In The Listeners, Brian Hochman Details History of Eavesdropping
Wiretapping and eavesdropping used to be the norm. Perhaps privacy was always an illusion after all.

The Listeners: A History of Wiretapping in the United States, by Brian Hochman, Harvard University Press, 368 pages, $33.67
America's first wiretapping conviction happened in 1864. A stockbroker named D.C. Williams had been tapping a telegraph line in California to get corporate information, which he used for advantageous stock trades. The law he broke had been passed two years earlier, making California the first state to regulate wiretapping.
The telephone had not been invented yet, and the transcontinental telegraph had only just been completed. The Golden State's legislators were ahead of the game. Ever since then, legislation dealing with electronic surveillance has been playing catch-up—both with the technology and with public sentiment.
In the early days of the telegraph, privacy was a difficult issue to address. It was impossible to expect or demand that only the addressee could see your communication: Operators had to both transmit and receive the messages, and couriers had to deliver them. The same was initially true of the telephone: Calls were connected by an operator, and many subscribers were on party lines. This made legislation hard. Simply "listening" couldn't be forbidden, since many individuals had legitimate reasons to listen or could do so incidentally.
"Eavesdropping was a feature of telephony from the beginning," Georgetown University's Brian Hochman observes in The Listeners, a history of American wiretapping. "Customer privacy was an invented ideal that came later."
Attitudes toward wiretapping evolved too. Soldiers on both sides of the Civil War had engaged extensively in the practice, and newspapers depicted their actions as beneficial, even heroic. But in peacetime, tapping was seen as the province of con men, blackmailers, and other disreputable types.
These wiretappers came up with many creative scams. A common technique was a gambling swindle: The con man would intercept the results of a horse race in another city before they could be communicated to a bookmaker, then place a bet on those results. Given delays in communication, it was easier to finesse a late bet than you might imagine—especially before the Standard Time Act of 1918 established a national system of time zones. An alternative angle was industrial espionage, trading stocks based on information gleaned from corporate communications.
Yet another scam was simply to claim to be involved in one of these hustles, recruit "investors" who might like to get in on the game, and then make off with their money. (This play was demonstrated in the film The Sting, where the Depression-era con men convince their victim they have a wiretap racing scam going, using a fake betting parlor.) In the real world, news stories about wiretappers and their tricks played in these criminals' favor: People were eager to believe they would make a killing on the third at Belmont, thanks to their new friend with a tap on the wire, and happily handed over their money. They thus joined the long tradition of saps who think they're in on the con until they realize, too late, that they were the marks.
On the other side of the law, police started using wiretaps more extensively during Prohibition. As the cops listened in on gangsters' operations, conflicting legislation became a real thicket. Some states, such as California, banned wiretapping; some permitted it only for police with a court order; some had no statutes on it at all. This diversity of rules sparked challenges when cases reached federal court and prosecutors elided the source of their information rather than acknowledge a wiretap that violated state law.
Such practices also provoked civil libertarian objections. Many people, including some legislators, thought wiretapping by the police was an unjustifiable intrusion, even when the targets were criminals. "For much of the twentieth century, wiretapping for national security was generally regarded as a necessary evil, a mild concession that individual citizens needed to make in order to combat dissent and subversion," Hochman writes. "By contrast, most Americans disapproved of the prospect of wiretapping for crime control."
Hochman traces a gradual shift away from this attitude, parsing various bills and Supreme Court decisions. Learning how our grandparents thought about privacy (or didn't) makes this an especially illuminating text for modern privacy hawks.
The 1950s brought greater use of bugging instead of wiretapping; it evaded many existing statutes, since it didn't involve "tapping" a line. It could run afoul of trespassing laws if the target's property was entered, but simply placing a small microphone was not illegal in many jurisdictions. Transistor technology made this a more viable surveillance method, and bugs quickly became popular among private investigators as well as police.
The prospect of being "bugged" went mainstream in popular culture, becoming a common film plot device even as technical magazines touted the developments that made it possible. For much of the 1960s, public emotion was swinging toward privacy and against government surveillance. Unfortunately, the decade's unrest stopped this movement in its tracks. The law-and-order faction became ascendant, renewing demands to surveil criminal suspects. "Even though the late sixties and early seventies seemed to herald a newfound national commitment to protecting privacy and limiting surveillance," Hochman writes, "the era's signature pieces of electronic surveillance legislation had the ironic effect of normalizing taps and bugs in areas of American life that would have seemed unthinkable only a decade prior."
