If Sanders and Warren Think Climate Change Is an Emergency, Why Are They Against These Green Energy Reforms?
If climate change is an emergency that requires immediate action, it makes sense to streamline environmental reviews that tangle green energy projects in red tape.

In July, a group of progressive senators sent a letter to President Joe Biden urging the immediate declaration of climate change as a national emergency.
"Declaring the climate crisis a national emergency…would unlock powers to rebuild a better economy with significant, concrete actions," the senators wrote. "The climate crisis is one of the biggest emergencies that our country has ever faced and time is running out."
The letter was signed by nine senators, among them Cory Booker (D–N.J.), Edward Markey (D–Mass.), Bernie Sanders (I–Vt.), and Elizabeth Warren (D–Mass.).
"We cannot allow a single Senator to stall our progress," they wrote—a not-so-veiled reference to their colleague, Sen. Joe Manchin (D–W.Va.), who has been wrongly castigated by progressives for single-handedly blocking bills that, in actuality, face opposition from a majority of the Senate.
Now, there's a bill before the Senate that would take concrete actions to speed the deployment of green energy projects that aim to combat the carbon emissions blamed for climate change. Manchin is sponsoring the bill—and you can probably guess where Booker, Markey, Sanders, and Warren are lining up.
The permitting reform proposal that Manchin is trying to attach to an upcoming must-pass government funding bill is a sprawling piece of legislation that aims to accomplish many things. But perhaps the most important part of the proposal is a series of deadlines that would be created to prevent the often lengthy delays that befall large infrastructure projects—including green energy projects. The bill would impose a two-year limit on National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA) reviews, would require permits to be issued within 180 days after the conclusion of a NEPA review, and would impose a 150-day statute of limitations for lawsuits challenging those projects.
As Reason's Christian Britschgi has detailed, the NEPA review process was created in 1970 to ensure that the environmental impact of infrastructure projects like power plants and highways was considered. That's important, but the process takes far too long: The average NEPA review now takes more than four years. Unsurprisingly, the complex bureaucratic process has become a tool for anti-growth and NIMBY activists—who also love to file time-consuming lawsuits challenging new construction—while driving up the cost of infrastructure projects.
Manchin's proposal, therefore, can be thought of as something akin to a pitch clock for big building projects.
If you're someone who views climate change as an existential crisis, these changes should be great news. After all, the key to reducing America's reliance on carbon-intensive energy sources is to get more green energy projects of all kinds online quickly. Government permitting schemes are the single biggest stumbling block to doing that—right now, the U.S. has offshore wind projects capable of generating 42 megawatts (MW) of electricity, while another 18,581 MW of potential offshore wind power are tied up in permitting battles, according to Department of Energy data. Construction on what could be a massive offshore wind farm in Massachusetts has been held up for years due to NEPA reviews.
So where do Booker, Markey, Sanders, and Warren stand? On Thursday, they were four of the eight senators to sign a letter to Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (D–N.Y.) opposing Machin's proposal on the grounds that it would speed up those permitting decisions.
"Changes to the permitting process should strengthen—not steamroll—public participation," the senators wrote.
That is, of course, the opposite of what is necessary during a true emergency. Though they do not admit as much in the letter, "strengthening" public participation in the permitting process would mean more bureaucracy, more meetings, slower approvals, and fewer new projects being completed.
Here's what that looks like as a practical matter. A recent Princeton study found that 80 percent of the potential emissions reductions from projects funded by the Inflation Reduction Act would be lost without an expansion of transmission lines. In short, you need more electricity infrastructure to connect renewable energy power plants to parts of the country where coal- and gas-powered plants are operating. Building those transmission lines requires cutting down trees, crossing wetlands, and potentially disturbing the habitats of spotted salamanders.
But if climate change is an emergency, maybe the salamanders can be expected to give way?
Unfortunately, that's not the way Congress is leaning. Along with the eight senators who signed the letter to Schumer, more than 70 House Democrats sent a letter to Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi (D–Calif.) opposing Manchin's proposal because it "attempts to short-circuit or undermine [NEPA] in the name of 'reform.'"
You can believe it is vitally important to build green energy infrastructure as quickly as possible in order to combat climate change, or you can believe that waiting four years for an environmental review is essential. Lawmakers trying to have it both ways are accomplishing nothing.
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Hey reason, this is how you talk about free speech as it relates to big tech.
https://youtu.be/bRueNI2BAw0
The entire federal (and to a lesser extent some state) environmental processes have become a way for politicians to force through stuff they couldn't get through the normal, constitutional process. If anything is a threat to democracy it's how activists groups and unelected bureaucrats have short circuited the constitutional process to enforce their wills on the majority of the country, who often don't agree with their goals.
See Obama and his sue and settle programs.
You know you're living in Bizarro world when people claim with a straight face that disempowering bureaucrats is a threat to democracy. By it's very nature and definition bureaucracy is the antithesis of democracy.
And historically the least free nations and states have almost always been largely bureaucratic nations.
There's a reason dystopian stories from 1984 to Brazil all feature ridiculously overzealous and overpowerful bureaucracy.
Those organizations put you in your place. Each petty functionary has their function, their excuse (I'm not authorized, it's not my job, etc) and no incentive or ability to change things. Maybe some incentive for graft to put your request closer to the top of the pile, but that's about the best a bureaucrat can do for creative problem solving.
Regular humans faced with the nightmare of the organizational labyrinth are dehumanized. You are not a free man, you are a number. Nothing but data on forms filled out in triplicate and rejected for misplaced information until your will is broken, you're supplicating to the bureaucracy, or you are enraged and then punished for acting outside the established order.
