Tonight on The Independents: DON'T PANIC, S.S. Follies, Libertarian Spoilers, Peter Suderman on Obamacare, Why Are We Still in Afghanistan, Intel vs. Obama, Plastic Bans, Are Hot Dogs Sandwiches, and Aftershow!

Because your cable news right now is filled with PANIC PANIC PANIC about Ebola coming to the U.S. and A., tonight's live episode of The Independents (Fox Business Network, 9 p.m. ET, 6 p.m. PT, with re-airs three hours later) is here to tell you to KNOCK IT OFF ALREADY. Non-hysterical Party Panelists Mollie Hemingway (senior editor of The Federalist) and Angela McGlowan (Fox News contributor) will purr you through the latest disease-news, then turn their attentions to the boiling-over conflict between President Barack Obama and his intelligence apparatus.

The co-hosts will discuss the ongoing clusterfudges surrounding the Secret Service's botched protection of the president, including this breaking bit about how, well, POTUS's praetorians let him take an elevator ride with a weird-acting armed convict a couple weeks back. The great Yahoo! News political reporter Chris Moody will come on to handicap close Senate races where Libertarians and other third-party types are threatening to be (alleged!) spoilers. Beloved Reason Senior Editor Peter Suderman arrives to explain how up to 300,000 Americans may soon lose their Obamacare as they know it. The Party Panel will be recalled to talk about California's spanking new plastic-bag ban, and hopefully also the critical debate as to whether hot dogs are or are not sandwiches. And Kmele Foster will wrap a bow on things by trying to unpack just why the hell the U.S. is keeping 10,000 troops in Afghanistan forever.

Online-only aftershow begins at foxbusiness.com/independents just after 10. Follow The Independents on Facebook at facebook.com/IndependentsFBN, follow on Twitter @ independentsFBN, and click on this page for more video of past segments.

Comments

[Heroic Mulatto]

More Arabic twerking.

[Notorious G.K.C.]

This one goes out to all the fellas
Who twerk and twerk to the glory of Allah

[Entropy Void]

WHAT THE HELL WAS THAT?

[Heroic Mulatto]

M'alayah

[Paul.]

Comment: Disgraceful. Their faces are covered but their asses are blowing in the wind. Ppl will use this against Islam. None of these hypocrites represent Islam. ?

[Dilligaf]

Disgraceful..hypocrites..?! Oh but that's where your wrong,this is totally Halal. Faces,hair,and body are covered. Dancing is not forbidden I am told nor is having money donated to you as a tip;everything else is merely differences of opinion on dance styles.

[Suthenboy]

Heh. Ok, I am home and not struggling with my iPhone in a loud restaurant.

Why the fascination with Arabic twerking? Wait, I bet I can get it on the first guess....because it is twerking?

[Heroic Mulatto]

I see it almost as an ISIS "What we're fighting for".

[PapayaSF]

No, they're fighting for the right to kill twerkers.

[Fist of Etiquette]

NO SPOILERS.

[Rev-Match]

Spoiler Alert: Spoilers.

[Homple]

Why is congress plus everybody and their dogs having a conniption fit about the incompetence of the Secret Service? The Secret Service is supposed to protect the President and his family. If Obama is satisfied with their performance, why should anyone else care. If he isn't, well, he's their boss and can make them shape up.

What am I missing?

[Notorious G.K.C.]

The fact that the President can't simply throw his life away out of stupidity or carelessness, the public has an interest in preserving him.

Acting within the Bill of Rights, the Sec Ser's job is to prevent this country from becoming some sort of banana republic with a new President every month.

[Sevo]

"Acting within the Bill of Rights, the Sec Ser's job is to prevent this country from becoming some sort of banana republic with a new President every month."

Instead, we turn into a tin-pot dictatorship with a pres in the 6th of 8 years.

[GILMORE]

I'm with Homple.

I thought the 'shocked face' would be over a day or 2 after the story.

Now that its snowballing into DO SOMETHINGISM!! i'm increasingly wondering why i should really give a fuck. ok - lock the door. Duh. Does that require congressional inquiry?

[gaijin]

I thought the 'shocked face' would be over a day or 2 after the story.

