California Defies SCOTUS by Imposing Myriad New Restrictions on Public Gun Possession
By banning firearms from a long list of "sensitive places," the state is copying a policy that federal judges have repeatedly rejected.

A California law that is scheduled to take effect on January 1 will impose a host of new restrictions on public possession of firearms. That may seem counterintuitive, since Senate Bill 2 is the state legislature's response to the U.S. Supreme Court's June 2022 ruling in New York State Rifle & Pistol Association v. Bruen, which upheld the Second Amendment right to carry guns for self-defense outside the home. But California, like several other states with discretionary carry-permit policies that had to be revised because of Bruen, is attempting an end run around that decision by simultaneously making permits easier to obtain and much harder to use.
In Bruen, the Supreme Court said states may not require permit applicants to demonstrate "a special need for self-protection distinguishable from that of the general community." Accordingly, S.B. 2, which Gov. Gavin Newsom signed into law on September 26, eliminates California's "good cause" requirement, along with a similarly amorphous "good character" criterion (although it still disqualifies applicants deemed "reasonably likely" to pose a danger to themselves or others). By limiting the discretion of licensing authorities, S.B. 2 notes, those changes could have opened the door to "broadly allowing individuals to carry firearms in most public areas." Deeming that outcome intolerable, legislators instead decreed that guns may not be carried in most public areas.
Copying the constitutionally dubious approach taken by states such as New York, New Jersey, Maryland, and Hawaii, S.B. 2 designates myriad locations as "sensitive places" where guns are not permitted. It also establishes a default rule that people may not bring guns into a business unless the owner "clearly and conspicuously posts a sign at the entrance of the building or on the premises indicating that licenseholders are permitted to carry firearms on the property."
As a federal lawsuit challenging those rules notes, the law "turns the Bruen decision on its head, making nearly every public place in California a 'sensitive place' (in name only)" and "forbidding firearm carry even after someone has undertaken the lengthy and expensive process to be issued a concealed handgun license." California's gun-free zones "include every park and playground, every hospital, all public transportation, any place that sells alcohol (which, in California, includes most gas stations and convenience and grocery stores), all land under the control of the Department of Parks and Recreation or the Department of Fish and Wildlife (with exceptions for hunting), libraries, churches, banks, and many more." S.B. 2 "even transforms private businesses into 'gun-free zones' by default, imposing an unprecedented affirmative duty on private business owners to post signage to authorize people exercising an enumerated constitutional right to enter the property."
As a result, says the complaint in May v. Bonta, "Californians who desire to exercise their enumerated right to carry are essentially limited to some streets and sidewalks (so long as those public places are not adjacent to certain other 'sensitive' places), plus a few businesses willing to post a 'guns allowed' sign at the risk of potentially losing other customers by doing so." The law "creates a patchwork quilt of locations where Second Amendment rights may and may not be exercised, thus making exercise of the right so impractical and legally risky in practice that ordinary citizens will be deterred from even attempting to exercise their rights in the first place."
Under Bruen, California will have to show that its restrictions are "consistent with this Nation's historical tradition of firearm regulation." In this context, the lawsuit says, that means "all law-abiding, competent adults" have "the right to carry firearms and ammunition for self-defense in all public areas that have not historically been considered 'sensitive places' or their modern analogues based on relevant history."
Before S.B. 2 was enacted, federal judges had concluded that similar restrictions in New York and New Jersey failed the Bruen test. While California legislators were considering S.B. 2, a federal judge in Hawaii issued a temporary restraining order against several of that state's location-specific gun bans. Three days after Newsom signed S.B. 2, a federal judge blocked enforcement of Maryland's restrictions on firearms near public demonstrations, its ban on carrying guns in bars and restaurants that serve alcohol, and its presumptive rule against guns in other businesses open to the public.
Unfazed by those warnings, California is forging ahead with a policy that defies Bruen while pretending to comply with it. At a February 1 press conference announcing the introduction of S.B. 2, its supporters lamented the "radical Bruen ruling" and the resulting "flood of applicants" for carry permits while expressing the hope that the bill would mitigate the "disastrous effect of the Bruen decision." As the complaint in May v. Bonta notes, Newsom himself called Bruen "a very bad ruling" and "used air quotes when discussing the 'right' to carry firearms outside the home, making his contempt for the Constitution clear."
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Is anyone seriously still under the impression that these laws will onoy be enforced against the street thug and the gangbanger?
Murderers don’t worry about the law against murder, therefore we don’t need to outlaw murder.
See how dumb that logic is?
Yes, your logic IS dumb. Got it in one.
From a factual standpoint, ignoring the completely illogic of your framing, you're wrong. Many, if not most murderers, go through some trouble to avoid getting caught and or convicted of murder, thus they do care about laws against murder, they just don't follow them.
As to the logic side. 99.99% of gun owners never commit a felony with their firearm. They won't break the law. So, to punish the 0.01% that are law breakers, your solution is to punish the 99.99% of law abiding citizens? Murder laws obviously don't end murders, gun laws obviously don't stop gun related crime. The difference is that, laws against murder don't infringe upon the rights of people who don't ever commit a murder. Gun laws disproportionately impact the rights of the vast majority of gun owners who will never commit a crime with a gun.
None of that or even relevant. Democrats want to take the guns so they can impose their Marxism without resistance.
Everything else is just bullshit excuses.