Bureaucracy, like most government functions, should be to protect the people from the government. When it becomes power to the government against the people, it is decidedly the true threat to democracy.
Man, I'm in a preachy mood today.
But absolutely correct!
I've been reading a strange little book published one week after Germany invaded Poland -- The Vampire Economy, all about Germany's economy as transformed by the Nazis.
It's part surreal, being after the war began and before it ended, before France fell, before Russia was invaded, before the Winter War or Norway fell.
It's also chock-a-block full of bizarro burrocratic craziness. Some company found it cheaper and faster to buy 5000 new trucks, shift their tires to trucks they already owned, and junk the new trucks -- trying to buy new tires alone was slower and more expensive.
The book is sure not objective, full of polemics, and not the kind of stuff easily verified. But it all sounds plausible, and I knew, for instance, from other books that the Nazis put Germany on the false path to autarky years before the war started to save hard currency; ersatz coffee was the norm by 1935, I think.
And it's only $3 as an eBook, so hard to be a bad buy.
Thanks. I'll check it out.
One of the myths about both world wars but the second especially was how German bureaucracy (which derived from Prussian bureaucracy as a reaction to Prussian perception that lack of bureaucracy was what doomed the Holy Roman Empire) contributed to Germany being more ready for war than their opponents and led to their early military successes. No, this is mostly myth, as even from the start the bureaucracy hindered war production for Germany (and Japan). Success for both nations was more about the allies having grown complacent in the years between the wars, and their generals and admirals preparing for the last war rather than the war they faced. The US has something of a leg up in that we had two years to evaluate how war had changed. Despite that, we pretty much started out in December of 1941 ready to fight WWI all over again.
Also, for another reference see how bad FDRs mobilization boards did before the Truman committee starting investigating and forced changes (one of the biggest and arguably the most effective was to eliminate 15 of the 16 boards Roosevelt had created).
Which is a whole other story, as Roosevelt detested Truman in large part because Truman not only created the committee (to conduct Congressional oversight, which Roosevelt avoided whenever possible) but ran it extremely effectively and got credit for running it effectively and non-partisan. It especially irritated Roosevelt that Truman was from his own party.
The other thing Roosevelt hated was that the mobilization boards prior to Truman Committee answered only to him, but after the committee took action, were reformed so that they answered to both the executive and legislative branches.
TL;DR FDR was a fascist.
France had better tanks than the Germans during the early stages of the war but no tank to tank radios...one reason they go slaughtered.
TIK on YouTube turned me on to that book. He does a lot of the WWII era from an Austrian economics standpoint, if you’re into that type of thing.
From that angle, the whole “German efficiency” thing is crock of shit. They had a basket case economy and he pretty much had to start WWII way earlier than he wanted to because they were running out of everything (including food).
https://youtu.be/YygQ0Wq0wDA
Basically Germany knew that if they didn't beat the Soviets in 3 months that they couldn't win even before they launched operation Barbarossa. The Japanese higher command never seriously felt they could win against the Americans and British. In fact Yamamoto told his superiors that at best he could guarantee success after Pearl Harbor for only six months, and Japans only hope was to win those first six months decisively enough that it would force the US to negotiate. He was pretty close as Midway was almost six months after Pearl Harbor and arguably the Battle of the Coral Sea was the turning point even before Midway.
For Japan I think the turning point was Pearl Harbor. Specifically, their failure to capitalize on the initial success and seize and occupy the islands, probably with the aim of forcing a negotiated settlement.
Japanese aim was never to conquer the US. As for invading Hawaii, that wasn't going to happen. At the time of the attack there was over 40,000 army personal assigned to Ohuhu. Japanese strategy was to knock the US Navy out and capture the Dutch East Indies and then force the allies to the negotiation tables. At no point did they ever seriously consider invading Hawaii. Additionally, Pearl wasn't even our best pacific base. In fact, Naval command protested stationing the Pacific fleet there the year earlier from our better equipped and supplied west coast bases. Conquering Hawaii would have done very little to the US war effort. And Japan would have had a hell of a time defending it. As it was, they were at the very end of their logistical lines on December 7, that's why they didn't stick around. If they had invaded Hawaii, it would have exposed their fleet even more than it was. Add strategy to the long list of shit you don't understand.
"Japanese aim was never to conquer the US. "
That's why the turning point was Pearl Harbor. Or even earlier, the occupation of China, an exercise even more expensive and doomed to failure that the attack on Pearl Harbor.
I like Yarvin's argument that it's an evolution in terms - because ostensibly democratic governments are everywhere controlled by their internal bureaucracy, democracy as a term is now synonymous with what we used to call oligarchy and democracy formerly understood is castigated as reckless "populism."
But the upshot there is that there's nothing wrong with tyranny, assuming that the intentions of the oligarchs are good and there's a regularly scheduled plebiscite.
"If anything is a threat to democracy it’s how activists groups and unelected bureaucrats have short circuited the constitutional process to enforce their wills on the majority of the country"
The constitution allows for free speech, free assembly, lobbying and petitioning the government. Activists and un-elected bureaucrats enjoy the same protections as everyone else.
Why Are They Against These Green Energy Reforms?
Because they're all about power. Well, not electrical power.
As with most declared emergencies it is about a solution in search of a problem; bigger government is always the solution no matter what the issue. So, more government control of green energy is completely consistent.
What a silly question. It is because they want MOAR regulations, not less.
Do I understand this properly?
The fucking Democrats are fighting over streamlining environmental impact reviews of their “green energy” crony schemes, like a laughable “potential” 18GW of offshore wind power?
