Covered at Reason 24/7: Associated Press Drops Use of "Illegal Immigrant"

Now that the firestorm over how the Associated Press refers to partners in gay marriages has died down, it's time to stoke some new flames! The Associated Press announced today it will no longer use the description "illegal immigrant" as part of its style.

Via ABC News:

The Associated Press, the largest news-gathering outlet in the world, will no longer use the term "illegal immigrant."

The news came in the form of a blog entry authored by Senior Vice President and Executive Editor Kathleen Carroll on Tuesday afternoon, explaining that the decision is part of the company's on-going attempt to rid their Stylebook of labels.

"The Stylebook no longer sanctions the term 'illegal immigrant' or the use of 'illegal' to describe a person. Instead, it tells users that 'illegal' should describe only an action, such as living in or immigrating to a country illegally," Carroll wrote.

AP reps go on to note that they prefer to label behavior rather than people, describing schizophrenics as people "diagnosed with schizophrenia" rather than just schizophrenics.

Does this mean they'll also stop using the word "felon"? We have a lot of nouns in the English language that have behavioral labels and judgments embedded in them.

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Comments

[A Serious Man]

So you are not an illegal immigrant, you're now an immigrant who is in this country illegally? I'm sure that'll make them feel very much at home.

[VG Zaytsev]

It worked for colored people.

[AlmightyJB]

No they're replacement citizens.

[Night Elf Mohawk]

Do they still use "racist" and "sexist"?

[Jerry on the boat]

Or teabagger?

[Professional Target]

Yeah, as I explained to a Democrat friend, nobody gets to throw homophobic insults at people and then complain about them increasingly identify against you.

[In Time Of War]

"Democrat" Now that's an ugly label.

[John Galt]

Hush you, they're no longer called Democrats, the new word is FormerKKKracebaitingneocommunistlibertyhaters.

[Hugh Akston]

WHAT PART OF UNDOCUMENTED RESIDENT OF FOREIGN ORIGIN DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND

[darius404]

"UNDOCUMENTED". If they're undocumented, how do you know they really exist? Huh? Answer that one!

[CE]

I think there are plenty of documents, but many of them are forged.

[John Galt]

And we should be doing the same. There's huge and obvious benefits to living a life based upon a forged identity. Why should this wonderful thing only be for non-natives? Seems this thing is at best inequality, and at worst extremely racist.

[AlmightyJB]

So if I get busted for creating several fake identities I can just claim I'm a victim of a hate crime perpetrated by the man.

[John Galt]

There you go. And if you crime is serious you may face deportation hearing and possibly be sent back to the USA (if you chose to show up for the hearings that is).

It's win win win for everyone!

[AlmightyJB]

They're not forgeries they're replicas.

[Butts Wagner]

Many URFO sightings occur in the American southwest...

[Heroic Mulatto]

Does this mean they'll also stop using the word "felon"? We have a lot of nouns in the English language that have behavioral labels and judgments embedded in them.

They don't have to if they pair the word "felon" with the term "convicted".

[Xenocles]

Or 'alleged.'

[Acosmist]

All names are labels.

Language is just labels.

Up next: AP banishes Sinn und Bedeutung.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

Imma let you finish but FUCK AP STYLE.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

(The preceding comment has absolutely nothing to do with the content of this post. Just, fuck AP Style because it's horrible. CHICAGO ALL THE WAY!!!)

[Night Elf Mohawk]

I don't know... "Chicago" and "style" together fail in some many areas it's hard to imagine it's the right way to go.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

We gave the world OXFORD COMMAS! And then sort of took them away, but kept them optional, but still WAY BETTER THAN AP. Also, we don't hyphenate words like "preeminent" or "reenter." Look at me, stylin' with my prefixes that allow two es to peacefully coexist without a hyphen coming between them. Oh shit, COEXIST. QED.

[Hugh Akston]

Oxford Comma 4 Eva

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

I always knew you were the right sort, Hugh. Even if Epi says otherwise.

Wait, what am I talking about? Especially since Epi says otherwise.

[Irish]

Sentences just look naked without the Oxford comma.

'I ate salad, soup and steak.'

Jesus, it just looks perverse.

[heller]

You ate a 'soup and steak' salad? Gross.

[Dweebston]

Who gives a fuck about an Oxford comma?

[Night Elf Mohawk]

People who think toast, bacon and eggs and orange juice sounds like a jumbled mess of a breakfast.

[Ted S.]

It all goes down to the same place.

[AlmightyJB]

"Who gives a fuck about an Oxford comma?"

It's mom, you heartless bastard.

[Dweebston]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_i1xk07o4g, for context.

I do give a flip about Oxford commas.

[Dweebston]

Oh, and @AJB my mother is, in fact, an English teacher. She doubtlessly does.

[Ted S.]

Also, we don't hyphenate words like "preeminent" or "reenter."

That's because you're supposed to use a diaresis mark: pre?minent and re?nter.

[John Galt]

What about the combination of the words Chicago, style and pizza?

[Night Elf Mohawk]

About as appropriate as Chicago, style, and St. Valentine's Day party.

[Stormy Dragon]

Fuck AP and Chicago. Gungam Style is clearly superior to both!

[Xenocles]

You mean Gungan Style, right? How's that song go... "Meesa Gungan Style," I think.

[Stormy Dragon]

Hey, you transliterate ????? the way you like, and I'll transliterate the way I like.

[Xenocles]

Apparently it does exist... Sadly.

[heller]

Die.

[John Galt]

Guggenheim Style.

[CE]

It's actually "Gangnam style".

[John Galt]

"Guggenheim."

[MJGreen]

You have to swallow the Gs, the Ns and the M.

(fuck Oxford comma)

[Jeff]

It's actually Gundam Style.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

CHICAGO!

[darius404]

"In conclusion, we need a better solution to our budget solutions than more tax revenue. Furthermore, fuck AP style."

[Heroic Mulatto]

Ceterum censeo modem AP-ensis futuandam esse.

[Heroic Mulatto]

*modum

Goddamit

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

HM, that is so going on my family crest. Or whatever.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I'd be quite interested in the blazon of the rest of your crest.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

It's a work in progress. I'm still looking for a charge that properly expresses "ass and titties" in a reasonably small space.

