The Volokh Conspiracy
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Breaking: Supreme Court Allows Slim Pathway to Challenge Texas S.B. 8
The private litigation against some defendants may proceed, but the federal lawsuit is gone.
In an unusual December Friday morning decision hand-down, the Supreme Court has decided the two cases concerning challenges to the S.B. 8, the controversial Texas abortion law that created a somewhat novel private enforcement scheme so as to frustrate judicial review.
First, in Whole Women's Health v. Jackson, the Court concluded that abortion providers may maintain a pre-enforcement challenge to S.B. 8 against state licensing board officials, but not against other state officials, judges or clerks. The decision to allow suit against the licensing officials was 8-1. The decision to preclude suit against the Attorney General and court clerks was 5-4.
Justice Gorsuch delivered the opinion for the Court, authoring a majority opinion dismissing the claims against most of the defendants and a plurality opinion allowing suit against the licensing officials. He was joined in full by Justices Alito, Kavanaugh and Barrett, and in part by Justice Thomas.
Justice Thomas wrote an opinion concurring in part and dissenting in part, arguing that the suit should be dismissed as against all defendants. The Chief Justice wrote an opinion concurring in the judgment in part and dissenting in part, joined by the Court's liberal justices. The Chief would have allowed the suit to proceed against the state AG and a state court clerk. Justice Sotomayor also wrote an opinion concurring in the judgment in part and dissenting in part, joined by Justices Breyer and Kagan.
There is a decent amount of back and forth between the opinions, which may explain why it took so long for these decisions to issue.
In United States v. Texas, the Court dismissed the writ of certiorari as improvidently granted (what is often referred to as a DIG). Justice Sotomayor dissented from the DIG without opinion. This conclusion was presumably a consequence of the Court's resolution of the private case. Insofar as private suits may proceed, there is less need to allow the federal government to pursue claims in equity.
One quick reaction: The Court's disposition would seem to allow the abortion providers to challenge S.B. 8's substantive restrictions on abortion (at least until the Court decides Dobbs). However, because the court does not allow the abortion providers to maintain their suits against state judges or clerks, it does not seem that they are able to challenge S.B. 8's private enforcement regime.
I am confident my co-bloggers will have more to say about these decisions later today and in the days ahead.
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I think the fact that they allowed a path to challenge indicates that Roe / Casey is not getting overturned. There is a footnote about Casey. They may draw the line at the first trimester, SB8 is 8 weeks as I recall.
Keep on whistling past that graveyeard
https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/21pdf/21-463_3ebh.pdf
Abortions past 6 weeks are still effectively banned in Texas. There will be no "first trimester" protection.
Roe and Casey are toast. By the time any of the cases make it through a District Court, the decision in Dobbs will be out
Seems unlikely to me that they would allow lawsuits to go forward challenging SB8, if they were going to then pull the rug from under the challenge in Dobbs. If Roe/Casey were toast, they could just hold all three cases and release them together.
I don't think you can read the tea leaves that way. The legal issues in SB 8 are almost entirely procedural, and could encompass a lot more than abortion.
If it were a legislative body, sure, they'd take into account the practical effects of two pieces of legislation and if one erased the practical effects of the other leave it at that.
But the legal issues between Dobbs, and SB 8 are completely different, and the Supreme Court doesn't like tipping it's hand in any case.
SCOTUS has tipped their hand.
Texas is banning abortions at 6 weeks, and 5 members of SCOUTS are entirely unwilling to strike down that ban.
If SCOTUS was going to rule in Dobbs that 15 weeks is ok, by in the 1st trimester is not, then they'd find a way to block SB 8.
After all, we all know that Roe and Casey are utterly Constitutionally illegitimate, so if the 5 were willing to let any part of them stand, they'd have already established that they are willing to engaging in results oriented "Living Constitution" BS, so the would have made up a way to strike down SB 8.
Hand, tipped
Greg J,
There are only two outcomes in Dobbs (abortion bans allowed in the first trimester or not), so you may well predict the right one of those two. But your analysis is a scrambled hash parading as logic.
The Court sent the case back to the lower courts on an 8-1 vote with the lower court already having tipped its hand as to what it will do and, you can bet, the lower court will find SB 8 unconstitutional. The 8 who agreed to sent it back knew that the District Court would do as Roberts asked: "Given the ongoing chilling effect of the state law, the District Court should resolve this litigation and enter appropriate relief without delay."
