Department of Energy Rolls Back Obama's Dishwasher Restrictions

You might finally be able to buy a dishwasher that gets the job done, unless Joe Biden changes the rules again.


President Donald Trump has scored a win against regulations that limit how much water a dishwasher can use—but those reforms could get scrubbed away by President-elect Joe Biden.

In October, Trump's Department of Energy finalized a rule establishing a new product class for residential dishwashers that will have a normal cycle time of up to one hour and that can use five gallons of water per cycle. Those rules effectively roll back an Obama-era rule limiting standard dishwashers to use no more than 3.1 gallons of water per cycle.

That limit forced dishwasher companies to adjust their products' cycle lengths. And the supposedly more efficient but less useful dishwashers have been a punchline at Trump's rallies for years.

"Anybody have a new dishwasher?" Trump asked the audience at a rally in January. "I'm sorry for that, it's worthless. They give you so little water….You end up using it 10 times…then you take them out and do them the old-fashioned way, right?"

It's probably been a long time since the president used a dishwasher or did his dishes "the old-fashioned way," but Trump's complaints reflect a frustrating reality. According to data from the Competitive Enterprise Institute, a pro-market think tank, the average dishwasher cycle time has jumped from the one-hour cycle that was common a decade ago to more than two hours today.

The tighter rules didn't lead to energy savings for customers. The Association of Home Appliance Manufacturers estimated that they actually increased water consumption by 63 billion gallons, as households would have to run their dishwashers multiple cycles, or pre-rinse their dishes by hand, in order to get dishes actually clean.

Under the new rules finalized last month, consumers will have more options. The upcoming generation of dishwashers will take less time to get dishes clean, and they'll actually get those dishes clean in the first place. As The Wall Street Journal notes, this isn't "peace in the Middle East or a Covid-19 vaccine." But it is the sort of rule-making that Americans should want from Washington.

Unfortunately, the new rules may not last. While the incoming administration has been vague about which deregulatory efforts they intend to undo, they have spoken in favor of tightening environmental regulations—and the new dishwasher rules could be a casualty.

If so, that'll be bad news for consumers. People should also be able to buy the products that best suits them.

NEXT: If Trump Ends Term by Pulling Troops Out of Afghanistan, That's Good for America

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  1. Yeah, the new ones take forever to run. There’s a detergent ad that tells you to run it every day, regardless of how many dishes are loaded, because they don’t use a lot of energy.

    I think that’s a way to sell more detergent and also to convince people that the dishwashers actually work, since they can handle a smaller load better than a full one.

    1. Biden may not be doing anything except shitting his diapers. It appears that the Dominion voting software switched over two million votes from Biden to Trump.

      1. Source?

        1. Anonymous coders, the most reliable citations on the planet.

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        2. Diebold.

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        3. It’s coming directly from the President. This is why I said it’s appears’. I’m waiting for third party substantiation, and/or a presentation of physical evidence.

          Stay tuned.

          1. Appears implies some evidence even if it’s not conclusive. The word you want is claimed, not appears.

          2. If the reports are true (and that is a big fucking “if”), it would mean the entire election was a sham and the results cannot be trusted. No audits, no recounts, would ever be sufficient to unfuck something of that magnitude.

            This is why I do not believe it.

            But, it is 2020.

            Still waiting on the big reveal about alien life.

            Fingers crossed.

            1. Millions of mailin ballots are getting tossed or entire states will be have their EC challenged making it a 12th amendment presidential race.

      2. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Not, “some guy said it”

        1. “Some guy said it” has diligently worked its way through the ranks as the most reliable source of credible information for media outlets over the past four years. Shit, we had a years long Russia investigation based on nothing other than “some guy said it,” and then an impeachment!

          “Some guy said it” carries real fucking weight, and don’t you forget it.

          1. You are some guy. So I believe it.

            1. 🙂

          2. And now you are doing the exact same thing the leftists did for 4 years, good job.

            I have a radical idea: how about we call bullshit on “some guy said it” no matter which political narrative the rumors favor?

            1. Yeah, let’s stick to some gay said it.

            2. >>And now you are doing the exact same thing the leftists did for 4 years, good job.

              nine days. good counting.

