Election 2020

Texas Congressman's Lawsuit Says Mike Pence Has the Unilateral Authority to Keep Trump in Office

Louis Gohmert asserts a previously overlooked power to decide which electoral votes will be counted.


Under the 12th Amendment, Electoral College votes are sent to the vice president, who "shall, in the presence of the Senate and the House of Representatives, open all the certificates." The amendment adds that "the votes shall then be counted."

According to a federal lawsuit that Rep. Louis Gohmert (R–Texas) filed this week, that means the vice president has the sole authority to decide which electoral votes count. The implication, Gohmert says, is that Vice President Mike Pence has the power to overturn Joe Biden's victory and declare Donald Trump the winner of the presidential election by recognizing "competing slates of electors' votes" when Congress convenes to officially tally the results on January 6.

Gohmert's lawsuit, which names Pence as the defendant, aims to overturn the procedures laid out in the Electoral Count Act of 1887, which he argues is unconstitutional because it conflicts with the 12th Amendment. Under that law, which has never been used to actually reject any electoral votes, objections backed by at least one member of both the House and the Senate can succeed only if they are approved by majority votes of both chambers. So far no senator has come forward to support the use of that desperate tactic by Gohmert and other diehard Trump allies in the House. Even if one did, it is not hard to predict the result, since Democrats control the House and at least a third of Republican senators have conceded Biden's victory.

But never mind all that, Gohmert says, because the 12th Amendment gives Pence "the exclusive authority and sole discretion to open and permit the counting of the electoral votes for a given state, and where there are competing slates of electors, or where there is objection to any single slate of electors, to determine which electors' votes, or whether none, shall be counted." He adds that any such decision by Pence is not subject to judicial review.

But Gohmert's claims are, and legal scholars are not liking his chances. "No, this won't work," said Rick Hasen, an expert on election law at the University of California, Irvine. "This is insane," commented Georgia State law professor Anthony Michael Kreis.

Fordham University law professor Jed Shugerman questioned Gohmert's claim that the 12th Amendment charges the vice president with "count[ing]" electoral votes, which is not actually what the 12th Amendment says. "The 12th Amendment merely designates the President of the Senate (the VP) to 'open all the certificates,'" Shugerman noted. "But then [it] uses the passive voice: 'the votes shall then be counted.' Implicitly, Congress does the counting."

Georgetown law professor Neal Katyal, who served as acting solicitor general in the Obama administration, makes a similar point in a New York Times op-ed piece co-authored by historian John Monsky. "Nothing in either the text of the Constitution or the Electoral Count Act gives the vice president any substantive powers," they write. "His powers are ministerial, and that circumscribed role makes general sense: The whole point of an election is to let the people decide who will rule them. If an incumbent could simply maneuver to keep himself in office—after all, a maneuver to protect Mr. Trump also protects Mr. Pence—the most foundational precept of our government would be gravely undermined."

The 12th Amendment was ratified in 1804. Yet in the 216 years since, it seems, no vice president has thought to invoke it in the way Gohmert suggests to favor his own party—or, in Pence's case, himself. If Gohmert were right, for example, Vice President Al Gore could have tipped the outcome of the very close 2000 election to himself, and Vice President Richard Nixon could have rejected electoral votes for John F. Kennedy in 1960.

Apparently Pence did not consider that option either, which is why Gohmert is suing him. The congressman, who filed his case in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Texas, is seeking a judgment declaring the Electoral Count Act unconstitutional and affirming that Pence "may exercise the exclusive authority and sole discretion in determining which electoral votes to count for a given State." In the unlikely event that Gohmert can obtain such a judgment, of course, Pence would still be under no obligation to reverse the outcome of the election.

"The 2020 presidential election was one we'd expect to see in a banana republic, not the United States of America," Gohmert said on Monday, alluding to Trump's wild claims of massive election fraud. How would you describe a country where the current leaders have the power to remain in office regardless of what voters say?

NEXT: COVID-19 Herd Immunity Is Possible Before Spring If the FDA Gets Out of the Way

Editor's Note: We invite comments and request that they be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of Reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment for any reason at any time. Report abuses.

  1. Yeah it`s Possible…Anybody can earn 250$+ daily… You can earn from 6000-12000 a month or even more if you work as a full time job…It’s easy, just follow instructions on this page, read it carefully from start to finish… It’s a flexible job but a good
    eaning opportunity.. Here is More information.

    1. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly YTR make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new… after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier. Here’s what I do…>> Visit Here

  2. >>Yet in the 216 years since, it seems, no vice president has thought to invoke it in the way Gohmert suggests

    sweet. lack of use does not mean lack of utility.

