Election 2020

Trump Wants More Stimulus Spending. Biden Wants a National Mask Mandate. Both Are Wrong.

Is it too much to ask for a presidential candidate who cares about America's fiscal health and respects the limits of his office?

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The 2020 presidential election is shaping up to be a choice between a man who wants to spend America further into oblivion to solve a problem that money can't fix, and a man who believes being president gives him license to regulate the personal behaviors of more than 330 million people (and also wants to spend America into oblivion).

In the first corner is President Donald Trump, who is now trying to paper over his administration's many, many early mistakes in handling the coronavirus by running the federal printing press at warp speed.

Trump on Wednesday agreed with Speaker of the House Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) that more stimulus spending is necessary. In May, Pelosi's House passed a $3 trillion coronavirus stimulus bill—that's $3 trillion on top of about $4 trillion in emergency coronavirus spending already authorized, some of which remains unspent—but the Republican-controlled Senate has refused to pass it. Citing concerns about the size of the deficit, Senate Republicans have pushed for a smaller package that would cost about $500 billion.

Trump left no doubt where he stood on Wednesday.

"I like the larger amount," he said from the podium in the White House briefing room yesterday evening. "Some of the Republicans disagree, but I think I can convince them to go along with that."

Over 13 million Americans remain out of work in large part due to the pandemic. There may be a good argument for a limited federal response that helps those most hurt by the pandemic and by mandatory shutdowns. Another round of business-focused aid might be necessary as the crisis drags on. But the "higher number" that Trump prefers in the House-passed stimulus bill is a mess of special interest handouts and unnecessary aid to states that shouldn't be looking to the deeply indebted federal government for help in the first place.

It is difficult to comprehend just how much money the federal government has already spent because of the COVID-19 pandemic. Here's a useful illustration—compare the total government spending during this year to the 2009 stimulus, which looks like a tiny bump in comparison:

Continuing to spend like this is beyond reckless.

Meanwhile, Trump's opponent in November's election also made coronavirus-related news yesterday—but not in a good way.

During a news conference in Delaware, former vice president Joe Biden said he believed the president has the authority to issue a national mandate requiring the wearing of face masks in public. "Our legal team thinks I can do that, based upon the degree to which there's a crisis in those states, and how bad things are for the country," Biden said, according to CBS News.

Biden has been beating the "mask mandate" drum since the Democratic National Convention but has not been forthcoming about the details of that plan, like how his administration would enforce such a rule.

Wednesday's remarks, however, suggest that Biden's team is actually building a legal case for having a president require that individuals dress in a certain way. That's beyond ridiculous, of course, and seems likely to be unconstitutional.

Should all Americans wear masks when they are unable to socially distance during the pandemic? Yes. Should the president be ordering this behavior? Absolutely not.

As Elizabeth Nolan Brown wrote last month, the biggest problem with a national mask mandate is that someone has to enforce it. "That means either turning federal agents to the task of monitoring mask-wearing or giving more funds to state and local police departments so they can do so," she argued. "No matter how it's accomplished, there's no way that doesn't lead to more spending on law enforcement, more government surveillance, and more contact between cops and communities that are already overpoliced—all at a moment when millions of Americans are demanding just the opposite of that."

Oh, and Biden also supports the passage of the House's $3 trillion stimulus package—part of roughly $11 trillion in new spending that Biden's campaign is proposing to pay for with about $3 trillion in new taxes. You can do that math on that one by yourself.

What neither Trump nor Biden has figured out yet is that it is impossible to stimulate your way out of an economic crisis that's been created by people being unwilling or unable to spend money. When the federal printing press churned out $1,200 checks for every American at the start of the pandemic, personal savings rates shot through the roof. There are some people who might need additional help to get through this crisis, but throwing money at the rest of us—to say nothing of bailing out the postal service and the Kennedy Center—makes no sense.

The mask mandate has a similar problem. It is impossible to enforce, so the only realistic option is to convince Americans to voluntarily wear masks—which is something you can do without a mandate. The president, like all other government officials, should encourage the wearing of masks and endeavor to provide accurate, timely information to all people so they can make their own risk assessments. That's all. Just please do that one thing.

