The Volokh Conspiracy
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Hostages and "Hostages"
There is no moral equivalence between the hostages released by Hamas and the prisoners released by Israel.
From a post circulating yesterday:
Hamas will release Elkana Buchbut, a 32 yo party producer and musician, married and father of a 4 yo boy.
Israel will release Baher Badar, who in 2004 was responsible for a suicide terror attack which killed 11 Israelis.
Hamas will release Bar Kuperstein, a 23 yo security guard of the Nova festival, and the manager of his father's falafel restaurant.
Israel will release Faras Ganam, who was responsible for at least 5 terror attacks, and at least 4 dead Israelis.
Hamas will release Maxim Herkin, a 36 yo who got to Israel from Ukraine with his family, including his 4 yo daughter.
Israel will release Jihad Rom, who kidanpped 17 yo Yuri Goshchin in Jerusalem to Ramallah, abused him, murdered him and abused his corpse.
Hamas will release Segev Halfon, a 27 yo from Dimona who suffers from PTSD and worked in his family's bakery.
Israel will release Maher al-Hashlamun, who stabbed 3 people, killing one of them - Dalia Lemkus, who was a survivor of another terror attack 8 years prior to her murder.
Hamas will release Eitan Mor, a 25 yo who lived in Jerusalem and worked at a coffee shop.
Israel will release Hussein Sharrif Jauadra, who was 16 yo when stabbing 19 yo Eden Atias to death on a bus.
Hamas will release Alon Ahel, a 24 yo talented pianist and musician.
Israel will release Nabil Abu Hadir, who murdered his own sister for suspecting she was an Israeli agent.
Hamas will release Yosef Chaim Ohana, a 24 yo bartender, who helped others to escape from the party until he was kidnapped himself.
Israel will release Eiad Abu-Al-Rub, the head of The Islamic Jihad in Jenin, who's personally responsible for terror attacks, among them a suicide terror attack in Hedera, where 6 were murdered.
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D Bernstein -
Thanks for exposing the extreme differences in the hostage vs criminal swap.
And he's being too kind at that -- there isn't enough space for a full listing of all the murderers being released by Israel.
There were 250 of them = murderers being released by Israel
And another 1,700 detained in the aftermath of the Simchat Torah Pogrom were released as well.
You are not supposed to notice that. You are just supposed to attack the external enemy to show your loyalty.
And *we're* the ones they call 'fascist';)
It’s sickening that so many terrorists will be able to go back to killing Israelis, but the return of the remaining living hostages is such good news.
I rejoice for their families and wish them a swift recovery from the undeserved trauma they have been subjected to.
On the plus side when Hamas breaks the ceasefire, and we know that they will eventually, the terrorists Israel released will be valid targets for the IDF.
and the "Flu/Covid" Immunizations the (Redacted) got in Custody will show their location, simplifying matters.
Perhaps the Mosad has some trick up its sleeve for those released. They did after all orchestrate the exploding phones that Hezbollah was using.
Who said there was a moral equivalence? More whaling against strawman windmills by perpetually angry conservatives. Just be happy there's a ceasefire and the hostages are home.
You're quite right, I haven't hear much about moral equivalence between Israel and Hamas. I can't say *nobody* said it, but such remarks seem to me to be unusual.
Good catch.
What I *have* heard is denunciation of Israel - not the terrorists - as perpetrators of genocide. They don't say "both sides committed genocide."
Might have something to do with the relative body counts?
Or it might not.
Maybe Hamas should have listened to Shylock:
The villainy you teach me, I will execute;
and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction
Body count: Palestinian Jews killed or driven out: 100%
Palestinian Arabs killed or driven out: ~2% (using Hamas numbers, which the Biden administration estimated as overstated by roughly 500%)
Here's an article from a large outlet that describes Palestinian prisoners as political prisoners but the Israeli hostages as legitimate captives, suggesting that the Palestinian prisoners are morally superior to the innocent hostages. It also claims that every prisoner was taken in violation of a ceasefire (but again that the Israeli hostages are legitimate captives). It's sickening.
https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2025/10/13/explainer-who-are-the-palestinian-captives-israel-released
You haven't seen pro-Palestinian people and organizations refer to the released convicted murderers as "hostages"? What color is the sky on your planet?
https://www.cair.com/press_releases/cair-calls-on-media-outlets-to-demand-access-to-gaza-freed-palestinian-hostages/
They seem to referring to Palestinians detained during the post Oct. 7th operation, not the security prisoners released.
