The FBI Regains Access to Mar-a-Lago Documents That Trump Claims He Mentally Declassified
Even if Trump did declassify those records, the 11th Circuit says, he "has not identified any reason that he is entitled to them."

A federal appeals court yesterday restored the FBI's access to more than 100 documents with classification markings that it found last month when it searched Mar-a-Lago, former President Donald Trump's residence and private club in Palm Beach, Florida. U.S. District Judge Raymond Dearie, the special master appointed by U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon, will continue reviewing the rest of the 11,000 or so documents that the FBI seized, looking for any that may qualify as personal property, attorney-client communications, or material covered by executive privilege. But thanks to the partial stay issued by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 11th Circuit, the FBI can use the small subset of documents marked as classified to assess not only whether keeping them at Mar-a-Lago damaged national security but also whether Trump or his representatives violated federal law by doing so.
The 11th Circuit's 29-page decision unambiguously rejects the reasoning that Cannon applied when she prohibited the government from reviewing the documents marked as classified "for criminal investigative purposes" and when she refused to issue a stay lifting that part of her order. The appeals court's ruling also highlights the dubiousness and legal irrelevance of Trump's claim that he declassified those records before transporting them from the White House to Mar-a-Lago in January 2021.
Trump elaborated on that claim during an interview with Sean Hannity on Fox News last night (emphasis added). "I did declassify," he said. "There doesn't have to be a process, as I understand it….If you're the president of the United States, you can declassify just by saying 'it's declassified' [or] even by thinking about it, because you're sending it to Mar-a-Lago or wherever they're sending it, and there doesn't have to be a process. There can be a process, but there doesn't have to be. You're the president; you make that decision. So when you say 'send it,' it's declassified."
That account is hard to reconcile with what Trump said four days after the FBI's search. At that point, Trump claimed he had "a standing order" as president that automatically declassified any records he took from the Oval Office to study at his residence in the White House. That policy was news to national security officials who should have known about it, and it would have been a very cavalier way to handle sensitive government records.
Declassification decisions are supposed to be based on a careful judgment that allowing unrestricted access to a particular document would not jeopardize national security. But by Trump's account, he declassified anything he happened to remove from the Oval Office. Furthermore, it seems he did not bother to inform anyone of those specific decisions so that people would know how the records should be handled and could update the markings on them accordingly.
Despite those obvious drawbacks, Trump's initial explanation at least involved an "order," meaning he at some point announced this purported policy. His comments on Fox News suggest he did not even bother to do that.
Trump said the president can declassify documents "even by thinking about it," meaning the decision does not have to be communicated to anyone, even though the whole point is to change how records are stored and handled. In fact, according to Trump, he did not even have to mentally declassify records. "When you say 'send it,'" Trump asserted, "it's declassified." In other words, anything he brought to Mar-a-Lago was declassified by definition, even if Trump never told anyone that or even thought about it.
That version of Trump's defense is also inconsistent with what Trump lawyer Evan Corcoran said in a May 25 letter to Jay Bratt, chief of the Counterintelligence and Export Control Section in the Justice Department's National Security Division. Corcoran told Bratt that documents "purportedly marked as classified" were "once in the White House and unknowingly included among the boxes brought to Mar-a-Lago by the movers" (emphasis added).
If Trump did not know what was in the boxes, he could not have declassified material "even by thinking about it." Nor could he have instructed anyone to "send it" in any meaningful sense. According to Corcoran, the records with classification markings ended up at Mar-a-Lago entirely by accident.
In June, when Corcoran and Christina Bobb, another Trump lawyer, gave the FBI 38 such documents in response to a federal subpoena, they said nothing about Trump's supposed declassification of them. On the contrary, the 11th Circuit notes, the envelope containing the records "was double-wrapped in tape, consistent with handling procedures for classified documents."
Does any of this really matter? "Plaintiff suggests that he may have declassified these documents when he was President," the appeals court says. "But the record contains no evidence that any of these records were declassified. And before the special master, Plaintiff resisted providing any evidence that he had declassified any of these documents."
During a hearing on Tuesday, Trump lawyer James Trusty implied that such evidence exists, but he told Dearie revealing it would be premature. "We are not in a position, nor should we be in a position at this juncture, to fully disclose a substantive defense," Trusty said. "We shouldn't have to be in a position to have to disclose declarations and witness statements." Dearie was not buying it. "My view of it is you can't have your cake and eat it," he replied.
In any event, the 11th Circuit says, the current classification status of the disputed documents is not relevant in deciding whether the FBI can use them to build a criminal case against Trump or his underlings. "At least for these purposes, the declassification argument is a red herring because declassifying an official document would not change its content or render it personal," the unanimous three-judge panel says. "So even if we assumed that Plaintiff did declassify some or all of the documents, that would not explain why he has a personal interest in them."
The appeals court alludes to the puzzle posed by Trump's removal of more than 300 documents with classification markings, including 184 discovered in the 15 boxes that he surrendered to the National Archives and Records Administration in January, the 38 that his lawyers gave the FBI in June, and the 100 or so that the FBI found at Mar-a-Lago in August. Those documents ranged from "confidential" to "top secret" and included "special compartmented information" about intelligence sources and methods. They also reportedly included information about a foreign nation's nuclear capabilities.
