The Volokh Conspiracy
Mostly law professors | Sometimes contrarian | Often libertarian | Always independent
Setting Up Mastodon Server, Using an Outside Service or on Our Own?
Trying to get up to speed on Ice Age technology.
I'm still thinking about setting up a Mastodon account (in addition to, not instead of, our Twitter feed), but I'm hesitant about setting it up on an existing Mastodon server.
Some of them have Terms of Service that I'd prefer not to sign on to: I don't personally think, for instance, that any of my posts involve "racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, xenophobia, or casteism," "incitement of violence or promotion of violent ideologies," "harassment, dogpiling or doxxing of other users"; but who knows what those terms mean these days? Will someone decide that expressing skepticism about certain forms of immigration "xenophobia," or questioning whether transgender athletes should compete on women's teams "transphobia"? Will someone conclude that arguing for broadening the scope of permissible armed self-defense (or of permissible conduct during war) is a "violent ideolog[y]"? Will someone label identifying the name of someone who would prefer to remain anonymous, something that news outlets often do in the right circumstances, "doxxing"? Plus given how many people view a vast range as "structural racism," does it follow that people who defend them (and perhaps fight the premise that racially disparate impacts are "racism") are therefore themselves engaged in "racism"?
To be sure, I can probably in good faith just interpret the terms my own way; I don't think I'd be lying if I agreed to them. We auto-feed to Facebook and Twitter, after all; all of us have to reconcile ourselves to the world as it is in many ways. But I'd prefer not to, if possible, and I would think that in principle it would be possible here. (That's especially so since the blog has some funds to pay a reasonable amount for the hosting or similar services.) [UPDATE: I should add that, if a site simply says "Here's what we could expel you for," rather than asking me to agree not to post such things, I'm more open to that, especially since (as I understand it) switching Mastodon servers isn't that difficult, though still annoying. I'm more concerned about having to make promises about such things.]
I thought that maybe some university systems would have Mastodon servers that are less interested in content restrictions (cf. this story as to Zoom), but a quick search for university mastodon chiefly revealed the Purdue Fort Wayne Mastodons. And in any event, I'm not inclined to count on many universities these days, either.
Plus while of course anyone who doesn't like our posts should certainly feel free to unsubscribe from them or block them or what have you, my understanding is that one form of content policing on Mastodon is server operators blocking whole servers. This makes me reluctant to join others on a server, both because then maybe our posts won't go through to some users because of some other account's posts, or because maybe others' posts won't go through because people are upset with us. (Please correct me if I'm misunderstanding this.)
I was therefore wondering if I should sign up—again, I'm willing to pay a reasonable amount—with some service that can provide me with my own Mastodon server, where we can operate all by ourselves; then others can block us or not as they prefer, based solely on what they think about our posts. (Of course, that has to be a service that likewise doesn't impose broad and vague content restrictions on me.) Or perhaps I should try to run my own server on my home computer (which runs Windows), if that's not too hard.
Any suggestions? I realize that sometimes one has to rely on the tolerance of business partners, and I'll do that when needed, especially when I trust those partners. (I've had nothing but the best of experience with Reason, for instance.) But in this day and age, I'd like to minimize such reliance, to the extent possible—especially on entities that are particularly likely to react to pressure if someone wants to pressure them to pressure us. I'd love to hear what others who know more about Mastodon can tell me about this.
UPDATE: Apropos hosting services, commenter Kenneth Almquist mentioned Masto.host (though it's all full for now) and Federation.spacebear.ee. Masto.host's policies, though, illustrate my concern: They appear to require one to agree to Terms of Use that exclude, among other things, "Racism," "Alt right, including under the disguise of freedom of speech," "Gender-critical," "Sex and gender discrimination," and "Transphobia," whatever exactly those would mean. I'm pretty sure I can't honestly promise that all our posts will comply with those terms, especially as to "gender-critical"—I'm not sure what the right answers are on transgender issues, but I'm very likely to at some point have some posts (whether guest-posts or others) that may take a "gender-critical" perspective. Indeed, I suppose Prof. Doriane Coleman's posts criticizing (in some measure) transgender athletes' participation on women's sports teams may well be viewed as "gender-critical" and "transphobic" by some.