I think it gives the press something to discuss other than civilian deaths in syria, the Ukraine, and the pastle of fake scandals afflicting the One. Plus it stirs up 'the fearz' among the easily afeared.

[BigT]

More importantly, dead Obama becomes St Barack. More dangerous than any zombie.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Still, Obama's plastinated corpse resting in the People's Mausoleum would be a tourist attraction.

[PapayaSF]

Why is congress plus everybody and their dogs having a conniption fit about the incompetence of the Secret Service?

Two words: President Biden.

[Sevo]

Re: the plastic bag ban.
Fomr the Economist story:
"This bill is a step in the right direction ? it reduces the torrent of plastic polluting our beaches, parks and even the vast ocean itself," Brown said in a signing statement. "We're the first to ban these bags, and we won't be the last."

I've yet to see anything that makes the use of "torrent" even remotely accurate, other than typical moonbeam bullshit tactics, and regarding the ocean:
"The amount of plastic out there isn't trivial," White said. "But using the highest concentrations ever reported by scientists produces a patch that is a small fraction of the state of Texas, not twice the size."
Another way to look at it, White said, is to compare the amount of plastic found to the amount of water in which it was found. "If we were to filter the surface area of the ocean equivalent to a football field in waters having the highest concentration (of plastic) ever recorded," she said, "the amount of plastic recovered would not even extend to the 1-inch line."
[...]
"On one hand, these plastics may help remove toxins from the water," she said. "On the other hand, these same toxin-laden particles may be ingested by fish and seabirds. Plastic clearly does not belong in the ocean."
http://www.sciencedaily.com/re.....151146.htm

It may not "belong" there, whatever that is supposed to mean, but it doesn't seem to be causing any harm

[Pl?ya Manhattan.]

The law says "single use". I use them to line my trashcans at home.

[Sevo]

And if they're serious, the amount of dog poop on the streets is gonna sky-rocket...

[GILMORE]

You are just awful. When it says, 'single use', they MEAN IT, buster!

Which is why i throw mine away *immediately after* i strangle hookers with them.

[gaijin]

I use plastic bags to pick up my dog's sh!t. I guess could just leave it on the sidewalk.

[Rev-Match]

but it doesn't seem to be causing any harm

It's not causing any harm, but plastic is MAN-MADE, so we have to DO SOMETHING!!1!1!

(nevermind that everything we make contains ingredients from nature, itself.)

[Paul.]

"We're the first to ban these bags, and we won't be the last."

Huh?!! I'd say they're like the hunnerdth.

Oh, Los Angeleans, as someone who's been labouring under an plastic bag ban now for... oh, a year or so, you're going to wish for the good old days when people wrote cheques in the checkout line.

[Pl?ya Manhattan.]

Let's see. We have Fake Dunphy, Tulpa, Mary, Mandalay, and a few others out this week.

This should make for an interesting thread.

[Paul.]

No shit. Let's bring the REAL COMMENTERS BACK!

[Smilin' Joe Fission]

The trolls showing up this week are far more annoying, in my opinion, than Shreek or Tony. This current League of Extraordinarily Shitty Trolls (tm) completely shit on a thread and make it unreadable.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

EBOLA! *clap-clap-clap-clap-clap-clap* EBO-LA!

[Rev-Match]

OT: My favorite troll

joshrendell|9.30.14 @ 6:11PM|#

if your talking libertarians, they are a bunch of wackadoo's whose ideas
have no basis in reality, that's why they
are part of the lunatic fringe

I have been debating whether this is an actual person or just one of you assholes doing overtime to get on everyone else's nerves. I'm leaning towards the latter because the grammatical errors seem so numerous and systematic as to be deliberate. So, someone fess up. My money is on FoE. (bc who else has this kinda free time?)

[Pl?ya Manhattan.]

Hey, Fist is a very busy school teacher!

[gaijin]

My money is on FoE. (bc who else has this kinda free time?)

HOw do we know you aren't FoE?

[Trouser-Pod]

HOw

Uh oh! Get 'im!!

[Rev-Match]

HOw (sic) do we know you aren't FoE?

How do we know that FoE is not Matt Welch incognito? It's not like he has anything to do all day. (besides review articles and always be the first to comment on them, albeit in disguise)

[gaijin]

ow do we know that FoE is not Matt Welch incognito?

