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Supreme Court

SCOTUS Rules on Deportation Case

Plus: China-U.S. relations heat up, ICE says ideas shouldn't cross borders, sexytime with the computer, and more...

Liz Wolfe | 4.11.2025 9:34 AM

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The U.S. Supreme Court | Photo 81937138 © Steven Frame | Dreamstime.com
The U.S. Supreme Court (Photo 81937138 © Steven Frame | Dreamstime.com)

Supreme Court rules on deportation: The Court, in an unsigned order, told the Trump administration that it must "facilitate and effectuate the return" of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia from CECOT, the Salvadoran prison he is being held in.

"The United States acknowledges that Abrego Garcia was subject to a withholding order forbidding his removal to El Salvador, and that the removal to El Salvador was therefore illegal," reads the order. "On Friday, April 4, the United States District Court for the District of Maryland entered an order directing the Government to 'facilitate and effectuate the return of [Abrego Garcia] to the United States by no later than 11:59 PM on Monday, April 7.'" The order notes that this deadline has already passed (Chief Justice John Roberts had issued an administrative stay to give the Supreme Court time to consider) but that the lower court's "order properly requires the Government to 'facilitate' Abrego Garcia's release from custody in El Salvador and to ensure that his case is handled as it would have been had he not been improperly sent to El Salvador." Meanwhile, the "effectuate" part is "unclear" and possibly "exceed[s] the District Court's authority."

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"The district court should clarify its directive, with due regard for the deference owed to the executive branch in the conduct of foreign affairs," adds the order.

Justices Sonia Sotomayor, Elena Kagan, and Ketanji Brown Jackson appended a statement below the unsigned order, adding, "To this day, the Government has cited no basis in law for Abrego Garcia's warrantless arrest, his removal to El Salvador, or his confinement in a Salvadoran prison. Nor could it."

"Instead of hastening to correct its egregious error, the Government dismissed it as an 'oversight,'" the justices add, issuing a strong rebuke of the administration's actions.

Some case background is provided here (and I spoke about this case at some length here, but it's behind a paywall, and nestled among thoughts on motherhood and truth czars and repro tech). The next steps for Abrego Garcia are currently unclear, but this could be considered a bit of a measured opening salvo from the Supreme Court, providing some indication that they will be curbing the Trump administration's worst impulses, in a very careful and considered way. This is checks and balances at its finest—provided the administration adheres.

Xi tries to make new friends: "There are no winners in a tariff war and China is not afraid of oppression, Chinese President Xi Jinping told visiting Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez on Friday," reports the South China Morning Post. "In a direct appeal to the European Union, said China and the bloc should shoulder their international responsibilities and 'jointly resist unilateral bullying.'" While meeting with the Spanish prime minister on Friday, Xi made a deal that opens up the Chinese market to Spanish pork imports.

Xi is, of course, referring to the trade war that's now underway between China and America. China has placed a 125 percent tariff on all American goods that pass through its ports of entry, starting April 12, while the White House has clarified that our own tariffs on Chinese products now stand at 145 percent. Stocks and bonds continue to face intense turbulence.

After the initial escalations, China has chosen not to raise its own tariffs to the same level (145 percent). "By signaling that China is going to 'ignore,' it allows Trump to claim a small tactical victory that may create space for negotiations," Dylan Loh, assistant professor at the Nanyang Technological University in Singapore, told Bloomberg. "They are also telegraphing to the world that they are the adult in the room and will not be led by Trump or simply be reacting to Trump's every move."

"One that goes against the world risks being isolated themselves," added Xi in his remarks earlier today.

We all need a fall guy: "Former hedge fund manager and Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent—the White House's main conduit to beleaguered financial markets—is now at the helm, with populist Peter Navarro relegated to the sidelines and Wall Street punching bag Howard Lutnick recast into the role of "bad cop," according to three people close to the White House, granted anonymity to speak frankly about internal dynamics," reports Politico. 

ICYMI: Sen. Rand Paul (R–Ky.) breaks down why tariffs are fundamentally wrong, and how they will have terrible effects on the American middle class:


Scenes from New York: Cops in my illustrious city are looking for a man…who appears to have sexually assaulted a corpse…on an R train. I am begging my local politicians to prioritize subway safety. This is insane.


QUICK HITS

  • Love that this, initially released by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), contains IDEAS.

Ideas

— Jessica Pishko (@jesspish.bsky.social) 2025-04-10T16:30:19.763Z

The updated version is…marginally better? But not by much. It's also not clear to me what ICE believes intellectual property to encompass (to the extent that you even accept it as a real thing at all).

ICE enforces 400+ federal laws to ensure public safety and national security.  Our job is to ensure people, money, products and intellectual property. DO NOT enter the U.S. illegally.
????Learn more about our mission: https://t.co/NiwdpaaC7Y pic.twitter.com/skg7LJuZIz

— U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (@ICEgov) April 10, 2025

  • Good read: "The People Who Fall in Love With Chatbots" by Katherine Dee over at Pirate Wires. "I interviewed people who've developed emotional—even sexual—relationships with LLMs," reads the subhed. "They're not as crazy as they seem." More: "AI companionship, in all its manifestations, does not feel entirely new. It is an extension of several long-established traditions of imaginative intimacy: erotic literature, fandom roleplay, sex toy-assisted masturbation, self-shipping communities in fandoms, and even robosexuality, that is, loving technology for the technology itself. It is a tool that exists in a vast, well-established ecosystem of behaviors and motivations." Though I enjoy Dee's thoughtful treatment of this subject, I must admit that my disgust mechanism was rather triggered, and I find myself agreeing with evolutionary biologist Robert Brooks (quoted within) that this is little more than "junk food intimacy", something we've become primed to accept by our landscape full of junk food—junk food short-form content, junk food television and movies, junk food copywriting (you know the type: littered with emojis, as if you can't stomach the sight of actual words) to advertise junk products. "We always seek ourselves in others, human and machine alike," Dee concludes, talking about her own projections onto Claude, and how they mirror her projections onto other people in interpersonal relationships. She's right that digitally-mediated relationships are not wholly different from meatspace ones, and there can be value to the self from having a sounding board—whether real, imagined, or programmed. But the thing that I think really triggers my disgust mechanism is that this strikes me as a perversion of what relationships are all about: Not just tending to the self, but also tending to the other. When a relationship will never ask that of you, what good is it really?
  • Honestly, Florida's whole shift toward restoring parental rights—example here, different from yesterday's case involving gender identity—strikes me as both good and politically smart. I'm not sure Democratic activists' approach of trying to allow ever-more third parties (doctors, teachers) to intervene in the parent-child relationship, or trump the parent's decision making, will yield good results.
  • "Tesla Inc. stopped taking orders in China for Model S sedans and Model X sport utility vehicles—both of which are imported from the US—after the countries raised tariffs on one another in an escalating trade war," reports Bloomberg.
  • I just can't recommend this highly enough:

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NEXT: American Prisons Don't Work. California Is Trying Something That Might.

Liz Wolfe is an associate editor at Reason.

Supreme CourtTrump AdministrationDeportationImmigrationEl SalvadorFree TradeChinaTariffsPoliticsReason Roundup
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  1. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    The Court, in an unsigned order, told the Trump administration that it must "facilitate and effectuate the return" of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia from CECOT, the Salvadoran prison he is being held in.

    PUT YOUR SIGNATURES ON IT YOU COWARDS

    1. Chinny Chin Chin   2 months ago

      anonymous internet commenter accusing others of cowardice

      zero real-world consequence... check
      petty insult... check
      feeling of superiority... check

      libertarian "activism" at its best

      1. Idaho-Bob   2 months ago

        Anonymous leftist commenter insulting another anonymous commenter.

