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Politics

Obama Campaign Can't Make Obama's Deficit Math Add Up Either

Peter Suderman | 10.17.2012 10:39 AM

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Mitt Romney has had a lot of trouble recently defending his proposal to reduce income tax rates, increase defense spending, close tax loopholes — and keep the whole thing revenue it neutral while working to reduce the deficit and eventually balance the budget. It's possible to do any of those things, but it's extremely difficult, at best, to do all of them together. 

But Obama's big debt reduction plan, which he claims would reduce national debt by $4 trillion, is also highly problematic. It's packed with gimmicks, and what debt reduction it might achieve would mostly come from tax hikes. And pressed to defend the plan, Obama's campaign has serious trouble.

The Washington Examiner's Philip Klein went back and forth with Obama campaign spokesperson Jen Psaki in the debate spin room last night to highly amusing results:

In the spin room following the debate, I noted to Psaki that Obama's math has its own problems. He preserves roughly 80 percent of the Bush tax cuts in terms of revenue and the taxes he raises won't be enough to balance the budget or save Medicare or Social Security from cuts.

"President Obama is the only one who has a $4 trillion balanced plan, so part of that is $1 trillion in ending the Bush tax cuts," Psaki said.

In response, I noted the the supposed $4 trillion deficit plan included $1.1 trillion in war savings and $1.2 trillion from the debt ceiling compromise that had already been signed into law.

"I think the important piece is that Mitt Romney has a $5 trillion plan," Psaki began to reply.

I pressed her on Obama's own plan, that keeps 80 percent of the Bush tax cuts without tackling entitlements.

She said, "I think we're talking about a couple different things. His plan is a $4 trillion plan. Part of it is ending the Bush tax cuts, part of it is making tough cuts to programs like Medicare and Medicaid. He's happy to make tough cuts and he also wants to invest in education and other programs."

I responded that the claimed mandatory savings were mostly offset by nearly $500 billion in new spending on his economic proposals.

"Yep," she said. She told me, "I'm happy to send you a copy of the president's plan outlined with all of the specifics of that."

The conversation keeps going. But it doesn't get any better for the Obama administration. At this point, presidential campaigns should, for their own good, probably stop trying to debate policy with Klein, who last year similarly boxed in Mitt Romney on the details of his dubious ObamaCare waiver plan. 

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NEXT: Woman Who Recorded Call Did Not Break the Law

Peter Suderman is features editor at Reason.

PoliticsPolicyEconomicsElection 2012Presidential Debates 2012Barack ObamaDeficits
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  1. HazelMeade   13 years ago

    And yet the media spends all it's time talking about Romney's math, as if they don't even know that Obama has a purported deficit reduction plan too.
    I'd like to see them do a side-by-side comparison.

    1. Groovus Maximus   13 years ago

      I'll save you the trouble: neither of them reconcile.

      1. $park?   13 years ago

        Tell you what, if I were to run for President I would claim to have a $700 billion trillion debt reduction plan. Because honestly, who cares about the number?

    2. Sudden   13 years ago

      Admittedly, Romney has tried being clever about it. He says "I don't want to cut taxes on the wealthy" but then said "The top 5% will continue to pay 60% under my administration" (referring to 60% of total income taxes, not 60% effective rates). While I have no problem with that because I am not a greedy prog motivated by envy and avarice, it is a bit disingenuous.

      1. Adam330   13 years ago

        And how is that different from Obama, who says he won't increase taxes on the middle class, yet then proceeds to raise them anyway?

  2. flye   13 years ago

    Obama's plan keeps 80 percent of the Bush tax cuts? I thought we couldn't afford to "spend" the government's hard-earned money in such a frivolous manner.

    1. robc   13 years ago

      He wants to keeps the parts that actually lowered tax revenue, mainly the creation of the 10% bracket out of part of the 15% bracket.

      The cuts above the (probable) laffer curve peak, on the other hand, he wants to get rid of.

      So, basically, he wants to minimize tax revenue, partly in a good way and partly in a really, really bad way.

      1. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

        Why not tax the 1% at 100% of their income, since they've sinned by exploiting the workers? The government can give them back whatever it thinks they need to live.

