Animal Rights

South Korea Considers Banning Dog Meat

Talk of a ban follows declining popularity of dog as a restaurant dish.


South Korea's president is considering a nationwide ban on eating dog meat, the BBC reported this week. Pres. Moon Jae-in, a pet lover and dog owner, says he's contemplating banning the controversial practice because of declining consumption in the country.

The dramatic drop in consumption in South Korea, particularly among younger generations, may mean a ban isn't needed. That said, declining consumption isn't the same as little or no consumption. South Koreans still kill and eat up to 1 million dogs every year, USA Today reported in 2019, including Retrievers, Spaniels, and Saint Bernards.

South Korea is one of many countries with a history of eating dogs. Based on translated documents, Wikipedia notes that butchers, considered the "lowest class of society" in South Korea during a roughly 500-year period ending in the early 1900s, helped combat a "feral dog problem" by turning said dogs into food.

In a 2009 article, Good to Pet and Eat: The Keeping and Consuming of Dogs and Cats in South Korea, Cambridge University Prof. Anthony Podberscek notes that historically dogs were divided in parts of Asia, including Korea, into three groups: "hunting dogs, watchdogs, and food." 

As National Geographic reported during the 2018 Winter Olympics—which took place in Pyeongchang, South Korea—the government attempted to pay off several area restaurants that serve dog meat, asking them to halt the practice during the games. They found no takers. That same report noted that while Asian countries are often singled out for eating dog meat, history shows those countries have plenty of company outside Asia.

"[S]ome Native American groups were eating dogs thousands of years before Columbus landed in the New World," National Geographic reported. More recently, Norwegian polar explorer Roald Amundsen, faced with a choice to starve or eat some of his sled dogs, survived to inform the public he found the dogs' meat to be "delicious." Notably, as of 2014, it was legal to eat dog in 44 U.S. states.

The tide in South Korea, meanwhile, has been turning against eating dogs for decades.

Seoul's most popular dog-meat restaurant closed in 2014, Quartz reported, due to falling demand. "There are no young customers," owner Oh Keum-il said of her reasons for closing the restaurant. Many of those young customers, Quartz noted, would rather own dogs as pets than eat them.

"The South Korean mindset toward dogs began changing in the 1980s and '90s as the nation grew wealthier and Western influence increased," that 2019 report in USA Today explained.

Animal rights groups, some based in Korea, have campaigned against dog meat for years, and have had some successes. Still, it's unclear just how much support there is for a ban. While the BBC cites recent poll numbers showing roughly 7 of every 8 South Koreans have never eaten dog meat, Cambridge Prof. Podberscek found in his 2009 study that most South Koreans opposed banning dog meat. 

The move away from eating dogs and toward raising them as pets could also be a way to further distinguish South Korea's fundamental differences from its authoritarian neighbor to the north. Just last year, reports indicated people in North Korea were being forced to give up pet dogs in order to meet demand at local restaurants.

Years ago, in an appearance on libertarian Bob Zadek's radio program, a caller asked me to explain my position on whether or not eating dogs should be legal. I stammered through a response, noting it was a "third rail" issue and a "libertarian purity test," offering a few ums and hmms and errrrrs, and settling on this: "If I would ever be okay with a law that would bar [eating a food], I would be okay with that."

This time, without hemming and hawing: that's my position. I am okay with that.

This isn't the first food ban I've supported. For example, I've defended the U.S. government's ban on finning sharks because that ban helps to conserve shark populations—sharks are both important to the overall health of the oceans and, in many cases, are threatened or endangered globally—while also conserving the right of people to eat sharks (typically in the form of shark-fin soup). I'm on record opposing anyone's right to eat any endangered species. And I've hypothesized that if some genetically modified crop were to sicken or kill humans—while noting there's zero evidence that has ever happened—the government could step in and ban that crop.

I don't shy away from opposing bans of controversial foods, either. For example, I've advocated for lifting a federal ban on slaughtering horses for food in the United States, and have written many tens of thousands of words, including here, in favor of repealing foolish foie gras bans.

So what, if anything, makes dogs different? I will admit both that emotion plays a key role in my position—chances are I love your dog more than you do—and that emotion is rarely a good reason to ban something, or even to pass a law.

Slate's Will Saletan, in a 2008 column titled "Legalize Dog Meat," pointed out the inconsistencies of supporting a ban on the slaughter of dogs but not, say, pigs, calling it "irrationality compounded by hypocrisy."

My best attempt to rationalize a dog-meat ban is this: While humans domesticated wolves so we could hang out with them and let them protect us (or let us carry them in purses) instead of hunting us—effectively creating a deal between man and animal—cattle, pigs, and other livestock were domesticated so we could eat them.

It's entirely plausible Saletan is right and I'm wrong. But I think we should honor the deal we made. Doggonit.

NEXT: Victims of Rights-Violating California Cops May Finally Get Justice in Court

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  1. “Pres. Moon Jae-in, a pet lover and dog owner, says he’s contemplating banning the controversial practice because of declining consumption in the country.

    “The dramatic drop in consumption in South Korea, particularly among younger generations, may mean a ban isn’t needed.”

    But this could be his last chance for some quality government social signaling!

    1. If he bans eating dogs, those hardest hit will be feeling melancollie.

      1. Noodles without poodles.

        1. General Tso’s Shih Tzu.

          1. Time to Chow down on some puppy poutine and foie paws while you still can. Me, I’ll wait for the lab-grown laborador.

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      2. And only outlaws will eat dogs. And there will be bootleg dogs, rot-gut dogs, “stepped-on” dogs, counterfeit dogs, homemade zip-dogs that explode in your hand, hack-alley dog cook-outs, people catching themselves on fire from freebasing dog, etc, etc., etc.,

      3. It could be ruff on restaurant owners, too.

    2. North Koreans never eat dog food, as the Dear Leader banned it following last January’s cat food insurrection in Pyongyang.

      it is not surprising that Prof. Podberscek notes that” historically dogs were divided in parts of Asia, including Korea, into three groups: “hunting dogs, watchdogs, and food.” , as literally translated, the Chinese characters for ‘Animals ‘ mean ‘Things that Move.”

    3. If he bans eating dogs, those hardest hit will be feeling melancollie.

  2. I love (S.) Korean food.

    (N.) Korean food not so much.

    P.S. if you like cooking, this is my favorite korean food / recipe blog:

    1. North Korean recipe
      1. Find some grass.
      2. Eat it.

    2. You mean North Koreans actually have food?

      1. Kim does. Obviously. That fucker is downright rotund.

        1. After all, wasn’t his Daddy or Grand-Daddy who supposedly invented the Hamburger, according to Juche mythology?

      2. It is kinda the modern successor to the joke about Ethiopian food.

        1. Also surprisingly good, when you can find it?

      3. The concept of air fryer originated in North Korea. They literally fry air and eat it.

  3. ‘Anthony Podberscek notes that historically dogs were divided in parts of Asia, including Korea, into three groups: “hunting dogs, watchdogs, and food.” ‘

    Any similarity to how elites view populist masses is pure coincidence.

    1. Will there be a group for those interested in watching what they eat?

      Who will watch the watchdog-eating watchers?

      1. Cervantes? Don Quixote, The Man de La Mancha? Sancho Panza?

    2. I bet my old fat pug would have tasted good. Nice and marbled…

      1. And rare? 😉

  4. Why would I care if some people still eat dog?
    As long as it isn’t my dog, how does it affect my life?

    1. If past experience is any example, half the forumites (and not the half you would expect to be telling you what to care about) will be along any minute to explain to you why you should throw out the entire libertarian playbook because puppers/doggos

    2. Duh! In the woke century you are not allowed to make anyone sad.

    3. I still don’t understand the ban on horse meat. Not that I would eat it, but it makes non sense to send them to Mexico to be butchered.

      1. Actually I would try it. And take pictures. Just to offend my ex who loves horses.

        1. Not shocked you still dream of trolling your ex. Very grownup.

          1. Talk about me more.

            1. It was a direct response to your exact comment dummy.

              1. It was about me, not what I said. Because you cannot talk about ideas. Only people.

                1. The idea of you eating a horse, taking a picture of it, and sending it to your ex because you’re broken?

                2. No. It was directly about what you said. Were you expecting an “atta boy” for being an asshole to your ex?

                  1. I was thinking someone who isn’t you might have a conversation about why it’s illegal, why it’s so offensive to people, should laws be based upon people being offended, Korea looking to ban dog meat for the same reason… you know, ideas. Things you never talk about.

                    1. I didn’t respond to your post about legality dummy. Do I need to post the response I responded to?

                      Do you understand how commenting systems work?

          2. Ignore the point that reason horse meat is illegal is because of peoples’ feeling and talk about me instead. Please. Don’t talk about the subject. Talk about me.

            1. Fuck off, screetch.

            2. Yes, you did talk about you. And your ex.

            3. sarcasmic – “I would try it. And take pictures. Just to offend my ex”

              everyone – “because you’re a trolling asshole”

              sarcasmic – “talk about meeeee. Please. Don’t talk about the subject. Talk about meeeeee”

              Oh, it’s retarded.

              1. And right on cue, here’s ML to white-knight for anyone on his tribe.

                1. The irony of you running to protect sarcasmic and thats your comment. Lol.

                  1. Chemleft still hasn’t figured out that it’s about his fifty-centing and sarcasmic’s trolling. Not some mythical tribal forces.

                    Because he himself is tribal and has no comprehension of personal responsibility, he can only imagine that other people are motivated by the same forces.

                    1. It’s like they completely ignore whenever y’all disagree with Ken, or each other.

                2. And his comment is about me personally while ignoring what I said. Because, like his buddy JesseAz, he is intellectually incapable of talking about anything but people.

                  1. You brought up being an asshole to your ex lol.

                    God damn. You both have serious delusions.

                    1. I brought up someone being offended by eating horse meat in context of an article about banning the eating of dog meat because it offends people.

                      Talk about not seeing the forest because of those damn trees in the way.

                    2. No, you talked about trolling your ex. Don’t pretend you didn’t, you drunken shitweasel.

                    3. Apparently you want me to post this more.

                      October.2.2021 at 10:05 am
                      Flag Comment Mute User
                      Actually I would try it. And take pictures. Just to offend my ex who loves horses.

                      That post says nothing about legality.

                  2. “And his comment is about me personally while ignoring what I said.”