        What a bundle of sticks.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

          *checks dictionary*

          Faggot?

          1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

            Fascio?

            1. Ersatz   2 months ago

              Wasnt he that male model with the long hair... the one that caught a goose to the face? 😉

          2. Idaho-Bob   2 months ago

            British cigarette?

      2. Knutsack   2 months ago

        Kinda new here?

        1. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

          Naw, it's another one of shrike's socks.

      3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

        Does random internet poster have the power to try to force government action?

        You're not that intelligent are you.

        1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

          He’s only as smart as the hairs on his chinny chin chin.

          1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

            How dare you! THEIR chinny chin chin.

            You must respect the results of hormone therapy.

            1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

              I guess Chinny Chin Chin could be a bearded lady.

              1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

                YOU STILL DON'T GET IT!

                Using "his" and "lady" indicate you need another DEI struggle session. Report to Room 101.

      4. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

        TDS-addled steaming pile of shit whining.
        Fuck off and die, asshole.

      5. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

        It's true that we both have lifetime appointments, but they get taxpayer-funded robes so they should at least be required to put their John Handpenises on their rulings.

        1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

          Ill start the give send go to donate money for lifetime fist robes. Have a color preference?

          1. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

            See-through.

            1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

              Now we’re talking.

            2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

              Damn. I'll also start a fund for eye bleach.

        2. Jefferson Paul   2 months ago

          I recall a funny cutaway to the signing of the Declaration on Family Guy. They had John Hancock, formerly John Footpenis. lol.

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxbftTFJW4I

          1. Jefferson Paul   2 months ago

            And a really early episode of FG had Peter going to Washington and being told about Majority whip Dick Army. "What's next, Vagina CoastGuard!?"

    2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

      The summary is co eradicated by the words below. They call out the judge can't order the administration to effectuate, ie force, the return. That's why roberts asks for revisement.

      The court can't force El Salvador to return the prisoner.

      Basically this tells the administration to ask for his return. But with a nod and a wink Bukele can just say no thanks. Then the action is complete.

      1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 months ago

        Yeah I think they're forcing the district court to craft an order that doesn't cross the line and challenge the government's ultimate authority. Meanwhile they're telling the administration that they can't pass this off as an error, they have to attempt to get this guy out of El Salvador. He will of course still be deported but to a different country. Again Trump won on the jurisdictional issue. The rest is process.

      2. chemjeff radical individualist   2 months ago

        This is why your team is descending into fascism. You round up people from a minority group, send them to a gulag with no opportunity for them to challenge their removal, and when the courts eventually do get around to saying hey, that's not right, that guy that you sent away shouldn't have been and why don't you try to return him, you ignore it and will continue to do it.

        Let's review: The Jan. 6 rioters, even the ones who committed actual acts of violence, were pardoned and you fully support that. But Garcia, who has zero criminal record in any country, was deported in error to a Salvadoran gulag, that even the government admits was an error, and you also fully support that.

        1. VinniUSMC   2 months ago

          Round up the MAPedo group, so we can finally be free of Lying Jeffy.

        2. Medulla Oblongata   2 months ago

          But he DID have an outstanding deportation order. So the error was not in the deportation, but that the deportation was removing him to the one country the deportation order precluded him from being sent to.

      3. One-Punch_Man   2 months ago

        Liz also misses the part that the government can deplore him and was within it's right. They just couldn't deport him to El Salvador.

  2. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    Meanwhile, the "effectuate" part is "unclear" and possibly "exceed[s] the District Court's authority."

    Unqualified win for the president!

  3. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    "Instead of hastening to correct its egregious error, the Government dismissed it as an 'oversight,'" the justices add, issuing a strong rebuke of the administration's actions.

    Lol. The first administration to do that.

    1. Minadin   2 months ago

      They're breaking ALL the norms!

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

        That have just been defined by the opposition.

  4. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    "In a direct appeal to the European Union, said China and the bloc should shoulder their international responsibilities and 'jointly resist unilateral bullying.'"

    Double lol. Get in bed with China and find out what real bullying looks like.

    1. mad.casual   2 months ago

      Correct me if I'm wrong Sandy, but did Trump's tariffs just force China forego their own tariffs and open up their markets?

      Maybe the real problem with Trump is that he's not supporting enough actual millions-dead genocide throughout the rest of Asia?

    2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

      I find it hilarious China is adopting the language of the globalists and calling reciprocal tariffs to be unilateral bullying.

      They mist have read all the false free trade articles and determined they should be advantaged or you're bullying them.

      1. Gaear Grimsrud   2 months ago

        Rumored that XI reads Reason every day. That's all he needs to know about tariffs.

        1. VinniUSMC   2 months ago

          Does Xi read Reason, or is Xi a contributing "editor"... whatever the fuck Reason thinks an editor is.

      2. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 months ago

        EISTAU is indeed an international language.

    3. damikesc   2 months ago

      I bet the EU does not love the constant theft of their IP any more than the US does.

    4. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

      Like an international brotherhood? (Which should now be "personhood".)

  5. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    Stocks and bonds continue to face intense turbulence.

    I need to actually see the word "crash" here.

    1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

      The correct word per media is cratering.

      1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

        “Turbulence “ is trending.

        1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

          I hear from SGT and Schiff this is all insider trading.

          1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

            Ask Nancy. Or Mr. Nancy.

  6. Knutsack   2 months ago

    who appears to have sexually assaulted a corpse

    You're alive. What's to worry about?

  7. Randy Sax   2 months ago

    "I interviewed people who've developed emotional—even sexual—relationships with LLMs,"

    I kinda understand the sexual, people get off on all kinda of dumb shit. Using your imagination, you are fucking the cartoon girl or whatever. Get the monkey off your back. But emotional? How? Your "wifu" doesn't exist. It has no emotions. That, I don't understand.

    1. Rev Arthur L kuckland (5-30-24 banana republic day)   2 months ago

      Plankton had a computer wife before it was cool

      1. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

        Karen from before Karen's were AWFLs.

    2. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 months ago

      I'm guessing that is probably the same emotional attachment people make with other inmate objects like a car. Once saw a father make his daughter ride in the trunk, as she was muddy after a soccer game. Heaven forbid she get dirt in his baby.

      1. Rev Arthur L kuckland (5-30-24 banana republic day)   2 months ago

        Have you ever driven an adolecent girl around? The trunk is ideal, the mud was a welcomed excuse

      2. Jefferson Paul   2 months ago

        Was his daughter a bear? I've heard about people riding around with bears in the trunk.

        1. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 months ago

          It’s all fun and games until one escapes into a Walmart parking lot.

    3. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

      But emotional? How? Your "wifu" doesn't exist. It has no emotions. That, I don't understand.

      ChatGPT is actually pretty good at faking empathy and being a good listener if you tell it to. In conversation mode it can work off the cues in your voice.

      1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

        What an AI girlfriend is actually like.

        https://www.youtube.com/shorts/rb6yp_kZagw

      2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

        Grok unhinged mode is more realistic.

        https://www.techradar.com/computing/artificial-intelligence/grok-3s-voice-mode-is-unhinged-and-thats-the-point

    4. Zeb   2 months ago

      Well, how do you know your real wife has emotions? Fake it good enough and what's the difference?
      But I do agree, it's fucking weird and it takes a particularly sad kind of person to go for something like that.

      1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

        I don't know...imagine a wife with an off switch...

        1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

          You mean totally off or just a mute button?

          1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

            I guess mute. I already know how to turn women off otherwise.

            1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

              I hear wedding rings do the trick.

            2. Jefferson Paul   2 months ago

              Lol.

              Did you watch the Rogan episode from yesterday with Dave Smith and Douglas Murray? If not, I suggest you do. It's odd how so many are claiming Murray wiped the floor with Dave. Did they watch the same thing I did? Murray kept engaging in logical fallacies and strawman arguments.