        1. $park?   13 years ago

          This is not a bad idea if you consider the fact that after you take away everything from the 1% you've just created a new 1%.

  3. T   13 years ago

    I can't make anybody's 'deficit reduction' math add up. I wonder why that is? Maybe I'm just no good at the math.

    I guess that business degree was a waste of time.

    1. Drake   13 years ago

      My liberal acquaintances get annoyed at me when I start doing math too. What's an MBA against feelings?

  4. The Late P Brooks   13 years ago

    He's happy to make tough cuts and he also wants to invest in education and other programs.

    He's going to balance the budget on the backs of cowboy poets.

    1. VG Zaytsev   13 years ago

      And puppets.

      1. Almanian's Evil Twin   13 years ago

        Also, fried chicken

      2. LTC(ret) John   13 years ago

        But not muppets.

  5. The Late P Brooks   13 years ago

    I can't make anybody's 'deficit reduction' math add up.

    It's easy. You just imagine a cut, project it over ten years, and use that number as if it is a one year saving. Presto!

    1. Almanian's Evil Twin   13 years ago

      "How do you balance the budget?"

      "Well, first, assume a spending reduction and/or increase in tax revenue..."

  6. R C Dean   13 years ago

    Soulless hack tells blatant lies.

    No film at 11, because what's the point.

  7. sage   13 years ago

    She looks like she wants to kill whoever she's talking to by taking a giant bite out of their leg and waiting for them to bleed to death.

    1. John   13 years ago

      Dead looking eyes. Like Susan Atkins dead looking eyes.

      1. Loki   13 years ago

        Your eyes would look pretty dead too if you had no soul.

    2. Tonio   13 years ago

      Waiting? No, I've seen that bloodthirsty PR flak look before. She's contemplating eating Klein's liver out of his still-writing body.

      1. Tonio   13 years ago

        "writhing"

        1. Delroy   13 years ago

          I like the "still-writing" image.

          Klein's final notes: "...omg, she's tearing open my stomach! she's pulling out my guts! she's eating it! aaarrrrgghhhh..."

          1. Loki   13 years ago

            Sir Bedevere: What is that?
            Brother Maynard: He must have died while carving writing it.
            King Arthur: Oh come on!
            Brother Maynard: Well, that's what it says.
            King Arthur: Look, if he was dying, he wouldn't have bothered to carve 'Aaaauuuggghhhh' 'omg, she's tearing open my stomach! she's pulling out my guts! she's eating it! aaarrrrgghhhh'. He'd just say it.
            Sir Galahad: Maybe he was dictating it.
            King Arthur: Oh shut up!

            1. Delroy   13 years ago

              Glad to see that someone picked up on the direction I was going. Bravo Sir Loki!

              1. robc   13 years ago

                Brave, brave Sir Loki, bravely ran away....

                1. Loki   13 years ago

                  I didn't!

                  1. Almanian's Evil Twin   13 years ago

                    "....and his bowels plucked open and liver spilled out..."

                  2. LTC(ret) John   13 years ago

                    Did you very nearly stand up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol?

          2. Trespassers W   13 years ago

            "...omg, she's tearing open my stomach! she's pulling out my guts! she's eating it! aaarrrrgghhhh..."

            Is this your screenplay for Troll 3?

        2. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

          "Waifing."

      2. Loki   13 years ago

        She's contemplating eating Klein's liver out of his still-writing body.

        ...with some fava beans and a nice chianti.

  8. John   13 years ago

    He's happy to make tough cuts and he also wants to invest in education and other programs.

    Because no matter what, the teachers' unions must be paid. Oh had a recession, fuck you pay me. Oh, going broke and facing hyper inflation, fuck you pay me.

    1. Whiterun Guard   13 years ago

      +1 funny guy

    2. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

      IT'S NOT FUCKING INVESTING.

      1. Jerry on the road   13 years ago

        It's investing in the votes teachers will give you.

        1. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

          Still not investing. That's purchasing.

          1. Whiterun Guard   13 years ago

            Caveat emptor!

          2. Rasilio   13 years ago

            No, for 3 out of every 4 years it is investing, in the 4th there is a vote so that's when you get your dividend.