It is a near certainty that either Trump or Biden will be elected president less than two months from now. It is also a near certainty, regardless of who wins, that federal spending will continue to rise and that presidential power will continue to metastasize.

There might be good reasons to vote for either Biden or Trump—and there are plenty of reasons to vote against both, as the new issue of Reason explores—but when it comes to their plans for the next stage of dealing with this pandemic, neither man deserves our confidence.

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  2. The Trump administration will ban downloads for both TikTok and WeChat on Sunday.

    Meanwhile, the latest deal for TikTok has Walmart joining Oracle to make a new venture owning TikTok’s U.S. operations majority owned by Americans–and with a promise to take TikTok public sometime in the next year.

    The primary purpose of the Trump administration’s move here is to encourage Bytedance to accept majority American ownership.

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    2. Isn’t this the very sort of thing we have been complaining about China doing?

      1. I’m not defending it, and I think it’s basically a campaign stunt. This was self-created, with due dates, etc. to coincide with when it would be best for Trump to have forced a Chinese company to sell itself to Americans. That Trump is insisting that the U.S. get a cut from the billionaires that are cutting the deal just underscores the point. It’s a campaign stunt.

        1. I don’t think you were.

          It is just another example of the farce and hypocrisy that is the Trumpian China policy.

        2. Who is it supposed to appeal to, though? It’s totally out of line with the conservative tradition of supporting capitalism and limiting business regulation.

          1. President Trump won the nomination in 2016 by winning states with open primaries–where Democrats could vote for him. The only open primaries Trump lost (when the primaries still mattered) were to native sons, Kasich in Ohio and Cruz in Texas.

            https://www.cnbc.com/2016/03/22/trumps-big-advantage-open-primaries.html

            Trump won the nomination and the presidency because Democrats voted for him. White, blue collar, workers have been the bread and butter of the Democratic Party since the New Deal, and the way Trump won swing voters in Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin was by appealing to disaffected former Democrats–who are patriotic, believe in unions, and whose local economies were destroyed by manufacturing moving to China.

            Trump’s trade war with China appealed to those people.

            And if he can force a Chinese company to sell itself to Americans, over the objections of Emperor Xi, no less, then that plays really well to voters in the swing state rust belt.

            1. P.S. Ronald Reagan won because he appealed to the same demographic, as well.

              “Reagan Democrats no longer saw the Democratic party as champions of their working class aspirations, but instead saw them as working primarily for the benefit of others: the very poor, feminists, the unemployed, African Americans, Latinos and other groups.”

              —-Reagan Democrats

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reagan_Democrat

              That was written about Reagan Democrats in 1980 and 1984, but it might as well have been written about Trump Democrats in 2016. They were even from the same region.

              When the Democrats become absorbed in identity politics, they lose the support of their bread and butter, blue collar base. It’s happened before, and it will happen again.

              1. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new…MGf after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier.

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            2. Interesting. We’ll see how it works out for the Trump campaign.

              In 2016, it helped Trump that Hillary Clinton was completely tone deaf and unappealing to blue collar Americans.

    3. And if Obama had done this, everyone here would have called him a fascist.

      1. which they also did to Trump.

  3. but has not been forthcoming about the details of that plan, like how his administration would enforce such a rule.
    With guns, of course.

    1. There are not enough federal agents to even start to enforce such a rule. As with cooperation with ICE, local officials may or may not enforce the rules. Most red states or even red counties and cities will never ‘find the time or resources.’

      1. Nice cell phone you got there… It would be a shame if we had to check it for illegal downloads.

  4. And this is why libertarians lose. They embrace fiscal austerity even when the stupid lockdowns were the states’ doing.

    Bail out the American public. Cut all subsidies to corporations. Cut defense spending precipitously. Cut taxes on the poor and middle class and raise them on the rich and large corporations. You can’t plunge the country into a recession and then say, “Well, we can’t afford to bail you out.” Fail to provide the public with stimulus money, and they’ll turn to a socialist left that’ll make Beltway libertarians’ fears of Big Government look quaint by comparison.