I don't think the SC tipped its hand one way or the other. There are reasons to think 5 justices will rule in favor of Mississippi in Dobbs, but none of those actual reasons are your supposed reasons.
The shortest answer was provided in the Opinion of the Court in a single sentence: "the ultimate merits question—whether S. B. 8 is consistent with the Federal Constitution—is not before the Court."
Thus it is nonsense to say five Justices "are entirely unwilling to strike down that ban." Precisely zero Justices weighed in on that issue.
You try to avoid this result by saying anyone that would uphold Roe and Casey wouldn't stick to any principles, including limiting themselves to the issues before the Court. Just lol. Yours represents the worst sort of thinking and part of what got America where it is today.
You assume because someone has different principles than you do, they must have no principles. Because you think they have no principles, you think they'll do anything to achieve their desired ends. Because you think they'll do anything to achieve their desired ends, you think that, regrettably, you're going to have to violate your own principles to stop them. I think this chain of reasoning explains a significant part of how the GOP got taken over by a malignant narcissist who actually does lack any discernible principles beyond his own interests. Importantly, this has not caused his detractors to abandon all principle, but to rally together with the Liz Cheneys, Adam Kinzingers, and Brad Raffenspergers to uphold our deepest principles and commitment to fair process and doing one's duty despite it may sometimes be against our own interests.
Be better than the people who have utterly corrupted the GOP.
SC can affirm MS law and also uphold Roe/Casey if it sticks to a trimester framework. SB8 would be unconstitutional if applied in the first trimester, while MS 15 week ban would be upheld.
SPLITTING THE BABY (PRE)MID-TERM THROUGH GESTATION
There is still the matter of constitutional applications of SB8 as to post-viability abortions (now) or those done after whatever the new legal/nonlegal (or shall be say "state-proscribable") line will be. The federal and state district courts favor facial invalidation across the board and refuse (Pitman) or decline (Peeples) to give effect to severability provisions. That can't be right if validity hinges solely on the a federal right to abortion per current or soon-to-come SCOTUS precedent.
Also, if the pre-judgment writ grant is withdrawn (DIGged or whatever the Supreme Court Kommentariat calls it), doesn't that put it back before the Fifth to decide, including what to do with the three intervenors repped by Mitchell that want to invoke SB8 only for non-protected abortions? (nonprotected under current SCOTUS precedent, that is). What's illegal about their registered intent to bring such SB8 action that would justify putting a prior restrain on them so they can be held in contempt for exercising their right to petition the third branch? Note that they are currently properly before the USDC and don't enjoy sovereign immunity (unless, perhaps, they were to be deemed agents of the State of Texas; -- small-fry Paxton progeny in camouflage, if you will).
From the decision:
At the same time, eight Justices hold this case may proceed past the motion to dismiss stage against Mr. Carlton, Ms. Thomas, Ms. Benz, and Ms. Young, defendants with specific disciplinary authority over medical licensees, including the petitioners.
That's the thread you're hanging on to.
Now, do explain how telling the regulators that they can't pull anyone's license is going to stop private citizens from suing people.
I'll wait, because this should be really funny.
Roberts asked: "Given the ongoing chilling effect of the state law, the District Court should resolve this litigation and enter appropriate relief without delay."
And if the 5 members of the majority were the least bit bothered by that "chilling effect", then they would have protected women getting abortions from it.
They didn't.
Again, "stopping" the chilling effect wasn't before the Court in this decision other than allowing the suit to proceed, which they did (albeit to only some plaintiffs).
A ruling in litigation against the regulators which stays the law or strikes it down on the grounds that it is unconstitutional will have controlling, preclusive effect in any suits by private litigants. Laugh away. Your analysis is balderdash.
4 members of SCOTUS were ready to enjoin Clerks not to take any SB 8 cases.
If a 5th had joined them , that would have ended the "chilling effect."
Your analysis is balderdash
Greg J,
You have no idea what you are talking about. The issue of a stay/injunction wasn't directly at issue in today's decision. To the extent it was, all we know is an 8-1 majority is allowing the challenge to go forward with an almost certain stay and, eventually, permanent injunction by the District Court. If you insist on counting votes like that, then 8 Justices voted in favor of enjoining SB 8.
Of course, the better view is today's opinion didn't tell us anything new about how any of the Justices view Dobbs (and, by extension, Roe/Casey).
But you know this. You're just trolling.
You try to avoid this result by saying anyone that would uphold Roe and Casey wouldn't stick to any principles, including limiting themselves to the issues before the Court.
