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DC Circuit Upholds District Court Order Blocking Deportations Under The Alien Enemies Act
The 2-1 ruling is procedural, but strongly suggests the majority judges also reject the Trump administration's position on the merits.

Earlier today, the US Court of Appeals for the DC Circuit upheld a district court temporary restraining order blocking the Trump Administration from using the Alien Enemies Act of 1798 to deport Venezuelan migrants it claims are members of the Tren de Aragua drug gang. The Alien Enemies Act is the only one of the notorious Alien and Sedition Acts of 1798 still in force. But the Act can only be used in the event of a declared war, or an "invasion" or "predatory incursion" perpetrated by a "foreign nation or government."
The ruling was a 2-1 decision. Judge Karen LeCraft Henderson (appointed by George H.W. Bush) and Judge Patricia Millett (appointed by Obama) each issued separate opinions upholding the trial court TRO for somewhat different reasons.
Judge Henderson's opinion primarily emphasizes the point that there is no war, invasion, or predatory incursion going on, and therefore the legal preconditions for invoking the AEA have not been met. She includes an excellent analysis of the meaning of "invasion":
First, the invasion must be "against the territory of the United States by any foreign nation or government." 50 U.S.C. § 21 (emphasis added). The requirement that the "invasion" be conducted by a nation-state and against the United States' "territory" supports that the Congress was using "invasion" in the military sense of the term See Ex parte Bollman, 8 U.S. (4 Cranch) 75, 131 (1807) (describing levying war against the United States as "a military enterprize . . . against any of the territories of the United States"); Wiborg v. United States, 163U.S. 632, 633 (1896) (explaining that a group of seamen were charged with preparing for a "military expedition . . . against the territory and dominions of a foreign prince"). Undesired people do not arrive against the territory. But foreign armies can—and as the 1798 Congress feared might—invade the territory of the United States. Second, the invasion may be actual, "attempted, or threatened." 5 U.S.C. § 21. Again, when used in reference to hostilities among nations, an attempted or threatened invasion of the United States would mark a logical trigger for enhanced presidential authority. Third, and relatedly, the conditional list of triggering events—a declared war, invasion or predatory incursion—must be read against the means the Congress employed to combat the same. The AEA authorizes the President to restrain and remove the nationals of a belligerent foreign power. Such power tracks when invasion is considered in its military sense.
Finally, consider history. The Alien Enemies Act was enacted by the Fifth Congress amid an actual conflict—the Quasi-War—with France, a foreign power. War was front and center in the minds of the enacting legislature. A little over one month before enacting the AEA, the same Congress authorized the President to raise a standing army of 10,000 men to combat any French invasion. But he could do so only "in the event of a declaration of war against the United States, or of actual invasion of their territory, by a foreign power, or of imminent danger of such invasion." Act of May 28, 1798, ch. 47, § 1, 1 Stat. 558. This language bears more than a passing resemblance to the language of the AEA, which the Congress enacted a mere thirty-nine days later. In his most famous exposition against the Alien and Sedition Act, Madison explained that an "[i]nvasion is an operation of war." James Madison, Report of 1800 (Jan. 7, 1800), in Founders Online [https://perma.cc/2D3N-N64Z]. In such times, the "law of nations" allowed for the expulsion of alien enemies as "an exercise of the power of war." Id…..
The term "invasion" was well known to the Fifth Congress and the American public circa 1798. The phrase echoes throughout the Constitution ratified by the people just nine years before. And in every instance, it is used in a military sense. For example, the Guarantee Clause provides that "[t]he United States shall . . .protect each [State] against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence." U.S. Const. art. IV,§ 4. The clause is a federal guarantee to the states against attack from without (invasion) or within (insurrection). In describing the clause, the Federalist Papers refer to invasion and domestic violence as "bloody" affairs involving "military talents and experience" and "an appeal to the sword." The Federalist No. 44 (J. Madison). To effectuate the guarantee the Congress has power "[t]o provide for calling forth the Militia to . . . suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions." U.S. Const. art. I, § 8, cl. 15. Again, to use military force against invasion. During these exigent times of hostilities—"in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion"—the Congress may suspend "The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus . . . when . . . the public Safety may require it." Id. art. I, § 9, cl. 2. Finally, if the federal guarantee fails, a state may exercise its Article I power to "engage in War" but only if "actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay." Id. art. I, § 10, cl. 3. When the Constitution repeats a phrase across multiple clauses—and the early Congresses echo that phrase in statute— it is a strong signal that the text should be read in pari materia…. The theme that rings true is that an invasion is a military affair, not one of migration.
I agree on all points, and have made similar arguments in my earlier writings about this issue. In particular, I have emphasized that the meaning of "invasion" in the AEA tracks the meaning of the same term in the Constitution. If courts accept the Trump argument that illegal migration and drug smuggling qualify as "invasion," that would have dire constitutional implications, such as enabling states to "engage in war" in response and the federal government to suspend the writ habeas corpus (including for US citizens) virtually anytime it wants.
Judge Henderson also presents what I think is the first judicial interpretation of the meaning of "predatory incursion":
The government finds no safer refuge in the alternative "predatory incursion." The government defines the term as "(1) an entry into the United States, (2) for purposes contrary to the interests or laws of the United States." Gov't Br. 18. And it explains that illegal immigration and drug trafficking readily qualify under that standard. As before, the government misreads the text, context and history. An incursion is a lesser form of invasion; an "[a]ttack" or "[i]nvasion without conquest." Samuel Johnson, Incursion, senses 1 & 2, A DICTIONARY OF THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE (4th ed. 1773). Its predatory nature includes a "[p]lundering," such as the "predatory war made by Scotland." Id., Predatory, sense 1. Secretary of State Thomas Pickering used the term to describe a lesser form of attack that France could conduct against the U.S. and which, in his view, could be repelled by the militia. See Letter from Thomas Pickering to Alexander Hamilton (June 9, 1798), in Founders Online [https://perma.cc/VD5M-QSNA]. This was raised in contradistinction to a full invasion, which would require an army. Id. Rep. Otis likewise described a predatory incursion as a lesser form of invasion or war. 8 Annals of Cong. 1791 (1798). Early American caselaw sounds a similar theme: incursions referred to violent conflict. Alexander Dallas, appearing before the Marshall Court, described "predatory incursions of the Indians" onto Pennsylvania's frontier, which had led to "an Indian war." Huidekoper's Lessee v. Douglass, 7 U.S. (3 Cranch) 1, 11 (1805). Chief Justice Marshall referred to "incursions of hostile Indians," which involved "constant scenes of killings and scalping," and led to a retaliatory "war of extermination. Cherokee Nation v. Georgia, 30 U.S. (5 Pet.) 1, 10 (1831); accord Worcester v. Georgia, 31 U.S. (6 Pet.) 515, 545 (1832) (explaining that Pennsylvania's royal charter included "the power of war" to repel "incursions" by "barbarous nations"). Like its statutory counterparts, predatory incursion referred to a form of hostilities against the United States by another nation-state, a form of attack short of war. Migration alone did not suffice.
I think Judge Henderson is also right on this point, though the historical evidence here is not as extensive as in the case of "invasion."
Judge Henderson notes she does not definitively resolve whether Tren de Aragua's actions qualify as an "invasion" or a "predatory incursion," merely concluding that the government isn't likely to prevail on these points (which is enough to uphold the trial court TRO). But I think it's clear the government cannot prevail under her (correct definitions) of these terms.
