The End of Roe? Everything You Need To Know About the Leaked Supreme Court Draft Opinion
Plus: Boston rebuked for rejecting Christian flag, Google will remove more personal information, and more...

"We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled." Access to legal abortion in America could be severely limited if an alleged draft of a U.S. Supreme Court opinion, leaked to Politico, pans out. The draft opinion—penned by Justice Samuel Alito and dated February 10, 2022—goes much further than many were expecting in a case concerning Mississippi's ban on abortion at 15 weeks.
"It is time to heed the Constitution and return the issue of abortion to the people's elected representatives," Alito writes in the leaked document, labeled "Opinion of the Court."
Oral arguments for the highly watched case (Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization) were held in December 2021. Many anticipated that the Court will uphold Mississippi's 15-week ban, thus moving the bar backward on the point in pregnancy at which abortion bans are legal. (Previously, courts including the Supreme Court have routinely rejected bans before 20 weeks; the recent Texas law, with its citizen-enforced ban at six weeks, is an anomaly because of the weird way it is structured).
But few expected it to entirely overturn Supreme Court precedent on abortion as enshrined in Roe v Wade (1973) and Planned Parenthood v. Casey (1992).
The leaked draft opinion, however, would set fire to those precedents.
"Roe was egregiously wrong from the start," writes Alito in the document. "We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled."
"The Constitution makes no reference to abortion," he continues, "and no such right is implicitly protected by any constitutional provision, including the one on which the defenders of Roe and Casey now chiefly rely—the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment."
"A person familiar with the court's deliberations said that four of the other Republican-appointed justices—Clarence Thomas, Neil Gorsuch, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett—had voted with Alito in the conference held among the justices after hearing oral arguments in December, and that line-up remains unchanged as of this week," reports Politico.

Is the document legit? Experts say yes, the document is almost certainly authentic.
But draft opinions do change, and justices do change their minds.
One (perhaps wishful thinking) theory about the draft opinion is that it was leaked to cushion the blow of an eventual 15-week ban by showcasing a more drastic alternative outcome.
But it's also perfectly plausible that the conservative-majority court will indeed back the opinion as written or with only minor modifications.
Note: CJ Roberts has been damnably susceptible to public pressure in the past (hello, NFIB), but if he was already in the minority, this isn't going to change the outcome.
— Gabriel Malor (@gabrielmalor) May 3, 2022
How did it get out? Politico says it "received a copy of the draft opinion from a person familiar with the court's proceedings in the Mississippi case along with other details supporting the authenticity of the document."
There's a lot of speculation—but no firm answers—on why the document was leaked.
Some suggest it was leaked by a liberal law clerk who opposes the ruling and wants to stop it. Others suggest it may have been leaked by a conservative staffer who supports the draft opinion as is and is upset by its subsequent watering down. In either theory, the leaker is presumed to want to change the ultimate opinion with this leak.
It's incredibly rare for a draft opinion to be leaked like this and this leak has been roundly condemned.
Leaking a draft opinion of the Supreme Court destroys trust among the justices and undermines justice. The justices must be able to share their thoughts candidly—and vulnerably—with one another. They are judges deciding cases, not legislators writing laws that need public input.
— Justin Amash (@justinamash) May 3, 2022
What does it mean? If the opinion is issued as-is or somewhere near it, constitutional protection of abortion access will be null and the decision of whether or not to permit abortion will return to the states.
Thirteen states have enacted laws saying that abortion is immediately illegal should Roe be overturned (Arkansas, Idaho, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, and Wyoming). Others retain (currently unenforced) pre-Roe bans that will be triggered again.
Overall, some 23 states "have laws that could be used to restrict the legal status of abortion," according to the Guttmacher Institute. This includes nine states with "unconstitutional post-Roe restrictions that are currently blocked by courts but could be brought back into effect with a court order in Roe's absence."
Meanwhile, other states have passed laws guaranteeing abortion access in Roe's absence, and others are poised to do so. According to the Guttmacher Institute, "16 states and the District of Columbia have laws that protect the right to abortion."
So even if the leaked Alito opinion stands, the Court's ruling in Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization certainly won't mean the end of abortion access in America. But it will make it much more difficult for women in some areas of the country to terminate a pregnancy.
Of course, systems will spring up to mitigate the effects of state bans and restrictions.

Pre-Roe, when abortion was legal in some states and not in others, networks existed to help women travel out of states with abortion bans in order to terminate a pregnancy. Such networks have already been activating to help women in Texas and other states where abortion access is limited. If Roe is overturned and more states impose hefty restrictions or total bans, such networks would almost certainly ramp up their efforts, helping contain the fallout for women in states with no or limited abortion access. (And employers of people in these states may aid in these endeavors; recently, Amazon and several other companies "have announced plans that ensure staff have access to abortions," notes the BBC.)
But these efforts would be complicated by laws like one passed in Texas and another approved by some lawmakers in Oklahoma, which prohibit assisting someone in obtaining an abortion.
One major difference between now and in the pre-Roe era is the now-widespread availability of abortion-inducing drugs. (The Food and Drug Administration even recently ruled that they can be prescribed by telemedicine.) These drugs make it much easier for women to secretly and safely self-induce abortion—as women in Texas are already doing.
Yet they also set up the possibility of a new war on drugs that induce abortion. Indeed, Texas recently made it a felony to provide abortion-inducing drugs (which are used for other purposes, too) for the purposes of inducing an abortion.
"If you think states can actually prevent medical abortions, you must be unfamiliar with the war on drugs, which has failed for more than a century to stop Americans from obtaining politically disfavored intoxicants, even when they are illegal in every state," notes Reason's Jacob Sullum. But this doesn't mean authorities won't set up a dangerous, invasive, and wasteful system to try.
A post-Roe world. "Without Roe, political battles over abortion will continue, but they will mainly involve state-by-state legislative debates rather than arguments about constitutional law and the composition of the Supreme Court," suggested Sullum in Reason's May 2021 issue. "While neither side will be happy with that situation, it will reduce the stakes of any given legislative or judicial decision and turn down the heat of a controversy that has frequently dominated national politics."
Should federal protection for abortion be obsolete, the best-case scenario for abortion access is that state laws will enable a plethora of different approaches and abortion-travel networks and abortion-inducing drugs will at least help women in no-abortion states.
But conservatives may not be content with abortion only being banned in some states and are likely to keep pressing for a national ban. Indeed, activist networks are already mobilizing to that effect, reports The Washington Post.
"A group of Republican senators has discussed at multiple meetings the possibility of banning abortion at around six weeks," the Post says. "Sen. Joni Ernst (R-Iowa) will introduce the legislation in the Senate, according to an antiabortion advocate with knowledge of the discussions who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss internal strategy."
FREE MINDS
Boston violated First Amendment by rejecting Christian flag. In a unanimous ruling released yesterday, the U.S. Supreme Court rebuked Boston for rejecting a request to fly a Christian flag outside its city hall in an area where many community groups were allowed to raise flags. (More background on the case here.) The Court held that this viewpoint-based discrimination violated the group's First Amendment rights.
The city said it was barred from flying religious flags on public property, on the grounds that this would constitute government speech and violate the Establishment Clause. But the Court found that the flags were a kind of public forum, and rejecting only religion-based flags constituted impermissible viewpoint-based discrimination. "When the government encourages diverse expression—say, by creating a forum for debate—the First Amendment prevents it from discriminating against speakers based on their viewpoint," noted Justice Stephen Breyer in the Court's opinion.
The opinion continued:
This case concerns a flagpole outside Boston City Hall. For years, Boston has allowed private groups to request use of the flagpole to raise flags of their choosing. As part of this program, Boston approved hundreds of requests to raise dozens of different flags. The city did not deny a single request to raise a flag until, in 2017, Harold Shurtleff, the director of a group called Camp Constitution, asked to fly a Christian flag. Boston refused. At that time, Boston admits, it had no written policy limiting use of the flagpole based on the content of a flag. The parties dispute whether, on these facts, Boston reserved the pole to fly flags that communicate governmental messages, or instead opened the flagpole for citizens to express their own views. If the former, Boston is free to choose the flags it flies without the constraints of the First Amendment's Free Speech Clause. If the latter, the Free Speech Clause prevents Boston from refusing a flag based on its viewpoint.
We conclude that, on balance, Boston did not make the raising and flying of private groups' flags a form of government speech. That means, in turn, that Boston's refusal to let Shurtleff and Camp Constitution raise their flag based on its religious viewpoint "abridg[ed]" their "freedom of speech."
FREE MARKETS
Google will let people apply to have personal information such as phone numbers, email addresses, and street addresses removed from search results. "The availability of personal contact information online can be jarring—and it can be used in harmful ways, including for unwanted direct contact or even physical harm," Google's Global Policy Lead for Search Michelle Chang wrote in a blog post announcing the change. "And people have given us feedback that they would like the ability to remove this type of information from Search in some cases."
Previously Google would only remove certain types of personal information (such as "in cases of doxxing, or information like bank account or credit card numbers that could be used for financial fraud," Chang writes). The new policy is much more expansive:
Under this new policy expansion, people can now request removals of additional types of information when they find it in Search results, including personal contact information like a phone number, email address, or physical address. The policy also allows for the removal of additional information that may pose a risk for identity theft, such as confidential log-in credentials, when it appears in Search results.
QUICK HITS
• Members of Congress have been briefed on UFOs. "Members of the Senate Intelligence and Armed Services committees received classified progress reports in recent weeks on a series of new data collection efforts the Pentagon and spy agencies are now required to pursue to more rigorously investigate reports of UFOs," reports Politico.
• "The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is moving fast to close off what seems to be the last remaining legal option for vaping companies that want to provide the e-liquid flavors that former smokers overwhelmingly prefer," reports Sullum. "Exercising regulatory authority that Congress recently gave it, the FDA has set a May 14 deadline for seeking 'premarket' approval of vaping products that deliver nicotine derived from sources other than tobacco. Companies that fail to submit applications by then, the agency warns, 'will be subject to FDA enforcement.'"
• Ohio's Republican Senate primary election—being held today—has highlighted identity problems within the GOP, suggests The New York Times. It has "revealed a party united in its conviction that American values, indeed the nation's way of life, are under attack, but divided on whether to embrace a strict isolationism to address its mounting misgivings about global interconnectedness and American leadership abroad."
• New Department of Education rules about Title IX are expected to be released soon. The controversial changes involve explicitly adding sexual orientation and gender identity to protections under the statute originally passed to prevent sex-based discrimination in education.
• The U.S.-based trucker convoy protesting COVID-19 policies is suing D.C.'s Metropolitan Police Department for blocking access points to the city. The police "formed the blockades for the sole purpose of preventing American citizens from entering our nation's capital to exercise their constitutionally protected right to free speech," they wrote in a complaint filed yesterday.
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Unrestricted abortion rights! (And government-funded abortion services.)
Because somewhere in the Constitution we are guaranteed a respsonsibility-free (and cost-free) life.
"somewhere in the Constitution"
Ummmmmm .......... yeah?
Did you never learn about PENUMBRAS FORMED BY EMANATIONS?
#LivingConstitution
I didn't. But I'm just a simple man who went to a simple college. I am glad we have you bringing out the details I failed to learn.
Probably paid for the degree, too. Right?
What really scares the statists is a return to state regulations and state power.
Which surprises me because they can simply go live in Cali or WA, etc. Is losing control of all 50 states at once that big of a blow to their tiny little brains?
So save Texas from going purple?
That sounds oddly pornographic.
Yes. See reasons earlier article on Ohio.