                    He never ignored what you said, you pathetic attention-whore.
                    You said YOU were going to be a dink to your poor ex (a woman I’ve never met but have unlimited sympathy for). YOU made it about you, nobody else did.

                    I’ve never seen a troll as retarded and pathetic as you, sarcasmic.

                    1. It is sad how freely he lies in a thread with the comment in question. I’m astounded at the fortitude of his dishonesty.

              2. The point was that it’s illegal to eat horse meat because people like my ex would be offended. Which is a really stupid reason.

                Then, right on cue, JesseAz makes a comment that is about me, not about horse meat being illegal because it offends people.

                So when I then say “Talk about meeeee!” I’m being sarcastic.

                My god you’re stupid.

                1. No that wasn’t the point. If they was the point you wouldn’t have talked about taking a picture and sending it to her.

                  You are just straight lying and mad you got called out lol.

                  1. Another post that is all about me. You’re on a roll.

                    Oh, and thanks for telling me what I really meant. You sure know better than I do.

                    1. *sarc talks about himself*
                      *Jesse responds*
                      “OMG your obsessed with me”

                      I think I’m starting to understand why sarcasmic obsesses about other people being teenage girls all the time. That’s where he is mentally.

                    2. Again sarc… the lost i responded to.

                      October.2.2021 at 10:05 am
                      Flag Comment Mute User
                      Actually I would try it. And take pictures. Just to offend my ex who loves horses.

                      Stop lying about what you said. God damn man. No wonder she left you.

          3. Right on cue, here’s Jesse to stir the pot and fling poo.

            1. I didn’t fling shit at all dummy. I responded to his exact comment as he requested yesterday. Notice how you and sarc are up in arms again?

              1. No shithead, you flung shit. Because you are intellectually incapable of having a conversation about ideas. All you can talk about is people.

                1. Lol. Let’s see what you wrote.

                  October.2.2021 at 10:05 am
                  Flag Comment Mute User
                  Actually I would try it. And take pictures. Just to offend my ex who loves horses.

                  Are you seriously delusional?

                  1. You seriously think I would do that? Yeah, or why would you say it, asshole! Um, to make a point about horse meat being illegal because it offends people in context of an article about Korea looking to ban dog meat because it offends people? Nuh uh! I know what you really meant! I know you better than you know you you alcoholic child molester!

                    I think that sums up any more conversation on the subject.

                    1. “you you alcoholic child molester!”

                      To be fair there’s probably over a hundred people here who think that about you. Maybe get a little less general.

                    2. Am inallowed to respond to your question without you fucking crying it is about you?

                      Yes I believe that. You fucking burned peoples steaks for ordering it medium. You post many stories of you being an asshole. I believe what you post as nobody is forcing you to post examples of you being an asshole.

                      Now answer my question.

                      Is that the post I responded to or not? If so, why are you crying like a bitch for me responding directly to your post?

                    3. And by the way. I never called you a child molester lol. Just a shitty parent whose kids key cars. Again. A story you freely brought up.

              2. Jesse, you took sarc’s comment about his ex and turned it into a personal attack against him. That is you stirring the pot and deliberately trolling to provoke a reaction. That is what you do daily. Own up to what you did.

                1. His post attacked his character by itself jeff. I just highlighted it.

                  1. No, Jesse, you did that. You did it intentionally to provoke a reaction. Just fess up to being an asshole for once.

                    1. Jeff, I have to ask. Are you completely retarded? He offered up the comment. I called him an asshole for his proclivities.

                    2. I called him an asshole

                      Yes, that is you stirring the pot trying to provoke a reaction. That is YOU being an asshole.

                    3. Lol. So sending pics of him eating horse to upset her isn’t being an asshole jeff? Again. Are you retarded?

              3. This is exactly what you wanted. You wanted a 50-comment mini-thread where you get to insult and call people names in every one. That is Tulpa-level trolling.

                1. How cute you’re projecting. I’m not the one who denied a post I made for 20 posts trying to claim something else.

            2. Right on cue, here’s Lefty Jeffy to white Knight his tribe mate who wants to send his ex pics of him eating a horse. Cuz that’s normal.

            3. “Right on cue, here’s Jesse to stir the pot and fling poo”

              Pretty sure that your little fair maiden sarcasmic, has already claimed that job here, Sir Jeffy:

              September.10.2021 at 12:14 pm
              I like to stir shit up. So what.

            4. Talking about trolling your ex isn’t flinging poo?

          4. Maybe just marital privilege, but I’ve always considered how someone regards their ex to be very telling about someone. Especially to strangers and/or in front of their own kids. Sort of the “judge someone by how they treat someone who can do them no good” except, at one point, you chose the someone to do good for and to do good for you.

            Sorry dude, I can’t abjectly hate someone just because you made the mistake of marrying them.

            1. Sarc’s a broken man.

            2. That’s not why. But I’m not going to give the trolls more poo to fling at me so I’ll leave it at that.

              1. Again. Your post was 2/3rds trolling your ex.

                How can you so openly lie?

                1. You’re doing good! You haven’t made a single post about any ideas.! They’ve all been about me! Now you’re telling me what I really meant, why I made the post, and calling me a liar for disagreeing with you! Damn you’re awesome!

                  1. Hey retard. Check timestamps below. Are you capable of not lying?

                  2. What idea? You want to eat a horse to troll your ex?

                    A reminder to everyone that no matter how much he pretends to just want honest conversation, sarcasmic is just here to troll.

                    August.12.2021 at 4:45 pm
                    I only show up to watch the clowns duke it out, while tossing in this or that provocation. Bread and circuses. This is a circus.


      2. Canada will butcher your horses too.

        The US isn’t as bad as the UK on “animal rights” but we’re still pretty bad.

        1. I didn’t know that. Interesting. All so my ex wife and people like her won’t be offended.

          1. Have you considered therapy to deal with your issues regarding your ex?

            1. See above. His ex may be a terrible person, he may’ve tormented her into hating him. I’ve never met her, I have evidence of the latter.

              1. Nice. Come up with some more scenarios about how I’m a terrible person. Everyone loves that stuff.

                1. He doesn’t need to come up with any. You openly post them.

                  1. Do you know what context means?

                    1. There is no context. You said you imagined being an asshole to your ex. There is zero context there.

      3. Horse meat ban is easy, the same thing as this dog ban. Feelings and prejudice for human-friendly useful animals.

        At least some libertarians jumping ship on this one admit it.

        People going way out west long ago took dogs, good for emergency food if worse came to worse.

        1. Personnally, I would want the dog as a means of sniffing out and fetching other animals to eat, as well as serving as an off-grid intruder alarm on the prarie.

          And eating horses on the prarie would be tantamount to eating a Harley-Davidson.

          Even separate from the “There Oughtta Be A Law” question, I just think eating these particular animals is just unresourceful and silly.

    4. Dog meat is super gamey and disgusting (yes I have eaten dog meat). They still shouldn’t ban it for 2 reasons.
      1. It is not the Gov Job to tell people what to eat
      2. It would really cut in on the number of Korean jokes I know

    5. Do you have a Kitty named Genovese?

  5. The dramatic drop in consumption in South Korea, particularly among younger generations, may mean a ban isn’t needed.

    Spoken like true Reason libertarian.

    The drop in heroin consumption in the US, particularly among the younger generations, may mean a ban isn’t needed.

    The drop in COVID infections in the US, particularly among the younger generations, may mean a mandatory injections aren’t needed.

    The drop in police shootings in the US, particularly among the younger generations, may mean a ban isn’t needed.

    Robby has trained you well.

  6. More signs of inflation… Biden boosted SNAP outlays by 25% for those choosing not to work. How generous of him..

    1. Trying to juice his poll numbers?

    2. Which is in line with the increase I’ve seen in my grocery bill. Must be nice.

    3. from your link:

      The increase is projected to cost an additional $20 billion per year but it doesn’t have to be approved by Congress. A farm law passed in 2018 by the then-Republican led Congress and signed by former President Donald Trump already directed the department to reassess the Thrifty Food Plan by 2022 and every five years thereafter.

      You can thank Donnie-Boy for yet another Big Gov move.

      (Biden is no better. They both SUCK)

      1. China is proof that a government run, centrally planned economy, is better than capitalism. Think about it. If American companies can’t compete without tariffs and [farm] subsidies, as the last administration proved, China’s economic system must be better than what we have. We should emulate them. More government owned businesses. More central planning. (by the way, to you literal morons out there you know who you are, that’s sarcasm)

        1. Yeah I know.

          Trump bypasses a future Congress on this stupid ‘Thrifty Food’ plan proves what a GREAT LIBERTARIAN he is!

          Biden does something similar and he is an overreaching executive.

          You and I say “They both suck” and we are called BIDEN supporters.

          The fucking hypocrisy and love of Big Gov by Trump by Jesse, Ken, ML and all the other Trump Cult members is nauseating.

          1. Well, in Mother’s Lament’s case it’s just really weird because he isn’t even an American. Why the heck does he care so much?

            1. Nothing the USA does affects Canada in any way. Why worry?

            2. I’ve already told this dishonest weasel why, many, many times. He’s pretending not to remember to try and score some weird rhetorical point off of my nationality.

              1. Family. My brother and sister both married Americans and live in Ohio and Pennsylvania respectively. I now have seven nieces and nephews who are American by birth and I love very much. Not only that, but my mother’s family immigrated to New York in the Twenties. My grandparents didn’t care for it and moved back to France after WW2, but the rest of their relatives remained and I have innumerable cousins and second cousins in the US who’ve kept in touch.
              I care and worry about these people.

              2. The mouse in bed with the elephant.
              When Justin’s dad Pierre was PM, he used this phrase in a speech in 1969 when he said, speaking of the U.S., that Canada’s relationship with the United States is like that of “a mouse in bed with an elephant…no matter how friendly the beast…one is affected by every twitch and grunt.
              America is Canada ten years in the future. Every shitty idea that emanates from the left coasts gradually trickles up and infects our clerisy and bureaucracy. Our economy is so integrated into the US’s, that every trade deal you reach with China or Mozambique, affects us as much as you.

              America’s future is my future too. It’s the future of my family, my friends and of my country that it’s socially, politically and economically tied to.

              Of course White Mike knows all this. I post it every time he pretends not to know.
              And if he wasn’t so retarded he’d realize that the answers were pretty obvious even if I didn’t tell him.