    1. That should say “state’s,” but I suppose “states'” works, too.

      1. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new…TMz after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier.

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    2. Libertarians lose elections because people don’t want to accept personal responsibility and individual freedom. Doesn’t change my mind about it though. I would rather be on the side I believe in.

      Voting for something you don’t believe in in the bigger loss.

      1. Keep telling yourself that.
        Lot of accomplishments in 50 years, right?

        1. The way I see it, is liberty is winning the public’s support (I recall listening to Hillary in the 2016 debates and thinking she sounded conservative, though contrary to her actions), though the political class is fighting against it. And many libertarian ideas have been implemented. E.G., deregulated beer, wine, airlines, taxis (due to Uber and Lyft), and pot is now legal in many states. I could list many other policy changes.

          I agree with Echospinner – many people are looking for government to care for them, forgetting, ignoring, or believing otherwise that government will take from them to do it. It’s immoral, selfish and greedy thinking, that one should, may or can use government force to live off the fruits of other people’s labor, but it’s so appealing to the lazy.

      2. Big-L “Libertarians” lose elections because they rarely are libertarian in any meaningful way. It’s always posturing. Look at Johnson, JoJo and Justin Amash.

        Besides, libertarianism is a life philosophy, not a political party.

      3. Personal responsibility for a lockdown caused by Chinese sadists and enforced by state governments? People need money now.

    3. What austerity? Spending is up by like 2 trillion dollars.

      1. “Austerity” wasn’t the right word. Refusal to help people who were harmed by government negligence is a more accurate phrase.

    4. “Bail out the American public. Cut all subsidies to corporations.”

      I don’t understand. Doesn’t the American public own most of the corporations in the USA? How do you decide how much to spend to bail out each individual? And who exactly is going to pay for this if not the “American public”? Does the owner of a sports stadium get a bigger bailout then say a guy who mows lawns because his loss is huge compared to the landscaper? Given this, why take money from the public, keep a bunch of it to pay for the government bureaucrats who then redistribute what’s left according to some unknown, unfair, rules? Especially when it seems people ought to be able to keep their property from people taking it for their own purposes, in defense of property rights.

      Bailouts are immoral, because the money to do the bailout is taken by force from people who were smart or lucky enough, to avoid business failure. The business successes, are businesses run by people who serve their customers better than than ones that failed, so we should let those under performing businesses fail because they were unwilling to change to better practices.

    5. So let me get this straight. Unless we enact communism, like literal communism where the government prohibits private ownership of business and prints everyone a check that they can spend at the government store, unless we create that we’ll get saddled with whatever Bernie Sanders/BLM is selling?

      Sweet Jesus just end me now.

  5. “Is it too much to ask for a presidential candidate who cares about America’s fiscal health and respects the limits of his office?”

    This article should consist of one word, “yes”.
    But Eric, so – – – – – – – –

  6. And if Biden was President, all of the people will still be alive.

    Christ, even WaPo had to call him out on that one.

    Is this really a worst pair of choices than Clinton/Trump? Man does 2020 suck.

    1. Trump is the best president since at least Reagan.
      Not sure why libertarians keep tripping over themselves to fall in line with progressive groupthink

      1. I’m bothered by two things Trump does. Spend and make shit up. I don’t like his immigration stuff, but eh. I don’t see how that falls into “progressive groupthink”.

        1. Less Trump “making shit up” than having the establishment media make shit up for him.

          As for the current stimulus proposal, it’s 2.5 billion dollars less than what congress is pushing.

          1. Sorry, 2.5 trillion.

          2. Trump does make shit up. The stupid thing that the media does is lie about things he says to make it sound worse. There are plenty of real things to criticize him for, but they go for the ridiculous and dishonest take every time.

          3. I just discovered OANN. No wonder you people don’t admit to being FOX News junkies. You’ve moved on to the hardcore shit, right? Full on North Koran style pro Trump propaganda. That’s what you sound like.

            1. Typical racist, taking credit for what indigenous peoples already discovered.

              #cancelColumbus
              #cancelTony

              1. Just change “first” to “last” and the kids‘ history texts will be right about Columbus, except where they leave out all the sadistic genocide.

