Election 2020

As Trump's Fraud Allegations Founder, More Republican Lawmakers Are Acknowledging His Defeat

At least nine GOP senators are publicly urging the president to concede or questioning his claim that he actually won.


The Trump campaign's post-election lawsuits have been almost uniformly unsuccessful, key states are moving ahead with certification of their results, and the General Services Administration has finally recognized Joe Biden as the probable president-elect. Although Donald Trump still insists he is not conceding, a growing number of Republican lawmakers are urging him to do so, or at least acknowledging that his wild fraud claims have not panned out. Joining a small group of GOP legislators who promptly recognized Biden's victory, several senators and representatives who initially took a wait-and-see approach recently said we have waited long enough.

Sen. Mitt Romney (R–Utah), a Trump critic who supported impeachment and said he did not vote for the president, congratulated Biden on his victory more than two weeks ago, after major news outlets projected him as the winner. Sen. Lisa Murkowski (R–Alaska) likewise acknowledged Biden's victory on November 7, as did Reps. Don Young (R–Alaska), Adam Kinzinger (R–Ill.), John Shimkus (R–Ill.), Paul Mitchell (R–Mich.), Tom Reed (R–N.Y.), Will Hurd (R–Texas), and Denver Riggleman (R–Va.).

Rep. Francis Rooney (R–Fla.), who congratulated Biden the following day, wrote a November 15 op-ed piece for The Hill headlined "Time to Concede." Rep. Don Bacon (R–Neb.) admitted on November 8 that "the handwriting is on the wall that Joe Biden has been elected as the next President." Sen. Susan Collins (R–Maine) congratulated Biden on November 9, and Rep. John Curtis (R–Utah) recognized him as the president-elect the same day.

Rep. Jim Durkin (R–Ill.) chimed in last week. "The election is over," he told the Chicago Sun-Times on November 19. "Begin the transition process."

Last Thursday, Sen. Ben Sasse (R–Neb.) cast doubt on Trump's attempts to reverse the outcome of the election. "What matters most at this stage is not the latest press conference or tweet, but what the president's lawyers are actually saying in court," he told The Washington Post. "When Trump campaign lawyers have stood before courts under oath, they have repeatedly refused to actually allege grand fraud—because there are legal consequences for lying to judges."

Sen. Marco Rubio (R–Fla.) likewise has been skeptical of Trump's election fraud charges. "Taking days to count legally cast votes is NOT fraud," he tweeted on November 4, although he added that "court challenges to votes cast after the legal voting deadline is NOT suppression." Last week Rubio casually referred to Biden as the "president-elect."

Rep. Liz Cheney (R–Wyo.), who chairs the House Republican Conference, initially said "it's the responsibility of the courts" to address election fraud claims. But by last Friday, she was losing patience. "The President and his lawyers have made claims of criminality and widespread fraud, which they allege could impact election results," she said. "If they have genuine evidence of this, they are obligated to present it immediately in court and to the American people."

On Saturday, after a federal judge scathingly rejected the Trump campaign's attempt to block certification of Pennsylvania's vote, Sen. Pat Toomey (R–Pa.), who had earlier noted that "the president's allegations of large-scale fraud and theft of the election are just not substantiated," said it was time for Trump to accept reality. "President Trump has exhausted all plausible legal options to challenge the result of the presidential race in Pennsylvania," Toomey said in a press release, noting that Saturday's ruling followed legal defeats for the Trump campaign in other states. "These developments, together with the outcomes in the rest of the nation, confirm that Joe Biden won the 2020 election and will become the 46th President of the United States….President Trump should accept the outcome of the election and facilitate the presidential transition process."

Sen. Lamar Alexander (R–Tenn.) took the same step yesterday. "The presidential election is rapidly coming to a formal end," he said. "Recounts are being completed. Courts are resolving disputes. Most states will certify their votes by December 8. Since it seems apparent that Joe Biden will be the president-elect, my hope is that President Trump will take pride in his considerable accomplishments, put the country first and have a prompt and orderly transition to help the new administration succeed. When you are in public life, people remember the last thing you do."

Yesterday Sen. Bill Cassidy (R–La.) also acknowledged Biden's victory. "With Michigan's certifying it's [sic] results, Joe Biden has over 270 electoral college votes," he tweeted. "President Trump's legal team has not presented evidence of the massive fraud which would have had to be present to overturn the election. I voted for President Trump but Joe Biden won. The transition should begin for the sake of the country."

Sen. Shelley Moore Capito (R–W.Va.) issued a similar statement yesterday. "I have been clear that President Trump—like any candidate for office—has the right to request recounts and to raise legal claims before our courts," she said. "However, at some point, the 2020 election must end. The window for legal challenges and recounts is rapidly closing as states certify their results in the coming days. If states certify the results as they currently stand, Vice President Joe Biden will be our next president and Senator Kamala Harris will be our next vice president. I will respect the certified results and will congratulate our nation's new leaders, regardless of the policy differences I might have with them."

By USA Today's count, "about a fifth of the Republican Senate has explicitly acknowledged Biden's victory." The paper notes that "some GOP senators, including Sens. John Cornyn, Ted Cruz and James Lankford, have called on Biden to receive intelligence briefings but have declined to call him president-elect."

One of the Senate holdouts is Trump critic-turned-toady Lindsey Graham (R–S.C.), whom Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger, a fellow Republican, recently accused of suggesting that he should find a way to disqualify Biden-favoring absentee ballots in that state. Graham said that was a misunderstanding. But he has not been shy about reinforcing Trump's claims of consequential election fraud. "If Republicans don't challenge and change the U.S. election system, there will never be another Republican president elected again," he said on Fox News two weeks ago.

"I think the election is not over until the votes are counted and the legal challenges are decided," Graham told reporters around the same time. "That's why I would encourage the president not to concede."

NEXT: Joe Biden's Secretary of State Pick Has Been an Avid Backer of American Military Intervention

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  1. It’s nice to see Republicans value evidence and act like adults. I’m hoping Democratic lawmakers will do the same and acknowledge Hillary’s 2016 defeat.

    1. Hillary’s defeat was a fluke in the matrix. The neoliberal agenda of open borders, free trade, high taxes, regulated healthcare and education will continue. Naturally, foreign policy will be aggressive in its promotion of American style democracy. Next stop Tehran!