For leftists it's not about living how they want to live, it's about feeding their all consuming resentment by forcing other to live according to leftist dictats
Yes. Just like with socialism - the revolution will not be complete until it meets itself.
Plus all these people who consider national borders to be meaningless when it comes to immigration consider them supremely important in every other aspect.
Ie, we're all humans when it comes to immigration but it's we're all Americans when it comes to deciding who's rich enough to tax and who gets the money.
Someone was making a good point the other day. I think it was Overt. Basically they posed the question: would you prefer to live in a libertarian society that allows for racists or bigots, or would you prefer a more intrusive government that is able to stamp those things out entirely.
This is a core question of libertarianism, and Overt can correct me if I misrepresented his question, but I think Reason would be more on the latter side. They do not sit well with federalism in many cases. Not all, but many.
Count me among the former.
Uh, why would Statists be scared by anything a State does? It's what Statists do.
Because having states be statist is less effective than a national state deciding it for states which is less effective than having a global state decide it for countries.
Statism is Statism, regardless of lines on a map. That's not what I signed on for to become a Libertarian. (And Ackshuyally, didn't sign anything at all, I just read a lot.)
And "effective" has nothing to do with it. Plantations and concentration camps are "effective" if your purpose is to enslave people.
You actually signed on? Some libertarian you are.
See above.
The word “statist” doesn’t just apply to individual states specifically.
Because Federalism is not statism.
Nice try sophist.
How so? At least it can be a form of statism.
"...Can be..."
LOL, ok.
You use an "if" because a reductionary argument that any exercise of state power is statism is really silly. And would smack of desperation.
The net result of overturning Roe would be greater diversity of legislation. In that sense it is an anti-statist effect. Which was one of the main arguments for Federalism in the first place.
You and the dingbat below are merely throwing pejoratives because the result will mean more people have been given a voice in the matter and you know that at least some of them are going to do things you do not like.
You don't know what I'm doing. I don't use "statist" as a pejorative, just a description.
Maybe we just use the word differently. To my mind most libertarians and all conservatives and liberals are statists. That's not an insult, it's just how it is.
I'd be interested to know how you define it, if you can stop imagining you know people's inner intentions for a minute and address what I actually say.
Statism is holding that the State has primacy over the Individual and Individual Rights. Never mind that the Individual pre-existed the State, Federalist or otherwise.
Nice try, Statist Sophist.
Devolving control from higher to lower is not an increase in statism you illogical twit.
Well also, if Roe is overturned, only the Clintons and Obama's will be able to afford adrenochrome.
I probably shouldn’t be enjoying this as much as I am.
I’m cautiously finding some entertainment in the whole thing, but if the person who leaked this isn’t found and punished severely we’re pretty fucked going forward.
This.
Once again we see that when anything threatens the left their response is to break norms and disrupt long standing institutions.
Reason should be shitting it's pants if they actually cared about actual threats to liberty. But they don't. They are fine with the collectivists, they just want to keep their participation on the down low.
Yes. Already the apologists are siding with the leakage. Saying the more important point is the revealed intent. One claimed it was free speech and we need more of it to know ahead of time what the courts are intending with their rule. No connection to how much of a breach of integrity this is. Sad really.
No, no. Reason has had a longstanding position that SCOTUS deliberations should be made in public based upon the liberaltarian principle that argle bargle, blah blah blah, blah, etc. ad infinitum, in excelsius. paratus, paratus, presto change-o!
They just never got around to sharing it until now.
RESIST! is a leftist license to break all rules and norms, because without deception and lies, democracy dies. Or something.
Hopefully prosecuted.
None of this should be enjoyable. After all, this nation may have to take the Ceauşescu Challenge. Ol' Nick not only banned abortion, but had women submit to monthly OB-GYN exams to assure they didn't have any "accidents." Here's how well the Romanian people liked that:
Romanian Dictator Nicolae and Elena Ceausescu Execution most excited crime story
https://youtu.be/PbZYgg3BpmM
That said, I did enjoy watching their execution on December 25, 1989. The Romanian people gave a most beautiful Christmas gift to the world that day!
I always take enjoyment from lefties going “reee!”
No Lefty here. And the sound is not "Reee!" but "Pew! Pew!"
Eenie Meenie Chili Beanie, The Spirits are about to speak.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/66890686@N02/51718474396/
we are guaranteed a responsibility-free (and cost-free) life
Except for taxes, you're responsible for those. Unless you're poor, don't earn any income, don't produce or own anything for yourself or others and are otherwise responsibility-free, then you're not. Look, it's all a bit technical but the important thing is that, your country's future is secure.
We hold that Roe and Casey must be overruled.
MIDTERMS: SALVAGED
This is honestly probably the only thing that could have saved the dems from a historic bloodbath.
I wonder the same.
It's not like women are not the majority of pro-life people also.
Will this help Dems? Somewhat. But if it is a state-by-state issue, the federal impact seems far more negligible.
With it not being a SCOTUS thing and there being approximately zero hope of a bill passing Congress, this seems like something that might help Dems on a state-by-state basis.
Except that Republicans are trying to push a national ban. If I'm a senatorial candidate in a Swing state, I'm telling my colleagues to keep this at the state level as much as possible.
Asking for state legislatures to decide is a national ban? Do you have a cite to this legislation?
Is the article above enough of a cite?
""A group of Republican senators has discussed at multiple meetings the possibility of banning abortion at around six weeks," the Post says. "Sen. Joni Ernst (R-Iowa) will introduce the legislation in the Senate, according to an antiabortion advocate with knowledge of the discussions who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss internal strategy."
Anonymous source? Not until I see the legislation actually put forward and what other Senators support it.
What authority would they have given this decision?
There woyls be an Article I challenge.
I mean how is a nationwide ban on abortion any more tenable than a nationwide ban on assault rifles?
Whether or not it is tenable, I was talking about the horse race. If I am a senatorial candidate in a purple state, I am telling the Republicans in red states to knock off the talk of national bans. Because that will absolutely be used to hurt purple state candidates.
Agreed. Republicans really need to focus on the state’s rights angle of this.
I've heard of legislation to put it at 16 weeks, which I do oppose. States should be free to decide to murder their own constituents if they so desire.
Seriously, I do not want ANY federal oversight of this. But in states with, shall we say, loose abortion laws, the concept of double homicide for killing a pregnant woman should be nullified.
… killing a pregnant woman should be nullified.
Ahem. That’s Birthing, person you monster.
Future ChestFeeder.
Overturning Roe works both ways. As it should.
GOP legislators want a national ban, but this decision would seem to preclude one almost entirely. Citing that there's no mention of abortion in the Constitution puts it into 10A territory where it's then explicitly reserved to the states, or to the people.
Without a Federal Referendum option, there's no mechanism for "The People" to enact Federal policy or law, and considering overall public opinion on the subject, if there were such an option it wouldn't likely go in the direction of a ban.
There is no Constitutional basis for a national ban on abortions if one follows the reasoning for overturning Roe; it will be left to the states. Suppose you are a poor woman in Mississippi. Roundtrip flights to Las Vegas - a state already heavily invested in personal freedoms - is less than $200.
Imagine the Luxor - a black pyramid casino - converted to an abortion center. Fly in, telling all the nosy Parkers in the home state you are gambling, play some blackjack, see a show, and get an abortion all in one fun trip.
There is no Constitutional basis for a national ban on abortions if one follows the reasoning for overturning Roe; it will be left to the states.
Exactly--things just revert back to the status quo, which is that abortion law would be set completely at the state level.
To a certain extent, this was already going on with states passing abortion laws that outlined the practice to varying degrees. Virginia's the only one so far to try and pass a law that legalized post-magic birth canal trip abortion, but New York and Colorado have laws now that legalize it all the way up until the kid's fully emerged.
And what continues to be glossed over is that the majority of people have actually supported at least some restrictions on the practice, mostly due to the question over when a fetus actually becomes a conscious, formed being that feels pain. The people who support unrestricted abortion remain in the minority, even after decades of the left pushing the Overton window on everything else in the culture wars.
The cheapest abortion in Vegas is to have a guy with a bent nose punch you in the stomach as hard as he can after you get caught cheating at the blackjack table.
More than two thirds of America believe in some abortion restrictions. Roe did nothing thab make the base requirements more stringent than some states wanted.
It was a terrible decision as pointed out in the draft.
That's true. But the problem politically is that Repubs in some states will now push to ban abortion altogether. This will give Dems the argument that Repubs want to take your rights away and then ban your freedom to choose.
Because, 70% of the country believes there should be restrictions on abortion, but 70% also doesn't believe that abortion should be completely banned.
This is a situation where a party got what it wanted and will now overplay their hand and pay the political price for it.
Very few states have asked for 100% bans, no questions asked. And the beauty of it is they do it through the legislative process.
Freedom of movement is available for people who have that as their highest priority, access to no questions asked abortion.
They haven't asked for it because it was unconstitutional. Heck, Kristi Noem has already jumped on it to protect all life. You will see that happen in other states too.
This battle will be in red states between the red state and pockets of urban blue. And that's not going to be good for Repubs.
And yes, there is the freedom to travel. But that's not a politically expedient argument. Never going to win votes by telling people go somewhere else if you don't like it. Especially since actually picking up and moving to another state is not that easy for many people.
The irony is that Roe and Casey protected Repubs from themselves.
“This battle will be in red states between the red state and pockets of urban blue. And that's not going to be good for Repubs.”
Maybe. Or maybe in some states, the people that live in in those urban pockets that feel so strong about it will move to blue states.
And if it becomes strictly a state issue, it’s one less cudgel for Dem senators to use in judge confirmations.
With a handful of possible exceptions, the people living in the "urban pockets" of red states can't afford to move to most of the blue states. The local poverty line in the cities where most of CA lives would provide an upper-middle-class standard of living (or better) in most of what the coastal Dems call "flyover" states. How many people find the issue of abortion so important that they'd trade a 4BR house with a swimming pool for a 2BR apartment and a 75-minute one-way daily commute?
Um, cite? I know plenty of people that moved from blue areas of red states to blue states. There’s other places in blue states besides San Francisco and Manhattan.
More people support some regulation than no regulation.
Why is this worse for Republicans than it is democrats?
More people support access to abortion than total bans. And that's the route that Repubs in many states will pursue.
It's better for Dems because Repubs just gave Dems a "legitimate" rights fight, fighting for the oppressed, and they are going to use it.
If they can win elections on full bans, then that is none of your business.
Um. Okay.
Your argument makes zero sense. There are more pro regulation per polling than no regulations. Democrats are crazier on this fact and invent terms to hide partial birth abortion procedures.
Again. Zero states have passed no abortion at all. If a state does 49 other states are free to allow it.
It is now a state battle, not a national battle so it would be better nationally for Republicans in general. This decision would also make legislation at the national level illegal making it a state fight.
This is better for Republicans over all.
Actually my argument makes a lot of sense. You just don't like it because you're a Republican and agree with the ruling and don't want it to hurt your party.
Look at Missouri, they want to ban people from traveling to another state to get abortions. Are you really telling me Republicans are now going to get all rational and simply impose reasonable restrictions on abortion when, even seen in the comments here, the right pushes hard for total bans?
Take off the tribal glasses on this and see what actual outcomes may be from this.
Lol. Wow. You argument is so strong that you have to resort to calling me a republican to try to salvage something.
Lol. Fine. Youre a leftist shit.
Now that we are back on level footing.
How is making this a state battle instead of a national battle worse for Republicans? Youre the one making all arguments on this topic political, not me.
What a fucking child like response. To think I thought you were actually being civil for once.
Actually no, I'm a registered Republican. I'm not afraid to say it. I stand center-right.