No they weren't, and even if thee were. those oqudl nbot be "hostages" either, and they've now removed that shameless press release.
But not to worry, the NYT is up to the task: https://x.com/Aizenberg55/status/1977758352135389235/photo/1
The vile CAIR is looking for some equivalence. By lying in the press release noted above. "1,700 Palestinian men, women and children going free after Israel occupation forces abducted them from Gaza, held them without charge and reportedly subjected them to torture in prisons run by Itamar Ben-Gvir." WTF? What torture? Did they hold them in tunnels, force them to dig their own graves and starve them to death? They raped and mutilated them and paraded their bodies with crowds cheering the display?
It refers to reports, likely such as this one:
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2025/10/10/in-israeli-prisons-hunger-and-torture-are-ever-present_6746283_4.html
So maybe don't murder Israeli men, women and children, and you wont go hungry and get tortured in an Israeli prison?
Even Clarence Thomas doesn’t condone torture of convicted murderers, and there’s the problem of people in administrative detention not being convicted of murder…
Didn't realize my Man Clarence ("Frogman") Thomas had such high standing in Israeli affairs. Eichmann didn't kill anyone himself either.
Le Monde has collected the accounts of 3 civilians claiming abuses. Wow. Three whole “accounts” Why, there’s even a picture. Not really what anyone but a sick antisemitic troll would accept as proof of anything, but a staged photo nonetheless. (Probably stock footage) Ever see pictures of the hostages who managed to survive the Hamas torture you repulsive piece of shit?
But we should acknowledge that are never any false accounts from Gaza. Not like they stage photos, or lie about casualties or falsely claim the IDF bombed a hospital. And they would never use schools and hospitals and children as human shields. They have too much respect for human life.
I know you’re a bastard, but do you have to be such a stupid antisemitic bastard?
I've forwarded your CV to a promising young Operator, Feldwebel Hugo Stiglitz.
Israel will release Nabil Abu Hadir, who murdered his own sister for suspecting she was an Israeli agent.
I don't think so.
Israel needs to simply execute these people -- then there won't be the incentive to take hostages, which IS a war crime....
I'm guilty of watching too much "Homeland" (and it's much better Israeli version "Prisoners of War" (Only 2 seasons, you can watch it over a "Lost Weekend" (HT B. Wilder, 1945 Paramount)
Most have been "turned" and will miraculously survive (while being at the location) of every Moe-Saad payback operation for the next few years.
Frank
So is murder.
so is buggering little boys, like your King does.
The differences:
The Israeli hostages (those that survived the attack on 10.7): Picked the wrong peace concert to go to
The Gazan prisoners released: Murderers, Bombers, terrorists.
There is no equivalence.
Who flew paragliders to the concert?
Once again, this worn-out style of right wing caterwauling shows only foolishness. Among the hostages released by Israel will be some who were turned in captivity, and who will henceforward report military intelligence to Israel. The larger the number Israel releases, the harder it becomes for its adversaries to identify which to kill selectively, or instead to kill all of them.
That is part of why you see such effective Israeli military intelligence, and also why this pattern has been seen again and again.
Certainly, I hope Israel is doing something like this.
Prof. Bernstein's contention is that Hamas is much worse than Israel. If Israel is spying on Hamas that wouldn't affect Bernstein's argument. After all, the U. S. spied on [Godwin edit].
I'm still smiling about the exploding pagers...
I like that they were probably so embarrassed to be carrying Pagers (C'mon (Man)! not even a "Flip" Phone??)
that they were likely concealed, umm, you know, where you usually conceal things you don't want to be seen carrying.
Frank "Hello, I can't take this call because my Testicles were just blown 1/2 a mile away"
Among the hostages released by Israel will be some who were turned in captivity, and who will henceforward report military intelligence to Israel.
Good. Why shouldn't Israel do what it can to learn about Hamas' plans?
I wonder how often Netanyahu thinks about Yigal Amir these days.
