The Volokh Conspiracy
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Thoughts on the Supreme Court Oral Argument in the Trump Section 3 Case
The justices might well overrule the Colorado Supreme Court on the grounds that only Congress has power to enforce Section 3 of the 14th Amendment. Such a ruling would be a serious mistake.

Today's Supreme Court oral argument in Trump v. Anderson overwhelmingly focused on the issue of whether Section 3 of the Fourteenth Amendment is "self-executing," that is whether states can enforce it in the absence of congressional legislation. Most of the other issues at stake in the case got little or no attention. For example, there was almost no discussion of the question of whether the January 6 attack on the Capitol was an "insurrection" and whether Trump "engaged" in it.
Both liberal and conservative justices repeatedly raised questions about whether letting states enforce Section 3 would lead to a lack of uniformity, and whether states could abuse their authority by trying to disqualify people for political reasons. Given the extensive focus on this issue and the relative neglect of others, there is a good chance that the Court will overrule the Colorado decision on that basis. Strikingly, the questioning focused much more on pragmatic concerns about chaos and abuse than on more traditional legal issues about the text, structure, and original meaning of Section 3. The self-execution question may also appeal to the justices because it is an "off ramp" that would allow them to dispose of this hot potato without having to pass judgment on the nature of the January 6 attack on the Capitol and Trump's egregious actions in inciting it and trying to use it as leverage to force Congress to keep him in power after losing the 2020 election.
But it would nonetheless be a mistake to decide the case in that way. Nothing in the text or original meaning of the Fourteenth Amendment require congressional legislation to enforce it. Indeed, multiple ex-Confederates were adjudged disqualified in the aftermath of the Civil War even without any such enforcement legislation, which suggests a broad understanding that disqualification does not depend on congressional action. Section 5 of the Fourteenth Amendment does give Congress the power to enact "appropriate" enforcement legislation. But there is no indication that this power is exclusive. And the Court has repeatedly allowed self-enforcement for other parts of the Fourteenth Amendment, even though Section 5 applies to them, as well.
Practical concerns about non-uniformity and abuse are understandable. But they are overblown. If state officials or state courts reach unsound or contradictory legal conclusions about the meaning of Section 3 (e.g. - by adopting overbroad definitions of what qualifies as an "insurrection"), their determinations could be reviewed in federal court, and the Supreme Court could impose a uniform definition of the terms in question. Indeed, it could do so in this very case! Non-uniform interpretations of provisions of the federal Constitution by state and lower federal courts can occur in many contexts. Settling such issues is one of the reasons why we have a Supreme Court that can be the final arbiter of federal constitutional questions.
In 2016, there was litigation in multiple states over claims brought by Trump supporters to the effect that Sen. Ted Cruz, his chief rival for the GOP presidential nomination, was not a "natural born" citizen (Cruz was born in Canada to US-citizen parents). Courts in different states could have reached divergent conclusions on the issue of whether a child born to US citizens while the latter resided abroad counts as "natural born" (it so happens they did not). Yet no one doubted state courts could decide this issue, subject - of course - to potential review by the federal Supreme Court.
Courts in different states could also potentially reach divergent conclusions about factual issues (e.g. - whether a particular person was involved in the insurrection or not). But that's a problem that can arise in any adjudication of candidate qualifications. Thus, no one doubts that state courts can adjudicate whether a candidate for president meets the requirements that he be 35 years old, and a "natural born" citizen of the United States. But if, for example, there is a factual dispute about the validity or accuracy of the candidate's birth certificate (recall "birtherist" claims that Barack Obama wasn't actually born in the United States), courts in different states could potentially reach divergent factual conclusions on that, as well.
Even on factual issues, serious abuses can be constrained by the power of the Supreme Court to review lower-court factual findings for "clear error." If lower courts or state officials make things up out of whole cloth or go against the clear weight of evidence, that can still be overturned.
While many of the justices seem to have overestimated the downside of allowing enforcement by states, they seemingly ignored the downside of ruling that the power belongs exclusively to Congress. As a practical matter, the latter turns Section 3 into a dead letter - not just for insurrectionist presidents, but for everyone else. It's highly unlikely Congress will enact new enforcement legislation at any time in the near future.