Excellent theory except that FoE is funny some of the time.

[Rev-Match]

Excellent theory except that FoE is funny some of the time.

Matt Welch 'dresses' funny, so there's that.

[Fist of Etiquette]

You ever notice how FoE never liveblogs while the camera is on Welch? Suspicious.

[Paul.]

A security contractor with a gun and three prior convictions for assault and battery was allowed on an elevator with President Obama during a Sept. 16 trip to Atlanta, violating Secret Service protocols, according to three people familiar with the incident.

Are we certain this was... you know, an accident?

[Paul.]

"You have a convicted felon within arm's reach of the president and they never did a background check,"

Background checks for everyone who comes near the president! We've got to close the gladhanding loophole!

[PapayaSF]

Hell, Obama couldn't pass a background check to get near himself.

[Longtorso, Johnny]

Oklahoma Federal Court Rules IRS Attempt to Save Obamacare's Subsidies for Federal Exchange Enrollees "Arbitrary, Capricious, an Abuse of Discretion, and Otherwise Not In Accordance with the Law"

More: The Judge in Pruitt Scolds the Obama Champions of the Judicial Branch

[Longtorso, Johnny]

Josh Kraushaar: Obama's Pass-the-Buck Presidency
...Obama takes daily intelligence briefings in writing, he explained, because no one will be able to testify about warning the president in person about threats that the White House doesn't act on...

[Longtorso, Johnny]

10 Famous People who Died from Masturbation

[Pl?ya Manhattan.]

Michael Jackson (not pictured)
A well-known black musician and current record holder for most chuck E cheese tokens purchased, Michael Jackson had a very disturbing and very private life. He was found dead on June 25 2009 from dehydration after expelling all his bodily fluids seminally. He was watching Lord of the Flies (1990).

[gaijin]

I never knew James Doohan played Saruman.

[GILMORE]

I think using "The Edge" as Michael Hutchance is a pretty nice stroke (no pun!)

[GILMORE]

oh, the text was even better

"Michael Hutchence is famous for being the lead drummer of the British pop Duo U2"'

That is some Me-Level dumb humor right there.

[Rhywun]

This isn't real, is it?

[GILMORE]

Shit is mad real, yo

[PapayaSF]

It's some sort of attempt at humor.

[JeremyR]

Yes, a real site would say something like "current record holder for most chuck E cheese tokens purchased"

That's not at all humorous.

[gaijin]

whether hot dogs are or are not sandwichestoys

A more interesting debate?

[Fist of Etiquette]

Prediction: Sleeveless.

[gaijin]

close...

[Fist of Etiquette]

Shot from the grassy knoll.

[Trouser-Pod]

Oh, "bleeding out your eyeballs"...

I totally wasn't expecting "eyeballs", there.

[Derpetologist]

I ran the numbers on the Secret Service. Turns out they're not very good at their jobs:

http://platedlizard.blogspot.c.....hless.html

I also found this derp-off between Sam Seder and Richard Eskow. The topic is Thomas Friedman. Oh man, this is going to be great!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1ofYq52-fY

[Irish]

How Thomas Friedman is a modern day Ayn Rand? Somehow, given her experience in the Soviet Union, I doubt Ayn Rand would be quite so high on the ChiComs as Friedman is.

[Derpetologist]

First, must think like a prog:

I don't like Ayn Rand. I don't like Tom Friedman. Therefore, Tom Friedman is the same as Ayn Rand.

[Dilligaf]

Not Thomas Friedman,Today's Wrong Way Corrigan?

[Fist of Etiquette]

CLOSE THE BORDERS TO IMMIGRANT HEMORRHAGIC DISEASES.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Yeah, bird flu totally equals ebola.

[gaijin]

They (Big Pharma) already have a cure...they created the disease after all. They are just waiting for a big enough market

/Van Jones

[Fist of Etiquette]

All this Africa bashing.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Prison shim? To make your cellmate plumb?

[pagal]

If his name is Robert, you can call him Plumb Bob.

[Derpetologist]

Sam Seder attempts to debate libertarian; the derp flows freely. I have linked to the part where he claims college is more expensive now because of government cut backs:

http://youtu.be/vGy4kPG0m20?t=8m0s

[gaijin]

"you could get a virtually free education except for the cutbacks"...

good lord. money, it's free when it isn't yours.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Yeah, sure. I love working for free!