              1. Intelligent contributions of people from all over the world are entirely welcome in the libertarian conversation, and it doesn’t surprise me if progressive trolls are targeting you–for that reason. Progressives truly are America’s most horrible people. Anybody who thinks your contributions aren’t welcome because you aren’t American is failing the ad hominem fallacy just for starters. In addition to being horrible, they’re typically stupid like that, too. If they could think for themselves, they probably wouldn’t be progressives.

                1. LOL, it would be different if Mother’s actually contributed. All he does is the Trump Mean Girls routine.

                  1. That’s rich, coming from a sealioning troll.

                    Here’s White Mike stating that his real objectives are to troll Ken, then troll anyone who thinks the cops shooting Babbit wasn’t a social good and finally to troll Tulpa. Finally, he asks Reason’s biggest shitposter to give him a hand.

                    Mike pretends he’s just trying to be reasonable, but by his own admission he’s nothing more than a troll:

                    Mike Laursen
                    September.18.2021 at 11:38 am
                    SQRLSY, can you cover for me today? In a typical day, I usually:
                    – post a comment or two pointing out logical flaws, contradictions and partisanship in Ken’s essays, which he regards as examples of flawless logical thinking
                    – post a comment or two pointing out that Ashli Babbitt was not a saint and the January 6th MAGA rioters were violent
                    – post one “Fuck Tulpa!” comment
                    – post a comment or two that actually seriously discuss a topic. Everyone once in a while I’m lucky and someone responds in serious conversation, but most of the time I just get met with a bunch of grayed-out insults from JesseAz and the other Trump Mean Girls.


                    Great contributions Mike, shitposting, trolling and harassing Ken.

                    1. Ken sometimes has long posts, but I always read them.

                      Sometimes I agree, sometimes I disagree, but they are almost always well thought out arguments, so it’s worth it for me, because I can actually learn something either way.

          2. You and I say “They both suck” and we are called BIDEN supporters.

            I don’t call you a “BIDEN supporter”. I call you a paid Democratic Party shill.

            You’re paid by some Open-Society-Foundations-sponsored PAC to post DNC-favoring agitprop here and I imagine several other places too, Shrike.

            You work off of talking-point pdf’s and run a gaggle of shitposting sockpuppets including Queen Anathema, American Socia1ist and probably KillAllRednecks.

            You’re far, far worse than just some Biden supporter.

    4. “More signs of inflation… Biden boosted SNAP outlays by 25% for those choosing not to work. How generous of him..”

      That’s not because of inflation.

      That’s because Biden cares about people.

      Inflation is a conspiracy theory. Only insurrectionists believe in it. Don’t you watch the news?

      1. It is because of a Trump/GOP law, you moron.

        But I know you have me on ignore so you don’t have to face facts.

        1. You said there was no inflation.

          1. I said inflation would be within or close to the Fed’s goal of 2%.

            A little inflation is good.

            1. the inflation rate in August went up to 4.3%, the highest since 1991. That’s more than double 2% Weigel, you stupid fuckin’ dickbag.

              1. one quarter -= supply chain shock.

                Can’t get semiconductors for cars and auto prices rise? Not inflation.

                1. It’s not just one quarter. Damn near almost every word that comes of your mouth is a lie.

                  1. They’re not very smart. That’s what it boils down to. They regurgitate the shit they read, but they have no idea what it means. I’ve never seen Shrike get anything right. He can’t get it right on a dare.

                2. You are truly not paying attention, diarrhea. But the butt love for senile old Joe, sociopath Kommie, and his redhaired retarded girl must be enticing for you.

        2. turd lies. It’s what turd does. turd has heard about this thing called ‘truth’, but has never encountered it.
          turd is a pathological liar, too abysmally stupid to understand that he is so and also too stupid to recognize that most everyone here knows he is.
          turd lies; it’s what turd does

    5. Most people don’t even know that America actually has a smaller nonfarm civilian workforce today than we had in 2000. Not just in terms of percentage of the population, but in raw absolute size! We have eight million jobs employers are struggling to fill and 11 million excess unemployed people who seem to not want to work. Manchin pointed this out recently, correctly said that it’s nuts, and that he’s not going to support the continuation of this insanity, and good for him.

    6. Vote for Joe and he’ll put you in chains. Gold ones.

      1. More like paper chains made by Janet Yeloen, much like you’d see at a kid’s birthday party or a senior’s birthday party if you’re trying to jog their memory.

  7. ‘I’m throwing in the shoes’: David Lee Roth, 66, is to RETIRE from rock and roll after 50 year career and disbandment of Van Halen

    About time, dude. You’re too old to be gyrating on stage. It’s downright embarrassing.

    1. Van Hagar was better anyway.

      *ducks and runs away*

      1. Figures you like Sammy better. You know, because of the tequila.

    2. Looking at you, Mick Jagger.

      1. Mick Jagger made a deal with God or Satan. Change my mind.

    3. And the work force diminishes even more.

      1. Actually, not. David Lee Roth has been a licensed EMT for a while now, and he says he’s going to do it full time:

          1. “Ackchyually” is how the meme is “ackchyually” spelled.

        1. Remember when Erik Estrada from CHIPS decided to become a cop in real life?

          1. And he plugged that horrible brand of turkey, so bad I suppressed the memory of it’s name…

  8. The Beatles nearly SACKED George Harrison and lined up Eric Clapton to replace him, unearthed recordings from January 1969 reveal

    It’s no coincidence that the best guitar solo on any Beatles song was done by Clapton.

    1. And the second and third best guitar solos were played by McCartney.

      Still I love Harrison’s slide guitar. And he turned into a pretty good pop songwriter, some of his best given away to Ringo.

      1. Harrison had no imagination for solos. All he did was rework the vocal melody.

        1. At least true for some of them. He also gets points from me for backing Month Python, and doing this:

    2. Go listen to “Get Back” from the rooftop concert. Lennon kills it.

  9. The cultural curiosity, here, isn’t that Koreans eat dogs. It’s that affluent people in the west have integrated dogs into their lives as family members–which is what makes eating dogs seem like cannibalism to us.

    When I lived down in the Yucatan peninsula of Mexico, one of the two questions I was asked most frequently about life in the United States was whether it was true that people in the United States sleep with their dogs.

    I’d try to explain that dogs in the U.S. aren’t like the street dogs all over Mexico (they don’t have animal control), that we bathe them regularly, make sure they don’t have fleas and ticks, etc. I’d try to explain that I don’t let my dog in bed or on the furniture . . .

    In the end, the answer had to be “yes”, and they thought it was both disgusting and hilarious.

    So, even in other parts of the west, dogs don’t necessarily become family members like they do in the USA. That may be changing in Mexico, and to the extent it does, it’s probably a function of affluence and the influence of American culture.

    1. Now, can someone explain why so many South Korean men, apparently, wear makeup?

      1. “Fashion”. Same reason some portion of American black men look like they’re incapable of properly operating a pair of trousers. Or some portion of American white men wear a man-bun.

      2. To attract other SK men. Part of the soy boy revolution.

        1. Y9u do know Alex Jones’ supplements also have soy, right? Also, he’s younger than me and looks much older. I pass on whatever he’s selling and on conspiracy rantings. They can’t do too much good for keeping youthful.

          1. Sorry, I’m not seeing the connection between Alex Jones’ soy supplements and Chumby throwing shade on makeup wearing men.
            Is Chumby a big Jones fan?

            1. Not that I know of but there are a lot of strawmen tossed around here so maybe others know better than I.

              1. Rest assured, I wasn’t making any accusation regarding you supporting Alex Jones, simply alluding to the source of the soy boy meme.

                (At least the source I thought it was. Subsequent research reveals it was Alt-Rightist James Alsop who claims he invented the soy boy meme. Nevertheless, Watson on Jones’ program was where I heard it propagated first.)

                See there? The cognitive dissonance of Alex Jones and COBRA is even affecting me….Must pull back with the Kung-Fu Grip!…

            2. Chumby mentioned the soy boy meme, which originated with Paul Joseph Watson, who IIRC is a regular feature for the Alex Jones show InfoWars.

          2. Are you suggesting Alex Jones is behind the soy boy revolution?

            1. (Assumes G.I. Joe COBRA voice) “Yeeeeaass! Alex Jones is part of COBRA’s scheme to demasculinate men in the most sinister way ever, not through diet..but by destroying their ability to think with cognitive dissonance! MU-WAHAHAHAHA!”

          3. I only know of Alex Jones due to my work debunking 9/11 conspiracy theories. He’s an idiot, and even 15-20 years ago looked like he was a lot older than he should.

            I wouldn’t buy anything he sells, certainly not supplements.

      3. Same thing is happening here Ken. Go into a makeup store abd you will see male employees in make up.

        Alex Rodriguez has a makeup line for men after all.

          1. “Gay Porn Star Has Makeup Line” doesn’t seem that shocking to me.

            1. Maybe you know something about A Rod that I don’t know?

              I know he hit 57 home runs in 2002.

              1. His nickname that other players gave him is bitch tits

              2. “A Rod” definitely sounds like the name of a gay porn actor to me… Even “Mike Hawk” is more subtle than that.

                Plus, I mean, makeup line.

          2. I don’t think they had male make-up back then…’cept maybe the Romans…

    2. Chihuahuas were bred as a meat animal that could forage for itself, but wouldn’t be an actual problem when it came time to slaughter them. Actually have to give the Koreans some props here, Saint Bernards are a lot more intimidating than Chihuahuas.

      1. It’s probably a function of the meat production to food consumption ratio. St. Bernards eat a lot.

        Funny story about a Chihuahua. I know a guy who had a girlfriend with with a really eccentric mother. He was a programmer for a bank, and his girlfriend’s mother was like a new age, chatty, disaster. Anyway, she decided to take her daughter on a cruise, and his girlfriend needed him to stay at her mother’s house and take care of the animals, watch the place, bring in the mail, etc.

        He goes to this woman’s house, and there’s a three page type written instruction manual about how to take care of her place. This guy is the most rigidly rational person I know, and she had him cleaning her collection of power crystals and clearing their energy in a step by step process, making the Chihuahua’s food from scratch in a ten step process, etc., etc.

        He told his girlfriend beforehand that he might eat the dog himself, as much as he liked Chihuahuas. These ridiculous duties were driving him nuts. For the last job on the list of instructions, he was supposed to take the dog out into the fenced backyard to do its business, but the crazy instructions said he was supposed to keep the dog on leash so that a hawk can’t fly off with the dog. Huh?!