Before Trump's attempt to overturn the 2020 election and the resulting January 6 attack on the Capitol, it may have seemed that gutting Section 3 is no big deal, because there was little chance it would be needed. But we can no longer assume such complacency is justified. If future presidents and other officeholders do not face disqualification for insurrection, they might well conclude that imitating Trump's example is a worthwhile gamble. If you succeed, you get to stay in power despite losing an election! And if you fail, you can still seek office again in the future.
At one point, Justice Kavanaugh suggested that 18 U.S.C. Section 2383, the federal criminal insurrection law, qualifies as an exclusive enforcement statute. For reasons explained in Part I.B of my amicus brief, that simply isn't true. In addition, requiring a criminal conviction for insurrection will make enforcement impossible in situations where getting one is difficult or impossible, or where prosecutors choose to pursue other charges instead.
While the vast bulk of oral argument time was devoted to the self-execution issue, there was also some discussion of the issue of whether the presidency is covered by Section 3. Here, Trump lawyer Jonathan Mitchell made some striking concessions. For example, he conceded there is no good reason why an insurrectionist president should be excluded from coverage. Indeed, as he noted, the case for covering the president is actually stronger than that for covering other offices, given that the president is commander-in-chief of the armed forces, thereby making an insurrectionist president a far greater menace than an insurrectionist member of Congress or lower-level executive official. He also admitted that people at the time feared that a former Confederate such as Jefferson Davis could potentially become president.
Mitchell tried to suggest that the exclusion of the presidency was the result of a "compromise." But such a compromise could only occur if some people had a reason why they wanted to exclude the highest office in the land from Section 3's coverage. If, as Mitchell admitted, no such reason exists, there is no basis for believing that a compromise on this point was made.
Early on, a good chunk of time was also spent on Mitchell's creative argument that Section 3 cannot be enforced until an official has actually taken office, because until then Congress can also lift his disability by a 2/3 majority vote of each House. This is a badly flawed argument, and I don't think it got much traction with the Court. But Mitchell and Trump won't need to rely on this theory if they can win on self-enforcement, as now seems probable.
In sum, the most likely outcome is that the Court will rule in Trump's favor on the grounds that Section 3 is not self-enforcing. It's a bad argument that would set a dangerous precedent by effectively gutting Section 3. But it obviously appeals to the justices, for reasons that see more pragmatic in nature than legal.
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I doubt Cruz’ father was a citizen. Nimarata Hussein Haley isn’t a Natural Born Citizen because her slightly older sister wasn’t born a citizen which means Kamala isn’t a NBC and neither is Marco Rubio. But I think that is a dumb requirement and so I voted for Rubio to be president.
Narrator voice: It is actually true, as Justice Alito said, that federal criminal insurrection law qualifies as the exclusive enforcement mechanism at present, as described in section 5.
Especially because he is on the Supreme Court and Professor Somin is not.
Obtaining a criminal conviction is not impossible if proven in a court of law. Due process is still a thing. It’s supposed to be hard to obtain a conviction and disqualify someone from office. Why in the world should such a thing be easy?
Because Trump is bad and SCO Smith hasn't charged Trump under the insurrection statute.
Therefore, lawfare must be waged. You can't let Trump get away with DUE PROCESS!
Trump had due process.
He had process, anyway.
He’s ineligible because he lied during a civil deposition.
He's ineligible because Democrats say so.
It’s really extraordinary throughout all these arguments that the pro-disqualification people choose to ignore Congress has acted, via a criminal insurrection statute. With all the dismissal of due process concerns, I’m left to conclude it’s because proving Trump guilty under it is “too hard” and won’t get them what they want. For those of us who believe in the rule of law (as opposed to the rule of men where personal feelings trump law), hard is a feature not a bug. It should be difficult, not easy, to disqualify someone from office with an accusation of being an insurrectionist.
Full disclosure again: I think Trump unfit for office and never have/never will vote for him. I would like nothing better than for him to be eliminated from our politics. Lawfare distortions to get a guy is a bigger threat to the rule of law than Trump himself.