I thought a uniparty would be easier to bribe than this, what a bunch of football bats.
Maybe the Republicans have a chance after all in the midterms.
Thinking the same thing.
They don't. The emergency is getting all their BS in place while they still can.
Because it isn't about the climate, or any other environmental issue, it's about control and the WEF agenda.
Eat ze bugs, peasant! And LIKE IT!
No question you are correct!
"If".
love how 115% of your headlines propose fallacies
It should be pretty obvious that Democrat politicians don’t give a flying fuck about any of the causes they purportedly champion.
Somehow Reason writers are still surprised.
^THIS^
It's because they don't give a flying fuck about the environment or anything else. They only care about keeping their ability to insider trade off government committee actions, which is basically what every asshole in Congress and the Senate are fighting to keep.
Yup!
Sen. Fetterman is going to ban all stock trades by Congresscritters.
Yeah, we'll see how that goes.
Amazing. It's amazing Corey Booker is a US Senator. A thank you to all NJ voters for your incredible ability to elect the worst candidates imaginable, over and over again.
Just wait until y ou see what Pennsylvania has in store for us.
Indeed. Uncle Festerman.
The real Uncle Fester was 10X more intelligent than this loser.
That brain damaged retard couldn’t find the shitter on his own.
As an Illinoisan I really have to speak up here. If the competition is worst candidates we are at least contenders for 1st place.
Our wonderful dipshits, Dickhead Durbin and Tammy Duckworthless. Wish we could replace both of them.
Sheldon Whitehouse is sooo much worse.
Two words: Mazie Hirono
Got me there.
Patty Murray.
Maxine Waters, anyone?
2022 will be my 9th time voting against that half-wit (and one-time winner of the "most corrupt member of the U.S. Congress"), and she probably still doesn't even know that my job is in her district. On the upside, I get to have a 5-10 minute commute and live within 4 miles of the beach.
I might start worrying about climate change as soon as all the people telling me to panic about it start acting like it's actually a big deal.
And that will never happen because they dont mean it, they dont believe it, and they dont care
If I truly believed there was a tipping point from fossil fuel use coming in 12, 10, 9, 8, 7 .... years, I'd be moving heaven and earth to rush through all the nuclear power plants possible. Nothing else could come close to being ready in time. The renewables especially are too slow, too unreliable, too expensive, and require far too many grid changes, while nuclear power plants are pretty much plug-replaceable for fossil fuel plants.
That alone proves they don't believe in their own dog food.
The earth was warmer in the Medieval Warming Period and the Roman Warming Period, as evidenced by olive trees growing higher than, by glaciers melting and uncovering forests which were growing then, by as many proxies and examples as one has the patience to read about.
There simply is no climate crisis.
Citation needed.
Grapes growing in England. Cod overwintering in Greenland. Grain crops grown in Greenland. It isn't even debated that the medieval warming period was warmer. Except by the uneducated who "believe" in global warming but don't actually understand the science. In other words idiots like you who haven't actually read the scientific literature and take the headlines from MSNBC as gospel instead of going to the source material.
You don’t have to cite anything. Leftist assholes like Tony never do.
Demanding you support your arguments while they tell their lies is one of their rhetorical tactics.
"Grapes growing in England. Cod overwintering in Greenland."
A warmer England and Greenland are but a small part of the Earth. Local warming vs. global warming.
I've seen some interesting projections about the climate in the near future. Lots of disruption and nastiness but monsoons are predicted in Western Africa, one of the few bright spots. With its predicted spectacular growth of population, and stagnation in every other continent, Africa might be in the best position to turn this emergency into an opportunity.
Stories like that and evidence like that is exists across the whole globe. Those are just some examples. Tree ring data, alluvial data, glacial data also support that the medieval warming period was 1-2°C warmer than current temperatures. God you're tiresome. Basically you'll argue about shit you know nothing about (like the other day about agriculture) and think you actually come off as educated when instead you come off as a sycophant who is to self unaware to realize how stupid you make yourself sound.
But that warming has been explained. So has current warming. They have different causes and different scales. You have not discovered something that all of science has failed to discover.
You have got to stop assuming you're smarter than the entire sum of the world's experts. I'm sure you're very bright, but you're not fucking Einstein, OK?
Again you're arguing shit I never said. Try actually arguing what I wrote rather than what you think I wrote. Fuck learn to read dipshit.
"Stories like that and evidence like that is exists across the whole globe."
Again, England and Greenland are not the whole globe. There's global warming and local warming, two distinct phenomena.
I'm really enjoying the irony of the fact that when you say you've read "the scientific literature," you mean you've read some cherry-picked crackpot outlier nonsense pimped by right-wing blogs.
Nobody with even cursory familiarity with the breadth of science on this subject would say what you said. What you've saying has been specifically debunked, but it fails on logic alone.
The causes of the so-called MWP are known. So are the causes of current warming. Current warming, taken as a global average, has far outstripped MWP warming, taken as a global average. That's why it's called global warming and not "it's hot in Europe today."
No I've read the actual IPCC reports every year they've been published. And no it hasn't been scientifically debunked. It's pretty much accepted in the scientific community. Keep trying. Unlike you I have an actual graduate degree in a hard science and don't get my science from IFL. Dipshit.
I'm saying the talking point has been debunked, not the fact that the localized MWP happened.
Your argument is literally to find one time anywhere in the past where one place was hotter than it is today and then claim that disproves a century of hard science on the matter.
If you're going to tell jokes, don't be so serious about it.