I don't always agree with you but here I agree 100%. Governments just want us disarmed. Screw the law, constitution, Bill of rights, common sense or proven hard numbers. You having a gun scares them and slows their evil schemes.
The only reason they're trying so hard to take away the guns is because they're planning to do something that you'd shoot them for.
Thar seems to be the logic. I mean, no matter how many SoldierMedic76s argue but muh second amendment it comes down to marxists who want to throw out the constitution and bill of rights to form a more repressive union.
Okay operation stolen valor.
Look, whatever you are. If someone was stealing Valor don't you think they'd claim something more impressive than being the schmuck folding a flag and firing 3 blanks at a funeral at Arlington?
Oh, I know why they want to ban guns, I was simply picking apart his assertion of logic.
So, trying to sound smarter than other people to feed your ego while wasting time and electrons.
And you think I'm the troll.
Gee, the troll calls me a troll whatever should I do?
"So, trying to sound smarter than other people to feed your ego while wasting time and electrons."
You must be new here
Well, when my wife puts on another Christmas baking competition or another Halmark Christmas Romance I need something to do while getting plastered. So I drop by here and look for distractions.
That's not the logic in play here. The logic in play here is that this particular class of law that is passed almost exclusively targets people who do not, and never will commit a crime. In fact, the logic that you're trying shoehorn into this discussion is exactly the logic used to mock laws against drug use.
Addicts don’t worry about the law against drug use, therefore we don’t need to outlaw drugs.
See how dumb that logic is?
Another drive by leftist, who is convinced that they're so much smarter than those idiots on the right (this may surprise a lot of the self described most true Scotsman libertarians on here, but to progressives libertarians are the far right, see their description of the Argentina elections). He (I know wrong of me to assume gender) is sure that he will wow us with his pithy analysis that his professor lapped up (largely because it was largely sycophantic regurgitation of the professors' own opinions) that he doesn't consider that he will actually encounter people with far more knowledge and logic than he possesses. How many times have we seen this before, and how long do they generally last? The really committed embarrass themselves for a few days and then disappear back to whatever subreddit that they can best self fellate themselves on. A few outliers, (cough cough Jeffy cough Pluggy) stick around and continue to embarrass themselves for years out of some masochistic need to be abused intellectually. Some (Tony, Mikey) just suddenly disappear after years of getting upstaged intellectual by those they consider inferior. I do tend to wonder what has happened to them and sometimes question, given the obvious compromised mental status... Well you draw your own conclusion to how that sentence ends.
Wow. Lots of words.
Ban guns because a small percentage of people use guns irresponsibly. Ban drugs because a small percentage of people use drugs irresponsibly. Ban alcohol because a small percentage of people use alcohol irresponsibly. Ban certain opinions online because a small percentage of people use the internet irresponsibly.
It's the same argument every time. It's gotten boring. Both sides use it and claim they aren't using it when something they don't like comes up.
Both sides tried to make rock and roll illegal at various times. Comic books were a target in other eras. Every time it's the same argument, "Some kids are committing suicide because of the lyrics in Rock and Roll songs, or the images in comic books or Dungeons and Dragons so ignore the 1st amendment and Ban these things for everyone."
Doesn't matter if a D or an R is after their name, Ban things because some people can't handle the responsibility inherit in Liberty.
My only disagreement with you is when you use "both sides" as if there can only be 2 sides.
We've got a defacto two party system. The Stupid Party and the Evil Party.
Which one do you belong to since you make arguments completely unrelated to anything the person you're replying to actually wrote (or even supports)? Former or the latter? It's a binary choice.
Actually I was supporting the person you were arguing with originally.
Now you're just fun to mess with.
You're all "The law, logic and history are in my side blah blah blah." And people keep telling you that it doesn't matter because the law, logic and history are routinely ignored by both left and right if an agenda is on the table.
It's like you were sealed in a vault for 40 years and just were thawed out and put on front of a computer.
Dude, these arguments have failed to change anything and continue to fail. Get with the 21st century.
Who is everyone, you're the only one who stayed that? Uff da, you don't have an overinflated sense of yourself do you Ole?
They've failed, really? McDonald, Heller and Bruen all seem to be 21st century rulings. Additionally, why were you supporting his statement, he obviously was arguing for gun laws, not against them, I was arguing against them. So, you support gun control do you?
Also, Constitutional carry is also a 21st century occurrence. As is state's legalizing marijuana, again, what is your proof my arguments are dated? Because you're to stupid to understand that you're actually arguing with someone who is for gun rights and against the war on drugs, which you seem to also support, but you misunderstood and thought the guy arguing for gun control needed defending from the guy who supports the same thing as you? Wow, you're reading comprehension really does fucking suck. You think Andrew was arguing against gun control. That's fucking hilarious.
Or even funnier, you thought I was calling DPR a leftist. OMFG, you really are an Ole. Shit, I needed a good belly laugh today. Fuck, thanks for giving it to me. You thought I was arguing with DPR. That's fucking priceless. Jesus fucking Christ. That's fucking hilarious. Stop it man, I am going to piss my pants that's just to fucking funny. Here you are white knighting and white knighting for someone who didn't need it because your fucking reading comprehension fucking sucks. Fucking priceless. I'll have to bookmark this.
Your last post used the word "fuck" in one form or another 6 times.
I think you are losing your temper.
More like a uniparty with a spectrum. The democrats are largely consumed by the uniparty. The republicans aren’t yet, but the part that isn’t is the minority anymore.