Such details proved disquieting even to some of Trump's reliable defenders. "Why did he have all that secret stuff at Mar-a-Lago?" Fox & Friends host Steve Doocy, a longtime Trump ally, wondered on the air last month.
The 11th Circuit judges, two of whom were appointed by Trump, don't get it either. "Plaintiff has not even attempted to show that he has a need to know the information contained in the classified documents," they say. "Nor has he established that the current administration has waived that requirement for these documents. And even if he had, that, in and of itself, would not explain why Plaintiff has an individual interest in the classified documents."
That is not the only error that the appeals court identified in Cannon's reasoning. It says she did not properly apply the rules laid out in Richey v. Smith, a 1975 decision "outlining the standard for entertaining a pre-indictment motion for the return of property under Rule 41(g)." Cannon "concluded that [Trump] did not show that the United States acted in callous disregard of his constitutional rights," the 11th Circuit notes. "No party contests the district court's finding in this regard. The absence of this 'indispensab[le]' factor in the Richey analysis is reason enough to conclude that the district court abused its discretion in exercising equitable jurisdiction here."
The appeals court says Cannon also erred in determining "whether the plaintiff
has an individual interest in and need for the material whose return he seeks." That is where Trump's unexplained "need to know the information contained in the classified documents" comes in.
According to the 11th Circuit, Cannon likewise was wrong to conclude that Trump "would be irreparably injured by denial of the return of the property" and that, without her intervention, Trump would have "no legal means of seeking the return of his property for the time being." Trump "has been clear that he is not seeking the return of the classified documents," the appeals court notes. "And even if he were, he has not identified any reason that he is entitled to them."
In short, the 11th Circuit says, "none of the Richey factors favor exercising equitable jurisdiction over this case. Consequently, the United States is substantially likely to succeed in showing that the district court abused its discretion in exercising jurisdiction over Plaintiff's motion as it concerns the classified documents."
When Cannon considered whether the government would "suffer irreparable injury in the absence of a stay," she rejected the argument that restricting the FBI's use of the classified records would endanger national security. Preventing the FBI from using the records in its criminal investigation posed no such risk, she thought, because she was allowing the government to continue its assessment of how keeping the documents at Mar-a-Lago may have compromised intelligence sources or methods.
"This distinction is untenable," the 11th Circuit says. "The United States has sufficiently explained how and why its national-security review is inextricably intertwined with its criminal investigation." The same FBI and Justice Department officials are responsible for both overseeing the criminal investigation and for coordinating the intelligence review with other agencies, and those two functions interact.
For example, the appeals court says, "if an Intelligence agency were to obtain intelligence indicating that a classified document in the seized materials might have been compromised, the FBI would be responsible for taking some of the necessary steps to evaluate that risk." Furthermore, such a discovery would unavoidably "inform the FBI's criminal investigation."
That investigation, like the question of whether a stay should have been issued, does not hinge on whether anyone believes Trump's claims about declassifying records through "a standing order," by "thinking about it," or merely by deciding to take the documents with him to Mar-a-Lago. The FBI cited three potential crimes in its search warrant, and none of them depends on the classification status of those documents.
18 USC 793(e) makes it a felony, punishable by up to 10 years in prison, to "willfully" retain "defense information" that the defendant "has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation." 18 USC 2071 makes it a felony, punishable by up to three years in prison, to "willfully" conceal, remove, or destroy a U.S. government document, classified or not. 18 USC 1519 makes it a felony, punishable by up to 20 years in prison, to conceal "any record, document, or tangible object" with the intent to "impede, obstruct, or influence" a federal investigation.
If the Justice Department ultimately decides to prosecute Trump for any of those offenses, it may have trouble establishing the requisite intent, since his behavior can plausibly be attributed to some combination of ignorance, arrogance, laziness, and sloppiness. But to obtain convictions, prosecutors would not have to refute Trump's assertion that the classification status of any given document is contingent on his fleeting thoughts or acquisitive impulses.
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Sullum for Banana republic style procecution!
No shit. The TDS is strong in that one.
Sullum is at stage 4 TDS. He has not yet entered stage 5 but he's probably very close. Once at Stage 5 the victim is incapable of doing anything other than being angry about Trump having been the president. At stage 4 they justify violent acts to deal with the problem but they are still able to be productive workers as long as they don't spend too many hours thinking about Trump. When they hit stage 5 they have to be hospitalized to protect themselves and everyone else for they start to see others as Trump and become violent. TDS is a serious mental disorder that is very much underfunded.
PSA: If like this victim you too suffer from TDS please for the sake of your loved ones seek help.
Funny that Sullum write an article talking about facts about documents, actions and words of people involved, applicable laws, etc.
And this triggers you to start talking about Sullum.
I do declare you guys have Sullum Derangement Syndrome.
So youre ignoring all the information and facts posted below and utilizing a weak appeal to authority instead?