              1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

                Thanks, JP. I haven't watched it, but I will tonight or tomorrow.

              2. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

                I watched it. I don't know how anyone can thin Murray won. He was condescending and contradicted himself. Imagree, Dave clearly won on the facts.

                1. Jefferson Paul   2 months ago

                  That wasn't even Dave's best skills on display. He said he intentionally didn't get as aggressive as he wanted because Murray was losing it all on his own.

          2. Gaear Grimsrud   2 months ago

            I keep my wife in a gray box.

        2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

          Or a girlfriend with "turns into a pizza" switch.

    5. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

      Have you been to Stepford?

      1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

        My exact point. The "women" there weren't women. The men didn't have emotional attachment to them. Only sex stuff/slaves. If I remember correctly, it's been like a decade since I've seen that movie.

    6. Super Scary   2 months ago

      "Your "wifu" doesn't exist. It has no emotions. That, I don't understand."

      I guess it would be pointless to ask, but... Asuka or Rei?

      1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

        Anime is not really my jam. A couple of my friends have tried to get me into it, but it's not for me. I'm more of a south park/venture bros guy. Dr. Mrs. The Monarch has got it going on.

  8. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

    HEY BUTTPLUG! HERE YOU GO! THE RUSSIAGATE BINDER HAS BEEN RELEASED TO THE FEDERALIST:

    File 1: https://scribd.com/document/848636280/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-1

    File 2: https://scribd.com/document/848636282/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-2

    File 3: https://scribd.com/document/848636474/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-3

    1. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

      File 4: https://scribd.com/document/848636562/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-4

      File 5: https://scribd.com/document/848636604/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-5

      File 6: https://scribd.com/document/848636281/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-6

      File 7: https://scribd.com/document/848636655/Crossfire-Hurricane-Binder-7

      1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        Turd is pulling his usual shit and ignoring the actual evidence, below.

    2. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

      Hey Jeff and Sarcasmic! These are the "classified" documents that Jumpin' Jack Smith raided Mar A Lago for. Maybe you'll find the nuclear codes inside?

      1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

        Anything previously unknown/interesting in there?

        1. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

          Haven't gotten past the first one yet, and so far it confirms what the Trump campaign was saying about the FBI and Steele.

          Edit: Crazy how they were relying on anti-Trump Buzzfeed articles and stuff for excuses.

          1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

            That is one of the most nefarious aspects of all the legal attacks on Trump, the consistent use of media sources as their probable cause for all of those.

            1. Minadin   2 months ago

              I thought the nefarious thing was that they allegedly were leaking the stuff they wanted to use to the press in the first place, then using the fact that the press reported on it as 'evidence'.

              1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

                That as well.

                Then the staging of classified documents later. Sullum still hasn't admitted he fell for that.

              2. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

                Yeah, that was very incestuous. They feed the press which in turn feeds them.

                1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

                  From each according to his ability to each according to his need.

        2. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

          Yes! Take a look.

          1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

            Too long for me. I'll wait for others to sift out the interesting stuff. I'm not expecting any surprises. We all knew this was all lies for years now.

        3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

          The documents are linked sea lion.

          I'm sure you're waiting for what CNN tells you though.

          1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

            Yeah. You read the whole thing already did you?

      2. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        I’ve got popcorn to read Pluggo’s denials.

    3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

      Jeff will be here to dismiss it on the grounds that the Federalist is not a real news source.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        I’m just waiting for Sarcasmic to claim “Democrats did it first so that makes it ok.”

        1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

          He can't. He already has defended and repeated the give back theory to make it okay for Joe.

  9. Randy Sax   2 months ago

    It's also not clear to me what ICE believes intellectual property to encompass (to the extent that you even accept it as a real thing at all).

    Once in awhile, maybe you will feel the urge
    To break international copyright law
    By downloading MP3s from file-sharing sites
    Like Morpheus, or Grokster, or LimeWire, or Kazaa
    But deep in your heart, you know the guilt would drive you mad
    And the shame would leave a permanent scar
    ’Cause you start out stealing songs, then you're robbing liquor stores
    And selling crack and running over school kids with your car

    1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

      People without the capacity to create don’t believe in intellectual property.

      1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

        People without the capacity to create with an internet connection don’t believe in intellectual property.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

          People in China don't believe in intellectual property.

          1. Small w woodchippertarian   2 months ago

            What's JD Vance's take? The correct answer is the opposite of that.

            1. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

              JD Vance is wrong.

              1. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 months ago

                And dubious.

      2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

        Essentially this.

        They are rationalizing their own theft more than anything. They wont even admit it still takes work to create IP and they are robbing people of said work.

        1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

          The fundamental difference is that people argue that copying is not stealing. The creator still has the original thing. He is no poorer.

          1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

            Your assertion is completely incorrect. He is in fact poorer as his sales are reduced.

            Resales make sense. Copying does not.

            The author owns the rights to his words. He owns the labor required to generate the work. Exploiting this through digital or direct copying doesn't change this fact.

            Now I'm fine with arguing for shorter terms of a copyright much like with technology IP.

            But claiming there is no harm for devaluing the labor of others is pretty nefarious.

            1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

              I downloaded a copy of "A Boy and His Dog" by Harlan Ellison. He's dead, but lets pretend he isn't. Does me not paying for that work materially harm him? Is he worse off? Would he ever know?

              1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

                Now I'm fine with arguing for shorter terms of a copyright much like with technology IP.

                You missed this part it seems.

                You're also using an extreme case and self selecting to dead authors.

                1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

                  I picked that example because it was a true example. Not to cherry pick an extreme case. We can change the scenario.

                  I download a *new book*. Same questions apply. Is the author worse off?

                  1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

                    Yes.

                  2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

                    Yes. He has lost a sale. He has added costs to what he does sell, not stolen.

                    It is the same as tech/manufacturing IP.

                    His labor and development costs get spread through the number of products sold.

                    If he spends a year writing a book, and only sells one book, the cost for that book is a year of his labor. If he sells 365, his costs are a day of labor per item sold.

                    1. Ersatz   2 months ago

                      He has a theoretical future value associated with sales of his book given the idea that everyone who wants to read it actually buys it.

                      This is diminished by unpurchased downloads

              2. Overt   2 months ago

                Yes. The right to a property includes the right to exclude others. By taking it, you have infringed on that right.

                Imagine someone has a well with more water than they could ever use. You go to that well and take the water. You have still taken it from them. And of course, if he wanted to sell that water, but you are going and taking that water and selling/giving it away, you infringe on his ability to sell that water.

                1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

                  The well analogy doesn't work for me. I'm not taking anyone's anything. I made a copy. And he didn't lose a sale. I wasn't ever going to buy anything.

                  1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

                    Then simply don't buy it instead of stealing it. That's not a good justification.

                    The sole beneficiary in your statement is you.

                2. Zeb   2 months ago

                  But IP isn't property. If it was you wouldn't need the "I", it would just be property. It's like saying "trans-women are women". No. If they were, you wouldn't call them "trans".
                  That's not to say I don't think IP laws are useful or largely beneficial (at least when implemented in a reasonable way). I just think to say that it's the same as other, real property is ridiculous. The laws don't even treat it that way. What other kind of property is yours for 7 years and then free for anyone else to use afterward?

                  1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

                    Does labor have a value or not?

                    Do you have a right to the labor of others?

                    Note I specified resale or giving a property you bought to a second actor as just fine. But the situation above is about copying and essentially creating a competing product through theft.

                    1. Zeb   2 months ago

                      Does labor have a value or not?
                      By itself, no. There is lots of useless labor with no value to anyone, except maybe the laborer himself.

