Tonight on The Independents: Tierney vs. Bolton in a Battle of the Johns, ISIL vs. the U.S., Gene Healy vs. Militarization, Killer Mike on Ferguson, Plastic-Bag Bans, Reclining Airplane Seats, the Worst Driving Cities, Plus After-show!
The whole point of doing television, really, is to create situations in which New York Times science writer and friend of Reason John Tierney gets to go toe-to-toe with the likes of former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton. On tonight's live episode of The Independents (Fox Business Network, 9 p.m. ET, 6 p.m. PT, with re-airs three hours later) this Battle of the Johns will form our Party Panel, duking it out over:
* News that an American citizen named Douglas McAuthur McCain (!) from San Diego was killed over the weekend while fighting for the Islamic State (ISIL).
* President Barack Obama's speech at the American Legion.
* A new inspector general report about the mess in the Veterans Administration.
* The morality (and threat assessment) of reclining your seat on airplanes.
* California's proposed ban on plastic bags.
Also on the show: Michael Weiss of The Interpreter discusses the latest developments with ISIL (including its level of threat to the U.S.). Cato Vice President (and Reason.com columnist) Gene Healy will talk about the political fight over police militarization, including Congressional Black Caucus calls for a federal police czar. The co-hosts will break down a new Allstate study of the worst drivers in America, and, obviously, the rapper Killer Mike will come on to talk about Ferguson.
Online-only aftershow begins at foxbusiness.com/independents just after 10. Follow The Independents on Facebook at facebook.com/IndependentsFBN, follow on Twitter @ independentsFBN, and click on this page for more video of past segments.
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First?
It's so lonely here.
Here, have a joke:
http://www.gdargaud.net/Humor/Pics/Hammered.jpg
Sacrilege!
I've sworn off < i The Independents.
Yet, here you are.
Hello.
SPOILER
Boston takes the second to last place, and Worcester takes last.
I am shocked.
a new Allstate study
SO the independents are good hands people?
Asian women?
So... it's a ranking of the country's most amicable driving conditions.
Singapore is much worse than anywhere in the US (and most of Asia as well).
Duty, honor, caliphate....Those three hallowed words reverently dictate what you ought to be, what you can be, what you will be.
/Douglas McAuthur McCain
You need to mix up a McCain quote in there. Like "I hate the Gooks Mun?fiq?n. I will hate them as long as I live*."
Something like that.
*Yes, he actually said that.
Like this?
"Duty, honor, caliphate...Stand with our Caliph and fight. We're Muslims. We'll never surrender. They will. This is what you are, what you ought to be, what you will be."
/Douglas McAuthur MCCAIN
He also needs a daughter with a large chest.
"President Barack Obama's speech"
Obama doesn't do speeches.
He does soliloquies, Matt.
Me me, me me me me, that is the question
Whether 'tis better for me to me me me...
This moveon.org petition about how evil Burger King is for their tax inversion is the funniest thing I've ever read.
When I read comments like this, all I can think is 'Mom! Why won't the cool kids play with me? Is it because I smell bad?'
??? So Burger King is going on welfare, apparently. Didn't know they let corporations do that in Canada.
That'll show them!
*takes off glove, smacks burger king in face, challenges to pistols at dawn*
Make the your minimum higher wage from Canada.
Definition of criminal: Anything which makes me sad
English make language no good in comments moveon.org
Thank you.
They keep out-retarding each other.
I call that a "Tard-Off".
Don't re-locate your offices to Canada to avoid paying your share of American taxes.
How soon before these types are advocating the holding of companies in the country by force? Because "economic patriotism", or something.
Schumer already is
Next step, invade Canada for sheltering US tax evaders.
They are. All they haven't done yet is propose making the law change be retroactive.
well 2073 retards can't be wrong...
You missed the best one:
Jesus Christ, that's fucking hilarious.