[Hyperion]

T&A, an internationally recognized symbol. Guys brains automatically can translate it from any language.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

Well I was hoping to get a little more creative than that, but there's always the fallback.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Might I suggest:

Gules, on an open book argent, a woman's breast sable and a woman's buttocks sable

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

Why they gotta be sable, man? But I like where this is going.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Why they gotta be sable?

The rule of tincture, silly.

[Stormy Dragon]

"Quia pedicabo ego vos, ut 'quare"

[Heroic Mulatto]

Risi

[Heroic Mulatto]

^that was a reply to Stormy^^

[Stormy Dragon]

That's dehumanizing! The preferred term is "styles that are fucking AP".

[Thane of Whiterun]

No, fuck APA style.

Or both. Just don't leave out APA.

[MikeP]

"The Stylebook no longer sanctions the term 'illegal immigrant' or the use of 'illegal' to describe a person. Instead, it tells users that 'illegal' should describe only an action, such as living in or immigrating to a country illegally," Carroll wrote.

They're also going back to their antebellum articles and changing "fugitive slave" to "slave who is living in the north illegally" or "slave who fled illegally".

[Hyperion]

Oh, for the sake of bejeebus. Fuck this PC non-sense, it's offensive. I'm offended. I thought it was undocumented residents already or some such bullshit.

What's it going to be now? Undocumented Americans? Like African Americans, a term that I will never fucking use. How many blacks in American have ever even been to Africa? I bet half of them, or anyone living here, of any other race, couldn't even point out Africa on a map. I bet at least 50% of high school graduates today don't even know that Africa is a continent.

Fuck these PC assholes, everyone of them, straight to hell. It's not only time for everyone to start ignoring them, it's time to publicly ridicule them into oblivion.

[Tman]

Dave Matthews, the whitest white man known to the color spectrum is in fact an African American. Born in South Africa, raised in the US.

And white as the pure driven snow.

[Episiarch]

"This is our skin color chart. It goes from Seal, to Seal's teeth."

[General Butt Naked]

My buddy from libya gets annoyed when you call him african-american.

No idea why, he just doesn't like it.

[Hyperion]

Probably because he's smarter than most American liberals, and thinks the term is purely unwelcome, patronizing, bullshit.

[BigT]

He probably does not identify with the A-A culture and considers it insulting.

[General Butt Naked]

I'd say that both of you are correct.

I know a good amount on Middle Easterners and they come here and work their asses off to become Americans and don't want to be thought of as different, or a sub-section of Americans. On the other hand, a lot of guys from the Middle East, especially those that came here after 9/11, think that they are thought of as goddamn terrorists and still make something of themselves, but blacks aren't and are less successful.

Not making a value judgement on this, it's just how I've seen things.

[Fatty Bolger]

I've known Jamaicans who really don't appreciate being called African-Americans. It's a stupid term, at least the way it's commonly used.

[Coeus]

Dave Matthews, the whitest white man known to the color spectrum is in fact an African American. Born in South Africa, raised in the US.

And white as the pure driven snow.

As is Charlize Theron.

[Calidissident]

"Like African Americans, a term that I will never fucking use. How many blacks in American have ever even been to Africa?"

I don't use the term African American, I've always just said black and have never had anyone get offended. However, under this logic, what do we call people of Asian descent? We almost always don't even use the qualifier "Asian-American" we just say Asian. Referring to them using color or some other geographic identifier ("Oriental") is considered offensive.

[Hyperion]

And what about us crackers? WTF? Do we now need to be called West European Americans? Damn, I just offended myself!

It's stoopid on the loose! The inmates are now in charge of the asylum. Black, White, Asian. Works for me, fuck any retard that is offended. This shit stops now!

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

It's Euro-American, Hyperion.

[Hyperion]

NO IT ISN'T, GODDAMNIT, Nicole!

It's fucking American!, or Americano, if I'm in Latin America. I'm not a Europeon!

I've never worn knee socks and sandals, with soccer shorts held up by suspenders on a beach!

[Fatty Bolger]

Note that he doesn't deny wearing a man purse.

[Hyperion]

That's a European shoulder bag, asshole!

[free2booze]

White Hispanics can trace their roots back to Europe

[General Butt Naked]

I prefer Italian-Scotch-Irish-Slovakian-American, you insensitive cunt.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

Well since I'm English, I'm kind of supposed to be insensitive to at least two of those things.

[General Butt Naked]

I'm actually related to Alexander Hamilton so any hate is probably well deserved, but there's no excuse for insensitivity.

[Hyperion]

Limey American!

[General Butt Naked]

Limey (opressing) American!

Scotch-Irish is its own thing.

[Ghetto Slovak Goatherder]

Yes, I am offended when anyone can't tell I am Slovakian.

[Irish]

I prefer "filthy mutt constructed piecemeal from the dregs of Europe."

Admittedly, it doesn't exactly roll off the tongue.

[ant1sthenes]

Given that they don't treat any past mistreatment as an excuse to fail at life, I expect the sort of people who care about that thing on the left side of the spectrum would consider them white.

[SweatingGin]

Generally Asian-American refers to first generation immigrants, right?

My personal favorite was some PC paper substituting African-American for black, for British blacks. Been looking for a link but not finding it.

[Hyperion]

I've never heard an Asian referred to as Asian America, only Asian, or Chinese, or Korean, or whatever nationality.

I've only heard the African American BS. And I refuse to use it, even in the company of those who do.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

Asian-American is definitely a thing, and I don't normally see it restricted to first-gen.

[Hyperion]

I just call my Korean friend, you crazy slanty eyed asshole. Is that PC?

[Hyperion]

But seriously, I know what you are saying, I have heard the term before. But I just never hear it used, although some of the folks that I work with seem to be extra super careful to use that African American term. But I've never heard any of them say Asian American when referring to our Asian colleagues.

[jesse.in.mb]

I read a paper about Asian identity in America in HS. There were three primary categories and different sub-groups preferred certain terms over others. It gets messy with Latinos and terms like Chicano and Hispanic in a similar way.

Two of my coworkers had a hilarious fight over whether or not Filipinos were Asian or Pacific Islanders. The Filipino coworker nearly choked a bitch out when she kept calling her a Pacific Islander.

[Heroic Mulatto]

The Filipino coworker nearly choked a bitch out when she kept calling her a Pacific Islander.

She can choke bitches all night and day, but it doesn't change the fact that she's Austronesian.