One result was the Omnibus Crime Control and Safe Streets Act of 1968. While this law placed restrictions on wiretapping and bugging by law enforcement, it also enshrined them as standard policing techniques. Wiretapping by other parties was supposedly illegal, but government enforcement was lax.
Meanwhile, a consumer market for surveillance devices emerged. Wiretap devices were sold as "answering machines." What once was a remote eavesdropping device was reinvented as a "baby monitor."
The agencies expanding the war on drugs also presented wiretapping as the heroic work of brave policemen rather than the dirty work of crooks or private eyes. When California legalized police wiretaps in 1988, a local police official told the Los Angeles Times: "Wiretaps are the answer. Let everyone know that Big Brother, as you call our government, will be watching the major drug dealers in this state."
Laws are always lagging behind technology. When cordless phones were introduced in the '80s, "cross-talk"—picking up the signal from another nearby phone—was a known issue that purchasers were warned about. This phenomenon led some courts to decide that users of these devices had no "reasonable expectation of privacy," allowing convictions based on overheard conversations even when there had been no warrant to monitor them.
The tug of war continued. The Electronic Communications Privacy Act of 1986 was supposed to offer individuals more privacy. But eight years later, another law-and-order spasm produced the Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act, which handed more surveillance powers to the cops. After 9/11, the USA PATRIOT Act gave government agencies even more snooping authority. "National security" can be a very wide net, especially in a globalized world.
Today some of us are resigned to the idea that the National Security Agency might be listening to our calls, and it feels almost inescapable that someone, in the government or in Silicon Valley, is tracking our communications. We conduct meetings on Zoom, knowing that the company can monitor our conversations. Is this a return to the mindset of a century ago, when everyone knew a Bell operator could be on the line? Perhaps privacy was always an illusion after all.
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They thus joined the long tradition of saps who think they're in on the con until they realize, too late, that they were the marks.
Like Social Security
Someone famous said con men were the good guys, since their marks were generally only taken in by thinking they were conning other saps; or maybe he said you can' con an honest man, only someone looking to cheat somebody else.
Sort of like blackmail; why is it against the law? Some scoundrel has done something illegal, or at least shameful, and the public-minded citizen who makes a buck off the scoundrel is just doing what court fines do, except keeping it for himself as an inducement to find other such scoundrels.
Obviously both are illegal only because the rich and powerful are their usual "victims" and enlist the coercive state to get their revenge. The poor are never their victims because they haven't got any money to siphon off.
Both blackmail and cons are great examples of the morality of market redistribution, and the fact that coercive governments deem them illegal is all you need to know about the morality of coercive government.
Good morning Peanuts! This is your daily reminder we're currently in the strongest economy in US history thanks to Biden and the Democrats. If you disagree you've been brainwashed by wingnut.com lies about HAPERINFLATION!!!!!!
#TemporarilyFillingInForButtplug
We willingly pay extra high prices for gasoline so Putin will lose his war.
Is the war still a Current Thing? I've been seeing less little Ukrainian flags in social media profiles lately. It's mostly back to alphabet sex cult flags.
What war?
Including in military school marches. Which is insane.
I heard Russia was about to be defeated. No update since.
There's been a slight shift in tone
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/when-lies-come-home
Unfortunately...
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/we-must-do-more-ukraine-even-if-costs-food-fuel-are-high-western-populations-nato
Here we go again: top officials in the West warning their populations against "Ukraine fatigue", saying that 'sacrifices' must be made for the long-term despite the 'high costs' in blood and treasure of continuing to ramp up support for Ukraine. This time it's NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg making unusually blunt statements, addressing the common masses.
"We must prepare for the fact that it could take years. We must not let up in supporting Ukraine," he began by saying in an interview published Sunday by Germany’s Bild am Sonntag newspaper. He stressed this should be the case "even if the costs are high, not only for military support, also because of rising energy and food prices."
Even if gas prices were high, which they're actually not, liberal capitalists like me and Warren Buffett are making way too much money to care about a few extra bucks at the pump.
#TemporarilyFillingInForButtplug
"some of us are resigned to the idea that the National Security Agency might be listening... or in Silicon Valley"
We willingly and happily plant a bug in our pocket and carry it around nearly every minute of the day.