Why are you so angry about being called a Republican? You defend almost everything Republicans do. Thus, the assumption seemed appropriate.
And now referring to my comments as child like? Dude. Maybe take a bit of a breather and calm down.
"This decision would also make legislation at the national level illegal making it a state fight."
I don't think this is settled. My review of the decision so far indicates that it merely says "you don't have a constitutional right to abortion." It is not "Only states can decide this."
Even if this is a power reserved to the states, the Federal Government can do the same thing it did with (e.g.) drinking ages, and essentially bully states into a national ban. Not saying whether or not GOP should do this, just that you can't say "It's not on the table". Because many republicans do definitely want it on the table.
Also, note that Missouri's "travel ban" is probably unconstitutional. It is Missouri trying to regulate literal interstate commerce- a power that is reserved to the federal government.
I think the Missouri law is wildly unconstitutional. But the issue is not whether such an action is unconstitutional, it's the intent and motivation behind it that will be the issue.
The problem for Republicans is that they almost always lose the PR war. Even when they are right on the issue, we get a big "don't say gay" surge to explain why the Dems are right, even if they are completely wrong. Having a bunch of partisan hacks run the biggest news orgs does have its perks.
Uhh… that’s because liars control the microphone. If a bunch of Matt Walsh or Gutfeld clones had charge of the mic, we’d get something more witty for the Right out. But they don’t and the left does, so we get lies.
Yeah, and that sucks, but that's reality. If you want to operate in reality, you need to acknowledge the fact that the left is going to use the entire might of their institutional power to push their narrative, whether or not that narrative is rooted in truth or not.
As I said elsewhere, the “Don’t say gay” spin wasn’t that successful.
That one looks like it actually backfired on them.
And as the approval for media and Hollywood continues to tank with independents, I believe it is a harbinger of things to come.
I think that's quite likely. People are quickly seeing through the garbage of corporate media an Hollywood.
Making abortion a state by state fight is far better politically per this draft.
The draft would also make national legislation of abortion illegal per its wording.
There was a study some years ago that concluded that democrat control of the media skewed public opinion 8-9 points I’m favor of the democrats. If they ever lost that advantage it would be the end of them.
It would decimate them.
I heard the same thing about the black vote being less than 90% D, but then Trump pulled 20% of the black vote yet Biden magically won...
Jesse fails to admit that just 10% of Americans support banning all abortions (even though most Republican lawmakers support banning all (or virtually all) abortions.
Abortion has now become the top political issue for November just as I've predicted here for the past six months (when nobody else was interested in discussing the issue because it wasn't front page news).
Where did I make the claim regarding all abortions?
What a weird argument against an argument i never made. On fact I was very clear on some regulation generally 2nd or 3rd argument.
Glad to see you corrected an argument I clearly didn't make.
Pro choice Democrats will benefit greatly in November if SCOTUS strikes down Roe v Wade, if more red states ban abortion, and if GOP candidates (who win the primary) have called for a total (or near total) ban on abortion.
Most swing districts (in State House and Senate races, and US House and Senate races) are in suburbs, where a significant majority of women are pro choice.
Republican candidates who endorse a 15 week ban on abortion, with exceptions for rape, incest and mother's health will fare better in November than those who advocate a total ban, a six week ban, no exceptions for rape, incest and/or mother's health.
If SCOTUS strikes down Roe v Wade, I anticipate two thirds of women will vote Democrat in November (and two thirds of men will vote GOP).
The economy is going to be the top issue. Unless we’re facing likely nuclear annihilation thanks to Biden being senile and Ron Klain being an incompetent progtard.
No, no, Bill is obsessed with abortion.
He's already stated he'd vote for leftist totalitarianism if any restriction on abortion was on display.
Weird that it's so important to him... or just revealing that he's a blue laws activist piece of shit.
The good news is that most people vote with their wallets. Which bodes poorly for the democrats.
After a certain point, yes. But before Roe and for a few years afterward, there was no partisan alignment to speak of on the subject. Before Roe, abortion wasn't even treated in the USA or any other country I'm aware of as a political issue. It was like narcotics prohibition before the mid-1960s: an uncontroversial matter, little spoken of, treated mostly as a medical problem, accepted as a legitimate law enforcement concern. (More recently we see the emergence of pedophilia as a talked-up issue.) Immediately after Roe, abortion became a matter of public controversy, but it took about 5 years before it shook out as either a "left-right" or a partisan issue. In the process of becoming partisan, it helped reinvigorate the moribund Republicans.
So the issue helped them, then over time it hurt them, but channeling it narrowly as a judicial matter mostly helped them.
e did nothing thab make the base requirements more stringent than some states wanted.
The reality of the situation is completely irrelevant. What matters is what voters can be made to believe about it.
The ministry of truth will tell them what to think.
Quite right - thanks for the reminder.
Lies like those spun about voter ID and FL "Don't say gay" come to mind.
If you can't tell the truth about an issue, chances are it's because your position is indefensible without the lie.
I think less people bought the “Don’t say gay” spin than lefties hoped.
Yeah, it’s a hard sell for most people it’s important to teach 5 year olds about trannys and homos, or just sex in general.
If the GOP is smart, this can be salvaged. Some of the worst excesses of leftists involve abortion. Most people support legal abortion within limits, but the loudest shrieking harpies on the left want abortion up to birth. Let the purple haired harpies shriek it out, and make their extreme views the defining point of their argument. I think after the past several years, moderate middle class America has swung right enough that they're ready to be skeptical of leftist propaganda.
Plus, there are way bigger problems for people to worry about. Just be fucking relentless with the economy. Every minute of every day, remind voters of how much they're paying for gas and ground beef. Abortion is all the dems have at this point, so don't let them make it the central issue of the campaign.
GOP will lose some seats they could have won, but I don't think they'll lose enough to make a difference.
My take as well.
The concern trolling like comments don't persuade me.
Survey after survey show anytime abortions are not popular.
Yes this will cause fire and brimstone articles from the left and media, but media trust is already at historical lows.
Arguijg against this draft release on concerns for elections is silly. It is playing into keeping a bad law around for political reasons instead of constitutional reasons.
That is a good approach, but the GOP won't do that. Do you really think the GOP cares about inflation and spending? They always make noise about those things, but what they really care about are fetuses.
The horror, protecting the lives of your cotizens at any age.
Feti are not citizens.
What are feti? We’re talking about babies here.
"Baby" is a term of endearment, usually for a human infant; it has no medical basis. So you can describe fetuses as babies if you desire, but it does not further or hinder any serious argument.
When a woman miscarries, no one ever offers condolences for the loss of their ‘fetus’.
I may be wrong, but I don't recall any Church that offers burials or cemetary plots for miscarriages either.
To Ecog: then you are an uniformed dipshit. Newspapers run obits for "fetuses" all the fucking time, and people attend the funerals and offer condolences.
Really, that is what you're going with. Sick.
So you argue for quantity over quality? Protect life itself at any cost, but whether you have jurisdiction over your own body is unimportant?
You ready to be aborted?
Rittenhouse retroactively aborted some democrats awhile back. Maybe that should be expanded upon.
Only if he identifies as their "mom".
So you have no moral objection to murdering homeless people.
At this point, the GOP cares about winning.
"but the loudest shrieking harpies on the left want abortion up to birth"
Have you ever actually researched who opts for a "late-term" abortion, how many are opting for it, and why?
Of all abortions performed, a fraction of a fraction of them are considered "late-term". The procedure is recommended by doctors to patients with *wanted* pregnancies, because there is a fatal fetal defect (it will only spend a few excruciatingly pain-filled minutes alive post-birth) or a regular birth will mean almost certain death to the birthing parent. In either case, there is horrible grief that the expectant parents will go through, mourning the loss of an expected child. It is the complete opposite of a frivolous or cruel decision.
Which is why abortion rights advocates believe that you, the government, and jill shmill/joe shmoe down the street, have no business butting into that decision and telling that couple not only what is the correct moral choice, but that they must accept it over their own beliefs, convictions, and decisions.
It's her decision, agreed.
She has no right to a hitman though, nor do you have a right to take money for the purpose of committing homicide.
So would you bust both the Doctor and the woman for murder?
I don't understand why everyone is going apeshit over a ruling that was going to come out later this summer anyway. If it had waited until the final opinion had come out in July, would it have made a speck of difference?
Someone performed a serious breach of etiquette for the judiciary. It just is not clear exactly who or why.
Not just a breach of etiquette, they broke a law. And if they aren’t found and punished accordingly, this will be a bigger problem for this country in the future than whatever political fallout comes from abortion.
If the world were otherwise cruising along reasonably well I might agree.
But to all the people who are having trouble making ends meet, and might be looking at unemployment soon if/when the recession really hits this is not going to a priority issue.
No matter how much the media try to make it the only story.
This definitely saved some Dems from losing in November. Ironic that a ruling Repubs want will help Dems at election time.
Remains to be seen. Abortion regulations are more popular than freedom of abortion until the magic birth canal grants life.
Polling would disagree with you.
Not really. Some abortion regulation is more popular than no abortion regulation.
The Kermit Gosnell stuff and the Planned Parenthood tapes really disturbed a lot of people.
Stop conflating some regulation and no regulation. Repubs will pursue outright bans. And there is much more support for regulated abortion versus outright bans.
Look who is conflating now.
Are you trying to make sense? I can't tell.
He makes sense, you are the one who needs your binky.
Good argument.
???
You were conflating with your polling claim. I actually broke the positions apart.
No, you left out bans in your argument. And that's the whole point. More people agree with regulated abortion than bans on abortion.
Nobody mentioned bans which you're now conflating with regulation. Look at the thread. Fist didn't, Jesse didn't and you didn't.
Jesse mentioned "regulations", not bans, and you said the polls were against them. Then, when I said "Some abortion regulation is more popular than no abortion regulation", you accused me of conflating.
I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt right now that you misread a few things and got confused, but I'm starting to get a little PO'd.
You're getting PO'd? Maybe calm down, then.
Jesus, the anger, hysterics, and mental gymnastics you all are doing to be antagonistic with me on this issue is hitting absurd levels. Give it a rest.
But I will also give you the benefit of the doubt that for some reason you just can't understand my position rather than are purposefully being obtuse.
The point is Dems have an opportunity to grab an issue for November, and maybe 2024. An opportunity they didn't have before now as their governance has been a complete failure.
What they will do is explain how Repubs want to BAN, not regulate, not sing kumbaya, not have a dinner party, but BAN abortion. They will then be able to pick out states like Missouri and Mississippi to use as intent of the whole.
Thus, if Repubs can stay calm and reasoned and simply regulate abortion moving forward, they will eliminate this political strategy from working. The problem is that I don't live under a rock and know that some Repub governors and legislatures out there will rush (like Noem is already doing) to jump on the ban-wagon to virtue signal their non-RINO status to garner the hardcore base.
At the end of the day, this has given Dems an issue that they can use in November and maybe beyond, when they were literally out of any issues to run on. As such, it's very likely to help salvage some toss-up races for Dems.
This is what one calls political analysis rather than flippant ideological debate. I haven't argued for or against any position on the ruling. Ironically, I think overturning Roe is the proper thing to do. But that's not the point of my posting. It's called being able to look at impact rather than what's right or proper. Sometimes the right thing can result in bad impacts, that's just life.
Also, if you don't think there are a lot of people in this comment section who are more than fine with states banning abortion, you need to read more.
It was an observation, not an argument.
At a federal level, I've seen no evidence of this as of yet. It could change, of course, but presently, I have not seen it.
State-wise, not my concern.
Statewide impacts national politics. That's just reality.