In this opinion, Judge Henderson does not consider the issue of whether Tren de Aragua is a "foreign nation or government." But I think it's pretty obvious that it isn't, and this is an additional reason to rule against the Trump Administration.
In assessing whether an injunction is justified to block the deportations, Judge Henderson properly highlights the extreme egregiousness of the government's actions, under which the Venezuelan migrants have not simply been deported, but sent to imprisonment in El Salvador, often with little or no evidence that they are actually members of any drug gang or have committed any other crime:
The Executive's burdens are comparatively modest compared to the plaintiffs'. Lifting the injunctions risks exiling plaintiffs to a land that is not their country of origin…. Indeed, at oral argument before this Court, the government in no uncertain terms conveyed that—were the injunction lifted—it would immediately begin deporting plaintiffs without notice. Plaintiffs allege that the government has renditioned innocent foreign nationals in its pursuit against TdA. For example, one plaintiff alleges that he suffered brutal torture with "electric shocks and suffocation" for demonstrating against the Venezuelan regime. Id. (D.D.C. Mar. 19, 2025), ECF No. 44-5 ¶ 2. While awaiting adjudication of his asylum claim, he was expelled to "El Salvador with no notice to counsel or family" based on a misinterpretation of a soccer tattoo. Id. ¶¶ 5–7. To date, his family and counsel have "lost all contact" and "have no information regarding his whereabouts or condition." Id.¶ 10. The government concedes it "lack[s] a complete profile" or even "specific information about each individual" it has targeted for summary removal….
Judge Millett's opinion emphasizes the lack of due process provided to the deportees. They were not given any opportunity to challenge the government's claims (often based on extremely flimsy evidence or none at all) that they are members of Tren de Aragua. Here reasoning is similar to that of the recent district court ruling in the case, which I analyzed here. However, she goes beyond the district court in emphasizing that the right to a hearing here is not simply statutory, but is rooted in the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.
I emphatically agree, and made a similar argument here. As Judge Millett also explains, the right to due process here is not just an abstract issue of legal theory. The government's denial of due process has apparently led to the deportation and cruel imprisonment of many people who are not actually members of any drug gang and haven't committed any crime.
In his dissent Judge Justin Walker (appointed by Trump) does not address any of the substantive issues in the case. Rather, he argues it should have been brought in Texas (where the five named plaintiffs are currently detained by ICE), rather than in Washington, DC.I find the majority judges' analysis on this more persuasive than Walker's. But I am not expert in these types of procedural issues, so will leave them to others.
Overall, this is a significant win for the detained migrants. And it's notable that - so far - not one judge has endorsed the administration's ultra-broad theory of executive power here. But, obviously, this litigation is going to continue.
The administration may try appeal the DC Circuit ruling to the Supreme Court. If not, or if the justices refuse to take the case at this time, we will see a final ruling on the merits in the district court (which will, I think, almost certainly go against the administration), followed by further appeals.
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Judge Henderson shows why the situation is unlikely to be classified as an invasion or predatory incursion by Venezuela.
An invasion would be the Venezuelan military coming to cross our borders. A predatory incursion would be some kind of commando raid by the Venezuelan military. That’s not what they’re alleging here.
I’d add that the Alien Enemies Act was a bipartisan law passed at a time of great division between Federalists and (minority) Republicans over other laws. If we read the tea leaves of “legislative intent,” Congress in this Act was not seeking to enter constitutionally contested ground as it did with the Alien Friends Act or the Sedition Act. For those who aren’t that intensely into originalism (and I’m not), then let’s consider simply the legal background of 1798, and the writings of respected jurists of the time that a country can expel the citizens or subjects of an enemy nation, but that this was in the context of standard-issue international warfare. This was the authority Congress delegated to the President in the Alien Enemies Act.
Drug-trafficking plots by another country against the U. S. might be a *casus belli* but that would be for Congress to decide, not the President unilaterally.
Basically, Trump claims that the Alien Enemies Act isn't a stable law, but a living document which holistically grows and evolves to meet current emergencies. I disagree with Trump's aping of legal progressisivm.
I think its fair that they get a hearing. It should consist of.
‘Can you present documentation that you’re a citizen or otherwise have the right to be here?’
If not. Out the door…There really shouldn’t be any need for the AEA since illegals shouldn’t be here in the first place. The fact that illegal now = right to be here of such strong standing that the President has to cast around for an ancient law to get rid of you is the real 'living law' people should be concerned about.
No. You can only invoke the alien enemies act for alien enemies. Not alien an alien enemy, no right to invoke the act.
You can’t arrest people for murder and hold them without bail on those grounds and then say that in order to get out, it’s not enough to show they’re not murders, they have to show that they’re not law-breakers, including that they’ve paid all their parking fines. You can’t bait and switch like that. People with unpaid parking fines can’t be treated like murders, can’t be held without bail etc. Ordinary aliens, even illegal ones, can’t be treated like alien enemies.
I don't know what you are complaining about. I said there should be gone if they're illegals without invoking the AEA.
I think that is correct. No visa, no citizenship, no staying in the US.
Under what law would they be deported, precisely? Immigration power is given to Congress. Trump’s admin can only deport pursuant to some law Congress enacted.
If immigration law was this legally enshrined reality tv show game where people were allowed to sneak in anyway they wanted and if they made it over successfully they had the right to stay permanently we'd have heard about it sometime in this several decades long debate. If you are a lawyer I hope whoever uses your legal services asks for a refund
In other words, there is no law you're aware of under which they can be immediately deported.
What Amos said.
There is a process for doing that. Trump doesn't want to bother with it. Additionally under the AEA, lawfully-present aliens can be deported.
I think it's more than that. Trump wants to establish that he doesn't have to bother with it.
Isn't it great that Trump promised us all that he'd never heard of Project 2025, and wanted nothing to do with it?
Project 2025 is only a boogey man to whacked out Leftists who worship the State. you know, people like you
Brett still argues the connection was spurious.
The 'lawfully present' aliens in question were only so because the staffers puppeting Biden's corpse waved the magic wand to make it look like they were doing something about illegals while actually make the problem worse. If Biden's corpse can wave the wand to do it. Trump can wave the wand to undo it. So the AEA is not necessary in either case.
Are you referring to Biden's Humanitarian Parole for Cubans, Haitians, Nicaraguans, and Venezuelans? If so, why is Trump using the AEA when he can use the normal process since those people are no longer lawfully present?
Remember when you supported Elian Gonzalez’ kidnappers over his father?? My how times change!
And I think if the statement was: I had a valid visa and no one said anything about it being revoked before I was arrested on the street?
Kind of seems like if someone is here legally then it can be true that (a) Congress vests in the AG the authority to revoke that legal status and (b) that person is not guilty of immigrating here illegally and (c) that person is removable, but not as criminal alien.
AmosArch 9 hours ago
"‘Can you present documentation that you’re a citizen or otherwise have the right to be here?’"
Agreed - and its certianly not hard to do. If the person is born in a US hospital since the late 1980's, they will have a social security number since the hospitals file the application on the newborns behalf. If they have a drivers license, most every state require proof of ID. If they are in the US legally, they have either a visa or a passport. The visa, DL and SSN data are readily available to ICE.
You guys live in a world that exists only in your head. We already know that multiple Venezuelans deported were legally pursuing their legal right to claim asylum. In at least two cases they were arrested (and "disappeared") after showing up for their required check-in appointment in that process.