                1. The textbooks haven’t left that out since the sixties. Just how old are you?

            2. Superspreader, YOU are the Fox News junkie here. You always bring it up, clearly are a viewer, and are obsessed about them.

              I don’t think I’ve watched more than ten minutes of cable mews in the last month. At least we now know what you do with your time when you’re not at the local bathhouse.

              1. One America News Network.
                I’ve only caught a few clips, but it does come across as solid right wing and nationalist. Doesn’t come across as something worth watching for me. A bit too biased and focused on framing to their narrative

            3. I have no clue what the fuck OANN is.

    2. It could have been Warren vs. Trump.

  7. “During a news conference in Delaware, former vice president Joe Biden said he believed the president has the authority to issue a national mandate requiring the wearing of face masks in public.”

    You know, I would just love to see how Biden would enforce such a mandate. It might prove rather difficult to prosecute or fine 150 million (or more?) Americans who just might say: “Enough, already.”

    1. And when the police start stopping people for not wearing masks, we’ll have to hear more about how systemic racism is to blame.

      1. To paraphrase George Carlin, we would ALL be Biden’s niggers…. (at least I think it was Carlin who said that about Nixon)

        1. Maybe we could get t-shirts that say ‘Biden’s Nigger’.

          1. How about “We are all ………….’s niggers now.” I don’t see any candidate for president with a chance at winning the election for whom such a t-shirt would be inconsistent, though perhaps differing in some aspects and in some small degree.

    2. Says the guy who was proud of his local supermarket for enforcing fascist mask mandates and calling the cops on a dissenter…

      1. Private property rights don’t matter to you?

        1. Private businesses enforcing totalitarian social conditioning is fascist.
          Full stop

          1. Full Stop. The store in question was asking customers to wear masks before it was mandated (masks were being worn by a lot, if not most folks here, when it was simply “encouraged” by the governor). But, since she couldn’t get 100% compliance in every single county, she mandated masks for everybody — even in counties, which, at the time, had not one single case. But then, she is pretty “woke.”

            1. Keep celebrating it then, by all means

              1. When I was a kid, virtually ever store I remember had a sign saying “No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service.”

                I guess that was a fascist plot, too, eh?

                1. to foot-breathers, yes …

                  1. Thanks for pointing that out to me. Such a policy is obviously discriminatory to amphibians. (I can see the signs already: “Frogs are People, Too!)

                    1. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new…DSf after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier.

                      Here’s what I do…>> CashApp

          2. No wonder you see fascism everywhere you look. You don’t know what the word means.

            1. Nominally private enterprise that works for, and according to, government dictat.
              Poor try, dumbass.

              1. All laws, are, technically, “government dictat.” I am assuming that you would not object to a business seeking police help to stop folks from selling heroin out of the trunk of their car in said business’s parking lot. Or would you? I mean, it’s still “dictat.”

              2. Right, which isn’t what a supermarket freely choosing to mandate masks on their property is. That’s the part you’re missing.

    3. It might prove rather difficult to prosecute or fine 150 million (or more?) Americans who just might say: “Enough, already.”

      Over half of the states have or have had a state-level mask mandate and there has been zero pushback.

      1. There is considerable “push-back” where I live. A whole lot of people are upset about the mandate, especially considering that, when it was encouraged, but not mandated, most people, including businesses, had no problem with it. But, since there isn’t rioting and looting going on, there isn’t anything exciting to report. Our county reports a total of 110 cases, and no deaths. At least 40 of the cases were in the county jail system (which “imported” one convict from the State system who was ill.)

      2. Plenty of pushback in Washington State.

        1. Yep. Only reason people are still wearing the masks in businesses is that Inslee is threatening THEM with not policing their customers. He can eat shit.

    4. Harris already said they wouldn’t enforce the mask mandate, the Biden administration just wants to set a good example. (as if a prosecutor doesn’t know what a “mandate” is.)

      1. Therefore, I am free to assume that prosecution, or the threat there-of, would be “selective.” Sounds about right for Harris.