[Rev-Match]

I have a deep loathing of Sam Seder. He exemplifies everything I despise about progressivism.

[Trouser-Pod]

If he's that bad, do NOT read his YT followers. Holy hell, are they stupid.

[gaijin]

I notice his bio lists, in order: comedian, writer, actor, film director, tv producer-director, progressive radio talkshow host...guessing he's not very good at any of it.

[Trouser-Pod]

Unfortunately, he's on Bob's Burgers. Blind squirrel; nut.

[Derpetologist]

How dare you insult the genius behind the outrageous comedy Assy McGee?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZ0CzaHHFV0

[Trouser-Pod]

Never watched it, and telling that Seder played "Douche" on it.

[gaijin]

It's buses for everyone! Public transportation for the win.

[Fist of Etiquette]

NO ONE HERE IS ON OBAMA'S SIDE?

[gaijin]

they are double agents...

[Rufus J. Firefly]

My left-wing sister couldn't believe what she was watching on 60 Minutes.

A baby and a jerk she thought.

[Rev-Match]

Take responsibility

Racist.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Imagine how much that won't happen when we have a woman president!

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Racist!

War on wymenz!

[Rev-Match]

Yea, basically this.

[Fist of Etiquette]

This just in: People who take the time to talk to pollsters are idiots.

[BigT]

Ebola, Ebonics. Coincidence? I think not.

[Fist of Etiquette]

You're banned. Get out.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Still a more rational observation than half the stuff I read in the Ebola thread comments.

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Here we go.

I want to preemptively say, If the republicans want libertarian votes, they should run libertarian candidates.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Those aren't libertarian votes. There's no such thing. Those are Republican votes that someone's stealing.

[Fist of Etiquette]

So then libertarians don't take Dem votes?

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Only if the dem loses.

[cavalier973]

I took some Democrat votes once. They were covered in progslobber, which is almost impossible to wash out.

[PapayaSF]

I would say "rarely," because the central concern of Democrat and Democrat-leaning voters is "more government."

[Fist of Etiquette]

Uh, Moody, next time you knot your tie, make sure it's around your neck.

[GILMORE]

Chris Moody = face of a serial strangler

[gaijin]

He appears to be about 17. What does he really know?

[Fist of Etiquette]

THAT GODDAMN INTERNET. Total spoiler.

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Bullshit. The reason we get moar votes is the libertarian moment.

[Jesus H. Christ]

Eeee-booo-laaaa! Bumpty bumpty bump! My life for you!

[Francisco d'Anconia]

M-O-O-N

That spells Trashman.

[GILMORE]

The Independents Attire Review, 30 September 2014

Peace In Our Time-Edition

- Kennedy: The Black T is my nemesis. Every possible 'Metal Groupie'/'Teen Goth'/'Biker Bitch'/Mummenschanz/Mime bad-joke has pretty much already been used, re-used, and then used again... much like a real-life Metal-Groupie/Teen Goth and/or Biker Bitch. I'm down with it. I think the hot-pink lippy helps it out. +1 Ronny Dio Metal-Horns

- Matt: Brings his own subtle play on "Secret Service"-chic. Note the earpiece! (the others always manage to hide theirs better for whatever reason). We have never been nuts about Matt's occasional hipster-suiting attempts. A confession: We actually think his "Red-Shirt/black tie" (aka "Ma?tre d' of Chez Satan") look is pretty dope as a cocktail party getip. The black tie against more neutral things just looks funereal.

- Kmele: We don't like the patterned shirt with the grey. While Kmele normally has ninja-master skills w/ the greyscale shades, tonight we're getting a "Twilight Zone"/static-distortion effect that isn't entirely pleasing. We still love that tie though.

Shukran

[Heroic Mulatto]

Mr. Anderson?

[Heroic Mulatto]

Brings his own subtle play on "Secret Service"-chic. Note the earpiece!

[GILMORE]

We called the same thing with the grey shirt "the Pleasantville" (because he looks black&white; below the neck)... we called black tie w/ the white shirt the "Royale w/ Cheese".... and when he wore browns with the black, we called it "Agent Smith"

This looks like a light-blue shirt? I figured this one gets its own name:

"The Incompetent Bodyguard"

[GILMORE]

I also note: weirdly, Matt flashes no earpiece tonight, while both k and k do.

i'm so busted.