I suspect we'll find that describes a large percentage of them when Trump is forced to disclose details. Likewise, we'll learn there is zero evidence of gang activity or criminal behavior with many - if not most. This was an empty stunt to entertain the rubes, dupes, and chumps. The Administration's claims are no more likely to be true than the talk of Haitians eating cats, or black people causing the airline-helicopter crash. Trump knows what kind of racist porn his supporters get off on, and this White House is packed to the brim with pathological liars.
The reason Trump is fighting disclosure? This whole farce will fall apart the second he has to produce facts. And remember this: MAGA may not care whether people were sent to an El Salvador hell-hole prison on the basis of crude lying. Hell, they'll probably get-off that much more over the injustice of it all. Brown-skinned people being brutally mistreated is just the kind of porn they like.
But normal people will see it differently.
Great conspiracy theory -
Do you seriously think there are a few hundred rogue ICE agents circumventing standard police procedures and actively participating in the coverup?
What conspiracy theory? We've already seen detailed accounts on multiple deportees that drive a front-end loader right thru the Administration's account. The question isn't whether they lied about these people; that's already settled. The only thing left to resolve is how many lies about how many people.
I suspect the lies will cover a large portion of the deportees, but freely admit that's just a guess. But your belief? That's these are all illegal alien gang members? That's complete DOA. It's beyond salvaging. It was a hopeless disproven mess 24hrs after the story broke.
Why do you think Trump is trying so desperately to keep the details hidden?
Do you ever think at all?
enjoy your delusions
Cops lie.
Well if it was the cops giving the accounts I'd be a little more inclined to believe them.
AFAIK this is being driven by administration appointees, and those are the ones summarizing back for the public.
And, as a group, their confabulations would make Nigerian Princes blush.
Uh huh. Here's some questions for you. If possible under Cult membership discipline, I'd love honest answers.
1. Do you think this is the one area where Trump's White House is completely honest? The one time they told the complete truth? The first instance of them giving a straight story?
2. If you learned tomorrow that large numbers of these people were sent to a hellish prison on the basis of no evidence, would you even care? Many of your fellow Cultists wouldn't. For them it's all WWE-style entertainment. The spectacle is exciting to watch and their little hearts beat wildly as they cheer. That's it's all one-hundred percent phony is completely irrelevant.
3. But let's say you answer you would care. So what will you do as the Trump Administration's story slowly falls apart? Many of your fellow Cultists endlessly follow behind Trump, cleaning-up after each bungle, lie, or criminal act. They're like that guy with a pan and brush following the elephant in a parade. Is that you? Is that your humiliating lot in life? Or will you show a little backbone.....
doubling down on your conspiracy theory.
None of your insinuations are likely to be true
Tell us how many rogue agents have to be involved in the coverup to make it work?
Why are you talking about a "coverup"? As cynical as we are, I don't think any of us think that they're deporting people they know to be ineligible for deportation. Just that they don't care.
Then what did you imply with your prior comment?
David Nieporent 3 hours ago
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Asked for the fourth time: how does "data" being "available to law enforcement" allow someone who is grabbed, shoved into detention, flown across the country, and then spirited out of the country without a hearing, to prove that he is a citizen?
What, in those quoted words, describes a "cover up"?
Your are the one that changed the question to "cover up".
However since you mentioned cover up - you should not whisking citizens out of the country would require a cover up, which shows why the allegations made by most leftists are simply inane conspriracy theory
Grb offered no conspiracy theories - no complex scheme - just a fairly reasonable suggestion aw to what happened.
Do you seriously believe that there was any sort of serious investigation behind this whole matter? If so, why weren't. the alleged gang members arrested and brought into court?
I'll tell you why. Because the Trump tale wouldn't stand up to five minutes of challenge.
One person's reasonable suggestion is another's conspiracy theory.
One problematic presumption here is that the aliens' asylum claims were legitimate to begin with. That's begging the question here. Particularly when it's also contested whether the Biden administrations handling of such claims was within the law. Also unknown is whether additional info about particular aliens was uncovered to justify.
Applying criminal (due) process expectations to immigration enforcement is not reasonable or fair. I know that's what the pro-immigration activists want. It's not what the law says.
I take issue with a lot of what you say, but most of all the suggestion that the burden of proof should be on the person arrested rather than on the government. If the government is going to seize someone and subject them to punishment or deportation, it is the job of the government to prove that those actions are justified.
The arrestees should get a hearing, and then the judge should ask the government, "Can you present documentation that they are not a citizen or otherwise do not have the right to be here?" If not, free to go.
How can you document that someone ISN'T a citizen?
on the flip side , its pretty easy to document that you are a citizen. A black sharecropper born in 1901 may not have a birth certificate or ssn. Whereas anyone born in a US hospital after the late 1980's is going to have ssn within a few weeks after birth. All that data is available to law enforcement.
Asked for the fourth time: how does "data" being "available to law enforcement" allow someone who is grabbed, shoved into detention, flown across the country, and then spirited out of the country without a hearing, to prove that he is a citizen?
(Setting aside that a SSN isn't an ID.)
DN -
you already know the answer but I shall repeat for the benefit of others
A - The ssn data base shows where the person was born (at least for those born in US hospitals within the last 35 years
B - Its near impossible to get DL without some form of ID (birthcertificate , passport visa, etc).
The first part of your question feeds into your leftist conspiracy theories. You have to assume that ICE is infested with rogue agents that disregard professional law enforcement standards that refuse to verify the persons identity.
If you want to enjoy basking in a delusional conspiracy theory
B - Its near impossible to get DL without some form of ID (birthcertificate , passport visa, etc).
Actually, it's perfectly legal, for an illegal immigrant to get a driver's license in nineteen states and DC
So maybe you don't know everything.
Nice try to be a Smart ass when those states' DL data base is going to show the individual lacked ID or was an illegal immigrant shows the point I made is correct.
Its obvious you are the one needing to obtain knowledge before commenting
California requirements:
https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/assembly-bill-ab-60-wizard/
Further
As you and everyone else already knows
Its standard police operating procedure to ask for ID when someone is arrested and when someone is pulled over for most every traffic offense.
So it would be extremely unlikely a US citizen was shoved into detention and whisked off without some form of hearing.
"Here is documentation showing that this person was born outside the U.S., and here is testimony from their parents admitting that they are not U.S. citizens."
"We've gone through our government databases, and there is no indication that this person was ever assigned a social security number or any other documents typically associated with citizenship."
"Here is this person's passport and birth certificate, which both establish that they are a foreign national born in a foreign country."
"Here are records relating to this person's career in a foreign military."
There are literally a million different ways. The standard is preponderance of the evidence - show that it is more likely than not that the person is not a citizen. If the government can't carry that relatively easy burden of proof, then they have no business seizing you and trying to boot you out of the country. Absolutely *insane* that I am on a libertarian website having to argue that the burden of proof should be on the government before it can take adverse action against people.
I think 9/11 for example was at least a predatory incursion. A commando raid reasonably describes it. So there can be entities other than nation-states that effectively have governments and armies that may be small but are big enough to do us enough damage to warrant a military response. But smuggling and so forth is just nothing like a commando raid. The things smuggled may be illegal, but it isn’t an act of organized violence. 9/11 was essentially military in character. This just wasn’t.
I think 9/11 for example was at least a predatory incursion.
Nonsense, it was a very big crime. Mass casualty crimes happen in the US almost every day.
A commando raid reasonably describes it.
A bunch of Saudi civilians with box cutters? Are you nuts?