Less than you'd think. What NY does has little positive impact elsewhere. Most people look at it like a failed experiment. Ditto CA.
Not saying this might not help Democrats. But given the economic shit show heading our way, I doubt it helps them much. People will always worry far more about their money than issues like abortion.
Especially if we have democrat food shortages in the fall like may are predicting.
Also, decent chance pro-abortion states go dramatically overboard over what voters will support.
Everyone here has been quite clear on the some regulation argument. Lol.
Yes, they keep resorting to some regulation, which is not what I am talking about.
Actually, it's quite funny how many of you are ignoring that issue. It's becoming quite telling.
Something like this:
Stage 1: All I want is policy X, it would never lead to outcome Y.
Stage 2: Well okay, policy X did lead to outcome Y, but it's not so bad after all, is it?
Stage 3: Actually, I wanted Y all along, suckas!
Yes, the literally playbook of both parties.
No, what is telling is that you have to conflate others arguments because you misread them. That is the funny part. Youre projecting.
Sure. Whatever you say.
Agreed.
You started the personal attacks and projection.
Feel free to peruse the timestamps.
I have no quandary calling you out for it either. Not the first time.
Sure, Jesseaz. It's always everyone else. LOL!
What part of your argument, squirrel, is based on reality rather than your fantasy of what will happen?
Your right. It's all in my head and make believe. No matter what happens, it will always help Republicans.
Aww, look at the little Fargo squirrel throw a tantrum because people are pointing out his collectivistjeff style debate tactics.
Lol
If that's what you want to call it, go for it. I just call it blowing off an uninteresting and childish commentor.
Squirrel is literally arguing based on personal fantasy, yet calls others childish.
LOL
The irony of someone who does nothing but post childish insults to everyone that he doesn't 100% agree with getting upset for getting called out on it is just fantastic.
I love the entitlement that you think you can behave like an ass, yet no one can notice it or call you out on it. LOL!
You're like the right version of Taylor Lorenz.
You might see that ima very few red states. Most will just apply more restrictions and regulations.
Doesn't take many states to do it to be able to form a general narrative about what Republicans want.
Less murdered infants?
Infants are post-birth, so no abortions are ever performed on infants. (If by "murder" you meant abortion).
The irony in your comment does wonders to prove my point.
Virginia, Massachusetts, and New York would like to have a word with you.
I see you missed the irony.
Hey Squirrely, Are those high-end Peregrina pearls you are clutching or the faux Mallorca type?
“A woman needs ropes and ropes of pearls." - Coco Chanel
So, this is your interjected response into a reasoned discussion between people?
Hey! If there were more ropes of pearls in and on mouths, necks, and asses, the question of unwanted pregnancy would never arise. Eh? Eh? KnowwhatImean? Nudge-Nudge? 🙂
Another failed attempt at humor
It is sad. He does try hard.
If there were more ropes of pearls in and on mouths, necks, and asses, there wouldn't be a problem with unwqnted pregnancy!
Eh?-Eh? KnowwhatImean? Nudge-Nudge? Wink-Wink? Spurt-Spurt? Say no More? 🙂
No it doesn't. Nearly 70% of respondents agree to regulations around 2nd and third trimester abortions.
Are you talking about polling on Roe and the misperceptions around what Roe did?
I can cite dozens of polls regarding explicit questions around abortion regulations and their support.
Are you purposefully ignoring my point so as to not have to address it?
I am not talking about regulation of abortion, I am talking about Repubs banning it altogether. Repubs had the upper-hand arguing for proper regulation of abortion. They had public support in that regard. However, now that Repubs are free to full-on ban abortion, they will lose the upper-hand because large majorities support regulated abortions, not bans.
If Repubs stay in the lane of regulating abortion, they will be good. But in today's political virtue signaling world, Repubs will be tripping over themselves to ban abortion to show their non-RINO bona fides.
You responded to me. I did not respond to you.
Nobody is talking about zero abortion vs full abortion. The discussion is on current regulations that generally provide regulations past 15 weeks and more generally around 20 weeks.
The fact that you had to change someone else's argument shows the weakness of your own argument.
No, you responded to my comment. That's how we got to this point. My god, you run quick to gaslighting deflection.
I responded to Fist and you responded to me. And my point is that Dems will be able to use this to be more successful in November than they would have been. That's just the fact of the matter.
And such success will be predicated on being able to fire up the base and to scare independents about Repub plans to ban abortion.
It's called politics.
Wait. So you didn't respond to me first? Weird. I can see timestamps above.
Again, who is talking about outlawing all abortion except for you? Who is the one gaslighting here?
Your argument is so fucking weak and you know it that you're flailing.
I responded to you on another thread, you responded to me on this thread.
It's kind of funny how angry you get and resort to garbage condescension when you are unable to argue a point.
I'll help you. I actually agree with striking down Roe. It was a terrible law and should be left to states to decide. I also know how political parties work, and yes, you will find Republican states seeking to ban abortion. You can read numerous comments here and even see the desire to ban abortion.
That's how our modern politics works. Repubs in places like South Dakota, Mississippi, and Missouri will run to the extreme. And it only takes one extreme for Dems on a national scale to use as an example. It's called politics. And analyzing politics is much different than trying to generate arguments to defend your desired political position. The decision to eliminate Roe is the right decision. However, that doesn't mean it will result in a political win for Repubs in the future.
Instead of trying so hard to be antagonistic with me, maybe ease up a bit and see what I am saying instead.
It is best to think of Jesse as like a junkyard dog. All he knows how to do is to snarl and attack. If you try to have a conversation with him, he will just snarl louder and attack attack attack. If you corner him, he will get even more vicious and just attack even more.
IS....I just don't see a groundswell of Team R Senators looking to ban all abortions for all reasons via federal law. I don't. Susan Collins? Linda Murkowski? That is just two Team R gal Senators. Plenty of Team R guy Senators who have zero interest in banning abortions. Not happening. They'd be breathing a sigh of relief IMHO, abortion now becomes a state issue and they can waffle even more than they already do.
Will there be asinine Team R politicians who exploit this for political purposes? Yep.
I am a lot more concerned about SCOTUS as an institution than I am a single constitutional decision. What happened here, leaking SCOTUS deliberations, was very wrong. I don't want Justices unable to work with each other because of mistrust. That affects the country.
Don't confuse my analysis as being disagreement with the decision. I'm fine with the decision to get rid of Roe. It was garbage legal reasoning and needed to go away.
And I don't believe there will be a national ban push by Repubs. They don't have that level of extremism at the national level. But what you will see is state extremism and the left will work to impute that on a whole. It will be that imputing that will help in the moderate and toss-up seats in November. That's simply my point.
In the end, the elimination of Roe is a good thing, but it will be more beneficial to Dems in the short term, mainly because they have absolutely nothing to run on in November.
I definitely think the dem base was demoralized and embarrassed to pull the lever for this clown show.
Striking down Roe gives them a reason to get fired up
This absolutely saves some seats.
It definitely does. Before this, they had absolutely nothing to get fired up about. And more importantly, you take those left of center people who have completely lost support for Dem governance, but are not looking at the other side as being the evil, rights eliminators the Dems have warned about. Thus, these basically independent voters are now concerned with the rise of the right.
Breaking down your argument....
Let a bad ruling survive because of political reasons.
Also you ignore this ruling would take abortion out of the national realm and make it state by state based.
I didn't make that argument, I am discussing the ramifications of the ruling. And I in no way am ignoring the national versus state issue.
Dude, ease up on the gaslighting and strawmaning.
Do you know what either term means?
This ruling ends Roe, a national regulation and pushes it to the states. That is the ramification of this leaked decision.
Are you ignorant to basic facts?
So far you've defended this leak as "bad for republicans" and "people don't want zero abortions". Cite where you've talked about state vs national because up above you ignore the issue completely.
It's hard to fathom just how much you are purposefully avoiding my actual premise.
I don't think it's on purpose. Many (most?) people aren't very good at looking critically at not just what they oppose, but what they support as well. A bias of sorts.
--Repubs. can't understand the ramifications of banning LGBTQ+...anything, "Abstinence Only sex ed", and dismantling the separation of church and state.
--Dems. can't understand the ramifications of banning hate speech, abolishing the 2A, and doing away with any meaningful distinction being lawful immigrant/illegal alien.
Anyway, I get your point, since I'm an abortion rights supporter. Repubs. trying to federally ban abortion is scary. Not too long ago, I think the idea of Roe being overturned would have sounded ludicrous. Now it's a looming reality. If 50 years of precedent can be overturned so easily, by this very partisan court, is a federal ban on abortion (even with its contradiction of the imminent ruling) really so far-fetched?
What's sad is that even if there isn't a federal ban on abortions any time soon, that doesn't stop draconian state bans. What does a lack of a federal abortion ban matter to an 11-year-old little girl who was raped by her teen brother, is now pregnant, and cannot obtain an abortion in her state because to the adults in power over her, the embryo matters more than her body, her life, her lifelong emotional/mental scarring from birthing a child as a child?
I'm not even being facetious. Children are raped by family members all the time, and many of the state bans coming into play do not have exceptions for rape or incest; I assume they don't care about age, mental capacity, or maturity of the victim either. The only thing that matters is zygotes, embryos, and fetuses, right? To hell with whatever irrelevant thing births them? "It's God's will"?....
The old rape and incest trope. Which is maybe 1% of abortions, if that. It’s just a dodge, like every other bullshit leftist talking point.
Some. But how many?
Based on how everything is absolute crap.... every seat they win?
I really cannot fathom why anyone other than CWP drones would vote for them at this point.
The way this administration is going abortion will be the last thing on most peoples minds in September.
Ironic that a ruling Repubs want will help Dems at election time.
This is actually how midterm swings go when you think about it. Party gains power, interprets as mandate, immediately starts going too far in the opposite direction, people realize that in voting against one extreme they got the other extreme and revert to voting the other direction next time. The GOP this time just happened to get there before being voted into power.
Well said.
Strategically speaking, there was never a good time for this to happen. Another election was always around the corner, and as long as Democrats remain committed to turning the US into Venezuela, every single one of those elections would be too important to lose.
We're still over six months out with the worst of the next recession ahead of us and facing the kind of food shortages that non-immigrant Americans (and most immigrants) have only heard about on the news.
Strategically speaking, there was never a good time for this to happen. Another election was always around the corner, and as long as Democrats remain committed to turning the US into Venezuela, every single one of those elections would be too important to lose.
This is the thing about culture wars, and wars in general--at some point, you have to quit practicing Fabian operations and engage the enemy in combat. The de facto posture for the right for most of the last 30-odd years has been, "Don't push this culture war issue, it will just spook the left and get them motivated to fight against these awesome economic policies!" But culture is where real principles are actually found, not piddly shit like tax cuts.
So if Roe is overturned, the question that SHOULD be asked is, "At what point is a pregnancy considered to be supporting an actual human being with legal protections?" That's never going to be firmly established even from a scientific perspective, but it's going to have to be the framework for how abortion law is crafted going forward. Because logically speaking, if someone can be prosecuted for killing a pregnant woman, and unlawfully terminating a pregnancy in the process, then it stands to reason that the person can be prosecuted for double murder as well (indeed, that was the whole reason Planned Parenthood didn't want to see Scott Peterson charged with double murder, as it established Laci's baby as a person with rights and legal protections as well).
It is time to heed the Constitution and return the issue of abortion to the people's elected representatives...
Have you met those idiots?
That was reasons earlier article on Ohio.
It is a helluva thing that some Demz outrage over this leak is based on the idea that the Court is undemocratic. Which shows they just throw about the word "democracy" without understanding its meaning. Overturning Roe would merely return the abortion issue to being decided by the democratic institutions of state government, the state legislatures.
