Unsettling Early News for Prop 19
Polls are still open for two more hours here in Californialand, but the Sacramento Bee harshes our pot legalization mellow (sigh, sorry for that) with this news:
Though voters ages 18 to 39 generally support Proposition 19 by slim margins, the measure is trailing among voters 40 and older. Respondents 65 and older also reported voting no.
The first wave of 1,500 voter interviews did not show unusually high turnout among young voters.
Predictions from some observers and campaign operatives that the measure would drive voters to the polls do not appear to be playing out so far.
Just 11 percent of voters surveyed named Proposition 19 as the one contest that matters most. Just under half the voters surveyed said the governor's race was the major draw, while 27 percent cared most about the Senate race.
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"Simpsons did it."
Pot smokers forgot to go out and vote.
We'll get there by 8pm, we swear.
I did my part both by voting and by purchasing my suits from Men's Wearhouse.
Just 11 percent of voters surveyed named Proposition 19 as the one contest that matters most.
That's plenty to save Boxer and Brown, which was the point.
Way to get put to use, potholes.
See you in '12.
sadface at truth 🙁
Welp, so much for marijuana ever being legalized in the next decade. Guess we'll have to wait for some more baby boomers to die off before trying again.
It's just one state, Bee, Eye, N-G-O.
And blaming the Boomers for all your disappointments may work on the intertubes but it doesn't cut it in the real world.
Baby boomers, the largest demographic in America, are absolutely complicit in escalating the war on drugs. 50 years of them voting for ever more authoritarian politicians and intrusive policies is proof of that.
Would it be rude to ask for some proof that Boomers are authoritarians? Just because they are numerous doesn't mean that they are drug warriors.
the measure is trailing among voters 40 and older
IIRC, the 45-50 y/o demographic should have the highest rate of both trying and past regular use of marijuana.
I think what he said was Boomers voted for authoritarians rather than being that way themselves. That they do so without necessarily meaning to is a moot point. So yes, Boomers are complicit. Everyone knows Hunters and Smokers vote libertarian. They turned out in record numbers for the "Pills Here" Campaign.
So this means, Obama should have enacted the death panels?
2014... it's the LAW!
Long live the wacky weed, but prop 19 is perverse. The taxation piece is unacceptable, although I lamented voting no because it surely would have changed the face of the war on drugs. There's always next time, and a more sensible solution: complete decriminalization. I've got a yes vote in my back pocket for that one.
Maybe the back pocket of your other pants... at the dry cleaners.
Well done! If it's not perfect, let 'em suffer with years of gang warfare!
I'm sure all the people sent to prison for MJ posession or killed in drug raids in CA will appreciate your reluctance to vote for a new tax.
myopic spineless fuck.
The outrage is typical, and from the usual suspects. One man's myopia is another man's clarity of purpose. Smoke it.
So you support the continuation of the 100% tax rate then?
Fucking statist.
Fucking statist.
The individual who is not in favor of giving the state new taxation and regulatory powers is the statist? That's rich.
"Clarity of purpose"? You've got to be trollin' me. What a fucking asshole.
Oh, quit with the trolling. Voting no because it's not perfect is completely ridiculous.
I can give a sliver of good news. Frank Pallone (NJ-6) is on the committee where the bill to legalize marijuana on the federal level died last time. He's got 48% of the vote. Anna Little is leading with 51%. She plans to leave marijuana policy to the states.
Oh God, if Frank Pallone went down, I would... well, I would do what I always do.
Despite the fact that prop 19 looks like a loser this year, I think it's hard to argue that in another few years people will continue to vote in favor of prohibition.
But some old people need to die off first, that's just the way it is.
Maybe an ironclad political strategy for cutting SS? We convince the stoners that if we starve old people weed will be legal?
Normally I'd agree with you, but that's the thing about potheads. They aren't mad at anybody (unless it's like totally schwag, and then -hey schwag is better than NO weed, AMIRITE?), and they aren't ever going to get fired up enough to care about actually voting in large numbers.
The sad fact about this is that there are millions of non-potheads who smoke pot (yes, I said it right, read it again) and would vote for something like this in their state if it ever reached the ballot. I have a hard time believing New Hampshire wouldn't pass decriminalization if it ever came up, simply out of anti-government spite.
California is a perfect ice breaker for the anti-prohibition legislation that will be needed to stop the drug war, but it will be interesting to see how many liberals in California voted against 19. I bet a lot.