So there can be entities other than nation-states that effectively have governments and armies that may be small but are big enough to do us enough damage to warrant a military response.
Yes. Most obviously when a military group launches a non-international armed conflict in/against the United States.
The more interesting historical example, I'd say, is Pancho Villa. The US invaded Mexico in order to capture him in 1916-17. (And failed.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pancho_Villa_Expedition
A planned attack. Planned by a group that considered itself a Nation State. Yes that is a "commando raid" or more to the point an insurgency or "unconventional warfare". Don't discount the "box cutters". The "box cutters" were a way around the security. The fact that all of the hijacking groups used them shows that the attacks were premeditated and organized.
I don't think anyone disputes that 9/11 was a coordinated, planned, and premeditated attack. I think the question is whether or not paramilitary terrorists are a nation state.
Like it's possible to think the government should have the legal authority to deport U.S. based members of al-Qaeda (although instead of deporting them, arresting them for the crime of being a member of a terrorist organization might actually be a safer option...).
The dispute is whether the Alien Enemies Act would authorize this, and whether, if authorized, the government would be able to do it with no process whatsoever. I think the answer is no and no.
Thankfully, Congress set up a special court specifically to deal with deporting terrorists, and it's equipped to handle classified intelligence so you don't need to worry about that. So the Trump admin should use that court to deport TDA members. Well, I guess first it needs to be established that a criminal gang is the same thing as a terrorist organization, but let's say we take that for granted. This would sidestep the entire debate about the legal niceties of armed incursion or invasion.
Actually, 9/11 appears very similar to the 1942 Nazi sabotage plot, except it succeeded where the German combatants were caught before they had a chance to attempt it.
A notable difference or three:
1. The U.S. was in a declared war against Germany.
2. Not so for the nation of al-Qaeda. which is not a nation anyway.
3. The real nation most associated with 911 was Saudi Arabia, with which the U.S. was not only at peace, but conspicuously in cahoots.
Surprisingly, at least to me, some U.S. intelligence agents claim the federal government has evidence that TDA gang members were trained by the Maduro regime with military-grade weapons and in sabotage, in particular in arson.
If the federal government could put on such evidence in a hearing, either an immigration hearing or a district court proceeding, I could see the U.S. prevailing under the Alien Enemies Act on the power to ultimately deport individuals affiliated with TDA.
Of course, that does not affect the need for due process for defendants to both challenge that evidence and to challenge claims that they are members or otherwise affiliated with TDA. While there are WW2 era cases running against that (see e.g. the infamous Korematsu decision), I doubt that our contemporary court would not require due process outside of the context of a declared war.
I read through it quickly; but what caught me is that the dissent says habeas in Tx is where the case should be...but doesn't address Judge Millet's point that the govt has indicated that under the proclamation, the detainees are not entitled to notice of their imminent/immediate removal. So if the detainees are not notified, how would they even know to file for habeas to stop their removal to El Salvador? They don't know they are going to El Salvador. And once in El Salvador they cannot file at all. The dissent doesn't address the lack of notice or meaningful opportunity to contest the removal at all.
Seems like a weak response to the two other opinions.
The gov't did no such thing. The TdA animals filed a case in the wrong venue. It should be dismissed on that basis alone.
Botfly, you're assuming that which needs to be proven, to wit that they are from TdA. The evidence is that some are not.
Sucks to be them
You're a real piece of shit, aren't you?
Hey, show some respect; you’re talking about someone who cheers for the rape and murder of sex workers.
I'm sure he means well. He probably figures most are liberals and foreigners.
Need I remind everyone why you're called "crazy Dave"? Why don't you reflect a little on the shit you write?
Get it right, it's David Nevercoherent, or his German Doppelganger David Neverpotent
The law is that the proper course of action is a habeas petition you imbecilic parrot. The DC case is not that thing. A class action habeas case doesn’t exist and Boagsberg has no power to review President Trump’s invocation of the Act. Like the presidential immunity case, the appeals court has once again made an ass of itself. I’m sure you can relate
There have been dozens of class action habeas cases filed over the years.
Name few. And the ones filed in the wrong jurisdiction. Then identify the ones filed with respect to the AEA.
I actually think they should have filed in Texas. An action to contest alien enemy status is in the nature of a petition for writ of habeas corpus, which is filed where the plaintiff is.
I don’t understand windycityattorney’s argument. The same information which led them to file in DC would have been enough information to let them file in Texas.
It's not "in the nature of" a petition for the writ of habeas corpus. It is a petition for the writ of habeas corpus. The complaint filed back on March 15 is captioned, "CLASS ACTION COMPLAINT AND PETITION FOR WRIT OF HABEAS CORPUS."
And venue would have been proper only in Texas. But aside from that fatal flaw, the illegal ruling of the judge goes beyond any habeas relief allowed under the law.
It's confusing what "winning" looks like from a habeas petition here. For a citizen facing criminal detention, it would mean release. Yes, these aliens are facing imminent deportation, which would not happen. But it's not like they have an absolute right of release from detention, when they ostensibly do not have the right to stay in the country.
Given the speedy nature of the unfolding events, I think there's no practical way for them to figure out where to file fast enough to do so.
In the interests of justice, it seems like some accommodation has to be made for filing, at least initially, elsewhere.
Read the opinions. The ACLU filed a pre-proclamation suit on behalf of 5 named plaintiffs based on rumors that the Trump admin was going to deploy it. Had they not done that, and not later sought class certification once the proclamation was made public… then nobody would have had time to file for habeas because nobody was notified they were subject to it and on a fast track to El Salvador. They were literally on a plane within couple hours at most of the proclamation.
At oral argument, the govt said, if the DC circuit reverses the trial court and lifts the TRO, going forward they are not going to tell the detainees they are being removed. I.e, they do not have to give the detainees advance notice. Without notice, nobody would know to file for habeas to stop them from going to El Salvador. They don’t know they are going to El Salvador until they arrive at CECOT.
Due process typically requires a)notice b)meaningful opportunity to contest what is happening. If the first time you realize you need to file habeas petition in Texas is when you are getting off the plane in El Salvador…it’s too late. The right is meaningless without knowledge/notice and time or opportunity to do something.
Did any of the pro Tda gang read the dissent?
I don't think anyone is going to consider themselves "pro Tda".
The dissent and the opinion disagree on an important thing. The opinion says that although the petition was brought as a habeas petition, the habeas petition has been abandoned and at issue presently is the APA claim. The opinion is based on the APA claim. The opinion says this in many places, including page 32-33 and page 9.
The dissent says that if you file a habeas petition, even if you try to make it something else, it's still a habeas petition. That's possible, I agree, but neither the opinion nor the dissent really dig into the lines between the two or come to a satisfying framework to resolving when a habeas petition becomes something else, so it doesn't seem all that obvious to me why the opinion is wrong in reaching its conclusion based on the APA claim.
The decision notes that the plaintiffs dismissed their own habeas petitions, and that seems pretty hard to argue with because it's like, a fact, and not, like, a legal argument. So that makes me think maybe the majority is correct to note this is not a habeas argument.
The dissent resolves this by saying the APA claim should only happen when there is no other adequate remedy. In other words, it says even though the DC court can't consider the habeas claim, because some court could consider a habeas claim, no court can consider an APA claim. Maybe. I don't know. It doesn't seem clear to me, I don't find myself persuaded.