That isn't my argument And it wasn't localized. Evidence exists for the warning across all of Eurasia and North America, and to a lesser extent the southern hemisphere as well. Also, I'm not trying to disproved climate change. Fuck, I've told you this before dipshit. I follow the science. Yes, the climate is changing, and yes man has contributed (still unclear as to how much) but it's not the catastrophe you act like it is.
Let's stop burning fossil fuels as soon as possible anyway, just to be safe.
The ClimateGate emails showed that the cabal of researchers were trying to find a way of making the MWP sleep with the fishes. They seemed less concerned with the Roman and Minoan Warming Periods. Another point, civilization flourished during all three of those periods.
And what part has been debunked? Wine industry throughout England? The archeological records and written records all back this up. Cod overwintering in Greenland? Again archeological records and written records from the Norse colony back this up. Cereal crops grown in Greenland? Again backed completely by archeological records and written records. So you are saying that documented and verified by archeological digs occurrences of actual events is not correct? Provide evidence that any of this has been debunked. I mean first source not some journalists second source material, but actual peer reviewed publications that disproves any of the events I described.
“It’s different because we want to impose socialism”
-Tony
Also note I didn't say climate change isn't happening. I'm pointing out a period within the last two millennia when temperatures were warmer and people and animals thrived, contrary to the doom and gloom that your side posts (which actually is contrary to the peer reviewed literature, which actually say these are the least likely outcomes and based upon the least likely models, the most likely models predict temperatures at the end of the century closer to what they were during the medieval warming period).
The problem is not so much what might happen in the short-term to currently cool areas. In the short-term, currently inhospitable places may become veritable lush paradises.
Unfortunately the bad far outweighs the good, not to mention the fact that you're arguing for letting people engage in property harm on a massive scale for free.
Again that isn't even close to being clear. No forecast past about ten years has any level of confidence according to the models. You know the actual science.
So it's equally likely that things will be worse than the models as they will be better.
The real world has warmed alarmingly faster than the models.
"I’m really enjoying the irony of the fact that when you say you’ve read “the scientific literature,” you mean you’ve read some cherry-picked crackpot outlier nonsense pimped by right-wing blogs..."
No body here is enjoying your habit of having facts jammed in your face, asswipe, and you returning the very next day repeating the same lies.
Eat shit and die, asshole.
The funny thing is I bet I've read far more of the mainstream peer reviewed research on Climate Change than he has.
But you haven't read a representative selection of it.
Scientific thinking isn't just reading papers, and if you're only reading papers hand-selected to bolster a denier argument, you're doing the plain direct opposite of science.
One of the most important and difficult tasks of scientific thinking is to eliminate confirmation bias.
I've read far more than you, and without the proper foundation in the subject matter your "thinking" is just opinion. I however have read considerable amount of the literature. I've also personally talked with some of the leading scientist, including Dr. Mann.
Tony, Soldier has now straightened you out (forgive the pun). Have the good grace to concede the argument and thank him for his generosity.
Go read about it you stupid fuckwit instead of taking whatever bullshit MSNBC says as axiomatic.
The great thing about not being chronically skeptical of universally understood scientific facts is that the information is at your fingertips, on Wikipedia or any newspaper. In school textbooks. On postcards.
Digging deeply enough on the internet until you confirm what you want to believe is a misuse of your brain. That's not "doing research." My crazy uncle "does research." I never know whether it's going to be a Bill Gates day or a Bush Crime Family day.
"The great thing about not being chronically skeptical of universally understood scientific facts is that the information is at your fingertips, on Wikipedia or any newspaper. In school textbooks. On postcards."
The great thing about being a cogent human being is watching steaming piles of lefty shit like you lie and whine to no effect, asswipe.
Eat shit and die, asshole.
No one is doing that. The fact is you are out of your depth. You have lost the argument, so you make vague aspersions at your betters, who have crushed your inane ravings.
You’ve lost. Everyone knows it.
Citation?
Comrade, please! For thought crimes of this magnitude nothing less than summary execution will do.
And your sense of humor has not gone unnoticed...
Forests under the glaciers are a huge clue.
Any Green that is not an avid nuclear power advocate does not really believe that CO2 is an issue.
“Any Green that is not an avid nuclear power advocate does not really believe that CO2 is an issue.”
I disagree. I’m not aware of any environmentalist who doesn’t believe CO2 is an issue? If you know any, provide links. It’s more accurate to say that environmentalists don’t believe that CO2 is the ONLY issue and oppose nuclear on many grounds, quite unrelated to climate change. Distrust of the competence of the operators. (Pretty much every nuclear accident has been put down to human error.) Nuclear weapons proliferation. (Pakistan, India, North Korea.) Imperialism and endless squabbling over scarce uranium sources. (See Congo for Uranium and Middle East for oil.) Unresolved issues over toxic waste disposal.
You have to agree with me about the solution or you don't care about the problem.
–People who can't stop talking about how much they don't care about the problem
No faggot, we’re pointing out how you progs are so hypocritical and inconsistent. Which are natural states of being for your kind.
And please note, when I call you a faggot, it’s not because I have an issue with gays. I don’t. I just despise you.
" I just despise you."
Isn't the internet wonderful?
Better to have genuine enmity than to pretend they're on your side. Tony is really unscrupulous.
I don't think there's anything genuine about the comment. It's all posturing and virtue signalling, like most of the comments here.
Hence why you comment so much?
