes for the office of President. Once a state submits the votes of its Electors, that is it. Congress’s job is simply to announce the total at that point. They only have any further role if there isn’t a majority winner. Even the Vote Count Act wasn’t relevant in this election, because there was no dispute over which Electors were certified by each state. The “alternate” electors that claimed to exist were just engaging in theater. No one from their states with any authority put them there.

      Trump was entirely justified and I would have cheered if he refused to step down.

      So you admit that you don’t give a shit about the law or the Constitution, you just want your guy in charge.

      1. To clarify, since I worded it poorly. A statewide office should be determined by a statewide total. If Democrats aren’t numerous enough to elect a governor or Senator (or vice versa), there is no problem with that. Majority rules, after all.

  25. Trump embraced a number of ludicrous legal theories in his attempt to remain in power after losing the election to Biden. Add the Eastman Memo to that sorry list.

    Trump didn’t “embrace ludicrous legal theories to remain in power”, he genuinely believe that election integrity was seriously compromised and that there was large amounts of fraud.

    Courts found significant amounts of violations but refused to act largely on technicalities and because they didn’t want to throw the country into chaos.

    Biden is president and that won’t change.

    What is ridiculous is that “libertarians” still pay lip service to the idea that there was nothing wrong with the 2020 election. You have become nothing but mouth pieces for progressives.

    1. Trump didn’t “embrace ludicrous legal theories to remain in power”, he genuinely believe that election integrity was seriously compromised and that there was large amounts of fraud.

      I don’t care how sincere his belief is. He still needs evidence instead of conspiracy theory and legal arguments that aren’t ludicrous. Since he doesn’t understand the law or the Constitution himself, he shouldn’t be getting advice from such bad lawyers.

      Courts found significant amounts of violations but refused to act largely on technicalities and because they didn’t want to throw the country into chaos.

      What violations? In some of those cases, the Trump lawyers were basically asking the courts to toss out hundreds of thousands of votes based on “violations” that they should have disputed many months sooner, ahead of the election, if they didn’t like them. It’s not a “technicality” to dismiss a case like that.

      Biden is president and that won’t change.

      Tell that to all of the Trump supporters that refuse to accept reality. Mike Lindell is still getting airtime making claims about Trump being “reinstated” and Rep. Gosar is still talking about having a “rematch” by the end of the year.

      What is ridiculous is that “libertarians” still pay lip service to the idea that there was nothing wrong with the 2020 election. You have become nothing but mouth pieces for progressives.

      Facts are not partisan and don’t adhere to any political ideology. And voter confidence in elections shouldn’t depend on those things either. All elected officials should work to secure the confidence of all voters. Instead, you have the default leader of the GOP working to convince his base that elections are rigged against them (him) without doing the hard work of providing evidence that would convince anyone outside of that base. And most of the office holders of that party are either echoing his claims to advance their own careers or remaining silent out of fear of being primaried.

      1. He still needs evidence instead of conspiracy theory and legal arguments that aren’t ludicrous.

        He did. Which is why he won a number of lawsuits.

        In some of those cases, the Trump lawyers were basically asking the courts to toss out hundreds of thousands of votes based on “violations” that they should have disputed many months sooner, ahead of the election, if they didn’t like them. It’s not a “technicality” to dismiss a case like that.

        In many of those cases, the courts had refused to intervene before the election (lack of standing) and then refused to grant relief afterwards (lack of remedy).

        Facts are not partisan and don’t adhere to any political ideology. And voter confidence in elections shouldn’t depend on those things either.

        If you have confidence in US elections, you are a damned idiot. US elections are laughably insecure and run by incompetents, imbeciles, and corrupt partisans. That’s nothing new, that’s been going on for decades. That’s a fact, and it’s non-partisan.

        1. He did. Which is why he won a number of lawsuits.

          What lawsuits did he win? You just got through saying that the courts failed to act. Winning would mean getting a remedy in his favor. Which is it? List cases that I can look up if there were any.

          In many of those cases, the courts had refused to intervene before the election (lack of standing) and then refused to grant relief afterwards (lack of remedy).

          That doesn’t sound like winning to me. It also doesn’t make sense. If a plaintiff didn’t have standing to dispute an election procedure before the election, they wouldn’t have standing to challenge it afterwards either. And standing isn’t just a technicality. There are undoubtedly some ways that it gets abused by government that is trying to get away with things, but it is still an important legal principle more generally.

          If you have confidence in US elections, you are a damned idiot.

          That’s just lazy and insulting. If I don’t agree with you, then I’m an idiot. It’s the argument of someone that knows they don’t have something convincing to say.

          I have confidence in US elections because all of the GOP efforts to find the massive fraud they have been crying about for 20 years have come up empty. If GOP AGs can’t find enough evidence to prosecute more than a handful of people for fraud in any given election cycle out of millions of votes cast, despite having plenty of incentive to look for it, then I am perfectly justified in doubting that it exists.

          US elections are laughably insecure and run by incompetents, imbeciles, and corrupt partisans.

          Corrupt partisans is apparently what Trump fans want running elections now. Just look at the Trump acolytes itching to replace guys like Raffensperger that actually have some integrity.