Someone posted a link about a child abuse gang in the UK. More on that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbpAXRfbE-A
"California's proposed ban on plastic bags."
I don't live in California, but to those who do, have you ever seen or heard a television or radio advertisement simply urging people not to use plastic bags? I've heard of many legislative proposals to use state coercion to bar their use, but I can't recall a single such ad trying non-coercive persuasion. I'll happily stand corrected if someone can note otherwise.
Never. But why would the State want to persuade us when they can rape us instead?
Since Jesse is lonely, I thought I would share pearls of wisdom from Louis Farrakhan.
A government conspiracy to kill black kids? Well, at least F isn't being a blind partisan for Obama!
Why is he wearing a 70's prom tux?
Maybe he's got the funk?
That's not the funk;this is the funk.
Damn. Now that is funky.
So get yo ass on the Mothership!
What did I jut watch?
Louis Farrakhan White Devils.
Looey has opinions. This one is, to be fair, kinda old.
Guess which celebrity Ayatollah Khomeini looks like:
https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/1068724480/hBECCF929/
I.... i.....
My world is shattered.
Although I guess that explains Connery's opinions towards women
(including its level of threat to the U.S.)
I'm guessing that this means the threat to individual Americans rather than to the nation. Because ISIL isn't taking out the USA unless they get more help from the US Congress.
ACLJ would have you believe that we're all about to die and the terrorists will be flying their flag over the Capitol
You've heard of Jews for Jesus, but did you know there are Sikhs for Hinduism?
http://www.info-sikh.com/PageRSS1.html
"News that an American citizen named Douglas McAuthur McCain (!) from San Diego was killed over the weekend while fighting for the Islamic State (ISIL)."
Another "Gentle Giant" bites the dust.
"He shall not return."
Nice.
An inspirational message:
http://platedlizard.blogspot.c.....agine.html
You added a picture of crazy-hair alien guy. That was a nice touch.
Hey, I've seen an elephant up close and it's waaayyyyy bigger than that little moon up in the sky.
Let the best John win.
After 10+ years of watching the Iraq war, and the geniuses who considered it *a good idea as part of a larger middle-east strategy*.... I sincerely hope Tierney has actually thought of some decent prods to Bolton that will force him to acknowledge errors in conception, execution, and in basic premises about 'democratisation via "light-footprint" invasion'.
Too many people go for the easy "I told you so", and just say, GAHH!! BOOOSH!! OIL!!! and don't actually remember that "the plan" with Iraq was to 'release a wave of pent-up desire for democracy' in the middle east... not just 'get rid of saddam'.
Its only been in the post-iraq phase (that year was fun!) where the Architects of the Iraq war have moved the goalposts to say that the effort was simply to 'oust saddam' and remove that threat. They pretend they achieved their 'limited goal', and everything since is 'someone elses fault'.
...when in fact, the current mess all across the region is partly what the Neocons said they *wanted*. Stir up the pot in the middle east, and let a thousand flowers bloom. The removal of Saddam, Assad, Gaddafi are all goals that Bolton would have said would/will lead to 'greater stability'.
It is beholden on people like Bolton to rationalize the status quo vs the thinking that DESIRED a power-vacuum in Iraq, and has since put the US in the position of endless war in the region, most likely *to the ultimate benefit of Iran and Syria*.
C'mon. Persia needs fair ups for Thermopylae.
So Iran is going to nuke the Greeks?
Those lies are easily exposed. The way the Coalition Provisional Authority busted up the Iraqi system and scattered, smothered, and chunked it shows that their intentions were to breed instability. A whole slew of old hat experts were telling them straight to their faces repeatedly that what they were doing would completely destabilize the country and possibly the region. They just ignored them and carried on stirring shit up between the Sunnis and Shia.
"...shows that their intentions were to breed instability"
You'd think so, but no.
No, they spent a decade+ explaining in advance how this was all going to work out great. The even wrote it all down and stuff.