We are likely past elections and the courts fixing things. More will be required.
That's why I like the "Stupid Party and Evil Party" bit. You can comfort yourself in thinking your preferred politicians are in the Stupid Party and at least they aren't evil.
Most of them are evil. The republicans aren’t entirely consumed by that, yet.
Left wing, right wing, still attached to the same dirty bird.
Damn right.
Damn left.
I think you're reading comprehension sucks. Where did I propose banning anything? Why did you respond this way to what I posted? Really? Fuck, talk about total non-sequitor.
As far as I can tell you didn't say anything beyond "me side good, you side bad."
Like I said, you're reading comprehension sucks.
And what exactly is my 'side'? I was making fun of a certain style of poster that is pretty common in the twenty years I've been commenting here. They're new posters, who think they are so much more intelligent than those of us who have posted for years. The often offer non sequitur arguments or illogical arguments or arguments that have nothing to do with who or what someone posted but what they consider to be a stance that what they consider the average poster to believe (maybe like someone posting about Roe never being an actual law unlike the 2A, and someone replies with, oh I ront know, maybe a completely unrelated remark about the drug war, but that's a completely hypothetical example, no one would actually do something so sophomoric).
TLDR.
Gee, what a thing to brag about. So, you're admitting you lack the ability to read complex posts or anything longer than 126 characters. No wonder you post non sequiturs and sophomoric boaf sidez anecdotap rants.
I didn't label you a tory. Talk about poor reading comprehension. I said you could be a tory and it wouldn't matter. Not that you were a tory and you don't matter.
We see this every day here from the likes of Shreek, Sarc, Pedo Jeffy, Reichmarshall Misek, etc., plus Tony.
Where is Tony? Haven’t seen that pinko bitch in ages.
I am seriously wondering if he didn't decide to take the long dirt nap after getting his ass handed to him so many times. And yes, the usual suspects. Andrew appears to be the other flavor. The drive by leftist come here to educate us poor, dumb right wingers and then getting himself so embarrassed that he doesn't come back. But it's fucking hilarious that Mr gobblygook thinks I was accusing DPR of being a leftist. It took me awhile, because I didn't think anyone with an above room temperature IQ could make that mistake, but I guess I gave him to much credit.
Who is Mr. gobbledygook a sock for?
Well, he labeled me a Tory down below and the only other person who’s done that is JFree. But given his whining about degenerating to personal attacks after he posted a personal attack, and his boaf sidez bullshit, I'd go with the alkie from Maine.
Further, very similar sophomoric trope, shallow arguments, misuse of Internet terminology (denied being a troll instead claims to be an asshole that gets off poking fun at others, which pretty much is the text book definition of troll). Dishes it out but can't take it. Difficulty with complex concepts. Non sequiturs about the war on drugs in a thread about gun control. Overdeveloped sense of his own superiority and intellect that the evidence strongly suggests is pure fantasy. Yeah, the alkie from Maine would be my bet if it were a sock.
And now he admits to drunk posting but he totes is not a sock. And he admits he just comes here for a distraction, but he totes isn't a troll. He's just an ass.
Could it possibly be White Mike with a new identity?
Not a sock, just a drunken asshole.
Not really an asshole. Dumbass maybe, but you aren't much of an asshole. I don't doubt you have delusions you're an asshole, but you really aren't.
"Where is Tony? Haven’t seen that pinko bitch in ages."
One of those people who would make the world a better place by dying, and making the world a better place is always desirable.
We can hope the steaming pile of lying lefty shit died.
Wasn't he secretly Kissinger?
I think he might secretly be Andy Dick. Who has a lot of legal difficulties resulting from his various sexual assaults in people. So maybe Tony is in prison.
Same for that guy KAR, he and tony struck me as unstable, so it's quite possible that something happened to them (or that they made something happen to them)
Isn't Mikey dead?
I'm not sure but it would explain a lot.
Mike Hihn is definitely dead. I tried to link his obituary, but Reason shit all over it.
I saw someone link this here once, but i dont know anything about him, so not sure if this is him.
https://obits.cleveland.com/us/obituaries/cleveland/name/michael-hihn-obituary?id=7712693
Yep, that’s him. I fondly remember having four entries on the enemies list that he published on his website.
Just to clarify, which Mikey, lying or demented Mikey? Demented Mikey is dead, Lying Mikey disappeared about a month ago after he got seriously beat down one day in the comment section about the time Liz took over the roundup.
But Hank below seems to be filling in the same niche as dementia Mikey once held.
I guess I'm thinking of demented Mike. Pretty sure I read here that he was dead (COVID maybe?). His special brand of foaming at the mouth has not been seen since.
I live in Pennsylvania. This time of year people go out and start their cars, leaving them idle to warm up, while they finish getting ready. A few years ago there was a rash of people stealing these cars. People wanted something done about this, so our Democrat run State Government passes a law making it illegal to have an unattended vehicle running. Nothing in the law affects car thieves, just regular people going about their business being made into criminals.
No. Murder is already illegal and that doesn't stop people from committing murder. The penalty is usually one of the highest available. Many states punish it with an attempt at a death penalty.
Tacking on lesser penalties for having the means of murder isn't going to sway someone with murder on the mind.
But by all means, take away an honest person's ability to defend themselves in an insane attempt to stop a person with murder on the mind. No matter how many times the strictest gun laws in the nation fail to prevent murder you won't learn anyhow.