With all the dismissal of due process concerns, I’m left to conclude it’s because proving Trump guilty under it is “too hard” and won’t get them what they want
The DoJ is prosecuting hundreds of Jan 6 protestors, Jack Smith is prosecuting Trump for Jan 6 crimes. But the DoJ will not charge Insurrection. You have to assume, it is because the Elements required to charge the crime are not present.
"The DoJ is prosecuting hundreds of Jan 6 protestors, Jack Smith is prosecuting Trump for Jan 6 crimes. But the DoJ will not charge Insurrection. You have to assume, it is because the Elements required to charge the crime are not present."
That is not a sound assumption at all. Jack Smith's objective is not to disqualify Donald Trump from running for President; it is to send him to prison. Trump is 77 years old. Some of the statutes he is charged with violating have much harsher penalties than insurrection under 18 U.S.C. § 2383. Proof of the charged crimes is simpler, more straightforward, and more easily understood by jurors than would be the case for an insurrection charge.
If Trump is convicted of the charged offenses, he will die in prison (unless he dies sooner). An insurrection charge would complicate the trial with no corresponding benefit to the prosecution.
Jack Smith knows a thing or two about prosecuting tyranrts. He is doing a masterful job.
Trump dying in prison is a beautiful concept. Would it be wrong to mock the Trump fans who queue and wail along the route as the body is transported to whichever of Trump’s family members want to plant it at that tax sham cemetery on a golf course?
At Trump's age he will die in prison if he's sentenced there for almost anything but a misdemeanor. That's not a factor.
No, that is very much a factor regarding how soon Donald Trump could be initially locked up. The more issues a criminal case involves, the greater the chance of release pending appeal after sentencing.
Detention pending appeal in federal cases is the rule, and release pending appeal is the exception. Per 18 U.S.C. § 3143(b), release requires specific findings by the trial court:
Charging and trying a streamlined case lessens the risk that the defendant will be released pending appeal following confviction.
Jack Smith knows a thing or two about prosecuting tyranrts. He is doing a masterful job.
Smith is a Jedi master of the law.
Not many lawyers get overturned by SCOTUS 9-0
An insurrection charge would complicate the trial with no corresponding benefit to the prosecution.
Complicate the case to a DC jury? Come on.
SCO Smith knows he doesn't have to worry about a DC jury being confused about Trump. There's no confusion there at all: they already hate him.
Smith likely isn't bringing in an insurrection charge because he knows that he'll lose it on appeal.
That's basically what the attorney for the voters said during oral arguments. They argued that getting a conviction is too hard, so they want an easier process.
Note for my fellow VC commentators: just because someone has a process does not make it a due process.
When did Trump have due process on this issue?
Trump has doo doo process like what he does in his pants after he eats KFC. 😉
Ilya: Its okay for states to unilaterally decide to remove people they don't like from the ballot for federal elections because the feds can swoop in and save the day essentially making the Feds the final decision maker
But its not okay for the Feds to be the decision maker.
Another masterpiece of legal genius from Prof Somin
Counsel for the voters tried to make the argument that SCOTUS can clean up any messes or problems of the evidentiary record made by trial courts.
It landed with a dull thud.
Pretty typical of his fascist arguments.
Sorry Ilya, the Great Deporter is going to be our next President.
I take comfort in my knowledge of Dr. Ed 2's track record for accuracy.
Yep, it looks like this will be a consequentialist decision rather than an originalist one. All that's left is to see how the most conservative justices will somehow spin consequentialism into originalism.
It certainly seemed to me that the case focused mainly around the original meaning, as well as precedent.
Justice Jackson seemed to focus very strongly on the language of Section 3, where she seemed to say the original intent was focusing on local elections in the south.
She has an extensive line of questioning on those textualist concerns about the 2:02:00 mark.
Actually seems very originalist.
I agree. If red state politicians decide a given Democrat is unfit for office they should be able to simply remove them from the ballot and not even put it up for a vote whenever they want. Red states and blue states can elect rival presidents from now on to prevent civil war.