        He’d had it. There was no way he was doing that. He’d had a dog when he was a kid, and it played in the backyard by itself for years, no problem. He was not about to stand there, in the middle of a fenced backyard with a chihuahua on a sequined leash, like an idiot, waiting for it do its business. So, he thought, I’ll just sit here on the back porch and watch the dog to make sure nothing happens.

        Faster than he could get up from his chair, a gigantic hawk swooped down out of nowhere, scooped up the Chihuahua, and flew off with it into the sky. He rushed out into the middle of the lawn, and looked up into the sky to try and see which way the hawk had gone, when he realized the phone was ringing. It was his girlfriend’s mother, and she wanted to know how things were going.

        “Can I talk to your daughter?”, he said.

        1. I guess she should have asked for less retarded stuff in order to distinguish it from the stuff that was an actual concern. I live in coyote country, so I’m well aware that pets below a certain size need to be kept indoors, but I can totally see how a person who wasn’t used to that might consider such a request to be superfluous, especially as part of an instruction set about cleaning healing crystals.

          1. Unless the leash was 5 ft. long, I’m dubious of the hawk’s “That dog’s leashed, I can’t eat it.” reasoning skills.

            1. I think the idea was supposed to be that the hawk might get at it, but it couldn’t carry the dog away if he was holding onto the other end of the leash.

            2. It’s less “that dog is leashed” than “there’s something really big next to my notional prey”, I suspect.

              1. I’ve seen hawks sit at the top of telephone poles and snatch animals off the side of the highway. I’ve seen them snatch fish out of the water from 50 ft. away. As I said, unless the leash was 5-10 ft. long and/or the yard is acres and acres and they just let the dog roam to the point where they wouldn’t even have been able to prevent a racoon from killing it, I’m unconviced that the dog wasn’t at least a pin cushion, if not a meal, even with the leash.

                1. I have to admit that I’ve never had a dog, so it’s not like I have a wide range if experience with leash lengths. Is a leash that’s only 10 feet long a rare thing? That seems about like what I’ve seen other people using when walking their dogs in town.

                  I don’t think that a leash would be effective at keeping the dog alive by pulling it back from the grasp of a hawk. I *have* had friends who were into falconry, and those talons are vicious. Plus, a Chihuahua falling from whatever height it got to would have a rough time of things. The only reason I can see it working at all would be by keeping the tiny little thing within about 10 feet, yeah, and thus encouraging hawks to seek less well monitored prey. But that’s admittedly pretty much a wild assed guess. It’s entirely possible the mom was mistaken about how effective leashing would be.

                2. Look . . . um . . . this lady was into clearing the energy from power crystals. The actual efficacy of leashes against hawks is beside the point–if the leash wouldn’t have worked as advertised, that just makes it funnier. The funniest part of the story may have been when they didn’t want to believe him about what happened to the dog. If the dog got loose, and you don’t want to bother going around the neighborhood, just say so–don’t make up a story about a hawk because you’re too cool to go door to door asking about the dog!

                  His defense was, how can you suggest I’d make it up–when the warning about the hawks was right there in your instructions?! Hawks stealing chihuahuas is apparently a real thing in that area. But he didn’t know that. That’s the ironic/hilarious part: How do you tell people the truth about what happened with the hawk, when the whole warning seemed stupid and ridiculous, even to you, less than a minute ago? This guy is among the most honest people I know, and if he’d let the dog out and didn’t care enough to go look for it, he’d have told them that.

                  There was this girl I worked with at a hospital, and one day her mom asked her to mail a letter for her on the way to work. She asked her mom why she didn’t just drop it in the post office’s mailbox at the corner–like 50 feet from the front door of their house. Her mom tells her that she doesn’t want to put it in the post office’s mail box because the letter is really important, and she’s afraid if she puts in the mailbox, someone will set the mailbox on fire.

                  She didn’t feel like going down the rabbit hole with her mom about that, so she took the letter. But while she was walking to her car to leave for work, she thought to herself, “This is stupid”, so she stuck the letter in the post office mailbox and forgot about it. At least she forgot about it until she got home, and she saw that the post office mailbox had been burned to a crisp! She walks in and her mom says, “It’s a really good thing I had you mail that letter at the post office because those crazy kids burned the mailbox just like they did the other two down the street last week!

                3. I saw a Cooper’s Hawk get a dove that was sitting in a row of other doves on my deck rail. It was like a missile hit it. One second there are six doves sitting there. The next second there are 5 doves and a cloud of feathers.

        2. That was a great story! Seriously.

      2. “Chihuahuas were bred as a meat animal”

        Ugh. Couldn’t they have bred them to have a little more fat. They probably even taste nervous and yippy.

        1. The Taco Bell chihuahua may have been in the chalupa. Yo no quiero Taco Bell.

    3. It is disgusting. I won’t even consider dating a woman who lets her dog on the bed and/or takes along in the car. Fucking dog stink everywhere. Gross.

      1. I don’t think you can afford to be so picky, screetch.

        1. Hey now. Stop making it about him even though his comment was about him!

    4. Even more curious is that affluent people follow their pooches around picking up the dog shit.

    5. Now do France and horses.

  10. “This time, without hemming and hawing: that’s my position. I am okay with [a law that would bar [eating a food]].”

    We appreciate you letting us know that you fit in perfectly with this formerly libertarian magazine. Always good to find out ahead of time when people are willing to compromise principle because they find something that doesn’t actually harm anyone else merely icky.

    1. “It’s entirely plausible Saletan is right and I’m wrong. But I think we should honor the deal we made. Doggonit.”

      “The deal”, as it were, is that we made wolves our bitch. See also: Chihuahuas.

    2. “this formerly libertarian magazine”

      Do yourself a favor, then, and stop wasting your time here.

      1. But bitching is so satisfying!

        1. How come you didn’t ask Mike to stop talking about him?

          1. I presume Lauren said something retarded?

            I’m guessing its ass gets really chapped that whatever undoubtedly supremely witty comment it made is just a small grey box as far as I can tell.

            Keep screaming into the void, Lauren. Perhaps you’ll convince the spam bots that you’re worth listening to.

            1. Don’t think it needs to be a presumption at this point.

            2. Don’t mind if I do.

        2. Especially if you can get a whole clique of fellow whiners to meet you everyday online and whine together.

          1. Not only that, but you can fling poo who says anything libertarian that is critical of the right, because anything critical of the right is leftist.

            1. Projection is strong with you today.

              1. Early in the month with an EBT card recharge.

          2. The fact that you say this without any self realization of what you do, is fucking hilarious.

        3. Which hills are worth dying on and which ones are worth letting the enemy take and antagonizing from the surrounding territory? Who decides?

      2. Fuck off asshole nazi mike.

  11. Some folks enjoy eating dog so much that whenever it is served, they wolf it down.

    1. Are you trying to make people howl with laughter?
      Because if that’s your intent, you might want to paws for a moment.

    2. Then they post their review on Yelp.

  12. OT: just drove by a flu shot clinic and there were two armed guards at the entrance to the parking lot.

    1. Were they going to shoot the flu?

        1. Not sure. It was surreal.

          1. Wild ass guess: A pro-vax extremist false flagging as an anti-vax extremist was hoaxing a threat against the clinic.

            1. It was off-duty LEOs. A threat would likely have involved on-duty there. This is the safest state in the union and a safer area in the state.

    2. I just saw a Mercedes with Hawai’i plates.

      In Missouri.

      1. The Maui Invitational basketball tournament is going to be played in Las Vegas, because lockdown mania. Hawaii (and New Zealand and Australia) seem intent on destroying their tourist business.

  13. This will probably be the only thread today, and I need to the get the following out of my system.

    “Even as Mr. Biden endorsed progressives’ push to hold up a vote on the infrastructure bill, however, he acknowledged in a closed-door meeting with House Democrats on Friday that the price tag of the social-policy and climate bill would need to drop substantially below $3.5 trillion to closer to roughly $2 trillion, according to lawmakers and aides.”


    My read on this:

    1) The reason Biden and the Pelosi are holding up the vote on the infrastructure bill is because if it passes before the budget reconciliation bill, then the moderate Democrats will withhold their votes from the reconciliation bill–the reconciliation bill won’t pass.

    2) The reason Biden is telling the progressives that they need to cut the $3.5 trillion budget reconciliation bill down to $2 trillion is probably because that’s Manchin’s new number. Manchin may have come up from saying he wouldn’t support anything over $1.5 trillion to saying he would accept $2 trillion. That’s the most reasonable and most probable explanation for Biden doing this.

    3) If I had to bet the farm on whether Bernie Sanders and the Congressional Progressive Caucus will support cutting $1.5 trillion off of the $3.5 trillion budget reconciliation bill (which is nothing but Green New Deal spending, taxes, and socialist entitlement programs), my bet would be against them accepting that.

    Conclusion: The whole thing collapsing is too much to hope for, but right now, Biden is screwing over almost everybody in his own party at the same time. Biden is angering the moderate Democrats in the House (union interests) by refusing to hold a vote on the infrastructure bill until they agree to support the budget reconciliation bill, and Biden is enraging the Congressional Progressive Caucus by telling them they need to cut $1.5 trillion off of their dream bill to institute socialism and the Green New Deal.

    I won’t be surprised if Biden and the Democrats find a way through this to pass both bills, but it’s hard to see how Biden’s tactics of turning them against each other and wedging them all deeper into the flustercluck is the way to get them all (every single one) to stand up, hold hands, and walk across the finish line together.

    If I were Biden, and the moderates needed to see the infrastructure bill fail before they’d vote on the reconciliation bill, I’d have held a vote on the infrastructure bill and let it fail. He could say they had their vote, and then put the reconciliation bill up for a vote. I think his leadership here is incompetent (from a Democrat perspective), which seems to be a persistent theme with this administration.

    1. He is nothing more than a brain dead old man well past his mediocre prime.
      Fuck Joe Xiden

    2. They should have voted on the infrastructure bill on Thursday and told the Progressives to take a hike. None of the Proglodyte districts are at risk of going to the Repubs next year, but all of the moderate districts are.

      If not even one member of the other party signs up to vote for your bill, maybe that’s a sign that it’s not a good idea for the country, or at least politically for your own party.

  14. “Outside of a dog a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog it’s too dark to read”

    G Marx

    1. “So the capitalists are now exploiting dogs as their own personal libraries”

      K Marx

      1. ” ”

        H Marx

        1. *Honk!-Honk!*

      2. They won’t stay still long enough for the Capitalists to read inside rhem. Why else are they called “Running Dog Capitalists?”