On the other hand, I was pleased to see that the "Terms of Use" link at federation.spacebear.ee yields an Error 404 (this page could not be found). Might be just what I need.
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Balkanization of the Internet. Parler on one side and Mastodon on the other. We also have infrastructure providers refusing to serve those on the side they don't like. What's next; ISPs? power companies? server vendors? chip foundries?
Camping World's CEO announced, Trump supporters not welcome as customers. After learning that meant 85% of their customer base, they relented.
How about Chick-Fil-A refusing to serve non-Christians?
Will we eventually Balkanize all of commerce? Where does it end?
It is often said that people are not entitled to their own facts. But if we access facts only through silo sources, it is the same result.
Is there anyone other than me concerned with these trends?
I'm not. I'm sick of Democrats and do not want to share anything at all with them. They're tyrants.
"How about Chick-Fil-A refusing to serve non-Christians?"
That would be un-Christian and I doubt they would do it. Jesus was quite explicit about that.
Now if they are ANTI-Christian and intentionally obnoxious, that's another story....
Remember that the gay wedding cake issue wasn't that they wouldn't bake them a cake -- they would be happy to do so. It was putting the gay decorations on it that they objected to.
There's not much evidence of a connection between what Jesus preached and what right-wing Christians do.
You don't know many Christians then, right-wing or not.
Agreed.
People who claim Christians are to any degree better people -- in conduct or belief -- than other people are especially unpersuasive, superstition-addled people.
If Christians wished to persuade others to embrace Christianity, the natural, obvious, and easy way to do it would involve example -- being better people. But they are not and never have been, which is one of the strongest indications that their beliefs are no better -- let alone valid to the point of validating supernatural tales -- than any others.
Well, apparently they do a lot of gatekeeping on the Internet.
Well I don't remember any sermons denouncing Leviticus.
There is virtually a 100% correlation between Dr. Ed saying "Remember that" and the subsequent statement being false.
David Nieporent: Indeed, from Masterpiece Cakeshop:
I recall an account at the time that they'd actually checked out multiple bakeries, and only settled on Masterpiece AFTER being told he wouldn't do it. IOW, they were shopping for a lawsuit, not a cake.
Certainly, Phillips has since had to endure a regular flood of gay and trans people coming to demand service from him specifically in order to be refused and file suit.
You and Dr. Ed should continue to stick together, Mr. Bellmore. You deserve each other.
No, you don't.
Chik-fil-a refuses to serve non-christians of Sundays.
I myself, an atheist, observed this when I tried the drive thru on a Sunday, and they hid and pretended they were closed
Chik-fil-A is entitled to open, or to decline to open, whenever it wishes.
It shouldn't be eligible for scarce concession locations in airports or on college campuses, though. Expecting others to suffer for your superstition seems substandard.
I share your concerns. As often as I might agree with others who responded to you with apathy, I think the trend is unhealthy, divisive and ultimately self-defeating.
But the positive thing is the ultimate realization that it is self-defeating. I had not heard the story about Camping World but that realization that they would lose 85% of their business forced them to reject that stupid idea. It ought to also lead to the BoDs firing their CEO who is so far out of touch with their customer base but that is their decision.
As a person who leans toward anarchism and most definitely its off-shoot of voluntaryism, I find these battles to be based in political power. Eliminate the power and these squabbles are pretty much eliminated. E.g: how do you exclude people who support a politician if no politicians exist?
I think that ship has already sailed.
Tuttle, your realistic choices are on the one hand internet giantism plus network effects, delivering perpetual struggles for control and government censorship; and on the other hand diversity and profusion among myriad private publishers who compete for every commercially viable opinion niche, delivering a maximum of expressive freedom, but to smaller audiences.
Note that neither choice includes the utopian ideal sought by nearly every internet commenter today—which is to supply everyone with world-wide, cost-free publishing to gigantic audiences, without any editing ever. That is utopian because no means to deliver it could be contrived which would not fatally undermine the practical processes necessary to supply it. As Elon Musk has just discovered, there is no publishing without publishing activities, which are both indispensable and surprisingly expensive.