            3. While the Dominion angle itself may be the equivalent of the pee tape(Although with the hand recount if the results change more that 1% independent of invalidated ballots than it probably isn’t), there are massive indicators of major fraud in this election which is why any CPA or fraud investigator will tell you so or shut their trap because they won’t risk their livelihood telling you otherwise.

              Then there is the absolute and total fraud that was the burst pipe excuse out of Fulton County.


              No work orders to fix the thing and the only text message about the leak stated that the leak was highly exaggerated, a slow leak, and that it was contained quickly and did not spread. So why did they stop at all, and what were they doing with that time? No evidence of fraud my left nut.

        2. It works great for WaPo, NYT, and other progtard rags.

      3. Appellate court sided with trump and is tossing thousands of mailin ballots in PA.

        Trump won NC, AK, and GA today. AZ is still counting but Trump has won that state too.

    2. So if I go to consumer reports can I sort dishwashers by “Trump Approved” or “Obama/Biden Approved”?

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  2. Dishwashers are not “green” enough. Save your grandchildren. Use your fucking hands.

    1. That’s what the old lady keeps telling me.

    2. I think that dishwashers often use less water and energy than hand washing. Not sure if that is just the new shitty ones, or older ones too.

      1. Definitely less energy. Hand washing the dishes takes quite a toll on my upper back and forearms.

        1. Then you need to build your forearm strength. I recommend jerking off 4 times a day

          1. Jerking yourself off is a joke. You know your own preferences, it’s going to be too quick, and the key to building stamina is prolonged repetition.

            Instead, I would recommend you jerking off four guys a day.

            1. Tony approves.

  3. You might finally be able to buy a dishwasher that gets the job done, unless Joe Biden changes the rules again.

    If only there was some kind of process where these types of rules didn’t rely on a single office holder. If only there was some branch of the government that was answerable and accountable to the people, a body which had representatives that reflected the local desires of each state and district. I can’t imagine what such a system would look like, but one can dream.

    1. Or they just could fucking slap a label on the damned things showing how much energy/water/time each one uses and we could make our own fucking choices.

      1. Now now, you know we are too stupid to make our own choices. Besides, some people might make the wrong choice and we can’t have that

    2. Shit, as long as you’re dreaming, why not dream of individual control of these things, and a government restricted by the people to very small things?

      1. Enumerated powers… check out Hitler over here.

      2. But how would 50.1% of the voters be able to use such a government to punish the 49.9% of voters that didn’t vote for “their guy?”

  4. Lest hope In the last months he cuts all agencies in the executive branch to 0

    1. Was just thinking the other day what a wasted four years this has been. Not because “orange man bad” or any of the usual flame-war comments, but because there was this golden chance to literally erase a bunch of garbage executive-branch fiats. He promised so much of that going in, but it seems like not much actually happened (my assertion is based on zero empirical data, and mostly on a guess). Things like abolishing the Department of Education sounded great, but last I checked Betsy DeVos is still a cabinet secretary.

      1. This!

      2. As far as I can tell, it took Trump 4 fucking years to realize that there are people within the bureaucracy who don’t like him and will attempt to undermine him by refusing to follow his orders in a prompt and efficient manner. He truly seems to believe that once he became President, everybody had to do what he said whether they liked it or not, that he could just handwave a “make it so” and everybody would fall all over themselves making it so.

        The media, for example, are attempting to portray his reorg in the DoD as some sort of Hitlerian revenge purge – I’m hoping that the reason he’s making some changes there is because he finally figured out that for all the times he’s commanded the war in Afghanistan to be ended, it ain’t getting ended and it ain’t getting ended because nobody else is interested in ending the thing and their inaction is simply a big “F U” to Trump.

        So much more Trump could have done if he had realized he was going to have to start draining the swamp and get some swamp drainer enforcement in there before he started ordering these people around. It takes attention to detail and focus enough to realize when people aren’t getting the job done and hold them accountable for not getting the job done. It’s a little late now, Donald, but goddammit, you got no excuse for not getting done what you can. There’s a whole shitload of slimy motherfuckers that need to be fired.