TV's, tablets, etc listen and then tailor web adds to our conversations. Real-time satellite remote sensing technology canvases the globe with incredible resolution. If anyone thinks these things aren't used for nefarious purposes, then I've got a bridge to sell em.
In 1984, there were places Winston could go or position himself where he couldn't be watched or eaves-dropped. The actual future doesn't have that much freedom in privacy; it's just that nobody cares, and they even delight in it.
We willingly and happily plant a bug in our pocket
I have been calling it a 5th amendment waiver machine
First word salad czar appointed.
Desiree Cormier Smith will be tasked with leading the department's "efforts to protect and advance the human rights of people belonging to marginalized racial and ethnic communities and combat systemic racism, discrimination, and xenophobia around the world" with the hope of achieving "more effective foreign policies and programs that support all people regardless of their race or ethnicity," according to a press release.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/white-house/first-racial-equity-justice-representative-desiree%20-cormier-smith
At what point does some sort of global robot uprising apocalypse become preferable?
I think I'm already there.
SWEET METEOR OF DEATH FOR PRESIDENT 2024
https://sweetmeteorofdeath.com/
I'm starting to find the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse completely relatable lately.
I've never seen one fall comically off of a stand still horse. Thats for sure.
I did something similar about a zillion years ago. First ride on a road bike with clip-in pedals, hadn't got used to them or gotten them properly adjusted yet. First stop at a traffic light, on a sidewalk because I had at least recognized I wasn't sure of the danged things, and I unclipped my right foot ok, but my weight on my left foot leaned the bike to the left, with the angle preventing me unclipping my left foot, and over I want. Felt pretty damned silly, but on the other hand, it was an instant unforgettable lesson, and I never did anything remotely similar again.
Everybody does this with clipless pedals. I did it the first time. I also did it the first time with toeclios in straps. But you never do it again because you learned not to do the stupid thing you did. Maybe senility would explain doing it again.
Privacy? Meh.
One upon a time, most humans lived in extended family and small tribal groups sharing caves, huts, and clusters of tents. They were within seeing and listening range of others almost all of the time. I bet they did not even have a word for privacy, and would probably have suspected the sanity and morality of anyone who sought it.
Then we had centuries of social structures based on behavioral and thought alignment and compliance, from the Catholic Church to the USSR. Perhaps the elite might have enjoyed some privacy, but the peasants and proles did not, at least officially.
Now we have comprehensive digital monitoring, with occasional facades of counter-measures and promises from entities who easily can listen in that they are totally, really, definitely not. And soon we will be back to living in compressed micro housing, and again will see and hear everything our neighbors do, whether we want to or not. We can return to suspecting anyone who seeks privacy as some sort of subversive kook.
Damn, I thought my post was pessimistic... not that I disagree, other than the first paragraph anyway. I think individualism and independence (and privacy by extension) is much more innate in humans. Might just be wishful thinking on my part though.
I have long thought privacy was a nonexistent unobtainable fantasy. When people lived in small towns, there was zero privacy; neighbors heard every fart, every conversation, could see all your possessions, knew of all your relationships. Big city apartment dwellers know almost as much about their anonymous neighbors.
But when governments and corporations snoop on you, the reciprocity is gone; the snooping is all one way. That's what rankles. You don't know who the anonymous bureaucrats are, and unlike apartment neighbors, you can't find out.
the snooping is all one way. That's what rankles.
No it is the myriad consequences that the government can rain down upon you for your indiscretions
That's a consequence of not having to fear the reverse, of no accountability. Village snoops can wreak all sorts of havoc too, but there's identify and pushback and accountability.
Thirteen senators and eight representatives signed a letter to Sundar Pichai, the CEO of Google parent company Alphabet Inc., dated Friday in which they highlighted a report by the Center for Countering Digital Hate (CCDH) that showed that in 13 states with trigger laws, searches for “abortion pill” or “abortion clinic near me” showed clinics that did not provide those services 11 percent of the time.
Private company?
All abortion searches must be perfect!
Have they ever tabulated the relevancy stats for other, non-abortion searches? I'd say 11% is a pretty low failure rate.
WHO now believes in the consprational lab leak theory. Ban them!
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2022/06/19/who-chief-now-says-he-believes-covid-did-leak-from-wuhan-lab-after-an-accident-in-2019-n1606402
Democratic PartyTwitter and Facebook fact checkers deplatform the WHO in 3... 2... 1...But surveys show that people who watch MSNBC and CNN correctly identify the lab leak theory as a hoax.