1994 Cheney was right about Iraq. I always wanted to understand what caused his total change of opinion.
The PNAC didn't have detailed plans of how to politically reshape Iraq after deposing Saddam. They thought they would have some puppet dictator (Chalabi) installed "democratically" and then that would be that, maybe a few loose ends to tie up. Well, that was a no-go right out of the gate and so their plan B, so it seems, was to completely dismantle the Iraqi government.
You're being reductive - PNAC only came into being in the late 1990s and did not re-do all the policy research proposals that
The actual lead up all throughout the 1990s had neocon intellectuals proposing the 'post-saddam' middle eastern scenarios, many of which were formulated by Paul Wolfowitz in 1989-1993 when he undersecretary of defense for Bush I.
The thinking went back over a decade. Chalabi was nothing but a placeholder for what they thought would be an emergent polity of anti-saddam locals who'd be happy to 'take over'.
You seem to be trying to backtrack 'rationale' from events rather than look at everything that lead the decision-making up to the invasion.
1st sentence - '....that preceded their recommendations.'
+1 greeting us with flowers
Also =
I think the rapper, rather than comment on 'ferguson' (why does rapping qualify anyone to talk... forget it)... explain the appeal of "Jihad" to other unsuccessful* rappers like himself.
(*because WTF is he doing on this show)
I find it interesting that there are plenty of musicians who lecture on politics but none who lecture on physics.
I think there are plenty of musicians who lecture on physics...they just happen to be physicists!
And of course, there are plenty of physicists who lecture on politics.
Some are even astrophysists.
damn you
+1 Flash
"Derpetologist|8.26.14 @ 8:42PM|#
I find it interesting that there are plenty of musicians who lecture on politics but none who lecture on physics.
Actually, Brian May - lead guitarist for Queen - ...completed a PhD thesis in astrophysics,[97] entitled A Survey of Radial Velocities in the Zodiacal Dust Cloud,...
He is co-author, with Sir Patrick Moore and Chris Lintott, of Bang! ? The Complete History of the Universe (published in 2006)[102] and "The Cosmic Tourist" (published in 2012)."
Yeah, but he doesn't lecture his fans on it and there's nothing about science in his songs- unless you think "Princes of the Universe" is about astronomy.
On a side note, I would like to bemoan the total lack of hit songs about sea monsters.
Yeah, but Flash Gordon
Doesn't Insane Clown Posse count, for their lectures on magnetism?
Fuckin' magnetism, how did they explain how it works?
TX Pastor Files Complaints About Vampire Books
"Pastor Phillip Missick of King of Saints Tabernacle, a Messianic church, filed a complaint with Austin Memorial Library, Cleveland's public library, asking that many fiction books on vampires, demons and the supernatural be purged. He says he was stunned to find the young adult section full of books like 'Blood Promise,' 'Twilight,' and the "Vampire Knight" series.
'This is dark. There's a sexual element. You have creatures that aren't human. I think it's dangerous for our kids' said Missick.
http://abc13.com/religion/past.....ed/275930/
They're "my" kids, not "our" kids. Thanks anyway, Pastor Asshole.
Okay, this is kinda adorable, if you like adorable puppies.
http://rlv.zcache.com/dog_in_a.....g=0xffffff
I will repeat a sentiment I shared a few months ago:
http://reason.com/blog/2014/03.....nt_4375535
Oh no! Our strongman was overthrown! No worries- we'll just pay the dictator next door to fight the new guy.
Oh no! The dictator is bankrupt! No worries- we'll just tell him it's OK to invade Kuwait.
Oh no! He actually invaded and now we have to fight him. No worries- we'll just tell the Kurds and Shiites to rebel.
Oh no! He slaughtered the rebels and is stronger than ever. No worries- we'll just sanction him and bomb him once in a while.
Oh no! We need to invade again so he doesn't help terrorists. No worries- it'll be a walk in the park.