"The justices might well overrule the Colorado Supreme Court on the grounds that only Congress has power to enforce Section 3 of the 14th Amendment. Such a ruling would be a serious mistake."
I suppose I should take some personal responsibility for my strenuous advocacy that serious mistake.
Basically an admission by Somin that the Section 3 argument has been lost. They will have to find another way to stop Trump from winning the election. With as desperate as the left has been I would not put assassination off the table.
Nor would I -- but I hope they realize the consequences of that.
I like to remind people that Jack Kennedy believed that he was not going to get re-elected in 1964 -- the reason why he went to Dallas was to shore up support in his own party.
His civil rights agenda went through Congress postmortem.
Same thing with Garfield -- his civil service law went through Congress postmortem.
Assassinating a President makes him a martyr and that is the last thing you want to do. But no one ever said that the Left was overly bright...
"His civil rights agenda went through Congress postmortem."
Not without crucial changes. He authored the "affirmative action as outreach, with racial discrimination prohibited" executive order. LBJ authored the "Full speed ahead with quotas and timetables" executive order.
I suspect affirmative action would have kept its original meaning if he'd not been assassinated.
There just aren’t enough old, white, male, bigoted, disaffected, un-American culture war casualties left in America — not even in desolate, loser-filled places like West Virginia, Alabama, Idaho, Oklahoma, and the Hoover Institution offices — to give Trump another chance at a multicushion Electoral College trick shot.
I think it's clear that a few Justices aren't buying the self-execution argument. The only question I have is whether the primary reason why Trump wins is on self-execution or whether it's on the "Trump is not an officer" argument.
Somin, like literally everyone not representing the plaintiffs, has always acknowledged that SCOTUS's decision is predictable in effect. The question has always been what grounds they will use. It's unfortunate that our highest court is 100% predictable in partisan cases.
The Court's questions did not suggest to me that they veiw Section 3 as never being self-executing. Rather, the justices seemed concerned by the prosepect of states disqualifying candidates seeking "federal" or "national" offices.
It will be difficult to use constitutional text, structure, and history to find a rule that allows states to enforce Section 3 to bar inserctionists from state office, but precludes states from enforcing Section 3 against candidates for federal office. But such a rule clearly appeals to the justices on a pragmatic elevel. If that's the rule they want, they will find a way to adopt it.
This appoach won't "gut" Section 3. Someone like Coy Griffin, who was kicked out of his New Mexico county commisioner position in a state-court Section 3 proceeding, would still be disqulaified. But neither Trump nor anyother presidential candidate could be kicked off the ballot by any state.
If nothing else, this approach would be better than carving a Trump-shaped hole in Section 3 by ruling that the President is not "an officer of the United States … [who takes an oath to] support the Constitution."
Right. And one way Section 3 could still be enforced at the federal level even if there were no legislation is by Congress when counting electoral college votes. I'm guessing SCOTUS won't rule that out, which may have significant practical consequences. Ilya is reading more than warranted into the justices' questions.
It will be difficult to use constitutional text, structure, and history to find a rule that allows states to enforce Section 3 to bar inserctionists from state office, but precludes states from enforcing Section 3 against candidates for federal office. But such a rule clearly appeals to the justices on a pragmatic elevel. If that’s the rule they want, they will find a way to adopt it.
The key words are state and federal.
Was it just me, or did the Justices seem to be seriously considering making this a federal-court jurisdiction matter, but NOT requiring a congressional statute?
Or maybe a federal court jurisdiction matter, and there's already a congressional statute?
I still think they'll find that federal insurrection law is the enabling legislation that occupies the field.
Indeed. There is a statue.
It's almost as if Congress has already spoken on this issue.
They certainly were very skeptical of Colorado asserting the power using their own independent power, but I didnt really sense a lot of enthusiasm for them to leave the matter to federal courts, absent Congress reviving the Quo Warranto process.
Tellingly the specifically asked both lead counsels whether conviction under 2383 would be sufficient to disqualify a candidate, assuming section 3 applies to President, both counsels agreed it was.
I think its a good bet that that's the way they will go.