    >>> to favor his own party—or, in Pence’s case, himself.

    ya fuck off the vote fraud isn’t even in the Constitution. the 12th is.

    1. Get $192 hourly from Google!…Yes this is Authentic since I just got my first payout of $24413 and this was just of a single week… I have also bought my Range Rover Velar right after this payout…AMs It is really cool job I have ever had and you won’t forgive yourself if you do not check it…

      =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Home Profit System

    2. There’s a first time for everything. I hope Pence does it. Fuck the de o rats after everything they’ve pulled. They legitimately lost and deserve nothing but pain and misery for what they’ve done.

      The democrat party shouldn’t even exist.

      1. The Democrat party consists of useful idiots, ivory tower liberals, and oligarchs. They have in common a hatred of everyday Americans – the type who enlist in the army, who hook their power lines up after an ice storm, and who go on vacation in campers.
        So they took Soros’s Dominion Voting algorithms and Zuckerberg’s $500 million ballot harvesting scheme and they got us a Venezuela style election with more votes counted than actual voters registered!
        Thank you, Jack Dorsey for keeping Biden’s criminal activity censored until after the election. And thank you Big Pharma for keeping the vaccine under wraps so Trump couldn’t point out that he got something done despite China’s best efforts to ruin us.

        1. I presume you’ll take the same stance in four years when it’s Kamala Harris opening the certificates.

          1. Kamala Harris won’t be Vice-President in four years no matter who is President on January 21st.

            Even if Biden gets inaugurated, he’ll be gone via the 25th Amendment (or impeachment if he insists on fighting his replacement) within 3 months.

            1. You missed the point, dumbass. If the Dems tried to pulls the same stunt, you’d be apoplectic.

              1. “You missed the point, dumbass.”

                Were you looking in a mirror when you typed that?

                “If the Dems tried to pulls the same stunt…”

                The Dems cheated, so all bets should be off. Who says only one side is allowed to cheat?

                1. Repeat after me: There’s zero evidence of cheating. There’s zero evidence of cheating. There’s zero evidence of cheating.

                  Have a nice day, faggot.

                  1. enjoy your universe dude. this one’s election-fraudful.

                    1. I am made $84, 8254 so far this year working online and I’m a full time student. I am using an online business. Here what I do,. for more information……… USA ONLINE JOBS

        2. “The Democrat party consists of useful idiots, ivory tower liberals, and oligarchs.”

          Yeah, oligarchs. None of those in the GOP, that’s for sure. Not a billionaire in sight! I bet you also think Wall Street hates them, LOL. Whatever, dude.

          “They have in common a hatred of everyday Americans – the type who enlist in the army, who hook their power lines up after an ice storm, and who go on vacation in campers.”

          Everyday Americans?’ Is that ALL Americans or just the white ones? Same goes for the military, whose membership is about 40% non-white. Do they hate them, too?

          “So they took Soros’s Dominion Voting algorithms and Zuckerberg’s $500 million ballot harvesting scheme and they got us a Venezuela style election with more votes counted than actual voters registered!”

          I also heard Lord Xenu is involved.

          “Thank you, Jack Dorsey for keeping Biden’s criminal activity censored until after the election. And thank you Big Pharma for keeping the vaccine under wraps so Trump couldn’t point out that he got something done despite China’s best efforts to ruin us.”

          Yeah, big Pharma conspired against Trump, despite all the favors he’s done for them. Suuuuuure. I bet Wall Street was a part of it, too, right?

          China’s efforts? What, you think they created the virus or something? Yeah, of course you do. And all to destroy Trump, huh!

          1. The Force (of a Chinese stooge) is strong with this one.

            1. Drake actually doesn’t realize that China created the Wuhan virus in a lab. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/chinese-virologist-claims-china-created-and-deliberately-unleashed-coronavirus/ar-BB195hh4

              He probably also doesn’t realize that a global pandemic was the subject of the WEF in 2014:
              “If you are World Economic Forum (WEF) Founder Klaus Schwab, you attempt to sell your vision of a global Utopia via a great reset of the world order in three simple steps:

              1. Announce your intention to revamp every aspect of society with global governance, and keep repeating that message
              2. When your message isn’t getting through, simulate fake pandemic scenarios that show why the world needs a great reset
              3. If the fake pandemic scenarios aren’t persuasive enough, wait a couple months for a real global crisis to occur, and repeat step one.
              It took Schwab and the Davos elite about six years to watch their great reset ideology grow from a tiny Swiss seed in 2014 to a European super-flower pollinating the entire globe in 2020.