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      1. Lol. Free trade used to be a Republican policy goal until Trump decided it was not.

        P.S. Everyone should love free trade.

        1. Not God’s AONN Prohibitionists. Try to buy a can of Birney’s Catarrh Cure and see how “free” is their trade policy.

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        2. “Free trade” with China is NOT free trade.

    2. They acknowledged it the night of the election when Hillary Clinton conceded.

      Both-sides gets increasingly flimsy an excuse for your poor behavior when you also have to make shit up even to get there.

      1. Hillary conceded the next day, then wrote a book.

        If only Trump had acted as “classy” as Hillary did.

        1. Then the entire Washington establishment claimed that dank memes on Facebook that cost Russian operatives around $100k caused America’s democracy to be “hacked”. Meanwhile, Mike Bloomberg spent a billion dollars on his own campaign and won American Samoa.

          1. The only evidence we need that the Russian memes worked is the fact that so many Trump supporters keep repeating them.

            1. Anna Semenovich can “hack” my erection any day!

              1. just hope you didnt confuse her with Lorena Bobbitt

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            2. Yeah, those Russian trolls are so brilliant that no one else could possibly have come up with any of it.

            3. I didn’t know that Jerry Nadler, Adam Schiff, and Nancy Pelosi were Trump supporters. Kinda a covert support thing I guess. Meanwhile, we’re still waiting for Schiff’s “plenty of evidence” to come out and Pelosi is still thinking about impeachment again.

              1. At least they all got new pens from Nance….

            4. I don’t think I’ve actually seen the meme in 4 yrs. The meta-meme, or just the fact that the memes existed, was repeated for 3+yrs. of the administration.

              If the Russians invented a meme that evolves and infects across the political aisleway and terminates conscious thought in even 0.06% of the people it infects, we should’ve locked down Twitter and moved to cut all economic ties with the Russians during the Obama administration. Even then, we were probably still right and truly fucked.

              At this point, I suppose the best Biden could do would be to advise people to avoid Twitter. Being the sage that he is, he’ll probably do it right away. Still, I predict 2.2M dead. Once again Trump throws the American public under the bus by refusing to listen to the science on viral Twitter meme memes.

              1. I suppose the best Biden could do would be to advise people to avoid Twitter fall asleep with his face in his pudding.


                1. Like Ahnilt “Just Say Nein” it it ain’t anabolic?

            5. See? This is why democrats suck at thinking, too.

        2. 4 years of her blaming Russians is classy? Go find a globalist forum. God fucking damn.

          1. I think he meant classy relative to Trump. Not a high bar.

            1. Being an annoying twat doesn’t make you an authority on being classy Dee.

      2. She didn’t concede election night dimwit.

        1. Dwell on trivia. It’s all you’ve got to cling to.

          1. Dwell on being an annoying twat. Seriously, you’re actually really good at it.

        2. Clinton called and conceded in the early morning hours immediately following the election.


      3. “”They acknowledged it the night of the election when Hillary Clinton conceded.””

        By acknowledged, do you mean started the #notmypresident hashtag?

    3. Except that all the secretaries of state are denying any collection of evidence. It is sad that the GOP won’t even turn this into a referendum on voter integrity. That is the saddest part. And Reason also doesn’t give a ahit about election integrity. If any election could be used to secure and audit an election, it is this one. Pa won’t even allow a statistical audit of ballots to see if there were any systemic issues to be corrected. All this will do is continue to encourage election irregularities in the future. Every mistake was a whoopsie (even though the vast majority were one way). Like the media, faith in elections is near all time lows. And nobody, including Reason, could give a fuck. That’s how banana republics start.

      1. Dems are still defensive about fraud so long as there are lawsuits in progress. However, as of next year that will all go back to giggling about voting the cemeteries again. At least for a year or so.

      2. Jesse is correct. After voting for Democrats and Republicans in virtually every election since 1976, I no longer trust PA’s election system or the partisan Democrats who drastically changed it this year (by using covid as an excuse), who are the same Dems who defended Gov Wolf’s disastrous business lockdown and his nursing home policy that caused thousands of deaths.

        On another issue, Rand Paul is urging Libertarians in Georgia to vote Republican.

      3. “Every mistake was a whoopsie”

        Trump’s election was a big whoopsie! As far as irregularities go, they happen every two years and nobody gave as much of a fuck as they did recently because the bad guy won and the orher bad guy, or woman, lost. Maybe if Trump supporters weren’t so emotionally attached to his left titty we could all move on to the next presidential disaster!

      4. WTF would “a statistical audit of ballots” be? “Brenfords Law”, arguments that the voting is different this time than it was in 2016, based on the unfounded assumption that there must be consistency from one election to another.

      5. Like they don’t give a flying fuck about non-interventionist war.

        They barely praised Trump for it and hardly concerned he’s gone.

        And yeh, about the integrity.

        This was a sham of shams. But Reason wants to act like naive children on this one.

        The stuff I’ve read are hardly ‘crazy conspiracy’ stuff. It’s just not getting traction because the media is in on the scam.

        As are some judges.

        The ‘system’ wanted Trump out. He was a poison pill.

        Now Reason is going to whine about wars again.

        1. “The stuff I’ve read are hardly ‘crazy conspiracy” stuff.”

          Have you read this?


          “Powell then spun a tale involving deceased Venezuelan strongman Hugo Chavez; billionaire Democrat George Soros; Lord Malloch-Brown, whom she described as “Mr. Soros’ number two person in the U.K.”; the Clinton Foundation; “the massive influence of communist money through Venezuela, Cuba, and likely China in the interference with our elections”; and election software designed to facilitate cheating via “an algorithm that probably ran all over the country to take a certain percentage of votes from President Trump and flip them to President Biden.”

          1. Hey, WK! Did you hear about how the D’s spun a tale about Trump getting peed-on by a russki hooker and turned that fake news into a 4-year ‘investigation’ of Trump?
            Of course you didn’t! As a fucking victim of TDS, why, that was just ducky! If Trump is being investigated, assholes like you are THRILLED!
            Fuck off and die, you pathetic excuse for humanity.

            1. Yeah but they did it with class and civility, so he doesn’t care. He also doesn’t care because he’s a lefty partisan.

      6. Amen. We are officially a banana republic. Fake voting, censored media, the federal government alphabet agencies all ignoring the well-funded and organized rioting, looting, and anarchy even though they know exactly who paid for it, and best of all we have a senile puppet owned by China as head of the free world. Throw in mass shootings in Chicago and NYC, and tent cities filled with addicts in San Fran and LA, and WELCOME TO SOROSLAND. He won. America lost. And the media is silent.