[Derpetologist]

? I told the witch doctor I'm bleeding out my ass!

? ? ?

? I told the witch doctor to do something fast he said

? E! bo! Ebola! Ting! Tang! Walla walla bing bang!

? Ebo! Ebola! Ting tang wallabang boom!

[Jesus H. Christ]

I like it! Work up a few more verses.

[gaoxiaen]

Just eat some albino and call me in the morning.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Jesus, Kennedy. You don't have to yell. We're right here.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Plenty of yucks.

[Rev-Match]

split the difference like a good thong

Statements like this make Kennedy less awful.

[GILMORE]

ARSE?!

INDEPENDENTS FAIL

REAL AMERICANS SAY "ASS"

[Jesus H. Christ]

He forgot he was on cable tx.

[Jesus H. Christ]

cable teevee. Damn auto correct.

[Derpetologist]

Holy hell, Sam Seder vs. Walter Block?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BhcdVubtZ0

[Rev-Match]

There is no way, in hell, it could be a fair fight.

[Derpetologist]

Yes, but it is an entertaining beat down.

[Fist of Etiquette]

No wonder Kim looks Dennis Rodman's height. And IQ.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Standardization fixes everything.

[Jesus H. Christ]

Kim Jong Un sounds like The Kid from Stephen King's The Stand. He was 5'3", with a 3" hairdo and 3" heels that brought him to a respectable 5'9".

[Fist of Etiquette]

XP WAS THE GOOD OS. Vista is the one that sucked. ME too. And 8.

[Jesus H. Christ]

XP is one of M$ better systems. Vista was horrible.

[Francisco d'Anconia]

YOU LEAVE HARRY ALONE...BITCH!

[Fist of Etiquette]

I once had an intern that looked exactly like Ron Weasley. Exactly.

[Jesus H. Christ]

That would have been fun.

[Fist of Etiquette]

I showed him the video for M.I.A.'s "Born Free" where they were rounding up gingers. He missed the point and got pissed at the video.

[Jesus H. Christ]

Hey, I like Harry Potter as well. No memorabilia or action figures, though,

[Fist of Etiquette]

The coppers were cleared in advance.

[GILMORE]

Professor Frink Professor Frink Professor Frink He Makes You Laugh He Makes You Think And Then The Thing With The Person

[Trouser-Pod]

+1 Glaven!

[GILMORE]

Technically i believe the accurate nomenclature is OH MY GOD THE FIRE AND THE BURNING

[Trouser-Pod]

C'mon, you were designed to alert school children about snow days and such.

Don't make my use that remote code!

[Francisco d'Anconia]

You can't smell SpaghettiO sauce on the fucking spoon, pig?

[Rhywun]

They only know "donuts" and "not-donuts" (usually identified as "marijuana").

[Rev-Match]

OT: My left-of-center grandparents

are up in arms about privately run prisons. My personal opinion is that public/private run is irrelevant, given that it is those in government (legislators, prosecutors, and judges) that put people in prison (I.e. "have the power"). And, "Profit" will be made either way. Does anyone have thoughts on this opinion or how to better convey this opinion to them?

[Derpetologist]

Over 90% of prisoners are government prisons, which tend to be overcrowded, violent & dirty.

Try working the angle that it's more human for the prisoners.

[The artist known Dunphy]

This is an excellent place to start.

Imnsho this ACLU piece on private prisons (including a lot on mass incarceration etc. as well) is pretty instructive

http://tinyurl.com/l8jan27

As the ACLU concedes the studies have produced some very mixed data

[PapayaSF]

If the contractor running the prison is doing a bad job, they can be fired. This cannot happen with a state-run system.

[The artist known Dunphy]

Right .

Because wardens have never been fired

God, the reason ignorati are fucking crowning recently

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Moron.

[The artist known Dunphy]

Smooches!

[PapayaSF]

Yeah, OK, wardens have been fired, but "get rid of the guy at the top" is not always effective at getting a bureaucracy to work well. My point is that if the prison system is run by civil servants, the legislature and governor have far fewer options than if it's contracted out to one of several companies that all want the business.