              That Chinese virologist has now seen her mother imprisoned. So let me know what she got out of letting the world know that a virus that lives all summer long (unlike the real flu, hence the name “flu season”) and that renders people unable to smell or taste, and largely kills 80 year olds isn’t manmade. PS The COVID virus does not affect Asians as much as non-Asians according to peer-reviewed medical articles, so Japan has had only 1800 deaths. Hmmmmm.

          2. It is telling that you think trades people/working people is code for white people. It is very telling that he didn’t mention race but you felt it necessary to bring up race. And then implied, with no evidence, that his support for the military is only for white servicemen. How many straw men did you create in your post?

      2. What did the Democrats “pull” other than kicking Trump’s fat ass?

        1. A massive cheating scandal involving a bunch of pathetic Davos private jet asshats like Soros, who made his money shorting currencies and hurting people without creating a single job.

          1. Allegations of Democratic cheating are the Big Lie that feeds on constant repetition.

            Biden won. Get over it.

            1. Denial of Democratic cheating is the Big Lie that feeds the useful idiots and perpetuates the swamp.

              Biden lost. Not over. He will be a Fraud Puppet, and the 75 million people who voted for Trump, plus the 30% of Democrats who think the election was rigged are now watching. Most of America was asleep before. Not anymore.

    3. So what you are arguing is that the Vice President essentially gets to decide who wins the election. Fuck off, you moron.

    4. Prove this “fraud,” asshole.


  4. How would you describe a country where the current leaders have the power to remain in office regardless of what voters say?

    The same way I’d describe a country where challengers have the power to take office regardless of what voters say.

    1. seriously. you’d think Sullum can’t even spell “mirror” let alone peer into one.

    2. That’s different!

    3. I guess a Trumptatorshit once removed might actually then be accurately called a Pencetatorshit! It doesn’t roll off of the tongue quite as easily, but it STILL tastes like shit!

      1. You’re the resident expert on the taste of shit. So you’ve got us there.

    4. The voters chose Biden. Suck it up, buttercup.

  5. What is it with Texans and the Constitution?

    First, Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton’s lawsuit depends on a very strict, very literal reading of the Constitution in which there is no wiggle room at all about it having to be literally be a state’s legislature making even the smallest change or interpretation of that state’s election laws. (Never mind that Texas’ own governor issued edicts that changed Texas’ election procedures.)

    Now, Texas Representative Louis Gohmert’s lawsuit depends on a very loose, creative reading of the Constitution which gives the Vice President the power to essentially decide who wins each Presidential election. Does he feel *any* shame.

    1. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we got it. You don’t like the rule of law when its applied to the government.

      Let’s overturn a few centuries of judicial precedent and practice in order to make the country ‘more like Europe’.

      1. Not a word in your comment relates to anything I wrote.

        1. It’s not in the nose, but true.

    2. Methinks the state apparatus would revolt en masse anyways. No way Trump or Pence can stay on past their welcome.

      1. When has Trump ever been welcome?

        When has the state apparatus not been completely revolting?

        The closest thing you’re going to get to a concession from Trump is all the pardons he just issued. It’s the truest sign that he’ll go if he has no other option.

  6. Oh dear the liberaltarians are fretting again. When you get your news from Twitter your angst is going to be rather high. Perhaps a sedative would help.

    1. How is this news from Twitter? I see it reported in CNN, Politico, MSN, Forbes, etc.

      1. who only investigate leeds provided on twitter…

        which is why twitter censorship is so great, right?

    2. Liberaltarians? The same “liberaltarians” you think control the Republican Party? You know, because you’re a fucking moron and all.

  7. the VP counts votes does not mean he can throw out votes

    1. *Shrugs shoulders* Maybe he just counts poorly.

      1. I hope this succeeds and then Pence declares himself the victor.

    2. Really? After this election, facts don’t appear to matter. Or rules. So if the republicans make it up as they go along to keep Trump in office, that’s just fine.

      Progressives started it.

    3. Maybe if the Pubes keep interrupting him while he’s counting he’ll lose his place and end up giving it to Trump.

  8. One last chance for Louie Gohmert to give Trump a big wet kiss on the backside before the President is gone.

    If you stop and consider this idea, every Vice President would run for the Presidency at the end of the term because he can count the votes and declare himself President.

    Our Constitution gives the Vice President the honor of presiding over the count of the electoral college vote count. Many Vice Presidents have done this task. Sometimes presiding over a win for their party, many times over a lose for their party and in some cases even a personal loss. I do not believe that Mike Pence would sully his reputation simple to keep Trump happy. I do not agree with Mike Pence on many things, but I do believe he is an honorable person.