Blah blah blah. Publishing activities, blah blah, sovereign people, blah blah, utopian blah.
Don't care, I can't afford a camper.
Don't care, I eat beef. (if I have to at fast food)
Don't care, I don't do (anti)social media.
As well as being a network, Mastodon is also sofware. Lots of services run the mastodon software or customised versions of the mastodon software. In many cases, if you bring up your own server, you can connect to both the main mastodon network (aka fediverse) and to several of these seemingly-isolated services, like Gab and Spinster. TruthSocial and Parler use Mastodon-based software with the federation features turned off, so you can't see them without logging on directly, but that's not true of many others, including Gab (an alt-right network) and Spinster (an anti-trans feminist network).
Different bits of the Mastodon/fediverse network are more or less closely connected together. The ability of the server admin to set their own moderation policies means that people who never want to see a political opinion they disagree with can go to places that will deliver that, while those who want a thunderdome can go to places that will offer that.
I think that servers are ultimately going to compete for users on the basis of their moderation policies, their reliability and performance, and on their price. Seems like a pretty good free market to me; much better than Twitter and Facebook, where I can't follow someone on Twitter from Facebook or vice versa and I have to have an account on both.
Gadsden — Everything in your comment is about stuff you can see across your keyboard. It is as if the publishing part of the enterprise did not exist, or was some miraculous fully-formed utility presented to you for free by a benevolent god. Your inability to even imagine the existence of the publishing activity which underlies and enables internet commentary is part and parcel of what makes your aspirations utopian. By that I mean so mutually-contradictory that any means imaginable to deliver them would disable the practical basis to make it happen.
This is word soup.
If you really don't like the Section 230 crap, just support my petition to the US Supreme Court for a writ of certiorari.
"9th Amendment Challenge to Social Medium Abuse"
https://www.gofundme.com/f/9th-amendment-challenge-to-social-medium-abuse
[You don't need to read my statement, just click on 'petition to SCOTUS'.]
I argue as we did back in the pre-breakup AT&T legal department, whose lawyers understood both common carriage and also the technology.
I have vetted my argument with Constitutional scholars, and there is a substantial probability that four Justices would support a grant of cert.
I could argue my case before SCOTUS. I used to prep a lawyer at AT&T, but I would prefer my usual role of prepping a lawyer for oral arguments if a lawyer wishes to volunteer, who is admitted to practice before SCOTUS.
"Where does it end?"
It ends when Democrats stop doing it.
" Will someone conclude that arguing for broadening the scope of permissible armed self-defense ... is a "violent ideolog[y]"?
Don't laugh -- I got into a bleepload of trouble at UMass Amherst for merely restating the Commonwealth's (unarmed) self defense laws.
It's generally not worth the time to be your own server administrator if you're not a server administrator as your professional job.
You also are more likely to make stupid mistakes if you aren't doing it all the time.
It's the same thing as to why it is a good thing to outright ban abortion outright in areas where they only do a few a month -- they are far more likely to screw it up and it is worth the travel time to avoid the morbidity and mortality.
BCD lets the borderline-violent psychopath mask slip just enough to reveal he’s in IT somewhere. Quelle surprise.
Or he has talked to server admins before. It's not a secret that it can be frustrating.
More likely this -- as server admins can't believe that mere mortals can actually find what they are doing to be difficult.
Not many people with my credentials working in IT.
HTH
Darn global warming, unfreezing the mastodons.
I've got a nice HP3000 you could use.
Gosh, I dunno, Eugene, you’re so eager to be the victim, why don’t you just go for it and see what happens?
I try to take agreements seriously; I'm reluctant to just promise something when it's not clear what that promise means. But, yes, if there's no good plan A, I'll set aside my compunctions and go ahead; as the post noted, that's what I do with Twitter and Facebook. I'd just prefer not to have to do that.
"I’m reluctant to just promise something when it’s not clear what that promise means. "
You mean like the rest of us when we check "I agree"?
Someone who uses a vile racial slur more than once a month might reasonably wonder whether legitimate, decent, mainstream companies would wish to associate with that content in modern America.
Some companies, though, would covet such a relationship.