        1. Spot-on comment!

    4. “It’s nice to see Republicans value evidence and act like adults. I’m hoping Democratic lawmakers will do the same and acknowledge Hillary’s 2016 defeat.”

      That would be nice, and Obama should obviously have left office and turned it over to Trump by late November.
      If not, he was obviously planning a coup, right?

      1. “That would be nice, and Obama should obviously have left office and turned it over to Trump by late November.
        If not, he was obviously planning a coup, right?”

        Except that’s not what people of intelligence are actually claiming right now.

        Buzz off, insignificant fly.

        1. Hey, shitstain!

          “Donald Trump Reportedly Could ‘Barricade’ Himself in Oval Office, Refuse to Leave If Joe Biden Wins”

          Fuck off and die.

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    6. The election was a fraud from start to finish. The Democrats filed 325 lawsuits changing election laws across the country to make it easier to send in any old ballot. Zuckerberg spent $450 million on “voter turnout,” but only in blue districts. Google created algorithms to encourage voting to Democrats while actively promoting anti-Trump stories and suppressing anything negative about Biden. George Soros owns Dominion Voting Systems through his ownership of Staples Street Capital, which is a spinoff of Soros’s Carlyle Group. Dominion is based in Canada and keeps its servers in Germany and Serbia. That is where our votes were supposedly counted. Dominion Voting Systems exec Eric Coomer has been videotaped showing how votes can easily be changed and manipulated with backdoor software. Coomer made a last minute change to the touchscreens used in Georgia and Coomer HATES Trump. His social media (now deleted just like his LinkedIn) was supposedly filled with anti-Trump screeds, and he is reported to have said on a call, “Trump will NOT win…I made fucking sure of that.” So. Where is the commentary on any of this? Is this where Big Brother and the MSM start calling anyone who points this out “conspiracy theorists”? South American newspapers are now pondering, “When did the USA become a banana republic?” I guess the answer is now. Because if we allow a Soros-owned company with ties to Clinton to count our votes and we accept that ANYTHING mailed in (no postage required!) is a legal ballot, then the election will ALWAYS GO TO THOSE WHO CHEAT. That is the end of what we stand for, it is the end of everyday Americans having a say in their government, and it is the beginning of the elites controlling everything we read, see, hear, and think. Trump may be a boorish clod. But Joe Biden is a racist, senile, angry, 47 year political hack who lies every time he opens his mouth. This election was stolen by Big Tech and George Soros, and if we don’t talk about that, no one should ever bother voting again because it will just be Fascists (ironically the party of Antifa could not be more fascist right down to their Lincoln Project brown shirts). Personally, I think whether you are a Republican or a Democrat, you should want answers as to why the media didn’t cover Hunter Biden’s payola, has never covered Hillary Clinton’s $2 billion fake payola charity amassed while secretary of state, and why they are now actually censoring people who point out the very straight line between George Soros (who hates us) and Dominion Voting. I guess Bob Woodward is too busy getting some ill-conceived Trump quotes about Covid to look under this hood. Meanwhile, 95% of all media coverage of Trump was negative. I can’t think of one time I saw a positive story in four years. And that despite some remarkable accomplishments considering how hard it is to effect change in the swamp. Our CIA and FBI know exactly who funded the summer of riots that destroyed countless small businesses and guess what? They don’t care because they too hate Trump. History is watching this. And it will not end well.

      1. Spot-on comment.

      2. Sounds like sore loser syndrome to me. Take a break. 2024 is not that far off. But until then, just remember. Trump’s a loser.

  2. Founder ? Looks like you guys might need an edit button too. Or, you know, an editor.

    1. Or maybe I just don’t know words, who knows.

      1. Founder is acceptable in this case. They still need an editor.

    2. Awkward sentence either way.

    3. I guess the only flounder Sullum knows is a marine flatfish.

    4. he’s still in that Word-a-Day calendar

    5. It’s not that unusual of a usage, is it? Fits better than “flounder”.

    6. Trump´s lawsuits are foundering upon the shoals of simple arithmetic.

      1. As are the TDS’ victims claims that Trump planned some sort of coup.

      2. Yep. “How many fingers, Winston?”
        “And what if the Army of Ghawd says five?”

    1. Apple sauce will be federally subsidized and Lolita sniffing will be legalized?

      1. No child left behind takes on a new dimension in Great-Uncle Nuzzles administration.

        1. At least he’s not eyeing his own daughter as someone he might date.

          1. “At least he’s not eyeing his own daughter as someone he might date.”

            Got a cite for your bullshit, bullshitter?
            Fuck off and die.

              1. You’ve got to be kidding….
                Or as a TDS victim, simply abysmally stupid.

            1. Yeah, a guy boasting about his daughters beauty is exactly the same thing as Uncle Fondle feeling up kids on camera.

    2. Only diff is that fascists will be forced to pay for other people’s race suicide. They could have accepted the 1972 libertarian plank: We further support the repeal of all laws restricting voluntary birth control or voluntary termination of pregnancies during their first hundred days. (This formed the basis for Roe v. Wade 45 days after the electoral college voted) But noooo. You had send severely retarded snipers, venereal vandals, faith-addled arsonists and bestiality-practicing bullies to threaten people’s lives. That is a special kind of stupid you will revel in for… maybe 20 more years? “Pro-life” dry killer eugenicists did it in 1932.

  3. It’s quiet around here.

    Too quiet.

    1. Well, it is a Tuesday.

      1. Tuesday before thanksgiving and everyone is making a run for relatives before more cities start shutting down the borders like NY is doing

        1. More Likely: Tuesday before thanksgiving and everyone is making a run for booze so they can deal with their relatives before more cities states start shutting down the borders liquor stores like NY PA is doing.

          1. I’m no coinisseur, but I believe liquor helps people deal with both problems. Crazy Uncles who sniff little kids and hate the Jews as well as their eccentric family members.

      2. Congrats Lying Jeffy, you figured out a way to tell the truth about something! See you tomorrow, when hopefully you’ll point out it’s Wednesday.