    1. Maybe I misread it, but wouldn’t it only give the Vice President the power to declare the losing Presidential candidate as the winner as long as that candidate won the electors from at least one state.

      Still crazy, but one notch less crazy than the VP being able to declare themself ruler.

    2. Your party pulled out all the stops to steal this election, and now whine and cry because republicans are looking to use any legal path to victory. Tough shit for you. If we can keep Biden out, even in a technicality, it should happen.

      Democrats are totalitarian scum. You destroy everything you touch.

      1. No, the Republicans claim the election was stolen so are pulling out all the stops to steal the election. It’s blatant hypocrisy. Where is tarring and feathering when we need it?

      2. All the stops, huh? And, yet, you’ve got absolutely JACKSHIT to show for it. Just a bunch of whining and crying like a little bitch. Either show us what you got or STFU.

        You ain’t keeping anybody out. Fact is, that senile old fuck is about to replace YOUR senile old fuck and there’s not a goddamn thing you can do about it.

        “Democrats are totalitarian scum. You destroy everything you touch.”

        HE’S scum?? LOL. He said Pence was “honorable” [which he’s not] and you insult him for it. Awww. No winning with you guys, huh? 😉

    3. Honorable? LOL. Hardly. He’s a disingenuous cuck that lives to serve Trump. He’s also a theocrat, and buddies with Roy Moore, theocratic pedophile, which means he’s a scumbag. So, no, not even close.

      1. Have you seen Biden sniff a child’s hair on camera for a looooong time or gab about children liking to touch the golden hair on his legs? How about the video of Hunter Biden and his young niece, or the girls in China? Is Roy Moore relevant anymore? Let’s focus on current pedophiles.

  9. It’s too bad that VP’s (and presidential candidates) John Breckinridge in 1860, Richard Nixon in 1960, Hubert Humphrey in 1968, and Al Gore in 2000 were not aware of this supposed power. They could have counted only the electoral votes for themselves and proclaimed themselves elected!

  10. In January 2017, Joe Biden could have declared Hillary Clinton the winner. Who knew?

  11. Well, if “Congress shall make no law” doesn’t mean Congress shall make no law, and “Shall not be infringed” doesn’t mean shall not be infringed, then maybe the 12t Amendment doesn’t mean what it says either.


    1. Good point.

  12. “The 2020 presidential election was one we’d expect to see in a banana republic, not the United States of America,” Gohmert said on Monday, alluding to Trump’s wild claims of massive election fraud. How would you describe a country where the current leaders have the power to remain in office regardless of what voters say?

    1/2 TDS
    1/2 election fraud doesn’t exist because it interferes with the open borders stance

  13. Have any states sent multiple sets of electors from which the VP will have to choose? I’m not aware of any but who knows – an alternate set of electors might have been selected by hacked voting machines and certified in Venezuela by exiled patriots…

  14. The most astonishing thing about the continuing faux indignation from the left over the election challenges is that they still think it’s ALL ABOUT TRUMP. I used to think TDS was just the product of trying to fit in. Now I think it must be brainwashing

  15. Yeah, baby! Turn it up to 11! Somethings gotta give eventually!

  16. It doesn’t matter what these people say.

    What may matter is what McConnell does over the next couple of days.

    “The Kentucky Republican, without committing to hold a vote, said the Senate would address Mr. Trump’s demands to boost the size of the checks to $2,000 from $600 as well as his concerns about Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, which regulates online speech, and his complaints about purported election fraud . . . .

    “This week the Senate will begin a process to bring these three priorities into focus,” Mr. McConnell said, without offering further details. A person familiar with his thinking said Mr. McConnell was considering putting all three items into one bill.”

    —-Wall Street Journal

    December 29, 2020


    If McConnell is trying to defeat the $2,000 checks in the senate by making the Democrats vote for an investigation into voter fraud as well, I’m not sure that will work the way he expects.

    The investigation into voter fraud is 100% a Republican issue, and would almost certainly fail if it were introduced on its own in the senate. However, if the senate passes the $2,000 direct payments and the repeal of Section 230 with the fraud investigation included–and House is required to pass an identical bill–they may be happy to do that.

    The polls in Georgia have the Republicans and the Democrats in a dead heat for control of the senate. An investigation into voter fraud by congress when both chambers are controlled by the Democrats is a non-issue–and there may be a 50/50 chance of that happening. Meanwhile, when the two parties are battling for control of the senate, being the party that’s responsible for depriving Georgia’s voters of $1,400 a piece isn’t likely to play well.