I would make a decision later after everything shakes out. Right now it’s mostly just upset Twitter, so if Twitter ends up okay I anticipate most people only using Twitter.
Twitter is already built.
It might get boring to not keep changing it, but how many people would be needed to maintain the hardware/software "as is"?
If they've done a scintilla of standardization, it's just going to be a case of "remove and replace" -- swapping out hardware, replacing corrupted software with mirrored images.
Like the NYC Subway System, they are going to run into problems when the hardware is no longer manufactured. And like gasoline stations (seriously), they will have problems when their operating system is no longer supported (memory is that Microsquish had to continue WinXP(?) because so many gas pumps were using it).
But for the next two-three years, he probably could lose 90% of his staff and still survive.
XP was a little different, because it ended up in XP Embedded, which wasn't upgradable in most cases without a hardware swap.
I appreciate that, but I'm always looking for more ways of reaching people, even if it's only a relatively small group. If there's a simple solution, and I can set things up to autofeed our posts from our RSS feed (as we do for Twitter and Facebook, and as appears possible for Mastodon), I'm happy to get whatever extra eyeballs that gives me.
Always?
Truth Social?
I've got a nice HP3000 you could use.
At the moment, I don't think the cost is worth it. The userbase of Mastodon (readers vs. content creators) seems to still be checking twitter as well.
My personal plan as a user is to wait and see if twitter fails and see what people end up adopting; I don't think that's actually clear yet even though Mastodon is the front runner.
So I'd think about it (a you are here); maybe lay some groundwork so that if the bird goes silent you have an easy transition, but I don't see the extended reach that would make it useful to pull any triggers yet.
Just happened to see that while checking out Mastodon after reading this post. It doesn't look too hard to set up a server -- perhaps a few days for someone reasonably familiar with, e.g., Ubuntu (Linux). VPS (Virtual Private Server) instances are available in the cloud. Without knowing the usage scale of the "Volokh Server" it's hard to estimate the cost.
I have 30+ years experience in IT hardware and networking infrastructure. From a purely content agnostic standpoint, I'm deeply suspicious of any servers or hardware I don't have direct physical access and control over. For my own business my Windows, Exchange, and Web servers are right in my office. When something goes sideways all I need to do is pivot my chair to the other half of the desk.
Plus while of course anyone who doesn't like our posts should certainly feel free to unsubscribe from them or block them or what have you,
Despite what you may suppose, many folks who want some content blocked are not out to protect their feelings—which is what your suggestion implies. They may instead be concerned about attempts to threaten them with stochastic terrorism, or attempts to undermine public health with politically motivated lies, or on the lookout as members of targeted minorities for attempts to keep them off elite college campuses. In short, they may be people with an eye to the common good, who would be happy to submit such opinion judgments to the various outcomes diverse private editors might decide, but who do not think, "anything goes, and no editing ever," is a workable plan for the public life of the nation.
I get that 1A fundamentalism is apparently willing to accept such consequences as collateral damage. But your preference for no editing prior to publication is utopian. Mass publishing cannot work that way. It is surprising to find a 1A expert who is himself a publisher who has not yet figured that out. My guess is that if you were running this blog as a business, instead of as an exercise in ideological advocacy, you would already be of a different mind.
I guess the question I have, and I'm not trying to be snarky, is why did this suddenly become such a problem? The Internet operated for years or at least two and a half decades with little to no oversight or control and there wasn't a rash of violence, and believe me all that time it was just jam packed with nuts and loons. If anything in the early days the whackjob ratio was probably far higher.
It was not as sudden as you suppose. And I very much doubt the whackjob ratio has ever been higher than now. Techie loons we have always had with us. Ordinary loons in large, organizable numbers, are a more recent phenomenon. Admit it, when you first heard about Comet Ping-Pong, six years ago, you were pretty surprised, right?
For what it is worth, I began worrying that things would head in this direction more than 10 years ago. If memory serves, I have been trying to get VC attention directed to the public policy issues—especially the threat of government censorship inherent in internet giantism, but also the utopian character of no-editing publishing—for at least 7 years.
As I am sure you can see, my commentary has not yet attracted much of a following. It's pleasant to hear from someone who eschews snark. Internet utopians see to it that I get more than my share.