Now, to credit the dissent, it also says the presidential proclamations are not APA reviewable at all. Maybe, I don't know. The majority opinion doesn't seem to discuss this. So if true, that seems like a good argument. The claim cites Franklin v. Massachusetts, which seems to hold a somewhat related claim, but not the actual claim being supported. But maybe I'm reading it wrong. What did you think when you followed footnote 33 of the dissent to the opinion being cited? Were you convinced?
Do you think you could, in more detail than a single sentence, explain how you reconcile the tensions I've brought up here? I'm not a lawyer so I don't know anything about any of this, I'm just literally doing exactly what you asked people to do.
What did you think of the entire opinion and dissent when you read them before making the post you made 8 hours ago asking people to read the dissent? Did you ask any of the questions I did?
"is rooted in the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment."
This is wrong. It is the Due Process Clause of the Fifth Amendment that applies to the federal government. The Fourteen Amendment applies the Due Process requirement to the states.
As I’ve said before, aliens have no inherent due process right to remain in the country, and they get only the hearing procedures Congress gives them. The AEA provides a statutory basis for a judicial hearing, however. Since Congress gave them a right to a hearing in court, the distinction doesn’t make all that much difference in this case.
"A due process right to remain in the country" is a nonsensical formulation. The due process right is a right to… due process.
For the benefit of the pendantic, they do not have a life, liberty, or property interest in remaining in the country (they are here strictly as a matter of invitation and grace revokable at any time, not right), and hence they are not constitutionally entitled to a hearing over it.
Satisfied?
ReaderY, you seem to be mixing up constitutional and statutory empowerments. Do you mean to imply that a statutory provision cannot create a due process right to benefit by its terms?
[A] person's liberty is equally protected, even when the liberty itself is a statutory creation of the State. The touchstone of due process is protection of the individual against arbitrary action of government.
(Quoted in Meachum v. Fano)
The opinion notes a "liberty interest" protected by due process of law can have "roots in state law." (Or, as here, federal law.)
The dissent thought the majority was too narrow.
The Court indicates that a "liberty interest" may have either of two sources. According to the Court, a liberty interest may "originate in the Constitution," ante at 427 U. S. 226, or it may have "its roots in state law." Ibid. Apart from those two possible origins, the Court is unable to find that a person has a constitutionally protected interest in liberty.
It appealed to natural law as a possible source of the liberty protected, citing the Declaration of Independence.
I had thought it self-evident that all men were endowed by their Creator with liberty as one of the cardinal unalienable rights. It is that basic freedom which the Due Process Clause protects, rather than the particular rights or privileges conferred by specific laws or regulations.
If someone can have a liberty interest in being able to learn German in school, why wouldn't they have a liberty interest in being able to live in the US?
Because aliens have no constitutional right to be here. They are here entirely at the grace of Congress pursuant to the laws it creates. Process rights can exist but their source is statutory, not constitutional.
Because aliens have no constitutional right to be here
1. Due process of law is a right held aliens legal, illegal, and permanent resident.
2. Permanent residents have a right to live and work in the US absent due process to remove those rights.
3. Congressionally created rights, beyond being legitimate rights on their own, can create property rights or reliance interests, both of which have due process implications.
In the US, we don't have unpersons.
They are not unpersons. They have constitutional due process rights in the context of criminal prosecution, but not deportation. Congress has plenary power to determine conditions of entry and residence, including limiting procedural and free speech rights. Aliens enter the US subject to the indulgence of Congress.
As with many things, many at VC here want to insert limits on constitutional text not there. This allows them to widen and broaden congressional power at will.
For example, now there is an apparent "context of criminal prosecution" limit on due process for certain non-citizens. Congress has "plenary" power, putting aside no such limit in the 1A, in the context of free speech in that context.
Meanwhile, when health care is involved, powers over commerce etc. are carefully parsed to create new limits on the power to pass federal legislation when the text seems more "plenary" in nature.
They have constitutional due process rights in the context of criminal prosecution, but not deportation
So you think immigration courts are just a courtesy?
No, due process includes deportation.
I am coming around to DMN finding use of the word 'plenary' as a red flag.
Question:
Congress passes a law allowing for certain aliens to be allowed legal entry into the US under the condition that they are subject to deportation if determined by [insert your preferred executive branch agency] to have criticized the foreign policy of the United States, which determination may not be repealed.
Constitutional or not?
I hope not.
It sounds a lot like a law "abridging the freedom of speech" to me.
And in any event, such a law would be "ripe for abuse," for whatever that's worth. Green card holder says we are spending too much supporting Ukraine. Deportable?
Well Bernard, we may soon find out since the Trump Administration seems keen on relying on a 20-year-old law authorizing the deportation of aliens who endorse terror or terrorist organizations, which law would clearly violate the 1A if applied to citizens.
It is important to remember that aliens have no right to enter the US, and it is well-established that persons can voluntarily waive constitutional rights in exchange for a privilege or benefit to which they are otherwise unentitled.
As for “plenary,” take it up with SCOTUS. https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/artI-S8-C18-8-1/ALDE_00001255/
The discussion alone underlines that "plenary" does not mean "no limits."
For instance: "the immigration power has proven less than absolute when directed at aliens already physically present within the United States"
See Zadvydas, 533 U.S. at 690 (observing that [a] statute permitting indefinite detention of an alien would raise a serious constitutional problem).
===
I'd add that multiple 1A battles involved non-citizens. Abrams v. U.S., for instance, involved free expression of non-citizens. We honor the dissents for respecting their free speech rights.
Sure, torture too. But not deportation. Aliens are here by the grace of Congress.
Here’s an example of the distinction. Normally, when the government provides a benefit, it has to provide a hearing before taking that benefit away, and the hearing has to meet constitutional standards of adequacy articulated by the court. But in immigration matters, there is such obligation.
Here is a recent case where the Supreme Court said the Secretary of Homeland Security gets to make an immigration finding, that the alien is not eligible for admission because the alien’s marriage to a US citizen is a sham marriage, solely on the Secretary’s own say-so with no right to contest the decision at all. Not just no judicial review, not just no administrative hearing, no hearing at all. No right to present contrary evidence or argument of any kind.
If immigration was protected by constitutional Due Process, there is simply no way the case could have come out the way it did. There would be a constitutional right to a hearing of some kind, at least administrative if not judicial. to contest the Secretary’s decision that the marriage was a sham.
https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/24pdf/604us1r03_3f14.pdf
You are, of course, mistaken. Not only is that a statutory case (note that the words "due process" don't appear in the decision at all), but there absolutely were hearings. From the opinion itself, which I suspect you keep citing because it's the only immigration case you're aware of and you have this idée fixe about immigration:
The Court further noted that she could obtain judicial review merely by filing another petition.
And, though it's not important to this discussion, you have the facts of the case wrong. DHS didn't conclude that the marriage was a sham; it concluded that a previous marriage was a sham.
To the contrary, ReaderY is making that precise distinction.
[aliens] do not have a life, liberty, or property interest in remaining in the country
How do we know this without a hearing?
And they certainly have a liberty interest in not being sent to an El Salvador prison.
See my comment above about the Bouarfa v. Mayorkas case. In that case, the Supreme Court said we know because the Secretary of Homeland Security said so. That’s how we know.
What is inferred here by the appeals court on the merits may end up being a fair interpretation of the law. The government theory is novel and maybe should be rejected–but of course I’m not going to take Somin’s word for that, because he’s not an objective commentator and would never concede that even if the government had a strong argument. If this novelty is ever accepted, it will only happen in a final SCOTUS decision (just like prior Trump court victories), on the merits.