    If the three bills are introduced separately, the repeal of Section 230 is likely to go through, the $2,000 direct payments are likely to go through with the help of a few Republicans (at least), and a version of the investigation into voter fraud will never be passed in the House.

    If the bills are wrapped up in a three way all or nothing situation, the odds of it passing aren’t as good, but I’d say it’s still likely to pass. The Democrats have virtually nothing to fear from an investigation into voter fraud, especially with the news media all but 100% on their side. If this were about introducing an investigation into Hunter Biden’s influence peddling, that might be another story. As it is, however, don’t be surprised if Section 230 is repealed and you have $2,000 on the way by the end of the week.

  17. Okay this shit is just getting fucking ridiculous. And doing nothing to help further the cause. If, and it is a big if, anything like this actually occurs, it will be a bigger loss of our freedom than Biden and Harris winning. Just shut the fuck up already. At this point anyone who still expects Trump to be President after January is smoking some good shit. Biden is scary, using this perverted interpretation is even scarier.

    1. > At this point anyone who still expects Trump to be President after January is smoking some good shit.

      Not good shit. Just shit. Some dog turd they scooped of their lawn.

      1. Good idea, perhaps, just maybe! Despite what SOME people claim, I have NOT tried it!

        But somehow THIS is VERY relevant! (Labrador shit specifically).

        cheech and chong Smoking Dog Shit

        1. I don’t know if you smoke shit, but it is the sole source of nutrition for you.

          1. You take yourself too seriously, man. 🙂

        2. Good one, we need more Cheech and Chong right now with all this heavy shit going down.

    2. Nope.
      Giving in to a blatantly stolen election is the worst possible outcome.
      I know you believe in “norms” and the restraint inherent in them, but the left definitely doesn’t.
      You can pretend the leftist totalitarianism of 2020 didn’t happen, but it’s real.
      Liberty dies with the stolen election and seizure of power.
      Our only choice is to go meekly into complete subservience, or fight for ourselves with the same zeal leftists have trying to cancel us and everything this country has ever stood for.
      If Biden is installed in the presidency, 11.4.2020 is the date the USA expired.

      1. No, advocate for laws that stop the shenanigans you believe happened. Having the sitting VP decide what electoral votes gets counted just assures that in the future there never will be another election. And will likely lead to civil war.

        1. “No, advocate for laws that stop the shenanigans you believe happened.”

          election fraud is legal?

          1. No, but they don’t do enough to stop it either. It isn’t difficult to say voter fraud is illegal but they way elections are held makes voter fraud possible. If you take away from the quoted sentence is that I believe voter fraud is legal your reading skills are pretty sophomoric.

            1. She’s just pointing out that laws aren’t exactly being enforced, and are powerless to stop cheating if the powers that be decide they want to cheat.

              1. So make the laws easier to enforce. The problem I see is that the current law makes it nearly impossible to stop fraud. If I have to show up in person and shoe an ID to buy a gun, I don’t think it is to much to ask that people vote in person and show a valid ID, and that we ban canvassers and ballot harvesting.

        2. They no shit destroyed (and continue doing so) the lives of tens of millions of people to create the conditions necessary to seize this one office.
          You’ll forgive me if I’ve given up on the rule of law and future constraints after what they’ve done this year.
          It’s going to get worse, as the illegitimately installed presumptive president elect himself promises.
          Weimar Germany wasn’t exactly a third world shithole either.

          1. Actually the Writer republic was pretty much a third world shithole because of the Versailles Treaty.

            1. Weimar. Damn autocorrect.

          2. So, basically if Trump is gone in January, which is the most likely outcome, you just give up?

        3. Nardz wants civil war.

      2. Such a blatantly stolen election yet no courts found any credible evidence that the election was stolen. And this was despite many very partisan people looking very hard.

        1. You think if you say that enough times it becomes true. It doesn’t, but then, you’re a known liar.

          1. The only ones who think I am a liar are the ones who believe crazy stuff (like the election was stolen) because thinking I am a liar is the only way to maintain their fantasy.