      3. To be fair, a distinct body of jurisprudence sprung to life in the last four years positing that Trump’s existence as President, in and of itself, was an exigent circumstance that warranted special treatment and consideration that would not apply in any other circumstances. Trump existing aggrieved litigants, and the courts had an obligation, of course, to take such psychic injuries into consideration when his executive actions were being ruled upon.

  5. Aw gee another awful Obama era fuckup bites the dust.

    And reason koch wanted Biden why, because of mean tweets?

    1. Mean tweets are bad, mkay?

    2. “And reason koch wanted Biden why”

      Because literally any Democrat will be better for Mr. Koch’s net worth.


      1. You stupid koch-sucker.

  6. >>Burton C. Gray Journalism intern for the fall of 2020

    be better than Sullum. and drop ‘that’ it’s a crutch.

  7. My dishwasher cycle is 2:46.

    Thanks Obama!

    1. Well, yeah.
      But when I tell my wife I am going to do the dishes, I can watch an entire movie.

  8. What’s the problem with 3.1 gal. per cycle? It’s not like it costs you $15/hr. to pay someone to wash your dishes for you.

    1. Good point. Piece work rates.
      ten cents for a knife-fork-spoon set
      25 cents per plate
      15 cents per glass or coffee mug
      a dollar per pot or pan or slow cooker liner

    2. Most of the time I run it overnight, so it doesn’t really matter.

      But sometimes I need my dishes sooner than that.

      And with my super efficient dishwasher, I don’t have heated air drying them, so that’s an extra 2 hours of drying time I am losing.

    3. The fact that people in Southern California are living in a semi-desert means the entire country must pretend like potable water is in short supply everywhere. To treat Michigan differently from Los Angeles just is not fair.

  9. Now if they’ll do something about those washing machines that sense the weight of the clothing before adding half the water needed to get them clean.

    1. Sounds like divorced drunk people problems.

    2. MY friend has one of those he now adds another gallon of water each time to increase the load and then it increases the water but once it goes to rinse you have to add another gallon of water. its fucking stupid he says if he doesn’t he has to run it three times

      1. What a pain in the ass.

      2. I was going to replace my fifteen year old washer and dryer. Sounds like I should hold off.

        1. No need to replace her. Just give your fifteen year old bribes to do the work, like spending money and snacks.

    3. My LG has a button for “more water” that I default to “on.”

    4. Well, I’ll hope my old one with a dial that tells it how much water to use keeps working for another 20 years.

      1. if Maytag then yes.

  10. Trump’s biggest success (which Reason and other media outlets rarely, if ever, mention because they hate Trump) has been reducing and delaying hundreds of economically disastrous Obama/Biden regulations.

    So why has Reason waited until after Biden has been declared the winner to reveal Trump’s excellent achievements, and why did virtually all Reason staffers oppose Trump?

    1. True libertarians love Trump and everything he’s done. True libertarians hate free trade and immigration. True libertarians oppose the free press and embrace economic protectionism. Reason “libertarians” are really a bunch of commies. Otherwise they’d have supported Trump and everything he’s done.

      1. Broken toy.

      2. Your behavior explains your lonely washing machine comment.

        1. Yet you still can’t find an example of me cheering Biden or the DNC.

          1. Perhaps not, but your tiresome TDS shit is enough to suggest you certainly did.

            1. At least you admit to having no evidence at all to support your slander.

          2. I’ve said cleay you only attacked one side and then Gloster that biden won for a week.

            Stop pretending you didn’t. You can deny your behaviors all you want. You were happy biden won. Own it.

              1. I like “gloster” better. It is more Biden-y.

          3. By the way, you have called many here trump cultists for daring to agree with trump even once. So your own behavior is going to get the same treatment. Most of us have stated where we disagree with him.

          4. Say one bad thing about Biden.

            I dare you.

            1. Don’t do it, it will get you on AOC’s list.

      3. Relative to any realistic alternatives, Trump is the libertarian choice. No one here ever said he is the perfect libertarian. He is certainly not.

        He is most certainly a million times better than a Harris/Biden presidency.

        1. Agreed.

    2. Bill you’re throwing curveballs at eight year-olds with all the common sense they don’t fucking know why past their twitter feeds.

    3. Because Trump opposes free trade and immigration. Have you read any of the articles in the past 4 years?

      1. Trump opposes people coming here illegally. Which is not immigration. And don’t start with the anti free trade bullshit. It’s been litigated to death here, and you’re wrong.