I don't know what this one is ostensibly about
https://twitter.com/sleeepysandy/status/1538540232034893825?t=cVDfzxuku5QYKmtDp2o4eQ&s=19
Currently in Bristol #StandingForWomen where the #BlackPampers have surrounded the pub, screaming through megaphones that they’ll leave bad reviews for the pub.
[Pics]
Went through the whole thread and still didn't get it.
Something about tranny activists protesting feminists who aren't "inclusive" to biological males.
The 21st century isn't turning out like I expected.
https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1538707612497334272?t=CWi_mDZNVHj3Xj7FURQdhA&s=19
#Antifa threatened violence & sexual assault against participants of a women's rally in #Bristol, UK. The militants accused the women of being transphobic fascists. Video also captured one of the Antifa with an erection when he ripped up the women's signs.
[Link]
Ok which commenter was that? Step forward, no shame in it. We just want to know.
Gotta be Sqrlsy if there's an inappropriate erection.
Jeff's to fat to notice, sarcasmic gets whiskeydick, White Mike doesn't have one and the women are too old for Shrike.
Why does everyone protest in lycra facemasks now? Is there a trend I missed somewhere?
I miss the oversized papier mache heads.
https://twitter.com/ZubyMusic/status/1538224894466457602?t=63C2Cjc2o7tGfrUqICb3fg&s=19
Governments could shut down whole economies, ban travel, force you to cover your face, stop you from seeing family, mandate mRNA injections, line their pockets, and tell you to eat bugs and not have kids.
But if you wonder if there's an agenda, you're a 'conspiracy theorist'.
It's only a conspiracy theory when YOU quote them. It's a good idea when they announce it.
https://twitter.com/SharylAttkisson/status/1538499723941789696?t=Yzjn-fA-QOGhTkY6aS53mw&s=19
Does anybody else think it's illogical that FDA okayed Covid vaccines in babies "for the prevention of COVID-19" when they also admit the vaccines don't prevent Covid? And they say children stand a statistical zero change of serious illness from Covid?
If you imagine for a minute that the FDA is run by Moloch, it all makes perfect sense.
Maybe one of our betters can explain it to us.
FYTW
I'm glad my daughter isn't 5 any more and I'm no longer married, because THAT would have been the cause of the divorce.
And that's just people on Earth. A new scientific paper says there could be between 111 and 42,777 alien civilizations in the Milky Way listening in:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamiecartereurope/2022/05/30/there-are-between-111-and-42777-intelligent-alien-civilizations-in-our-galaxy-say-scientists/?sh=76610adb30a8
How many extraterrestrial intelligent civilizations are out there and when will one of them send us a message? The answers, according to a paper published in The Astrophysical Journal are 42,777 and sometime in the next 2,000 years. It’s a decent explanation for the Fermi Paradox, which asks why we still haven’t received any messages from other civilizations despite there being a high probability of them existing.
And Earth has been blasting out unencrypted radio signals for the past 100 years, as well as one intentional message giving them all the info they need to conquer us:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arecibo_message
The content of the Arecibo message was designed by Frank Drake, then at Cornell University and creator of the Drake equation, who wrote the message with help from Carl Sagan and others... The message consists of seven parts that encode the following (from the top down in the image): The numbers one to ten; The atomic numbers of the elements hydrogen, carbon, nitrogen, oxygen, and phosphorus, which make up deoxyribonucleic acid (DNA); The formulas for the chemical compounds that make up the nucleotides of DNA; The estimated number of DNA nucleotides in the human genome, and a graphic of the double helix structure of DNA; The dimension (physical height) of an average man, a graphic figure of a human being, and the human population of Earth; A graphic of the Solar System, indicating which of the planets the message is coming from; A graphic of the Arecibo radio telescope and the dimension (the physical diameter) of the transmitting antenna dish.
An alien spy couldn't have sent a better message to its handlers.
And Earth has been blasting out unencrypted radio signals for the past 100 years, as well as one intentional message giving them all the info they need to conquer us:
I demand that we build a wall with Mexico to keep these aliens out. You can’t be too permissive with these alien-types. They’ll probably come here for some American-style Welfare and then when exactly are they going to be returning to the Planet Tralfamadore. I’ll tell you when. Never.
God damn man. Just fucking sad.
Now I know where the WHO and the Wuhan lab got their inspiration.
Right now, based on the evidence, that's as probable as leprechauns.