What continues to bother me about these preliminaries is that, because this is a very important issue, procedural niceties like jurisdiction continue to be ignored. At least one judge here noted that there is a venue/jurisdiction problem (because the detained are in Texas, not DC) yet they continue to indulge this lawsuit. Venue shopping is bad, except when it isn’t.
What everyone should do is read the AEA itself. Lots of goodies, and t's bloody obvious that it does not encompass this regime's kidnapping of people, not all of whom are illegals.
I think the majority opinion is correct on the merits, but I also think they should have filed in Texas.
A nice summary of what I said. What is interesting, and contestable, is the reasons why the courts in DC didn't let go of their purported jurisdiction. Maybe that will also be vindicated in the end. But that's perhaps as novel as the administration trying to use the AEA. Like I said, the very important case clause of Article III. Who knows, they left may not like what bringing this contrary does to the doctrine of standing. If certain justices are given the chance.
The plaintiffs explained this at oral argument; they had habeas claims and APA claims. They voluntarily dismissed the habeas claims…for one, they were not seeking release from detention. Which is the heart of a habeas claim. They were contesting they were subject to the proclamation and filed claims pursuant to the administrative procedure act (APA). Because it’s not a typical habeas claim and has other claims; it can be filed somewhere other than place of confinement and in a venue where the defendant's being sued are located. Like Washington DC where the named defendant's principle offices are located.
But it also misses a larger practical point. These people were not all arrested in the southern district of Texas. They can be detained anywhere in the US and flown around the country to various detention centers. They were moved to Texas as a last stop before being sent to CECOT. But none of the detainees knew that. They have no control over where they are detained and the govt can play games shuffling them around at their whim to prevent them from filing in any one location by moving them around like a psychotic shell game.
Once they file, moving them elsewhere should not destroy jurisdiction.
That's what happened with the Columbia Univ student. He was arrested in NYC and held there; then moved to New Jersey. He was then transferred to E District of Louisiana. Govt says habeas pet has to be in Louisiana but the NYC judge said its New Jersey because that is where he was when the petition was actually filed (even though plaintiff's lawyers didn't know). His lawyers didn't know where he was because the govt kept moving him and wouldn't tell them.
Which highlights a problem when the govt has the sole decision of where someone goes and who to inform of the person's whereabouts. The govt can engage in its own venue shopping. If they move everybody to the 5th Cir as fast as possible then that is where all the habeas petitions will end up. And that power is in the exclusive control of the govt.
I think that for habeas corpus, once you file correctly the court retains jurisdiction, and I think if you file very soon after you are initially detained you get to file where you were initially detained. So I think the NYC judge is probably right.
Petitioners can’t file wherever they want, but I agree the government can’t play wackamole with jurisdictional rules either. If it could the whole purpose of habeas corpus would effectively be defeated; the government could just keep prisoners it doesn’t want to release on a prison bus and literally give them the runaround,
If this novelty is ever accepted, it will only happen in a final SCOTUS decision (just like prior Trump court victories), on the merits.
Do you think of Trump v. United States as a case decided on the merits? Where and when were the merits even argued? Seemed to me like the first time merits even showed up was in dissent after the decision was handed down.
The government theory is novel
You probably don't know this, but "novel" is the most common euphemism polite English barristers use for "wrong".
Venue and jurisdiction are different concepts. A case filed in a court that lacks jurisdiction must be dismissed. A case filed in an improper venue need not be.
IANAL - just curious...what's the difference between jurisdiction and venue? Thanks.
If you are on the 12th floor of your local federal building looking for tax forms you are in the right jurisdiction, but the wrong venue. The IRS is on the 7th floor.
That question is a bit more complicated than it sounds, because there are two forms of jurisdiction: subject matter and personal. To simplify: subject matter jurisdiction means, "Does the court have the power to hear this kind of case?" and personal jurisdiction means, "Does the court have authority over this defendant?"
The dissent is absurd.
"The Government has also shown that the district court’s orders threaten irreparable harm to delicate negotiations with foreign powers on matters concerning national security."
Really? What "delicate negotiations"? And the irreparable harm to the government is worse than to the prisoners, who are going to be deported to a brutal prison in another country?
MollyGodiva — The delicate negotiations when Bukele came and met in secret with Rubio and Musk, to sell them the scheme to pay El Salvador to imprison anyone the administration might care to designate and arrest. When you look at the history, this entire fiasco seems to have occurred at the initiative and instigation of El Salvador.
Seems to me there needs to be a different case, to try whether any innocent person was criminally deported to El Salvador by Rubio. Trump too, except for Trump v. United States.
Rubio should do time in prison for this. But of course the U.S. Department of Injustice would ignore any indictment a grand jury handed down.
If I were a grand juror, upon a showing of innocence by anyone deported to El Salvador, I would also press to investigate for evidence to indict Bondi, as a member of a criminal conspiracy to imprison outside U.S. jurisdiction (and likely to torture) someone guilty of nothing. Maybe someone who had already established qualification to appeal for asylum in the U.S.
I do not think you have to show much more than the conditions of imprisonment at CECOT to establish torture. Anyone who disagrees ought to Google Getty Images, and scan the return which promises more than 3,000 images. If viewing those does not turn your stomach, you are a sadist.
I think the invocation of the AEA is incorrect as I’ve said. But it doesn’t violate any US criminal laws.
I will let the lawyers correct me if this is mistaken, but why would it not be possible to act criminally while invoking the AEA? For instance, by pushing AEA deportees out of airplanes to fall to their deaths into the ocean.
I’m not saying it would be impossible to construct a scenario in which what US personnel could be guilty of a crime. But once they are outside of the US and in the hands of someone else, it’s not the US’s problem anymore.
I understand very well why this upsets you. When WWII broke out, Germany, having previously stripped Jews of citizenship and declared them aliens, proceeded to declare them enemy aliens. And the Final Solution was based on a similar legal theory (Hitler was actually) very careful to follow legal theory) that as far as Germany was concerned, they were merely being interned and deported, which any nation is entitled to do to enemy aliens. And once outside Germany’s territorial borders (in merely occupied territory, not Getmany proper), they and their fate were then no longer Germany’s responsibility.
I understand why the similarity concerns you.
But like it or not, a similar loophole exists in our own constitution and laws.
So tossing them out of airplanes is okay?
Are you sure about that?
What about the Convention Against Torture? What about re-foulement?
What about "“It shall be the policy of the United States not to expel, extradite, or otherwise effect the involuntary return of any person to a country in which there are substantial grounds for believing the person would be in danger of being subjected to torture, regardless of whether the person is physically present in the United States.”
If I knowingly send someone to El Salvador knowing I have an agreement that they will be housed at CECOT (because I negotiated the terms and paid the fee) and CECOT is known for human rights abuse amounting to physical or psychological torture or death... I would be concerned I am violating the convention against torture if one of the people I send there ends up beaten to death. If I am the president I am potentially immune. If I am one of the President's lackeys...not so much.
None of the examples you give constitute a criminal law. Neither treaties nor statements of policy create crimes. The constitution’s protections for Due Process rights require that a crime has to be specifically identified as such with a specific statement of prohibited conduct and a specific punishment, and a federal crime has to be specified in a statute passed by both houses of Congress with either Presidential signature or veto override.
Does the U.S. assert power to punish air piracy if it occurs over international waters? Serious question, not rhetorical.