        1. There would be no such thing as an “illegal immigrant” in a pure libertarian world. People would be free to move across borders (if they still existed) to wherever it was to their advantage and to their employers benefit to make the most productive use of resources.

      2. Because ignoring the actions of foreign trade partners make it free trade.

      3. Free trade is a two way street. Can you point to a situation where free trade was on the table and Trump turned it down?

  11. All I gotta say is fuck California. Seriously. The rest of the country isn’t a fucking desert, so why do we all need to conform to standards set by a desert state with a river running through it? Cocksuckers and squareheads.

    1. Something about the popular vote, or something.

    2. Screw prior agreements. Drain the Colorado River before they get anything.

      1. But, but, but… almonds!

        1. But, but, but… cheap, American-made, almonds milk!

          Almonds themselves are pretty cheap and can be grown elsewhere.

    3. The 1.6 gallon toilets eventually worked. Took them years to perfect, though, and tons of complaints.

      1. Yeah, I have no problems with my new toilets. Faucets on the other hand are quite frustrating when all you want to do is fill a pot with water or take a bath.
        And why can’t I have round knobs on faucets anymore?

      2. In California it is now 1.28 gal per flush and yes i have to flush two to three times now. Another side effect is teh cities now have to flush teh sewer system because there is not enough to move all the sludge and they also have to add water at the sewage plant because you need water to get the bio process working.

        1. We get ‘running blackouts’ so we don’t have to have NG generating plants, and now we have millions of gasoline-powered home generating systems which, I’m sure, are less ‘polluting’ than the NG plants, right?

          1. Don’t worry Sevo. There is a simple solution to that. The democrats will ban privately owned generators.

      3. The toilets do indeed work better than the old two flush pieces of junk, but why is everybody forced to buy the tall toilets that put your legs to sleep while catching up on your reading?

        1. As you get older, you’ll come to appreciate the tall toilets.

      4. Yeah, 1.6 gallon toilets work eventually…. on the third flush.

    4. Yeah, the national mandate for reduced flow fixtures is maddening. Especially for things like kitchen sinks and bat tubs where the whole point is to fill something with water as fast as possible.
      Much of the country has abundant shallow ground water and no need to conserve water. Desert area can make local regs if they want. Or better, market pricing for water to reflect actual scarcity.

      1. Or better, market pricing for water to reflect actual scarcity.

        But if they did that well off progressives in LA might have to pay slightly more for their water than a poor person in Texas. And that’s not fair.

      2. This is always been my argument on this topic. we keep wanting to make standards based on people living in the desert in southern California. Meanwhile, people living in Minnesota and Wisconsin could literally leave the water running all day to no impact.

        It is almost as if this is a large country and one size solutions do not fit all.

        1. I am honestly surprised we have not yet seen any pornographic films out of California where the premise is a chick who is forced to fuck some dude for water.

          1. That’s not in a Mad Max movie?

          2. My eyes will need bleach now.

      3. Look on the bright side, you only have to run the water for fifteen minutes or so before it’s tepid. Think of all the scalded babies this prevents.

    5. I’d like to formally (re)file my complaint about Safe-T-pour gas cans too. Still more complicated, still more expensive, still “less safe”.

      Is this where I should do that?

      1. Get yourself a retrofit kit at your local big-box hardware store or Amazon. Costs about three bucks, and IIRC comes with a few different sizes of caps. Has a flexible spout with a cap, just like the old days.

        1. Do they have to sell those as “water can spouts”?

      2. Struggled with one for 10 minutes one day and never did figure it out. Cut the thing off so I could fuel the tractor and ordered the old style on line.

    6. This.

      Every State along the Mississippi watches gallons upon gallons of water flow past us, but the handful of desert states out west try to tell us how much water we can have in our toilets.

  12. “The rest of the country isn’t a fucking desert, so why do we all need to conform to standards set by a desert state with a river running through it?”

    Public office buildings in Harrisburg, PA’s capital, have idiotic water saver faucets. The state office complex is a half mile from the Susquehanna River, which flows at an average of 30,000 gallons of water per second. Why?