[Rev-Match]

I appreciate the input. My main issue is that they cite some judge "lining his pockets" by sending people to private prisons. I do not know how to respond to this because I do not know how it is possible.

[Derpetologist]

The whole legal system lines its pockets via the War on Drugs. Do they know about asset forfeiture?

[Rev-Match]

They sent me an article in an email, which I responded to by making direct responses to quotes from said article. The War on Drugs and Asset Forfeiture were referenced in my responses.

[The artist known Dunphy]

There was a case recently where iirc a judge was actually indicted after it was found out he was purposefully sending juvies away for long sentences at a private prison that had bribed him to do so

Pretty sure it was reported here in h&r

IMO, it was practically death penalty worthy, just pure evil no equivocation needed

[Cyto]

Kids for cash

[Trouser-Pod]

Boy, if they're worried about kick-backs and political "donations" from the prison companies, I hope to God they don't ever find out about police unions, and the like.

[Rev-Match]

Good point. I may just need to research specific examples.

[Trouser-Pod]

Well, do they have any specific examples? I mean, bottom line, if it's just about possibilities, at least companies can be fired and /or come and go. Government is here to stay, baby, and, besides, is a vote as powerful as $?

[The artist known Dunphy]

Again, see the above example or the ACLU report

Private prisons are a mixed bag IMO and need more studies

Of course many people will knee-jerk and automatically support them if they come from a free market perspective which is of course stupid when you can actually look at data first

I'm agnostic thus far. Clearly there are different incentive structures etc. and the issues are way more nuanced than most on either side will admit

Props to the ACLU for admitting that the studies do conflict to some extent and the jury is still widely out

[PapayaSF]

Yes, the lining of pockets thing has happened, but with civil servants, the same thing almost always happens in a different form: the state employee unions want something, the politicians give it to them, and the unions donate to those politicians. All very cozy.

[MJGreen]

This is pretty much your point, but if you haven't read this it may help you strengthen your argument.

[PapayaSF]

Well, that's a good distinction between privatization and contracting out. And it's true that the latter is no guarantee that things will be done well, or that they should be done at all. Yet, what is the guarantee that civil servants will do things right? I'd say it's no greater. There's still the inherent flexibility issue I mentioned about.

[PapayaSF]

*mentioned above.

[Rhywun]

Where do they come up with these commercials?!

[Fist of Etiquette]

They're trolling for tips? So they don't have a research staff anymore?

[Fist of Etiquette]

If only California would lead the way into the Pacific and give Nevada a chance at oceanfront property.

[PapayaSF]

Hey!

[Fist of Etiquette]

You had your chance.

[Cdr Lytton]

PapayaLV is standing by in Otisburg.

[gaijin]

We are a nation of cowards when it comes to discussions of plastic bags!

[Fist of Etiquette]

A hot dog is a sandwich.

[Rhywun]

Fine. They are still disgusting.

[gaoxiaen]

Especially here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKy_gLPZFzE

[GILMORE]

And the salmonella and the botulism and the bacterials GLAVIN?!

[Rev-Match]

"Progressive" Idea: ban or put a tax on grocery bags.

Because increasing the expense of groceries to the poor is good for everyone.

(P.s. Anyone with two brain cells to rub together can find a secondary use for a paper OR plastic bag. See: covering a textbook or cleaning the cat box.)

[gaijin]

increasing the expense of groceries to the poor is good for everyone.

Well, they want them all dead anyway, so why not do it slowly.

[GILMORE]

The correct answer to "Is a hot dog a sandwich?" is FUCK YOU

[Fist of Etiquette]

If you put it in water and it sinks then it's a sandwich.

[Fist of Etiquette]

No wait, if it floats it's a sandwich.

[Rhywun]

Either way - burn it.

[Francisco d'Anconia]

What also floats in water?

[Heroic Mulatto]

Fat people?

[GILMORE]

I have a doctorate in slopification

[Jesus H. Christ]

A taco is NOT a sammitch. Neither is a hot dog.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Never would I thought that the semantics of "sandwich" would be debated so earnestly. Not even linguistics journals are that nerdy.

[PapayaSF]

So an open-face sandwich is not a sandwich, Matt?