    2. I want Governor Gretchen Whitmer to stomp on the Constitution, violate my civil liberties, and call me a “faggot” when she milks my prostate. Hurt me bad Mommy Government!

  4. He can’t concede yet. He isn’t done taking advantage of the crisis that he created in order to pay off his campaign debts.

    1. He isn’t done taking advantage of the crisis that he created

      Not letting a crises go to waste? He must have switched has party affiliation back to D.

    2. Yep, you’re not a lefty shit lol. Hillary was paying campaign debt for years and you never batted an eye. Same with gore. Weird.

      1. She was paying campaign debt, but also taking a personal campaign salary until about a year ago when the Party told her they weren’t doing her again. This is the advantage of “suspending a campaign” instead of terminating it. You can be “running for office” and thus take a cut until it’s obvious that you’re never going to hold office ever again. Also how Rick Santorum paid the bills for about 8 years of milking a single Senate term.

      2. You know that chemjeff didn’t bat an eye about it, how?

        1. Having a bad bout of Tourette’s, I see.

          1. Naah, just we can all hope is a fatal case of TDS. A case causing a long and painful death; WK deserves at least that.

    3. “He can’t concede yet. He isn’t done taking advantage of the crisis that he created in order to pay off his campaign debts.”

      Got a cite for your bullshit, bullshitter?

  5. He deigned to permit a transition to the next presidency in the middle of a global crisis as long as he could keep peddling his insane whiny conspiracy bullshit. This is some people’s idea of an alpha male.

    1. Prefer a fictitious claim of collusion? Trump was never given an actual transition.

      1. Yes he was. Where do you get this crap?

        1. He was SPIED on. Can you try fucking an intelligent person so something smart can come out of you at some point in your life?

          1. Hey… he was spied on “for his protection” according to Comey.

        2. They denied him all the IC information given during his transition idiot. Read any of the books like Comey’s.

        3. “Yes he was.”
          Cite missing, lefty shit.

    2. “some people’s idea of an alpha male”

      Not Tony’s. Tony figures if he’s not raising welts with his birching stick, he doesn’t deserve to be called ‘daddy’.

    3. “He deigned to permit a transition to the next presidency in the middle of a global crisis as long as he could keep peddling his insane whiny conspiracy bullshit. This is some people’s idea of an alpha male.”

      And lefty shits like you post lies like this here and hope someone other than a lefty shit will buy your lies?
      Fuck off and die, lefty shit.

  6. Admitting that the deep state won’t let republicans investigate clearly unusual voting counts. No on is ready to go to war over what may have been a fluke or actual fraud

    1. Maybe Trump should go to court regarding these clearly unusual voting counts.

      1. …with courts unwilling to perform the only possible remedy, why?

        We have an illegitimate moron as President come 1/20.

        1. Then why aren’t you mad at Trump for his failure to prove it in court?

          Whatever happens, you will have to acknowledge that Trump brought every flimsy speck of conspiracy horseshit he could legally admit to court.

          To carry on with this lie, you will have to implicate the judicial system in the conspiracy, if not Trump himself. At what point do you stop? Ever? Do you think you are entitled to believe whatever you wish regardless of evidence?

          1. “his failure to prove it in court”

            Oh, there’s been an adjudication?

            1. Several

            2. Dismissals, whether on evidentiary failure or for failure to state a claim upon which relief can be granted, are adjudications.

            3. 1-31.

              At least he didn’t get shut out. Still though, pretty fucking strong evidence, 31 times over, that Trump has no evidence of fraud.

          2. >>prove it in court?

            because all the courts are closed until February.

          3. Most courts haven’t even allowed anything beyond a hearing. Why are some of you so God damn ignorant? There has been zero discovery. The SoS have refused to audit ballots or hand over internal data so a challenge can be mounted. Are you all really that ignorant? This was always going to the USSC.

            If any of you weren’t partisan you’d be welcoming standard election audits used in other countries instead of denying any and all investigations. But none of you are honest.

            1. If you wrote that while standing in front of a mirror, it would explode.

              1. Was that supposed to be funny? I guess you should just stick to being a squawking bird and leave the humor to the rest of us. I mean, JFC, sarcasmic thinks that joke was lame.

            2. Jesse you know how it works even in basic civil cases.

              I am not a lawyer but have been involved in a few legal cases. The plaintiff has to bring enough evidence to bring the case. That has not happened here. Allegations are not the same thing.

              We have some legal beagles here who could explain it better. Not my field.

              There is no way from just observation that Trump won the election.

              I voted for Jo Jorgensen.

          4. To be accurate, the conspiracy bullshit was saved for press conferences. The claims made to actual courts were much watered down from the crazy shit spouted in the pressers.

          5. He did prove it in court but the judge flat out said the lie was so big that there was nothing he could do about it.

        2. We get it, mike. It’s always someone else’s fault. It’s never Trump’s fault. It’s the Democrats’ fault, or it’s Obama’s fault, or it’s the Deep State’s fault, or it’s the foreigners’ fault, or it’s the judges’ fault. It’s never Trump’s fault for doing a shit job.

          1. How high will the Biden death clock go until a mandatory two month lockdown is enacted? It is worth it to save just one life!

          2. It’s definitely the media and the Democrats fault, absolutely. No question.
            You, Tony and Sullum lying your asses off here, can even be a small part of the problem too.

            1. The media, the Democrats, and the socialism-loving Canadians.

          3. Nah. PA decided that being transparent on vote counting is not necessary. Grand. I’ll just suggest people don’t go to the ballot box to resolve issues.

            1. You and Nardz should get a room.

            2. The case brought before Pennsylvania was framed as an equal protection matter.

          4. Says the obese person asking others to change their lives to protect him.

          5. Umm, yes? Virtually all of the world’s problems are caused by government. Most governments are dominated by statists and socialists.

        3. The only possible remedy? As the judge explained in the “Frankenstein’s monster” case, the remedy would have been two count the two votes of the two people who claimed they were treated unequally. Yet the Trump campaign wanted to throw out millions of votes because it hadn’t occurred to them to simply ask for them he two votes to be counted.

      2. He has dumbass. What so you think those affidavits and lawsuits are?

        1. Huh. And how has that worked out so far.

          1. 1-31

    2. “When Trump campaign lawyers have stood before courts under oath, they have repeatedly refused to actually allege grand fraud—because there are legal consequences for lying to judges.”