Who was Shaneen Allen's victim?
Murder is initiation of force. Owning a weapon is not, and actually has deterrent value. Lysander Spooner, on the subject of vices, has already explained that handing a non-compos-mentis whack job the means to harm self and others is indeed actionable, and rightly so. So trust, but verify.
Your logic is impeccably awful.
Can you explain why, if laws against murder do not stop them, why laws against gun possession would?
"Murderers don’t worry about the law against murder, therefore we don’t need to outlaw murder."
Are lefty shits born ignoramuses, or to the practice long and hard to become one?
Fuck off and die, asshole.
The act of murder infringes upon others rights.
The act of exercising a Right does not deprive others.
Should I not be allowed to vote as my participation might offend someone?
Should I not enjoy feee speech as it might make someone uncomfortable?
In addition to SoldierMedic's comment above, if what you, Andy, say is true about murderers not caring about laws against murder, why would they obey laws against guns, designed supposedly to prevent murder?
Laws against murder are morally justified because murder itself is wrong. The mere possession or sales of firearms cause no harm in themselves and are not wrong in themselves. Supporters of gun laws try to justify such laws on the grounds that such laws, if obeyed, would prevent murder and other wrongful acts. But that justification is dependent upon potential murderers and other criminals actually obeying such laws when, in fact, they and most people are no more likely to obey gun-control laws than they would laws against murder or any real crime. So the practical justification of gun--control laws as preventing murder evaporates since they're no more likely to prevent murder than laws against murder itself. By restricting people's freedom to defend themselves, may actually increase murder.
Murderers also pose a much greater threat to the safety of others than anyone carrying a gun for self defense (or to be able to intervene to save another).
Anyone carrying a weapon with the intention of using it to commit a more serious crime isn't going to be deterred by laws limiting when/where they're "allowed" to carry, but intensive restriction on the rights of those without hostile intent mostly just turns more places in to a "soft target" where those looking to do harm can be more confident that they won't meet any significant resistance along the way.
Unless the crimes defined by the new law are felonies, they won't be enforced at all in L.A. or SF Counties.
Gangbangers will probably get a pass in the name of not engaging in racial profiling, or maybe just because they're more likely to be moving around in parts of town where there isn't much of a police presence anyway. Lots more money to be raised for the city with an agressive focus on parking enforcement in Hollywood and ticketing soccer mom's for rolling stop signs in the SFV, and not much to be made by slowing down the drug sales and extortion of the homeless on Skid Row and other parts of DTLA.
Perhaps federal prosecutors should be filing charges against those imposing illegal laws.
Nah. Democrats recognize the constitution. They have good intentions. All is good until an appeals court strikes it down, they they do it again. Repeat the process. It isnt like they made memes online or put feet on any desks.
Just like the right did with abortion.
They didn’t care that Roe was the law for 49 years, they still openly defied it until the right captured the court through shrewd politics (some have stronger words for McConnells games but in the end they were just political games).
Black letter law versus "penumbra" laws.
What law was passed, which legislature passed it and which president signed it into law? It wasn't the law, it was a legal decision that even many of its supporters (e.g. RBG) admitted was poorly reasoned and ripe for repeal. It was never law.
The second Amendment, however, is a law. The US Constitution and the associated Bill of Rights is literally the supreme law of the land. It was passed in a legislature and approved by the legislature of the then existing states, thus making it the supreme law of the land.
So is the 9th and 10th that leave powers not enumerated in the Constitution to the states and the people. But the Drug War violates the hell out of that. Yet even as states pass laws dropping out of the War on Marijuana the federal government that has no enumerated power to do so continues to persecute states that are well within their rights under the bill of rights. Still comes down to a small percentage abuse a liberty so we must take that liberty away for everyone.
Again, who the fuck are you arguing with dipshit? When did I support the war on drugs in what I wrote? Fuck, go find another straw man to argue. Are you incapable of actually posting a response that actually is pertinent to what I actually posted?.
Pointing out that having an amendment from the bill of rights on your side along with a couple bucks will get you a cup of coffee.
There are two amendments that make the War on Drugs unconstitutional and that hasn't stopped that shitshow for going on for more than half a century.
Throwing the second amendment around like it means something is pointless. Both left and right piss all over the ENTIRE bill of rights at city, county, state and federal levels.
Want an example? We had to fight mostly against Republicans in South Dakota to get constitutional carrry passed. Even our supposed Republican Governor is against it.
Another? We can't manage to get the damn Republicans to throw weight against the Board of Regents to allow concealed carry on college campuses in this long time Red State.
So go ahead and bring up the bill of rights. It's been ignored so often by both sides that it may as well be written on their toilet paper.
Fuck, you really are an idiot aren't you? You appear to assume I'm a Republican? And every state that has passed constitutional carry are Republican dominated so you anecdote is not evidence but an anecdote you're using to enter into purile boaf sidez argument.
No, I don't assume you're a republican. Mainly because it doesn't matter. You could be a Tory and your arguments are still dated and pointless.
A Tory. Fuck, you really are scratching the bottom of the barrel now. Dated and pointless? Forgive me if I don't cry that an idiot who can't stay on point and make completely unrelated, sophist arguments labels my arguments pointless. I won't cry myself to sleep over it.