[Fist of Etiquette]

IF IT'S MEAT IN A BUN IT'S A SANDWICH.

[Jesus H. Christ]

Sorry, if it's meat in "roll" it's a sammitch. If it's in a bun, then no, not a sandwich.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I don't agree with that.

[Jesus H. Christ]

Looks yummy, even if it's improperly named.

[Heroic Mulatto]

What would you call that? An Italian hot dog?

[Jesus H. Christ]

BTW, I grew up referring to italian sausage sandwiches (using a sourdough roll) as "grinders". One of the best things of having leftover marinara as a kid was the knowledge that grinders would make an appearance in a day or so.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I see. Here in New England, "grinder" is what we call any submarine sandwich.

[Derpetologist]

"I'm sick of eating hoagies. I want a grinder, a sub, a foot-long hero. I want to LIVE, Marge. Won't you let me live? Won't you, please?"

[Francisco d'Anconia]

What about Wonderbread?

[Rufus J. Firefly]

A sandwich isn't a sandwich until you fuck it in all the open holes it claims to want closed.

There.

Happy?

[Rufus J. Firefly]

And it's pronounced 'sangwich.'

Filisteins.

[Jesus H. Christ]

"With a reverse mortgage, you get to experience the priceless look on the faces of those little parasites you call family when they find out there's no house in their inheritance!"

[gaijin]

Suderman deserves his own attire review

[Rhywun]

His tie is crooked. That's all I've got.

[Sevo]

His shoelace is untied, too.

[Fist of Etiquette]

HOLY SHIT SUDERMAN EASE BACK ON THE STICK.

[GILMORE]

LOUDER PETER

[BigT]

Sandwich:

Christina Hendricks
Me
Sofia Vergara

[gaijin]

sausage hot dog.

[gaijin]

argh! why does reason not allow the greater than sign (alt62)?!

[Heroic Mulatto]

I am extremely interested in this subject and would like further updates as to advances in this field.

[Trouser-Pod]

+4 tits

[Agile Cyborg]

Poor Sofia.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Obama lied, everyone hide!

[Fist of Etiquette]

Suderman crams three segments top-of-the-show worth of information into one below-the-fold segment.

[Derpetologist]

Classic derp: A prog once told me that libertarians are responsible for the War on Drugs because they support private prisons. I told him the War on Drugs came first and that most drugs offenders are in government prisons. I then asked him if he believed wet streets cause rain.

More. On.

[GILMORE]

Bonus:

- the S?dermensch: Holy Grownup Clothes? Peter brings "Mad Men"-level suiting skills tonight, apparently discovering how things like collar, lapels, and shoulders can combine together in a complementary way. We've nitpicked Peter to death in the past, particularly over problems with his jackets gapping horribly around his neck, and the way his shirt/jacket combos made him look like a Bobblehead. This finally dials everything in and he needs nothing but a martini and a moll to look like he's ready to close the deal. A+

[gaijin]

nice!

[Fist of Etiquette]

I disagree.

[GILMORE]

WHO DARES CHALLENGE THE WORD OF THE GREAT AND POWERFUL....

well, what?

I thought his suit looked great.

[Fist of Etiquette]

It was all over him like a, um, well, you know.

[The artist known Dunphy]

IMO, the whole Mad Men phenomenon has inspired many to seek suits and god forbid 'fashion' that are more like costumes than a suit should be

True style is largely timeless. The whole mad men costume Schtick is not

Of course one thing that mad men gets correct is of course that nothing is more important in looking good than proper fit

Sadly, on the whole American men wear awfully tailored suits

You are way better off spending $250 On a cheap fused suit and paying a tailor to get it fitting you right than in many cases wearing a $3000 suit that is poorly fitted

Take any man and tailor a well fitted suit and hopefully shirt to him and you will have a convert for life

You don't have to go bespoke, but just get a well tailored suit

Granted the ultimate is to go bespoke on both suit and shirt

Stay away from Mad Men faddishness

If you can't afford bespoke go custom and if you can't afford that just go OTR and then pay a tailor to do his magic

Again, you are better off in a well tailored cheap fused suit than any other option that doesn't fit properly

There are a few things in this world I feel more strongly about

[GILMORE]

you could just say, "get suits tailored" and i think the point would be clear.