      1. What’s the difference between fraud and grand fraud?

      2. Unless of course you actually pay someone to produce false evidence to use against an incoming Republican president and submit it to a court to get a wiretap. No legal consequences there.

        1. Well Kevin Clinesmith will be facing some sort of legal consequences. But our resident lefties don’t really care about that , since Orange Man Bad.

    3. So now the “Deep State” isn’t just a Federal thing. It extends to all the state governments, too.

    4. Bwaaaah! Hah hah hah! Walgreens has Dr Trump Salve on special. Reason could mail a bunch out to God’ Own Prohibitionist infiltrators and libertarian-importuners as kind of an offering of pity.

  7. If this entire episode gets Republicans thinking about maybe reforming our ridiculous and antiquated voting systems in this country, then that would be I suppose a silver lining to all the conspiracy nonsense that Trump is throwing in the air.

    1. What is the libertarian perspective on democracy? Is greater participation a better justification of high taxes and heavy regulation since the elected representatives truly represent the general will of the public?

      1. In general, libertarians see democracy and liberty as two different political ideas. Pure democracy without limits and individual rights is dangerous.

        1. We know the difference between National Socialism, International Socialism and freedom, and choose the latter. You looters can’t even grasp the third possibility.

    2. You and Sullum really are fighting super hard on this.

    3. God youre such a lying fuck. You have never called for any investigation into this election so fuck off. You’ve dismissed any statistical anomaly.

      1. Well, Jesse, I don’t think “this election” (which one? there are actually 51 separate elections) should be investigated based on hearsay, conspiracies, or inappropriately applied statistical laws found after about 5 minutes of googling. Do not just give statistical trends – after all they don’t really prove anything, they only suggest a hypothesis at most – give some actual, documented, clear evidence of actual fraud that is so grave and so vast that it requires immediate judicial relief and overturning of an election. Trump’s team was supposed to be doing this, I thought, but instead he brought in his usual clown show of very loyal grifters and morons to be in charge of his legal team, so we know how that story is going to end.

        I would hope that this episode might get some more people to question the status quo of how elections are conducted *generally*, and perhaps decide on some structural reforms that would make elections better run. Maybe now when local boards of election go asking for some more resources to upgrade their technology or for better training or better staffing, they might get a more receptive response.

        But if this is going to happen, then you all had better knock it off with the conspiracy bullshit, otherwise, the entire thought of “election reform” will be associated with this conspiracy bullshit instead and will be laughed out of polite society. You need to grow up and stop acting like a child and do what you can to transform this experience into something positive.

        1. However, you reserve the right to define “fraud”, correct? Why am I suddenly reminded of Obama claiming there hasn’t been a single scandal in his entire 8 years in office? Even die-hard Democrat pundits were face-palming themselves on that one.

          1. The conversation was about elections, and you go off on a tangent of whether there was any fraud in the Obama administration.

    4. There is no reason in the current times we cant figure out a better way for everyone to vote.

      I do appreciate that each state gets to make their own set of rules to suit them. But everything can certainly be updated, and should

      Most importantly, not only did Trump, who said he was cheated LAST time, not even try to put forward anything to help reform the system that cheated him LAST time (it didnt), the R’s blocked literally every attempt to think about or reform anything regarding elections, every chance they got.

      Of course they did this because they know that A) The current system is the ONLY way trump could possibly get elected, and even when going against an opponent that was almost universally hated, he still won with a Happy-Gilmoresque trick shot; B) there was no actual fraud that caused trump to lose last time, and C) it is the last hope of them ever getting power again.

      They made their bed, now they can shit in it.

    5. All republicans do is think of ways to bully girls and kneel in front of Billy Graham. Any minute now they’ll put up whining ads asking electors to vote in Boss Trump for Gott-Mit-Uns Fuehrer and Comstock Law enforcer. Without schadenfreude it’d be too pitiful to watch. Bwaaaaah hah hah!

  8. lol fake news.

  9. Have ANY Democrats come out against Russian collusion YET?

    I mean, since Reason is so keen on this and all…

    1. The sins of the Democrats do not excuse the sins of the Republicans.

      1. If only one sin is ever discussed, yeah, it kinda does.

      2. “”The sins of the Democrats””

        Democrats do not admit their sins.

  10. Whatta joke. Nine. Nine! Three weeks after a clear election. Nine.

    And Trump will never ever concede. Because he’s a child, supported by all the children who comment here. It’s not a matter of principle to him, it’s a matter of infantilism. So it attracts infantile.

    Cue the the infantile!

    1. >>Cue the the infantile!

      dude you’re killing it all by yourself.

      1. Infant #1 checks in!

        1. That was his point. You’re infant #1, sparkles.

          1. Infant #2!

            1. There’s two of you using this handle? Explains a lot.

            2. “Infant #2!”

              From lefty jackass #1.

  11. What are the legal consequences of Trump conceding? I’ve read through the Constitution and don’t see anything about it, but I’m not about to try reading through the CFR to find a mention of it. Is there any mention of presidential concessions in the federal code? As far as I know, once the states certify their votes and the Electoral College meets and casts their votes, Biden’s the President-Elect regardless of what Trump thinks, so why the demand that he concede? What difference does it make?

    1. Remember how Twitter kept demanding the NY post take down its tweet? That. Subservience is the goal. And Reason happily claps along.

    2. It makes no legal difference, but not conceding is just poor sportsmanship. Not just in himself, but in his supporters. It’s further degrading what’s left of civility in this country.

      Once upon a time, but still well withing our lifetime, conservatives said “character matters”. Now that conservatives have been replaced with populists, character no longer matters. Tantrums are praised, and full diapers held as the epitome of politics.

      1. We felt character mattered. The Left said it did not. So we’re now playing their game.

        Now we intend to resist mightily. And should Biden or Kamala suffer any unfortunate circumstances, we will probably laugh and piss on them.

        1. So you are letting your opponents define your moral standards for you. Brilliant.

          1. The right does not have any moral standards, so they need to look to others for them.

        2. If you truly believed character matters you would never use the “we are playing their game” b.s. excuse.

          1. Yeah! Next he’ll try to say that stealing people’s handles to teach lessons on civility isn’t good manners, oh wait…

        3. Now we intend to resist mightily.

          Oh fuck watch out guys, they’re beginning to intend!

          we will probably laugh and piss on them.