                      My point isn't that it's totally OK to use others' IP and I don't think there is any good in protecting it at all (though I do think there is a reasonable debate to be had there). My point is just that it isn't the same as property and I don't think it should be thought of that way. It's only "property" because there are laws that say it is. Without those laws there is nothing you can do about other people using your ideas. With real property, you can lock it up, or hide it, or defend it with force. And if someone steals it, you no longer have it. It's just a different thing and I think it's stupid to pretend that it isn't.

              3. Lester75   2 months ago

                The beneficiaries of his estate won't get the money he intended for them if you steal his work (assuming it's still under copyright).

            2. Zeb   2 months ago

              The other side of that is that the value of their labor was artificially increased through IP laws.

            3. See.More   2 months ago

              Your assertion is completely incorrect. He is in fact poorer as his sales are reduced.

              Reduced sales are not theft. He cannot claim ownership of something that he has not received. Expected sales are not deposits in his bank. Selling less than expected does not take money out of his bank. While his wealth might not have grown as much as he would have liked, he is no oorer for it.

              1. Medulla Oblongata   2 months ago

                So if I sneak into a movie theater or concert without paying and watch the show, no harm done?

        2. mamabug   2 months ago

          I try to find legitimate sources for most of the stuff I want to read/watch (even if it is just the library), however some there just aren't any except fan translations so I don't beat myself up over it. If they aren't available in English at all, the creator wouldn't make any money off me anyway.

          I do have a hard time, though, with the works that charge something like 10c a chapter for 250,000 chapters though.

  10. Rev Arthur L kuckland (5-30-24 banana republic day)   2 months ago

    Sure would be a shame if that evil subhuman ms13 gang member that was ordered to leave in 2019 fell onto a shiv

  11. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 months ago

    Chinese MSG in Spanish Pork. Make Spain Great

    Or

    More pork barrel politics.

    1. Minadin   2 months ago

      I wonder if MSG would speed up the process for Jamón Ibérico.

      1. Zeb   2 months ago

        That is the worst idea anyone has ever had. You don't fuck with Jamón Ibérico.

  12. Rev Arthur L kuckland (5-30-24 banana republic day)   2 months ago

    Hey Liz in case you didn't know the US looses billions a year in ip theft. That's "just an idea". Fuck off. The US should wait till the rainy season then blow up the three gorges damn.

    1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

      Do you really call buying shitty knock-off nikes "loosing money"? I wasn't gonna buy the real ones anyway.

      1. Rev Arthur L kuckland (5-30-24 banana republic day)   2 months ago

        The chinks steal research and tec development constantly. Start at us universities and any prof that is still loyal to the ccp, lock them up for 20 years

        1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

          I can agree with that. Can we change copyright law to mostly exclude creative works and focus on scientific ones?

          1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

            So if you spend a year working full time writing a novel, you can only sell one copy?

            1. damikesc   2 months ago

              I do not think you should have more time of protection than, say, a drug that cost billions gets.

              1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

                Why not? Will people die if they can't buy Chinese knock-offs of your romance novel?

                1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

                  Depends on if it’s less coherent than Fifty Shades of Gray.

      2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

        Why do a lot of you confuse IP with trademark/copyright so often.

        And even then it is a weird take given there are monetary evaluations for reputation, see defamation laws. So there is recognized value there.

        1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

          Why do a lot of you confuse IP with trademark/copyright so often.

          Explain to me the difference. Is Mickey Mouse not an intellectual property? I'm not being sarcastic, I genuinely want to know.

          1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

            Trademarks/copyright is a form of IP. Not all IP is trademark/copyright.

            Are you going to start calling all rectangles squares?

            You seem to have different views above based on type of IP. So if you do, you should be careful to differentiate.

    2. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

      That's true. It is (least conservatively) estimated Americans lose about $600 billion/year to Chinese IP theft, which IF successful will be retained by the large corporations that hold most IP.

      Also True:
      --Fiberation Day market crashes cost $6.6 Trillion to traders on the American stock market.
      --Estimated annual revenue from tariffs is $6-7 Trillion/year coming from American consumers.

      Hmmm

      1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

        Also bullshit:

        "--Fiberation Day market crashes cost $6.6 Trillion to traders on the American stock market."
        Un-realized "losses" are not losses.
        "--Estimated annual revenue from tariffs is $6-7 Trillion/year coming from American consumers."
        This assumes the tariff will continue.

        Also true; QB suffers from a raging case of TDS.

        1. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

          Short term corrections in stock markets don't even impart a cost. Sounds like qb doesn't have stocks.

        2. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

          I guess you're right. No one cares when the markets across the entire world tank. It's meaningless if Trump says so.

          Anyway...if you have any worthless stocks cluttering up your accounts, I'll take them.

  13. Roberta   2 months ago

    Who's the guy I keep mixing up with Peter Navarro who had that Cato-sponsored plan ~45 years ago to phase out Social Security? He had a similar name, but it may be similar only by my criteria.

  14. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    'Justices Sonia Sotomayor, Elena Kagan, and Ketanji Brown Jackson appended a statement below the unsigned order, adding, "To this day, the Government has cited no basis in law for Abrego Garcia's warrantless arrest, his removal to El Salvador, or his confinement in a Salvadoran prison. Nor could it."'

    Not to get overtly political or anything.

    Also, chicks, right?
    Justice may have once been blind. Now apparently it is blindly partisan.

    1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

      This is why you can’t have chicks in charge.

      1. Quicktown Brix   2 months ago

        This and bird flu

        1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

          Don’t egg me on like this.

          1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

            What are you, chicken?

  15. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    "There are no winners in a tariff war and China is not afraid of oppression, Chinese President Xi Jinping told visiting Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez on Friday"

    Oppression? I see Xi has been reading post-modern American left wing philosophy. But he missed the point: everything, at least here, is based on fear of oppression.

    1. Moonrocks   2 months ago

      Reading? He's been partly bankrolling it.

  16. Ajsloss   2 months ago

    the adult in the room

    Are we doing this again? Are the walls closing in on said room?

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

      Well, Pluggo is back to shouting "Russia, Russia, Russia!" so maybe yes. What's on Vox today?

    2. Super Scary   2 months ago

      People familiar with the thinking of the walls are closing in!

  17. Stupid Government Tricks   2 months ago

    Liz, if you read the comments ...

    The "smoke..." link is not paywalled, at least for the summary page and ToC. I avoid podcasts like the plague; I can read and skim and search text a whole lot faster than listen.

    Aside from being a podcast, it also turns me off right from the start:

    Wolfe is not your average 28 year old: Unapologetically pro-life and pro-natalist as a time when many in her generation haven’t even started contemplating freezing their eggs. Or, in the case of singer Chappell Roan, 27, they might tell an interviewer, “All of my friends who have kids are in hell. I actually don’t know anyone who’s happy and has children at this age.”

    This is why I despise personal pronouns. I will bet, based on that quote from Roan, that Roan is a she whose personal pronoun is meant to hide that fact, but it's all too easy to think "they" includes both of you. The woke usage muddies the meaning.

    The purpose of language is to communicate. Muddying the meaning to appease the subject of an interview does not help communicate ideas. Even if a transcript were available, I will not waste my time reading something intentionally written to confuse the reader.

    I canceled a subscription to Analog science fiction magazine when one issue had three separate stories bowing to the personal pronoun brigade. One of them dealt with (space!) aliens, plural, visiting Earth, and the author and/or editors thought it cute to call both individuals and groups of them "they". The thing was unreadable. Science fiction has been dealing with space aliens for a century and never had any problem with pronouns before.

    1. Minadin   2 months ago

      I think the 'they' you are objecting to doesn't refer to Roan, specifically, but the group to which she belongs - females in that age group. In which case, a plural pronoun is grammatically appropriate.