[Tman]

Nothing is more frighteningly hilarious than to watch someone call a Kiwi (New Zealander) an Aussie (Australian) or vice versa.

I saw fisticuffs over this a few years ago. It was awesome. From what I can tell drunk kiwis can't fight as well as drunk Aussies, but the Kiwis sure can run their mouths with the best of them.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Nothing is more frighteningly hilarious than to watch someone call a Kiwi (New Zealander) an Aussie (Australian) or vice versa.

OBLIGATORY

[neoteny]

That's fuckin' righteous, man.

[jesse.in.mb]

HM: Oh, I know, she was just really unhappy about being lumped in with Samoans.

Tman: Aussies are incredibly high performance drunks. It's like going out drinking with Germans or something.

[Tman]

I would stack Aussies against any nationality possibly excluding the Scottish.

I hung out at a bar that hosted a rugby league for years so there was a pretty decent mix of nationality represented. The Germans I knew couldn't last two hours with the Aussies. The Aussies were like machines. Some of them were essentially a loaded weapon after enough booze. And then Kiwis came in and started running their mouths. Good times.

[jesse.in.mb]

I was in Europe with a friend (who is a terrible drunk) and she said she was going out drinking with Aussies. I warned her that drinking with Aussies is ALWAYS a mistake. She didn't believe me.

Suffice it to say that we ended up not talking for most of the last leg of her trip and I will not travel abroad with her, ever again.

[Irish]

This story really requires more details.

[jesse.in.mb]

Oh I missed most of the interesting bits. We had an extremely early train to catch and I'd been drinking absinthe (yay Slovenia!), so I went to bed. She came tearing in at 4am weeping about how sorry she was for waking me up (this went on for 45 minutes and involved me saying "shut the fuck and go to sleep" in my gruffest voice more than once) and us barely getting to the train with her unshowered and smelling of booze and stale cigarettes until we got to Budapest.

[Shine on, Nikki Diamond]

jesse, your chick friend sounds insanely like my bff. Like, not in a "the details of this actual story" way, but in a "she has totally pulled that bullshit on me countless times" way. I sympathize.

[jesse.in.mb]

Yeah, everyone feels bad, but we highly finesse our social engagements with her to avoid heavy drinking situations (and hiking). She's great in most other situations.

[Tman]

Yeah, is she was an average American girl I can only imagine. Most of the Aussies I knew were good dudes even when they were in to their eighth case for the evening, but call them Kiwis and you might as well have just pissed on them instead.

However, I've heard stories from Scottish men about Scottish women that would make most men tremble. Even Aussies.

[Ted S.]

I'd rather be lumped in with Thin Mints myself.

[Thane of Whiterun]

"Asian-American" refers either to people of:

* East and Southeast Asian descent born in America
or
* The above group plus those born elsewhere but maintaining permanent residency in America

But Jesse is right that there are a bunch of different categories and subgroups.

In high school we kept things simple and just had Asians, Indians, and FOBs.

[Hyperion]

The Filipino coworker nearly choked a bitch out when she kept calling her a Pacific Islander

Try calling a Brazilian, Hispanic or Latin.

[CE]

If you go back far enough, we're all African-Americans.

[Hyperion]

You're onto something here.

I was 1/64th African only 10,000 generations ago. I'm a victim! Where's my affirmative action? I want into Harvard now!

[General Butt Naked]

I've always liked that argument.

Now that that's out of the way, I'll be taking my 40 acres and mule now.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Charlize Theron is my favourite African American.

[Xenocles]

Here you go.

[Calidissident]

Don't really care either way, but as a society, we need to realize that "illegal" should not automatically signify "bad" or "immoral." Bad, stupid, and immoral laws exist. That doesn't mean a lot of illegal things are bad, but we shouldn't blindly follow that line of thinking. Judge an action on the ethical and moral significance of it, not on whether or not Congress has deemed it bad.

[Calidissident]

The first phrase of my comment is referring to what term the media uses

[Hyperion]

All illegal drugs are bad, mmkay?

[buybuydandavis]

Rejoice, Brothers!

Another word removed from Newspeak, another step closer to perfection! Doubleplusgood!

[WC]

That was my first thought as well, however in reality it's just reordering the words. If we prefer to use meaningful labels, we should come up with a more descriptive word than illegal. At what point did that word start being used as a noun?

[Hyperion]

If it ever gets to the point, I should say when, that most of us need to flee Amurika, I don't think being offended by the natives of fled to country is going to be really high on my list of concerns. Them not sending me back to Amurika will be my highest priority.

Likewise, I am sure that the folks who are here that don't have any legal resident status, are not nearly as worried about being called illegal, as are these pathetic douchebag proglodyte, liberal whiteys , who have nothing better to do than trying to create new victims to join their shitty, stupid, whiney victims cause.

[Palin's Buttplug]

The Australian Sex Party's policy platform has been described as libertarian.[6] It is opposed to mandatory internet censorship, and supports the introduction of a national media classification scheme, including a rating for non-violent sexual content and an R18+ rating for computer games. The ASP also supports a royal commission into the sexual abuse of children in Australian religious institutions, and is in favour of legalised abortion, gay rights, voluntary euthanasia and the decriminalisation of all drugs for recreational use.[23] The party is in favour of sexual rights for intellectually disabled individuals.

(Wikipedia)

[Some call me Tim?]

supports the introduction of a national media classification scheme, including a rating for non-violent sexual content and an R18+ rating for computer games.

Definitely not a libertarian position.

[SweatingGin]

No idea why shrike posted that, but IIRC, Australia has an outright ban on any games that would have the R18+ rating right now.

[Hyperion]

Australia is well on their way to being the first country to ban everything. They are the envy of Nanny Bloomberg.

[Xenocles]

Shrike has been described as a moron who spends most of his time trying to seduce rams. Discuss.

[Sevo]

Xenocles| 4.2.13 @ 7:49PM |#
"Shrike has been described as a moron who spends most of his time trying to seduce rams. Discuss."
I thought it was pigs. Or his daddy; he seems to be ambivalent.
Is that enough discussion?

[Xenocles]

My comment was too much discussion, unfortunately.

[Lord at War]

The party is in favour of sexual rights for intellectually disabled individuals.

Three generations of Buttplugs are enough.-OW Holmes

[DRM]

So, "illegally immigrated migrant"?