    1. Because morons who mandate those things in the first place think that using a few ounces less water in Pennsylvania will make it rain in southern California, or some crap like that.

      Albert Hammond was a prophet:

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  14. Interestingly, Consumer Reports found many new dishwashers do a good job. We rarely use anything except the short 60-minute cycle on our Bosch, and the dishes are clean every time. (and no, we don’t pre-rinse them either. And we do use the longer cycle for the occasional time we have something thoroughly baked on.)

    1. consumer reports is a political hack magazine and has been caught fudging numbers before.

      1. Verifiable source?

        1. Consumer Reports Report.

    2. An anecdote! I guess all of the people I know must be wrong.
      Are you of the ‘party of science’, by any means?

    3. I’ll have to try the 60 minute cycle.

    4. Bosch makes really nice dishwashers. But not cheap ones….

    5. And how much did the Bosch cost?

      I bought a GE or Whirlypool or something about 20 years back in my old house for about $400, worked just fine. The Meele uses less water, works fine too, but cost $2K 4 years later.

      I could have paid for a boatload of water with the $1600 difference, and filled my non-existent pool.

    6. My old dishwasher is done in 30 minutes full cycle. Never will replace it as long as it lives.

  15. Say goodbye to this sort of market friendly reform.

    Biden surrogates are already crowing about ousting Ajit Pai at the FCC and bringing back net neutrality.

    For those who believe, net neutrality protected us from ISP abuse. For Netflix it was with a $60 million payoff to Obama the moment he left office.

    Why the left thinks one set of tech companies is a bigger threat than a set of much larger internet companies is beyond me, but they are ecstatic…

    So say goodbye to those bundles with Hulu or Netflix in your cell phone package. Those will soon be illegal again.

    They were also crowing that Biden would correct the rampant anticompetitive abuses by the ISPs during covid. My ISP has cancelled all data caps during covid, so I am not sure which abuse they are on about….

    1. Obama also allowed control of the net to go away from the US.

  16. Is this article just simply not going to point out that the “water saved” to protect the environment is out-striped by the 3x time it takes to run the machine, which requires power? How much more coal did we use to save all that water?

    1. It’s not just dishwashers, either.

      Automatic sensors are required on almost all new public toilets, but they’re rarely calibrated correctly or well maintained, so they tend to either flush 2-3x as often as is needed, or not at all.

      The mandated GPM flow restrictions on all new shower heads means it takes longer to get clean. It used to be that you could remove the little restrictor gasket / washer before installation, but now they have to be internal.

      These might be good options (as in, non-mandatory!) in a location like southern Arizona or the Los Angeles metro area. It might help save some water. But lots of us live in areas where fresh water is abundant and inexpensive.

      Nationwide one-size-fits-all solutions for local problems are a central planner’s dream, though. Recurring theme:
      – $15 minimum wage
      – VA Care for All
      – Covid-19 responses
      – Etc.

      1. A simple drill can fix that shower head quickly. Just sayin.

        1. A lot of new shower heads have a removable flow limiter. Just a little piece of plastic to take out to get normal pressure again.

    2. Or by the water wasted in rinsing out bottles and cans so they can be recycled instead of dumped in landfills. I wonder how many gallons it takes to rinse out a ketchup or salad dressing bottle?
      [Dirty secret is that some large percentage of plastic never gets re-cycled even if you put it out in a separate bin for a separate trash truck.]

  17. Plus they took the phosphates out of detergents which is another reason your dishes and clothes don’t get as clean. You can cheat and add it yourself but I have heard that you want STPP not TPP.

    1. You mean STPP, not TSP. STPP is [penta]sodium tripolyphosphate. TSP is trisodium phosphate and is undesirably (sometimes dangerously) alkaline.

      About as good as STPP is sodium hexametaphosphate (amorphous sodium polyphosphate glass), the ofiginal calgon. But not today’s Calgon.

  18. Elections have consequences.

    Starting Jan. 21.

    1. Yes, asshole-bigot, we’ve had to put up with lefty shits like Obo, LBJ and the lot of them.
      We are fortunate that the the worst of their ignorant attempts at social engineering have been blocked,
      But we are well aware that lefty ignoramuses like you continue to cheer them on, oblivious to history.