      3. In Glorious Soviet Union, all dogs are the lead dog!
        And the Party Members are the fat guy driving the sled.

  15. A former coworker of mine, a Marine, spent some time in Asia. He said the street food was really good. Just don’t ask what’s in it. Basically he endorsed dog meat without saying the words.

    1. Thanks to my Chinese MiL I now know that the feet are the tastiest part of the chicken, the brains are the tastiest part of a crab, and the cheeks are the tastiest part of a fish. And she’s not wrong about it.

      1. I ordered chicken feet once by mistake in a Chinese restaurant (where the menu was in Chinese and the staff didn’t speak any English). I wondered why the waitress was smiling at me….

    2. Cats taste better!
      Cat in the Kettle at the Peking Moon (parody)

      1. I’ve been watching “Future Man” on Vudu. Fucking stupid hilarious show. Totally recommend it. Anyway, one of the characters likes to eat cat. Because it’s better than rat.

        1. Future Man is Alf?

        2. Oh, wait, you said “hilarious”. That’s not Alf.

  16. Joe Manchin is my new goddamn political hero after telling the lowlife scum in the media and the entire world that he’s not a liberal and never has been. I only wish there was some way he could take control of this once-great magazine!

    “I’m a liberal.”
    -Matt “Park Slope Welchie Boy” Welch

    “I’ve never been a liberal in any way, shape, or form.”
    -Joe Manchin

    P.S.: Enjoy your favorite teams’ games today, and fuck Joe Biden.

    1. It is more than obvious that you conservatives hate classic liberals like FA Hayek.

      But he didn’t care for you either.

      1. “The Dotard will join his convict team soon.”

        – Sarah Palin’s Buttplug 2, May 23, 2021

        It’s early October. Any updates on this?

        1. Glad to acksed!

          Trump’s Business May Go On Trial On Tax Charges Just Before The 2022 Elections

          The judge hearing the tax fraud case against former President Donald Trump’s family business and its longtime chief financial officer, Allen Weisselberg, in New York City has set a schedule with a potential court trial starting in late August or early September 2022, just months before the midterm elections.

          That timing, as well as a potential conviction against his family business, could cast a pall over any efforts by Trump to drum up support for Republican candidates. And with multiple investigations still underway, the legal cloud hanging over Trump’s world may be getting larger, lawyers on Weisselberg’s defense team suggested during a court hearing on Monday.

          “We have strong reason to believe there could be other indictments coming,” said Bryan Skarlatos, one of Weisselberg’s attorneys.

          The AG of Georgia and the rape trial may get to him earlier!

          1. Honestly I would have preferred to send him to prison for his most severe crimes — colluding with Putin to “win” a hacked election, putting kids in cages, ordering a full-scale war with China that only Milley’s brilliant maneuvering could stop.

            But I guess I’ll settle for the tax stuff.


            1. You forgot how he monstrously slandered Rosie O’Donnell as soon as he was inaugurated?

              1. Slander suits are good again since it harmed Alex Jones. Ask Jeff and sarc.

              2. And went off on a weird, extremely petty diatribe against Penn and Teller’s Broadway show while he is as still just a candidate.

      2. Sorry Dipshit Dave Weigel, but you, AOC, Bernie Sanders, and all the rest of you far left scumbags aren’t getting your ginormous transformative $3.5 trillion welfare bill for one very simple reason. To quote from Manuel Lin-Miranda’s smash hit Broadway music “Hamilton”, you don’t have the votes!

        If you feel like you might need to cry, go ahead, I promise I won’t judge you. OK, maybe I will just a little bit.

        1. Why do you think Hayek doesn’t like you conservatives?

          (don’t try to change the topic again Mikey)

          1. You don’t have the votes
            You don’t have the votes
            (A ha-ha-ha-ha)

          2. You’re gonna need congressional approval and
            You don’t have the votes
            Such a blunder!
            Sometimes it makes me wonder
            Why I even bring the thunder

    2. The thing to understand here is that the democrats original wish was to spend 4 trillion. Manchin joined the sellout gop and compromised with 1.7T in spending. Liberals countered woth 1.7T plus 3.5T. Now Manchin is asking for 1.7T plus 1.5T, meaning basically democrats get 75% of their original ask.

      Amazing how people aren’t realizing the game playing here.

    3. “Joe Manchin is my new goddamn political hero”

      He’s on the side of the AFL-CIO in their struggle against the fanatical progressives–to get the infrastructure bill passed. It’s like George Orwell railing against communism. Orwell was a socialist. He was trying to save socialism from communism. When you’re railing against communism like only someone who’s been betrayed by it can, it makes you seem heroic, and I think that’s where we are with Manchin. He seems like a hero for railing against the progressives, who are the new communists. But Manchin might make us all work for the AFL-CIO if he could.

      And ultimately, it’s not about Manchin personally. It’s that the Green New Deal and the new entitlement spending in the $3.5 trillion budget reconciliation bill are likely to hurt his political future. Ultimately, we shouldn’t be thanking Manchin for this. We should be thanking the good people of West Virginia for scaring Manchin so thoroughly, that he’ll reflect their interests–out of fear. I have no faith in politicians, but I believe in the forces that drive them.

      The man who said, “Segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever!” changed his mind, shortly after he said that, and it wasn’t because of his heroic ability to overcome his own prejudices with reason and compassion. It’s because he put his finger in the air and saw which way the winds of public opinion were blowing. When being a segregationist became a losing proposition, he stopped being one.

      That’s where we are with Manchin and McConnell and every other politician. Politicians ultimately have no principles, and it’s unnecessary to have them. The voters need to have principles and be ready to punish those who violate them. Politicians aren’t to blame for any of our problems, and they don’t deserve the credit for any of the solutions. Our problems our ours to solve, and if we fail to hold politicians responsible when they cause problems, it’s our fault.

      The people of West Virginia are part of the solution here, and IF IF IF this all blows up, we’ll owe them a great debt of gratitude.

      1. You’re right of course, but I’ll still give Mancin credit if he saves us all 2 trillion bucks by standing up to his party. It’s very easy for a politician to cave, when the party starts throwing pork his way to buy him off. Sinema too.

      2. Fair enough, although if you read Orwell’s definition of socialism, it’s not really socialism. It’s some sort of kumbaya voluntaryism, with people being nice to each other (and not acting haughty).

    4. The Daily Mail had a picture of Manchin telling the lefties he is ready to negotiate in good faith, as long as it is on his terms. From his $700K yacht. It was hilarious.

  17. What up Peanuts?

    WTF happened to BitCoin? Up nearly $5000 after China bans it and the US says will begin regulation (on stables).

    I suspect a little regulation is a federal endorsement to buyers.

    Gold is still at $1750.


    1. Banning is form of regulation I guess.

    2. Gasoline up 100% in past year. No inflation whatsoever. Go cherry pick some data point from 15.275 years ago to prove your strawman.

  18. Mutt-on chops

    Dalmatian Sensation

    Ground Round of Hound

    Ground Fennel plus a Treat from the Kennel

    Baked Alaskan Sled Dogs

    1. Chihuahua Ha Ha
      Skillet-full of Pitt Bull

      1. Labradoodle snickerdoodle
        Everything b(e)agle with cream cheese
        Chicken a la Rex
        Pug in a blanket

          1. Dachshund Weenie-Dog Wieners

    2. Snips, snails and puppy dog tails.

  19. Anniversaries are the perfect time to remember why we are there. Remember why we keep trying, why we care so much and why we want to keep doing it. It’s finding your reflection in the eyes of the person you love and realizing the smile in your face.
    It is a moment to look back on time and see the road traveled with all the willingness to keep walking that same stretch, to keep walking by their side.

  20. For you libertarians:

    Katherine Mangu-Ward was on Real Time with Bill Maher last night – she did very well – especially since the only other panelist was the insufferable prick Matt Tiabbi.

    1. OMG

      Taibbi is just awful. Can you believe he actually thinks the mainstream media’s coverage of #TrumpRussia was an embarrassing failure?

      It’s like, helloooooooooooo? The Mueller Report literally proved what journalists like Rachel Maddow had been saying all along.

      1. Tiabbi is a Russian national and on the Putin payroll. Of course he is going to give the RT perspective.

        1. turd lies; it’s what turd does. If turd ever doesn’t lie, it’s purely accidental. turd lies where the truth would serve; problem is, he’s too stupid to recognize the truth.
          turd is a pathological liar.
          turd lies. It’s what turd does.

          1. Get back to your hood, Sevo.

            1. turd is incapable of recognizing the truth. turd lies; it’s what turd does. turd is a pathological liar.

            2. To paraphrase Sevo; you’re a liar. It’s what your paid to do. If you ever don’t lie, it’s purely accidental.

        2. Tiabbi is a Russian national and on the Putin payroll.

          Oh, do you have a source for that accusation, you mendacious cunt? Because I believe that you just invented it.
          I’m betting you hate Tiabbi because he’s an apostate. A heretic to your beloved Uncle George’s plans.

  21. Stephanie Grisham describes the Trump White House as ‘a clown car on fire running at full speed into a warehouse full of fireworks’

    Other choice descriptors:

    “I can give you endless metaphors to describe the Trump White House from a press person’s perspective – living in a house that was always on fire or in an insane asylum where you couldn’t tell the difference between the patients and the attendants or on a roller coaster that never stopped – but trust me, it was a hot mess 24/7,”

    “Working as Trump’s spokesperson was like sitting in a beautiful office while a sprinkler system pours water down on you every second and ruins everything on your desk,”

    Sure, this is the guy we need 4 more years of.

    1. I have mixed feelings about tell-all’s, especially from a p.r. person. It seems really unprofessional to kiss and tell, but the stories are salacious and I can’t look away.

    2. The few good people Trump appointed saw what a fucking looney bin the White house was and got out fast.

      (Tillerson, Koch, Scaramuchi)

      1. Not to mention Trump had a habit of firing people and bad mouthing them, which is not a good long-term strategy for getting high-quality people to work for you.

        1. What the fuck would you know about hiring people?

          1. I bet he knows a hell of a lot about being fired though.

    3. Jeff. You never responded to why you supported the Carter Page FISA suits while claiming to hate those courts yesterday. Why?

    4. My favorite thing about the national media right now? How they pretend like NOTHING is going on.

    5. Her book is called “I’ll take your questions now”.

      Will her next book be called “IT’S TIME FOR EVERYONE TO LEAVE, NOW”?