[Xenocles]

"Migratory worker (or non-worker, not that there's anything wrong with that) temporarily displaced from legal status through no fault of his/her/its own."

[CE]

Hard-working international adventurist temporarily classified as "illegally" migrating to this fine country, pending approval of the inevitable path to citizenship.

[Xenocles]

I was once a hard-working international adventurist like you, and then I took an arrow to the knee.

[Hyperion]

You should have joined the Storm Cloaks. You deserve that arrow, Imperial scum!

[Hyperion]

and supports the introduction of a national media classification scheme, including a rating for non-violent sexual content and an R18+ rating for computer games.

Australia is the most retarded country, politically, on the face of the planet. Nanny statism at its very worst.

In what universe would the comment above about media be considered libertarian? Must be somewhere where people are upside down all of the time and their brains are bleeding from it.

[Calidissident]

And somehow they have a freer economy than the US

[Hyperion]

How so? I'm surprised to hear that.

[Some call me Tim?]

According to the Fraser Institute, Australia is 5, US is 18.

http://www.freetheworld.com/release.html

[Calidissident]

Heritage also has Australia at 3 and the US at 10

http://www.heritage.org/index/

[BigT]

'Politician' has been replaced with 'power-hungry person with honesty issues.'

[woodsy]

The AP absolutely did the right thing here. A person, by himself, cannot be described as "illegal," as opposed to merely his actions. So anyone hollering about how the PC police is on patrol should just calm the fuck down and appeal to his better senses, namely, reason and logic.

"Illegal immigrant" is just an invented term deployed by certain political groups over the past twenty years to sway people against immigration reform by effectively trying to paint a large, and certainly diverse (in more ways than one), population of people as criminal. Entering this country without a visa is merely a civil violation, it's NOT a criminal offense.

People can just as easily invent a label tomorrow for people who violate traffic laws, such as those against speeding, and call them 'illegal motorists' even though such violations would qualify as civil and not criminal. The difference, of course, is that most individuals would find this label to be ridiculous. That is until you repeat it enough times in the media that suddenly it becomes accepted and used as part of popular everyday lingo.

Those crying out about Orwellian doublespeak have it ass backwards.

[CE]

The grammar police are much more welcome than the PC police.

[Irish]

"Illegal immigrant" is just an invented term deployed by certain political groups over the past twenty years to sway people against immigration reform by effectively trying to paint a large, and certainly diverse (in more ways than one), population of people as criminal.

They are still in this country illegally. They don't call them 'criminal immigrants,' they call them 'illegal immigrants,' which is actually what they are.

People can just as easily invent a label tomorrow for people who violate traffic laws, such as those against speeding, and call them 'illegal motorists' even though such violations would qualify as civil and not criminal.

Yeah, but we use 'drunk driver.' If I drive drunk, I am a drunk driver. If I immigrate illegally, I am an illegal immigrant. I hardly think that qualifies as Orwellian double speak.

[General Butt Naked]

If I drive drunk, I am a drunk driver.

Which, based upon your handle, we an assume is always.

[Irish]

Based on your handle I can assume that you are a former Liberian soldier who has since converted to Christianity.

[General Butt Naked]

Soldier?!

Fucking soldier?!

Try WARLORD, motherfucker.

[Irish]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Butt_Naked

Joshua Milton Blahyi (born September 30, 1971), better known by his nom de guerre General Butt Naked, is a former leader for the Liberian warlord Roosevelt Johnson[1] in the First Liberian Civil War known for his fierce, violent, and eccentric measures in the first years of the 1990s. He was originally a tribal priest, and since the war he has converted to Christianity and become a preacher.

I'm sorry, what were you saying? I couldn't hear you over the sound of you playing second fiddle to the actual warlord, Roosevelt Johnson.

[General Butt Naked]

I ate Roosevelt Johnson.

So much for him.

[Irish]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roosevelt_Johnson

Johnson fled to the United States Embassy and was then transported out of the country to Nigeria. He was charged with treason and convicted in absentia, in April 1999. He died in 2004 in Nigeria.[2]

Is there no end to your lies?

[General Butt Naked]

Who do you think wrote that wiki article?

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Wikipedia is not a source.

[Irish]

I would kill you for your impudence Archduke, but I hear that when you kill an Archduke you trigger a world war.

[Hyperion]

I can actually vouch for GBN, from when I fought alongside him in Liberia, as Captain Hyperion.

I never cared much for his style. The fighting naked thing was just annoying, and when he insisted on eating the hearts of our victims, he always insisted on eating them raw, while I preferred deep-fried enemy hearts, with some good tabasco flavored dipping sauce.

I won't even go into what happened after Liberia, in Somalia you know, while we were searching for the one Libertarian paradise.

[WC]

+1

[Sidd Finch]

"Illegal immigrant" is just an invented term deployed by certain political groups over the past twenty years

bullshit

[Sevo]

OT:
"Warbler" Senseman gets removed from the tree in which she's been 'warbling' for a while.
She's a whacko, and the freeway's been 'discussed' by everybody in the county, but it's still kinda hard to pick the good guys from the others.
http://www.sfgate.com/news/art.....403696.php

[Irish]

OT: New York City politicians attempt to rig mayoral race.

The six defendants nailed by the feds Tuesday certainly did represent many levels of government. State Sen. Malcolm Smith, a Democrat, allegedly wanted to rig the 2013 mayoral race so he could run as a Republican. Republican City Councilman Dan Halloran reportedly helped arrange the bribes to buy Smith a waiver, and two Republican officials had their hands out, reportedly saying "show me the money and the waiver is yours."

BIPARTISANSHIP!

[Hyperion]

There's only one party in NYC. The one that's going to steal all of your money, and then use it to take all of your rights away.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

What would Cesar Chavez do?

[Hyperion]

Could be a boring posting night unless someone comes up with a really good thread hijack here.

Back to Kingdoms of Amalur and killing some 2 headed trolls for a bit...

[jesse.in.mb]

How are you liking KoA? I don't remember much of it.

[Hyperion]

It's a fun game. Really fun combat, and lots of loot.

It has a bit of a learning curve, so if you think the combat isn't that much fun at first, it's probably because you aren't used to it yet.

The stylized graphics are pretty, it's not Skyrim by any means, but still nice to look at.

Lots of dialogue and come interesting character, tons of side quests.