Dee thought this post was very clever. Chuckled to herself for a good hour after posting it.
Obama foundation admitted to having classified documents in a warehouse in 2018.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/matt-margolis/2022/09/22/letter-reveals-obama-foundation-is-keeping-classified-docs-in-abandoned-furniture-warehouse-n1631408
“The Obama Foundation agrees to transfer up to three million three hundred thousand dollars ($3,300,000) to the National Archives Trust Fund (NATF) to support the move of classified and unclassified Obama Presidential records and artifacts from Hoffman Estates to NARA-controlled facilities that conform to the agency’s archival storage standards for such records and artifacts, and for the modification of such spaces.”
Direct link to document on Obama website: https://www.obama.org/wp-content/uploads/BOF-NARA-LOI.pdf
So what you're saying is that Trump should have bribed NARA to set up an "office" in the closet where he was keeping the records?
Yes. 2 years later.
May as well have. That letter was the result of the exact same negotiations Trump was holding when the political raid on his house occurred.
No, they weren't. Obama didn't lie to NARA, either.
The MAGAts trying to pretend those things are the same are their usually pathetic selves.
Trump wasn't charged with lying to NARA whose structure is civil and not criminal. With the commanding current ruling being the president has wide deference based on the Clinton case.
What an idiotic statement you've made.
"Obama didn’t lie to NARA, either."
Neither did Trump.
Neither did Hitler, Stalin, or Mammary-Necrophilia-Fuhrer!
Or that he should have agreed to pay the amount necessary to make sure the documents were properly cared for. You're arguing that buying a loaf of bread is the same as stealing it and bribing the cops with same amount of money as the price of the bread. It's just dumb. You know better. We all do.
Obamas documents are in a warehouse, prior to being shipped to NARA facilities.
Can you dumbasses read?
He can, but it ruins the narrative, so he's ignoring it.
And then they hysterically screech when they get called NPCs.
Trying to claim that a locked fileroom in a security private estate protected by the Secret Service is very insecure is not a rational objection. The documentation that Trump had is clearly under significantly more protection than most archives because it is also Trump's home
Great link - shows how former presidents scoop everything when they leave expecting to sort it later. Here's the link to an article showing Hilliary exercizing her priveledge to do anything with classified info. Mar a Lago is all about "get Trump". The elites want to smash Trump and Putin just to strike fear into those who won't go along. https://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/clintons-handling-of-classified-information/
"Trump and Putin"?!
Sure, why haven't republicans done anythnig about it? They investigated her for months and came up with nada. Now it's Trump's turn and it looks like we caught a big one. No covfefe or hamberders or ambulance chaser is going to be able to save him this time. He's header for a little vacation in federal prison. Hope he gets a window cell .
Are you seriously asking why nobody went after Clinton? You can't be this stupid.
That’s just what about isn’t to deflect from your orange Jesus!!!1!1!1!
One of the more insidious things is trumps lawyers not being granted clearances to investigate if the documents under question were the crossfire hurricane documents he explicitly declassified before leaving office.
DOJ: They were marked classified!
Were they declassified?
DOJ: They were marked classified!
What are they regarding? Crossfire Hurricane? Because those were declassified and you're in contempt of court right now for refusing to release them.
DOJ: They were marked classified!
Lock her up for those emails, but actual top secret documents retained after affirming by sworn affidavit that all documents had been returned is nothing at all.
I was going to make fun of you for *still* carrying water for a fat fuck traitor, but you’ve become so utterly pathetic I just don’t have it in me.
The losing continues. That’s what happens when you completely eschew reality.
Edit: whoa an edit button. This place is really coming along!
Viz: the shitshow of the Biden administration: a bunch of imbeciles, racists, and psychopaths, completely divorced from reality, running the country, the economy, and the markets into the ground while making America the laughing stock of the world.
Where you been sociopath?
Stolen valor's been sockpuppeting here for a while lately under different nicks.
Considering it's one of cytotoxic's (chemjeff, since his humiliating meltdown after Hillary lost) many socks, so you're right.
Hey blood libel is back!
DOL
And the (((Deep State))) is just another obvious iteration of the Jewish blood libel. The newest boogeyman for paranoid anti social types to fixate on instead of self reflection.
Still top ten dumbest comment ever made on this site.
Welcome back buddy.
Remember when DOL called for prison camps?
https://reason.com/2021/01/19/goodbye-trump-hello-war-on-domestic-terror/#comment-8712029
Is Jewish blood libel more or less dangerous than a bear in a trunk?
Bears in trunks actually kill children for their blood bro.
Hey cytotoxic, it's great to see your fake special ops soldier back in action. Why did you lock it up for the past year? Or were you on special assignment to assassinate Bin Laden again? Want to run your mouth like a LARPing faggot again and then run away pissing your shorts when somebody accepts one of your challenges?
You're back!
Says Dee as she creams herself.
Republicans could have done somethign but there was no there there so Hillary moved on and they moved on. However, with trump probably stealing state secrets for possible ominous reasons I think these charges will stick when there's finally an indictment. Trump's little sycophant Canon won't be able to save him from this.