      2. A good example for whom? All of the people who are obedient enough or can be convinced that it is the right thing to do are already wearing masks.

  8. “In May, Pelosi’s House passed a $3 trillion coronavirus stimulus bill—that’s $3 trillion on top of about $4 trillion in emergency coronavirus spending already authorized, some of which remains unspent—but the Republican-controlled Senate has refused to pass it. Citing concerns about the size of the deficit, Senate Republicans have pushed for a smaller package that would cost about $500 billion.”

    This is both inaccurate and outdated.

    Before President Trump extended unemployment benefits without Congress’ input, House Democrats passed an additional $3.5 trillion stimulus package–with $1 trillion in bailouts for states like California, Illinois, and New York. Once President Trump extended unemployment benefits through the upcoming election in November, support for passing stimulus completely dried up in the Senate. While it is true that Mitch McConnell, big spender that he is, was privately pushing a $500 billion “skinny” package at one point, that package was never even made it out of committee–because the Republicans in the Senate preferred to do nothing.

    That’s where things stood a couple of weeks ago. Since then, McConnell proposed an additional $350 billion in additional spending–with assistance to states to reopen their schools (conditional on the state in question reopening the schools), additional money for another round of $1,200 checks, and the rest of it mostly going to the unemployed and for coronavirus treatment. Once again, just because Mitch McConnell wants something doesn’t mean the other Senate Republicans care, and the additional $350 billion package failed to clear procedural hurdles earlier this week because Senate Republicans prefer to spend nothing additional.

    I suspect something, eventually, will be passed. If they don’t spend in a recession and ahead of an election, that may be miraculous evidence that God is real and watching over us. However, if it doesn’t happen in the next two weeks, it probably won’t happen at all.

    My primary concern is that we don’t bail out the states–and neither President Trump nor the Republicans have been willing to do that so far. The House Democrats are using the coronavirus and the “need” for stimulus as an excuse to bail states like California, Illinois, and New York out of their unfunded pension obligations, and there is no good reason why the rest of the country should be forced to pay for those outrageous pension obligations. There is no more libertarian outcome than to starve the states of a bailout so thoroughly that they’re forced to lay off thousands of state employees and bring their pension benefits down to levels somewhere less outrageous–and that’s what’s happening now because we’re doing nothing.

    Meanwhile, Pelosi’s $3.5 trillion monstrosity is an ex-parrot–because both President Trump and the Senate Republicans refuse to bail out the states that way and because they refuse to even consider spending that much money. Like I said, as of earlier this week, the Republicans in the Senate wouldn’t even bring a bill to spend another $350 billion up for consideration.

    Once again, because the Republicans aren’t libertarians doesn’t mean they aren’t vastly superior to the Democrats.

    1. They are, but only relatively. Not when compared to normal humans.

    2. “Once again, because the Republicans aren’t libertarians doesn’t mean they aren’t vastly superior to the Democrats.”

      In some cases, no real distinction at all, unless one prefers getting fucked-over one way instead of another.

      1. In this case, the Republicans are making a $3.5 trillion difference.

        States are already laying off workers by the thousands. That is the sound of the government getting smaller–and the difference is the Republicans refusing to bail them out.

        It’s a big difference.

        1. “It’s a big difference.”

          Regarding that particular policy, I agree. I was thinking about overall, where most Repubs are as bad as the Dems, albeit in different ways. As I look at the roster of Dems and Repubs I have the chance to vote for here in local and statewide elections, I am seriously disappointed. But then, I always am.

          1. You’re always disappointed, but it’s never your fault…

            1. It’s not my fault that the repubs and dems win 90% of the elections here. I really can’t see voting for any of them. I might end up voting against one, though. I am new to this location, but the dem candidate for the Secretary of State looks like a disaster in the making. Probably will vote for the Repub in that race, who seems rather more sane.

      2. Republicans like getting fucked in the mouth instead of the ass.

    3. So your example of good politics and ethics is to put untold numbers of people out of work because you disapprove of their jobs philosophically.