The issue before the Court was that Texas has effectively banned abortion after 6 weeks. 4 members of hte Supreme Court are desperately eager to stop that.
The other 5 are not.
Is it you position that the 4 who voted to stop that, and lost today, are all unprincipled monsters who refused to honor the principle of "limiting themselves to the issues before the Court"?
Cool! Something we can agree on!
Yours represents the worst sort of thinking and part of what got America where it is today.
What got America where it is today is left wing scum bags using the Supreme Court to force their personal political beliefs on the rest of us, in complete contravention of the US Constitution.
You assume because someone has different principles than you do, they must have no principles.
No, I think that people who act as if they have no principles are telling us the truth about themselves.
"Whatever my side wants is good, whatever the other side wants is bad" is not a principle
"The US Constitution is a written document that means what it was understood to mean when its various parts were adopted. When it grows out of synch with the desires of the American people, they will demonstrate that fact by Amending the US Constitution as described in Article V" is a principle. It is in reality the only principle about Constitutional interpretation that has any possible legitimacy.
Because every other "principle" boils down to "whatever my side wants is good, whatever teh orther side wants is bad".
Because you think they have no principles, you think they'll do anything to achieve their desired ends
Gosh, you mean like claiming that the ObamaCare individual mandate is a tax, not a mandate, and therefore Constitutional?
Despite the fact that the defenders and implementers of ObamaCare repeatedly insisted it was not a tax?
Gosh, you mean like claiming that the part of ObamaCare that said that subsidies only go to people who sign up on a State ObamaCare exchange meant that people who signed up on the Federal ObamaCare exchange got the subsidies, too?
Yes, I know that the 4 who voted against SB 8 have no principles, and will do anything to get their way, because they've repeatedly proved that.
Because you think they'll do anything to achieve their desired ends, you think that, regrettably, you're going to have to violate your own principles to stop them
Nope. I've not violated any of my principles by supporting SB 8.
I think this chain of reasoning explains a significant part of how the GOP got taken over by a malignant narcissist who actually does lack any discernible principles beyond his own interests.
Ah, so the people I disagree with are really principled, but the people YOU disagree with are not.
Got it.
Importantly, this has not caused his detractors to abandon all principle, but to rally together with the Liz Cheneys, Adam Kinzingers, and Brad Raffenspergers to uphold our deepest principles and commitment to fair process and doing one's duty despite it may sometimes be against our own interests.
You're so full of shit.
Be better than the people who have utterly corrupted the GOP.
I am, which is why I oppose the "Republicans" like Cheney who've spent decades screwing over Republican voters.
What you need to do is be than the people who have spent decades corrupting the US Constitution. But you're clearly happy with that corruption
I've come to the conclusion that I have no idea what you think is going on, so I've decided I'm ready to read some fan fiction.
What is it that you think is going to happen in TX, because of this case, between now and when Dobbs is decided?
I'll get the ball rolling:
1: The licensing defendants are all going to say (again) that they have no intention to do anything to abortion mills' licenses because of SB 8 until Dobbs is decided. District Court will enjoin them not to do anything, and they will comply
2: District Court may do a bunch of wanking. it might even get a ruling out before Dobbs comes out. But anything the District Court tries to do to obstruct private suits based on SB 8 will be shot down by the 5th Circuit.
3: SCOTUS will not reverse any 5th Circuit rulings blocking the District Court from trying to block private suits.
Or, IOW, the "chilling effect" will continue until Dobbs comes out and nukes Roe / Casey etc et al.
Your turn
Greg,
You definitely don't know what's going on.
1. District Court will enjoin the remaining defendants from enforcing SB 8 on the grounds SB 8 is unconstitutional.
2. The District Court won't do anything specifically regarding private litigants, because the ones named in this suit are dismissed. That you think otherwise is......weird.
3. The Fifth Circuit doesn't have a jurisdictional/procedural out, this time, and, given Roe/Casey, there are no grounds to vacate the District Court's stay this time. So, there will be pronouncements that, under current law, SB 8 is unconstitutional and, therefore, there can't be any liability unless until Roe/Casey is overturned or severely limited (because even if Mississippi's law is upheld, SB 8 could fail as it sets a much earlier ban).
So, I think providers will feel much more comfortable providing constitutionally-protected abortions. The chilling effect will be much reduced, though definitely not eliminated as it would have been had the SC gone a different way back in September and marginally so if they had adopted the four Justices view in this case.