"Which shows they just throw about the word "democracy" without understanding its meaning."
A common misperception that becomes clear once you realize that when they say "democracy" what they really mean is "we get to control everything."
When they say "our democracy" it is really a Freudian slip.
Leaking a draft opinion of the Supreme Court destroys trust among the justices and undermines justice.
It's not the crime; it's the coverup.
Well it was probably leaked so the Pope could approve the decision. Pretty sure that if the decision is approved then then the Pope will talk to God. No cover up needed
https://twitter.com/ChuckDeVore/status/1521300879307116548?t=FpLSdgJTFlSKYGpyrW0k1w&s=19
I saw @MollyJongFast griping about @elonmusk on @MSNBC and for a moment, I swear, I swear that I thought it was @danacarvey and he was announcing that he convinced Mike Myers to come out of retirement for a new Wayne's World. Imagine the bitter disappointment.
[Pic]
So many on the left have begun to look like cartoon characters.
Many "libertarians" too
"The End of Roe?"
Roe is literally the most brilliant decision in Supreme Court history. Its logic is so ironclad, its Constitutional basis so sound, that it has attained the status of SUPER-PRECEDENT. If any part of it gets watered down, it means we're literally living in The Handmaid's Tale.
#AbortionAboveAll
I heard that exact argument, without the sarcasm.
OBL, just among us, is opposition to abortion restrictions another Koch-funded disinformation campaign? Cuz it seems like more births, especially among the po peeples, would add to the low-pay work force. And the hand-maiden model is just an extension of that.
I'm pretty sure what we're going for is to import as many people as necessary from high birthrate places but keep them sterile once they get here. People looking after infants are simply not as productive. As the article said, "recently, Amazon and several other companies 'have announced plans that ensure staff have access to abortions.'" Rather a packing clerk take two days off for an abortion than two months off for maternity leave.
True, but Amazon could operate hand-maiden centers which produce hoards of eager fulfillment workers. Maybe we need to see a business model and cos-benefit analysis. Bezos, are you listening?
It could work as a long-term green banana strategy.
Politico says it "received a copy of the draft opinion from a person familiar with the court's proceedings...
It's good that the "I Am Part of the Resistance Inside the Trump Administration" guy found work.
There is good evidence that the person who leaked it was Sotomayor clerk. The same person has been cited more than once by the politico reporter who leaked this.
I’d be curious exactly which kind of FBI agents have been assigned to this. It’s a pretty limited pool of people that would have access to this draft. If the person isn’t identified pretty quickly, we can assume it’s the political kind of agent, and they might get away with it.
I'm betting this fellow is having quite a day:
https://socialtelecast.com/who-is-amit-jain-all-about-supreme-court-clerk-who-exposed-abortion-draft/
That is who I referenced. Yeap.
I was worried reason would censor it like the media did for the Trump telephone call leaker.
“After a very long, once again Amit Jain and Sonia Sotomayor are coming into the limelight on social networking sites.”
I’m going to be skeptical of a source that fucks up its very first sentence until I hear it somewhere else.
Yale's Judicial Clerkship program will be worthless if it is found to be Jain that leaked the draft. Any law student with aspirations for a judicial clerkship will have to cross Yale off their preferred list of law schools. Yale was already on shaky ground with some justices due to their position on free speech. (Remember the Silberman letter?).
Good. The ivy league schools are basically Marxist training camps at this point. Anything that hurts them is good for America.
Is this all about the same person, or two different people with the same name?
https://theancestory.com/who-is-amit-jain/
Saw that one too; seems it's pretty much on the fringe right now, nothing you'd call "mainstream" carrying this, yet.
And be on lookout for malware on those; I had to clear and restart to get rid of a rather insistent "your computer is infected fix now" pop up
Ok Roberts has made a statement acknowledging the leak and an all out search for the culprit.
I'd say it's a pretty small pool of suspects, the whomever is going to pay a price for their martyrdom. Maybe even going to join Benedict Arnold and Alger Hiss in the pantheon of rascals.
And this will be the third big exposure of how unprincipled some in the media are as they cheer this leak, behind Trump and Elon.
The culprit may never be publicly announced but if a clerk leaves their position before expected you can pretty much know that they identified the "leaker".
Leftists don't see consequences from their actions.
It's up to The People to deliver justice by any means necessary.
Let’s hope Roberts doesn’t wet himself and reverse course.
Amazon and several other companies "have announced plans that ensure staff have access to abortions," notes the BBC.
Trial balloon for "plans that ensure staff have access to cannabis and handguns"?
The second amendment isn't a SuperPrecedent like Roe v. Wade.
No, those are the wrong kinds of employee benefits. We all know that free and frequent abortion is what makes this country work.
I know someone who has had 13 abortions. Pretty horrific.
Why? Why would they do that? It can't be cheaper than a rubber.
I think she had the first one at 14 and became conditioned to use abortion as a for, of retroactive birth control. She’s a real democrat success story.
I also know someone who remorselessly used abortion as birth control. At 22 years old, when undergoing consultation for her seventh abortion, she was told that if she had one more, it was likely that she would never be able to carry to full term. She had that kid.
I had an ex that was told that after her third abortion. In her case it was complicated by pretty severe anorexia/bulimia. All of it between 17 and 21. She straightened her shit out by the time I met her, thankfully.
"Here, Juanita, get in this box and we will get you to California ASAP. Do you have a Prime account?"
Now let's see the USSC leak something overturning United States v. Miller (1939). In for a penny ...
One major difference between now and in the pre-Roe era is the now-widespread availability of abortion-inducing drugs.
And don't even get me started on the hit to the fetal tissue market.
Hey, that's just a market opportunity for plant-based fetal tissue entrepreneurs.
An additional issue is that neither the Beyond Fetus nor the Impossible Fetus taste like the real thing.
Ya im not going to have a ton of sympathy for the green haired fat freaks with "my body my choice" signs that just very happily argued that minimum wage laborers should lose their jobs and not be allowed in public or denied healthcare if they didnt get their mandatory govt injections.
Something something hoisted something petard
A+
Hear, hear!
And all your kids are not belong to you!
[/ref]
Logical and moral consistency is racist!
I fail to see how "you can't be a menace to society and spread a deadly disease around willy nilly" equates at all to abortion.
But you do you.
I suppose we should let people drive drunk too. I mean, if people are afraid of being hit by drunk drivers, they should stay home right?
Life is full of risks. Best end it now before life gets you.
Yes, Shitlunches would be better off dead. So would the rest of us.
It's pro homicide, give it what it wants
Pro homocide……. so if Tony kills himself, is he guilty of an anti LGBwhatever hate crime?
I don't see why he should be relied upon to do the right thing
"you can't be a menace to society and spread a deadly disease around willy nilly"
This kind of thinking is why we clearly cant allow you or people to think like to any kind of power. You will use a disease with <1% mortality, pre-vax or treatments, and call it "deadly" and people spreading it "menace to society" in an exercise to control others. Thats all it is.
Next up itll be you stopping people from doing X,Y, or Z to "prevent hate" or "stop violence against trans people" because your hystrionic estrogen filled self thinks not agreeing that a man with a cock and balls is in fact a man is literal hate and violence. Anything you impose on people is fine, because you are virtuous and trying to prevent violence.
Keep reminding us all why we can never let your kind take control again.
I favor compulsory expatriation of all Marxists from America.
There's a fertilizer shortage coming, we will need them for compost.
I suppose we should let people drive drunk too
Yes: the .08 BAC standard is absurd. Many of us are perfectly effective drivers well in excess of that limit.
I have little doubt that I could pass a written and in-person driver's test at it. So since this is the only validation of quality required to receive a license under ordinary circumstances, why am I not permitted to be licensed to drive at a higher BAC?
I know dude, I’ve infected like hundreds of people and millions have got the sniffles as a result.
It’s Willy nilly out there! Haha. What a doosh.
Some "healthcare" is more private than others you hater.
For consistency women who refuse abortions should be fired and not allowed to work.
You realize that the "leaked" Supreme Court decision is thinly veiled Russian disinformation, don't you? 51 intelligence officials have declared it has all the hallmarks of Russian propaganda and no reliable news source should be repeating this garbage.
Better wait for Nina Jankowicz to tell us.
Gotta give her a couple days to write the lyrics.
LOL--really
Her insane antics are oddly entertaining. Except she should be performing from a psychiatric facility. Not a government office.
" Except she should be performing from a psychiatric facility. Not a government office."
A minor problem.
The real problem is that we think those two different places.
We can move the entire civil service to mental hospitals. I would even be ok spending a few billion to build more nuthouses to keep them all locked up forever. Then divert some of that phony vaccine money for a massive supply of Thorazine.
Also, it would give her time to write more Harry Potter snuff fan fiction.
While we do not condone the unsanctioned, unabridged release of government documents the People Are Not Yet Ready to Know, this info is legit, folks. You heard it here, and you will hear further as Nina's next classic hits the Spotifys.
We are currently considering whether or not to call the opinion itself misinformation, though, as Alito is currently under investigation as a potential source of uninformation for this opinion and others.
Have a pleasant day!
Hey, what The People really need is a color-coded Information Warning System. Words are confusing. Is this an amber day, an orange day, or what?
We like your comment and would have marked it GREEN, but we found it on a known right-wing comment board and must therefore mark it CHARTREUSE.
Have a pleasant day!
I'm still not fully convinced the leak is legit. This is a mainstream media outlet, after all. I'm going to need a little more than "some guy we're not going to name gave this to us, trust us on this".
https://socialtelecast.com/who-is-amit-jain-all-about-supreme-court-clerk-who-exposed-abortion-draft/
This is what/who the net is all abuzz about
You could actually read thorough that? The Hindlish it was written in was near-indecipherable to me, and I work with some heavily-accented folks.
Right; I'm only seeing it on what you'd call "sketchy" sites, awash with malware just waiting to jump on you.
We'll see if the story goes mainstream later today; regardless I wouldn't want to be in his shoes right now, being summoned to the justice's chambers with the FBI on hand and every yellow journalist rag in the waiting room.
Go visit the Daily Kos comments. Sweet and salty.
Boston violated First Amendment by rejecting Christian flag.
If they let Christians be a victim group then it's all over.
Didn't that Christ guy do something with victimization?
Call a man a victim he is only a victim for a day; teach a man critical theory and he can be a victim for life.
Best parable ever.
According to the legend, he victimized himself. Small wonder PC, SJWs, and Wokeism infiltrated the Churches with such ease!
You should smoke more or less crack. Your current level doesn't seem to be working.
It is also expected to codify protections for LGBTQ students for the first time by adding that Title IX, the federal education law that prohibits sex-based discrimination, also prohibits discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity.
So, uni-gender washrooms and lockerrooms at long last?
Creepatopia!
'Make that "LGBTQC"!'
I identify as a college aged female pole vaulter. For the locker room privileges
Women’s volleyball player for me. Although I’m fluid so sometimes I identify as a softball player.
I wouldn't mind joining the dance team or cheerleading squad.
Where I went to college it wouldn’t have been difficult to get into their shower as a man.
Nothing says freedom like a penis in the girls locker room.
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of a penis!"
Indeed. Scott Shackford does his best work when he's explaining to ciswomen how bigoted they are if they don't want to see ladydick while changing or showering.
#TransWomenAreWomen
Ladydick is America. If you don't love ladydick, your kind of bigotry is worse than Orange Hitler's tweets.
"Wax my ladydick and STFU."
Ladydick? WTF is that?
A female penis, a feminine cock, a womanly wang, a damsel's dangler, a girlish trouser trout, a matronly meatstick...