Don't give any support or assistance to the people pushing catastrophic climate change. It is a viewpoint fundamentally geared towards the reduction of human life and flourishing by it's denial of power for machine labor, explaining the comments about nuclear. If you value human life and flourishing, *and* you think CO2 is catastrophic, you will support nuclear. If you think CO2 is catastrophic and then don't really care about human life and flourishing, then nuclear shouldn't be engaged with either as it has climate impacts as well, so do wind and solar, in fact, all han energy production does and should be done away with to be consistent. That's why it's antihuman, and that's why you don't really have an issue pushing back with Tony on this, as neither of you starts with human life and flourishing as a foundational ethic like most of the posters here. Who when confronted with a narrative of doom for the human race, actually looked into it saw it was contrived, and see the solutions proposed as antihuman.
Dang no double edits, *human energy production* most of the commenters here *do* value human life and flourishing as foundational was my point, but my train of thought was a little long so my communication suffered. I apologize.
"If you value human life and flourishing, *and* you think CO2 is catastrophic, you will support nuclear. "
I keep telling you guys, the countries that are poised to lead the way in climate change mitigation, China and India, are both aggressively pursuing nuclear. You're knocking at an open door. Personally, I think there are more interesting options like fusion, harnessing photosynthesis, solid state wind, etc. Nuclear fission still has a lot of problems, like the ones I enumerated earlier.
"If you value human life and flourishing,"
I do but I don't equate flourishing with the production of electricity, and unchecked burning of fossil fuels. What with CO2 emissions, burning fossil fuels can have a deleterious effect on human flourishing. Too much of a good thing, and all. Burning too much whale oil reduces the population of whales, leading to a poorer planet. It's a conservative attitude I have with respect to resource use. We should husband our resources and keep an eye open for unintended consequences.
"I disagree...."
Stupid and smug will do that.
People are acting like that, but psychopaths brainwashed by their own greed control the most powerful industry on earth, which happens to be the thing causing the crisis, and which happens to own the Republican party and this very website.
What you need to be asking yourself is how you will atone once you realize how helpful you've been to the forces literally trying to destroy the human species in exchange for a little stripper cash before they die.
3/10, needs more transgender holocaust.
That would be a great name for a band.
Get a grip.
Even the worst climate change predictions don’t include human extinction. Rising ocean levels may make some coastal city is less livable, but this isn’t the book of Genesis; we are not all going to drown.
Better safe than sorry.
You stated climate change would lead to destroying the human race. Suck it up and eat your words or shut your mouth and leave.
Yes, it’s those fossil fuel companies, that provide all the fuel for those subsidized airlines, using those subsidized airports, and all those cars using those subidized public roads, and all those public utilities, and that powered all those military vehicles that won world wars, etc.
You know whose fault it all is? Fossil fuel companies.
Eh, I think people spend entirely too much time placing blame, when blame is, if anything, academic. Leave it to historians.
You could torture and murder every oil exec in the world in the most unjust and grotesque way imaginable, and if that was the catalyst for a clean energy future, it would be a small price to pay by any accounting.
Blame is for people who think with their feelings, and what our feelings want most of all is for ourselves to be blameless. It feels better to rationalize than to reason, and the horrible irony is that the greater the harm you're doing, the more motivated you are to rationalize away your blame.
My longtime Usenet ally, Christopher Charles Morton, wrote this.
https://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=380576&p=4522359#post4522359
No wonder he influenced my own political views for twenty-five years!
And now the prosperity of the Chinese people.
Whether we would have been better off not inventing modern technology is an interesting question not easily answered.
Of course your takeaway is almost incomprehensibly ridiculous. American prosperity IS causing global warming, but American prosperity now is more important than survival later.
Genocidal sociopathy doesn't even beat the strawman of Democrats you're trotting out to excuse your advocacy for complete inaction. Ending the march of economic growth is bad but not as bad as suicide.
Of course Democrats are far, far better capitalists than Republicans and haven't renounced it yet. Only those urging inaction are implicitly endorsing more drastic measures.
Never mind, there is blame. You're to blame, personally.
American prisperity is a top priority for me.
It was a top priority for Chris.
It allows us to thrive as a nation.
But short-term prosperity, right? You can't prosper on an uninhabitable planet.
Burn it all and have a big party and die. That's the plan, according to the premises you laid out.
Fortunately, your kind are idiot liars using this as a delivery system for totalitarianism.
"psychopaths brainwashed by their own greed control the most powerful industry on earth"
From context, it would seem that your preferred solution is to "nationalize" that industry instead? I'd love to see the case for why putting it under the control of the political class represents any kind of change from it being run by "psycopaths brainwashed by their own greed".
Actually gotta give Eric an attaboy for this one. He reveals the hypocrisy but conspicuously avoids jumping on the anti carbon train. The reality is that the climate change agenda currently steamrolling the planet is a not particularly sophisticated scheme to transfer the wealth of the great unwashed to their elite masters. This is simply an insider dispute about which elitist group gets paid first. Manchin would get the well connected green contractors paid sooner with the added benefit that West Virginia would get a chunk of business prior to his election. Warren et al want to ensure that the lawyers and NGOs don't miss out in the meantime. It's just grifting all the way down with everyone involved claiming the moral high ground. Remember when Trump got us out of the Paris accords? Good times. But now the adults are back in the room. Bend over Eric. This is what you voted for.
Eric is basically a 90s Democrat pretending to be a libertarian.
Because they are horrible people. Full stop.
No good climate revival meeting is complete without a folk singer
https://revkin.bulletin.com/with-billions-of-dollars-to-invest-in-clean-energy-and-resilience-here-s-the-new-climate-communication-challenge/
With James Taylor coming out of retirement the movement is unstoppable!
More times than Frank Sinatra with less talent.
Democrats don't want to solve problems, they want to milk them for votes and graft. See "public schools", "homelessness" and "marijuana legalization" for additional egregious examples.