Ehhh, there absolutely was, but they just declined to prosecute her. Because she's Hillary Clinton.
"Mentally declassified" is enough to satisfy the action.
Snarky comments like this just show the TDS.
The special master, you know the one Trump requested, does not agree that mentally declassified is enough. But then the special master isn't suffering from Trump Defense Syndrome.
He explicitly said he isnt ruling on criminal matters dumbfuck.
It’s funny how they always bring up TDS when 99% of the time the only that is deranged is Trump and his sycophants.
Call it "Trump derangement syndrome syndrome" - the psychotic delusion that any disagreement or opposition to Trump is due to TDS.
That's a good way of putting it. I just always explain to people that TDS runs both ways.
We get it Jacob, you're a leftist propagandist who cheers for political persecution of your enemies. You've thoroughly beckoned yourself with your hype man routine for every idiotic fraud of an investigation so far so why stop now.
LOL at the stupid MAGAt calling everyone he doesn't like a leftist.
Hey shreek, remember that time you got your Sarah Palin's Buttplug account banned because you posted dark web links to hardcore child pornography?
“stupid MAGAt”
Tell me you’re a fucking retarded fuck without saying I’m a fucking retarded fuck.
You're calling him names and accusing him of doing nothing other than pointing out simple, easily verifiable facts. Maga world does really live in a reality all its own.
Do it right! Make claims that Trump had special powers or had a perfectly good reason for stealing the stuff, or make up some other red herring excuse if you'd like. But it's just so profoundly childish to acknowledge to clear facts and call someone names for pointing them out. Low effort, even for a magat.
Trump didn't "steal" anything, nor did he have any "special powers". The GSA packed up the papers in the WH when he moved out and moved them into his post-presidential office. Same thing they do with every president.
The only thing unusual this time is that Democrats are trying to use this normal occurrence for a political persecution.
He had a bunch of top secret documents in his desk with his passport. Are you really trying to argue that ignorance is his best excuse? Honestly, it may be, but the law doesn't accept that. And when it comes to national security, an patriotic American is glad it doesn't.
"top secret documents in his desk"
Were they still "top secret", or were they declassified? Because the FBI and DOJ are refusing to answer that very, very pertinent question.
He is probably also of the belief NARA calls for every copy of a document ever made and not just the primary documents or copy when that doesn't exist.
Cite?
What Difference At This Point Does It Make, sarcasmic?
Anyone that follows him and qanon really needs to seek professional help.
Why? He beat Hillary, and the left lost their minds. They lied in order to spy on him, had two bullshit impeachments, the Mueller probe that everyone knew was bullshit, and he was still an awesome President.
Jailed Putin opponent Alexei Navalny has been found guilty of fraud and may face up to 13 years in a maximum-security prison camp
Can you believe it? As bad as Vladimir Putin is, at least he's not committing fraud the same way his political opponents do, which is why they must be thrown in jail. I hope the Biden administration can do the same. We must all respect the law equally.
What???
Why???
What you wrote was incoherent.
When???
Do you understand what political investigations are?
If you like Russia's justice system so much more you're welcome to emigrate. I'm pretty sure that if you're willing to shoot a Ukranian grandmother in the face you can score a citizenship card.
Well this comment is ironic because it is the democrats acting like Russians and going after their political opponents.
Did act blue send out a distress call?
They're not sending their best.
A lot of republicans seem to think that Biden is both all-powerful and capable of raising or lower gas at will and having Trump go to trial. It's the same crowd that also are 100% completely convinced he's an inept doddering old fool. The cognitive dissonance in their minds must be the deafening, like the worst case of tenitus imaginable.
https://youtu.be/LdldQ6x4UKg
Nope, not a doddering old fool at all, lol
Sullum, so broken by TDS.
If Trump did not know what was in the boxes, he could not have declassified material "even by thinking about it."
Obviously Fatass Donnie has special powers others do not have.
Don't you have a NAMBLA meeting you're missing?
Don’t be so modest.
You have some kind of clairvoyance because you knew back in May 2021 that Trump would go to prison for exactly this scandal — even though the rest of us only heard about it 14 or 15 months later.
#WallsClosingIn
Yes, #GotHimNow
It's the #TippingPoint you might say.
Apparently my edit failed so here's the link in which Buttplug demonstrates his ability to see more than a year into the future.
You are a master of schadenfreude
The world's first atheist prophet.
We have entered the "He was too dumb to even know what he had done" phase.
"He isn't a lawyer! Heck, he isn't even a politician! He's just an innocent guy who accidently stole top secret classified documents when his coup failed. Cut him some slack. He only lost about 50 of them. Why do they treat him so unfairly?"
Hey look, sarcasmic the drunken piece of shit who raped his underage daughter and lost custody of her in his acrimonious divorce agrees with shreek the kiddie fucker who got banned for posting child pornography!
Cite?
You were banned for posting links to kiddie porn shrike.
Hey shreek, remember when you got your Sarah Palin's Buttplug account banned from Reason.com and got an entire article and comment section wiped from the site because you posted dark web links to hardcore child pornography?