            1. No, I believe you are a liar. You have proven it time and time again.

              1. I have never posted false info, I may once in a while get some small facts in error, but I am always honest here.

                1. Yeah, keep telling yourself that. And your small errors tend to be real whoppers.

                  1. Fuck off, faggot.

      3. And no I don’t believe in norms I believe in fighting battles you actually can win and not giving up just because you have a setback. I believe in not tilting at windmills. And I don’t believe in constraint but in channeling the energy into something constructive rather than Quixotic. Build on the success Trump had with minorities. Work on winning back the suburbs. Work on better laws and electing state lawmakers that will fight voter corruption. And go ahead say the election was stolen, hell the left has been saying that about every election they’ve lost since 2000. But don’t try and subvert the constitution by allowing the VP to decide which votes count and which don’t.
        Work on removing bad judges. Most the time elected judges run unopposed. And many state judges are elected. This is an opportunity to replace the ones you feel decided wrongly.

        1. Work on voter referendums that support better voter verification systems and forbid the type of stuff you feel allowed the election to be stolen. Drum up grass roots support. Show the Democrats and progressives that you are watching and that you have support.
          Write letters to the editors. Start a blog. Develop a system that gets your voice out there. The progressives actually are cheering these Quixotic quests like the Congressman mentioned in the story, because rather than accomplishing anything, they are taking energy away from actions that will make voter fraud harder.

          1. The writing is on the wall, and giving up is exactly what you’re advocating. I don’t have much hope that anything other than a violent revolution will save the nation, but I doubt it will happen. We’ll get Soviet style totalitarianism, complete with gulags and show trials, and far more intrusive because of technology. But when you realize that, it will be too late.

            Tell me how you’d respond to this situation:
            You have a massive herd of cattle. Biggest the county has ever seen. You just bought a bunch more at auction and put them in the pen today. Before you go to sleep, you look out at your herd satisfied and impressed by its size.
            You wake up the next morning only to find your herd has dwindled to just a few cows and your fence is broken, with thousands of hoofprints leading right through it to tire tracks that go to the road. You go to your neighbors to check if anything happened to them, and sure enough find the same signs. 4 or 5 ranches whose pens look the same as yours.
            Then you get to another neighbor’s, a ranch that had only a few head of cattle just yesterday. Suddenly he has a herd that covers hundreds of acres and a pristine fence, though fresh wear leading into the gate.
            You ask him where he got all those cattle and he says he made some good deals. You ask him to look at some of their tags and he refuses. You ask him for a bill of sale and it looks suspicious. Finally you ask him if he stole your neighbors’ and your cattle and he says “no, you’re a conspiracy theorist”.
            You go to the sheriff and he says there’s nothing he can do. You go to one judge, then another and another, but they refuse to even consider your claim or investigate. You go to the press and they tell you your neighbor totes made a legitimate, magical deal. You go to the county, federal, and elected officials and bureaucrats and they refuse to help.
            Losing that herd is going to cost you and your family everything. Same for your neighbors. And the neighbor whose herd inexplicably grew has been telling you for years that he wants your land, which he’ll now get because you’re bankrupt and the bank is going to auction it off.
            Oh well, guess you’ll just have to go on welfare and live on the streets?

            1. But that isn’t exactly what happened. Trump didn’t lose cattle but Biden gained cattle. It smells fishy but is impossible to prove. So we need a system that provides more transparency, , whole also protecting the anynomitu of the vote.

            2. And your analogy is a bit insutling.

            3. Also, no I don’t give up, I keep working with the cows that I have to rebuild my herd. Also I brand my cattle so 8 can prove they are mine. I support in person voting and voter ID and banning ballot harvesting. Those would make any fraud much more difficult.

              1. When you allow people to cheat and steal, it gets worse until no one even votes, because what’s the point? Why would I get in my car and show my drivers license at the poll as I did, when in Nevada people were gathering up thousands of ballots from apartment complex mail rooms, filling them in with a Biden dot, and sticking them in the mail, postage paid? My vote and my time MEAN NOTHING at that point. 75 million people who voted from Trump were disenfranchised by Soros et al and the Zuckerberg $500 million ground game that included gift cards for voting.

      4. There was no stolen election and I cry at all the snowflake republicans who can’t stand that they got beat lmfao

        1. If they can prove it, I say keep saying it, so we can avoid it in the future. But stop pretending there is any way Trump is going to remain President.

    3. Oh, I was certain Biden would be the next president even before the election.

      But in the meantime, I have no problem with Trump raising as much hell as possible. The more damage he does on the way out the door, the happier I am!

      1. As long as he leaves and doesn’t try this cockamamie idea, I don’t care how much hell he raises. But letting the VP decide which votes get counted is a recipe for tyranny. Even more so than a possible stolen election.