    2. So do wars.

      Good luck.

    3. What consequences?

      Are the Biden brownshirts going to crack heads?

  19. It’s too bad the orange idiot didn’t do this 3.5 years ago. He was too busy making things more expensive and bailing out farmers with his stupid tariffs. He couldn’t quit running his mouth, trolling, and tweeting nonsense, so now we’ll get this senile old fart making even more of a mess of things.

    1. The rule making process was probably started about three years ago.

      Blaming him for not getting it done sooner is equivalent to complaining that he doesn’t have a magic wand.

    2. The steel tariff didn’t work either.

      As nice as would it be to admire his intentions, we are not living in the 1960s.

      There is no such thing as an American car built from American steel heated with American coal assembled by American workers.

      We have global car makers building vehicles in the US made of aluminum, plastic, carbon fiber, and recycled steel melted in electric arc furnaces, assembled by robots.

      Why? EPA pollution regulations, Environmental impact studies, planned land use management, OSHA, CAFE mileage standards, labor laws, high energy costs, universities choosing students based on something other than ability to succeed – the list is long.

      We have chosen the path to our own destruction. China makes almost all our consumer goods. We can’t even make the machines to make the machines that makes stuff.

  20. But it is the sort of rule-making that Americans should want from Washington.

    Or.. you know.. NO RULES AT ALL!

    Why the hell is Washington making rules about dishwashers in the first place? it’s utterly ridiculous how bad things have gotten. The over-regulation of all aspects of our lives has got to be reversed.

    1. Because dishwashers are interstate commerce, if you have guests from out of state and wash their dishes for them?

    2. If regulators weren’t constantly creating new regulations, they’d have to go get a real job. It’s as simple as that.

  21. My dishwasher uses about a half cup of water and get the dishes quite clean. Of course it takes 4 hours instead of the one hour the old dishwasher took.

  22. I seriously thought this regulation stuff was 100% about Trump having to flush twice after a bucket of chicken. But I doubt he’s ever touched a dishwasher.

    1. You’ve never touched a dishwasher either except to grope one.

      1. Tony is no Biden.

  23. Where the blank is a president able to determine this? is it in the constitution? Isn’t this a legislative and more likely a State prerogative not Mr. “the tea party was a response to a black man int eh white house”. Whenever I forgot what small petty chip on his shoulder man he is he reminds me. Honestly he is just like every liberal art major who knows nothing and has no experience in anything but running everyone’s life. Now we have Corn Pop Joe and the usual idiotic suspects coming in…I’d like an administration who only hires people with hard science or engineering degrees and maybe MBAs. No a lawyers or find lvy league liberal art majors…JC..I still have to flush my toilet three times..

  24. I run my dishwasher on the Heavy Cycle, Hi Temp Wash, Sani-Rinse and heated dry settings every time. Just a few extra button pushes every time. My dishes are clean the first time.

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  26. We need to find some black market dishwashers that work well. I’d gladly pay double for quality. The free market at work.

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  28. Many years ago – I’m guessing 25 or so – I read an article in some fancy home design/decorating magazine about the home kitchen of a successful chef/restaurant owner. The guy liked to have large family gatherings and his home kitchen included a lot of restaurant grade equipment, including a dishwasher that had something like a five minute cycle. I’m sure that dishwasher was expensive and it likely used lots of water – very hot water – but with such a short cycle, perhaps it was relatively energy efficient. Now I’m going to try to satisfy my curiosity and see if such units are available today.

    1. My previous house came with a very old, very reliable, and very effective Hobart branded residential dishwasher. The house was built in the late 40’s but I suspect the dishwasher was circa late 60’s. One year the hose to the top impeller failed. Of course no replacement parts were available so I went with hardware store plastic tubing and hose clamps. After one failed repair attempt I had to go with steel reinforced hose. If you didn’t load it properly it could break dishes. But man could it clean anything.

      Had I known what it I had I would have taken it with me when we moved.

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  32. Whenever I see government forcing car companies to make cars that have less gas milage or dishwashers not using as much water, I’m wondering if they think we’re all stupid. Do they honestly think that consumers don’t want more effective dishwashers? Yes, we do, but we need a dishwasher that actually washes.

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