Wasn't Hillary's defense to keeping official Email documents private pretty much this?
In a nut(case) shell, yes.
Yes, but no reasonable prosecutor would pursue such charges.
IIRC, "convenience".
There are two questions here:
1. Does the president have the authority to declassify documents purely on his own authority?
2. If Trump had a standing order to declassify any documents that ended up in Mar Lago, then surely there is some record of that order and it can be produced?
Though just for some history. During the 1945 Potsdam Conference of the Allied Powers, President Truman received word of the successful Trinity Atomic Bomb Test. Despite the very existence of atomic bomb program being one of the most classified secrets at the time (When a Senator, Truman was told to back off when he started sniffing around the appropriations records for the Manhatten Project, and was deliberately not informed about it as VP), he, on his own decision, informed Stalin that the USA had the bomb. He was disconcerted by Stalin's muted reaction, as Soviet spies had already told the Soviet leadership. There is precedent that the President has a great deal of personal discretion with regards to classified materials.
Or it could be useful for Sullum to detail the process used to declassify documents so the reader could determine if what Trump did was wrong. I suspect there isn't an official method, and whatever Trump did was legit because he had the authority.
You completely missed the part where he reiterated that their classification status is irrelevant to him taking them at all. His making up excuses in an effort to foil the investigation could be considered further obstruction of justice, but they shouldn't even bother with that. There is no need to heap decades and decades of prison time. He is an old, fat man. Just nail him with the easy stuff and put him away for 10-15 years. That should be plenty.
What's the easy stuff, Shrike?
This is sarc, not shreek. Shreek is running 3 other socks in this thread. Sarc just likes to follow him around humping his leg hoping to get sloppy seconds on an 8 year old boy.
The problem with Trump's "I could declassify anything I wanted" claim isn't really that he didn't have the authority.
It's that he's claiming he could do so without telling anyone.
Simply put, if the only person that knows whether a given document is classified or not is the president themselves, then you don't have a classification system, you have a cluster-fuck. So when something is declassified --even if it is declassified outside the normal procedure-- you still need to tell people so that markings, databases, classification guides, and so-on can be updated.
If you don't do that, then obviously there's no way for anyone else to handle the documents according to their new classification as, absent telepaths (which don't exist) there is literally no way for anyone to know it was changed.
If the Justice Department ultimately decides to prosecute Trump for any of those offenses, it may have trouble establishing the requisite intent, since his behavior can plausibly be attributed to some combination of ignorance, arrogance, laziness, and sloppiness.
Trump an arrogant, lazy, ignoramus? No jury would convict with that as his defense.
Got a rig count update? I need your #DefendBidenAtAllCosts / #BestEconomyEver analysis as an antidote to the misinformation my aunts and uncles were spreading at my cousin's birthday party last week.
Get this: they actually said things are so bad that their investments are doing even worse now than at any point in the Trump years. Worse than the low point during the most severe lockdowns of early to mid 2020, they claim. That's nonsense, right?
yes, nonsense.
The S&P 500 has doubled on a closing basis from its Covid trough of 2,237.40 on March 23.
vs 3757 today.
But a recession has been ordered up by J Powell.
Thanks. 🙂
Next time my relatives talk about how they're objectively worse off financially now than before Biden took over, I'll tell them they have no idea what they're talking about. (Or that their financial advisor is a Republican who's sabotaging them on purpose.)
#BidenBoom
turd lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, TDS-addled asshole and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.
Fuck off and die, turd.
Well child pornography hasn't been ordered up by anyone, so you can feel free to fuck off, shreek.
"That’s nonsense, right?"
Anything that tries to divert this conversation away from the simple, self evident fact that Trump stole national security secrets, and then proceeded to lose, or sell, or give away nearly 50 of those same stolen national security secrets is nonsense.
You keep repeating lies that not even the DoJ has made. Are you doing okay?
Perhaps I am assuming too much. You're right. It is possible he emptied out 48 envelopes marked top secret and used the contents as kleenex. The DOJ hasn't needed to publicly talk about all of the missing documents because they are frantically trying to find them. There are plenty of crimes to charge him with as it is.
"The DOJ hasn’t needed to publicly talk about all of the missing documents because they are frantically trying to find them."
Lol, they're frantically doing something all right.
"There are plenty of crimes to charge him with as it is."
Oh? Like what?
You should maybe share your hot tips with Garland and Letitia James. They've been desperately searching for anything for two years now.
So you make up more lies after the initial batch.
Are you doing okay?
Other than the cirrhosis, homelessness, joblessness, welfare dependency, and losing his family sarcasmic is doing great!
If by "assuming" you mean "drinking" then you're right, sarcasmic.
Or it might be attributed to a lack of evidence.
I’m sure you guys will invent something new though.
Do you think a jury would convict you for possession and distribution of child pornography based on the indisputable evidence that you got your original Sarah Palin's Buttplug account banned and got an entire article and comment section wiped from Reason.com because you posted dark web links to hardcore child pornography, kiddie fucker?