Oh no! They've taken to guerilla warfare and they're pretty good at it.
No worries- once they have elections, the new government will restore order.
Oh no! The country is hopelessly split into factions and they're having a civil war.
What's with all the ancient history? Next you'll bring up Mossadegh
Reminds of the time O'Reilly hushed Ron Paul for giving a history lecture:
http://youtu.be/gZyxnctMims?t=2m39s
History is for losers and nerds
And guys who've glommed on to "Killing so and so" books.
Questions About Story of Tenn. Teen Allegedly Suspended for Saying Bless You
"So I called up Principal Peggy Dodds just a little while ago and got her side of the story before shit hits the fan in the conservative world.
According to Dodds, Turner was not given an in-school suspension. She wasn't sent out of the classroom, either ? she chose to walk out. And, most importantly, she wasn't punished by the teacher for saying 'God bless you' ? however, the teacher did admonish her for 'disrupting the classroom.'"
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/f.....z3BY5k9fFr
Teacher, then, is still an idiot for claiming a 'bless you' disrupts anything.
Not that I care either way at the moment. I mean, what difference does it make at this time?
Prediction: Black.
Kennedy looks fruity.
He's a loser.
Next.
Oh, Bolton, come back for more, eh?
Does Tierney cancel out Bolton? Or vice versa?
Kennedy starts interrupting again?
WHy is Kennedy surprised that middle class people would be attracted to ISIL? Economic class certainly didn't define hte 911 hijackers...except that they were not poor people.
Bill Ayers was middle class. I think Lenin was, too.
Ditto for Che & Castro. Actually, they were near-rich.
yep...thus the middle class must be destroyed...for the children. 🙂
Very poor people are too busy trying to stay alive to waste any time with other causes.
Bolton's brilliant plan: Just Kill People
He has to destroy the village to save it
He didn't say it was a new plan.
Some people just need killin'.
I propose another increase in funding for veterans care.
Just throw money at it, you pinheads!
"I sure hope my opponents don't politicize this issue by supporting vouchers for veterans."
They're much nicer to Bolton. I mean, by comparison to before.
Well, he just came out as a "hawkish" libertarian.
Say what? I'm not watching so pardon my disbelief.
Basically it went down like this:
Bolton: I am a hawkish libertarian.
Kennedy and Kmele: There's no such thing!
Bolton: Yes, there is.
*commercial break*
Somebody is betting on a Rand Paul nomination.
Yeah, I got that before, both on here and Red Eye.
I think they want him to come back on...and he wants a gig in case this libertarian thing gets big.
I'm not sure what terrorist attacks on the United States buys them, other than actual American retaliation.
I'm not sure that a lot of people in those kinds of organizations appreciate what that really means.
They have a belief in western weakness, but the SouthPark episode where Cartman goes back to the founding fathers kind of ties in the two headed capability of the US people.
We do still have the capability to turn the region into a glassy parking lot. A bad enough attack would likely move the current 'Libertarian Moment' into an after-thought if a majority of the US is out for blood.
"We can agree to disagree as long as we all agree that America kicks ass."
? AmeeeeriKuh....Fuck Yeaaaah!
Ooh, a PhD in Islamic studies.
"And what do you intend to do with this degree?"
"I'll appoint myself Caliph."
"Ha ha, that's a good one!"
PhD...hah...one can only imagine the heresies that must be committed in challenging and defending a thesis presentation.
Mohammed pictionary
I am stealing this idea.
Well, an armed American public does help forestall a single Islamist with a gun.
If things go south...
Things are going south like Sherman.
Oh, we're *all* going to meet the one who refers to "the least of these."
The Independents Attire Review, 26 August 2014
Krakatoa-Edition
- Kennedalia: Its the orange patterned-thing that evokes something between 'Christmas' and 'Pocahantas'. We've been pretty neutral on it; our main complaint is that whatever it *is*, its 'incomplete' because all the TV broadcasts is 'tits up'; we're not really privy to the 'whole thing', and therefore its sort of badly employed as a TV-Host presentation.