I think its a good bet that that’s the way they will go.
It also has the virtue of not even being textually wrong.
That being said, I think the VC peanut gallery would need a wellness check if the Court rules that Congress meant what it said when it wrote Section 5.
I just don't see how letting the voters vote for either of the two major party nominees for President can ever be a "serious mistake".
Let's assume for sake of argument they got the Constitution completely wrong. So what? The point is to have an elected government and a democratic system. Court decisions get stuff wrong all the time, and the Republic doesn't fall. It's just not that important that every SCOTUS case be rightly decided, any more than (to use John Roberts' favorite analogy) every ball and strike call in a baseball game has to be accurate.
We're going to have an election and the voters are going to get to choose their President. That seems... right, in the larger scheme of things.
If the SCOTUS makes a mistake in a decision the citizens the final say in who becomes POTUS would be better than a mistake that takes that say away from them by state officials.
The Constitution was amended in 1951 after almost four years of effort, solely to prevent any popular President from holding office for a third term. Obama could probably win another term in November, but the Constitution bars him from serving a third term. And you think it's "right" to ignore the Constitution because a fleeting majority of voters (or at least those in a few critical States) think it's "better" than following the Constitution?
It's not a Smorgasbord--you either follow the Constitution, or you don't.
Who is saying that the Constitution should be ignored?
What I said was that if SCOTUS makes a mistake that I would prefer such a mistake favor citizens over bureaucrats when it comes to electing the leader of the USA. It isn’t even specific to this case and the fact that it looks like the SCOTUS is about to overwhelmingly rule against your desired position does not make it a mistake in any event. Btw if the Democrats want to nominate Obama I would have no problem leaving him on the ballot and he somehow win then Congress and SCOTUS could rule on if he is eligible to assume office at the time. My prediction in such a case he would clearly be ruled ineligible since there is no serious question that Obama served two terms. In the same vein questioning Trump’s eligibility to serve would need to wait until after he won the election and then have Congress and SCOTUS decide the matter. Even then if declared ineligible Congress could remedy the situation by an appropriate vote. Of course the reason the Democrats really want to keep Trump off the ballot is because if he did win and they used Section 3 to keep him from assuming office it would be a really bad look for them.
Well, for some people it's a serious mistake if it allows the wrong person to win the election.
Like when Trump thought the wrong person won the last election and decided, with the full support of his followers, to do something about it.
Protest was once CLAIMED to be something the Left supported.
That's a really good point. If there is any doubt, we should err on the side of democracy, rather than stretching tenuous legal theories to the breaking point.
At this point, this just reads like propaganda.
I think we have a very clear understanding of Ilya's position ... does this repetition provide any new information?
Well there is new information to digest besides He's right. Now we also have good reason to believe at least 8 justices are seriously wrong, at least according to Ilya.
I'm pretty arrogant myself but if I was faced with an overwhelming repudiation like this, I'd have to reconsider some of the basis underpinning my opinion.
The whining has started. He knows he's getting his ass handed to him and is too stubborn to accept it. "But I'm still right!" the loser cried. Only drama now is if it's 9-0.
I see Professor Somin is taking on the chin the fact that his arguments are not being accepted by--it appears--eight-ninths of the Supreme Court (/s). It must be especially grating to see that the Court is unlikely to even reach the question of whether Trump engaged in insurrection when, almost as surely, Professor Somin's arguments on that point would be rejected as well.
Grating? It allows him to retain his illusions, I think.
I mean, if Ilya's positions were actually fully realized, you'd see him move to another country pretty quick due to the results.
It is quite enjoyable to think about him stewing about just how wrong he is.
IMHO: if Colorado state is subject to Section 3 (as it is) and Colorado state plays a role in the presidential election (as it does), then the only possible conclusion is that Colorado must apply Section 3 when it plays such a role in the presidential election.
Perhaps it was a chaos-driving mistake to let states play a role in presidential elections, but that decision was made supreme law of the land, and any effort supporting that states can behave as if Section 3 didn’t exist literally means fighting the Constitution.