TL, DR: "Duck season, FIRE!" - Jacob Sullum
In any event, the 11th Circuit says, the current classification status of the disputed documents is not relevant in deciding whether the FBI can use them to build a criminal case against Trump or his underlings. “At least for these purposes, the declassification argument is a red herring because declassifying an official document would not change its content or render it personal,” the unanimous three-judge panel says. “So even if we assumed that Plaintiff did declassify some or all of the documents, that would not explain why he has a personal interest in them.”
ROFLMAO! At this point, you can practically picture Sullum chugging two quarts of beer, doing 10 circles with his forehead on top of a baseball bat, falling down, vomiting on himself and then shouting “I’m not drizzy *urp* or dunk. You are!”
“We issued a search warrant for classified documents that were critical to our investigation and once we found classified documents illegally being held by the FPOTUS the classified nature of the documents was irrelevant to our investigation.” – DOJ
“The DOJ raided Trump’s home under the premise of the NARA and found both classified material and personal records. Trump attorneys distracted from the raid by raising a smokescreen of impropriety within the DOJ that he had taken classified documents when, in fact, he had only taken personal effects.” – Jacob Sullum
Seriously, Jacob, my teenagers understand this better than you do. You really need to sit down, shut up, and stop making your own team look like a bunch of bungling retards, more stupid and less principled than Orange Man.
Court intrigue, nothing more.
The political junkies who follow this shit closely are the same as housewives reading People magazine. Same intellect, same brainwaves
"National security, smashanal security" is a pretty pathetic argument.
Now leftists are concerned about National security. Pathetic.
Being a homeless drug addicted welfare case who lost custody of his daughter because he was credibly accused of child molestation is a pretty pathetic life, sarcasmic.
Sorry, my concern for national security died in 2016. And not because Trump got elected.
anything he brought to Mar-a-Lago was declassified by definition, even if Trump never told anyone that or even thought about it.
"It's good to be King!"
"King" has nothing to do with it. "Classification" is just a mechanism set up by the executive to run things more safely and efficiently. That's what "classified" means: to divide documents into different classes, to be handled differently.
Obviously, the head of the executive branch isn't subject to any limitations or restrictions there.
There's one tiny problem with that: Donald J. Trump is not the United States President anymore and hasn't been since January 20th, 2020. If he didn't formally declassify the documents before then, then they remain classified. As of January 21st, 2020, he would have no power to declassify them and any classified materials still in his possession would become contraband. Every other president has managed to navigate this hazard by following the guidance of lawyers and the National Archives, usually long before leaving office.
Him and his staff have said they declassified documents taken to Mar a Lago. Do keep up instead of flailing like a leftist moron.
Surely there's some documentation to that effect, then. You're not just going to take his word for it right? Also, if that were the case why are they stored in folders that say "TOP SECRET/SCI" on the front? Why haven't his lawyers asserted that the documents are declassified? Surely if it's such a simple and ironclad legal defense that would be the first thing they would do. Why have so many people from inside the administration said they've never heard of any order to declassify such things?
Or, alternatively, perhaps he's not very stable or a genius.
It doesn’t require documentation for the WH or their staff. You can read the Egan v Navy decision stating as such. Or you can look at the Bush or Obama EO on declassification processes that exempt the WH and staff from those procedures.
Do keep up.
Forget they were classified. It does not matter whether he used his very stable genius brain to will away their classification. He stole them. That's all that's necessary for DOJ to prove. Once they've done that, they can make a case for why he is claiming to have done something only a few sycophants argue he did. None of the people involved with the handling of classified documents ever heard any mention of that. It should be pretty easy to convince a reasonable jury that he made up the excuse in order to further obstruct justice.
DOJ might have to get in line behind Georgia and New York prosecutors to do it. But America has been patient with him so far. Just be a little more patient.
He didnt steal them. Can you make one knowledgeable comment? If your claim is he stole them, then you should look at obamas letter as well.
That letter doesn't mean anything to sarcasmic, because sarcasmic can't read. He self-admittedly couldn't finish Economics In One Lesson, a basic primer written at a middle school reading level.
Hahahahahahahaha
Man Joe Friday and shrike are facing some steep competition, I hope you stick around.
Hahahahahahahaha
We are Banana Republic for sure now.
More like Chess king.
(Please excuse the terrible joke.)
Well, it’s this Hot Topic we’re talking about.
"There doesn't have to be a process, as I understand it….If you're the president of the United States, you can declassify just by saying 'it's declassified' [or] even by thinking about it, because you're sending it to Mar-a-Lago or wherever they're sending it, and there doesn't have to be a process. There can be a process, but there doesn't have to be. You're the president; you make that decision. So when you say 'send it,' it's declassified."
This claim holds true based on Egan vs Navy where an example that a president revealing classified information during a discussion with a foreign leader is valid. Does Sullum ever investigate his articles?
"Does Sullum ever investigate his articles?"
Fuck no. He's paid to hit a set quota of orangemanbad articles regardless of the quality. Factuality and logic have no home here.
That investigation, like the question of whether a stay should have been issued, does not hinge on whether anyone believes Trump's claims about declassifying records through "a standing order," by "thinking about it," or merely by deciding to take the documents with him to Mar-a-Lago. The FBI cited three potential crimes in its search warrant, and none of them depends on the classification status of those documents.