1: Correct. Well, mostly. What the District Court judge will be able to say is that "the plaintiffs are likely to succeed on the merits of their case." Which is NOT a ruling that SB 8 is unconstitutional, as that takes a trial
2: Correct. No, I don't think they'd do anything WRT to them, but you appeared to
3: Correct. But the issue here is that the 5th doesn't care, because the injunction doesn't actually accomplish anything. If the judge rushes the case and tries to actually issue an opinion before Dobbs comes out, the 5th will enjoin the ruling, and nothing more will happen until Dobbs comes out
4: There was never the slightest chance that the people enjoined in 1 were going to do anything to the abortion clinics before Dobbs comes out. Because trying to pull someone's medical license would be a "case or controversy", and at that point the District Court could clearly hear it
If SCOTUS tosses Roe and Casey, then:
* The centers will all lose their licenses for violating SB 8, even if Texas doesn't immediately outlaw all abortions
* All teh SB 8 lawsuits against the centers for any post-heartbeat abortion will go ahead, and they'll be on the hock for all those judgements, at $10,000 each.
Hmm, let's see, $400 for each abortion in income, $10,000 in lawsuit loss in expense.
I would love to play poker against anyone who thinks that's a good, or even reasonable, risk
Absolutely nothing has changed for the better for Texas abortion providers who want to do post-heartbeat abortions.
The fact that SCOTUS released this opinion, allowing the lawsuits to go forward, allowing that Sword of Damocles to hang over the abortion provider's heads, is a clear statement that Roe and Casey are going down.
It appears (from oral arguments in Dobbs) that Kagan and Roberts are going to desperately try to get the 5 to agree to a compromise where Dobbs wins, but Roe and Casey aren't explicitly overturned. The fact that the 5 aren't willing to block an abortion ban at "6 weeks" says they've got their work cut out for them
If they didnt want to tip their hand, they should have held these for Dobbs.
What they're allowing is Texas abortion providers who do abortions past 6 weeks to stay in business until Dobbs is decided.
Which was an easy "allow", since the people being enjoined all said they weren't going to be using SB 8 to shut down those abortion providers right now, anyway (because that shut down would have been an act by the government, with two particularized parties, and therefore a proper "case and controversy").
It still is the case that any private individual can sue anyone who gets, or provides, a post-heartbeat abortion. And when Dobbs tosses out Roe, Casey, and the rest of SCOTUS' abortion "jurisprudence", those suits will be winning suits.
So abortion providers have not won anything in today's ruling.
All they've received is more rope with which to hang themselves
When did wingnuts start thinking they had a chance to win much of anything in America's culture war?
I guess people gullible enough to be today's movement conservatives (the superstition, the multifaceted bigotry, the belligerent ignorance, the disdain of science) will believe just about anything.
(Has a new date for Trump to reclaim the presidency and correct the stolen election been established yet, clingers?)
I guess people gullible enough to be today's movement conservatives (the superstition, the multifaceted bigotry, the belligerent ignorance, the disdain of science) will believe just about anything.
You means the superstition, belligerent ignorance, and disdain of science that leads people to claim that "gender" is meaningful", and not bound by your biological sex?
You mean the multifaceted bigotry that causes people to lash out against "cis het white males"?
Yeah, Rev, your way of feeling (there being no actual thought involved) is heading for the junk heap of history
Greg predicts victory for superstition, bigotry, ignorance, backwardness, insularity, and dogma over reason, tolerance, education, modernity, science, inclusiveness, and progress in modern America (reversing a half-century tide of national progress shaped against the preferences and efforts of our vestigial conservatives).
Anyone else see it his way? Among the Conspirators, I doubt that even Prof. Blackman would claim to expect that conservatives can win (or even just stop losing) the American culture war.
Guys like Greg J. are being forced into increasingly small, desolate corners of America and American life. I expect better Americans to ensure that this continues. If you disagree, let's hear the arguments for conservative victory in the culture war. Thank you.
VA elections: CRT + boys in dresses in girls bathrooms / "culture war" was the biggest driving issue.
Result?
VA move 12 points to the GOP, the GOP swept the Statewide races, and took back control of the State House.
You keep on dreaming about your 1000 year Reich, Rev
The only effect of todays opinion is that lawsuits against the license board can go forward. The SC could have stayed enforcement without an opinion until Dobbs comes out.
But Chief Justice Roberts told us what the practical effect would be:
"Given the ongoing chilling effect of the state law, the District Court should resolve this litigation and enter appropriate relief without delay."
