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Sherif Girgis on the Draft Dobbs Opinion and Its Critics
An assessment of claims that Justice Alito's draft opinion rests on historical error, provides no meaningful basis for distinguishing abortion from other unenumerated rights, and forecloses constitutional protection of the mother's life.
The unprecedented leak of a draft majority opinion in Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization has prompted substantial commentary, both on the leak and the substance of the opinion. Author David Garrow praised the opinion in the Wall Street Journal (prompting letters from Professor Steven Calabresi and Jennifer Mascott). Others have been far less complimentary.
Notre Dame Law School Professor Sherif Girgis has written extensively on Dobbs, and whether the Court can uphold the Mississippi statute in a principled way without overturning Roe v. Wade. He has also been active on Twitter responding to various criticism of the opinion. As I found Professor Girgis's points thoughtful and interesting, I asked him to summarize them for a post. His response is reproduced below.
Sherif Girgis: Crowd-critiquing Justice Alito's Draft: Historical Claims, Other Rights, Life Exceptions
The leak of a draft opinion for the Court in Dobbs has enabled something remarkable: the crowdsourced critique of a Supreme Court opinion before its release. And it's done so in a case where the incentives and opportunities to expose the draft's flaws could not be greater—given the topic, the massive significance of the outcome for both sides, the possibility of forcing changes (or informing dissents), and the sheer number of the draft's historical claims and legal arguments. Under these unprecedented circumstances, a feast for any law professor on social media, how has the draft fared? I've discussed a few emerging criticisms with friends on all sides. Here, at Prof. Adler's kind invitation, I'd like to elaborate, focusing on the objections that the opinion:
- rests on a historical error,
- offers only ad hoc ways to distinguish abortion from other unenumerated rights, and
- forecloses even a narrow constitutional right to life-saving abortions.
- Historical error?
Following Glucksberg on the Due Process Clause (and early cases on the Privileges or Immunities Clause), the opinion holds that generally speaking, an unenumerated right must be deeply rooted in history. And it holds that abortion is not. Here Justice Alito makes three vast claims that would be independently decisive if true:
(a) From the early common law until just before Roe, no law, no state case, no federal case, no legal treatise, and no academic work suggested a right to abort.
(b) By the 14th Amendment's ratification, three-fourths of the states had statutorily expanded criminal penalties to cover abortion at all stages. In fact, in several cases it was the same legislature that expanded those penalties and ratified the Amendment.
(c) Even before ratification, there could have been no common law right to abortion since according to leading treatises and cases, "[a]t common law, abortion was criminal in at least some stages of pregnancy and was regarded as unlawful and could have very serious consequences at all stages."
Though (a) tries to prove a negative, and an astonishingly broad one, I've seen just one response to it (though I will myself introduce and address a possible wrinkle at bullet 3 below). Professor Aaron Tang has argued against (a) on the ground that state cases recognized a right to early abortion. Professor Tang also argues, against (b), that 12 of the ratification-era statutes thought to ban abortion at all stages actually didn't. But he has failed to overcome detailed rebuttals by Professors John Finnis and Robert George as to the common law cases at issue or as to any of the 12 states' statutes. Nor have I seen others contest the accuracy of (b), Alito's statutory history, which is fairly conventional and largely conceded by Roe. Instead, people have questioned its relevance, on the ground that women had too little political power in the 19th century for the historic lack of abortion access to tell us very much. But no one has presented evidence that women at the time favored abortion access at higher rates than men (today the gender gap in opinions on abortion is small to nonexistent). So I think this concern is best read as an objection to Glucksberg's "deeply rooted" test itself and as a counsel to pivot to equal protection analysis, which I've discussed separately (here).
The most common charge of inaccuracy concerns only (c)'s reading of the common law. Critics point out that at common law, abortion was criminalized only post-quickening. Thus, they conclude, pre-quickening abortions were lawful at common law.
As previewed in the sentence I quoted at (c), Alito affirms that the common law drew "a distinction between pre- and post-quickening abortions" and that it didn't generally treat pre-quickening abortions as crimes. Yet something can be non-criminal and still unlawful. For instance, it might be subject to civil penalties. Alito's point was that pre-quickening abortions were "regarded as unlawful"—that was Hale's word, in a passage embraced by Blackstone—in another and more serious sense. They were treated the same as felonies under a sort of early felony-murder doctrine. Under that doctrine, while murder normally requires injurious or lethal intent or knowledge (actual malice), you can be guilty of murder for accidentally causing someone's death if you do so in the course of committing a felony (e.g., robbery). The law finds "implied" malice in your accidental killing (which turns it into murder) "because of the previous felonious intent, which the law transfers from" the felony to the killing, as Blackstone explained.
All Alito said, citing Blackstone and Hale, is that at common law, the same was true if you were performing even a pre-quickening abortion. If a non-fetal death occurred—that of the mother, or of the child if briefly born alive—you could be guilty of murder. That's because the act you were performing—a pre-quickening abortion—was not legally innocent to begin with. It was done "unlawfully," as Hale wrote. It was "without lawful purpose, dangerous to life," and thus supportive of an "imputation of malice" for murder, as the Massachusetts high court put it in 1845. Otherwise—if the early abortion were lawful—there would have been no malice for the law to "transfer" to the accidental killing, and you could not have been liable for murder.