    6. Stephanie Grisham describes the Trump White House as ‘a clown car on fire running at full speed into a warehouse full of fireworks’

      Imagine if you can, a flaming car full of clowns driving full speed through a warehouse full of fireworks and killing fewer people than Biden did in Afghanistan… pretty amazing!

    7. People who live in Biden White Houses shouldn’t throw stones. Or get stoned. Or whatever man.

  22. Last night, Chemjeff made a whopper of a statement, in defense of Employer vaccine mandates: ““Unvaccinated have a much higher likelihood of being a major burden on the company health insurance plan.””

    You can read the math in the thread, but ultimately it came down to this: The expected net burden of an unvaccinated employee is $18 per year. It is a rounding error, and 533x smaller than the net annual burden of Type 2 Diabetes ($9,600- and that is just the cost of diabetes- not the other healthcare costs that come with being overweight). If we are ok with companies mandating healthcare choices to save money, get ready for mandates about weight loss.

    More importantly, it just goes to show how easily fear and basic inability to conceptualize numbers and risk have driven this country into the arms of authoritarians. States are mandating healthy kids get vaccination for a virus that represents zero risk to them. Because they cannot integrate their emotional response to a dying kid with the actual likelihood that it would happen.

    And by the way, I still have not seen one of the lefty-writers on this site condemn the Vaccination Mandates. They will fight with the Trumpers and call them uninformed idiots (what does that make Chemjeff’s numerical illiteracy above?). They will argue that the Vaccine Authoritarians have good intentions. They will try to get into philosophical arguments about where you draw the line. They will even protest that they don’t SUPPORT the mandates.

    But unless I missed it, in 3 days of constant posting among Team Left, none of them have been willing to outright condemn school vaccine mandates as wrong. Not once.

    1. With all due respect, Overt, I think you are emotionally compromised on this issue, because of your child. I don’t have a child that would be subject to this California mandate, as you apparently do. You seem to be looking for people who don’t just agree with you on the issue, but who is also as emotionally and passionately OUTRAGED about the idea of a childhood vaccination mandate as you are. And I am not. I don’t share the same level of emotional response to the idea of the mandate that you do. And, frankly, it is unfair of you to start labeling people as ‘pro-mandate’ only because they don’t have the same level of EMOTIONAL opposition to the mandate as you do.

      I am opposed to a government mandated vaccine for COVID.
      I am not interested in being your emotional support crutch on this issue, or serving in the role to validate your feelings on the matter.

      That will have to be good enough for you.

      1. Lol! He is the one who is emotionally invested??? You demanded people wear masks because you were at higher risk, ie obese. You demanded of it last year and continue to this year. You dismiss the ability of people to assess their own risk postures. You support employers firing the unvaccinated and ostracized them from society. You haven’t endorsed vaccine passports but neither have you condemned them. You’ve literally pondered to a false sense of security by trading the freedom of others. And you call others emotional??

        Overt literally just gave you unemotional actual evidence and you blamed him for being emotional?

        What a sophist shit you are.

        And you are only against the word mandate because you realize it makes you look like a hypocritical piece of shit. You fully support the outcome of a mandate through other means as mentioned.

        1. You demanded people wear masks because you were at higher risk, ie obese.

          Lie #1.

          You demanded of it last year and continue to this year.

          I never DEMANDED anything. Lie #2.

          You dismiss the ability of people to assess their own risk postures.

          Lie #3.

          You support employers firing the unvaccinated and ostracized them from society.

          I support private businesses making their own hiring and firing decisions consistent with the NAP. Do you?

          You haven’t endorsed vaccine passports

          Finally you say something truthful.

          but neither have you condemned them.

          Again, here is this idea that opposition to an idea is not enough, what is necessary is EMOTIONAL CONDEMNATION AND ALL CAPS DENUNCIATION AND DECLARATIONS OF EVIL TYRANNY AND BAD MOTIVES BY THE PROPONENTS. You want emotional validation on the issue just as much as Overt does.

          You’ve literally pondered to a false sense of security by trading the freedom of others.

          Lie #4.

          And you call others emotional??

          Some, yes. You, I just call stupid.

          You fully support the outcome of a mandate through other means as mentioned.

          If by “outcome of a mandate” you mean “fewer people dying needlessly from COVID” then yes I support that outcome. DON’T YOU? Isn’t the entire idea here to have fewer people die, just not using coercive means to try to reach that outcome?

          1. A few weeks ago one of the right-wing commenters here complained that Reason didn’t condemn some thing that some left politician had done. Which was bizarre because Reason is not in the habit of issuing condemnations of anything; it’s just not their editorial tone.

            1. It is because they want emotional theater. They want fiery denunciations more than they want intellectual arguments.

          2. Lol jeff. Need me to go back in time like I did with the FISA thread you ran from?

            1. So now you are going to try to change the subject. Because your entire raison d’etre here is to stir up shit and provoke reactions from people.

              Why don’t you try answering this question Jesse:

              If by “outcome of a mandate” you mean “fewer people dying needlessly from COVID” then yes I support that outcome. DON’T YOU? Isn’t the entire idea here to have fewer people die, just not using coercive means to try to reach that outcome?

              1. No jeff. I’m calling you a known liar. You have lied here for years about last statements. And when overt brings up your past statement you cry it doesn’t count because it was a year ago. Youre a dishonest piece of shit who has no moral base and feeling you can freely lie to win a conversation.

                I brought up FISA as an example of how you lie and have no principles. Because as soon as something favors the left you stop pretending to have a principle you claim. Justice you said fuck FISC yesterday after supporting and defend it for Carter page.

                Youre a lying political leftist. Everyone here sees it day in and day out. I dont know who you think you are fooling with your c average community College arguments.

                1. I brought up FISA as an example

                  No, Jesse, you bring up FISA as an example of both changing the subject, and ALWAYS making the issue one that is personal. Every issue is just one more opportunity to score cheap points against people you hate. Who cares what the issue is? If you can find a way to use an issue to call me a retard, you’ll do it every time. Because that is who you are.

                  Even now in this discussion we aren’t even talking about vaccines anymore. It’s entirely a personal diatribe against me, or sarc, or anyone else that you hate. That is what discussions with you always turn into. “You suck, you’re a retard, you’re a liar, you’re a leftie, you’re a terrible person”, etc., etc. You don’t WANT to discuss the issue of vaccines, or the issue of FISA, or anything else. You just come here to troll and provoke reactions and call people names. Because you are basically Tulpa at this point.

      2. jeffsarcredneckmike is of course a far leftie who champions government mandates. Don’t believe a word he says – he voted for Biden and loves the proggies.

      3. I think Newsom’s mandate is overreach, and these things should be decided at the local school board level.

        However, I have to admit, emotionally, I don’t care that much. Unlike those who accuse Democrats of power grabbing, I give them the benefit of the doubt that their motivation is to try to solve a very real public health crisis.

        1. Mike agrees with the overreach so he is fine with it. Amazing. Not a libertarian.

          1. Wow dude. That’s the opposite of what he said. You don’t even pretend to be honest.

            1. Lol.

              However, I have to admit, emotionally, I don’t care that much. Unlike those who accuse Democrats of power grabbing, I give them the benefit of the doubt that their motivation is to try to solve a very real public health crisis.

        2. I think Newsom’s mandate is overreach

          Overreach is mandating a calorie count on a fast food menu because the public health demanded it.

          Demanding every man, woman and child submit to a medical procedure, locking down an economy, forcing millions into unemployment and demanding a medical transcript from every man, woman and child to navigate public life, leave the house, or engage in interstate travel isn’t overreach. It’s something else… I’ll let the commentariat come up with a clever catch-phrase.

          1. I was only taking about one specific act — his recent mandate about public schools and vaccination. You just listed a bunch of other stuff.

        3. Libertarians don’t care about “motivation”, Mike, but since you are a lying troll, that doesn’t shock me.

          But for the benefit of the thread, please remember this series of posts the next time the lefties come in arguing on principle. Being principled sometimes means you have to resist or support things that don’t emotionally excite you, or even anger you. Many of the early abolitionists were quite racist- but their principles lead them to oppose slavery. The ACLU has no interest in Nazis, but their principled support of free speech led them to defend them in court.

          The reason our world continues to get more and more fractured is that there are very few principled people left. It is all about team.

        4. I think Newsom’s mandate is overreach, and these things should be decided at the local school board level.

          This is the type of thing that just drives me nuts. A local mandate is just as terrible as a statewide or national mandate.

        5. However, I have to admit, emotionally, I don’t care that much.

          According to Overt, that means you are not a Real Libertarian(tm). To be a Real Libertarian(tm), one must not only have the correct set of positions on issues, but one must also have the correct set of emotional responses to every issue. It’s a real tough challenge to be a Real Libertarian(tm).

          1. Luckily, I don’t really care.

            I am a life-long libertarian, but I am all grown up and have experienced the real world — which means I am no longer a libertarian who is dogmatic, or simplistic in my thinking, unconcerned with practicality, or even concerned about clinging to libertarianism as a way of defining myself.

            1. My view is similar in the sense that I see a lot more gray in the world than in my youth, when I was more susceptible to simplistic black/white thinking. People are complicated and they cannot be easily reduced to simplistic caricatures of good/evil. Issues are complicated and to understand an issue fully requires seeing many facets and nuances that are not immediately apparent from a simplistic analysis. But these things are hard, they don’t generate rageclicks, they require thoughtful contemplation and study, and so what we get instead is simplistic emoting based on strawman caricatures.

              1. Yes. Youre a sophist. You now rationalize why you support leftist policies or policies against the right when you know they violate a pure principle. Glad you admitted it dummy.

                1. In your world, Jesse, “sophist” just means “a person who makes abstract arguments that I don’t understand and can’t keep up with”.

            2. You’re a libertarian like Buttplug should be left unsupervised with a child.

          2. Because you’re not a real libertarian if you give tyrants the benefit of the doubt while they are in the middle of fucking ruling you.

            But then, you’re not a libertarian either.

      4. “I don’t share the same level of emotional response to the idea of the mandate that you do. And, frankly, it is unfair of you to start labeling people as ‘pro-mandate’ only because they don’t have the same level of EMOTIONAL opposition to the mandate as you do.”

        Thank you for finally admitting what I have tried to get you to admit since you started posting here: That you are not a principled libertarian. You of course denied this last year.