[The artist known Dunphy]

Basically

I'd actually say get a bespoke suit but if that is too much than get your suit however purchased properly tailored

[GILMORE]

I guess you need a good suit for those IAD investigations

[The artist known Dunphy]

For all sorts of business, but most importantly for court.

[The artist known Dunphy]

Just to add to this, getting Turnbull and Asser bespoke shirts is EASILY worth a few hundred per shirt - again assuming one can afford it.

I'm not advocating living beyond ones means

[GILMORE]

How do you keep the drool off your clothes?

[The artist known Dunphy]

Ironically that's what ties were originally for

They were to keep food off one's shirt and eventually became a fashion item themselves

[BigT]

My suits all fit until I started pumping iron and Morgan Fairchild.

[The artist known Dunphy]

Most bodybuilders I know have to buy suit separates if they go OTR

If you are a platform athlete you either have two different sets of suits and shirts

One set for training build
One set for competition build
Or you are a little more reasonable and just get your stuff for your training build and accept that it will be a little loose in competition phase.

I tend to walk around about 14 to 16 lbs over competition weight

[Derpetologist]

Do you normally smear yourself with chum and jump into shark-infested waters or are you trying to start a trend?

[The artist known Dunphy]

Sharks?

Brah, sharks are my aumakua. I gladly swim with them and god knows I was whether I knew it or not when surfing la perouse or hole in the head.

Sharks are apex predators and about as perfect an evolutionary result as one could hope for.

I am not chumming sharks. I am feeding platypi, silly mostly harmless animals that prove God has a sense of humour or was just hung over as fuck

Hth

[Derpetologist]

I'll say this much for Dunphy- he's never made anyone feel stupid.

[The artist known Dunphy]

Lol

That's what's so sad about it

The crazy are the most insistent they are sane and the ignorant, those who know not and know not that they know not iow the fools here will never heal themselves because they are never open to facts or ideas that upset their prejudices, that cloud of comforting convictions surrounding them as clouds on a summer day

They will continue to be men living lives of quiet desperation and when their personal encounters sour they will always fail to understand why

I have nothing but love and pity for them

Hth

[Francisco d'Anconia]

I have nothing but contempt for you.

[The artist known Dunphy]

I have nothing but love and smooches for you!

Here's another - smooches!

[gaoxiaen]

Don't lump us all together. I, for one, appreciate the input of an LEO here.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Look who thinks he's Peter Suderman. Slow down, Foster, you don't have the coke in your system to talk at this pace.

[Derpetologist]

Reason can't gif the "remain calm" scene? Cheapskates.

[BigT]

Remember the last man asked to die in Iraq-istan?

Not last anymore!

[Derpetologist]

Some commenter pointed out that in a few years, there will soldiers over there who weren't even born when the 9/11 attacks happened.

[Jesus H. Christ]

Hey, if the Palestinians can eagerly sacrifice their children to pointless wars fought over slights that should be long forgotten, why can't the US?

[Fist of Etiquette]

AH! Lou Dobbs.

[GILMORE]

hominahominahominahomina Dobbs!

[Fist of Etiquette]

FLAKE IS TOTALLY CUT.

[GILMORE]

Is that her barney frank?

[GILMORE]

Weirdest place I've ever been?

- Lost in a salt mine in Poland.

not just any salt mine, but the *best* one.

But we actually got genuinely lost. as in, snuck away from tour, and got lost in freezing rock tunnels

[BigT]

Cold? Must have been shallow.

I was 1600 meters down in a platinum mine in S Africa. Whole thing was A/C because the ambient T was 53C. And we had to wear jumpsuits over our clothes. Sweaty.

[gaoxiaen]

I got lost on a mountaintop covered with cloud forest near Luang Prabang, Laos and couldn't find my way down. I kept getting stuck on hanging cliffs. Had to camp out with no water.

[Fist of Etiquette]

What the hell is Frozen?

[Derpetologist]

Jan Helfeld actually gets a prog to change his mind about climate change:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLosWL7J2oQ

[Agile Cyborg]

"Gotta clean some damn mouth, bitches!"

[GILMORE]

Chris Moody was like, "I LIKE TO DRESS UP AS ROBIN! FROM BATMAN, YOU KNOW!?"

[GILMORE]

No cutoff

drat