God keeps replacing old people just as soon as they die off.
On net, old people aren't dying off, because the popul'n is getting older, except for immigrants.
Regardless of what happens tonight with Prop 19, trusting the popular voter with something like this is a risky tactic. In my opinion, nothing less than ending the war on drugs will do.
So what is the strategy here? Is it gradualism? Just hope the voters see the light on marijuana and then what?
If the end game is stopping the war on drugs, and this is seen as a step in that direction, then if I lived in CA I would've voted yes on Prop 19 even though "it doesn't go far enough" for me.
That said, asking for voter permission - to just use one "drug" legally - and as part of a whimsical utilitarian movement is a weak strategy.
"In my opinion, nothing less than ending the war on drugs will do."
How do you propose to do that? Wait for our leaders to lead on that issue? That is a fucking pipe dream.
The only way to end the drug war is by revolt, either at the voting booth ala P19, or with lead and flowing blood. I prefer the peaceful method.
Yeah, what you said.
No it's not a pipe dream. You have to continue to persuade public opinion to your side. At the moment, popular opinion is still mostly on the side of the drug warriors even though views on marijuana are improving. Candidates represent public opinion. If popular opinion generally wants welfare-statism, those are the candidates people are going to get.
My point is that you have to make an unapologetic and "radical" case for liberty. Be an extremist.
Like I said, I would've voted yes. But if gradualism is all people want, then that's all it's ever going to be.
if gradualism is all people want, then that's all it's ever going to be.
I don't think people who believe in true individual liberty only want "gradualism", but prop 19 is clearly a better alternative than NOTHING.
I agree. But I just don't understand why some aren't more radical about this. How many dead in Mexico since the latest "escalation" of the drug war? 26,000? This is an emergency. Talk has to go from just decriminalizing marijuana to ending the war.
"Candidates represent public opinion."
Or they take billions and billions of our tax dollars to fund propaganda campaigns telling us who we need to think and giving out blatant lies about things they want to control. Thus they set and manipulate the publics opinion and we pay for it!
How do you plan to end the war on drugs without a popular majority supporting that course of action?
The Supreme Court, in theory, is supposed to be the ultimate check on unconstitutional popular movements. Their decisions degrading the 10th amendment and misconstruing the commerce clause are the number one reason why the drug war continues and will continue. Prop 19 needed to pass because it's about the only thing that would force a decision on the matter.
There are chances that other types of "interstate commerce" could force SCOTUS to revisit Raich and Filburn, but if the court gets packed by the left you can forget about either of them being reversed.
Exactly. Majority public opinion doesn't support it yet, even in CA. There is still work to do.
Someday the drug war will end. Stay focused on the goal regardless of what happens tonight.
Tbhe next step could be a proposition to amend the constitution to cap penalties very low on all types of violations. It could leave pot illegal, but if it's made just a $20 fine for all the pot in the world for sale to minors, then it means they have their symbolism while you have virtual impunity.
Dude...that vote was yesterday? Dude...that sucks.
I blame the Giants. The hangover from their world series win caused half of SF's stoner population to forget to get to the polls and vote. Another reason to hate the fucking Giants. Go Doyers.
Hee,hee, hee. Silly stoners lose again.
Actually, I'm going to get baked right now. I've got nearly an ounce of outdoor grown Amish country weed. Time to bong out, English.
For some strange reason, stoners are never really upset when they lose.
Well, fuck. We'd thought California was worthless for pretty much everything, and if this plays out, that will be proven true.
Two words: amotivational syndrome.
this is the problem.. not enough people went to the polls today. people talk about how they would like this or that, but they arent willing to get out and vote. its wrong and it makes me upset more than anything.. boo to the state, boo to the people and boo to the lack of voters. i have been in this state my whole life and so much i love, but to pass something like this is going to take courage, i am afraid that courage is in short supply.
According to a vocal contingent here at Reason, voting is immoral because it constitutes an endorsement of government abuses.
And then they piss and moan about why elected officials don't care what they think.
Well, look at what people are voting for.
Steve Cooley appears to be in the lead for CA AG. That's bad news for MMJ.
Honestly, after arguing with the MMJ guys on http://www.rollitup.org/legalization-marijuana/ for the past two weeks all I can say is, fuck 'em. Steve Cooley is going to give them what they deserve.