The 8-1 majority knew that Roberts' expressed wish is precisely what the District Court will do. They will stay enforcement of the law very soon. (The SC's prior denial of a stay or injunction was based on procedural grounds that, given the 8-1 ruling in favor of Whole Women's Health, no longer exist to prevent a stay.)
I don't think you can read anything about Dobbs into this procedural case. But your interpretation of the tea leaves is terribly flawed because, no, they could not have (in resolving this case) stayed enforcement. What they did is actually clear the way for the District Court to stay enforcement of SB 8. Which is will promptly do. If you are going to give that weight, it would be against Dobbs resulting in a striking down of Roe/Casey.
"What they did is actually clear the way for the District Court to stay enforcement of SB 8. Which is will promptly do. If you are going to give that weight, it would be against Dobbs resulting in a striking down of Roe/Casey."
Yes, that is what I am saying - this ruling in WWH clears the way for the district court to stop enforcement of SB8, which indicates that they will not overrule Roe/Casey in Dobbs.
Got it. That's fair, but I still don't think this really foreshadows much (other than I think there are four votes to uphold Roe/Casey, in at least in some form).
No, it doesn't.
The ruling in WWH allows the district court to block State officials from doing something they weren't going to do anyway, which is try to pull abortion mills' licenses for doing post-heartbeat abortions.
It does not allow the district court to do ANYTHING else. In particular, it does not block private suits against abortion providers, or people who help someone get a post-heartbeat abortion, and it doesn't allow the district court to do that, either.
"Given the ongoing chilling effect of the state law, the District Court should resolve this litigation and enter appropriate relief without delay."
The 8-1 majority knew that Roberts' expressed wish is precisely what the District Court will do. They will stay enforcement of the law very soon.
Wrong.
The judge will stay State officials from pulling the licenses of abortion mills that do post-heartbeat abortions.
That is ALL the judge will and can do.
You are riding the magic shroom bus to go from "8-1 they allowed a stay that won't accomplish anything" to "8-1 they're goint to block the entire law".
The 4 of the 5 who voted to allow that stay did so to protect gun shops from a CA anti-gun version of SB 8. That's it.They are not going to do anything else to block SB 8 between now and when Dobbs comes out.
The more I think about it, the more I find this a benefit for the Right.
Let's say CA passing an anti-gun version of SB 8. And puts gun stores in the position that, if they don't follow the stupid law, they lose their business license.
What this ruling means is that they can block CA officials from going after their licenses until CA wins at SCOTUS.
And since CA isn't going to win at SCOTUS, this means it eliminates CA's ability to threaten gun stores with unconstitutional laws.
So, in short, the one "gift" they gave was a gift that only helps those who actually have teh US Constitution on their sides.
Gun stores do, abortion providers don't.
Win, win
Or California could just pass a statute authorising neighbours to sue each other for owning a gun, on the theory that guns are a threat to everyone in the vicinity. All the procedural bells & whistles like in Texas, and no state official or licencing board would have to go within 100 miles of any such case.
Let me suggest that the analogy is vacuous: Unlike with ongoing gestation, there is no time pressure relevant to the pre-vs-post enforcement question, among other failures of parallel logic.
Plus I can sue my neighbor right now if I feel threatened by his gun toting, and even ask for a TRO or instanter pre-trial injunction. Or for him letting his dog poop in the shared yard. Doesn't mean I get one, or win, in the end.
Yeah, and then one of those cases makes its way to SCOTUS, where it rules that filing that lawsuit was a violation of the neighbor's civil rights, there's no qualified immunity, and therefore that any individual filing a lawsuit trying to deprive someone of their 2nd Amendment rights is liable for attorney's fees, economic costs, and pain and suffering.
The SB 8 mechanism only works if you think that SCOTUS won't defend the "right" in question. With abortion, which is not a legitimate Constitutional right, Texas appears to have bet correctly that SCOTUS is going to make that "right" go away.
If guns, I believe the bet goes the other way
That sounds like a reasonable prediction to me. But as we know predictions are difficult especially about the future.
" Roe and Casey are toast. "
As are movement conservatives' aspirations in the culture war. After observing the Republicans' recent conduct, I expect better Americans to become substantially less gracious in victory toward intolerant, ignorant, superstitious, backwater, disaffected culture war casualties.
Open wider, clingers.