-jcr
Don't forget about the issue that appears to now be the singular question in which the left actually believes that their stated principle of "my body, my choice" actually applies.
If Sanders and Warren Think Climate Change Is an Emergency, Why Are They Against These Green Energy Reforms?
(1) Most politicians don’t understand the policies they promote, they just push whatever their lobbyists and special interests groups push on them. Because they don’t understand the policies, they also don’t see any contradictions in them.
(2) Most politicians aren’t motivated by solving problems, they are motivated by staying in power. They are happy to push contradictory policies if they can get away with it and if it increases their power.
To put it more concisely: most politicians are stupid, ignorant, greedy, and corrupt.
Offshore wind is stuck because it presents an inverse NIMBY problem:
It's an attempt to stick an eyesore in the nation's coastal front yard, all 12,000 miles of it.
The only people enthralled by the idea are executives and pension funds with GE and other wind turbine shares in their portfolios- both of who began lobbying for these monstrosities decades ago.
Windmills are elegant compared to oil platforms.
And produce so much less energy.
One oil platform produces as much energy as hundreds of wind turbines. Plus they can be placed over the horizon, which turbines cannot (transmission losses are no fun at all).
But oil is destroying the habitat of our species.
Windmills don't have to last forever. And I don't even think they're eyesores. Not even a little. I think they're cool. They signal that the country they're near has some intelligent people in it.
"But oil is destroying the habitat of our species..."
Assertions from ignorant piles of lefty shit =/= evidence or argument, ignorant pile of lefty shit.
I can't be mad at you. Every authoritarian movement needs its empty-headed brutes.
"I can’t be mad at you. Every authoritarian movement needs its empty-headed brutes."
To steaming piles of lefty shit (who don't reply to the comment) this represents clever repartee'!
Eat shit and die, asshole. Not clever, just the sincere wish of nearly everyone here.
It's cute how you think you make comments to respond to. Am I supposed to check in here sometime between eating shit and dying?
"It’s cute how you think you make comments to respond to. Am I supposed to check in here sometime between eating shit and dying?"
Eat shit and die, asshole.
Oil is one of the most useful sinstances ever in existemce
If those species' habitat are destroyed by oil,then those species should be extinct!
"Oil is one of the most useful sinstances ever in existemce
If those species’ habitat are destroyed by oil,then those species should be extinct!"
Unless someone comes up with a preferable alternative, ME's claim stands.
As mentioned below regarding the nukes ending WWII; we got an answer. Tough luck Spatterd Anwart!
Opens the door --------- "WHAT F'EN CLIMATE CHANGE EMERGENCY!!!"
That day arming Chicken-Little sh*t ("the sky is falling! the sky is falling!) with Gov-Guns came to pass. Chicken little's GUN is going to kill you long before the sky falls down. Good grief they can't even make up their mind if cooling is bad or warming is bad the only consensus they can gather is packing Gov-Guns against people (Yep; as many have said 'POWER').
More to the point.. It's just a stunt to Nazify everyone's energy.
Just as they made excuses to Nazify healthcare.
Just as they made excuses to Nazify education.
Just as they made excuses to Nazify housing/loaning.
Just as they made excuses to Nazify well practically everything.
But do take note; they focus most heavily on the most important of human resources. When the Nazi's get control of energy it'll be a big win for Democrats ( the Nazi-Empire ) taking over the USA.
Um, it also affects environmental permitting for pipelines to transport methane in West Virginia. Did this article even mention that the projects it facilitates include fossil fuel infrastructure?
This is deregulation sought by the fossil fuel industry. It's literally the opposite of a climate change bill. A climate change bill free of bonanzas for fossil fuels would be opposed by this website, of course, so the smarmy tone is noted. You could pass a bill for turning babies into soap, and it would be right to vote against it even if there were some windmills thrown in.
Burning more fossil fuels is not going to help the climate crisis. This is one of the most egregiously Koch-snorting articles here since maybe yesterday.
This is hardly the deregulation any person interested in the concept favors. It's transparent logrolling for a pet project of Sen. Manchin, with a bit of tinkering around the edges instead of anything that would really move the needle. Nobody on wither side of this issue should really care about its passage, because it's an immaterial act that exists solely to benefit one Senator's re-election campaign.
Burning more fossil fuels is not going to help the climate crisis.
Burning more gas and less coal does, you pig-ignorant lefturd twat.
-jcr
Oh and just do the math for me on that. How does burning methane, a potent greenhouse gas, solve the greenhouse gas problem?
Unfortunately, it cannot be simplified sufficiently to make sense to those who wonder why 1+1=2, ignorant pile of left shit. As has been pointed out, a technology sufficiently advanced appears to be magic to those not capable of understanding it. To a lefty ignoramus like you, the best we can offer is: Suffice to say, it does.
Eat shit and die, asshole.
Tony could get a WordPress account and post snide proof of ignorance over at Tony Heller's RealClimateScience dotcom blog. Engineer Tony is a religious conservative Trump worshipper embarrassing to we who seek to increase power output to match increasing population. But try it....
"Burning more fossil fuels is not going to help the climate crisis. This is one of the most egregiously Koch-snorting articles here since maybe yesterday."
Since the "Green" moment killed the nuclear power build-out in the 1970s-80s, and leftist regimes worldwide are aggressively decommissioning the remaining reactors we have, there aren't a ton of great alternatives left while we wait for the two kinds of "acceptable" power to reach the scale where they can meet more than a fraction of existing demand.