I want a galaxy full of blue-skinned alien babes, but currently it's all fantasy.
I want a galaxy full of busty blue-skinned alien babes, but currently it's all fantasy.
Um, how many busts?
As many as it takes.
https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1538351744387801088?t=Xg-CuSSCykreRbeRwN_OhA&s=19
A man driving a car with an anarchist symbol & an anti-Donald Trump sticker rammed his vehicle into a Trump merchandise store in Easton, Mass. An employee inside was uninjured. The car attack suspect has been named as Sean Flaherty, of Raynham.
Here is a photo of Sean Flaherty, the man from Raynham, Mass. who allegedly rammed his car at high speed into a Trump merchandise store in Easton, Mass. He has a tattoo of the logo for #Antifa band, "Ministry."
Watch the surveillance video of the car ramming attack on the Trump merchandise store in Easton, Mass. An employee narrowly survived being run over at high speed. Suspect Sean Flaherty has a tattoo of an #Antifa band on his arm & his car displays an anti-Trump sticker.
[Video]
JobRoss @TreborJoss
Replying to @MrAndyNgo
Local news is saying Sean's politics had nothing to do with this. They base this on a friend saying so.
Because of course they are.
Cunts or retards?
No, the local news reporter presented the friend's side of the story, ALONG WITH the shop owner's side. "Local news" didn't take a position one way or another. But the author of the tweet tries to twist the reporting into OMG BIASED MEDIA CHOOSES A SIDE.
It's these types of dishonest complaints that lead reasonable people to conclude that a great deal of the complaints about "the biased media" by right-wingers is really just a combination of a victimhood complex and a complaint that they don't get the favorable coverage that they think that they are entitled to.
Here is a clue. When the media actually does a good job, don't bitch about it. Praise that which deserves praise. Because if you don't, then it makes your legitimate complaints look illegitimate.
But...but... was he carrying an official Antifa id card? - White Mike
You watch, he'll get a slap on the wrist. Misdemeanor with time served.
If this had been a driver with Trump bumper sticker and drove into Hillary/Biden/Obama merch store, this would be attempted murder charge with no bail.
INSURRECTION!
Sorry, fact checked. A close friend says that politics was NOT the motive for this. Move along, nothing to see here.
As the overweight woman-identifying friend said (she/her) , "Politics had nothing to do with it... it was just an unfortunate ac... coincidence."
Direct quote.
*drops microphone*
What you linked to wasn't a "fact check". It was a local news story.
What exactly is your complaint?
The reporter interviewed the store owner. The reporter also interviewed one of the driver's friends. The friend's story wasn't presented as "the truth". The store owner's opinion was fully presented, not silenced or censored. What more do you want here? Isn't this the type of reporting that you want?
This is just sad for you.
https://twitter.com/ConceptualJames/status/1538572012523864067?t=s0Io9AuFAFy96uCm32OTdQ&s=19
The Great Reset involves a two-pronged vanguard.
1) Top-down (Leninist) "stakeholder" "public-private partnership" enforced through ESG.
2) Bottom-up (Maoist) youth revolt created through SEL.
It does this along with an inside-out Cultural Revolution (also Maoist).
ESG is supposed to seize control of the supply side of our economies: material, economic, attention, cultural, information.
SEL is supposed to seize control of the demand side of our economies through Maoist thought reform posing as education.
The Cultural Revolution is meant to make the new economies universal, hegemonic, and irresistible. The propaganda must be in everything as the new sensibility for our world. The struggle sessions must occur everywhere. Thought reform and divorce from the past must be total.
Fortunately they're going to fuck it all up because humanity is complex and their arrogance is only equaled by their incompetence.
Unfortunately they're going to fuck it all up because of arrogance only equaled by their incompetence.
Speaking of surveillance…
The former president, responding to videotaped testimony played at the Jan. 6 hearing, said Ivanka Trump had been “checked out” and was not involved in studying the election results.
Jesus Christ Dear Leader! You aren’t going to get in the pants of this feckless cunt talking like this. No, just because you found out that she isn’t going to put out for you like the Slovakistanian prostitute you married is no reason to get bitchy and bitter. Besides… she’s way too old for you. Don’t they have any more 14 year old girls in Palm Beach willing to take one for the team like they did at those Epstein parties you used to go to? Geesch, Palm Beach must not be like it used to be like it used to be. Sad.
Hey shrike. You okay man? One of your buddies got arrested sharing CP this week.