        Remember when you said you would resist mandates? I do:

        Over a year ago, I said that I mask and vaccinate my kids, but I refuse mandates. Do you remember? I asked you this:

        “So what are you going to do when the state tries to require it, as they have in places like california?

        Are you going to *correctly* take the libertarian approach and resist such a thing? Or are you going to shrug and go “See guys, I told you” as the State takes away yet one more freedom from us?”

        Your response?

        “I’ll probably do both.”

        But, as you admit now, you are NOT going to do both. You are not going to resist mandates. You are going to say its my problem to deal with. Because you aren’t a libertarian. You are a leftist who pretends to be a libertarian in order to seem more credible when trolling on a libertarian site.

        “And, frankly, it is unfair of you to start labeling people as ‘pro-mandate’ only because they don’t have the same level of EMOTIONAL opposition to the mandate as you do.”

        I am not arguing that you are Pro-Mandate. I am arguing that your tribal loyalty keeps you from criticizing your team- that you don’t really choose your positions based on principles, but team loyalty. And you have just shown that.

        “That will have to be good enough for you.”

        Yes, it allows me to easily flip the switch on you from “left libertarian” to “team blue troll”. Thanks!

        1. I love how you rhetorically curbstomp chemjeff. He’ll be drinking his Pizza Pops through a straw for the rest of the month.

        2. Agree with everything you said here overt. But you’re also missing how he wants the same outcome as a mandate, he just wants it done through corporations so he can hide his support.

        3. Oh my dear Lord. You are using an equivocal response to a hypothetical question that was posed 15 months ago as “proof” that I’m unprincipled? Frankly, you are simply reaching for any rationalization that you can try to find to justify your pre-existing conclusion. Your entire argument here rests on the emotional meaning you imbue into the word “resist”. I think it means “oppose”. You think it means “FIGHT WITH EVERY FIBER OF MY BEING”. And because I don’t have the same EMOTIONAL response to you on this topic, you declare me “unprincipled”, EVEN WHEN YOU ADMIT that we AGREE on the substantive matter – opposition to government mandates. No, Overt, I am just as _principled_ as you on this subject. I oppose the mandate as much as you. The ONLY difference here is that I don’t turn the emotional spigot up to eleventy like you have done.

          I am arguing that your tribal loyalty keeps you from criticizing your team- that you don’t really choose your positions based on principles, but team loyalty. And you have just shown that.

          If you think I am a Team Blue tribal member, then why aren’t I supporting government mandates of vaccines? Why do I argue in favor of privatizing schools, privatizing Social Security, ending foreign wars, opposition to tariffs and support for free trade (which Biden does NOT support)? Hmm? You claim I am a Team Blue loyalist. Prove it. You are not stupid like Jesse who thinks that “criticizing Team Red = supporting Team Blue”. You understand the difference. So demonstrate exactly why you think I am a Team Blue loyalist by proving, if you can, these supposed bonds of loyalty that you claim that I have. You cannot because they don’t exist.

        4. And quite frankly Overt you were about the last person around here I would have expected to substitute emotion for logical reasoning. Your position is literally that the emotional theater in support or opposition to an issue is more important than the corresponding intellectual arguments. And I find that quite sad.

          1. I like how you claim he is emotional for being the only one here who actually posted numbers. You just lie about what you said and rage in defense of sarc and white Mike. Lol.

          2. Everyone else is emotional but poor Jeffy.

            He’s the sole voice of reasoned, measured thought… which mysteriously just happens to coincide with whatever narrative the Democratic Party is pushing that week.

            But it’s just sheer coincidence that he reads like an ActBlue email. It’s because reality just happens to have a proggy bias, amirite?

      5. I don’t have a child that would be subject to this California mandate, as you apparently do. You seem to be looking for people who don’t just agree with you on the issue, but who is also as emotionally and passionately OUTRAGED about the idea of a childhood vaccination mandate as you are. And I am not.

        I agree 100%. And this may be the unintended consequence of a libertarianism that has mostly focused on creating philosophical purity and rational consistency everywhere than on getting in the trenches on local issues when things are gray and have to deal with people who don’t agree. We lose the local credibility gained from experience that might have prevented stuff from happening – and are left with the empty substitute of railing at the tides.

    2. I’m against federal/state vaccine mandates.

      An employer or company can sure as hell impose a mandate though – on employees or customers.

      1. A lot of them don’t have a choice. If a company does business with the federal government, and it’s hard to find a large company that doesn’t, then they’ve got to follow federal rules. Meaning all employees must get their first dose by the end of this month, and their second by December, or they’re unemployed.

        1. You do realize that Biden never submitted the OSHA rule right?

          Who am I kidding. You don’t.

          1. If sarc didn’t hear it on CNN, he’s never going to know.

      2. If a female employee becomes pregnant, you will be terminated.

        1. Reason: Pregnant employees are a higher burden on the corporate healthcare plan and reduce productivity by taking maternity leave.

          1. Pass out coat hangers at employee orientation.

        2. Not in Silicon Valley.
          Google employees get 18 to 22 weeks of paid leave. Fathers and adoptive parents get 7 weeks. There are also cash gifts and primo parking spots. Other companies are also trying to keep pace.

      3. So an employer could not hire people of a certain race because that race commits a higher rate of violent crime?

      4. Sbp in favor of fascism and pedofilia. To the left wing trolls of reason this is your idol, enjoy

    3. Hey, how about a fairly simple “fix” that is pretty libertarian? Health insurance… If you smoke, many insurers make you PAY more for your policy! After all, smoker have more health costs!

      You don’t get vaccinated? PAY more for your policy! Fair and square!

      (I don’t know why this idea isn’t being kicked around… I’ve not seen it).

        1. Yeah man! From there…

          But as vaccines have become widely available to adults in the U.S. and health care utilization has rebounded more generally, health insurers may no longer face political or public relations pressure to continue waiving costs for COVID-19 treatment. As more waivers expire, more people hospitalized for COVID-19 – the vast majority of whom are unvaccinated – will likely receive significant medical bills for their treatment.

          1. Ooops, that was from the below link, not the above.

            Good news in my opinion! Thanks, Mike!

            1. Two flags for the spastic asshole

              1. The below poetry is dedicated to Super-Perv-Predator-Sevo the Pedo, Hippo in a Speedo,
                AKA “SmegmaLung”!

                Sitting on a park bench
                Eyeing little boys with bad intent
                Snot’s running down his nose
                Greasy fingers smearing shabby clothes
                Hey, Smegmalung!
                Drying in the cold sun
                Watching as the frilly panties run
                Hey, Smegmalung!
                Feeling like a dead duck
                Spitting out pieces of his broken luck
                Oh, Smegmalung!
                Sun streaking cold
                A hateful man wandering lonely
                Insulting others the only way he knows
                Brain hurts bad as he tries to think
                Goes down to the bog to spread his stink
                Feeling alone
                The army’s up the road
                Salvation a la mode and a cup of tea
                Smegmalung, my friend
                Don’t you start away uneasy
                You poor old sod
                You see, it’s only me
                By you insulting me,
                The rotting goes to thee!

    4. I totally oppose all vaccine mandates. I can see the point of view, but I don’t agree with it.

      1. No, sarc, that is not enough. You have to not only oppose all vaccine mandates, but you also have to turn your rage meter up to eleventy and denounce proponents of vaccine mandates as evil tyrannical monsters. Only that and that alone earns you the label of Real Libertarian(tm).

        1. Or stop supporting and gaslighting about your support for the open attacks against the unvaccinated.

          Please go on another rant about ivermectin jeff. I mean a well understood drug that won a nobel prize for use in humans that is linked to beneficial effects… and your take is to mock those and attack people like Rogan for saying they used it. Want to talk about emotional argumentation again? Then you have the Gaul to create a strawman about your opponents not wanting vaccines or drugs despite every fucking gop politician you hate telling people to get vaccinated but not wanting a mandate. Innis the fact that you attack that stance that people can freely say you’re full of shit when you say you want no mandate. Understand now?

          Side a) get vaccinated if you want, it will help. Use ivermectin or other anti viral if they help, talk to your doctor.

          Side b) get vaccinated, lose your job if you don’t, don’t go to stores or restaurants, get charged 100 a paycheck if your family is not vaccinated, kids with zero risk get vaccinated or no school…

          And you attack side a you dishonest shit. Thats why we can call you out for your bullshit around covid.

          1. Or stop supporting and gaslighting about your support for the open attacks against the unvaccinated.

            Except for the very few who are medically unable to receive the vaccine, the decision to get vaccinated vs. the decision to not get vaccinated are not morally equivalent decisions and I refuse to pretend that they are. Weren’t you the one denouncing moral relativism earlier? I refuse to buy into your moral relativism on this topic and pretend that the decision to protect oneself from an illness vs. the decision to refuse to protect oneself from an illness are morally equivalent. They are not.

            Please go on another rant about ivermectin jeff. I mean a well understood drug that won a nobel prize for use in humans that is linked to beneficial effects… and your take is to mock those and attack people like Rogan for saying they used it.

            The drug did not receive a Nobel Prize. That is another lie from you. And yes I mock people who on one hand say they don’t want a “RISKY AND UNTESTED” vaccine, but then turn around and willingly swallow a “RISKY AND UNTESTED” drug for treating COVID.

            Side a) get vaccinated if you want, it will help. Use ivermectin or other anti viral if they help, talk to your doctor.

            Side (a) sounds pretty good, actually. But that is not the Team Red side. Here is the Team Red side:
            “COVID is basically the flu, no big deal! The vaccine is RISKY! Talk to your doctor, but if your doctor tells you to get the vaccine, you should ignore him/her because that just proves doctors are in thrall to Big Pharma and/or are woke progressive Democrats, so instead, if you get sick, swallow horse pills because it worked for Joe Rogan!”

            The Team Red side is a sewer of paranoia, half-truths, and sometimes outright dangerous lies. That is what I criticize.

            Side b) get vaccinated, lose your job if you don’t, don’t go to stores or restaurants, get charged 100 a paycheck if your family is not vaccinated, kids with zero risk get vaccinated or no school…

            And here comes those pesky property rights again. If you don’t think PRIVATE employers should be able to hire/fire people based on whether or not they get a vaccine, then how do you justify this position while also respecting private property rights of employers to decide whom to employ? You can’t.