It's estimated that the nuclear expansion to replace coal 40-50 years ago would have reduced aggregate human CO2 emissions since the Industrial Revolution by 30% (although the major concern back then was acid rain and the ozone hole which led to re-engineering a lot of tech to emit CO2 instead of more reactive compounds).
It would have meant trading thousands of pounds of "nuclear waste" for the billions of tons of toxic (and radioactive) coal ash that were produced instead. However coal ash is something the lefty-green movement and the "Team Blue" media seem all too happy to ignore so it must not really exist, like the birds killed by windmills in Palm Springs and the Tonopah solar collectors in the Mojave desert.
They’ll never streamline it. They get too much money from the contractors and lawyers who write Environmental Impact Statements and deal with the rest of the process. It’s graft. Period.
Also, kudos to Reason for skipping the extremely tedious and misleading both sides bullshit for once.
Climate change is not an emergency. Climate change is not the greatest threat we have ever faced. The government cannot “build” an economy.
If you believe that either of the first two things are untrue, you are simply ignorant. If you believe that the third thing is untrue, you are not a libertarian.
“The NEPA review process was created in 1970 to ensure that the environmental impact of infrastructure projects like power plants and highways was considered. That’s important, but the process takes far too long.”
Is this a libertarian site or some milquetoast center left rag?
"If you believe that either of the first two things are untrue, you are simply ignorant."
Well I'm simply ignorant then; And my ignorance in *REALITY* has cost me nothing. Nothing at all but more snow than I've ever seen last year and record setting cold temperatures just a few years ago...
Oh wait; *REALITY* of it seems to be I'm not ignorant at all. Those who believe is such UN-founded conspiracy theories are probably too ignorant to realize even if their conspiracy theories were founded in anything but B.S. Gov-Guns still haven't had a running record of controlling the weather.
Yep; lol... I'm Ignorant. Missed the *not* in those first two sentences. 🙂
I might've worded that poorly.
I meant to say if you believe climate change is an existential threat and the greatest threat we've faced you're ignorant.
"right now, the U.S. has offshore wind projects capable of generating 42 megawatts (MW) of electricity, while another 18,581 MW of potential offshore wind power are tied up in permitting battles"
That's nameplate capacity. Now figure in average capacity factor for grid scale wind (around 35%).
*scrolling through the comment section*
Good god... Why is a website called "reason" filled with so many close-minded rightwing morons?
And by close-minded you must mean non-delusional.
SEE? Republicans believe prohibitionist Hitlerite National Socialism is free enterprise. But Gary's campaign made a lie of that by getting 4 million votes and accidentally helping the Grabber-Of-Pussy get elected--though defeated in the popular vote. Now they and the Dems struggle to assign shitposters to the comment section and infiltrate the platform committee with child molesters, communist surrenderists, communist anarchists and anarcho-fascists to make us look like fools. The LP ovvers voters the opportunity to leverage their votes with law-changing clout to repeal coercive laws and lower taxes. Looters hate that.
Do you know what you're even talking about? We're not the ones who linked to CP, unlike Shrike.
You should learn about "Trump Derangement Syndrome", because that's what you've been showing symptoms of.
Countries have multiple goals and priorities, sometimes they are in conflict with each other. In the US, democracy, transparency, and public participation in decision making is one priority, dealing with climate change is another. In China/Canada, energy independence and the exploitation of clean coal/tar sands is one priority, climate change is another.
My longtime Usenet ally, Christopher Charles Morton, explained climate change.
https://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=380576&p=4522359#post4522359
The future is scary. So is the enemy within.
In Orwell's Animal Farm the pigs mesmerized the more idiotic animals into trying to build windmills. Meanwhile, the pigs helped foreign powers (humans) to wreck those most miserable of power sources, lied about the sabotage and shocked the dumb animals they'd betrayed back into slavery by morphing into men. This scenario I observed firsthand while infiltrating communist and econazi Freeze & Surrender useful idiots on campus. Looters seek to de-industrialize suckers, then attack them like Fascisti on Ethiopians. The upside was their traveling propagandist led me to a Libertarian meeting where I found the Party I'd been looking for since 1968.
Econazi lawmakers accomplish a lot for countries run by the KGB or Chinese communist party. Think of them as the nazis infiltrated into Poland, Czechoslovakia, France and Norway in the late 30s and early 40s. Puerto Rico today could be taken over or blown up by any military adventurer--were it not a U.S. protectorate. But finally, 95% of boricua voters are in favor of having nuclear reactors replace power outages. Experience teaches!
Fuck off and die, Hank. No one cares about your drug-soaked rants. Not even your mom.
If you do not support nuclear power, you are not serious about addressing the claimed “emergency” of “climate change”; not a one of the other strategies addresses the issue in a time-frame which would possibly effect a change. Further, nukes are safe, period:
“Accidents When thinking of safety with regards to nuclear energy, it is easy to think first of disasters such as Three Mile Island, Chernobyl (see Fig. 1), and Fukushima. Of these three events, the only one that caused deaths was Chernobyl for which death estimates are slightly above 50 people. [1] A 2007 study of energy production in Europe assessed accident related risks of several different sources of energy production. The results showed that nuclear energy production averages 0.012 deaths due to accidents per TWh of energy produced. [2] In contrast, coal production averages 0.12 deaths due to accidents per TWh. [2] Indeed, nuclear energy also had a lower number of accident related deaths than all other forms of energy production studied (Oil, Gas, and Lignite). [2]…http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2019/ph241/marshall2/#:~:text=The%20results%20showed%20that%20nuclear%20energy%20production%20averages,of%20energy%20production%20studied%20%28Oil%2C%20Gas%2C%20and%20Lignite%29.