If the person deported to El Salvador is not a citizen or permanent resident, he has no rights to litigate anything in our courts. I don't care about "due process" as it applies to aliens, as the founders never intended that.
And that statement is clearly contrary to precedent too numerous to list. Even the current govt wouldn't argue that and they hate illegals with an unholy passion.
I’m going to give a careful answer. In general, aliens don’t have a 5th Amendment Due Process right not to be deported. But they do have statutory rights. And American courts have recognized since at least the War of 1812 that the AEA recognizes a statutory right to contest alien enemy status and deportation in a habeas corpus proceeding. There have been occassional cases in which aliens won the right to stay in court in such proceedings since at least that time.
I don’t think the US can defeat that statutory right by deportation. The same argument I’ve made below that says the APA and ordinary immigration law don’t apply also, as I see it, means that the statutes stripping agencies of jurisdiction and courts of review jurisdiction also don’t apply. That is, the very things I’ve said below that government lawyers can use as a shield, I think immigrant lawyers if they are careful can potentially use as a sword. (For example, the Supreme Court recently applied a statute stripping courts of jurisdiction to review certain immigration decisions made by the Attorney General. But here Congress gave the decision to the President, not the Attorney General. The whole jurisdiction -stripping statute doesn’t apply!)
Unlike most other immigration proceedings, including APA proceedings, I don’t think deporting the alien strips US courts of authority to hear a direct AEA-based habeas corpus proceeding merely because the alien has been deported mid-proceeding. It’s a different animal, and the usual rules don’t apply.
That’s one of many reasons why I think that lawyers for immigrants should take care to attempt a traditional AEA habeas corpus petition proceeding, with a suitable petitioner, as their best shot at success.
That is a well thought out response. But I think its missing a key ingredient. Traditionally, habeas is the proper vehicle when the person is challenging their detention. It is directed at the person holding them (usually a warden or similar) challenging their authority to keep them in custody.
But what if someone isn't challenging their detention but rather challenging only their removal? The plaintiffs in this case are not saying they have the right to be released. They are saying they are entitled to notice and a chance to challenge their designation as TrendeAragua before being sent (removed) to El Salvador.
Its an unprecedented scenario because the invocation of the AEA outside of a declaration of war is unprecedented. Likewise unprecedented is the gov'ts insistence that the detainees are not entitled to any individualized review they are subject to the proclamation, are not entitled to notice before removal and are not entitled to a hearing. That is not consistent with past invocations of the AEA. And it's not consistent with the statute. It's a breathtaking assertion of executive authority to ignore the statute, precedent, and the constitution. But here we are.
If the alien is no longer in U.S. custody, under what legal theory could a court hear a habeas petition? The case is moot, because the U.S. lacks the ability to produce the petitioner.
Let’s assume that, if the US gave the petitioner a ticket back and allowed him back in, he could/would come back and appear before the court. Let’s stipulate that once he arrives at the airport they are entitled to take him into custody and escort him there rather than let him proceed on his own.
What does it mean in this context to say that the United States lacks the ability to produce the petitioner? It certainly looks like they can.
Yes, if you assume away the bad facts, then you can establish almost anything. (Here the "bad facts" are that these people are in the custody of the Salvadoran government, not the U.S. government, and a judge's order to release such a person is inoperable. Unless the theory is that the prisoner will use the plane ticket to bribe the prison warden with a free vacation, what good do you think it would do?)
OK, let’s up the ante and throw in a “fee” for the warden.
You seriously think the Salvadoran government wouldn’t put the guy on a plane for the US if the US government asked for it and crossed their palms with a suitable amount of silver?
It might, but that doesn't matter; that's not how habeas works.
Judge: "I order you to produce this guy in court."
DOJ: "Sorry, Your Honor, but he's not in our custody. He's in the custody of the Salvadoran government."
Judge: "Well, then, I order you to pay the Salvadoran government enough money to get them to let him out."
The U.S. could also send Seal Team 6 to break the guy out of the prison. Judge can't order that, either. Still not how habeas works.
The founders obviously intended that, since they expressly said "person" rather than "citizen."
I think the “delicate negotiations” argument is completely irrelevant. They either are enemy aliens or they aren’t, and negotiations have nothing to do with it. The President lacks the power to violate a Congressional statute, whether or not doing so might improve his negotiating position.
I understand this argument was raised against a temporary restraining order, not on the merits, and the government claimed that such an order would cause it losses in foreign relations. I agree with the majority that any such losses are highly speculative. Moreover, because I think that in general an Administration can’t negotiate to violate US law with a foreign state, or at least the judiciary doesn’t have to consider such negotiations as having any validity for legal purposes, I think the administration needs a colorable merits claim for this to represent an interest in the government’s favor.
The delicate negotiations bit is not about deportation, it's about invoking the States Secrets defense to stay out of court.
Ah yes, someone likes to second guess the separation of powers when it's your cause at stake. It's not like there isn't a ton of precedent about such things. Maybe it's not on point here, but the idea (delicate foreign policy negotiations) is not absurd. It's literally a power given to the president, and often recognized in law and precedent.
The president indeed has the power to conduct negotiations with foreign governments. Since the court is not doing that or trying to do that, "separation of powers" is not relevant here.
The claim of absurdity was not that the president has the power to negotiate with foreign governments; the claim of absurdity was that the judge's order implicated that power.
And the fact that the govt is arguing that the detainees should file for habeas in Texas. Which would also cause their removal to El Salvador to be delayed or stopped. So they are okay with the removals pausing in the case of a habeas petition; but it screws up their foreign policy if the same thing is accomplished via the administrative procedure act? It's not a coherent argument to make.
Simple, we do what Argentina did...
Since it’s Dr. Ed, he probably means when Jorge Rafael Videla was running things.
On reflection, I think the plaintiffs here blundered strategically. They dropped their habeas corpus petition and are pursuing only APA claims.
Whatever my opinion of the ultimate merits, I don’t think the APA applies. Congress, acting in an era before most administrative agencies and administrative law existed, assigned responsibility to proclaim and set rules for alien enemy status not to an administrative agency but directly to the President, under the War Power. I don’t think the APA applies, at all, to direct Presidential decisions made under the war power. The President simply doesn’t have to offer notice and comment (etc. etc. etc.) in order to conduct war.
It would have been more prudent to find plaintiffs with a colorable claim that but for the invocation of the AEA they would not be immediately deportable, and file the petiition for writ of habeas corpus traditionally associated with the AEA and which has been the historical method of contesting AEA findings. They could have asked for a temporary restraining order in the context of that petition.
The majority took the view that the government had essentially abandoned its claim that there wasn’t jurisdiction to review an APA claim because “this case sounds in habeas,” saying it hadn’t developed this argument or provided support for it. That suggests it’s still a live argumejt capable of being better supported at a later stage in the proceedings. It might win.
I would urge folks interested in challenging the AEA proclamation to avoid this potential defense - which I think has some merit - by finding plaintiffs in a position to file habeas corpus claims and meeting the jurisdictional rules for them. Lawyers can then ask for restraining orders to ensure their clients aren’t moved in an attempt to defeat jurisdiction, and moreover I think once jurisdiction is established moving them for this purpose probably doesn’t actually defeat it. And they can ask judges to declare the presidential proclamation invalid as inconsistent with the requirements of the AEA in both their argument and their request for relief.
I think once there is a valid basis for jurisdiction, everything can proceed. But lawyers should be careful about jurisdiction and make sure they have a case that clearly has it and doesn’t risk being defeated by these sorts of arguments.