      What do you even get out of the Republican Party? For most people it scratches that particular white racial grievance itch. Do you really do all this ridiculous embarrassing excuse-making for a tax cut?

      1. You mean like the Democrats and the health insurance industry? Coal industry? Fossil fuel fracking industry?

      2. Sigh. Tony, reducing the size of government will result in people losing jobs. I know you only pretend to be a libertarian, but this isn’t very complicated. Thanks for proving that you are a big government authoritarian.

    4. True. Rape is also vastly superior to rape and murder.

      1. I didn’t say that.

        I said that not spending $3.5 trillion is better than spending $3.5 trillion, and if you can’t see the difference between those two, you’re willfully blind.

        1. I can see the difference between the two spending plans just like I can see the difference between rape and murder and just rape. Yeah one is not as awful as the other, but your comment seemed to be cheering something awful just because someone else wants something worse.

          Are analogies completely foreign to you?

          1. Why is it awful that our government doesn’t spend money that it’s not support to spend? You do realize that all of this bailout/stimulus spending is 100% un-Constitutional?

            No “stimulus” package was approved in August and the economy and jobs are rebounding just fine. This is the opposite of awful. This is letting the economy work without government interference; which every true Libertarian should applaud.

          2. “Yeah one is not as awful as the other, but your comment seemed to be cheering something awful just because someone else wants something worse.”

            What’s awful about not spending $3.5 trillion?

            So far, the Republican alternative is still spending nothing, and there isn’t anything awful about that.

  9. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new…ABc after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier.

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  10. I may be wrong here, but doesn’t Biden also want more stimulus spending, much more than Trump? So Trump wants some stimulus spending, and Biden wants even more stimulus spending than Trump wants AND a mask mandate, and this is both sides?

    1. A simpler way of looking at the central issues of the day is, which do you prefer, the Devil or the Deep Blue State?

      Alternately put: Do you prefer to have your pussy grabbed, or your hair smelled? Chose well, it’s gonna be 4 more years of Hell, of one flavor or the other!

      1. I’ll go with the side that isn’t burning down their own cities, demanding a totalitarian police state to solve a non-problem, and promising to spend 5-10 times more monopoly money than we currently spend.

      2. MIKEY HIHN LADIES AND GENTLEMEN!

        WHAT A KNEE SLAPPER!

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          1. Don’t feed Sqrls, folks.

      3. Squirrelly, please follow Hihn’s example and die.

    2. Trump does approve of these massive deficits in any case.

      BUT BIDEN! is no defense at all. Obama was a cheapskate in comparison to Trump.

      What good is the GOP if they jack spending up to record levels? It’s like a Barry Bonds that can’t hit. What good is he?

      1. Gold Glove left fielder?

        1. 8 Gold Gloves actually

          1. Also the dude could rip off a bag back in the day, too.

      2. No new wars?

        1. Troop levels in the endless war are up under Trump compared to Obama. Also civilian deaths. You don’t hear about that from Tucker Carlson, but by any measure Trump is the bigger warmonger.

          It’s no great accomplishment to be a Republican and not invade yet another country on false pretenses. Let’s set our expectations higher.

          1. Holy shit. Do mine eyes deceiveth me? Is this a coherent and poignant comment from Tony?

            1. Your eyes deceiveth you.

          2. We know you masturbate to Carlson nightly.

          3. So, what were your expectations for Obama? His troops reductions were consistent with Bush’s original plan. Gitmo NOT closed. Wars started in Syria and Lybia. Killing Americans on foreign soil without due process. (Remember HuffPo equating Obama to Bush?)

            And be honest, Trump has reduced troop levels around Syria and is trying to reduce levels in Afghanistan. You know full well that the Congress and the true war-mongers are holding up his efforts. Sadly, it’s both GOP and Dems fighting against these reductions.

            While Trump hasn’t been a full Libertarian in this area, he’s a huge improvement over Obama. Only blind TDS would cause a person to believe otherwise.

            1. So, what were your expectations for Obama?
              To be fair, Obama is black, so tony had lower expectations.

  11. What a stark contrast, since Biden doesn’t want more stimulus spending. If only we had a president who embodied Joe Biden’s fiscal restraint but wasn’t so hung up on masks, amirite? BOTH SIDES!!!!!!!!!!