          Makes sense, given you were praying for another 9/11 the other day just so more D voters could die.

      2. “Once upon a time, but still well withing [sic] our lifetime, conservatives said “character matters”. Now that conservatives have been replaced” blah blah

        It’s a frequent theme of progressive concern trolls to mourn the passing of the previous generation of good conservatives. But the thing is when these conservatives now hailed as “good” were still alive and in a position to influence events, progs were calling them corporate shills, fascists, etc.

        Whoever replaces Trump will be met with concern-trolling about how conservatism used to be so much better under Trump.

      3. “”It’s further degrading what’s left of civility in this country.””

        It’s what happens when you promote no civility until dems are elected.

        There was little civility in the way the Hillary fans handled her defeat.

  12. So Lindsey Graham wants to change the US election system. To what? Ranked voting? Inquiring minds want to know. Because the current election system has been in place for two centuries.

    And any change requires a Constitutional Amendment. I would love it if states had to split their electors according to the actual votes, but that would require an amendment. Because the current Constitution says states get to decide how they select electors. It’s the law.

    1. Lindsey Graham (R–S.C.), whom Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger, a fellow Republican, recently accused of suggesting that he should find a way to disqualify Biden-favoring absentee ballots in that state.

      Are you just pushing a narrative? Graham was asking about signature matching. Across the states rejection rates are normally 3% this election they were under half a percent. What changed? The software in Nevada was set to a threshold for signature matching to less than recommendation.

      Why does your side lie so much?

      1. Graham was asking about signature matching.

        Sure, he was “just asking questions”.

        “What I heard was basically discussions about absentee ballots, and if a – potentially – if there was a percentage of signatures that weren’t really, truly matching, is there some point when you get to where you can say, if somebody went to the courtroom, could say, ‘Let’s throw out all these ballots because we have no way of knowing because the ballots are separate.’ And that was part partially what was going on,” Sterling said. “I could see how Sen. Graham viewed it one way and Secretary Raffensperger viewed it one way. But, you know, our job in this state has to follow the law and follow the process as we continue to do. There’s no physical ability for this office to do anything along those lines.”


        1. You’re kinda making Jesse’s point. You know that right?

          1. Lying Jeffy is best known for being a dishonest piece of shit, but he’s also known for being dumb as a box of rocks.

        2. There’s a simple solution to this. In-person voting at the polls and everyone pre-registers and shows a valid government issued ID matching the registration name and address information. Registration must happen no later than 30 days before an election, and again requires a valid ID. Registrations go inactive if not used in the last 6 years. Military, physical incapacity excepted. Votes not received after midnight on election day are not counted. Problem solved and questions of fraud are all but eliminated.

          Any “but what-abouts” are red-herrings as they apply to people of all political and ideological persuasions.

          I’d add making it illegal to call/email/text anyone for political purposes and capping campaign spending at all federal levels of government, but that’s really just an add-on after my own heart.

          1. Stop trying to disenfranchise people you fucking fascists.

            1. Requiring ID is not disenfranchising, you fucking moron.

              1. We need a large tin of Dr Trump butthurt salve for plastic toy GI Joe here on aisle seven. That’s in front of the Fire Sale basket with the 40,000 maga caps and surplus Bully dem Bitches posters.

            2. For once, Tony is dead right.

              1. Does that only apply to voting or other rights as well?

      2. YES! I could watch whining fascists and crybaby communistas scratching each other’s eyes out–and have since I was a volunteer for Hohn Hospers. Crybabies might as well know there is an actual non-socialist party out here chuckling at your tear-streaked hair-pulling. Go Calico Cat! Sic ‘im Gingham Doggie!

    2. Are you capable of an accurate statement of fact?

    3. Our current method sucks badly. There are many other systems that would be better. There is a reason that new democracies do not model their system off ours.

      1. There are many improvements that can be made. That is no reason to throw out votes made under our current systems.

        Signatures are an odd thing in the modern world. Traditionally, everyone knew handwriting, but a lot of the younger generations no longer have that skill.

        1. Feel free to provide ANY possible security for mail in ballots.

          If you cannot, we should do away with them. As most advanced countries have done due to their laughable security.

    4. Lindsey “Army of Ghawd” Graham Cracker gets top billing for helping the Dems rally women voters against Boss Trump. Here’s hoping his fellow coercive klansmen make him feel that coathanger on his own hide. Judge Amy has better things to do–like rescue 2A from Freeze-And-Surrender “treaties”–than to change diapers for antichoice hillbillies too cowardly to do their own clinic vandalizing.

  13. Romney/Murkowski should run in 2024 as the appeasement bipartisan coalition ticket the Republican’s yearn for. Substitute Liz Cheney for either if they’re not good enough for the war-boners.

  14. You know what would send 2020 out just right?

    Joe Stupid signing off on Xmas Eve.

    Jill rolls over, wondering why its cold…”AAAAAGGGHH!”

    And I think it is all quiet legal-side on who’s Prez if the “elect” shoves off before getting signed in. Ruh-roh.

    It would also make for a Merry Christmas!

    1. Joe Stupid signing off on Xmas Eve of COVID*.

      *Natural causes while testing positive after 3 tests, 50 cycles each.

      I’d lay down good money that we would “seamlessly” transition to having voted for ‘administrations’ rather than persons for President. Certainly makes for an interesting thought experiment for all those ‘Biden-only’ ballots and the absurd ‘He’s the rejection of more extreme socialism’ narrative.

    2. I just googled “what if” and it auto-completed “the president elect dies?”

      Apparently the Vice-President elect becomes president.

  15. Fuck you Jacob.

  16. If/when Trump concedes (if Biden prevails in the Electoral College and in court), I strongly suggest (and suspect) he’ll turn the press conference to announce he’ll be running for reelection again in 2024 (to lawfully reclaim the White House after it was stolen in 2020).

    Doing that would also prevent neocons, never Trumpers and other RINOs from trying to regain control of the GOP, and would help Republicans regain control of the US House in 2022.

  17. I hate Reason Magazine a little more than yesterday, a little less than tomorrow.

    Started reading the print edition as a lass, back in the 1980’s.

  18. I am waiting to see what the Republican do after January 20th. I don’t think it will be too long before they are falling over themselves to tell how bad Trump really was and how hard they worked to oppose him. Waiting to which one of the sycophant is first with a tell all interview about Trump. Will it be Cruz, Graham, Cotton, or maybe Jordan?