- Matt: Hey! after many instances of pointing out that the Pink should give it a go with his Navy suit, he finally gives it up... and its OK. We think it still rolls hotter with the Tie That Likes Pink, but this isn't bad at all. What would be *ideal* would be a light purple/lilac tie, which is also a pretty banging tie-shade in general (particularly with grey, like...)
- Kmele: We've never seen him do the "light grey w/maroon" and its a classic match. Grey is our #2 favorite jacket-color next to the Khaki, and the things we like best with it are the Maroon first, then Navy combos, with the 'multiple shades of charcoal/grey & brown' tie running a close third. This actually leads us to note = someone on the show should wear a Royal Horse Guard Regimental Stripe tie at some point - its a great look, and works with a variety of suits/jackets.
Matur nuwun
Where does all this come from? Honest question. I wake up too tired to deal with my day job, let alone much extracurricular to my couple of classes, yet here you are, an unpaid and unrecognized fashion blogger, wringing a couple hundred words from (to my eyes) the utterly unremarkable couture of some trio of cable personalities several nights a week. What gives? And where can I get some?
'Sup Khalil!!
(*Kmele gets this a lot)
At the risk of sounding like anonbot, wow, this rapper is making a whole lotta sense!
yup
"If it can happen to Mike Brown, it can happen to anyone."
Haha, no. It can happen to anyone who fights with a cop, but that's rather different.
Well, we don't know that that is what happened here.
There is agreement that there was a tussle at the car door.
Execution at 35' is clearly the remedy.
The 35 feet thing has not been established.
Police are the ones who are in greater danger?
Wah?
I *think* he's saying the cops endanger themselves by their confrontational attitude.
They don't even make the top ten (statistically) most dangerous jobs.
Then they should get rid of some cop shows a give us a show about those brave boys in brown- garbage men.
In the municipal sanitation system, the garbage is collected by two separate yet equally important groups: the trash men , who dump the cans; and the drivers, who handle the truck. These are their stories.
Well it's not like it's danger danger
Oh my God?
Police are in danger of getting sent on paid vacation.
I want my Constitutional rights recognized by the police.
I want a weekend alone with Jessica Alba, but some things just aren't in the cards.
Khalil... again.
*sigh*
He has a Stephen King monkey?
Seems appropriate since King uses a slave army of monkeys with typewriters to write his books.
I read about this time some zoo keepers decided test the monkey-typewriter theory. They used keyboards instead. In the first pen, all the monkeys were afraid of it. The alpha monkey cautiously approached it, picked up, and examined it. Then, he threw it on the ground, pissed on it, and smashed it with a rock.
In the other pen, one monkey actually typed. He produced an 8-page document consisting solely of the letter S.
"The alpha monkey cautiously approached it, picked up, and examined it. Then, he threw it on the ground, pissed on it, and smashed it with a rock."
That's also how Hemingway worked.
*polite applause*
DONT BLAME THE BEER!!
I think Kennedy has built up a tolerance to rohypnol
It was originally designed to get her to pause for a second so someone else could talk
By her husband.
I bought all the Alaskan Amber in Kenosha one time- 90 beers. It's my brother's favorite and he can't get it where he is. He lives behind the Wal-Mart in Ozark, Alabama.
A year later, I cleaned out all the Alaskan Amber at Woodman's for the same reason.
its that good?
That raises a question (which has come up before)...
What is the best *cheap* beer in America?
And I don't mean 'supercheap' (where people debate the relative merits of Natty Bo to Labatt Blue)... but, 'not fancy ass micro-snob' stuff.
I'd say "Gerst" from Nashville (which used to be $4-5 for 6)...but i don't know if it still exists.
I think Yuengling probably is a deserving contender.
Hmmm.