Is a womanly wang a "wong"?
Two wongs don't make a wang.
I mean it is already bigoted for a straight man to refuse to date a chick w a dick.
Hey, every citizen has equal entitlement to oral sex from you.
Rosie O'Donnell after an hour sauna session.
Youre up.
I would not be up.
Michael Moore after he’s done rolling in a puddle of sewage.
Your move.
Joe Biden ... depends ... tapioca ... German voice-over
And we're one step closer to Verhoeven's Starship Troopers.
I prefer Yes's Starship Trooper.
Google will let people apply to have personal information such as phone numbers, email addresses, and street addresses removed from search results.
Taylor Lorenz hardest hit.
Meh.
Resistance and antifa members in government will still use government databases to dox people.
Yeah, pretty sure someone like Lorenz can get the info from a contact at Google.
But not from Google's data centers, I presume.
Members of Congress have been briefed on UFOs.
"They're objects, they fly and we ain't identified them."
Oh. I thought congresscreatures had been briefed while *riding* on UFOs.
*** kicks pebble ***
They're more the scurry under rocks type of lizard people.
During the anal probes.
Or de-briefed.
...and sometimes they are just a lump of bird crap that hit the instruments.
The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is moving fast to close off what seems to be the last remaining legal option for vaping companies...
If you can't vape crack, the Bidens aren't interested.
That’s the beauty of the laws not applying to you.
It has "revealed a party united in its conviction that American values, indeed the nation's way of life, are under attack..."
Have they tried a Ministry of Truth?
Or defining "American values"?
Or political prisoners?
Maybe a march towards economic ruin led by self-proclaimed socialists?
How about trains pulling cattle cars to special camps?
Nonsense. Once beef is banned, we'll have no use for cattle cars.
They’ll just rename them “high density passenger transports”.
Nothing more environmentally friendly than that.
New Department of Education rules about Title IX are expected to be released soon.
On the plus side, you will be able to have automatic victim status now with a penis.
Only if you promise never to use it for oppression.
The police "formed the blockades for the sole purpose of preventing American citizens from entering our nation's capital to exercise their constitutionally protected right to free speech..."
Pelosi's handlers saw diminishing returns so no second order to open the doors for MAGA was given.
I assumed it was because the dungeon under the capital is full.
The funniest part last night was watching the DNC giving up all pretext of their trans claims calling for women's Healthcare and stopping the use of birthing people in their histrionics.
So they were just pretending to be retarded?
No, so retarded they can't keep their retardation consistent.
If this is a legitimate decision and reflects the courts opinion, I suspect this very much is winning the battle at the expense of the war. Democrats are going to get a serious midterm bump which will likely salvage what was going to be a bloodbath. Republicans have for years owned state houses at a much higher level, they were already starting to garner more attention due to their idiotic culture war bullshit laws, this is going to make sure the eye of Sauron gets turned upon them. Roe was never well reasoned, but it was a good compromise on something that is inherently a difficult conflict to resolve. Not saying the court got it wrong, but at the end of the day you have competing rights and there is no clear bright lines.
Wouldn’t sending it back to the states be a good compromise?
If you're trying to run a country, then yes. If you're trying to grandstand and demagogue, then no.
What was I even thinking?
It's fun that so many libertarians are being good little leftist toadies and already spreading the narrative meant to cover massive fraud.
Fraud?
My bad, I forgot we now have the freest and fairest elections eva
Ah, I gotcha. Wasn’t sure what fraud you were referring to.
What rights are competing?
The right to kill and the right not to be killed?
> I suspect this very much is winning the battle at the expense of the war.
A huge chunk of the Right are single issue voters. The Religious Right got on board the Trump train because Trump flipped from being pro-choice to pro-life. To these people abortion is the only issue. Not just a litmus test, literally the only issue that will animate them politically.
So losing the war while winning the battle is not a problem for them. This battle is everything. Back in the 90s, Bill Bennett said "character matters", but who remembers Bill Bennett these days? The only thing that matters is abortion.
This is winning the war, you doofuses. Getting laws passed in states that were overturned was winning battles and losing the war.
It’s like you don’t understand the point at all. Single issue voters don’t care about The Party maintaining slim majorities
It's only winning the war if you think the war is about abortion. If you don't think the war is about abortion, then you might be concerned that abortion will overshadow other issues, like the looming depression, the trampling of civil rights, consolidation of power into an unelected shadow government, etc.
If the abortion debate is enough to derail combat against those things, we were already doomed
In what way was Roe a "compromise?"
Roe overturned will put this country through one of the largest social experiments ever seen. For 50 years it has been taken for granted that a women could end a pregnancy. Parents learning that their teen daughter is pregnant had options, young women in college had options, women who were raped had options, couples with children had options if they wanted or needed to limit their family's size, couples finding out that their unborn baby had significant medical issues had options. All these options were present, even when taken for grant, and will be gone or limited.
This is not as simple as just taking away abortion. This is a big experiment.
I wonder if any of the state laws have exemptions for rape and insest?
How did europe survive with their 20 week regulations theblast 150 years! Complete chaos there.
Excuse me: “women”?
Rape victims deserve some special consideration, but four out of five of those groups still have options. They can either abstain from sex or use birth control.
and most likely drive to the next state over as another option
Unless Missouri has its way.
why? either killing a child is wrong or it isn't. saying that a woman can kill her baby because she was impregnated during a rape does not justify the killing.
That’s always been an interesting question for me.
Agreed. I still think it's wrong, but I'd find it hard to stand in the way of a rape victim seeking an abortion.
Yeah, it drags the girl's rape out for 9 months, but by the same token the kid is innocent and doesn't deserve to be killed.
Nature's a cunt.
“Some Republicans, not content with banning slavery in some states, will seek a national ban” Reason October 1860 issue
It is an interesting question.
I'm pro-life. That applies across the spectrum to the death penalty, too.
Killing a child is always wrong. A child is a child, no matter where it comes from. However, we can't necessarily apply the same "you had options before you got pregnant" standard to rape victims, because they didn't necessarily have them.
I have little sympathy for someone who chooses to have sex, knowing the natural consequence of sex is pregnancy, and then expects to be absolved of responsibility for the choice. Even if they use birth control, it's known that birth control isn't 100% effective, and they chose to take that risk. I do, however, have sympathy for someone who didn't choose to have sex and ended up getting pregnant. It doesn't change the fact that a life is a life, but it does change my level of compassion for the burden they now carry.
A woman who becomes pregnant from rape still has the option to put the child up for adoption after it's born.
Sucks that she was raped. Sucks that bad stuff happens. Deal with it.
I am pretty hardcore pro-life and I would counsel a rape victim to pursue adoption over abortion (I think it helps to see something good come from something bad)…
But from the position of the law, I have never liked the removal of choice from anyone. That goes for vaccine mandates and this. Pregnancy is not easy, is resource intensive, and I am not comfortable with the law forcing that.
However, I see making an exception for it may lead to false rape claims more than already exist.
I'm pro abortion. It's a pragmatic issue to me, and I'm not absolutely anti homicide.
But legally and logically, performing abortions should be illegal if we want to have any consistency w/laws against homicide.
The woman, rape victim or otherwise, should be on her own. Women have been aborting prospective children for thousands of years. The difference is now doctors do it and get rich off taxpayer funds.
I'm ok with drugs like the Plan B pill but, again for consistency's sake, they should have another ostensible purpose for which they are marketed even if they're used exclusively for the highly probable side effect.
I would say dealing with it would include finding a way to get an abortion, in this scenario.
A violent crime was already committed against a person, then you are asking them to go through a process that puts physiologic (sometimes pathologic) stress on their body for something that is not only a personal choice / responsibility but something that was forced on them.
There's a reason a huge majority (it really isnt even close) is in favor of abortion in this specific scenario. Its a bit cruel to force someone to go through that process when it was in no way their choice, IMO anyways
It's not cruel, it's a fact of life.
I have no problem with a woman pursuing abortion, which doesn't need to be illegal.
I have a problem with doctors and facilities providing abortions, which should be as illegal as other homicides.
But it's on her to solve her own problems consistent with her decision. Life isn't fair. Bad things happen. Weakness should not be coddled and cultivated.
How many men with underage teen daughters would agree?
Yes, moderate inconvenience is justification for murdering helpless babies.
Since day after pills are readily available, it shouldn’t be a big problem anymore.
Isn’t that still an abortion?
Because we live in a Constitutional Republic.
I think the blood is on the rapist's hands in that case not the woman or the state. That's the argument.
So the hitman is innocent if he's a doctor performing abortions?
How dare you, you patriarchal fascist! Forcing people to constrain their own behavior is the worst thing in the universe.
You're right. When we discuss women's issues, we need to think of men and then take away reason and accountability.
Oh, you mean after SCOTUS also goes after contraceptives? Read the memo- it's all in there.
Wow. Talk about being a lying fuck. Cote the clause about banning contraceptives.
No one wants to ban contraceptives. No one.
The red states are trying to make the pill Over the Counter
ya its not.
Go back to your blue bubble if you want people to believe lies that are so easily proven false because your feels told you its true
If I were a nasty piece of shit like you, I would hope this bombshell gives you a stroke and leaves you drooling in a diaper full of your own shit.
"SCOTUS also goes after contraceptives... Read the memo- it's all in there."
No it doesn't, you lying fuck.
An IUD is 99+% effective and many clinics will put them in at next to no cost.
"couples with children had options if they wanted or needed to limit their family's size"
They can take some control of their lives and their personal decisions. Also its very likely they can just go to a D state and get one. Ending a developing life shouldn't be an easy breezy drive-through decision. A culture of freedom from any semblance of personal responsibility creates a toxic society
Abortion is not about giving people "options." It's about absolving people of responsibility for their actions. Options existed before they had sex, they just chose not to exercise them.
It's the same toxic culture that expects people to pay their student loans.
Hey, why even have a progressive government if we can't absolve people of responsibility, and push costs onto others less deserving?
Correct
I guess we should've told rape victims that they should've just taken responsibility for...being raped?
Get fucked asshat.
Eat a bullet, rapist
Cronut didnt put forth the rape strawman, you did
Almost no abortions are related to rape. This is typical of you faggot leftists. You demand in some horrible, monstrous policy because of some extreme outlier scenario. Mainly because your arguments are worthless.
Abstinence and adoption are always options.
Those involve personal responsibility and good decision making.
You do understand that overturning Roe doesn’t ban abortion in any way, right? It just kicks the issue back to the states. Which will have to pass laws to change anything.
Most states won’t change much. California, and other Marxist run states will still be gleefully murdering babies. A few red states will largely restrict abortions. That’s about it.
It will be interesting to see how much democrats will riot and rage over this. America may need to go full Rittenhouse on them
We do regardless of abortion
True, but this is something that could set off riots by this weekend. The progs are very testy and always looking for an excuse to bust in storefronts and loot shit. Those iPhones and celebrity endorsed designer sneakers don’t steal themselves.
Abortion and crime.
https://freakonomics.com/2005/05/abortion-and-crime-who-should-you-believe/
Correlation is not causality. I know Freakonomics likes to argue that this is not the case with abortion and crime, but the same causes that lead to better abortion access also lead to lower crime. It's NOT the abortion killing off babies who would turn out to be criminals. Rather there is a third factor floating both boats.
Crime drops also correlate with a drop in real poverty.
I thought their argument was interesting. Never said it was the bible.
I found it interesting too, but never claimed you said it was the bible. But I have run across people who thought Freakonomics said you could reduce crime with more abortions. Which is silly.
Look at the trolls on this site. I'll bet most were born before 1973. As in they probably would have been aborted had they been born after.