      Conversely, it could be just a common lazy use of language error, for instance, you might hear someone say something along the lines of: 'I spoke to some guy at the station and they said the train to Baltimore ran hourly.' Improper use, but not uncommon.

      1. Zeb   2 months ago

        Yeah, that was very common well before preferred pronouns were a big thing.

      2. Randy Sax   2 months ago

        'I spoke to some guy at the station and they said say the train to Baltimore ran hourly.'

        Is how I hear it more often.

      3. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 months ago

        Well they lied...the train to Baltimore barely works, let alone runs on time.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

          Clearly "they" needs more government funding.

      4. Jefferson Paul   2 months ago

        Before the modern trans culture war, when I heard someone relating an anecdote, but he used "they" to describe the person, I would wonder if the speaker was lying.

        "So my friend came to me and said they weren't happy about this thing that Bush said." You know the friend you're referring to. You know that that friend is a male (or conversely a female). There is no reason to use "they" to describe your friend. Back then many people would use "they" when they didn't know the sex of the antecedent. But when people made up a story they were more likely to use "they," as well.

        But now with all of this pronoun nonsense all of that is thrown out the window.

    2. Juliana Frink   2 months ago

      Interesting comment about "Analog" science fiction magazine. Back in the late 90's I wrote dozens of science fiction short stories in hopes of getting them into such publications. I was always a fan of the classic science fiction style, and at the risk of coming off as cliche, submitted that which I was comfortable with. And wouldn't you know, Some of the rejection slips I got mentioned cliche as being the reason. Well, okay.

      At the same time, I was getting pretty disgusted with the glaring political correctness that had infiltrated the genre. I finally stopped submitting to the magazines, and stopped reading them. Thanks SGT, for letting me know I haven't been missing anything.

      PK Dick still seems fresh. And for what it's worth, I think Jack Williamson's "With Folded Hands" should be required reading for all middle school students.

      1. Stupid Government Tricks   2 months ago

        I think it was more or less 5-10 years ago. Kindle edition, I could probably find it again.

        Thanks for trying. Science fiction makes you think.

        I remember another story which caused me to drop Asimov's. (I had three subscriptions: Asimov's had the best writing and worst ideas, Analog had the best ideas and worst writing, and the third (Fantasy and SF?) was in between.) Some guy woke up from a dream about being in a rowboat on fire ... to find he was in a rowboat on fire. That was the whole story. No science, nothing speculative, no mystery, no character development, no nothing. I suppose someone might say it was an allegory about not knowing if we live in a dream world or something, but that kind of story was not what I paid for.

        Maybe I should look into Analog again. Maybe the end of Biden shook them up. I didn't mind the crappy writing. Analog was like live concerts. Asimov's was like albums which came out of five years of studio work, and that last story was like finding they'd dumped in John Cage.

        1. Juliana Frink   2 months ago

          Used to read all three you mentioned. Of all the rejection slips I racked up, I had several personal and encouraging ones from F&SF. Told me to keep trying. Ah well. Maybe some day.

      2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

        IMO, worse than science fiction pubs going woke are more actual science pubs, like Scientific American, going woke. Probably connected somehow.

        As for required reading, I nominate Harrison Bergeron, for middle school and the US Congress. But we have to stop pushing 1984, since Democrats think it's an instruction manual.

        1. Stupid Government Tricks   2 months ago

          Harrison Bergeron would scare too many people. That alone makes it good.

        2. Stupid Government Tricks   2 months ago

          Also ... I gave up on SciAm sometimes before April 1980, based on where I was living. They used to begin with a flabby article seldom worth reading, usually social or psychological, then all the real science articles, then the DIY project, and Martin Gardner's tricks and puzzles.

          This time, that lead article's thesis was that communist capital cities are healthier for the planet than capitalist capital cities. His two prime examples were the two Koreas. North Korea's picture was dark and devoid of people. South Korea's was crowded with people, some with shopping bags, and store windows, everything bright and colored. He thought the North Korean picture showed a healthier more sane city.

          He also complained that South Korea's city showed one of the prime problems with cities, that they concentrate sewage all in one area instead of spread out of thousands of small villages. That was a real head scratcher.

          I don't remember now if I canceled it or just let it expire, but I was done.

      3. Small w woodchippertarian   2 months ago

        JULIANA FRINK IS THE CIGARETTE SMOKING MAN!!!11!1

  18. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    'Sen. Rand Paul (R–Ky.) breaks down why tariffs are fundamentally wrong, and how they will have terrible effects on the American middle class'

    Will he next cover income and property taxes?

  19. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    'Love that this, initially released by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), contains IDEAS.'

    Can we ask Sarc to help with ideas?

  20. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

    Peter Navarro relegated to the sidelines and Wall Street punching bag Howard Lutnick recast into the role of "bad cop,

    These two are jokes and have zero credibility. The whole cabinet is full of retards (ML is woke police and he can fine me for that).

    Bessent has cred but he is obviously shilling for shitty policy.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

      Hey, um, Turd, you want to review the Russia Russia Russia stuff released above?

      1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

        Link me. No wingnut sites.

        WSJ, NY Times, Bloomberg all acceptable.

        1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

          They’re the actual files in ML’s comments, you idiot.

          1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

            Crossfire Hurricane is a line from Jumpin' Jack Flash.

            Great song. One of my favorites.

            Russia still colluded with, met with, shared intel with the 2016 Trump campaign. It is well documented.

            1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

              Returdo, you are so full of shit. Even when shown the actual evidence, you continue to stick to your delusions.

              1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

                turd certainly is dishonest, but he’s got a heaping helping of stupid to go with his dishonesty. Stupid, lying, despicable steaming pile of lefty shit and proud to be!

            2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

              turd, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
              If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
              turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

        2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

          turd, the TDS-addled ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
          If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
          turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

        3. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

          Can we also get Well-Adjusted-Biden-Guy's take on those files please?

          1. Ajsloss   2 months ago

            Don't forget Senater Tim Scott.

            1. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

              Shrike's socks all share that homoerotic fascination with Scott.

    2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

      turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
      If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
      turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

    3. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

      "...Bessent has cred..."

      A laugh riot, right there! turd, the lying pile of TDS-addled lefty shit who never posts the truth is going to tell us about CRED?!
      Get reamed with a barb-wire-wrapped broomstick, shit-stain.

    4. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

      (ML is woke police and he can fine me for that)

      Opposing the Klan doesn't make one woke, Kleagle:

      "Katanji Brown Jackson for lowest IQ affirmative action hire
      Uncle Clarence a candidate.
      Sandy, I had a genuine fear that a Senator Walker would be shucking and jiving us good liberty-loving Georgians every day.
      Do you remember Spermin’ Herman Cain? He sounded like a slave extra from Song of the South.
      No, you’re a fucking snowflake who only gets offended when one of your Lawn Jockeys is criticized.
      Groveling like a shoe-shine boy, Tim Scott humiliates himself
      Tim Scott’s twerking and jiving is just him feeling that ole-timey religion.
      Fact checking Tim Scott – Trump’s black friend/shine boy
      How many little lawn jockeys are in your yard? I bet it looks like a scene from a Tarzan movie out there."

      That's flat out racism, Shrike and you can't hide behind accusations of "Woke" which is also a form of racism just like yours.

      1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

        THAT'S GOLD!

      2. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

        He also hides behind outright stupidity (see immediately above).

  21. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    'Cops in my illustrious city are looking for a man…who appears to have sexually assaulted a corpse…on an R train. I am begging my local politicians to prioritize subway safety. This is insane.'

    So, is dead-loving more of a crime than dead-naming?

    1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

      How common are corpses on trains in NY?