Also, just FYI, I was pointing out the difference between an actual law (e.g. the 2A) and a court ruling that was overturned (Roe and his claim that Roe was a law). I now realize that I have to use simple explanations for you to understand and break it into small pieces. I'll try and keep it at a third grade level in the future when you're on, so as not to confuse you overly much. But please feel free if at any time I use a word or phrase that confuses you and I'll happily give you the short bus version.
Again, you like to use big words and a lot of uneeded ones to try and look smarter that everyone else.
So you swallowed a thesaurus. Your still just a troll complaining that no one can understand you because they are stupid.
Sorry if write above a third grade reading level and that makes it hard for you to follow. I'm actually amazed you even know what a thesaurus is, kudos operation call of duty.
You're writing above a three stout level. Are you actually sober when you do this?
Keep trying young Padawan, you'll eventually land a punch.
Roe was NOT the law. It was a court finding in the constitution that even people on the left knew was a terrible ruling, but defended it because it was THEIR terrible ruling. Abortion is no less or no more "the law" than it was after Roe was overturned. It merely returned the matter to the states.
However, unlike abortion, firearm ownership is explicitly mentioned in the constitution, not like Abortion which was "discovered" through novel interpretation of emanations and penumbras.
I actually like the idea of taking a right to privacy to that extreme. If privacy between a woman and a doctor can allow murder then privacy between a person and their accountant should make not paying income tax legal. The IRS violates the hell out of my privacy. I have to testify against myself when I file a return. The right to privacy between myself and my employer should prevent withholding as well.
I'd give abortion a pass if it ended the IRS.
It would be nice if you actually believed in debating what people wrote rather than the voices in your head or what you think they meant. But I won't hold my breath.
Hey, at least I don't accuse you of being a troll or being a sock puppet of a troll. That's what I get mostly as a reply.
Also, debate? Seriously? Have you been living under a rock since the internet was invented and just crawled out last week?
No, but unlike you,I've not a newbie to this comment section, and actually debate is pretty common on here. It's usually the newbies (and a few usual suspects) that engage in trolling. If you're getting accused of trolling or sockpuppeting by the long time posters it's because you're behavior warrants such accusations, so you may want to take that into consideration (see you're above replies to all of my posts for examples of why you may be getting these accusations).
I'm not a troll or sock puppet. I'm an asshole. Look up my screen name and it should tell you all you need to know about my motives.
Yes, you're an asshole and also extremely amateurish. That basically makes you a troll.
If it’s ok to murder infants, then it should be just fine to kill adult Marxists where we find them.
I've no problem with that.
Marxists clearly have serious mental health problems. The kind of child you should have aborted.
Roe wasn’t a law though.
Roe was also unclear based on the theory of viability dummy.
Lovely thought, but it's not going to happen.
Legislative immunity. Look it up.
Not so much for the cop enforcing it though.
Legislative immunity only applies to debate not to actually breaking the law. You cannot commit an obviously illegal act and then claim legislative immunity because you didn't agree with said law.
plus a few businesses willing to post a ‘guns allowed’ sign at the risk of potentially losing other customers by doing so
If you think the risk is of only losing other customers and not the risk of being held liable if not culpable for any shootings on their property by posting such a sign, you haven’t been paying attention.
"By banning firearms from a long list of "sensitive places," the state is copying a policy that federal judges have repeatedly rejected."
He should take that new law, roll it up real nice, turn it sideways and shove right up his "sensitive place."
... thus making exercise of the right so impractical and legally risky in practice that ordinary citizens will be deterred from even attempting to exercise their rights in the first place.
Isn't that kind of the point?
In other news. Fauci's boss admits on camera that he, Fauci and Collins conspired to cover up the Wuhan lab leak to avoid exposing their personal culpability. Amazing.
https://twitter.com/RWMaloneMD/status/1729927924445278355?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1729927924445278355%7Ctwgr%5E55217db6db6f70991bce86b3849268ef75fb8d2d%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fhotair.com%2Fdavid-strom%2F2023%2F11%2F30%2Flab-leak-coverup-unraveling-n595693
What difference, at this point...
Meh, that's quite an over-statement. He says it was a PR move, he doesn't cop to the truthfulness of any allegations like leak cover-up, or personal culpability for anything. I can't read his mind, but he's not clearly confessing.
Banning guns in sensitive places dates back to the founding and any judge who rules to the contrary is most likely a federalist society fraud imposing their personal viewpoints above the law.
One can know that banning guns in sensitive places goes back to the founding, and still rule against turning everything into a sensitive place. If everything is a sensitive place, nothing is a sensitive place.
Cite examples. For reference, on the frontier, it was common for kids to wear guns to and from school and actually store them with their coats, easily accessible. Until the end of the 20th century, it was common in most rural areas during hunting season to see guns in kids vehicles parked at school. Please provide examples of your assertions.
See, now that's a lot better than holding out the 2nd Amendment like it's a magic talisman that will summon Constitution Man who will beat up the nasty liberals who want to ban guns.
Screw sensitive places, congress has the power to grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal to let the private owner of a ship which had cannons capable of bombarding a port. The founders intended for private citizens to own the weapon of mass destruction of their time. Those private citizens could bombard Washington DC if they wanted to. They could hit the sensitive places and blow them to kingdom come.
Personally I think this means I can own a tank in case the congress wants to issue such letter to private citizens to harass the shipping of enemies like Canada or Mexico. I mean, just in case.
That would be cool to see Musk or Bezos turn one of their yachts into a destroyer to go fight pirates and claim the bounties.
Fuck yeah! I hate water but I'd serve on a Musk owned vessel.