    1. I am looking forward to seeing the look of regret on the faces of Biden supporters when he is replaced by Harris in mid 2021 and she immediately proceeds to demoralize the country and economy worse then Carter, achieving approval ratings well below that of Trump. And then the inevitable billboards with a smiling orange face and red tie, captioned “miss me yet?”

      1. LOL, I see you are taking advantage of the new laxer drug laws. Is this peyote dream?

  19. Trump won.

    There was massive fraud.

    1. At this point I’m already white privileged, an alt-right extremist, a racist, a rapist who is drowning in toxic masculinity. So may as well jump on this.

    2. I mean no one will care either way, because you are in another country and shouldn’t be this obsessed with US politics

      Like the pathetic people obsessed with the royal family

      Whether there was fraud or not, you are an irrelevant Canuck, no one actually cares what you think about US politics. Except LCock1776, I guess.

      But if you want to declare out loud, from the rooftops, that Trump was cheated, in Canada, feel free. You might get laughed at a little more there I guess, because…pathetic…but go for it kid

      1. True but meh.

      2. “Like the pathetic people obsessed with the royal family

        Whether there was fraud or not, you are an irrelevant Canuck, no one actually cares what you think about US politics. Except LCock1776, I guess.”

        We are all a bit pathetic here but I think almost everyone values Rufus and his contributions. We would be lucky to have more people like him in the country instead of say, Tony and Buttplug.

        1. The Democratic party appreciates every belching mouthfart these rednecks with green teeth regurgitate. The ONLY thing that can possibly make whining, crybaby looters look good to voters is whining, crybaby looters who are WAY more pathetic and seriously wreck the economy with superstitious laws every time they squirm into office.

      3. I really think you should have gone with chicken sandwich Dee. Because you’re a squawking bird.

    3. Also…he lost. Sorry to burst your frosty bubble

      1. You motherfuckers influence this country. You may not care but I sure do because they’re sucking Biden cock now and it’s bad for this country. So yeh, I’m gonna weigh in when you act like a bunch of cunts.

        So take your myopic comment and shove it up your ass.

        Now you stay on that side of the room and I’ll stay here. I gave a lot of money to the magazine over the years because I believe in the principles of libertarianism.

        Got it bully? Now fuck off.

        1. Wet MAGA mop needed on aisle four–in front of the Kellogg’s Apple Jacks display. A girl-bullier was same-sex bitch-slapped right in the tender feelings by heartless libertarian. And fetch along some Dr Trump butthurt salve…

    4. Squawking about fraud is easy. Offering admissible evidence thereof sufficient to vitiate election results is at least three states is damn near impossible.

      1. TDS has many faces. Funny that those accusing others of it for the past 4 years have suddenly developed it themselves.

        1. “TDS has many faces. Funny that those accusing others of it for the past 4 years have suddenly developed it themselves.”

          Not nearly as funny as those having it accusing those who don’t of being victims.

  20. Oh. And another thing. I own investments in the USA. I pay taxes every year to the IRS. That’s more than half in the country do.

    I even was in a partnership in a business in Florida.

    1. Upon reflection, I think I owe Jacob and the fine folks here (those that remain from the day), an apology.

      The strong language was unnecessary and not meant to be an insult. As the group know, I can get wordy and pissy but not a jerk.


      1. I disagree. The strong language was appropriate.

        The vile close-minded tribalists and totalitarian wannabes here are tiresome. And the authors are largely propagandists for the DNC, whether they realize it or not.

        As someone on the ground in PA, the election numbers are extremely unusual and historically unprecedented. Few locals think they make any sense at all and the number that Biden pulled in are highly questionable. It’s really one of two things.
        1) the GOTV efforts by the dems using mail in ballots were extremely successful, pulling in 20-30% increases in dem turnout for Biden.
        2) massive dem fraud

        It’s one or the other. Biden had little campaigning, little enthusiasm and no ground game. It’s entirely possible that the Biden campaign utilized a different approach that focused on the mail-in voters, but it wasn’t really evident here to any great degree. It still may certainly be legitimate, but there are a few things that raise further questions.
        – the efforts by state dems to void validations of signatures for mail-in ballots. Questionable to say the least
        – longstanding prior fraud in PA. Every election its known and common, but thought to be small-scale. Most folks have shown up to their poll and found that someone already voted in their name….the problem with no ID requirement and lazy signature verification. there is certainly prior, and common fraud in PA….just no ability to know the extent or impact.
        -the Dems arent’ touting how amazingly successful their GOTV efforts were. The numbers are historic…but yet where is the strutting around they’ve done in prior elections? seems odd.

        None of this is conclusive, but it makes it smell. But what is really egregious and offense is the utter lack of curiosity by so-called journalists and the endless hectoring by moronic lefties to “prove it”. degrading our elections and dismissing concerns is not a longterm viable strategy. And in the meantime, harsh words for the vile partisans and propagandists is entirely appropriate.

        1. I like to take a minute to address signatures. Frankly they have little meaning today. Most of the signature I see are very sloppy. Yes, when I was young a signature was important today it is a joke. I write zero checks these days and use a debit card for everything. Even when the computer system requires a signature you can just draw a line across the pad and it is accepted. So in reality the idea of signature match is simplistic at best, fertilizer at worst. That said it was the standard for the 2020 election and we need to go with it. I doubt many ballots failed this or if any really should have.

          If you want to truly verify a ballot legislatures are going to need a true identifier and that is likely a pin. I am not sure how you could work that on an absentee/anonymous ballot. That would be the challenge.

          1. I worked a few elections in NYC in the 90s. The voter would be handed a card to sign, then before going into the booth, the signature on the card was checked against the signature in the book from their voter registration. Signatures matched every time, except once, and that person convinced a judge they were who they were, the judge gave them a court order and we let them vote.

            Signature checks work.

          2. I agree that a signature match is a stupid method of identity verification. But that is the law in PA.
            In 2015, PA dems fought tooth and nail against Voter ID even with the proposal for the state government to provide photo ID free of charge to anyone without a drivers license.
            In 2020, signature verification is the ONLY method allowed to verify voter identification. Without signature verification, as bad as it is, anyone can vote under an assumed name and this often happens anyway. And in late 2020 leading up to the election, the PA SOS voided signature verification for mail-in ballots. Those received mail-in ballots have zero verification of who actually voted.
            That is not a legitimate system for a third world country, let alone the US.