      1. Randy Sax   2 months ago

        Fresh ones?

      2. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        No idea, but apparently you have a choice of cold and hot (on fire) there.

    2. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 months ago

      I'd like to know if is wrong to do this on other trains in NYC or if the R train has a specific no fucking corpses policy?

      1. Marshal   2 months ago

        I'd like to know how the corpse got on the train. Normally you'd think a corpse being transported would have someone with it to stop such and event.

        Did he bring it with him? Was the corpse from someone who previously died on the train which subway personnel had not yet removed? If so why not?

        1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

          So we don’t have a zombie problem in NYC?

        2. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

          “There’s a dead guy on the train”

          “Not my job”.

  22. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    Cops in my illustrious city are looking for a man…who appears to have sexually assaulted a corpse…on an R train.

    A lot to unpack.

    1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

      Forget it, Fist, it's (not) Chinatown.

    2. Sometimes a Great Notion   2 months ago

      *The Great Carnac opens envelope*

      What did the undertaker say to the cops?

  23. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    "I interviewed people who've developed emotional—even sexual—relationships with LLMs," reads the subhed. "They're not as crazy as they seem." More: "AI companionship, in all its manifestations, does not feel entirely new. It is an extension of several long-established traditions of imaginative intimacy: erotic literature, fandom roleplay, sex toy-assisted masturbation, self-shipping communities in fandoms, and even robosexuality, that is, loving technology for the technology itself. It is a tool that exists in a vast, well-established ecosystem of behaviors and motivations."

    Libertarian or libertine? And sad?

    1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

      Take a shower and shave, go find a real girl.

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

        Does that mean doing the Crocodile Dundee test?

        1. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

          It’s mandatory.

        2. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

          Nowadays? More than likely.

    2. Gaear Grimsrud   2 months ago

      Yeah no they're just as crazy as they seem.

  24. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    Our job is to ensure people, money, products and intellectual property. DO NOT enter the U.S. illegally.

    That weird punctuation is President Trump's IP and you just stole it, ICE.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

      What, the lack of an Oxford comma?

  25. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    'I'm not sure Democratic activists' approach of trying to allow ever-more third parties (doctors, teachers) to intervene in the parent-child relationship, or trump the parent's decision making, will yield good results.'

    Depends on whether public school teachers can mobilize enough kids to march (and spy on mom and dad).

  26. Fist of Etiquette   2 months ago

    I'm not sure Democratic activists' approach of trying to allow ever-more third parties (doctors, teachers) to intervene in the parent-child relationship...

    It takes a village to indoctrinate a child.

  27. Marshal   2 months ago

    It's now been two weeks since the NYT dropped the biggest story of the year: that the American military moved closer and closer to operational control of the Ukrainian military in its war on Russia to include directing its artillery and rocket fire on Russian targets. This is one of many "bright line" violations from earlier restrictions on American involvement which occurred during a time President Biden was too mentally incompetent to have decided himself.

    Reason has yet to admit the existence of this report in any way at all.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

      It’s way too local and doesn’t involve food trucks or weed.

      1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

        And gay stuff.

    2. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

      So Donnie has us in a hot war with Russia?

      Don't tell the cult that. They are campaigning for his Nobel.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        Somehow you missed the obvious, Turdo.

        This is one of many "bright line" violations from earlier restrictions on American involvement which occurred during a time President Biden was too mentally incompetent to have decided himself.

        Where does that say Trump anywhere in it, Turdski?

        1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

          Still not a story, dumbfuck.

          1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

            So the fact that Russiagate is proven to be a total and complete fabrication isn’t a story, Returdo?

            1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

              Russia still colluded with, met with, shared intel with the 2016 Trump campaign. It is well documented.

              Russian collusion is documented. The Trump campaign met with Kremlin officials in June 2016 at the Trump Tower. No one disputes this fact.

              1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

                Where’s your citations and links, Turd? I’d say the actual fucking FBI documents trump your bullshit.

              2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

                turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
                If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
                turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit.

              3. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

                "Russia still colluded with, met with, shared intel with the 2016 Trump campaign. It is well documented."

                This is a lie. It is not documented. At all.

                "Russian collusion is documented. The Trump campaign met with Kremlin officials in June 2016 at the Trump Tower. No one disputes this fact.

                Again, this is a lie. The Trump campaign never met with Kremlin officials in June 2016 at the Trump Tower.
                This did not happen.

                Trump's son Donald Trump Jr., and son-in-law, Jared Kushner, met with Natalia Veselnitskaya at her request.
                Neither Veselnitskaya, who was a lobbyist or Rinat Akhmetshin, who also was a lobbyist, worked for the Russian government. Akhmetshin was an American citizen.
                THEY WERE NOT KREMLIN OFFICIALS

                Time to stop lying.

          2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

            turd, the TDS-addled ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
            If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
            turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

        2. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

          "Somehow you missed the obvious, Turdo."

          TDS will do that.

      2. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

        Try typing Benghazi in all caps. That's always been one of your strongest arguments.

        1. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

          Hey, remember the announcement in yesterday's comments. Capital letters are now white patriarchy colonial oppression.

          1. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

            I guess it tracks with Shrike's racism.

      3. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

        turd, the TDS-addled ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
        If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
        turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

    3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

      Polis just signed a ban on basically all common guns.

      Brandon Richard
      @BrandonLRichard
      BREAKING: Colorado Gov. Jared Polis signs SB25-003 into law, banning the manufacture of and severely restricting the sale of certain semiautomatic firearms with detachable magazines. #coleg #copolitics
      @DenverChannel

      They'll ignore this too.

      1. Z Crazy   2 months ago

        Gang violence in the ghetto is a huge problem, and this law will make it easier to put away the gang member.

        Whats the downside?

        1. Michael Ejercito   2 months ago

          That is an interesting approach, assuming that the people who enact stricter gun control laws have a sincere desire to suppress street crime.

          Which side wanted to defund the police?

        2. damikesc   2 months ago

          It is ADORABLE that you believe that.

          All it does is insure that innocent people are unprotected.

          I do not get how a party that feels that the cops cannot be trusted ALSO want the only people to have guns to be...cops.

          1. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

            I do not get how a party that feels that the cops cannot be trusted ALSO want the only people to have guns to be...cops.

            Being incredibly stupid helps.

            1. Michael Ejercito   2 months ago

              They only want cops that will only go after their political enemies.

              They feel that Laken Riley and AJ Wise had it coming.

        3. Medulla Oblongata   2 months ago

          Project Exile is a federal program started in Richmond, Virginia, in 1997. Project Exile shifted the prosecution of illegal technical gun possession offenses to federal court, where they carried a mandatory minimum sentence of five years in federal prison under the federal Gun Control Act of 1968, rather than in state court. Note that federal law (18 U.S. Code § 922(g) & 924) provides for a penalty of ten years in federal prison for being a "prohibited person", i.e., a convicted felon in possession of a firearm, as well as for falsifying information in order to obtain one, or furnishing a gun to a convicted felon.

          Project Exile was opposed by some gun-rights groups and some black leaders, the latter saying that it disproportionately affected African Americans.

      2. Marshal   2 months ago

        Courts will kill this shortly, but it does show left wingers don't have any use for the constitution.

    4. sarcasmic   2 months ago

      You are aware that only leftists read the NYT, right?

      1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        You are aware that you’re a retard, right?

    5. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

      Cool, 5 billion can die in an hour when WWIII breaks out and the ICBMs are launched.

      How narcissistic are the left that they would rather have 5 billion die than have people just acknowledge Hillary lost a winnable race in 2016 because she is an arrogant fuckup, and the Dems screwed up by nominating the one person with high enough negatives for Trump to beat?

      I really don't care to die for the glory of Hillary.