I can't say much more, I am only in about 12 hours, just purchased it on Saturday after playing the demo and liking it.

[Hyperion]

come interesting character

some interesting characters.... good grief, I've lost focus for the day...

[Proprietist]

There are a lot of rational, non-PC reasons not to use "illegal immigrant." First, the burden is on the author to actually prove the act of immigration by the person being referred to was illegal. What if they overstayed a legal visa but did not actually enter the country illegally? What if their legal status is in flux? What if they are planning to petition for asylum?

[DRM]

What if they overstayed a legal visa but did not actually enter the country illegally?

Then they immigrated illegally, even though they entered the country legally. "Enter" and "immigrate" aren't synonyms; the latter includes an intent to settle (see the OED).

[Hyperion]

What if they overstayed a legal visa but did not actually enter the country illegally?

I think that in that case, they are 'out of status', and that is the term that is actually used. Now, if they are out of status for 5 years, then I think you can consider them to be here illegally.

I'm pro-immigration, just stating some facts here.

[jesse.in.mb]

Will this work as a thread-jack for you Hyp?

Lena Dunham ?@lenadunham 9:16 PM - 29 Mar 13

The @taylorswift13 show tonight=most life-affirming thing I've experienced (NOT hyperbole. After all, haven't yet been to a gay wedding.)

[Irish]

I'm going to go sit in my corner and think about the state of American society.

[Tman]

Will your head explode if I tell you I've been listening obsessively to the new Justin Timberlake album?

I don't even like this kind of music normally. Something might be wrong with me, I don't know.

[Irish]

No. I don't judge people on the music they listen to. It's really just a collection of things in that post that make me so unhappy that people like this exist.

1. She refers to a fucking concert as 'most life-affirming thing I've experienced.' Life affirming to Lena Dunham isn't going for a swim in a beautiful lake, it isn't spending time with friends or family, or having sex with someone you love. It's a motherfucking Taylor Swift concert.

2. "NOT hyperbole." Thanks Lena. The only thing keeping me sane as my eyes passed that eldritch abomination of a first sentence was the hope that you were exaggerating. Now that I know you aren't, it's like all joy and beauty is leaving the world.

3. "After all I haven't yet been to a gay wedding." I am wholeheartedly in favor of marriage equality, and I still think that Lena Dunham should go fuck herself. The only reason to write this sentence is in a 'LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME!' sort of way where you signal how cool you are to other mindless progressives.

Seriously. Totally insufferable.

[Tman]

Agreed, but come on, if she didn't exist the left would've invented her already anyways.

It's like when someone posts a link from femifisting or Lezebel. How many times do you need to be reminded how many scary crazy bitches there are out there before you just start tuning it out?

[Episiarch]

Oh, my son, if you watched her show you'd realize she's trolling. The "NOT hyperbole" is the giveaway.

See, she trolls you and she trolls the people who agree with it. Do you realize how big of assholes every person on her show is, including her? She's making fun of herself and her friends and the people around her practically every episode. And they have no idea.

[jesse.in.mb]

Didn't you make fun of me in PM Links for making up a more prosaic version of reality?

[Ted S.]

No; we'll just all know you have terrible taste.

[Heroic Mulatto]

God, that bitch is insufferable.

[Ted S.]

Are you talking about Miss Dunham, or Miss Swift?

[Hyperion]

WTF did I do to deserve that, Jesse?

[jesse.in.mb]

Could be a boring posting night unless someone comes up with a really good thread hijack here.

I didn't want to half-ass it?

[Ted S.]

Wait until Taylor writes a song about being dumped by Lena Dunham.

[jesse.in.mb]

Elias Barton ?@EliasBarton 5h

@lenadunham How would you like to officiate ours? That would catch you WAY up AND fulfill my dreams... in multiple dimensions!

Dear Elias Barton,
You're dreaming to small.
Love,
Everyone.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Archaeologists find 'gate to hell' in Turkey emitting noxious gases

[Hyperion]

Ye Gads! It's the infamous bottomless pit from the prophecy! The end is nigh!

There's also been discovered in Turkey, a temple site, that has been dated to somewhere around 11,000 years old.

Gobekli Tepe

I think this all adds to up to Turkey being an evil and Godless abomination of a state. We need to nuke then, now.

[Hyperion]

them. I think I'm done here...

[jesse.in.mb]

Bipartisanship in action!

Lawmakers in New York Tied to Bribery Plot in Mayor Race

Mr. Smith [Democrat] was going to bribe his way onto the ballot to run for mayor of New York City.

But he needed help, from a disparate cast of characters, including a Republican City Council member from Queens, Daniel J. Halloran III, and two Republican leaders from Queens and the Bronx, Vincent Tabone and Joseph J. Savino

[Irish]

OT: New York City politicians attempt to rig mayoral race.

The six defendants nailed by the feds Tuesday certainly did represent many levels of government. State Sen. Malcolm Smith, a Democrat, allegedly wanted to rig the 2013 mayoral race so he could run as a Republican. Republican City Councilman Dan Halloran reportedly helped arrange the bribes to buy Smith a waiver, and two Republican officials had their hands out, reportedly saying "show me the money and the waiver is yours."

BIPARTISANSHIP!

- Me, 8:18

Get your head in the game, Jesse.

[jesse.in.mb]

Hot damn, I failed.

I'm very sorry Irish for biting your style, and being over an hour late about it.

[Irish]

Don't apologize. We both made the bipartisanship joke. That shows your heart was in the right place.

[Hyperion]

I was too nice to say it, but those Micks, they're all assholes. Us of Welsh decent are their betters.

[Hyperion]

Except that we can't spell descent after 5 beers, fuck it!

[Ted S.]

It's not as if your language has the vowels necessary to spell "descent".

[Hyperion]

Can I buy a vowel?

[Irish]

One day a man walked into a pub in Wales and ordered a pint of beer. All the other men in the bar looked at him and the barman asked, "You're not from around here, are you sir?"

"No," replied the man, "I am from London."

"So, boyo," said the barman, "What do you do for a living then?"

"I'm a taxidermist." replied the man.

"A taxidermist?" asked the barman, "What's one of them then?"

"Well," replied the man, "I mount animals."

The barman then turned to all the other Welshmen in the bar and said, "It's ok lad's, he's one of us!"

[jesse.in.mb]

Eh, I can't hold it against either of you. Iirc, my family has a little bit of everything from the British Isles except English.