            1. And this is why the ~48% of voters in PA that didn’t vote for Biden are pretty damn angry right now. Trumps voters turned out in record-setting numbers. No Republican ever pulled as many voters out in PA as did Trump, and he surpassed even Obama’s historic 2008 turnout. But yet he lost.
              The mail-in ballot numbesr should be questioned and investigated. Voters deserve that respect and the over 2million trump voters that braved the cold and covid to stand in line to voter as they have always done deserve to know that the willy-nilly mass mailing of ballots that threw the election to Biden was done with comparable care and validity.
              And when those voters hear reports that the signed security envelopes (the sole proof of legitimacy) was not stored with the ballot, contrary to PA law, and erased any subsequent viable investigation, it raises an awful lot of questions. And also really pisses off those voters to hear chattering morons constantly chirp “prove it” when it was made impossible by the very same side.

              so harsh language is very appropriate Rufus.

        2. The poor, misunderstood National Socialists at Nuremberg trials felt the same way. Nobody understood the importance of eugenics and government regulations were in preserving Positive Christianity and preventing race suicide. They were “right” to take good-faith advice from invisible buddies, and the skeptical mean people trying and hanging them were wrong to side with individual rights commie Bolsheviks! Somebody get Mike Pee Pee a MAGA doily to cry into

          1. What, did you have ancestors on trial at Nuremberg, Hank?

            somehow…not surprising….not surprising at all.

    2. If illegal immigrants and dead people can vote, Rufus, you can express interest in our politics.

      1. Sure they can. Please send your affidavit to rudy.g.69@aol.com.

    3. Hey everybody listen up! Doofus here has all the pious respect in the world for Germany’s Communist Manifesto Plank 2 that William Jennings Bryan helped inject into the Constitution–along with making beer a felony. For he’s a jolly good Jell-O…

  21. PA Senator Pat Toomey is a lame duck anti Trump RINO who has advocated shipping jobs abroad and increasing the number of low wage immigrants to take jobs of Americans (similar to Koch).

    Since Toomey recently announced that he won’t seek reelection in 2022, nobody should be surprised he is urging Trump to concede to Biden.

    1. Toomey is a careerist deepstate ahole who never did shite for the state he is supposed to represent.

      1. Yeah, but his efforts on behalf of the Army of Ghawd clinic arsonists were sure remembered by women voters 3 weeks ago. With friends like Toomey…

    2. The cowardly stain knows when to desert. Seen today’s Dilbert cartoon?

  22. And all of these weak-willed and cowardly claims of defeat by spineless Senators are based on all the evidence that they’ve examined? Nope. They haven’t seen any of the evidence! There hasn’t been a single evidentiary hearing to date.

    The slimy RINOs have proven they lack the integrity to represent The People in our government. Nor have they shown any respect for millions of American Voters who have disenfranchised by the massive election fraud.

    1. As I have noted RINO has really changed meaning over the years. At one time it represent a series of principles identified by the Republican party. Today it mean little more than loyalty to Trump. I suggest RINO no longer has any true meaning.

      1. I agree. I have no idea what Republicans really believe, except that fealty to Trump and his base is necessary to withstand primary challenges.

      2. yeah, today it is just any republican saying something you don’t want to hear.

      3. RINO means loyalty to Trump?!? wtf are you smoking?

        RINO is basically a “moderate” Republican. The definition has never changed, dipshit.

  23. So Pat “Coathanger” Toomey is worried fiscal Republicans will wake up to the fact that his cross-burning faction of girl-bullying clinic vandals and physician snipers just cost them both hands in the till. The staff at Los Alamos was shocked, SHOCKED to discover that Klaus Fuchs had been handing bomb lens secrets to the commies. Naval “Intelligence” was surprised that John Walker had been helping the Soviets to whom Tricky Nixon was busily signing away our Second Amendment rights. Trump, like Bert Hoover, was knifed from behind.

  24. they must all be RINOs….. we must love the orange one…. we must believe whatever it takes to pretend he didn’t lose….. if you live in reality you hate America!!! let us explain to you why we should be allowed to throw your votes out.

    seriously though, i hope the rational minds begin to take more prevalence in the GOP. it is hopeful that more are now calling him out….. it is worrying that it took so long and that so many still won’t.

  25. Kris Kobach, former Kansas Secretary of State, is the poster child for the claim of endemic voter fraud. Kobach was given authority to prosecute voter fraud in 2015. By 2017, he had filed a whopping nine cases with six convictions. All six were double voting cases involving older voters. Five were Republican.

    Does voter fraud exist? Sure. If you buy the Heritage Foundation’s number of over 1,000 cases (and some do not), during the reporting period over 3 billion votes were cast.

    I detest both major political parties but looking at this objectively, it seems like the expressed interest in “every LEGAL vote” is more an untoward interest in suppressing votes and delegitimizing the entire election process. I’m not happy with elections because invariably, someone wins and one politicians generally seems as odious as the rest. Be that as it may, all of the jaw-jacking about massive voter fraud getting Biden electing (without bothering to lock up the Senate) seems like the same pile of bullshit Trump was peddling when he said he would have won the popular vote in 2016 because of “three to five million” fraudulent votes.

  26. A certain German made famous the propaganda technique of the Big Lie. If you make a lie make it big and keep repeating it people will come to believe it. That is what we are seeing.

    It is fascinating to witness how well it works.

    I also think Trump himself falls victim to his own bullshit. He cannot distinguish fact from his own fictional beliefs.

    1. “I also think Trump himself falls victim to his own bullshit. He cannot distinguish fact from his own fictional beliefs.”

      Projection: the unconscious transfer of one’s own belief or behavior to another person.

      1. Denial and externalization are common defense mechanisms when faced with unpleasant truths.

  27. How can I take anything on this website seriously when they cannot even spell check their headlines. I am pretty sure the headline should read:

    “As Trump’s Fraud Allegations Flounder, More Republican Lawmakers Are Acknowledging His Defeat”


    “As Trump’s Fraud Allegations Founder, More Republican Lawmakers Are Acknowledging His Defeat”

  28. Speaking of defeat. This is pretty funny. Spending 3 million for a recount cost trump 132 votes. What a bright investment that was. Lol.

  29. Jacob Sullum eats ass. There, I said it.


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