Sirz,
I don’t know who exactly you think I am but I am not Shrike. What I am is a gay and Black man who is GOP Proud like Milo and Caitlin. Also, there has been a dirty rumor that I am a socialist. That too is untrue. I get paid as a Black and gay man lots of money by White Nationalists and Proud Boyz who want to show their allegiance to White supremacy by giving money to this Black man because they want to own the libs. Please, by all means, correct yourself before you wreck yourself, ok?
Going that badly huh shrike?
Bring back American Socialist!
Poor Shrike, he just can't into memeing.
He is like the terrible impressionist comics that have to tell you who they are making impressions of. If those comics downloaded child porn.
Not a 50 cent effort. Maybe worth a dime?
https://twitter.com/billmaher/status/1538013603701280775
Nothing captures what’s wrong with today’s “journalism” like the sad saga of what happened last week at The @WashingtonPost.
Sharing this with ENB and Reason editors in mind...
Come on, man, we can laugh at this. Twitter is the greatest tool in journalism since the printing press. I stand by that, and I'm not backing down.
Ok, "unlicensed day-care center known as the newsroom". Ok, Maher, that one was good. I'm keeping that.
Guys. I bring some terrible news.
Matthew Yglesias
@mattyglesias
Some personal news:
I have contracted the novel coronavirus.
I think the novelty wore off in 2020.
ENB hardest hit!
Btw, this is hardly news. I have COVID right now and it's basically a sinus cold. This is nothing compared to when I had it last year in October. 10 days of brutal headache and I lost 15lbs. Not life threatening for me, but I'm also under 65 and I'm not obese. But certainly, it was a severe flu.
Whatever variant we have now, it's nothing news worthy or life threatening. Any more so than the common cold or flu.
I believe the dominant strain is now BA-4/Monkeypox edition. How gay are you? On a scale from 7 to 10?
Well, THAT explains a lot. 😉
Hmm. Scale, 7 to 10. I do like avocado toast.
Online privacy really ought to be a subject taught in school.
I have seen too many people who take an extremely cavalier approach to online privacy. If more people knew how to take control of their online information, they would be less willing to share it to everyone I imagine. Having more people jealous of their privacy can only be a good thing from a libertarian perspective. More people jealous of their privacy means fewer people willing to tolerate government surveillance.
Besides, it would also defeat the common pro-surveillance argument along the lines of "well, Google already knows everything about me, so what's the big deal if the government also does too?" Well, perhaps neither the government nor Google ought to know everything about you!
If you have nothing to hide, what are you afraid of?
His past statements showing he is an authoritarian.
Your past statements show that you are an idiot.
Yet that doesn't stop you from posting here.
But you are a Top-Men authoritarian. Don't get bitchy at Jesse for pointing out what everyone already knows.
You are a simple-minded sophist and Jesse's attack poodle, always present to yip yip yip at anyone making an argument that makes Jesse sad.
Your entire purpose here is to frame every discussion in terms of Team Blue Bad. You're not intellectually honest and part of the problem when it comes to the terrible state of discourse today.
Tell us again how a military review of extremist group membership is "Third Reich stuff" when Biden does it but no big deal when Reagan does it, and also no big deal that it has been bipartisan policy for over 50 years.
What exactly is the difference between you and Nardz? At least he is honest in declaring his desire to purge Democrats with violence. What is stopping you?
Lol. Jeff is calling others sophists now. Holy shit the projection.
chemjeff radical individualist
February.26.2021 at 10:42 am
Flag Comment Mute User
Elitism in the defense of liberty is a libertarian ideal because the goal here is to defend liberty, not to placate the mob.
chemjeff radical individualist
February.26.2021 at 10:18 am
Flag Comment Mute User
Because the voters are always right?
When did it become libertarian orthodoxy to trust the mob?
No voting! Don't trust the masses! Follow the government elites!
You want your defense of capital sentencing for trespassing again?
Awww. Someone not get ice cream today?
https://twitter.com/Julio_Rosas11/status/1538712324701298689?t=Ah-eTk8REvPicLVP8F871A&s=19
DC police officials are currently being briefed on the shooting that took place in the area of 14th and U Street. Waiting on the press conference to take place.
BREAKING from DC Police Chief Contee with Mayor Bowser by his side: A total of four people have been shot. One officer, two adults, and one juvenile. The juvenile is believed to be 15 years old and is deceased.
[Link]
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