The plaintiff abortion providers can get an injunction to keep their licenses even though they perform abortions. Not a big deal considering the state claimed no intention to punish them. The defendants should be able to get a ruling without precedential value simply by making their promise official and not appealing the order (or winning the case on standing and being estopped from changing their position later). Meanwhile, federal constitutional claims were omitted from the consolidated state court suit and won't be decided there.
"The plaintiff abortion providers can get an injunction to keep their licenses even though they perform abortions."
Yes. Until Dobbs comes out and nukes Roe and Casey.
At which point they will be in violation of SB 8, and will have been in violation of it the entire time of the injunction. So the injunction will be lifted on the grounds that there's no Constitutional right to an abortion and that therefore SB 8 is good law, and then the abortion facilities that did post 6 weeks abortions will lose their licenses for having violated State law.
It's a meaningless poison pill for the abortion providers.
Greg J
December.10.2021 at 11:23 am
Flag Comment Mute User
"The plaintiff abortion providers can get an injunction to keep their licenses even though they perform abortions."
Abortion providers can get jobs coding -
Oops those jobs are for coal miners
I have lost much of my sympathy for coal miners (and for everyone else who stuck with declining industries and dying communities against all evidence for 30 or 40 years).
For decades, I wanted to help those disadvantaged Americans with subsidies, other government assistance, education, training, and the like.
After watching them turn hard toward bigotry and ugliness, however, I now am more content with the idea that they should eat their goofy red hats -- which, I hope, are delicious and nutritious -- and burn their Trump flags for warmth.
The more adultery, the more vindication of constitutional rights ?
Somehow some strange federal due process argumentation slipped in.
That said, there is Texas precedent for the proposition that due process and "due course of law" (Texas const.) are analogous and that a distinction need not be drawn as to the procedural protections. That doesn't work for abortion-as-a-privacy rights, though. Judge Peeples properly rejected that state constitutional argument for lack of SCOTX endorsement. See the case about the police officer that had an affair with the wife of a colleague and wasn't promoted.
Great job grasping at straws.
The Court allows plaintiffs to sue State abortion license reviewers to keep them from using SB 8 to rescind and abortion provider's license
That's it
Roe is toast. it will go away 5 - 1 - 3, or else Roberts will give up and it will be 6 - 3
"The Court allows plaintiffs to sue State abortion license reviewers to keep them from using SB 8 to rescind and abortion provider's license"
There was little point in allowing even that much of the case to go forward if they were already planning to turn around and overturn Roe.
Sure there was:
When CA passes a SB 8 like like that violates our gun rights, and tries to use it to close down gun stores, those stores will have a clearly defined right to get an injunction blocking the shutdowns.
In this case, the defendants said they weren't going to use SB 8 to pull the licenses of the abortion providers in the near future anyway, and they were right to say so because that attempt would provide a valid case or controversy for a Federal Court to rule on.
If they were going to keep any part of Roe or Casey, then a ban on abortions at 6 weeks would not be allowed to stand.
The ban stands
No, SCOTUS did not make a ruling on the merits upholding the ban.
They didn't have to
As the 4 in opposition showed, anyone willing to keep Roe was going to twist themselves into sufficient knots to come up with reasons to block SB 8.
Take a look at the way SCOTUS refused to handle any of the election law lawsuits that they had to take under any reasonable reading of the Constitution. Barret, Kavanaugh, and Gorsuch all proved they're capable of great gymnastics when they're unwilling to piss of upper middle class and upper class white people
They didn't do those gymnastics this time because on this issue, they are willing to piss off their social class
The majority, unlike Justice Roberts and the three liberals, was very careful not to take any position on abortion or say anything that would be inconsistent with a future reversal of Roe.
At least they didn't say - unlike the Texas MDL judge -- that the case wasn't about abortion.
"joined by the Court's liberal justices"
Left out "other".
Scathing!
Roberts felt that.
That'll teach him to adhere to those liberal values of treating currently controlling Supreme Court precedent as currently controlling Supreme Court precedent when deciding a procedural matter.
Roberts is conservative. The problem as Bob sees it, though, is that anyone who doesn't do what Bob wants is, by definition, a "liberal". Fortunately, there are still some actual conservatives out there (e.g., Jeff Flake, Ben Sasse, Liz Cheney, Brad Raffensperger, and Adam Kinzinger).
It was a joke, but many share the underlying belief so its not just "as Bob sees it".
For instance from a moderate conservative law professor:
"Andy Grewal@AndyGrewal
I think it’s clear where the 4 SCOTUS libs will stand in Dobbs. Will they get one more Justice by June?"