Alito cites sources identifying other ways that even early abortions were legally burdened: Contracts to perform them were void for illegality. A house where they were performed could be summarily closed as a "disorderly house." Advertising them was illegal. These, too, support the point of Dobbs's history: there was no common law abortion right, even pre-quickening. In fact, that conclusion would stand even if the history rehearsed in this section were mistaken on key points. The question under Glucksberg is not whether early abortions were legally permitted but whether they were seen as a right; their lawfulness wouldn't be enough.
- Distinguishing other rights
Some object to Dobbs's premise that an unenumerated right must be deeply rooted. The "deeply rooted" test rests on longstanding precedents, though Obergefell recently downplayed it. Many warn that reinvigorating the test imperils the rights to contracept (Griswold and Eisenstadt), enter interracial marriages (Loving), pursue same-sex relationships (Lawrence), and have them recognized as marriages (Obergefell). Professor Akhil Amar has argued that these other rights are safe under Dobbs's historical test or an independent constitutional ground, like equal protection. Indeed, Amar has harsh words for contrary arguments (some not repeatable on a family-friendly law-nerd blog). If Amar is right, the concern that Dobbs would undercut other rights can be dispatched on its own terms. Other scholars have argued that the precedents recognizing other rights would fare better than Roe under stare decisis principles.
The draft offers another basis to distinguish Casey and Roe: that only abortion involves the taking of fetal life. Professor Adam Winkler contends that this distinction makes no legal difference. And specifically, that it doesn't go to what Dobbs itself makes crucial: rootedness in history. If contraception did lack deep historical roots, wouldn't that be fatal under the draft's reasoning? Why would it matter that it doesn't take a life?
Professor Winkler's objection misreads the role that abortion's impact on life plays in the analysis. Before mentioning Griswold and other precedents, the opinion spends pages arguing that an abortion right as such is not deeply rooted in history. When the opinion turns to Griswold, it's addressing a different argument—not that abortion access as such has deep roots, but that it's part of a broader right that is historically rooted:
Instead of seriously pressing the argument that the abortion right itself has deep roots, supporters of Roe and Casey contend that the abortion right is an integral part of a broader entrenched right. Roe termed this a right to privacy, and Casey described it as the freedom to make "intimate and personal choices" that are "central to personal dignity and autonomy."
Thus, the arguendo assumption of this part of Alito's analysis is that some rights that aren't deeply rooted in themselves are protected anyway, because they're aspects of a deeply rooted right to privacy or autonomy. It's here that Alito says that abortion is not part of any broader, historically rooted right to privacy or autonomy, because it ends fetal life.
Back to the question: Why should abortion's fetal impact set it apart from privacy or autonomy rights? We need a theory of what unites those other rights. There are lots of possibilities, of course, but what might the Court have in mind?
Maybe this: What animates privacy and autonomy cases is a liberal political-moral principle that you find in one form or another from Mill's On Liberty to the philosophers' brief in Glucksberg itself: There's a sphere of sacrosanct life choices over which the individual is sovereign and can't be interfered with—but this sphere ends where harm to others begins. (As Justice Ginsburg once quoted someone saying, "'[y]our right to swing your arms ends just where the other man's nose begins.'"). And just so, nearly all the rights cited in Casey and Roe (and distinguished in Dobbs) directly affect either (1) no one else (e.g., rights to refuse medical procedures), or (2) only consenting adults (rights to intimate partnerships or interracial or same-sex marriages).
By contrast, abortion does inherently harm a non-consenting party—or more precisely, it's constitutionally permissible (because it's at least rational) for states to think so. (Here "rational" means what "rational" and "legitimate" mean in rational-basis review: not crazy, and free of independent constitutional defects like animus.) Indeed, if states couldn't regard fetal death as a serious harm, it would be hard to see how some 40 states could treat non-abortion feticide as a crime, most often homicide. And the draft's point is that this arguable third-party harm takes abortion out of the sphere (privacy/autonomy) over which the individual is sovereign. So abortion bans shouldn't trigger the heightened scrutiny that a ban on purely private conduct would. They trigger only rational basis review.
From this angle, Griswold is different because preventing conception does no direct harm to a third party, or a third being of any kind. It only prevents the partners' gametes from joining.
Only one unenumerated right (abortion aside) has any direct effect on third parties who aren't consenting adults: the right to direct one's children's education. But unlike with abortion, states couldn't rationally think of this right as inherently harmful. (By "inherently" harmful I mean that an alleged harm flows from any exercise of the right, not just the bad exercises. If one exercise of the right to abort is harmful to another being (or permissibly believed to be so), then all exercises are, and for the same reason. Not so with the right to educate one's children.)