Ideas!
do you know what else happened in 1973???
hint* ask Hank Phillips
Excessive crime is driven by democrat social welfare.
Now cite correlation studies like The Bell Curve.
RACIST!
It sounds like progressives figured what a woman is this morning.
As a freedom-lover, I was hoping that the right to privacy from Roe v. Wade would be expanded outside the uterus: a right to privacy that allows women to kill babies should be enough to allow me to avoid IRS forms, wealth reporting, vaccine mandates, own firearms, and say whatever I want during an election in any manner and platform.
As it stands, SCOTUS will take abortion freedom back to whatever democracy gives you, which is just fine for progressives in a myriad of other cases. If anything, SCOTUS is forcing them to be consistent. But they hate consistency, because they hate logic: they were never afraid of a consistent application of privacy rights. Now they’re just mad that one of their sacred cow carve-outs was eliminated.
Live by the sword, die by the sword.
Hey, do you have a uterus (real or imagined)? If not, STFU.
Not sure if joking...
I thought the "imaginary uterus" would give me away,
POE's law is just the rule these days rather than the exception.
Yes, but in my defense I didn't notice the name and we've got Jeff and Shrike spamming the thread with crazy.
The right to privacy was never expanded beyond sexual matters because of the court's reasoning. Read thru the cited precedents if you don't trust me to be summarizing it fairly:
If it weren't for babies, we wouldn't be here. If it weren't for people, there'd be no constitutions. Therefore making babies is fundamental to the constitution.
If it weren’t for babies, there would be no constitution, so the the right to privacy only protects killing unborn babies.
That’s crazy.
It's crazy, but can you read the line of decisions leading up to and thru Roe as based on anything more? There was one (count 'em) justice in the preceding cited case &mdash: the one on birth control in Connecticut — who based it on the 9th amendment. All the others based the birth control and abortion decisions on the 14th amendment, by determining that matters dealing with "family" (i.e. sex) were "fundamental to an ordered society". Why were they fundamental? Because people always had babies, since before there was a constitution. Society was based on there being people, and there being people was based on making babies. So everything about making babies was fundamental to the US, or any other, constitution.
If you see anything in there that says I mischaracterized them, please point it out.
I’m not talking about you. I’m talking about how crazy our system is.
"If freedom means anything, it is the right to say 'no' to any person, idea, or product."--The late, great Steve Ditko, Co-Creator of Spider-Man and Dr. Strange. And parenthetically Child-free.
I remain skeptical. While RvW was a bad decision, being based on a penumbra privacy and not the right to make a personal medical choice under the 9th amendment, nevertheless abortion for the first trimester remains embedded in the medical and legal culture.
If overturned the brouhaha is going turn our already nasty politics to the extreme. It's going to embolden the extremes on both Left and the Right. Both Democrats and Republicans are going to be running the hardcore culture warriors. You thought AOC was bad? You ain't seen nothing yet! And I think a hell of a lot of the Right is going to be cheering on that war.
Abortion vs inequality, street battle, more at 11.
HA HA. Funny stuff.
Wait…you’re saying politics of the past decade has been MODERATE !?!
Compare with other democracies.
If overturned the brouhaha is going turn our already nasty politics to the extreme. It's going to embolden the extremes on both Left and the Right. Both Democrats and Republicans are going to be running the hardcore culture warriors. You thought AOC was bad? You ain't seen nothing yet! And I think a hell of a lot of the Right is going to be cheering on that war.
Roe was already a catalyst for that when it was passed. The left spent the next 20 years belly-aching about the Religious Right trying to turn the US back in to the "cultural hellhole" of the 1950s. 1980s pop culture was obsessed with culture war issues, which is why the neocons tried to disengage on that front in the early 90s and focus mostly on economic concerns, after Hollywood nearly threw their shoulders out from patting themselves on the back that they got Bush I out of office. Even mostly soft-handed shit like Bush II's "faith-based initiatives" got presented by the left and their media allies as some sort of insidious evangelical Christian brainwashing effort.
This stuff has always been an ongoing thing; it's going to be a while before the new civic consensus is finally established, and even then, the side that mostly ends up on the losing end will continue to press for changes that favor them. This is the wrong environment right now for fence-riders to try and argue that these issues are just "distractions." Distractions from what, exactly?
The leaked draft opinion, however, would set fire to those precedents."
Precedence that set fire to the constitution
I'm all for legal abortion, but Roe was really a pretty bad decision.
If the finding of a right to privacy was more broadly applied in other areas (e.g. drugs, commerce, use of your own property, education) that would be one thing.
^^^^
Very sobering article. Good stuff! Still, abortions will rapidly decline if RvW is overturned. Abortions have been declining anyway just as a result of God-fearing states erecting various legal obstacles. But the real conflict will ensue when the Satanist Feds try to their so-called health/civil rights laws (and hold hostage its associated welfare money) over God-fearing states' brand new capital murder laws. That should make, hopefully, for some entertaining debates on secession in 20-30 state legislatures.
Newsflash: The rate of abortions were the same before Roe v. Wade, but simply took place in deadly back alleys or jurisdictions where it was legal.
So much for "God-Fearing States" and for that matter, God, who doesn't exist, M'Lady.
*Tips hat of Train Conductor, Ship's Captain, and Airline Pilot.*
People took some measure of personal responsibility?
The horror!
"Former NYPD officer convicted of assaulting police during Jan. 6 Capitol riot"
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/thomas-webster-january-6-guilty-assaulting-police-nypd-officer/
With an aluminum flag pole AND ALMOST BRINGING THE AMERICAN REPLUBLIC TO AN END!!!!!
Right?!
That 6 ounce pole and 5 ounce flag was every bit as deadly as the molotov cocktails and bricks that the Democrat's protesters threw when they attacked the White House several months earlier.
You don't understand. The Peaceful Protesters were only attacking the Bad Orange Man. The Insurrectionists were attacking Our Democracy.
"Google will let people apply to have personal information such as phone numbers, email addresses, and street addresses removed from search results. "The availability of personal contact information online can be jarring—and it can be used in harmful ways, including for unwanted direct contact or even physical harm."
Does anyone still publish phone books? Used to be, having your name in print, with your number and address, meant that you WERE SOMEBODY NOW. Navin. R. Johnson.
Speaking of Google...
https://www.axios.com/gmail-filters-more-likely-to-weed-out-gop-emails-458febc1-7a8e-4394-8965-c7b277b1ab36.html
"In general, the study found, Gmail was more than 50% more likely to mark a Republican email as spam than a Democratic one."
There's a big, fat fucking surprise.
Muh private company is perfectly within its rights to decide what mail you should receive.
FTFY
"Amazon workers vote against unionizing a second Staten Island warehouse"
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/amazon-workers-vote-against-unionizing-a-second-staten-island-warehouse/ar-AAWQNlZ?ocid=uxbndlbing
Unions, outside of the pub-sec, continue to fail.
They need to recount until the proper decision is made.
Considering the education system failed them (and you evidently), this is hardly surprising.
I'm as pro-legal abortion as they come (as you'd know from reading me here), but the line of federal jurisprudence on sex and reproductive matters up to and including (and especially) Roe is just plain wacky. It's a lawyer's dream in terms of being able to pull anything out of one's ass and have it win on appeal.
If there's no constitutional privacy rights then just imagine how much fun we can have outlawing shit. Sex could be outlawed or tou could enslave people to force them to have sex. There'a just no limit. Women are basically slaves now.
Women are basically slaves now.
You tell the most retarded lies, Shrike.
"Women are basically slaves now."
How bigoted of you. Dont you know gender is just a construct after all? There is no difference between "men" and "women"
Therefore, everyone is a slave (and no one is)
Why, without a right to privacy, you could mandate broccoli eating, or wealth taxes, or campaign finance reporting. You could force people to have a license before practicing medicine. You could ban certain drugs and foods. You could mandate vaccines and force businesses to close. Imagine the tyranny that could befall “birthing people” in the future.
Given that all kinds of decisions and actions lead to significant consequences that disrupt care-free living, I guess we are all slaves.
Down with reality!
You waste a lot of time posting dumb shit that makes people laugh at how stupid you are.
Have you considered a new hobby? Basket weaving maybe.
Russian roulette?
Women are basically slaves now.
Why are only women slaves by this possible outcome?
I'm guessing it's a fetish.
Assuming this is true, they are no more "slaves" than they were prior to RvW; that's some steaming pile of lefty shit lying as always.
Federal authority is still delimited by the enumeration of powers. Article I does not authorize Congress to govern sex (or abortion).
If there's no constitutional privacy rights then just imagine how much fun we can have outlawing shit.
Someone appears to not be aware of the Patriot Act legalizing government spying on US citizens.
Sex could be outlawed or tou could enslave people to force them to have sex.
"The Handmaid's Tale" is a work of fiction.
Women are basically slaves now.
Suddenly, gender is no longer a social construct.
Funny thing, I think the Left’s distaste for “breeders” has far more chance of turning the world into the Handmaid’s Tale than overturning RvW.
I mean, why were handmaids even needed in that story? Because the elite women were all sterile.
"Fox's Maria Bartiromo Fed Trump Softball Interview Questions, Texts Reportedly Show"
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/fox-s-maria-bartiromo-fed-trump-softball-interview-questions-texts-reportedly-show/ar-AAWLOl7?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=3e8bda704bbd4e17a7816113066585b1
"Softball" is MSN bullshit, and AFAIK, it is not uncommon to get the questions in advance of an interview.
Now if she had handed over the questions prior to a debate, as some scumbag did for HRC, THAT would be worth a headline and my memory says MSN didn't bother co comment.
How would MSN see whether it's hardball or softball? I can't imagine the view when you're gobbling old Joe's crotch is very good.
Hilarious because Fauci demanded the questions before interviews, as well.
I see with the Google story up top that ENB "forgot" to mention the bigger Google news.
"A remarkable, and apparently damning study disclosed that during the most recent federal election campaign, Google's Gmail sent roughly two-thirds of GOP campaign emails to users' spam inboxes..."
It's not like this paragraph comes from Fox or Brietbart either, but from the lawyers at Reason's own Volokh Conspiracy.
https://reason.com/volokh/2022/05/03/googles-spamgate/
Let's be honest, there is news on Roe. We cant expect her brain to be able to deal with that and much else at the same time.
She can’t even tweet and make sammies at the same time.
The main issue I have with RvW being overturned is that it rests on the 'penumbras and emanations' - the court explicitly recognizing that our rights are not limited and enumerated.
How long after a potential overturn will they start deciding you only have the rights the constitution says you have?
Don't you already?
That may be a point, except that I don't know if the penumbras and emanations ever aimed at anything except abortion. At least I can't think of any other case when it's been used.
One (perhaps wishful thinking) theory about the draft opinion is that it was leaked to cushion the blow of an eventual 15-week ban by showcasing a more drastic alternative outcome.
That would obviously be legislating from the bench, of course, so we're not in favor of that. Roe and Casey were both instances of legislating from the bench. You could pass a law, you could even pass a constitutional amendment. There ARE abortion positions which can get 75% of the population on board if people want to focus on the broad agreements: no late-term abortions, but allowing abortions during the first trimester, or at least up to 8 weeks. The old adage was safe, legal, and rare, and that's something where you can forge a large consensus.
Hmm, Smart People seem to be upset about terrible suffering imposed by pregnancy. How about we outlaw that?
'My body my choice', eh?
Yes, but only if your choice is the right choice.
Prohibition doesn't work.
Sure the usual suspects will say "Abortion is murder! May as well legalize murder! People will do it anyway!"
Fuck you. It's a medical procedure.