            1. Everything o said is fucking true. You are incapable of honesty.

              1. And there it is. You turn a discussion once again into a personal insult.

              2. Here is what Jesse could have done:

                He could have explained or tried to justify his moral relativism with respect to the decision to get/not get a vaccine.

                He could have tried to clarify his FALSE claim that ivermectin won a Nobel Prize.

                He could have explained why Team Red is so willing to be taken in by conspiracies and half-truths regarding the vaccine.

                He could have offered a more detailed explanation of his position of property rights of employers with respect to hiring/firing decisions based on employees’ behaviors.

                But he did none of that. Instead he just lied and insulted me.

                Earlier he wrote that arguing with me in good faith is “not worth his time”. That’s not true. He doesn’t argue with me in good faith because he CAN’T. He can’t keep up in an honest discussion with me. So he just resorts to insults.

            2. I have no moral obligation to get vaccinated. Especially for something with a death rate of less than 1% for the overwhelming majority of people.

    1. Lol. Nice source “not a lefty.”

    2. TDS is a powerful disease of the mind, and asshole nazi mike has got it bad.

    3. http://www.thedailybeast

      Remember folks, White Mike is totally not a Democrat. Just ask him.

  23. UGA 7 Arkansas 0.

    Go Dawgs!

    We might actually beat Alabama for once. Maybe. Like 10-20% chance.

    1. Dawgs, don’t go too far or too fast, and burn off too much fat! A bit of fat in the Dawg-meat makes it taste better!

      (Keeping it topical here).

        1. The below poetry is dedicated to Super-Perv-Predator-Sevo the Pedo, Hippo in a Speedo.

          He’s a real pedo man
          Playing with his pedo gland
          Dropping his smegma across the land
          Doesn’t have a point of view
          Knows not where he’s going to
          Butt he spews stupid insults at you!
          Pedo man, please listen
          You don’t know what you’re missin’
          Smegma man, the world is at your command
          He’s as blind as he can be
          Just sees what he wants to see
          Pedo man, can you see me at all
          Smegma man don’t worry
          Take your time, don’t hurry
          Leave it all ’til somebody else
          Lends you a hand
          Ah, la, la, la, la
          Doesn’t have a point of view
          Knows not where he’s going to
          Butt he spews stupid insults at you!
          Pedo man, please listen
          You don’t know what you’re missin’
          Smegma man, the world is at your command

    2. Not bad hogs are scoreless. Yeah it’s going to be Georgia Alabama in December.

    3. turd lies. turd is incapable of recognizing the truth
      turd is a pathological liar far too stupid to know that.
      turd lies; it’s what turd does.

      1. Be careful man!!! Do NOT piss off Sevo the Pedo, man!!! Sevo the Pedo has special permission to insult others all day every day, with unfounded accusations, but can NOT be trolled by Pedo-disrespectin’ others!!! Or else Super-Perv-Predator-Sevo the Pedo, Hippo in a Speedo, will SUE you in the courts of Government Almighty!!! Pedo’s LAWYERS might wear speedos IN YOUR FACE in court ass well, so BEWARE!!!

    4. Arkansas is going to eat the Dawgs for lunch.

  24. Did you guys hear the latest Trump news? Hopefully tReason will cover it.

    1. I’m sure that they’ll put Ja¢ob $ullum right on it.

  25. All TDS all the time democracy will die if it’s not covered extensively.

  26. No more poodles with noodles.

    1. Damn I should have scrolled down posted same up top. Credit goes to you though!

  27. Can’t vouch for the accuracy but this is a pretty compelling article about Obama’s deep state roots.
    During Obama’s presidency, General Dynamics bought out 11 firms specializing in satellites, geo-spatial intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance, and amassed contracts from 16 intelligence agencies after investing $10 million in annual lobbying.
    The company further embraced “every intelligence driven style of warfare,” developing small target and identification systems and equipment that could intercept insurgents’ cell phone and lab-top communications and computer software used for cyber and psychological warfare.[24]
    The Crown family gave at least $86,636 to Obama campaigns between 1990 and 2012 and raised an additional $3,205,233 between 2007 and 2012 while paying $135,000 for Obama’s inauguration in 2009.
    Susan Crown, Lester’s daughter, sat on the board of Northern Trust, which gave Obama a sweetheart loan for purchase of a $1.65 million Georgian revival mansion in Chicago’s Hyde Park complete with a thousand-bottle wine cellar.
    James Crown, who was the target of a congressional and criminal probe as chairman of the J.P. Morgan Chase & Company’s risk committee, was Obama’s fundraising chair in his 2004 campaign for the Senate.[25]
    The Crowns’ investments in Obama paid off —General Dynamics’ revenues shot up to over $30 billion in 2016, a three-fold increase from 2000. The Crowns’ net worth doubled in the Obama years, causing the family to rise in the Forbes ranking to the 27th richest family in the United States.[26]

    1. “Muh private company”, literally.

      We won’t hear a peep about this from Reason or the establishment media, I’m sure.
      Meanwhile the Media went ape shit when Trump indirectly owned $400 worth of the drug company that makes Hydroxychloroquine, through a mutual fund. Claimed he was enriching himself.

    2. Interesting article. Seriously. Don’t know if everything in it is true.

      By the way, President George H. W. Bush was the _head_ of the CIA.

        1. Mike wants to pretend differently but Bush Sr and Obama were on the same side and governed exactly like each other.

    3. “Can’t vouch for the accuracy…”

      You’re on firmer ground with Caro’s Johnson bio.

  28. France takes the red-pill:

    Macron, France Reject American ‘Woke’ Culture That’s ‘Racializing’ Their Country

    “(The) French media are now reexamining everything about America.
    The latest target? “Woke” ideology.
    One of France’s leading magazines, Le Spectacle Du Monde, ran a cover story titled “The Suicide of America.”…

    In the same issue, an article faulted U.S. universities as islands of extremism, where even students’ Halloween costumes are policed, citing Yale University as a place where “offensive” costume-wearers were punished…

    a conference of leading politicians, journalists and intellectuals devoted a panel to “America’s woke ideology.” Some panelists seemed alarmed by the trends they saw in American society, including alleged “woke” censorship by Twitter, Facebook and other U.S. tech giants.
    Former French Prime Minister Alain Juppé and Agence France Presse CEO Fabrice Fries attended the panel…

    In an interview with Elle magazine earlier this summer, President Macron said American-imported “woke culture” is “racializing” France and creating more division among minorities…

    Macron’s anti-woke sentiment is widely shared in his government, even by the delegate minister for gender equality and diversity, Elisabeth Moreno, a Black woman born in Cape Verde, off the coast of western Africa. In a televised interview with Bloomberg, she praised the increased awareness on social issues, but rejected cancel culture because it can “kick out people from ongoing debates because they think otherwise…

    The French have been wary of “wokeness” for a while. The country’s reckoning over the “Me Too” movement against sexual abuse and harassment came to a head in 2018, when a group of more than 100 prominent French women, including actress Catherine Deneuve, penned a letter claiming the movement had gone too far. The women warned of “puritanism in the name of a so-called greater good” and compared the new feminist movement to a “witch hunt.”…

    “The two most toxic ideologies of the 20th century were Nazism and Marxism. In my opinion, Nazism was identity politics on steroids, and Marxism was an oppressor narrative on steroids. The combination of the two is actually modern wokeism that was born in the United States,” said Vivek Ramaswamy.

    “I do think” said Ramaswamy “that it’s actually becoming one of America’s most toxic exports, the rise of modern wokeness.”

    1. It’s too bad that even when the French get a good idea, they have to package it as anti-Americanism.

      Do Americans get all xenophobic because of Derrida or Foucault?

      1. They seem to be the one culture in the West that’s never questioned its own supremacy. Forced assimilation is the opposite of multicultalism, and they’ve always rejected multiculturalism in favor of the supremacy of their own culture.

      2. France, China and America are similar in that each one sincerely believes they’re the apex of human civilization. Russia sorta does too, but unlike the others has an element of maudlin self-pity and thinks that the West is always trying to fuck it over.

  29. Our administration will set up your mp3 record with the best quality prepared for download 24musicplay

  30. The saddest moment in a child’s life is not when he learns that Santa Claus isn’t real. It is when he learns that Joe Biden is.

    1. Don’t worry kids, President Potemkin isn’t really real. He’s actually just a scary puppet.


    “Nobody has done more for Christianity or for evangelicals—or for religion itself—than I have, [doing] so many different things,” he said during a phone interview with Devin Scillian on the show Flashpoint.

    1. What do you care, since your a religious-hating lefty? I still remember when you accused me of being a secret Christian, like you’d just discovered a maggot in the cheese.
      I think that the word for what you’re doing here is called Concern Trolling.

    2. Sooo…More than JHVH-1 His-Own-Self? Or JHVH-1 Jr.? Or Dr. Gene Scott? Or more than the Venus from Willendorf, Austria, whose pussy he grabbed?

      Small wonder. Trump’s Pastor was Norman Vincent Peele, author of The Power of Positive Thinking. The Orange Man not only took it to heart, but never learned how to temper it with reality.

    3. …and Democrats engaged in deep reflection, wondering why voters preferred this weird narcissist to them.

      Ha ha, just kidding.

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  35. Discussion with my son on this subject when he was 6 years old. “Dad, I know it wrong to eat dogs but they taste so good”. Me – “What are you talking about?” – My kid, “Dad, hot dogs are made from dog’s legs aren’t they?” I told him “No, you have that wrong, they are made from their tails.”

    That was 20 + years ago. He has since spent time in Korea and has mentioned that he had ate dog when he was over there. I remind him to not tell people this as it is not worth upsetting people over this.

    I have been to Korea and found it interesting that the factory fed scraps to dogs kept in cages on site. I assumed the company picnic was coming up.

    While working in Japan, I unknowingly ordered horse. No issues when my compatriot informed me of what I had consumed a while after the meal.

    1. “I’m so hungry I could eat a horse!”

      “Well, today is your lucky day.”

      1. “Is this meat fresh!”

        “Sir! If this meat were any fresher, the jockey would still be riding it.”

  36. When a dog bites a man, that is not news. When a man eats a dog…ewwww!

  37. “Park, Park
    Wherever you may be
    You eat dogs in your country, ”

    Man U football chant.

    1. Park, Park
      Wherever you may be
      You eat dogs in your country,
      It could be worse,
      You could be scouse,
      Eating rats in your council house

      That’s the full chant. Scouse is Liverpudlian, Council is gov’t assisted housing.

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