“Admit it, when you first heard about Comet Ping-Pong, six years ago, you were pretty surprised, right?”
Probably no more than say, Heaven’s Gate back in the 90’s or the planet Niburu loons, or the Mayan Calendar end of the world nuts. I remember well the Microsoft and the Bavarian Illuminati crowd back in the day along with the Rosicrucian Conspiracy crazies. There were numerous others.
My point is crazy has always been with us, and always will be and I can’t see that justifying what amounts to a giant global government and corporate alliance designed to protect us from a small amount of nuts and if something you read online pushes you over the edge you were probably eventually headed there anyways. Brilliance is no guarantee of immunity, after all look at Ted Kaczynski.
I just am deeply troubled and frankly very offended more by the belief that someone thinks they have to right to determine what is safe and what is not for me to see than I am the actual online nuts. It’s a creepy level of paternalism.
As for your comments re: Internet Utopianism, I think Starlink signals the very beginning of the end of the days of curated internet use, as it utterly bypasses any government attempt to restrict what people see and read. I suspect it is just the beginning.
Now having that kind of power in the hands of one man is very disturbing, and is worthy of debate.
Starlink, from Elon Musk? Musk is right now this week proving himself the all-time, retire-the-trophy king of the internet utopians. The guy bought Twitter with his eye solely on the view across his tweeting device. It never even dawned on him that there was publishing activity going on behind the scenes to keep it all going. Maybe he can find some way to recover from that blunder. But it will take a hell of a lot more than mere recovery to turn him into the kind of practical genius who could invent and operate anything which would fulfill your vision.
Doctress Neutopia was running wild at UMass back in the early 1990s. See: https://scholarworks.umass.edu/dissertations_1/5144/
It's just that there weren't the searchable archives back then that exist now --- all I could find was her dissertation. Now there are automated daemons that are watching...
The bogeyman is out there in the dark, waiting for you.
Find out what the terms of service are for allowing content to be shared between Mastodon servers. If your own server has to promise to be politically sound to be connected to other servers, you are not much better off. A little, because you get disconnected from one server at a time instead of having your account yanked.
Assuming it is relatively easy to switch servers later ....
Start out with whatever existing server seems easiest to deal with right now, ToS, costs, ease of access and control, whatever.
Then take several months to monitor admin forums and get a better idea of what you need to do. Be ready to do that if your first server choice turns out to be a mistake, or if you decide it's easy enough to run your own.
You're a Lawyer, don't sign a contract you have problems with. Jeez, I-ANAL but get that.
Frank, Google "adhesion contracts." (Seriously; no snark.)
I haven't run a Mastodon server, but I've read about them. The easiest way to proceed is to have a company like masto.host set up a server for you. (They create a virtual machine and install the Mastodon server software on it for you.)
The problem with doing anything with Mastodon right now is that a lot of people are jumping onto Mastodon all at once. Masto.host is currently not accepting new customers because they don't have the capacity to handle more customers. Federation.spacebear.ee, which is based in Estonia, may be the best choice right now. They charge $16.55/month for a basic instance.
Well, I was pleased to see that the "Terms of Use" link at federation.spacebear.ee yields an Error 404 (this page could not be found). Might be just what I need.
Masto.host, even setting aside the capacity limits, has Terms of Use that exclude, among other things, "Racism," "Alt right, including under the disguise of freedom of speech," "Gender-critical," "Sex and gender discrimination," and "Transphobia," whatever exactly those would mean. I'm pretty sure I can't promise that I will comply with those terms, especially as to "gender-critical" -- I'm not sure what the right answers are on transgender issues, but I'm very likely to at some point have some posts (whether guest-posts or others) that may take a "gender-critical" perspective.
I gather from Gab moving on to Mastodon that even running your own server doesn't entirely insulate you from the "Fediverse"'s consensus moderation policies.
That's really a misunderstanding: each instance does its own moderation, but if one instance doesn't like how another instance moderates, it can defederate from that instance.
Sure, some instances (e.g. gab) are defederated by a lot of the left-wing instances that call themselves mainstream (mastodon.social and the like), but no-one will defederate you for not defederating the bad instances, so if you run your own instance, you can follow people from both sides of that argument (though they can't see each other).