[Hyperion]

Well, just so we know you're not one of those damn limeys, Jesse, then you're ok.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Our long national nightmare has ended.

[jesse.in.mb]

I'm sure he had to after Canada banned his rum

[Archduke Pantsfan]

That ban was here. It lasted a few hours before they realized it was dumb.

[AlmightyJB]

So are women now people with vaginas? 'Cause I love people with vaginas. Actually I like their vaginas. Vaginas are fun.

[Hyperion]

some people get too carried away with their love of Vaginas.

Doctor who loved vaginas too much

[AlmightyJB]

I'm impressed that you came up with that link so quickly.

[Hyperion]

Ancient Asian-American secret.

[Rich]

So are women now people with vaginas?

No, you un-PC imp!

Not all women have *legal* vaginas.

[AlmightyJB]

I forgot that only the cops were allowed to have assault vaginas?

[jesse.in.mb]

assault vagina!

[AlmightyJB]

That's just wrong! I guess it's good to always start with a finger. I have ten of those. Maybe I should start with a toe instead? I'd miss that even less than a finger.

[jesse.in.mb]

When my roommate originally sent me the link for the trailer and I saw it was called Teeth I messaged her back and said "I swear to god if this is about vagina dentata we are no longer friends" I need to be better about following through on my threats.

[AlmightyJB]

That's funny:)

[Hyperion]

Yeah, I have to say that when dealing with vaginas, best to insert something first, other than the face.

[Xenocles]

I forgot that only the cops were allowed to have assault vaginas?

[Hyperion]

Vaginas is best when they gots some T&A what come with em. You know, if I'm gonna be smackin some dat ass, I need some ass worth smackin! T & A! I ain't smackin on none those skinny asses! Bones is for dogs!

Sometimes, I think that God made me a black guy in a white mans body, with a bad attitude to go along with it. Creator dude sure has a sense of humor, have to admit that, anyway.

[SumpTump]

Sometimes man you jsut have to roll with that shit!

http://www.DatAnon.tk

[Archduke Pantsfan]

The opening episode of the third series of Games of Thrones was the most pirated ever, according to TorrentFreak.

"I probably shouldn't be saying this, but it is a compliment of sorts," Lombardo said ahead of the season 3 premier. "The demand is there. And it certainly didn't negatively impact the DVD sales. [Piracy is] something that comes along with having a wildly successful show on a subscription network."

[Proprietist]

I just never will understand why these channels don't create a la carte web streaming. I don't even own a TV, much less a cable package - and there are plenty of premium shows I would pay to watch legally online.

[DRM]

Because HBO is part of an entire larger family of cable TV channels, most of which get significant revenue based on how many people subscribe to just basic cable, and the rest on how many people watch them (which is only possible if you're subscribing to basic cable).

Yes, sure, you don't subscribe anyway, added revenue. But every person who switched from the combined cable-and-HBO model to streaming would hammer Time Warner profits.

[Tman]

I was giggling to myself about this clip from Mediaite Ben Carson To Levin: White Liberals Are 'The Most Racist People,' They Don't Want Me To Leave 'Plantation', especially the part where Levin asks Carson if they told him not to say anything in particular before the Prayer Breakfast speech he gave, and Carson responded that they asked they he stay non-political which of course he ignored. Why? Cause he's Doctor Ben Carson, BRAIN FIXER

"Oh, you got someone else to fix this brain for you? I DIDN'T THINK SO."

[Hyperion]

The guy has a serious set of ballz to be preachin the shit that he's preachin, while working in downtown Balmer, surrounded by white liberal PC racists.

[Irish]

The comments on that are terrible. They basically say 'OH YEAH! Well what about this one racist who is a Republican!?'

Carson is talking about ingrained racism in the entire leftist worldview, and their response is to point out individual racist Republicans.

Don't bother arguing with his point, guys. Just keep your head in the sand.

[AlmightyJB]

That's all they got.

[Palin's Buttplug]

For a libertarian you sure spend a lot of time defending Republicans.

[Irish]

I prefer them to Democrats, by far. My entire family is either Republican or libertarian. When I disagree with my Republican friends, they always rationally argue with me, whereas when I disagree with liberal friends they assume there's something morally wrong with disagreeing with them. I also believe that many Republicans are essentially libertarian leaning, since I've met many libertarian leaning Republicans, whereas the Democratic party is irredeemably fascist.

I don't hate Republicans, I just disagree with them. I'll also always defend them against charges of racism since those charges are just a way for liberals to dodge an argument.

Did I explain why I defend Republicans? Or would you like to write something about Bushpigs and AM radio? You know, play all your old hits.

[Thane of Whiterun]

My experience essentially boils down to lefties thinking I'm evil whereas righties just think I'm stupid.

[Hyperion]

My experience is that you can sometimes have a rational discussion with conservatives.

However, with progressives, it's a lost cause. They are totally the victims of mindless group think and rational discussion is completely lost on them.

The 2 biggest road blocks that I have seen with conservatives is the WOD and the foreign wars. On almost everything else, you can usually reach some common ground.

[jesse.in.mb]

Eh, I find I have to play the long game with both teams. If I get them to agree to small subtle things, they're more likely to buy in with larger things later. I also find repeating things makes them go down more easily.

[Hyperion]

I've successfully converted 2 progs to libertarianism, in my 6 years as a Libertarian. They were all very young. The older ones are fucking impossible.

I don't really find that much difference in older vs. younger conservatives, although the older ones are still tough.

Conservatives are just way more likely to convert to Libertarianism because they have more distrust for big central government, or at least they have that idea somewhere in their mind, and they also value economic freedom a lot more. If you can convince them that the WOD is a lost cause, and that the US shouldn't be the world police, you are well on your way to a win.

[jesse.in.mb]

I tugged a little too hard on a conservative and he went full Rothbard on me.

I find I can sell people on certain ideas on a short term basis but then they go emotional and revert back to their old position.

[Old Man With Candy]

Bush II was the best friend that libertarians ever had. He made it MUCH easier to convince my Republican friends that perhaps I wasn't quite as stupid and cynical as they thought.

[Tman]

HE'S ALSO RACISSSSSS!

[Archduke Pantsfan]

"@penguins: The #Pens winning streak ends at 15. The Sabres win 4-1."