      1. Marshal   2 months ago

        I'm not sure how this ties back to Hillary. In Reason's case I think it reflects their current priorities. They want Trump gone more than they want nuclear war to not happen.

        It's weird though since it seems obvious it's possible to want more than one thing at a time. This suggests they see a conflict, that recognizing that Biden was drawing us into war will hamper the efforts to get rid of Trump. I'm not sure I see this given that Biden is permanently out of the picture. But I guess they suspect any Dem would have and will again act as Biden did. Maybe that is true but I don't see it as a good enough reason to ignore reality.

      2. Michael Ejercito   2 months ago

        None of them had a problem with Russia until 2016.

        who was it that said," The 1980's called and they want their foreign policy back"?

        1. Rick James   2 months ago

          That's not really true. There has been a neocon anti-Russia attitude for many years, probably leading back to just after the post-Yeltsin period.

          McCain was extremely hostile to Russia prior to the Maidan coup in 2014. The whole reason that the US broke its promise about NATO not moving "one inch" eastward is because the anti-Russia faction within US politics has been dominant for so many years. That goes back to Clinton.

        2. Marshal   2 months ago

          "I'll have more flexibility after the election". - Obama to Medvedev to pass along to Putin.

          But even if the 2016 election driven Russian Collusion Hoax had not occurred Dems still would be supporting UKR and we'd be in the same position.

    6. Rick James   2 months ago

      Some dude got a talking-to because he perved on women in the women's bathroom.

  28. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    Diversity is our strength!!

    Labour ‘dropped grooming gangs inquiries to avoid offending Pakistanis’
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/04/09/labour-dropped-grooming-gang-inquiries-offending-pakistanis/

  29. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    Unearthed FBI Chat Logs Reveal 'Gag Order' On Biden Laptop Exposé
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/unearthed-fbi-chat-logs-reveal-gag-order-biden-laptop-expose

    On Oct. 14, 2020, the New York Post released its first story on the laptop’s content. That same day, FBI officials instructed agents, “please do not discuss Biden matter.”

    Earlier chats show a group of agents—including Laura Dehmlow, Bradley Benavides and James Dennehy—debating the Post’s story.

    “You guys are tracking the coverage of the laptop right?” Dehmlow wrote. Both Benavides and Dennehy replied affirmatively.

    Later, agents whose names remain sealed sent messages stating, “right answer – nobody on call is is [sic] authorized to comment upon NY Post story” and “nobody [is] authorized to comment.”

    One agent asked if another had “admonished” the colleague who nearly revealed the laptop’s authenticity to Big Tech companies. “yes but he wont [sic] shut up,” one response read.

  30. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    https://x.com/jeremykauffman/status/1909976023896117367

    "Experts were wrong about one important thing 5 years ago, therefore we can ignore all expertise in all domains"

    1. Rev Arthur L kuckland (5-30-24 banana republic day)   2 months ago

      Correct

  31. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/tulsi-gabbard-drops-two-huge-bombshells

    National Intelligence Director Tulsi Gabbard made a startling revelation during an open cabinet meeting Wednesday, announcing that she has evidence that electronic voting machines have been tampered with to manipulate the results of past US elections.

    1. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

      Then she handed out My Pillow samples to the crowd.

      1. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

        turd, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
        If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
        turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit.

      2. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

        Shitty attempt at redirection from the fact that you criminals stole an election.

  32. sarcasmic   2 months ago

    https://graboyes.substack.com/p/tired-of-winning-apparently

    A few snippets that will drive Trump defenders crazy.

    Ancient societies believed solar eclipses caused plagues, deaths of kings, crop failures, etc. To stave off the anger of gods or God, they beat drums, flung arrows, slaughtered livestock, and sacrificed children. This madness subsided as science demonstrated that eclipses were predictable and benign.

    Antique societies similarly feared trade deficits. Their religion—“mercantilism”—taught that trade deficits impoverish a nation, benefit the wealthy, and result from other countries’ malice. Mercantilists viewed tariffs the way their ancestors viewed drums, arrows, cattle-slaughter, and child-sacrifice. Their beliefs were demolished by David Hume (1752), Adam Smith (1776), David Ricardo (1817), and centuries of theory and data. Unfortunately, economists haven’t been as successful as astronomers at dispelling superstition.
    ..
    Superstition #3: Tariffs increase national prosperity
    Tariffs can sometimes benefit segments of a country’s economy by harming the rest of the population even more. Steel tariffs might enrich American steelmakers by $100 billion by making other Americans poorer by $200 billion. When those other Americans buy fewer products with steel, even the steel industry can end up poorer.
    ..
    Superstition #6: Trade has destroyed American manufacturing
    Manufacturing employment has shrunk over the past half-century, both in absolute numbers and even more as a share of overall employment, but mostly because of domestic competition and automation. Some manufacturing did go overseas as Americans moved into higher-earning occupations. Likewise, 150 years ago, 50% of Americans worked in farming, versus 2 percent today—but we don’t fret that 48% of Americans have “lost their farm jobs.” To be sure, there are some worrying reasons why some manufacturing has gone overseas. For example, eliminating shop classes on American schools a generation ago left us bereft of skilled craftspersons. But tariffs won’t fix that.

    Overall it's a good read for anyone who isn't willfully and deliberately ignorant of economics.

    1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

      Blah, blah, blah, Sarc shows off his TDS yet again.

    2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

      Is that your opinion sarc? Did you say this yesterday?

      I remember when I worked at a job that paid overtime, and if I worked too much my paycheck would be smaller because it put me into a higher bracket. So I limited the hours I worked.

      I don't think anyone cares about your opinion on economics.

      Question for you. Do you know the following names: Nicholas Kaldor, C.F. Bickerdike, or Francis Edgeworth?

      1. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 months ago

        Lol. Did he say that?

        Of all the OT hours I’ve put in over the years, not once has the IRS taken 100+% of it. Not once did an extra hour result in less pay than if I had not worked it.

        What an idiot.

    3. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

      Here's your attention, Sarcasmic. Now call them a "CULT".

      Witches cast 'mass spell' against Donald Trump

      Sculpture of Obama as Jesus causes stir

      From Mecca, a prayer for Obama

      Distraught liberals hold ‘group scream’ on beach following Trump victory

  33. Rick James   2 months ago

    MSNBC Settles $30 million defamation lawsuit regarding MSNBC claiming doctor was performing unwanted hysterectomies on migrants in a detention center.

  34. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    https://x.com/DefiyantlyFree/status/1910566402798272652

    DOGE found that approximately 9,700 individuals, with birth dates more than 15 years in the future, have applied for $69 million in welfare benefits.

    Read that again. How does this not infuriate everyone?

    1. sarcasmic   2 months ago

      That's about as infuriating as learning that there are people over 100 years old in the SS database.

      Not at all.

      What would be infuriating is them receiving benefits. Being in a database doesn't equal getting benefits, nor does applying for welfare.

      You're being played like a fiddle by liars who give out incomplete information knowing that you emotional Trump defenders will jump to conclusions.

      Get some information on how many of these people actually receive money instead of emoting over conclusions drawn from useless tidbits meant to make you angry.

      1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

        Anything so you don’t have to face reality, Sarc?

      2. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

        Sarc defends fraud. Amazing.

    2. Zeb   2 months ago

      That one sounds like data entry fuckups. If it was deliberate fraud, I'd think they would be smart enough to at least make it plausible. You never know I guess. In any case, this is something that should be audited regularly. If this kind of stuff isn't caught, then there's lots of room for undetected fraud.

      1. Rick James   2 months ago

        Here's the problem with that.