18 USC 793(e) makes it a felony, punishable by up to 10 years in prison, to "willfully" retain "defense information" that the defendant "has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation." 18 USC 2071 makes it a felony, punishable by up to three years in prison, to "willfully" conceal, remove, or destroy a U.S. government document, classified or not. 18 USC 1519 makes it a felony, punishable by up to 20 years in prison, to conceal "any record, document, or tangible object" with the intent to "impede, obstruct, or influence" a federal investigation
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Why are people stuck on classification status like a mental block or something ? It doesn't matter if it is classified or if it is a napkin drawing, so long as it runs afoul of USC. Every source I read today cannot get over whether Trump can declassify with his brain or not. Who cares ? That isn't even the point, nor is it on the warrant. I feel like I'm in a circus and tent is on fire, but nobody cares because they're busy watching the Lions maul the Tamer because it's more entertaining than doing something about the fire.
You're absolutely right: classification status is irrelevant. It's a propaganda tool used by Democrats trying to smear Trump. Thanks for admitting that.
You're absolutely right. And Trump didn't run afoul of those statutes.
Glad we settled this.
Reason is also defending the over classification and wide breathe of defense information often used by government to hide bad acts. For decades they have attacked both over classification and vague rules of defense information. But not here. If it hurts Trump throw out their principles. No mention that government often over classified and misclassifies documents. None at all.
"The FBI cited three potential crimes in its search warrant, and none of them depends on the classification status of those documents."
Let's face it, even Democratic Party allies like the Washington Post are 99.99% sure that the documents in question are related to the Crossfire Hurricane criminality, and there's zero chance that the one concealing the information or causing injury to the US, is Trump.
The DoJ is actually in violating a court order to release parts right now.
Which of those crime moves Trump beyond the protections of attorney-client privledge, which one means they can grab everything insight because general warrants are back in style? God you progs are evil.
A lot of that is just because you're an incredibly stupid cunt with no idea what you're talking about, though.
Why did you change over to this handle, HazelMeade?
Fine. Then let's raid the home and storage facilities of Obama and Bush as well and apply the same standards. Ditto for Hillary.
Trump's "mental declassification" remark confirms the theory that the most dangerous interviews for a politican (maybe especially Trump) are not the hostile ones but the ones with *friendly* interviewers--because they lead him to relax and say things he'd be wiser not to say...
Sullum, stuff your TDSS up your ass, you steaming pile of shit.
If you're the president of the United States, you can declassify just by saying 'it's declassified' [or] even by thinking about it...That account is hard to reconcile with what Trump said four days after the FBI's search. At that point, Trump claimed he had "a standing order" as president that automatically declassified any records he took from the Oval Office
I see no evidence Trump has thus far claimed he declassified documents "just by thinking about it", just that he could. And if he did have the power to declassify anything for any reason, he is essentially right in his supposition.
SCOTUS said otherwise back when Nixon was in office.
No, they didn't, shreek.
"Who will rid me of this turbulent SCI/HUMINT stamp?"
For a Chief Executive to willfully jeopardize the safety of national assets by cavalier declassification or disclosure of documents that may identify them is, at best, a scary misdemeanor if they escape exposure.
If it leads to their exposure, capture, or death, the responsible party may become complicit in a capital crime.
Cite? Who was at risk from documents locked in a closet under SS protections.
"Who was at risk from documents locked in a closet under SS protections"
I find it hard to imagine you need to know, but closets in beach clubs with a thousand members are not generally rated as secure document safes.
I-i-it's just not fair! He has to be guilty of something!
This is the part that people are quoting to make the story more clickable even when it's the hottest of retard takeaways one can imagine.
Basically they take Trump literally and report breathlessly on obvious hyperbole from perhaps the king of hyperbole.
It's obvious to most non-retards, especially with context, what Trump meant and he wasn't talking about telepathically declassifying things he's saying none of that applies to the President. And most seem to actually agree on that point when the subject isn't Trump, so...
Trump has been a master of getting the media to report the most retarded hot take and then be clowning themselves.
I see the MAGAts are still infesting the comments section.
Who sent out the distress call to Act Blue?
A big fat weasel appearing on the clouds.
Hey shreek, remember how you got banned from this site for posting dark web links to hardcore child pornography? Maybe you should have taken the hint.
If the president of the U.S. cannot declassify a document, then who can? Looks like Truman decided to do so way back in 1945 with Joe Stalin. That's not to say Trump or any other president was wise to declassify something. Imagine if the declassification was a list of secret agents employed by the U.S. in China. That's not to say there shouldn't be a formal process, with notifications to a data base and potential users. Let's say a document is Top Secret and can be seen by only, say, ten others with top security clearances. Those ten may need to know it has been declassified - and not by mental telepathy - in order to carry out their job responsibilities by now sharing it with subordinates who may now need to know some info that was previously denied to them.
That would never happen.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/obama-administration-trade-british-nuclear-secrets-with-russia
“That’s not to say Trump or any other president was wise to declassify something.”