Roberts should have killed obamacare, such a breach of trust can only be forgiven if he comes thru on abortion. Until then, he gets scorn. Sorry if it offends your sense of lese mageste.
That you found someone else who shares your sense of humor and your willingness to punish deviation from Bob (or Andy) - approved results says nothing about the "underlying belief." (Unless you are referring to your underlying belief that there are no true conservatives other than those who agree with you that judicial results should conform to your policy preferences.)
He doesn't know or care what I think, but if Roberts does not want to be called a liberal, he can stop acting like one.
Reaching a couple conclusions you don't like (or even that a majority of Republicans don't like) doesn't make Roberts a liberal.
That'll teach him to adhere to those liberal values of treating currently controlling Supreme Court precedent as currently controlling Supreme Court precedent when deciding a procedural matter.
You know, I missed those "liberal values" with Lawrence v Texas, Windsor, and Obergfell.
It's amazing how none of the "liberal values" are ever followed when the "liberals" win
Which point will mainstream history identify as the most important or direct factor precipitating the United States Supreme Court enlargement of the 2020s?
___ abortion
___ guns
___ pandemic management
___ voting rights
___ partisanship/gridlock/election results
___ bigotry (racism, misogyny, gay-bashing, xenophobia)
___ special privilege for religion
Choose one (and only one). Thank you.
___ yo mama
You mean, the one where President Trump appoints 6 new members in 2025, to make sure all the rulings are correct?
Oh, and Congress doubles the number of Appeals Court seats, so that the new President Trump can appoint all those seats, too, getting all the Appeals Courts pointing the right way?
McCauliff tried to run on abortion in VA, and none of the voters cared. 12% shift from Dem to GOP.
No "Moderate Senate Democrat" who wants to get reelected is going to go along with any more of the "Progressive's" idiocy. You've got a 3 seat margin in the House, and none in the Senate. Jussie Smolett was found guilty, and Kyle Rittenhouse was found not guilty.
If you think anything is going to go your way in the next year, you're high
I don't focus on year-to-year results.
I focus on the arc of history, which punishes conservatives -- because they are half-educated misfits in modern America; because they are superstitious gay-bashers; because they are obsolete misogynists, because they are backwater rubes; because they disdain science, education, credentials, experience, and expertise; because they are vote-suppressing racists -- and rewards those who prefer reason, inclusiveness, science, education, modernity, tolerance, and progress.
The reason most conservatives are so desperate, delusional, dispirited, deplorable, and disaffected is that they have been losing in America throughout their lives, and recognize there is no hope for their paltry ideas. So they try to delay progress where and when they can, nip at the ankles of their betters, and try to separate themselves from the modern America they despise.
There are two things that could save movement conservatism in America -- (1) a machine that mass-produces uneducated, bigoted, disaffected, obsolete, economically inadequate, superstitious, elderly, rural, southern White males, (2) a Rapture, or (3) a revelation that Prof. Blackman is not a downscale White malcontent teaching at a shit-rate law school but instead is the Lord God Of The Bible (with or without angel wings, singing lead at a Lynyrd Skynyrd concert).
Good luck with those three lifelines, Volokh Conspiracy fans.
Me? My celebratory beverages have been cellared for some time and continue to flow, as will the tiers of can't-keep-up conservatives.
Aren't you going to denounce the Board of Censors, too? Or are you tired of all this darn free speech?
Ah, the Rev tells us how inevitable his Thousand Year Reich is!
Or are more of the "We will bury you!" Communist variety?
"If you think that you can think about a thing, inextricably attached to something else, without thinking of the thing it is attached to, then you have a legal mind."
/attributed to Thomas Reed Powell
Seems like the conduct SB 8 seeks to encourage is already defined as criminal under federal law.
Just wait for someone to sue to claim the bounty. Then charge criminally in federal court everyone involved—the bounty hunter, any state judge who awards the money, any state official involved in disbursing the money, etc.—with violation of civil rights under color of law.
For good measure, have the Justice Department announce now that will happen. No time like the present to chill the chillers. In the press release, point out that the threat of criminal charges is necessary not only to protect abortion rights, but also to protect other civil rights now at risk to be undermined likewise.
More specifically to this case, can anyone explain what real motive the SCOTUS majority might have for structuring this decision the way they did? No one expected this, right? Even though the cases are not analogous, the decision feels like the same kind of contorted, results-oriented reasoning Shelby County delivered.