        1. At this point the tyranny is a given. Better my tyrant than theirs!

          1. Until it isn’t.

        2. Yea, the most powerful cabal that’s ever existed stealing official authority in front of everyone’s eyes is totes the lesser threat of tyranny…

          1. The WHO changed the definition of herd immunity to contradict known virology, but as long as Pence approves of disputed electors we won’t have tyranny…

            1. Not at all what I said. And the election isn’t disputed any longer, at least as long as the house approves the electoral college on January 6th. You may not like it. It may seem questionable but the process as laid out in the constitution has been followed. Pence deciding to arbitrarily throw out electoral votes, which has never happened before, is unprecedented and does not appear at all supported by what Gohmert is quoting.

              1. Now, the caveat is that since some states have sent competing electors the House will decide on which ones should be seated. But that isn’t the same as Pence deciding which ones get counted and which ones don’t by himself.

          2. Yes, it is because it can be corrected. But allowing a partisan to decide which votes count is nothing short of tyranny. Also, despite a number of irregularities, it is a stretch to ca it obvious. There are questions that need to be answered, and the system definitely needs improvement. But it isn’t self evident either, or you wouldn’t have such a hard time convincing those of us who don’t support Biden but don’t buy into the stolen election narrative.

            1. You see what you want to see, and you’ll have to accept that responsibility.

              1. What do I see, according to you? Just what exactly do you think I am saying?

                1. You see a world as it’s always been, constrained by normality and civility.
                  You think there’s hope in laws and voting.
                  I’m telling you that 2020 marks a phase shift where faith in our institutions is no longer reasonable.
                  You have hope that playing by the rules won’t result in exactly what’s happening now, and has been happening.
                  The Gazi (global socialist) party/caste/cabal is right now waging war on the American people, specifically the middle class, working class, and independent business owners.
                  They already have more power than ever before wielded by Man.
                  And they’re on the verge of absolute victory.
                  We’ve seen this same process play out in Russia, Germany, China, Korea, Cuba, Venezuela, etc and know where it leads.
                  What cause for hope do you have that The System will prevent liberty being utterly crushed beneath the totalitarian bootheel?

  18. But Gohmert’s claims are, and legal scholars are not liking his chances.

    But Gohmert’s claims are what???

  19. “The 2020 presidential election was one we’d expect to see in a banana republic, not the United States of America,” Gohmert said on Monday

    And having the VP unilaterally decide the election outcome is supposed to be better? That sounds exactly like something one of the banana republics would pull.

    1. If that’s what we’re left with, so be it. Can’t let Biden get away with this fraudulent bullshit.

      1. I don’t want Biden to be President and would be perfectly happy if a Democrat at least the current form, never wins another election. But if you support the VP deciding the election, and manage to get it happen, I am willing to label you a domestic enemy of the Constitution and my oath requires me to defend against enemies of the Constitution foreign or domestic.
        And yes, I think in many ways that progressives are enemies of the Constitution and will fight them at every turn, including if it becomes necessary, with actual arms. But if you think me and those like me would support you in allowing the VP to decide which votes get counted, than you are a fool.

        1. So an explicitly constitutional action makes one an enemy of the constitution, who you’ll kill, but you’ll show restraint when it comes to progressives?

          1. This isn’t at all constitutional. The constitution allows him to open the votes but not to decide which ones get counted. Fuck, you are getting as bad as WK and ChemJeff.

            1. The state legislatures send competing electors, but the governors and AGs are all who count?

              1. No, in the case of competing elecors, the house decides. Not the VP. It is in the Constitution.

              2. And the Senate also has a say. It will be decided on January 6th, if and it is a big if, they vote to seat the competing elecors rather than those approved by the states, as is their right under the Constitution, than it would not violate the Constitution. I think that would create a lot of problems but it follows the Constitution.

                1. But the process itself didn’t follow the constitution in many instances.
                  Short of disqualifying the certified results of multiple states, there is no way to make this already unconstitutional election constitutional.

          2. And I said I would take up arms if necessary against progressives. And fighting doesn’t require actual arms. I’ve listed above all the ways you can fight the progressives. But because they don’t end up with Trump somehow getting to be President you rejected them. Unfortunately at this point I have to agree with WK, Sarcasmic, ChemJeff et al that you are nothing but a Trump sycophant. If you don’t get your way destroy the system. Is that what you suggest? Fuck that is as bad as the progressives.