Someone once said “You take on the intelligence community, they have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you.” It took a bold person to expose the Forever Bureaucrats at the Administrative State, so I’m glad Trump saved those Russiagate documents that pose NO SECURITY RISK, but can only show us how corrupt these ABC agencies are.
Let’s face it…DC (along with their globalist puppets in media and industry) have never cooperated with Trump. They were hostile to him from before he was president and up to this very day. They have never let up with their illegal, unconstitutional and criminal persecution of Trump and his supporters. These intelligence agencies will stop at nothing to shape-shift events to create false narratives and fake crimes. I mean, come on…Whitmer and J6. How embarrassingly obvious can it be. The TDS sufferers should be horrified at what’s transpired over the past 6 years. Just imagine if the tables were flipped.
The Libertarian Case For Zero Oversight of Government Agencies As Long As They Say It's A National Security Thing
Notice how REASON, a Republican Establishment controlled asset, is no trying to frame the story as not being about whether these were classified documents but whether or not Trump had the right to posses then. They know they've lost the battel of the declassification front so this is their fallback.
And naturally its Jacob Sullum writing the piece, as if there was any question who would do this story.
“is no trying to frame the story as not being about whether these were”
Reason has officially sunk to being assigned to quarter trolls.
I cannot believe so much news can come from taking work home...
Holy crap; It's not as if he sold the docs to Hunter Biden.
This is Witch-Hunting 101 and I'm not even sure what the witch hunters are after short of their own Nazi-Fan-club hatred.
Have you forgotten Clinton's CIA chief being dismissed and fined $250,000 for taking his laptop home from the office?
https://www.voanews.com/a/former-cia-chief-fined-100000-for-leaking-classified-documents-to-mistress/2732054.html
Apparently he resigned and was appointed by Obama.
And apparently he sold it to his "press" writing affair-mistress.
Unless you had some other story to tell.
You are wrong on both counts.
John Deutch, Clinton's DCI was the one dismissed and fined 250K after several of his laptop computers were found to contained classified information wrongfully labeled as unclassified. In January 1997, the CIA began a formal security investigation and Deutch agreed to plead guilty to a misdemeanor for this breach of trust on January 19, 2001, but President Clinton pardoned him in his last day in office.
This was a decade before General Petraeus' woes.
I cannot believe so much news can come from taking work home…
Except Trump was no longer president and had no right to those docs.
Well, maybe he wanted them to do a post-mortem performance review of his first term so he can serve the American people even better in his future terms.
Or he was still working for Putin so he was continuing to work from home. : )
Kash Patel says he was present when Trump declassified the docs.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/matt-margolis/2022/09/22/doj-claims-trump-did-not-declassify-documents-oh-really-n1631383
“Trump declassified whole sets of materials in anticipation of leaving government that he thought the American public should have the right to read themselves,” Kash Patel, a former top Trump administration official, told Breitbart News in a phone interview in May. According to Patel, the classification markings just had not been updated.
“The White House counsel failed to generate the paperwork to change the classification markings, but that doesn’t mean the information wasn’t declassified,” Patel added. “I was there with President Trump when he said ‘We are declassifying this information.’”
It's also been reported that he declassified docs relating to Russian collusion probe.
https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/presidential-actions/memorandum-declassification-certain-materials-related-fbis-crossfire-hurricane-investigation/
I don't quite understand how he was able to "steal" these docs, when government personnel removed them and stored them at the SCIF at Mar a Lago, and FBI visited there to take back some of them. They advised him to get better locks. No one at DOJ or archives knew Trump apparently took home nuclear secrets? 11 thousand pages of nuclear and state secrets?
Let Kash Patel say that under oath.
Mar-A-Lago does not have, and is not a SCIF.
Don't open your mouth until you actually understand the facts. Nobody is here to read your idiotic bullshit.
Lol.
Shrike road the subway yesterday,
He found he had to stand.
A young boy offered him his seat,
so he grabbed it with his hand.
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-lawyers-ethics-complaints-joke-maga-making-attorneys-get-attorneys-2022-9
MAGA means making-attorneys-get-attorneys!!!!
I think he meant a cite showing anything shreek (dba bacchys) said to be true, sarcasmic, not a cite of a lame pun you found while jerking off to Mother Jones.
Maggots believe whatever they WANT to believe!!!
https://reason.com/2022/02/11/sidney-powell-disowns-her-kraken-saying-she-is-not-responsible-for-her-phony-story-of-a-stolen-election/ (Yet another Powell article)
https://reason.com/2021/03/23/sidney-powell-says-shes-not-guilty-of-defamation-because-no-reasonable-person-would-have-believed-her-outlandish-election-conspiracy-theory/
Sidney Powell Says She’s Not Guilty of Defamation Because ‘No Reasonable Person’ Would Have Believed Her ‘Outlandish’ Election Conspiracy Theory
Which particular lies are you wanting to hear and believe today, hyper-partisan Wonder Child?
It's a pretty damn funny pun, Tulpa. You are lame for thinking it's lame. So, there!
God, mike even simps for sqrsly.