  12. “I like the larger amount,” said the Con Man.

    That evil witch Nancy tricked him again! I am told by the Trump Cult that he really does not want these record deficits and spending.

    1. I’m told that you like child porn.

  13. There is a candidate for president who stands for smaller government and fiscal responsibility. Her name is Jo Jorgensen.

    1. Always believe marxists, eh?

    2. The way I see this, is Trump is profligate because he knows Congress is profligate and trying to stop the spending is a battle he can’t win, so he doesn’t try. This has the benefit of actually exposing Congress (we know who votes for more spending; RINOs and Democrats, while the libertarian leaning Freedom Caucus are the fiscal conservatives), and has even led to Democrats bringing up the subject of overspending.

      Ultimately we really shouldn’t be blaming Trump or Congress, because WE collectively elected them: voters are ultimately responsible, and we’ve been collectively voting ourselves money from the treasury we shouldn’t be getting, or paying taxes for.

      The interesting thing is how the RINOs claimed the “fiscal responsibility” mantle when they never earned it, and always got enough GOP votes to pass the spending.

  14. So… both sides bad?

    Trump wants more spending… bad.

    Biden wants a mask mandate… bad.

    But Biden wants even more spending than Trump, too….

    1. Choosing the lesser evil is still choosing evil.

    2. Trump would rather the democrat governors reopen their State’s businesses, but they won’t. This all the fault of the democrats.

  15. “Is it too much to ask for a presidential candidate who cares about America’s fiscal health and respects the limits of his office?”

    Yes.

  16. Did this article really attempt to imply that Biden doesn’t want more “stimulus” spending than Trump does?

    1. Haha! You get it. Sad that Libertarian writers at a Libertarian magazine/website cannot understand it. OR, they do understand and are playing the useful idiots.

  17. It is absolutely ridiculous to be a sniveling penny pincher in the middle of one of the biggest global crises in 100 years. We can’t prop up the economy during its nosedive into oblivion, there might be a hyperinflation event! It’s real this time come on!

    Useless. All of you.

    1. You can’t prop up the economy and hold down the economy simultaneously.

      1. Tell it to the virus that is causing the economic problems.

        1. The virus has a negligible effect on people in the labor force. All economic problems are caused by the insane reaction to the virus.

          1. ThE vIrUs MaDe ThEm Do It!

        2. It isn’t the virus, it’s people like you Superspreader.

          1. That was meant as a reply to Tony, AKA Superspreader.

    2. Nancy, is that you?

  18. the biggest problem with a national mask mandate is that someone has to enforce it

    No, the biggest problem is that it is illegal, idiotic and tyrannical.

    There are things in the world more important than not catching the ‘Rona. Jesus titty-fucking Christ, people have fought wars and died to defend their rights and freedoms. And now we’re supposed to give it all away because there is a moderately serious repiratory virus out there? Ben Franklin wants to kick you in the nuts.

    1. *slow claps*

    2. Interesting about wars and respiratory viruses. In WW1 around 50,000 American soldiers were killed. However nearly as many, around 43,000 died from the Spanish flu.

      It is said that troop ships would arrive with half the soldiers dead or dying.

      I do think a federal mandate is a bad idea.

      1. I’m not sure what your point is. I’m not comparing deaths from the virus to deaths from war. I’m talking about what people have been willing to sacrifice to fight for liberty. And now people are willing to give it all up when facing a 1:1000+ chance of dying and a somewhat larger chance of having an elderly friend or relative die. That’s some weak ass shit.

        1. Nobody has ever fought a war for “liberty.”

          1. George Washington! Calling George Washington!

    3. 80% of deaths are over 65 years old. So, 40k deaths for people in the work force. Basically, a normal flu season.

      I keep hearing out 2020 sucks so much and is a huge disaster. Well, nobody to blame except ourselves for letting the media and politicians ruin our economy and take away our freedoms.

      Cheer on Tony. You’re a beacon of Liberty.

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