The split on the Court is obviously ideological. But in this case it's harder than it was in Shelby County to figure out what outcome the Court is trying to put off limits. The notion seems strained that this outlandish legal novelty from Texas is a dangerous precedent which might spread to other cases and endanger cherished procedural customs. Isn't it more the opposite—that letting the Texas scheme avoid pre-enforcement challenge, and thus stand as an example of a way to hamper civil rights, is the continuing danger which is likely to spread?
With a few exceptions involving situations like prosecutorial immunity you don't have a constitutional right not to be sued. Your opponent, on the other hand, does have a constitutional right of access to the courts.
Could be that under the supremacy clause that right of access you suppose depends on state courts which do not under color of law flout federally guaranteed civil rights. I am a legal layman under the impression that, "under color of law," was meant to bypass the stratagem to deprive folks of rights by purposeful abuse, while using the legal system as mechanism. Have I got that wrong?
"Could be that under the supremacy clause that right of access you suppose depends on state courts which do not under color of law flout federally guaranteed civil rights."
And that will be of great help when CA goes after gun rights.
But since Roe and Casey are bullshit rulings bereft of any legitimacy, those lawsuits aren't actually violating any actual rights.
Which is why SCOTUS is letting them go forward.
But, by all means do get the Feds involved in establishing that doing this against a real right gets your life destroyed.
Re: "avoiding pre-enforcement challenge"
Hello !? .... We just had rulings in pre-enforcement cases in state and federal courts, with more activity forthcoming in the inferior courts.
As the concurring SCOTUS justice points out, there are more anti-SB8 suits than SB8 suits, and the 14 in Austin involve actually more than 14 plaintiffs. BTW, the plaintiffs are NOT all abortion providers, but include abortions funders (who fall under the aiding & abetting provisions) and at least one attorney (who could claim Texas-style attorney immunity, if sued, for legal abortion counseling).
And self-confessed SB8 violator Alan Braid (San Antonio, TX) has exported the cases of "THE THREE SCHMUCKS" to friendlier litigation territory 1000 miles to the North under a dubious federal interpleader theory predicated on $500 federal diversity jurisdiction, designating himself as the plaintiff going after the pro se schmucks as plaintiffs-converted-to-defendants. The anchoring "interpleader defendant" is Felipe Gomez, who sued Braid, MD for a declaration in Texas court that SB8 is unconstitutional and has filed a sworn disclaimer as to the $10,000 "bounty". He don't want no money from the good doc. Some case or controversy there!
INTERPLEADING INJUNCTIVE RELIEF?
How will the far-off US Dist. Court in Chicago handle the mandatory injunction component of the "res" in the alleged predicate dispute among competing SB8 claimants over the same post-heartbeat fetus extraction at or near the Alamo?
Let Dr. Braid's posse of 12 high-powered attorneys and their academic entourage figure it out!
Four (4) lawyers per schmuck. Seriously?
Also, because of the threat they pose to the right of abortion, the defendants should be locked up without bail until they crack and agree to plead guilty.
There is no "right of abortion", so there's nothing for them to threaten
The decision seems to be another Masterpiece Cakeshop or Fulton. The Texas Legislature did a shoddy drafting job that allowed residual enforcement authority for some state officials. It screwed up.
And as with Masterpiece Cakeshop and Fulton, the victory for the plaintiffs is Pyrrhic. The Texas Legislature can easily amend its statute so as to remove the residual public enforcement authority that it mistakenly left in.
Nope.
Well, the victory for the plaintiffs here is Pyrrhic. Because the State officials weren't going to do any of the things the injunction will tell them not to do.
But when Dobbs nukes Casey and Roe, all those abortion providers who did post-heartbeat abortions will get their licenses immediately yanked
I'll just note here that PredictIt currently has an 85% chance that SCOTUS will not strike down Dobbs
https://www.predictit.org/markets/detail/7504/Will-SCOTUS-strike-down-Mississippi-ban-on-pre-viability-abortions-in-Dobbs
If you think Dobbs is going to lose, you really should hop on over and make some money on your belief
And if you're sure the Mississippi law will be upheld, hop over and make money.
I don't buy 15% payoff with an uncertain timeline bets. I hate having my money tied up like that.
Besides, I've got most of mine tied up in better bets..
PredictIt take 10% of any winnings, so for every $15 you bet that SCOTUS will throw out Dobbs, you get a $76.50 profit. 5 to 1 payoff, how can you resist?