Banning abortion will only result in illegal abortions and people not going to the hospital when those illegal abortions go south.
Fuck you. It's a medical procedure.
Well, that's not much of a counterargument. I can kill you using a "medical procedure".
Can't have a rational discussion with someone who equates abortion with murder.
So life begins at birth?
You're complaining about not being able have a rational discussion but you don't even know what your priors are. Or have worked out agreed definitions.
You don't even know that the definitions are at the core of the argument.
Sad
"Fuck you. It's a medical procedure."
I support abortion up to certain limits and don't know or care which asshole that was, but it's typical of the those on mute.
Hey, shitbag! So's euthanasia.
I’ll ask the same question I always ask when this topic comes up: if one is in favor of interfering in a woman’s life to force her to have a child, do you feel any obligation to continue t be involved with the mother and child to ensure that that child has basic support like adequate food, clothing, shelter, education, medical treatment?
"If you're pre-born, you're fine. If you're preschool, you're fucked."
There's thousands and thousands of children's charities, adoption agencies and government agencies created for the exact situation that White Mike frets about.
But look at you two dishonest fuckers pretend that the only alternative to butchering fetuses are hordes of starving street kids.
Your dishonesty would be less galling if it wasn't so retarded.
I’ll ask the same question I always ask when this topic comes up: if one is in favor of interfering in a woman’s life to force her to feed her child, do you feel any obligation to continue t be involved with the mother and child to ensure that that child has basic support like adequate food, clothing, shelter, education, medical treatment?
I'm fine with making it illegal to shoot homeless people for sport. That stance in no way makes me obligated to support every homeless person getting a mansion on the taxpayers dime. In fact we've specifically had this conversation before, and you've just conveniently forgotten it had a simple an obvious answer.
No.
Do people e who oppose murdering the homeless have some sort of greater moral obligation to let the homeless live in their homes?
Sure, that is a totally analogous scenario, with no differences at all, subtle or broad.
We get it. You have absolutely no understanding of the beliefs of the people on the other side of this argument.
be involved with the mother and child to ensure that that child has basic support like adequate food, clothing, shelter, education, medical treatment?
Well, we don't have a choice when the person chooses NOT to abort, so I don't really see this as much of a substantive argument.
But, if you'd like to introduce an argument that a father (person) has a right to abort xim relationship to the child, then we may have something to discuss here.
There are a lot of people out there wanting to adopt. There are waiting lists for babies a mile long. They go to foreign countries because we murder our babies.
So I’d say your point is stupid.
Not to mention all the welfare handouts we give to women and children.
Welfare, or else the baby gets it.
Not necessarily talking about welfare or any government-provided aid. Talking about general ethical obligation once one has interfered in another’s life.
As a gay Black man who is GOPProud I’d like to thank the Trump administration and its excellent Supreme Court picks for recognizing that limited government starts at allowing gun nuts to purchase Uzis and stops at smelly and gross vaginas. Thank you!
Difficult for what now?
Is the document legit? Experts say yes, the document is almost certainly authentic.
This feels like a Russian disinformation campaign does it not? And shouldn't we be concentrating on who leaked the document rather than what it says?
I mean, I understand the point of your joke, but we should also really be getting the person who leaked it. This is a significant breach of trust.
"Women...women...women" I keep hearing that term but I don't know what it means.
that's because youre not a biologist
Look, I’m not a normie like Caitlin Jenner or Milo so don’t judge ok? But having a government run by pilgrims and preachers gets this gay and Black man kind to of horny. It’s so transgressive just like the rest of the GOP. Meow.
Sorry Shrike. Try harder.
"A group of Republican senators has discussed at multiple meetings the possibility of banning abortion at around six weeks," the Post says.
For the past six month, I've predicted many times here at Reason that the GOP could snatch defeat from the jaws of victory in November if the SCOTUS strikes down Roe v Wade.
In sharp contrast to the Puritan theocrats who now control the GOP and who are intent to deny women of their fundamental natural right to control their own vagina, only 10% of Americans support banning all abortions.
I similarly suspect that no more than 15% of Americans would support banning abortions after 6 weeks, just one or two weeks after pregnant women discover their pregnancy, and before many pregnant women can schedule an appointment with their doctor, get tested (for pregnancy, or for genetic or medical problems).
As one who strongly supports free markets and freedom, I'd vote for a woke racist left wing tax and spend Democrat (who supports women's right to access abortion services) than a GOP Puritan theocrat who supports banning all (or most) abortions.
And since black women (90% of whom vote Democrat) now have 60% of abortions in America, banning abortions will increase the number of fatherless and/or unwanted children who will become dependent upon Big Brother welfare programs, increase high school drop out rates and violent crime in black neighborhoods.
Yes but I don't think they care- they're putting plans in place to win by default anyhow. They're gerrymandering and putting in election officials who will overturn any result not favorable to them anyhow.
I'm not sure they give a shit about your vote- they'll find a way around that pesky little nuisance.
“they're putting plans in place to win by default anyhow.”
Imagine saying this un-ironically.
ya they are so good at cheating at elections that Joe Biden found a few hundred thousand votes in the middle of the night, just enough to win.
They are the best at election cheating
So we're kind of back to the early 20th century abortions as eugenics idea? Tell me more about how we need to limit the populations of troublesome ethnics.
Seems like anti abortion extremists are working hard to increase the number of Democrat voters in the future.
I understand why Democrats support open borders (i.e. most illegal aliens will vote Democrat after being given the right to vote).
But it makes zero political sense for GOP activists to aggressively campaign to increase the number of Democrats in future elections.
Maybe because to them it's a moral issue rather than a strategic one?
Politics is religion to one side of this debate.
There is always a "group of republican [insert house] discussing" some kind of horrible thing. That means nothing until they actually try to do it.
The rest of the GOP Senators are not stupid enough to do that in an election year.
What are conservatives thinking? If shrieking green-haired womyn don't want their fetuses, then why in the hell do conservatives want them around?
Unwanted fetuses vote progressive.
Wouldn't expect anything less from reason authoritarians here- you're more than fine with a woman have less privacy and agency over her own body than a corpse.
At least the mask is off- be the fascist fucks you were always destined to be.
someone will always advocate for that other body.
IT’S JUST A CLUMP OF CELLS YOU MISOGYNIST!
you're more than fine with a woman have less privacy and agency over her own
I'm sorry, are you a biologist?
Not a biologist just a surgeon, ahem, a nullification surgeon. I am now offering a buy one get one free nullification surgical procedure. Which gonads do you wish to be removed?
https://www.alignsurgical.com/non-binary/nullification/
waahh waaah everyones a fascist!!!
What do you think that means?
>>But few expected it to entirely overturn ... Roe ... and ... Casey
I've expected it every fucking time it's been on the block including Casey.
It would be some sweet satisfaction to watch an exodus of companies from red states where they outlaw abortion.
With the numbers that support abortion being a choice, I wouldn't be surprised to find it very hard to find workers to go to red state shitholes if this goes. Especially if you go and start banning gay marriage, contraceptives, etc.
With the numbers that support abortion being a choice, I wouldn't be surprised to find it very hard to find workers to go to red state shitholes if this goes. Especially if you go and start banning gay marriage, contraceptives, etc.
God, I'd almost be in favor of a total abortion ban if it meant the exodus of the bugman class and their behavioral sink neuroses from red states. Housing in high-trust red and purple voting areas might actually become affordable again.
It's funny because the SJW Twitter loonies don't realize they're tearing down their own ecosystem. Moving your company's HQ every time a state passes a law a portion of your customers don't like means you either go broke looking for the Goldilocks legislative state or tell your SJW Twittard contingent "Fuck You, we're about making and selling product. Take it up with the legislature, not us."
It's funny because workers have been migrating out of blue abortion utopias and into "red state shitholes" for the past two years. Seems like, "What if I want an abortion?" is not a top consideration when choosing where to live.
The kids are not alright. They are not dating, not marrying, not popping out babies, heck, they arent even doing porn! At this rate, extinction is inevitable.
Abortion is so 1970s
"red state shitholes" lol
massive migration from CA to TX despite everything happening with abortion this year says otherwise
Most states probably won't ban abortion. Shit, the 15 week ban by Mississippi that instigated this is not even that illiberal by world standards.
Regardless of what one thinks of abortion, I would think the libertarian position would be to defer to the states since abortion is only found in the "penumbras and emanations" of the Constitution (ie, nowhere).
I bet most of those protesters live in states that already have laws decriminalizing abortion.
And yet somehow ended up at the Supreme Court first thing the next morning. And yet somehow the White House already had all their talking points ready the next morning, despite previously taking the position they don’t comment on leaked information. One might suspect their was some “collusion” involved, except that would be ridiculous conspiracy theory shit.
ya dude whole thing is a top-down operation.
And yet somehow ended up at the Supreme Court first thing the next morning
They could be locals. DC and the surrounding suburbs are packed to the gills with insane leftists.
And yet somehow the White House already had all their talking points ready the next morning, despite previously taking the position they don’t comment on leaked information
I haven't seen them, but they're probably the same talking points leftists have had for years. And hypocrisy from the Biden regime should come as no surprise.
And Kamala was scheduled to speak at the Emily's List Gala? That's an amazing coincidence.
Yup
We only have the rights the constitution grants us?
I can't wait for Elon's take on this.
Members of Congress have been briefed on UFOs.
Are we all just going to ignore the fact that the federal government has been revealing the truth about UFOs, admitting they are real, admitting they dont know what they are or where they come from, admitting they appear to be intelligently controlled?
We're just gonna argue about abortion and trans and ukraine and ignore this?
What baffles me is the not insubstantial number of normally intelligent military men who are familiar with the subject, claiming that they're demonic and we shouldn't have anything to do with them. And they're British, Dutch and Finnish too. Not just Americans.
Could be a disinformation campaign, but a damn weird one.
I mean, if you've ever *met* officers, 'intelligent' is not a good descriptor of a large segment of them.
We've known since the beginning that ufos are real. No one denies they are real
They're just not aliens.
Everything You Need To Know About the Leaked Supreme Court Draft Opinion
I've always hated this Vox style. It means you can ignore everything I don't cite in support of my position, which, coming from Vox was pretty much everything.
In non-abortion news: This is a bit disturbing.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/02/us/lake-mead-body-barrel-water-level-drought-climate/index.html
That chart of the height of the reservoir over time was interesting. Surprised it was highest in the late 80s. Though, I wish they'd use approximate volume of water. That feels more meaningful to my understanding of things.
Though, corpses is weird. Grim thing there.
They expect to find more too.
I wish Just Say'n was here...
"In either theory, the leaker is presumed to want to change the ultimate opinion with this leak."
Or more likely, it is part of the ongoing fascist takeover of the country.
Were there any headlines today about:
Inflation?
Afghanistan?
Interest rates?
Ukraine?
Crime rates?
"The Border"?
Election integrity?
The votes in Ohio?
The major goal here is to fire up the democrat base and bump up turnout in November.
Roe was a crappy decision, relying on it for decades is now backfiring. Never fear, though, the central government’s economic tendrils will tighten around the funding of any facility that doesn’t continue to provide abortions. All in the name of Women’s Health, of course.
When will this country pull itself out of this mess? Here's to hoping. Thanks for sharing.
Whatever you may think of abortion, the fact remains that Roe was bad law, poorly reasoned, and granted the Federal Government powers it does not have. Joni Ernst's six-week ban is no less unconstitutional than Roe is extraconstitutional. The power to regulate abortion resides in the police power of the individual States.
Drives me crazy when 'news' sources say "here's what you need to know" or "everything you need to know." That means "here's what Big Brother will allow you peasants to know."