            1. R C Dean   13 years ago

              The contract could be for future delivery of votes.

              It would be an investment if they were getting some sort of ownership interest or some kind of asset they could re-sell.

              Its a tough call, really.

          3. T o n y   13 years ago

            Increasing access to and standards of education don't increase economic productivity?

  9. Tonio   13 years ago

    Math is hard.

    /Psaki

    1. MP   13 years ago

      Out of random curiosity I looked up the going rate for one of these on eBay.

      $1200

      1. Whiterun Guard   13 years ago

        If (when) I pay $1200 for a doll, it's going to do a lot more than say "Math class is tough."

        1. T   13 years ago

          You'll get the one that says "ow, stop that"?

          1. Whiterun Guard   13 years ago

            No, the correct comment will be "ow, please be gentle".

  10. generic Brand   13 years ago

    Hey Peter, I don't think you got the memo. Reason isn't supposed to point out any flaws in Obama's policies; only in Romney's. John and other commenters told me so.

    1. Whiterun Guard   13 years ago

      They're allowed to point them out, now that it's too far down the road to matter.

    2. $park?   13 years ago

      No, no, John would have said don't point out flaws in Romney's policies, only Obama's. Or if you're going to point out flaws in Romney's policies you must also, in the same article, point out flaws in Obama's.

      1. John   13 years ago

        Who is this John and how long has his voice been talking in your head?

        I hear they have medication for that now.

        1. BakedPenguin   13 years ago

          I think he meant "Tulpa".

      2. JW   13 years ago

        I thought they had to point our how much better it was under Postrel.

        1. Almanian's Evil Twin   13 years ago

          ...and a sip for my homeys....

  11. Drake   13 years ago

    Did I imagine that Obama claimed that Romney's proposed changes to the corporate tax rate would cost $5 Trillion?

    I looked it up - annual corporate tax revenue is $181.1 billion. Total tax revenue is about $2.2 trillion. Obama's math isn't even in the ball park.

    1. Loki   13 years ago

      It's not so much that he's bad at math, he's just bad at telling the truth.

      1. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

        Turn that frown upside down! He's not bad at telling the truth; he's bad at lying.

    2. T   13 years ago

      I'm sure it's 5 trillion over X years. I don't much care, seeing as how we need to get the deficit under control now, not in X years.

      1. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

        In five trillion years, the Earth and sun will be long gone.

        1. Whiterun Guard   13 years ago

          Not if we invest in sustainable green energy.

      2. Drake   13 years ago

        If the corporate rate was cut to zero, it would "cost" 5 trillion over 27 years. Everyone watching a debate should assume all numbers are based on 27-year projections.

      3. flye   13 years ago

        Math is hard enough without you mixing roman and Arabic numerals. If it's VxM^IV over X years just say so.

        1. Pro Libertate   13 years ago

          Can you imagine being a Roman engineer? No wonder they did everything geometrically.

    3. $park?   13 years ago

      As soon as anyone says "tax cuts that cost..." you can stop paying attention.

  12. Romulus Augustus   13 years ago

    Hardly anyone who hasn't made up his mind by now is not going to "do the math." It is all about who can tell the biggest whoppers and look dreamy/presidential doing it. Anyone with a lick of sense doesn't believe either guy's plan or that either guy will actually propose it if elected.

    1. OldMexican   13 years ago

      Re: Romulus Augustus,

      Hardly anyone who hasn't made up his mind by now is not going to "do the math." It is all about who can tell the biggest whoppers and look dreamy/presidential doing it.

      Much like how many Americans today choose their spouse/partner. No difference.

      1. R C Dean   13 years ago

        American men, perhaps. Women, I believe, still tend to do the math.

  13. David @ Engage America   13 years ago

    Romney's tax plan has taken a lot of hits, but the fact is that people don't really understand it. Romeny is proposing to lower tax rates as well as broaden the base. This is the same economic philosophy that is at the heart of the Bowles-Simpson Plan which most experts agree is the best grand bargain on the table. http://bit.ly/QsGN4Z

  14. ??? ??????   12 years ago

    very nice

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