States do not get to decide questions of qualification for national elections, especially those fact questions that depend on subjective determinations.
That could explain why the Supreme Court is hearing oral arguments.
Or, maybe it's a coincidence?
So you think that if Greta Thunberg walks into the Texas Secretary of State's (or whoever runs elections in Texas) office in Austin and says, "I would like to be on the presidential ballot; here's my filing fee and some signed petitions," that the Secretary of State would say, "Okay, I know you're not a citizen, not 35, not a resident of the U.S., but fine; I can't decide whether you're qualified, so I'll print your name on these ballots"?
Now do Jefferson Davis.
This was (thankfully) specifically mentioned during oral arguments: age/residency/citizenship are not the same type of objective facts as determining whether Trump (who was not a captured POW of a rebel army) is an insurrectionist. Determining that requires both a legal standard and due process fact finding adjudication. As much as people want to tout the state court’s “judgment”, I have to date heard no evidence showing that Trump planned the Capitol breach, was aware of any plan in advance or on the day, or ordered it once he became aware of it.
Sometimes minions do things they think will help their guy, like the IRS Cincinnati office slow-walking Tea Party tax exemption applications and subsequently deleting their hard drives during an investigation.
One other point (just listened to oral argument), adding on. It applies to 'holding office' not 'running for office' because Congress can remove the disability. That was an interesting argument.
Another part was tricky too. State cannot add a qualification to office by moving up a deadline, such as the ability of Congress to vote to remove a disability (e.g. being the Chief Insurrectionizer), by denying access to the federal ballot.
I don't think SCOTUS will ever reach the question of whether an insurrection occurred or not. Nobody, I mean nobody on that Court wanted any part of that. That was clear to me.
In the real world, Ms. Thunberg would have submitted an application to register as an independent candidate to the TX SOS, in which she swore under oath she was correctly representing that she was a) a US citizen and b) had lived in the US for the requisite length of time. I’m not aware of any discretion the SOS has under the TX election code to do anything but accept those sworn representations and perform the ministerial task of putting the name on the ballot, much less any likelihood the SOS is personally running background checks on no-name independent candidates.
Would any other readers like to study legal debate in action post moot court? Professor Somin please educate your devoted readers; publish a follow up post arguing for the other side, Trump. Surely, two legitimate sides to Supreme Court cases deserve publication?
It is very disingenuous of Prof. Somin to criticize the Supreme Court for resolving a case on pragmatic grounds. Can anyone recall a single VC post where the writer produced a careful analysis of a currently disputed issue at the end of which he concluded that, sadly, the Constitution compelled a result which the writer opposed for policy reasons?
They haven't resolved anything yet.
My youngest child stomped her foot when she didnt get what she wanted. Grew out of it by age 5 or so. Ilya's still working toward that goal. He's a stubborn boy.
I want Congress to decide if I can eat ice cream for dinner!!! Whaaaaaaaa!!
I agree with the notion Colorado lacks authority to enforce Section 3.
I heard of something called quo warranto, where people can sue to remove officials who're disqualified. I don't know if Congress could authorize states to do this, but they can certainly authorize one or more legslative and executive branch officials to sue quo warranto.
Notably, when Congress passed the Civil Rights Act of 1870 (aka the Enforcement Act of 1870), the quo warranto process was federal, not state.
who cares about all your pontification. you are a commie
Yada yada yada. Somin gets buried again. Big fuckin' surprise.
The Amendment spells out a cure to the disqualification controlled by Congress. Why would there be any need to read in an implicit prerequisite to enforcement when the amendment plainly spells out how Congress can override any State's decision
The reconstruction Amendments were crafted to take power away from the States. The 14th amendment was ratified to take power from the States and give it to Congress. Remember, the Civil was the States going rogue.
The amendment is 2 sentences. The first says that "No person shall..." The second specifies that "Congress may..." Congress gets the power you're describing in the second sentence. The power to nullify the person's disqualification from the first sentence. Congress doesn't need to enforce Section 3 because it has a "veto". Requiring Congress to enforce basically reads out the second sentence of the section because if they can enforce the first, they don't need the veto in the second
Actually it does, because the former is general, and the later is specific.