            1. You are as distracted as they are by Trump.
              He is part of a much bigger picture.
              If they can do to Trump what they’ve done, what can’t they do to any non-member of the political establishment who seeks elected office?
              What can’t they do to you?
              We no longer have a government of elected representatives, we have a ruling Soviet.
              Independence has been murdered.
              RIP USA

              1. Cry harder, faggot. Trump lost fair and square, snowflake.

                1. There’s no evidence of that, eunuch.

                  1. No evidence of you being a faggot? I disagree.

      2. Prove the “fraudulent bullshit.” I’ll wait.

  20. Gohmert is a fucking idiot and anyone who listens to him is also a fucking idiot.

    1. Go fuck yourself cuck.

  21. The GOP is like Charlie Brown and the Dems are like Lucy holding the football. The only smart thing for the GOP to do is run up and kick Lucy in the head as hard as they can. Guess who wants to stop playing that game first?

    1. No. Biden won the election, idiot.

      1. It’s not really winning if you cheat.

        Biden could only win fair and square at a NAMBLA meeting.

        1. Prove the cheating. We’re still waiting, dipshit.

          1. Poor lefties. Jan 6 joint session is gonna be fun to witness trumps second term as president.

      2. “Biden won the election”

        And covid19 is the deadliest pandemic in recorded history.
        And blmantifa protests were peaceful.
        And there’s no evidence Joe Biden is corrupt.
        And Russia collusion was a legitimate concern, not completely fabricated.
        And humanity controls global climate.

        1. Russia collusion was proven in a Senate investigation. Humans do affect climate. You’re a fucking idiot.

      3. Poor lefties. Biden didnt win a plurality of legal votes in states that matter.

        1. Furthermore, there is no constitutional right for Americans to vote for president. Electoral college as determined by state legislatures vote for president.

  22. Gohmert is a pathetic Trump cuck.

  23. Gohmert Pyle

  24. People will disagree with me on this but I hope they keep it up as long as possible. These people made everyone stop what they were doing for four years as they screeched endlessly about Russia, even as they knew there was nothing there. Let them suffer a few more days of the charge of an illegitimate presidency of their own. It’s not quite a fair trade as the one side has all the journalist leading cheer on their hoax whereas the other has none, but still. Stay at it you magnificent bastards.

  25. Does at least explain why Mistress Harris has not gotten around to resigning her Senate seat…

    1. Harris knows she wont be VP, which is why she wont resign.

  26. Quick, Pence should agree to a consent judgment giving the plaintiff what he wants! Or, possibly, he’s not the correct defendant.

  27. Anyone who suggests that the Vice President can and should unilaterally select the next President is unfit for office.

    This is such an obviously bad idea that even if it were somehow legal, the objective should be to change the law, not enshrine it in practice.

    And frankly, anyone trolly enough to argue otherwise really needs to reconsider their life choices.

    1. Enjoy the coming totalitarianism

      1. Yep. Heard that when Obama was elected. And when Trump was elected (but from the other side).

        1. Yea, and 2020 totes didn’t happen.

    2. Poor lefties. They dont understand logic or they are truly propagandists.

      The BP counts the votes from states.

      The EC votes from states didnt comes from the state legislatures, so are all void. Per the us constitution.

      Expedience does not equate to constitutional validity. Poor lefties.

  28. The red team vs. blue team on a libertarian publication’s comments section is so goddamn hilarious, don’t you faggots have enough of your own corners of the internet to shit up screeching at each other? Bunch of bootlicking statists shouting about which senile old fuck is going to continue to fuck us in the ass; the autism is strong.

    1. don’t you faggots have enough of your own corners of the internet to shit up screeching at each other? the autism is strong.

      Welcome to the club! You fit right in!

      Bunch of bootlicking statists shouting about which senile old fuck is going to continue to fuck us in the ass

      Please keep your sexual fantasies to yourself; this isn’t that kind of site.

  29. God, give it up people. Trump lost and he and his supporters should accept it gracefully.
    The idea that the VP can just dismiss EC ballots he or she doesn’t like would be hilarious if it wasn’t so damn scary.

    1. Constitution strikes again lefties.

  30. Proof that you can sue for anything in the US. Please, can we have a working loser-pays system?

    1. Sure. Biden pays for election fraud expsenses.

  31. But never mind all that, Gohmert says, because the 12th Amendment gives Pence “the exclusive authority and sole discretion to open and permit the counting of the electoral votes for a given state, and where there are competing slates of electors, or where there is objection to any single slate of electors, to determine which electors’ votes, or whether none, shall be counted.” He adds that any such decision by Pence is not subject to judicial review.

    Well, that’s the rules for the election officials in GA and PA; why not apply the same rules for the electoral college?

    Pence can always say “trust me, I counted all the votes accurately”!

  32. Poor unreason. Constitution strikes again.

Please to post comments

Comments are closed.