Of course, as soon as you start posting your own content, you run the risk of getting defederated. But all that means is the same as getting blocked - just by a whole bunch of people, rather than a single one.
Hey, maybe that's why I said "entirely".
As I recall, it went a bit beyond individual servers blocking you. A real push was made to try to get them systematically blocked by pushing out an update to the code with a mandatory ban list.
In fact, Gab had to fork the code to protect themselves from that avenue of attack.
And, remember, the reason they went to Mastodon in the first place was that their previous IT vendors, (And not just IT!) had cut them off at the knees in a coordinated attack.
I'm just pointing out that the censors we're talking about here are VERY aggressive in going after anyone who won't comply with their demands. VERY aggressive.
"I’m just pointing out that the censors we’re talking about here are VERY aggressive in going after anyone who won’t comply with their demands. VERY aggressive."
That’s what The Good Guys do.
I’m a big fan of the preconfigured and built hardware running Windows Storage Server. If all you are doing is running a web server and some sort of database and front end, some of the configurations are ideal. You don’t have to worry about the sheer Byzantine task of sorting out licensing, the storage pool is preconfigured usually in some sort of redundant array, and despite some of the functional limitations imposed on the version, are capable of authenticating a small office network/domain.
The place to cruise for Mastodon servers is https://joinmastodon.org/servers
I think that running your own server is probably the right answer, though I’d suggest that paying someone to run it for you is likely more sensible in the long term. You can probably just get a VPS (virtual private server) for $15-$50 a month (depending on how much you will use mastodon) and set it up yourself if you are moderately technically competent: if you could run a blog yourself in 2002, you’re certainly technically competent enough to run a mastodon server.
You’ll get blocked (“defederated”) by some instances, especially the ones where you looked at the moderation policies and said some variant of “these people don’t want me, do they?” And you’ll need to run a defederation list of your own (even if you don’t want to block anything else, there are some instances that consist solely of spammers and/or scammers).
At some point, you’ll probably want to hire someone to manage the server for you and keep it secure, but I’d give it six to twelve months for things to calm down and the sort of small businesses that will currently maintain wordpress for you to get up to speed with mastodon, and some current mastodon admins to set up side-businesses maintaining other people’s private instances. You can also give that time to making sure that mastodon is something you want to do permanently, rather than just a flash in the pan – 20-50 bucks a month for a year for something that ends up going nowhere, you can easily pull the plug; sign a three-year maintenance-and-hosting contract and you don’t want to be walking away next Summer if Elon manages to turn Twitter around or someone takes over and everyone goes back.
Well, Digital Ocean would be my go to for hosting, but have you tried convincing Reason to set up their own service? I mean, if you like them for hosting blog, and it’s a known hood relationship, and they have the technical resources to mind the service, seems like that would be ideal. Probably not too hard to make a good case for it, too.
Not a bad idea.
I am not a Mastodon expert but I have worked in IT and tech for quite a while. I largely agree with Gadsden’s comments but would add a couple things to think about:
1) A VolokhConspiracy specific server seems like a good idea.
2) Do you want to allow anyone to sign up for the server or just the people who write for VC and expect people to follow you from account to on other Mastodon servers? If you are only hosting accounts for a handful of people then a very small server, potentially your home machine, is probably all you need.
3) How important is independence from other organizations to you? Assuming your relationship with the Reason organization is good and assuming they already have some IT org/experience then working with them to set up a VolokhConspiracy Mastodon instance. Leverage their expertise and infrastructure but you own the name and if you ever part ways with Reason it would be simple to take your Mastodon data and server name to another service.
For what it’s worth.
There's no way to escape constraining terms of service ... if it's not the server, it will be your ISP, your payment provider, your storage engine, ... they have "six ways from Sunday of getting back at you".
Just ask Parlor.
How far down the stack do you have to go before you hit a common carrier?
I.e. our internet is DSL, supplied by the local telco over gen-u-ine copper. IIUC they can't cut off my landline voice because they don't like what I am saying over the twisted pair. Can they cut off the DSL if they don't like what I'm saying over the data link?