Congress generally: "This is insurrection, and conviction means they can't run for Senate"
Congress specifically: "All persons participating in J6 riot are hereby removed from the disability of the 14th amendment"
The lawyer representing the voters insists that Trump was disqualified from office Jan 7th. At that time, he was no longer President. How is that to be enforced? Who is the enforcer?
The Supreme Court has a smorgasbord of dispositive issues to choose from. If SCOTUS rules that states do not have the authority to disqualify a candidate under the Fourteenth Amendment, § 3, but also does not declare the President not to be subject to disqualification, here's one scenario that I would like to see play out.
Once Donald Trump is nominated by the Republican National Convention in July, Secretary of State Griswold sues Trump in United States District Court in Denver for declaratory judgment under 28 U.S.C. § 2201, seeking a determination of whether Trump did or did not engage in insurrection regarding the events of January 6, 2021. (Until Trump is formally nominated, the question would not be ripe.)
Jonathan Mitchell argued differently. His argument....Congress can remove the disability.
Did you listen to arguments? What did you think. I thought it was amazing.
I think Mitchell argued the states can’t remove Trump from any ballot (primary or general) even if he is plainly disqualified because Congress can remove the disability after the election. That strikes me as absurd because how will Trump be disqualified after the election, and doing so would result in much worse chaos than disqualifying before the election.
As to “not guilty’s” observation, there seems to be a consensus (based on the consequences) from the justices that a single, nationwide standard applies (sorry, Amar brothers). Kicking the can down the road to an action in federal court that does not begin until late July would also have serious consequences (a disqualification would hamper the GOP’s ability to pick a replacement candidate). A holding that Congressional implementing legislation is required for disqualification to federal office might be the easiest way to resolve the case (but may be hard to write as a matter of text, history and intent).
Fed.R.Civ.P. 57 provides that the court may order a speedy hearing of a declaratory-judgment action. 28 U.S.C. § 2101(e) and Supreme Court Rule 11 authorize SCOTUS to grant certiorari and bypass the Court of Appeals. SCOTUS can move quickly when it chooses to. See Bush v. Gore, 531 U.S. 98 (2000).
I'm not sure what the rules of the Republican National Convention provide regarding naming a replacement in the event of a vacancy on the ticket, but there is some historical precedent. In 1972 a reconvened Democratic National Convention replaced Thomas Eagleton on the ticket when he resigned the Vice-presidential nomination.
Replacing the VP candidate is far different than replacing the top of the ticket. I boldly predict SCOTUS will not permit a federal case to be heard only after Trump is officially nominated.
Before Trump is nominated, the issue may not be ripe.
I don't think the arguments bode well for upholding the Colorado Supreme Court decision. I doubt that SCOTUS will address whether Donald Trump did or did not engage in insurrection. I suspect that concern about whether a state can disqualify a candidate for federal office may carry the day. I expect SCOTUS will address whether the President is covered by the Fourteenth Amendment, § 3, but I can't predict which way they will rule.
I'll go out on a limb and predict the Opinion of the Court will decline to address whether the President is covered, but perhaps a concurrence will side with Tillman/Blackmun.
If it is self-evident that January 6th was an insurrection, why have none of the persons charged in connection with January 6th been charged under 18 U.S.C. Section 2383?
Prosecutors have charged 332 person under 18 U.S.C. § 1512(c)(2) (Corruptly obstructing, influencing, or impeding any official proceeding.), torturing a law designed to prevent evidence destruction into a reason to imprison trespassers on a felony charge.
Why not just charge them all with insurrection? They have held many of these people in egregious conditions, bordering on 8th Amendment violations, yet they just skipped the most obvious charge. Why?
This was a (permitted) protest that turned into a riot AFTER the authorities started shooting rubber bullets into the crowd. The FBI won't answer questions as to how many agent provocateurs were in the crowd (should be none) either.
The failure of Pelosi to call up the National Guard on January 5th led directly to the outcome and NONE of the rioters had a gun and, contrary to Biden's and the media's continuing lies, NO officers were killed by the rioters.