Let me consult my notes:
http://platedlizard.blogspot.c.....ument.html
I'll go with Sierra Nevada or Shiner.
Sierra is 'expensive' most places.
Is it cheapish in ... wherever its from?
shiner i agree on. Thats Texas, right? We used to get cheap cases of that in Tennessee.
Shiner or the late, lamented Rhinelander (circa 1989).
You are right, the answer is Yuengling.
He lives behind the Wal-Mart in Ozark, Alabama.
In a dumpster?
No, I just enjoy pointing that out since he hates the South & Wal-Mart.
I had been at a new job for about a month when the boss/owner offered to let me drive his new truck. I get back about 5:30 with the bed two-deep full of $6.99 Negro Modelo 12 packs. As I'm pulling in he's greeting people important enough that he changed into a suit. Akward.
Is Ozark the town on 231 with two Walmarts almost next to each other?
Yep.
Sleepy time
We can move beyond that...
The Government: Here to help move you on to things that the government wants you to move on to.
My airline is nothing but hammocks.
I buy the plastic bags.
Doing anything else is barbaric.
Kennedy flies private charter.
Or travels naked on a donkey.
Mo Money County, mo problems.
Bolton.
Foster.
Big Ballers.
I thought police czars are called Ministers of Internal Security, or Ministries of Love.
Children belong in the baggage hold.
I can't remember the last time there was a 2 minutes of hate.
Thank your lucky czars. He comes prepared.
Booya! Joke of the night.
The CBC is all about big brother coming in and doing what they can't or won't do for themselves.
And (as Reason points out) they voted to continue federal military giveaways to local police departments like Ferguson's.
What have they done, constructively, for the cause they claim to represent?
Perpetuate it, thus perpetuating the need for the CBC?
She used up all of Healy's time with a commercial for Friday's show!
Throw a czar at it?
An argument for balliste.
I believe Massachusetts has the most expensive car insurance. Try driving in Boston to see why.
Massholes.
DC has an excuse. They're the most important people in the world.
DC has an excuse the most self-important people in the world.
AH! Lou Dobbs.
The important thing is to be FROM THERE.
eeek. Dobbs
I declare this aftershow stillborn.
Enjoy this musical interlude instead.
So...
"The Live Stream will begin soon"
Have you tried saw palmetto? it helps with the prostate.
Yeah, I guess not on the aftershow...
I thought the stream just didn't like me.
Well, that was a hell of an aftershow....
Oreo.
Wait, the stream is showing for some people?
I caught the tail end....yes.
This is what they do when Matt and Kmele get into knife fights.
it happens! more often than you think. matt's partial to the stilleto, while Kmele is more a karambit-style fighter.
Sounds like a prett y solid plan dude. Wow.
http://www.AnonCrypt.tk
President Barack Obama's speech at the American Legion.
The link to the speech is above. The length is 38 minutes. I listened to the first 2 minutes and then clicked again ahead to the 36 minute mark. He is still speaking. He really does speak for 38 minutes at a time. Some snarking hacker should put the Gettysburg Address on his teleprompter just to see how long it takes for him to read it.
Eh, they should be used to it.
My experience says that the higher ranks *love* to hear themselves talk. Usually it goes like this just before a major holiday,
Get into formation and wait 10 minutes for the senior command to show up.
Then the SEL (CMC/SgtMJR) talks for 10 minutes.
Then the XO gets up and talks for 15
Then the CO gets up and talks for 20
Then you break and reform by department.
While waiting for the DH to show up you get to listen to your LPO, LCP, and DivO go on and on.
Then the Dept LCPO has to give his two cents.
Then the Department Head.
By this point you're just so fucking exhausted form listening to these people drone on that you don't even want to do anything.
Kinda like this post.
Term of the day: OOBOOs (offended on behalf of others).
Congressional Black Caucus calls for a federal police czar.
*facepalm*
Dude makes a ll kinds of sense dude. Wow.
http://www.CryptAnon.tk