[General Butt Naked]

*sobs*

[Tman]

The Pens are toothless this year, I wouldn't worry about them.

[Xenocles]

The whole undocumented thing will just wind up on the ash-heap with the rest of the failed PC terms. The PC terms that replace the derogatory ones inevitably wind up assuming the derogatory meaning of their predecessors. People started using "retard" as an insult, so it became "mentally challenged." Then "special." Now all three are derogatory. It turns out that the terms don't matter, the intent of the speaker matters.

People will start mocking the 'undocumented' adjective too. A mugger will become an 'undocumented tax collector.' Some guy who shoots your dogs will be known as an 'undocumented police officer.' Drug dealers could be 'undocumented pharmacists.' You get the idea.

[Hyperion]

Well, no one here will be disappointed if you're right.

I just read an article a couple of days ago, I can't remember well enough to go find the link, but there was someplace... not sure if in the US or not, where white workers at an organization where being encouraged to wear these plastic bracelets with 'White Privelege' written on them, so that they would 'be reminded throughout the day to think more seriously about their white privelege'.

Seriously, one cannot make up things this stupid.

[Xenocles]

You know who else made certain ethnic groups wear an identifying mark?

[Rich]

Estee Lauder?

[Archduke Pantsfan]

is it Hitler?

[AlmightyJB]

What's Phil Collins supposed to write now.

[Hyperion]

What else should I be? All apologies.

What else could I say? Everyone is Gay.

What else could I write? I don't have the right.

What else should I be? All apologies

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Then later on, on the drive home
I called her mom from a pay phone
I said I was the cops and your husband's in jail
This state looks down on sodomy

And that's about the time that bitch hung up on me
Nobody likes you when you're 23
And are still more amused by prank phone calls
What the hell is caller ID?
My friends say I should act my age
What's my age again?
What's my age again?

[Butts Wagner]

He was a boy
She was a girl
Can I make it anymore obvious?
He was a punk.
She did ballet.
What more can I say?
He wanted her.
She'd never tell.
Secretly she wanted him as well.
And all of her friends
Stuck up their nose.
And they had a problem with his baggy clothes.

He was a skater boy, she said, "See ya later, boy."
He wasn't good enough for her.
She had a pretty face but her head was up in space.
She needed to come back down to earth.

[Ted S.]

You can't hurry hate
No you just have to wait
She said hate don't come easy
It's a game of give and take

[Hyperion]

Since my first post on this thread, I have watched the comment count go from 17 to 197. Quite an accomplishment for a relatively boring topic, with no links to anything nekked.

BTW, what happened to that rash of new whippersnapper commenters that we had there for a while? Where they real? Is it really just back down to us old regulars at H&R?

[Palin's Buttplug]

Just us oldtimers.

Adulterer Mark Sanford wins GOP primary in SC. I remember when he was a favorite of the peanut gallery here.

He's back!

[Hyperion]

Sanford has good taste in wimin. Besides, I care a lot less about who politicians are screwing, when it isn't the tax payers.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Who has better eyebrows, Eugene Levy or Martin Scorcese?

[Hyperion]

This guy

[Coeus]

Peter Gallagher

[Thane of Whiterun]

Do I count as a young whippersnapper?

[Hyperion]

No. You didn't notice the sudden rash of new commenters a few weeks ago?

I haven't seen anything like it since I first started posting here, around 5 years ago. But they seem to be mostly gone now.

[Coeus]

I believe that was all one person.

[Hyperion]

I'm sure that it wasn't. I'm not talking about the one racist troll.

[Hyperion]

Check one, directly below...

[jesse.in.mb]

I started around the same time everyone else did, so I have no frame of reference.

[Hyperion]

I don't think you've been here that long, have you?

The 2 commenters, that I definitely remember being here from when I first started coming here, are Episiarh, and Pro Libertate.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

also SugarFree.

[Hyperion]

Yes, that's true, and maybe Warty? There are a few others that I recall, who are all gone now. Akira McKenzie, and some trolls, like Crayon.

[jesse.in.mb]

No, I haven't been here long at all.

[Irish]

But the sun shines brighter since you've been here. (: Admittedly that's probably because it's getting closer to summer. So unless you're responsible for the Earth's rotation, that probably doesn't actually have anything to do with you.

[Hyperion]

So unless you're responsible for the Earth's rotation, that probably doesn't actually have anything to do with you.

I'm actually responsible for the precession of the orbital axis orientation. So don't fuck with me now, or it's crop failure for you! And more bad things!

[Hyperion]

I started coming here in 2007. Although I never posted that often, until a couple of years ago.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

I've been visting since 2002 or 2003

[jesse.in.mb]

I've been reading Reason for a while. Didn't really dive into the comments until a few months ago, and then started commenting when I realized what terrible people you all are.

Terrible people are my people.

[Hyperion]

Didn't really dive into the comments until a few months ago, and then started commenting when I realized what terrible people you all are.

Thanks, Jesse, for the compliment. And we are glad to have you. Stick around, you will learn a lot. But I am sure you can already tell that by the great wisdom of us elders.

[Irish]

I don't know, every time you start talking about what life was like in the Truman administration, I just kind of doze off.

[Hyperion]

WOW! Old timer! You're like the ancient of days! You, who have no beginning and no end! You are, who are!

Buy seriously, I guess it's hard not to remember Epi, and Prol, being the blowhard windbags that they are, (:

[Coeus]

I started coming here in 2007

Class of '07 represent!

[Irish]

This is just weird. I only started commenting like a month before Jesse, and the rest of you are gross old people.

[jesse.in.mb]

Plenty of the day shift commenters are newer. It's just the night shift people who are aged.

[Hyperion]

This is just weird. I only started commenting like a month before Jesse, and the rest of you are gross old people.

Yeah, it's true. But just remember that we are all gross old people who are far superior to you warm beer sipping Micks.

[Hyperion]

Hear hear! Hear him!

The class of 2007 is supreme!

[Dweebston]

Class of 2012, reporting... but I'll probably outlive you fogies, so I count myself as something of a torchbearer.

[Hyperion]

Don't count on it, snapper. We have this mission where we want you to pay for our free healthcare while we booze it up and take weed tourism trips to CO, during our very, very long retirement.

So, get with it!

[jesse.in.mb]

Ugh, this is why we need to have Carrousel

[Dweebston]

You'll be fighting DOE for primacy over our student loan payments, so... best of luck!