That all said, there was NO excuse for those people going into the Capitol and all that did should have been charged and punished, but how do you have in insurrection without guns?
https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/36-months-jan-6-attack-capitol-0#:~:text=Approximately%2011%20individuals%20have%20been,restricted%20federal%20building%20or%20grounds.
Because when conservatives riot, it's a racist insurrection. When liberals riot, it's a social justice moment.
You know, when not just the conservatives but even the most liberal justices of the Court seem skeptical of your argument, then maybe, just maybe, you are on the wrong side of the law.
"In addition, requiring a criminal conviction for insurrection will make enforcement impossible in situations where getting one is difficult or impossible, or where prosecutors choose to pursue other charges instead". Huh? That's the dumbest argument. I get it, he wants Trump off the ballot (a truly undemocratic result), but saying that because it is difficult to get a conviction is a reason not to require a conviction before the very serious result of disqualification of a candidate is, frankly, absurd.
The authority for the view that the 14th Amendment is not self-executing is Section 5 thereof.
Anyone who thinks that state supreme courts are owed any kind of deference on Constitutional interpretation, Hawaii's just said that the "Spirit of Aloha" overrules the 2nd Amendment.
How does it feel to be so wrong Illya????
Certainly not an equals sign.
But both are in the originalist family. A clear example is Goresuch’s opinion in Bostock. I don’t think anyone would claim the result reflects the original intent of Congress, but I do accept Goresuch’s rigidly textual approach reached a defensible result on those grounds.
But Jackson's line of questioning focused not only on the textualist concerns but also whether section 3 was actually intended to apply to the Presidency.
Idealist? Pretty funny ideals which depend only on the conclusion.
Idealist? Only if his ideal is hating America and hating Trump.
It’s not silly. The objection is, even if the anti-disqualification side wins 8-1, that the pro-disqualification camp ridiculed the idea that there was ANY reasonable argument against disqualification. Trump is so obviously disqualified, and anyone who suggests otherwise is arguing in bad faith and/or a partisan hack. We're not talking about Plessy v Ferguson here.
It’s the arrogance of the Somin/Baude/Paulsen’s of the world that provokes the strong reaction.
Admittedly Somin does exactly the same thing about anything immigration related, so it really doesn’t surprise. It’s obnoxious.
(He’s not alone in that, Blackman does something similar, but at least does engage with opposing views before declaring inevitable victory in advance.)
No it's quite silly. The fact that he's a law professor and is arguing the ends justify the means is the problem.
Any serious person can see that the J6 mostly peaceful protest was not an insurrection, that Trump did not even participate in such protest, that Presidents aren't covered by the 14th Amendment, that the 14th Amendment only covers holding office, and that only Congress has power to enforce.
Dude is literally 0-5 and is till arguing for it. That's extremely silly. It's only because he hates Trump, nothing more.
I understand Justice Jackson's point. The Presidency was omitted from the offices subject to Section 3.
My own opinion is that they didn't take as much care with drafting the 14th amendment as you would today expect, so maybe the omission was akin to a scrivener's error. Maybe.
It was clear during argument it was not a scrivener error. The POTUS and VPOTUS were in early drafts, but removed. It was intentional. Mitchell addressed this: politicians voted for 14AS3 for their own reasons and motivations, some of which were in direct conflict.
Such carelessness might still be decisive, though I agree with ComXY that it wasn’t an accident. The omission doesn’t violate any canons of interpretation that I’m aware of. It means what it means. There is a logical argument that explains its absence, but even without one its legitimacy remains as written.
What’s problematic jurisprudence is when people use intent to allow for something unwritten, or just plain overrule the text, because of some nebulous intent. That is what anti-death penalty judges do with “cruel and unusual”, even though the amendment text also explicitly mentions capital crimes.
That's more akin to living Constitutionalism, at least in application.
That's why the legislative history is frowned upon for constitutional provisions.
Like most legislation, the 14th Amendment is a product of compromise. But at the end of the day, what we get out of that compromise is text, so you start with that. If there's no ambiguity in the text, then there's nothing else to discuss.