Paying attention to these sorts of technical jurisdictional details is critical here. Judges who want to avoid weighing into a constitutional crisis may look for some sort of technical out, so it’s important to be careful to close that option off.
If the plaintiffs are to play by jurisdictional rules like everyone else is, how else are they going to forum shop this to the DC courts?
Two women against one man in dissent. Exactly what I'd imagine. Women are too emotional to be judges.
Abolish the DC circuit.
Congress is gonna do it....
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/republican-escalate-efforts-rein-judges-politics-desk-rcna198079?utm_source=firefox-newtab-en-us
How would Congress (AKA the Senate) possibly do that with the filibuster in place? You think any Democrat senators would allow that to come to a vote? That's ignoring you don't even have a majority of the Senate. (Collins, Murkowski, McConnell, plus a dozen hiding behind them.) Primary the RINO cucks!
I don't know what it is that has caused Trump supporters to continue saying stupid sh!t like this. Congress is not going to ratify every single grievance correction you all want to see happen.
Simple solution. Trump can have rogue senators from states with reliably conservative governors assassinated in D.C by supporters in the military. He can then pardon all of the people involved, himself included. Since it happened in D.C., no state has jurisdiction to prosecute.
Then the MAGA governors appoint replacements, and enough to defeat a filibuster. Winning.
You are, of course, aware that if the DC Circuit is abolished that all of the judges you're mad about will continue to be judges, and they will be assigned to other circuits (which, I trust you know, is required by the constitution -- because of the guarantee that judges retain tenure for life -- and is the practice of the government in past cases where courts were abolished). And the cases will continue to be filed in the circuit which would assume responsibility for federal cases, so you'd just move to that court being the one you hate because it has all the cases you hate and the judges you hate. Like, just say what you mean and announce the government should execute liberal judges at Space Guantanamo or whatever.
Query: a hostile state (think Iran) trains and arms covert terrorists to perform attacks on U.S. soil. Group comes here, and then is caught.
Deportable under the AEA? Under Judge Henderson's reading, it appears the answer is No.
It's possible that the covert terrorists are a predatory incursion as defined by Henderson:
Here is where you (and the Trump admin) are missing the point of the AEA. It is not about deporting the people doing the invasion/predatory incursion. They are at best POWs and at worst spies and saboteurs (aka terrotists), subject to severe punishment.
It is about being able to deport every other Iranian [or, in this case, Venezuelan] national in the US.
Been waiting for someone to mention that.
These activist judges are simply carrying out a political open borders agenda.
Sure, torture too. But not deportation. Aliens are here by the grace of Congress.
So, it is granted, that Congress does not have "plenary" power over immigration to the extent that means they can do anything they want to carry out its power over immigration.
"Deportation" is no talisman. You cannot torture people while deporting them. There are limits on the government generally and they do not disappear during the deportation process.
The whole thing is somewhat academic here. There are statutory limits on deportation. This alone provides due process rights. But, above all that, there still is a basic constitutional floor.
My prediction is that the Supreme Court will ultimately reverse this on jurisdictional grounds. For one, it would be the correct decision. This is a habeas case (regardless of what the plaintiffs label it), and a habeas case must be brought in the district of confinement, subject to certain uncommon exceptions not relevant here. Secondly, it allows the feckless John Roberts to do what he does best: delay an ultimate decision as long as possible, avoiding making one at all ideally.
As to the merits, I have said from the beginning that Trump may lose, but ultimately it puts him on the side of wanting to exclude and remove foreign terrorists, murderers, rapists, and child traffickers from this country, and his opponents on the side of keeping them here, It is a political loser for the Democrats, but if they choose to stand for nothing more than "against whatever Trump is for", then they will probably suffer electorally, to Trump's gain. And, if he ultimately loses on the merits, he will turn to Congress, and say, "The courts say I don't have the authority to remove foreign terrorists and criminal gangs. Give me that authority." I have little doubt which side the vast majority of the American people would take in such a Congressional debate.
Bill Barr answers all 3 fallacies of this article
"Even where it's appropriate for the court to play its traditional role of safeguarding the liberties of American citizens, we have this phenomena of nation-wide injunctions where the lowest level judge, district judges, try to bind the entire nation and bind the president in their initial decision. That is not what we have meant by the judicial power under our Constitution,"
Finally where was REASON when ROBERTS !!!! came up with Presidential Immunity.
They don't teach Logic nowadays (except at my college) but you get and EPIC FAIL
Level of Court, Roberts pretending to not judge , dithers, gives a grinning interview, denies it is important enough for SCOTUS and thus in effect overrides 8 other judges !!!! Where is Presidential IMmunity, where the hell is some, any guidance on Birthright Citizenship --- yet some bottom level judge tries to stop everything.
A potential limitation on Ludecke v. Watkins that might be explored.
Ludecke v. Watkins held that courts could not review the finding that Ludecke was dangerous. But it held this in a context where the President had limited action against enemy aliens to dangerous aliens, exempting non-dangerous aliens entirely. Ludecke held that where the President chooses to enforce the statute against a narrower category of enemy aliens than the statute covers, membership in the narrower category is non-reviewable.
My suggested interpretation of Ludecke’s holding in this regard is that membership in Presidentially-created enforcement categories are unreviewsble because they are essentially an exercise of prosecutorial distinction, which is traditionally unreviewable.
However, dangerousness is for some purposes a statutorily-created category, not a Presidential one. The statute says that non-dangerous aliens are entitled to a reasonable amount of time to settle their affairs before leaving, and get an opportunity to leave voluntarily. They cannot be immediately deported. And I suggest they cannot be confined for that reasonable period of time either.
My suggestion is that courts are still permitted to assess membership in statutorily-created categories, and hence are permitted to assess dangerousness for purposes of determining whether the President can immediately deport or even immediately confine them.
In other words, I am suggesting that courts can entertain a writ of habeas corpus petition from even enemy aliens who claim that they are not dangerous and are entitled to the reasonable amount of time provided by the statute before the President can take action against them, even though they are eventually deportable.
Yes, I’m suggesting enemy aliens get a right other kinds of aliens generally don’t have. While that may not seem to make sense, it makes complete sense if one recognizes that this is a statute from 1798, and Congress in 1798 was simply more hospital, moderate, and liberal towards foreigners (at least white ones) than Congress today. Professor Somin would have had a lot more friends back then than he does today. The statute reflects 1798 attitudes, not today’s attitudes.
Because the statute is sui generis, alien enemies get its unusual liberality as well as its unusual harshness.
So I think Ludecke doesn’t foreclose courts from entertaining a claim by petitioners with no criminal record and roots in the community and with solid-citizen witnesses of a kind that might impress judges able to testify for their character, that even if it turns out they are enemy aliens, they are not dangerous, and because they are not dangerous they cannot be confined or removed for the reasonable amount of time the statute gives them. And this in turn can provide a basis for a restraining order or injunction.
By the way, it was argued that various Obama and Biden administration initiatives were illegal because prosecutorial discretion regarding immigration can only be exercised on an individual, case by case basis, and a President isn’t permitted to entire categories from enforcement. It was described as unprecedented.
But under the above interpretation, this is exactly what was done, and what the Supreme Court held was judicially unreviewable, in Ludecke.
I agree some of these programs had other features besides just not prosecuting. But Presidents can in fact decide not to enforce immigration laws against entire pre-specified categories of immigrants of the President’s own devising.