Indeed.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/labor-chief-michaeli-rabin-was-assassinated-with-netanyahus-cooperation/
When I Googled most news sites referred to Israeli hostages, 250 Palestinian prisoners (or security prisoners) and around 1700 Palestinian detainees (“Gazan detainees uninvolved in the October 7, 2023, massacre, who were arrested as unlawful combatants during the war” as the Times of Israel put it).
https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-frees-nearly-2000-palestinian-prisoners-including-hundreds-of-terror-convicts/amp/
I don't care what label each side puts on the people being exchanged. If hearing the other side claim the moral high ground is the price of peace, so be it. What's interesting to me is the roughly 100:1 ratio in the value of a life. Russia and Ukraine, Russia and USA, China and Canada trade at close to a 1:1 ratio. Venezuela and the USA recently traded at a 25:1 ratio.
US had 93,087 fentanyl deaths in 2024.
so how many did Venezuela have? OK, I don't care but you didn't address his point.
What were the criminal records of the Palestinians whom the Israelis killed?
What were the criminal records of the 100K German civilians killed in the Battle of Berlin, and which side should take the blame for those deaths?
How about the thousands of women gang raped by the Red Army in that event? Is that all on the Nazis? In other words, even when dealing with loathsome, evil thugs the good guys have to follow certain rules of war and decency, not everything that may be done by the latter would be the bad guys fault.
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2002/may/01/news.features11
How about the thousands of women gang raped by the Red Army in that event? Is that all on the Nazis?
Mostly. How did Russian civilians fare during the war? Revenge is a powerful motive. That may be unfortunate, sometimes, but it's a fact of human psychology.
Did those women cheer the Wehrmacht as it marched off to conquer? Did they partake of the extensive looting of conquered countries?
The whole point of the law is to restrain our baser instincts. You can read Hobbes for a longer version of that insight.
The allies. Under the laws of war as they were agreed after World War II, the carpet bombing campaigns the allies did during World War II, like many of the attacks Israel carried out against Gaza, would surely have been illegal.
Which is why I referenced the Battle of Berlin, not the bombing of Tokyo. If you or Ed er, you can look into tho r battle of Manila, and how many friendly civilians were killed while we were trying to save them for on Japanese occupation.
Civilians are civilians. Under today's laws of war you're not allowed to target them regardless of their citizenship.
Maybe a "King" ordered it, they're (simply) "Divine" you know.
Trump is responsible for Hamas getting so many of their terrorists back.
and you're so happy!! Or you would be if it was Parkinsonian Joe or Barry Hussein Osama.
would a Symptom of Parkinsons
make someone (Write( like you
No, but your fixation on one object you have no control over is, might want to have your Substantia Nigra status checked.
I like to laugh at weirdos, I admit it. Or, as you’d put it:
i like to Laugh at Weirdos )I
Admit It
But none of the praise for Israel getting all living hostages released, right?
The Code of Hammurabi remains visceral within all, even those who know better.
I believe: "A man's life on this earth is meant to perpetuate life. And, animals and the devil's progeny exist to defeat God's purpose."
I pray that the animals released in exchanged for "hostages" have limited fight left; and that the ignorant stateless people who are told they are "palestinian" can be taught, and come to understand how they have been used (same as the majority of the other peoples of the world).
That said, I see nothing in the peace plan which would suggest the abused (by all emirates and nations who previously would not assist / accept them) will be "educated" such that they might come to know: "How to teach themselves and their progeny."
The irony of picking on Palestinians in this conflict with Israel seems lost on this one.
For being stateless, I mean.
How many "Palestinians" were killed on 10-7? and I mean not by their own incompetent "Friendly Fire"??? This is like George Foreman getting a Draw in the "Rumble in the Jungle". They might fight a few more bouts and sell some Grills, but they'll do better when Gaza is Vegas on the Med.
Frank
As with most English punctuation Francis misses the .
Tell me more about Marwan Barghouti, who is apparently worse than all of these people, which is surely the only reason why Israel might have refused to release him.
He was convicted of 5 murders in a court of law.
What more do you want to know?
Why that's worse than what the people in the OP did, for one.
This all demonstrates exactly why women should not be allowed to vote.
So what I'm seeing here is that unlike the people held by Hamas, the people held by Israel *don't* have families and professions?
Perhaps the comparison should be with people like Bezalel Smotrich and Itamar Ben-Gvir.
It's a fantastic day for the released hostages and their families. Perhaps it's best to leave it at that for now. We all know nothing changes in the long term. More atrocities like October 7th will happen, and Israel will commit atrocities in retaliation.