      2. Tell that to all of the Trump supporters that refuse to accept reality. Mike Lindell is still getting airtime making claims about Trump being “reinstated” and Rep. Gosar is still talking about having a “rematch” by the end of the year.

        Trump is likely going to run again.

        Frankly, at this point, I’m just tired of this crap. You people deserve what you voted for: an authoritarian, corrupt government that runs the country into the ground, destroys the social fabric, and re-institutes racial segregation and government sponsored discrimination. You had the wealthiest and most free nation on the planet and you pissed it all away.

        1. You people deserve what you voted for: an authoritarian, corrupt government that runs the country into the ground, destroys the social fabric, and re-institutes racial segregation and government sponsored discrimination.

          Total projection here. I am tired of Trump fans that won’t see him for what he is. Or they do, and they like it.

          1. Total projection here. I am tired of Trump fans that won’t see him for what he is. Or they do, and they like it.

            You misunderstood. When I said “you people”, I was referring to Americans as a whole, not Democrats.

    2. NOYB2, you live in a dream world and it’s a nightmare.

      Trump doesn’t sincerely believe in anything except saving his own sorry fat as.. He began calling the election rigged 6 months before the 1st vote because he could read the polls too.

      He lost by 7 million votes – as predicted – and has such a puny soul he preferred trying to wreck our electoral system, hindering the incoming administration, and lacked the nuts to show up at Biden’s inauguration in the peaceful transition of power we have enjoyed for 250 years. For more than month after the election he refused the normal sharing of information and offices to the incoming election, cranked up his cult followers for a “fight” on Jan 6, tried to get the DOJ involved, and finally, lacked the gonads or respect for our country and government to show up at Biden’s Inauguration. Hillary showed up for his in 2016, and not being in office, had no obligation to do that.

      He lost 60 out of 62 court cases and many by GOP judges and ones he appointed. Numerous studies have shown virtually zero vote stealing at the polls -an act of dubious advantage with serious fines including thousands of dollars and years in jail “Yeah, I’m going to vote twice so I can decide the next president.”

      WTF is wrong with you?

      1. PS The constitution does not stipulate winner take all EC allocation of electors, a practice which was not in place at first. That practice maximizes the impact of each states vote, but disenfranchises minority voters in each state while causing elections to focus on “battleground states” while ignoring all others.

        Also, look this up, Biden did not do as well as Hillary in Philly, Detroit, Milwaukee, and Atlanta but did much better in bedroom suburbs and small cities/towns and that’s how he won Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, and Georgi. It was not because of some big vote swings in his favor in these large cities – your theory is BS.

        1. PS You lost. Be a man and an American and suck it up and get ready for next time.

          1. I didn’t vote for Trump; I didn’t vote at all. I’m not and have never been a Republican. And as I have pointed out repeatedly, Biden won and that will never be reversed.

            I don’t need to “suck it up”, since I can just leave this country and retire elsewhere.

            You’ll need to “suck it up”: you have a senile, incompetent psychopath running a failing country, even worse than the orange guy before him. You have that because Americans, regardless of party, have become lazy, entitled, complacent, uncompetitive, and ignorant. You have the presidents you deserve and you will suffer the consequences. And don’t expect anybody to shed a tear for you.

            1. I didn’t vote for Trump; I didn’t vote at all.

              Unless you’re just trolling, this is hard to believe. I don’t know how someone that didn’t care enough to vote for or against Trump would spend this kind of time arguing about the election on the internet, let alone take such a strident position for one side.

              1. I’ve been pointing out how ridiculous and insecure US elections are for decades. It’s you who clings to the delusion that in 2016, the election was somehow questionable, but in 2020 it was pristine.

                And the “one side” I’m taking a position for is that of a country with small government, free markets, subsidiarity, and individual liberties.

                If you think that’s somehow partisan, let me disabuse you of that notion: while Democrats explicitly push reprehensible ideologies, Republicans have been happy to go along with it for decades.

                America is f*cked and it won’t recover from this. As an immigrant, I just want you to realize what you people have done to your country and to yourself as you spiral down the drain.

            2. Sorry NYOB2, I didn’t realize you aren’t an American.

              1. I am an immigrant. I immigrated to a country that had some backbone and cared about liberty. Not anymore.

                  1. Huh? I’m gonna hang around a while longer. After all, Democrats are currently still rigging the economy in my favor.

      2. NOYB2, you live in a dream world and it’s a nightmare. Trump doesn’t sincerely believe in anything except saving his own sorry fat as..

        No, you live in a dream world if you think that’s Trump’s motivation.

        1. No, you live in a dream world if you think that’s Trump’s motivation.

          What do you think Trump’s motivation is? If he wasn’t someone that seems to have taken the list of traits of narcissistic personality disorder as a challenge, then maybe I’d believe that he had some other motivation than satisfying his own disturbed emotional needs.

          1. All US presidents are psychopaths and narcissists; meaning, they are all motivated by manipulating how people perceive them.

            Trump’s narcissism expressed itself in him trying to portray himself as a standards bearer for free markets, conservative values, and individual liberties.

            Biden’s narcissism expresses itself in him trying to be the perfect progressive, handing power to younger generations, building a better society, helping the needy, and wrapping himself in a veneer of empathy.

            One of these is less harmful than the other.

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