Who's holding out the 2A as a talisman? You appear to be arguing with shit I never actually stated or inferred. You state you're an asshole. I think you got the ass part correct, but you forgot the dumb prefix.
Oh, degenerating into personal insults. I also think you've blocked me since this is the first post of yours I've seen in a while that I can reply to. What's up with that?
Add computer illiterate to the list of your inadequacies?
You can still reply even if there isn't a reply tab, you just go back to the last post that has a reply tab and hit that and type in your reply and then it will post it after my last reply. It's pretty self explanatory but it may be beyond your remedial computer skills, so I thought I would spell it out for you, just so you don't embarrass yourself again.
I wouldn't block you, carl, you're way to funny (unintentionally) to block. Watching you flounder trying to insult me was the highlight of a pretty shitty day yesterday. Oh, hint, when you mute someone on reason, they can still reply dickhead, it just means you don't have to read their drivel. So, an obvious nube to the forum, who doesn't understand how the forum works. Gee, you can't stop self owning can you?
As for personal insults, I'm betting you are used to them by now. You're a walking personal insult, Carl.
And the guy who labeled me Mr Master History prick says I degenerated into personal insults. Self awareness is obviously not your superpower, high speed.
“ Personally I think this means I can own a tank”
Yes. You can. There are tanks owned by private individuals and private organizations.
Check out the number of L39 aircraft registered in the FAA database.
This is actually more restrictive than the old law, as in some counties you could get a permit. Now, even there you can't legally carry in public even with a permit. The many "sensitive places" makes you a felon nearly everywhere.
Of course, they know this, but are simply delaying and will continue to do this until the Supremes rule that there is no qualified immunity for enforcing this kind of law.
This is ultimately a trial-by-error type of legislation. Many jurisdictions have carry-restrictions that no one has challenged. For instance, it's illegal to carry a firearm anywhere in Washington where patrons under the age of 21 are prohibited. In other words "bars". It's reasonable to presume that if Washington can make this particular carve-out, then why aren't other carve-outs allowed?
So California's test seems to be feeling around the edges and using these principles to put them to the test.
If California's carve-outs are found to be universally rejected by the courts, then this puts into question Washington's restricted spaces as well. And from what we've seen, courts are reluctant to tear a whole system down- especially one that's generally accepted.
Never fear! Now that you have brought the problem to public attention there will be a challenge to those restrictions forthwith!
If at first you don't succeed, try ... try again!
If at first you don't succeed, maybe skydiving isn't for you.
Democrats say F You to the Constitution?
This is my shocked face.
The contempt elites have for the law-abiding seems to be never ending.
I know this "new law, same as the old law" is annoying, but Newsom is just so dreamy.
No one likes him, but he's going to have the best hair in any matchup, which is often predictive of the winner.
California Defies SCOTUS by Imposing Myriad New Restrictions on Public Gun Possession
I think California defying SCOTUS sets a good precedent. I hope conservative states will follow California’s example by also defying past SCOTUS rulings.
I have been asking this question for a long time now and have never heard an answer: what happens if a Federal Court or Supreme Court ruling is ignored by a state government or governor? Does the Supreme Court send bailiffs to arrest said Governor? Does the DoJ or the FBI issue an arrest warrant for "contempt of court?" Has this ever happened? What if the Governor's state police decide not to let the Fibbies serve the warrant or arrest the Governor? Is there a shootout at the Governor's Mansion? Inquiring minds want to know!
Based upon not to distant history, there may be a chance the 101st Infantry shows up.
Or they may say, "the court has made its ruling, now let them enforce it."
That was Jackson, and a century before the actions I described.
Yea. But it's still relevant. If the sitting president agrees with the constitutional violation and refuses to send in the 101st it's not like Constitution Man will burst out of the Liberty Bell and give the president a good old SMACK and POW. The courts have no enforcement arm to make their rulings stick.
The enforcement power isn't necessarily an actual force. Once a law is ruled unconstitutional the ability of a government official to actually implement the law becomes practically impossible, as most enforcement agencies would choose not to enforce it to cover their own ass. Jackson's actions were so remarkable because he did successfully resist a USSC decision, however, it's rather irrelevant because it's an anomaly rather than evidence of a trend. The reason states like California are passing these laws is because they want to resist the USSC decision but realize pragmatically they can't so they are trying to create a work around, to achieve the same goal without actually technically violating the decision. To enforce the law, you have to get the policing agencies to agree to enforce it, the prosecutors to agree to prosecute it, and the courts to agree not to dismiss it. Achieving all three is not realistically possible once a law has been ruled unconstitutional. Then, even if you managed to get these three entities to defy court order, you have to then get the appellate courts to agree to not overturn it on precedence, etc. No, using federal forces was an extreme example, but the practicality of enforcing a law that's been overturned by the USSC is simply not credible. No Constitution Man needed.
So the cops whose paychecks are cut by the city governments are going to refuse to implement the laws because... why exactly? Cops pretty much do what their paymasters tell them to do. If Newsome told them to go door to door rounding up all guns theu wouldn't bat an eye. They'd put on the heavy body armor, break down the door and plant drugs so they can claim it was a drug bust and all these cool guns were taken as well.
Yeah, cops are going to go door to door, to people they know own and know how to use guns, to round up guns that the supreme Court has ruled they have a right to own. Yeah, yeah sure. That will happen. Uvalde and Parkland beg to differ that cops will put themselves into that kind of danger for a paycheck. Okay, Ole.