        Us: Can we look at your database?
        SSA: No
        Us: Well we're going to look at it.
        SSA: *sigh* we'll fight you in court.
        Us: Great, in the meantime, we're looking at your database for fraud.
        SSA: There is no fraud. 136% of the people receiving benefits are 174% eligible for them.
        Us: Let's talk again after we take a look at the database.

        *looks*

        Us: Holy shit, you've got people who are 224 years old, plus people who are -26 years old receiving hundreds of millions in benefts!
        SSA: Wait, what? Let me see that.

        *looks*

        SSA: Probably a data entry fuck up
        Us: Is it?
        SSA: *shifts uncomfortably, looks at press talking point memo* Y... yeah, COBOL code does that kind of thing, or something.
        Us: But you said there was no fraud, but yet you've got thousands of people with impossible data here... have you investigated these?
        SSA: No.
        Us: Then how do you know it's not fraud?
        SSA: *looks again* because it looks like a cobol-ish data entry fuck up.
        Us: So let me get this straight... you've been operating for decades with tens of thousands of recipients with completely bogus personal data, yet you assure everyone that there is no fraud, how did we find it in *looks at watch* 7 and a half minutes? And you didn't even want to let us look at it?
        SSA: Shut up racist.

        1. sarcasmic   2 months ago

          Holy shit, you've got people who are 224 years old, plus people who are -26 years old receiving hundreds of millions in benefts!

          Except that's not what they found. They found people who are 224 years old in the database, and people who are -15 years old applying for benefits. Neither of those things are proof or even evidence of them receiving benefits.

          I'll repeat that one more time.

          Being in the database doesn't equal receiving benefits.

          Applying for benefits doesn't equal receiving benefits.

          Stop emoting and engage your brain.

          1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

            You have evidence these folks aren’t getting benefits? If they’re glitches, it also goes to show we have rather large issues with that’s being ignored within government.

          2. Don't look at me! (No longer muted!)   2 months ago

            These types of errors are a bright red flag for corruption that would probably land people in jail if it was happening in private industry.

          3. JesseAz (Prime Meanster of Sarcasia)   2 months ago

            Hilarious watching you defend fraud and you don't realize it. He could change SSA to sarc in his post and you'd be doing the meme.

        2. Zeb   2 months ago

          That is just a dramatized version of what I was saying.

      2. chemjeff radical individualist   2 months ago

        No no, Zeb. It's totally real and you should be OUTRAGED over it so much that you hand over all of your votes and liberty and property to Team Red so that they can SAVE AMERICA.

        1. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

          Jeff, you realize your track record on this kind of stuff is in the sewer, right?

          1. chemjeff radical individualist   2 months ago

            You realize that your team's propagandists try to manipulate you using fear and outrage to generate votes and attention, right? That is Jesse's main goal here in this forum. So, SS database errors turn into MASSIVE FRAUD!!! THEY'RE STEALING FROM YOU! GIVE US YOUR SUPPORT TO STOP THEM FROM STEALING FROM YOU!!! They're lying to you and manipulating you.

            1. Bertram Guilfoyle   2 months ago

              I don't need a "team" to be outraged about everything connected to the SSA. It's been morally and fiscally bankrupt for its' entire existence.

              THEY'RE STEALING FROM YOU!

              You got this part right, by accident.

              Also, you forgot to address your track record.

            2. Mother's Lament - (Sarcasian Meanister of Foreign Affairs)   2 months ago

              "MASSIVE FRAUD!!! THEY'RE STEALING FROM YOU! GIVE US YOUR SUPPORT TO STOP THEM FROM STEALING FROM YOU!!! They're lying to you and manipulating you."

              All of these things have been proven true time and time again.

              You're like a Wiseguy mocking people who are pointing out the mob is running a sanitization contact.

            3. EISTAU Gree-Vance   2 months ago

              “…..manipulate you using fear and outrage…”

              “THEY GON’ PUT Y’ALL BACK IN CHAINS!”

              - joe biden

              Haha. Fuck you jeff. You’re the worst.

        2. Zeb   2 months ago

          I have no doubt that there is tons of fraud to be found as well. I'm sure it could be done better. Pretty much everything that gets done could be done better. But I'm glad someone is looking at all of this stuff. It's insane that anyone objects to a thorough audit of government outlays.

          1. Its_Not_Inevitable   2 months ago

            It's insane that anyone objects to a thorough audit of government outlays.

            Amen.

    3. Moonrocks   2 months ago

      $69 million

      This sounds like a joke.

  35. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    https://x.com/lamps_apple/status/1849679481620865142

    Hillary screams into the mic, "DEPORT THEM!!! THEY'RE GONE!!!" Democrats cheer, media praises her "tough stance on border security" as she demands they need to learn English.

    1. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

      https://x.com/lamps_apple/status/1849815938645807129

      Hillary warned about the same border risks Democrats now call Trump “racist” for addressing. She stressed that 40% of illegal immigrants came legally and overstayed, noting the post-9/11 dangers. Yet, when Trump says it, they slam him—what changed?

  36. Ra's al Gore   2 months ago

    https://x.com/Mick_O_Keeffe/status/1910669298244157887

    Ireland is being plundered by a small group of Irish families, banks and foreign investors. They are making billions for housing migrants through a network of shadowy offshore companies.

    This industry is backed up by an NGO complex that employs 200,000 people and also costs us billions. Its purpose is to dumb us down and convince Irish people that being replaced in our own homeland is normal.

    The police and judicial system are also onboard. Enforcing illegitimate laws passed by compromised politicians who serve the EU. Foreigners even get special privileges under Irish law.

    What's happening to Ireland is completely unnatural. Dumping people from African and Islamic countries into an ancient and homogeneous society is the quickest way of causing that society to collapse.

    Trust is low, cohesion is gone and people from the 3rd world are walking straight into our country without even so much as medical screening. HIV, typhoid and diphtheria are becoming more common in Ireland.

    None of us are safe.

    Plus the added strain these migrants place on our housing market, education and healthcare systems cannot be ignored.

    Those of us older than 20 remember the old Ireland. An Ireland with a relaxed pace of life and high trust communities.

    We have a responsibility to maintain that version of Ireland and hand it to the next generation.

    1. Rick James   2 months ago

      Ireland is being plundered by a small group of Irish families, banks and foreign investors. They are making billions for housing migrants through a network of shadowy offshore companies.

      Ah, so that's why people in England were protesting DOGE.

  37. Small w woodchippertarian   2 months ago

    Liz, you should consider reading Unrestricted Warfare by Col Qiao Liang & Col Wang Xiangsui (1999). You could probably start with Chapter 6 if you don't want their assessment of US performance in the Gulf War.

  38. Earth-based Human Skeptic   2 months ago

    '"Tesla Inc. stopped taking orders in China for Model S sedans and Model X sport utility vehicles—both of which are imported from the US—after the countries raised tariffs on one another in an escalating trade war," reports Bloomberg.'

    See, President-for-life Musk was behind this whole thing!

  39. Sarah Palin's Buttplug - Jan 6 = 9/11 (same motive)   2 months ago

    biggest flip-flopper in history:

    Donald Trump Says Millions of Illegal Immigrants Could Be Allowed to Return

    https://www.newsweek.com/trump-says-millions-illegal-immigrants-could-return-farms-hotels-2058413

    1. InsaneTrollLogic (Sarcasia’s disloyal opposition)   2 months ago

      I’ll believe that when I see it, Turd, instead of from Newsweak.

    2. Sevo, 5-30-24, embarrassment   2 months ago

      turd, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
      If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
      turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a TDS-addled lying pile of lefty shit.

  40. Spinach Chin   2 months ago

    "The Court, in an unsigned order, told the Trump administration that it must "facilitate and effectuate the return" of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia from CECOT"

    This is not what the SC ordered, but that hasn't stopped every 2-bit, gormless pundit from claiming it does.

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