[MissMalevolent]

PC police strike again!

[General Butt Naked]

I run linux...

[Archduke Pantsfan]

so do I. with a mac interface.

[Hyperion]

I need for someone to remind me what good Linux is other than a novelty or as a server to run VM on?

I game, I comment, I sometimes surfs the Pr0on. Why do I need anything besides the Winders?

[jesse.in.mb]

You're surfing porn in Windows? Do you bank with the same interface?

[Hyperion]

Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

Yes. I'm a total IT geek, for 17 years, no needz to worry about me.

[jesse.in.mb]

I didn't really think there was. I'm consistently impressed how people can get malware during day to day surfing. I shudder to think what happens during the average user's porn surfing.

[Dweebston]

Is porn a thing we still do with browsers? I thought we'd all discovered bittorrent before now.

[SIV]

What's "malware"? Other then the 10 minutes it took to remove the Blaster Worm I've never experienced it. Never run an anti-virus program either

[jesse.in.mb]

I think it's just the more generic term for software designed to infect and subvert your computer's normal function. One of the work computers I was working on has a fake google homepage, fake PC tuneup software, and a few other applications that nobody recalls installing. It can be stubborn to remove.

[Hyperion]

227 comments and counting. If we break 500, I will print beers on my 3D printer, and email one to everyone who commented.

[Irish]

It's 10:30. I'm guessing this won't break 500.

[jesse.in.mb]

But we're half way there!

[Irish]

Let's

[Irish]

Just

[Irish]

Talk

[Irish]

Like

[Irish]

This!

[Archduke Pantsfan]

now cut that out!

[Hyperion]

Noes! I like it. First free 3D printer emailed beers in all the history of the interwebz! Soon as I figure it out, on Tuesday.

[jesse.in.mb]

So this comment should at least cause us to breach 290, which is the current number 5 slot for most commented Reason articles.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

your comment is also in the 95th percentile of useful comments.

[OldMexican]

The Associated Press, the largest news-gathering outlet in the world, will no longer use the term "illegal immigrant."

Sounds good to me. And I will stop using the term "serious journalism" when talking about the AP.

[Rich]

"Undocumented journalism", then?

[Sidd Finch]

If you ever wondered what a Ngram of illegal immigrant, illegal alien, undocumented immigrant, undocumented alien, unauthorized immigrant, and unauthorized alien would look like, wonder no more.

If you're wondering what happened in the mid 70's, here's a clue.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

what's a Ngram?

[Sidd Finch]

google chart by year of uses in books

[jesse.in.mb]

Beer infographic

[Archduke Pantsfan]

I found Warsteiner Dunkel (dark) in my store this week. Not bad, but not as good as Erdinger Dunkel.

[Hyperion]

I can get both of the Warsteiners here in the draught cans.

I really wish I could get the Ayinger Brau Weisse here in one of those.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Warsteiner, DAB, Krombacher and Bitberger are all available in the tall cans.
Erdinger is only in bottles.

[Hyperion]

I'm talking about the draught cans, with the tap, that contain like 14 beers.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

OH! We only get those in DAB

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Wait, I think I've seen the regular Warsteiner in those.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

contain like 14 beers.

or as I call it, Wednesday

[Hyperion]

Or in this case, for me, Tuesday.

[Dweebston]

Each bullet needs a citation, not because I doubt the veracity but because a statement of fact without a brief contextual paragraph is just frustrating.

[jesse.in.mb]

There's a sources list at the bottom.

[Dweebston]

You're no fun anymore.

[jesse.in.mb]

I was fun once?

[Hyperion]

Never.

[jesse.in.mb]

That's what I figured.

[Hyperion]

Thanks, great link.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Remember when G?rard D?pardieu moved to Russia instead of paying French tax?
France's former budget minister admits lying about secret offshore account

[Irish]

Saudi women are now allowed to ride bikes!

I don't know how they can allow this. Just think of how quickly bikes pervert the nobility of the female spirit and lead them away from the one true god, Allah.

[Hyperion]

Why do women need to ride bikes? That will only give them other ideas, like voting. Best to nip this one in the bud.

[jesse.in.mb]

Or worse: driving!

An entire new population of lady drivers.

[Coeus]

Proof that cops lie.

Informa Systems conducted an experiment with online learning. Multiple-choice questions were created that participants were required to answer online. Officers were informed that their scores WERE NOT recorded in the test (although they actually were). The officers were instructed to record their own grades. The average grade that the officers reported was 76%. However, their actual grades scored averaged 71% -- a difference of 5%. The participants were guilty of grade inflation! Then, a second set of participants were asked to answer the questions, but were told that their scores were being recorded. Interestingly, the difference between average grades reported and recorded this time dropped to 2%. So, it looks like we lie less if we know that someone is checking up on what we say.

[Hyperion]

Cops only lie when they are caught red handed on video, ... lying.

So, they are a lot like politicians. No, wait.. that's not quite right, politicians get caught all of the time lying on video, but they aren't actually lying, they just misspoke. Never mind.

[Hyperion]

304 comments!

[jesse.in.mb]

That put's us over April 1's PM Links. (299)

[Hyperion]

We're part of history! Oh noes, I'm out of beer... were's that damn key to the wifes wine stash, fuck she's sleepin...

[jesse.in.mb]

Your wife keeps the wine locked away from you? That's ...telling.

[Hyperion]

GDit! No, it's fucking downstairs and I can't find the key to the cellar... but it wouldn't be a bad idea if she did, as I could probably drink all of her finer stuff in one night, haha.

[Old Man With Candy]

Did I mention how much I like your wife?

Sadly, Im on alcohol restriction (medical) for the next 6 months, and Illinois isn't an MM state.

[Archduke Pantsfan]

Who needs a reason to comment!

[John C. Randolph]

Jeez, is it time for a PC jargon shift AGAIN?

They do this every couple of years. Make up a term for some group of people, and jump down the throat of anyone who uses the previous term, even though it wasn't even a pejorative.

-jcr

[Coeus]

I hate when they do that. It's like a linguistic merry-go-round made of diseased shit. Remember negro?

[John C. Randolph]

I remember when white left-wingers got all snotty with me for saying "black" instead of "african-american".

-jcr

[heller]

What does the AP stylebook say about gay thugs?

[Archduke Pantsfan]

It says I'm signing up the jerk at the office