You didn't describe ANY actions. You didn't even refer to any actions with enough specificity to RECOGNIZE if they were actually cited.
Eisenhower's use of the 101st to enforce desegregation is a well documented and known action, which I clearly referenced. Sorry if you're historically illiterate.
"Based upon not to distant history, there may be a chance the 101st Infantry shows up." Yeah, sure I didn't refer to any actions or enough information to recognize the citation. Gee, go with that. It doesn't demonstrate at all that you're basically don't know well known American history. Probably one of the most well known highlights of the civil rights movement, even referenced and represented in a Hollywood Blockbuster (Forrest Gump), and one that another poster easily picked up on and posted a citation for below, but it's really to obscure for StevenF to get.
That’s the 101st Airborne.
Oh! Mega Burn on master history prick! Congrats, I missed that mistake.
101st Infantry (airborne) is actually the proper term. It wasn’t a mistake. Especially as the 101st is not technically an airborne unit anymore, they’re heliborne (specialize in air assault). Airborne is not a division name it’s a designation of what that division specializes in. Like the 1st Infantry full name is Ist Infantry Division (mechanized). The Eight deuce is 82nd Infantry Division (airborne). Gee, do you get tired of making yourself look like an idiot?
And since you have trouble reading more than one sentence: tell me you never served without saying you never served.
Fuck you. I did my time at Fort Meyer VA. Old Guard. Pick up your shovel and follow me.
Right sure you did, was that your call of duty character, operation stolen valor?
And if you consider that a mega burn you're even dumber than you already shown yourself to be. No, it isn't a burn, it's trying to be pedantic and failing miserably. It's like saying it's not the 10th infantry division, it's the 10th mountain, no it's not dipshit, it's the 10th infantry Division (mountain). Or it's not the 7th infantry division, it's the 7th light. No, again it is not it's the 7th infantry division (light). Ot simply the seventh infantry. He didn't burn me, he actually made himself look foolish to those of us who actually served. Airborne, mountain, light, mechanized etc are a description of what that units primary speciality is, it isn't the units name. Fuck, you're just constantly demonstrating you're inability to have anything approaching actual intelligence. Oh and BTW, you say you're not a troll, just someone who likes to have fun with people, post non sequiturs and be an asshole. That's pretty much the textbook definition of an internet troll. You really aren't good at this are you?
Note to foreign readers: The new guy is interacting with planted Republican Trumpanzees and Army Of God zombies assigned to emit stink at Reason instead of hang around women's clinics bullying unarmed girls. Nobody sees these MAGAts thanks to the Moot Lewser button at the top right-hand corner of every noisome spewing.
Note to readers Libertrans is not a libertarian, has cognitive difficulties and is one of the most muted posters on here. Additionally, I actually am not for strict abortion control, nor have I ever voted for Trump, however, due to his (libertrans) simplistic worldview and likely early onset dementia, anyone to the right of Mao must be MAGA anti abortion extremists, because he is only capable or binary thinking. Which is why he is so muted, he lacks the ability to offer anything approaching a well thought out argument or post.
Holy shit, the mental vegetable accusing others of being “planted”. You post like you’re suffering from some kind of permanent greenout condition, Hank. Maybe you should stop smoking that astroturf.
No, no it isn't. It's the 101st Infantry Division (airborne). Or as we affectionately call them, the puking buzzards or the choking chickens. And it isn't even considered an airborne division anymore, it's now the 101st Infantry Division (heliborne).
"Based upon not to distant history, there may be a chance the 101st Infantry shows up."
Do you mean 101st Infantry Regiment or the 101st Airborne Division (which is airborne infantry)? The 101st Infantry Regiment is part of the Massachusetts National Guard and is unlikely to be called up in that situation - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/101st_Infantry_Regiment_(United_States)
I think you mean the 101st Airborne Division, which was originally leg infantry until it went airborne in WW2. It's 327th Parachute Infantry Regiment was called up to provide federal muscle to integrate Little Rock Arkansas schools in 1957, and the division, along with 82nd Airborne, was sent to quell the Detroit riots of 1967.
Here's reference to 101st Airborne - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_101st_Airborne_Division
Well, Eisenhower responded by Federalizing the National Guard and sending them in to enforce the defied ruling. But it seems unlikely that Biden will do so in a case like this.
He also deployed federal troops, the 101st INF to be specific.
Yes, you're very smart. Now lay down and listen to the story.
It obviously doesn't take much to be smarter than you.
Oh, more insults. Gee, I'm hurt.
It's not an insult, it's an observation based upon the available data.
Jesus you're a sensitive little prick. I post a sentence or two and you reply with three or four posts screaming like a toddler who had his blanket taken away.
Okay High Speed. If you did ever serve it was on an ASVAB waiver. Says the guy who posted fuck you above, calling me a sensitive fucker. I doubt you were even smart enough to be a crayon eater. Ain't no way an ASVAB waiver like you could serve with the 3rd infantry.
But it seems unlikely that Biden will do so in a case like this.
And that sets a good precedent.
He federalized the Arkansas National Guard in order to take them away from Governor Faubus, who was using them to prevent integration.
Then he took the white soldiers of the 101st Airborne to force entrance of the black students.
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Executive_Order_10730
In the case of Worcester v. Georgia (1832), the State of Georgia ignored the Supreme Court decision, and President Jackson did nothing to enforce it.