The paranoia regarding the issue is associated with the (largely lefty shit) misinformation regarding the numbers of deaths at Chernobyl: “There is consensus that a total of approximately 30 people died from immediate blast trauma and acute radiation syndrome (ARS) in the seconds to months after the disaster, respectively, with 60 in total in the decades since, inclusive of later radiation induced cancer…” Wiki, so salt required, but Wiki is nothing other than capsizing to port; got a better link regarding actual deaths, rather than some predictions lacking data? And this is the WORST nuclear accident in history, resulting in the average Chicago weekend shooting death toll.
Or the HORRIBLE!!!! Japanese Fukiyama disaster: “…Despite this, there were no deaths caused by acute radiation syndrome. […] For evacuation, the estimated number of deaths during and immediately after transit range from 34 to “greater than 50”
Again, Wiki with the same warning, but if we were to extrapolate, it suggests that many more deaths are caused the fear of nuclear danger than the fact of it.
Finally, in a subject near to my heart, we have lefty ignoramuses (the asswipe above in particular) whining annually around the beginning of August about the “horror” of the nukes which ended WWII in the most humane possible way, in every intelligent estimate, saving millions (plural) of both Allied and Japanese lives. I make that claim with the certainty of someone who has asked asswipes like Tony for at least 20 years to propose a more humane alternative solution, only to get (and this was Tony’s response several years ago) “The US should have surrendered”. That tells you a lot about Tony’s logical abilities. Don’t bother, asswipe, worthwhile response to this post requires you to add 1 and 1 and get 2; beyond your capabilities.
I think the US's ideas about what an invasion would have looked like were heavily influenced by the atrocities committed by the Japanese military starting with Saipan and continuing on most every island campaign with a substantial non-military population. See this video on the Suicide Cliffs of Saipan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoIVAqtYlkw&ab_channel=TheHistoryUnderground
We had basically 4 choices: Invasion, Blockade, Continued fire bombing or nukes. Of the 4 choices forced upon us by the Japanese Gov, those nukes were the lowest death options of all. They didn't surrender after we had destroyed their entire fleet (literally) and most of their combat aircraft. They didn't surrender after the fire bombing of Tokyo. The didn't surrender after Hiroshima. WTF were we supposed to do with these crazy mfers?
What threat to the US did the Japanese pose after their navy was destroyed and the civilian population were reduced to eating dogs?
No reasonable person takes Warren, Sanders and the other weather deniers seriously. Listen to the babbling stooge Raging Tlaib earlier this week. If they were around when Ford rolled out its first Model T they would have wanted all the horses shot. They are delusional and demented.
Climate change and "green energy are hoaxes much the same as the holocaust.
It's all about raising money. The fraud of climate change/ global warming/global cooling has been perpetrated for 50 years, each time proclaiming we have only ten years left and blah,blah,blah. Virtually none of it true. The only thing the climate hysterics have accomplished is raising lots of cash for which they provide themselves with private jets and fancy expensive hotels from which to pontificate their rubbish in well tended dinners and luncheons. Green energy is another great hoax as well as a complete failure. None of it provides anywhere near the amount of electrical power needed to sustain a nation and it never will. The amount of actual environmental damage being done in the way of mining lithium and other needed materials is staggering. Wind turbine blades cannot be recycled, 80-90% of the lithium batteries are not recycled, very little amount of solar cells are being recycled. Besides being a blight on the landscape, wind turbines also kill thousands of birds including Golden Eagles.
What they really want is for the rest of us to live in tiny little cubicles dinning on crickets and grasshoppers while they, the ones behind this fraud live in the splendor fit for a king. This is what's coming. You will own nothing and eat bugs and you'd better be happy or else.
Harnessing photosynthesis would go a long way to solve our energy needs. The earth's plant life manages to produce an order of magnitude of energy greater than the needs of civilization all thanks to photosynthesis. Be warned though, research and development will cost money, time and effort.
If Sanders and Warren Think Climate Change Is an Emergency, They (and other left wing Democrat environmental extremists) Wouldn't Have Opposed Every Effective Green Energy Reform during the past five decades, including nuclear power, oil and natural gas pipelines, fracking, oil and LNG exports (all of which have reduced coal burning).
Countries have multiple goals and priorities, sometimes they are in conflict with each other. In the US, democracy, transparency, and public participation in decision making is one priority, dealing with climate change is another. In China/Canada, energy independence and the exploitation of clean coal/tar sands is one priority, climate change is another.
Well Warren and Sanders can't seem to competently prioritize if they think climate change is such an enormous issue.
It seems they believe that public participation in decision making is also an enormous issue. It's normal for people to have desires and priorities that conflict with one another. Pretending otherwise is just disingenuous. An emergency needs immediate attention, public participation requires time. There's the rub. It's not difficult to understand.
Not being a mind reader, I can't say with authority why any Dem wouldn't support clearing the way for approval of the "green" energy projects they claim to believe in (and which many of their biggest billionaire donors are heavily invested in).
Federal regs are the least of the manufactured delays which beset the wind farm off Martha's vineyard, a project which managed to break ground almost exactly 20 years after it was first proposed thanks to Biden putting the last leg of its path on a "fast track". For most of the first decade, the Kennedy family (especially Sen Ted) was lauded as a hero by many major "conservation" groups (especially the Audobon Society) for almost single-handedly blocking it
In the case of Sanders and Warren, the most likely answer is that they (maybe sincerely, or maybe just because it's what their supporters want) are more interested in having the "solutions" come from the public sector than they are in allowing the private sector to accomplish 20x as much 10x as fast and at 40% of the cost.