Wonderful opportunity for the Court to declare that every member of the California legislature who voted for the law, and the Governor who signed it, by so blatantly and grossly violating the Constitution, engaged in insurrection against the United States, and accordingly are disqualified from their current offices and any future offices under the United States or any state.
(Not that the next class of California politicians will be the slightest bit better, given the California electorate.)
There should absolutely be some tangible legal consequence for what they've been doing.
Democrat wackjob Newsom should be put in jail with the rest of the corrupt democrats. Do you think we would get away with ignoring SCOTUS?
Shucks, since Gorbasuch, Long Dong, Palito, Mutterkreuz Mom and Ku-Klux Kavanaugh turned La Suprema into a Christian National Socialist People's Court, MAGAts are lining up to lick the blacking off their boots and take them cruising on fancy yachts.
It’s been a few years since I checked, but Texas and Florida both documented that people with carry permits were less likely to commit felonies than cops are.
CC Permit holders in most states have to get more firearms training than the police in those states. Also CC Permit holders are responsible for every round they fire, unlike cops who are typically found not liable if while emptying two magazines into a dangerous felon in a wheelchair they hit a half dozen bystanders.
And if the police are found at fault, the local taxpayers pay the settlement.
Yup. While the CC Permit holder has to move to another state, change his social security number, name and blood type.
Six dead/wounded bystanders still qualifies our hero for qualified immunity, provided none were politicians or fellow looters.
Gee Hank, what about those mystical bigot girl bulliers?
That didn't stop a half-blind deputy in Columbia County FL from arresting a completely blind man because she thought his walking cane was a gun.
I still don't see the "unless" or the "except when" after "shall not be infringed" in my copy of the Bill of Rights.
Well, that is because your copy is out of date. Check with any democrat to get the new, improved version.
Careful, Mr Gooblygook thinks constitutional arguments are dated and not pertinent to the 21st century. Also, don't bring up logic, he also seems to consider that dated and not very 21st century. And we need to respect him, so let's make sure to post at a third grade level and keep posts to under 126 characters because anything longer takes away from his window licking time.
You're funny. I like you. Let's be bestest of pals.
And that's all that matters to me, your approval. My life is now complete.
I agree, but then again there was no "sexual orientation" in the Civil Rights act, Congress for years and years attempted to rectify that, and then SCOTUS just goes ahead and says it said what democrats wanted the CRA to say, even when they knew it said no such thing. Congress could have changed the law at any time to include it, but didn't (failed to).
How is this not deprivation of rights under color of law? It is ridiculous that tyrants can keep imposing unconstitutional restrictions at no personal cost. They spend millions of our tax dollars defending an infinite supply of this illegal legislation. This has become insanely frustrating and frightening.
The police are paid by the tyrants. Thus they don't care about justice. Just their pensions. Arresting innocent people is a lot easier and saferthan going after dangerous felons.
Not when said Innocents are armed and know how to use those arms. You really lack second degree thinking ability.
Get real. Most conservative gun owners worship cops. They'd hand their guns over without a single complaint. Even if someone tried to shoot at the cops by the time the media got done with them their family would have to go into hiding and change their blood types to avoid the public embarasment.
We aren't discussing your Fat Cry fantasy here bubba.
The media took Janet Reno's armed assault on the peaceful Branch Davidian property and turned it into a rescue of children who were being sexually abused and being forced to make drugs. I watched the conservatives talking about an armed rescue swap to cheering the FBI on.
I don't have any faith in conservatives making any real stand against anything. They love the LEOs way too much for that.
Where did you watch “the conservatives talking” about that? The media? Or real life (would imply a bit of a small sample size)
It would be somewhat ironic to derive a trend from something media-provided and at the same time mocking conservatives for being gullible because they are willing to swallow a media narrative.
George Waffen Bush Executive orders urged faith-based armed robbery and asset forfeiture. Robbing and killing "lawbreakers" who violated no rights and engaged only in useful production and trade became so profitable that the entire economy collapsed in 2008. Observe as of 2009 the sudden drop in asset forfeiture looting and concurrent sudden quickening in the repeal of laws lying about plant leaves as pretext for such depredation. Search "looters by law"
You'd think folks in a government with a long coastline vulnerable to SLBMs and cruise missiles and facing three totalitarian dictatorships would value a strong Second Amendment. Article 1 Section 10 of the Constitution would also be uppermost in their minds if they had any sense at all. (https://bit.ly/3Tm8cu6)
They have lots of bases with F16s, which according to Sleepy Joe are way better than being armed.
At this point, I think there really does need to be a process in this country where lawmakers, who vote yes to a law that is demonstrated to have already been struck down by the Supreme Court, should face jail time. I don't think there is any other way to stop this blatant defying of established freedoms that seems to happen over and over again.
No jail time that costs taxpayers money.
Sentence them to shovel up at least 15 pounds of human poop per day for 60 days.
For each offense.
Someone in Congress should introduce a bill to expel California from the Union.
No need to expel California, just the lawmakers.
Simple answer to all of this. When Trump resumes the Presidency, he needs to declare all of California to be in open rebellion against the Constitution; imprison all of the leaders voting for this nonsense; install a provisional Governor; revoke their Statehood; and then re-admit Counties based on their compliance with our laws and Constituitons. Build a wall around the small blue parts to contain the contagion, and keep them under martial law (which is what they seek to impose on the rest of us).