Something like this idea—that abortion falls beyond the reach of the liberal principles driving privacy (and autonomy) cases—animates Judge Henry Friendly's draft opinion in a pre-Roe abortion case and Amar's comments in a recent podcast. Even Justice Blackmun in Roe conceded that abortion's fetal impact makes it "inherently different" from these other rights.
Crucially, abortion's third-party impact can be weighty enough to set it apart from other privacy or autonomy rights even if the harmed "party," the fetus, isn't a "person" for purposes of the Fourteenth Amendment. In fact, Roe and Casey themselves taught that saving X's life can be a compelling interest even if X isn't a person; they said just that of viable fetuses. Under Roe and Casey, post-viability abortion bans were permitted (though they burden a right) because they serve a compelling interest—but not required, because the late-term fetus isn't a constitutional person. (See pp. 340-341 & n.46 here.) Here, by analogy, whether or not the fetus is a constitutional person, abortion's lethal impact can be morally significant enough to remove it from the realm over which each individual is sovereign under our autonomy and privacy cases.
- Life exceptions
Finding that general bans on deliberate feticide have a long history and don't violate equal protection, Dobbs applies rational-basis review to abortion laws. Some say this forecloses even a narrow constitutional right to abortions needed to prevent the mother's death, or death or serious bodily injury. (For ease I'll refer to the "life exception," though the history I will describe offers some support for an exception when there's a threat of grave bodily injury or death, and I think the two are practically inseparable insofar as an emergency threatening serious bodily injury will also increase the risk of death.) Others say that any basis for such an exception could well support a broader one, thus undermining Dobbs's general rejection of a constitutional right to abortion.
I disagree on both points. But I do think Dobbs's analysis would spell the demise of Doe v. Bolton (1973), where the Court articulated an extremely capacious health exception.
As an initial matter, I should note the life-exception issue isn't raised (or, thus, settled) in Dobbs. The law under review contains a "medical emergency" exception, and neither the clinics nor the United States has alleged that this exception is unlawfully narrow. That may be why the question presented focuses on "elective" abortions. So the life-exception question isn't at issue.
It will almost certainly never arise in the future either. I know of no state or locality—at any point in U.S. history—that has forbidden a pregnant woman to obtain treatment (however labeled) that is needed to save her life even when it results in fetal death. Nor have I seen lawmakers arguing that procedures intended to save the mother's life should—or even may morally—be banned. And as I discuss below, abortion opponents may well have longstanding principled (not just political or pragmatic) reasons for so uniformly embracing a life exception.
So, thankfully, this objection has no practical significance. At most, I gather, it's meant to raise theoretical concerns: Would the Dobbs opinion's analysis imply that there is no constitutionally guaranteed life exception? And if so, does that prove the opinion's analysis unsound, and thus incapable of supporting its conclusion about elective-abortion bans?
Start with the latter—whether it would be fatal for an argument if it foreclosed a constitutional right to a procedure necessary to preserve the mother's life but inevitably fatal to the fetus. There is a clear moral right to this exception to abortion laws: any just system must protect this right somehow. But on anyone's view, there are some moral rights that our Constitution doesn't secure, for better or worse. Does it secure this one? Consider three adjacent issues: First, do you have a constitutional right to cause another's death—an attacker's death—in defense of your own life (i.e., a right to plead self-defense to homicide)? A recent Supreme Court case makes the answer non-obvious and contingent on matters of historical fact (rather than on the strong moral imperative to recognize such a right). In that case, the Court, per Justice Kagan, found no constitutional right to another defense—a certain sort of insanity defense—due to a history of inconsistent protection. Second, as to another issue adjacent to whether states must allow abortions to stop lethal threats, the Court has rejected a constitutional claim to states' protection from private violence. Third, while the Court has recognized rights to refuse medical treatment, it hasn't affirmed a right to obtain medical treatment, even to save one's life, free of state interference. (One might have invoked this right against, say, a ban on imports from a country that manufactured a drug one needed to survive.) These issues can be variously distinguished. But putting them together, it's possible to imagine courts finding no general right to take lethal action (abortion or otherwise) against privately caused or naturally emergent harm.
That said, pregnancy is a unique context, and the Dobbs opinion leaves open several possible paths to such a right in the case of abortion.
A. Rational basis? Then-Justice Rehnquist in Roe said bans on life-saving abortion might fail rational-basis review. Perhaps he was thinking that such bans wouldn't do anything. They wouldn't save the fetus, who would presumably die along with the mother. That's true pre-viability. And it is not clear that post-viability, at least today, saving the mother ever requires killing the viable fetus (as opposed to removing the fetus, albeit at some risk to that fetus). If not, Dobbs's application of rational-basis review to abortion laws would not foreclose any procedures needed to save the mother.
More robustly, if the rational-basis test is tantamount to asking if a rational government could adopt the policy under review, then it may be decisive that for centuries of American history no government has ever banned life-saving abortions (despite long histories of banning abortions of every other kind). That may establish that such a ban would have no rational basis. It's really just the flipside of the reason to think the issue won't arise in real life.
B. Deeply rooted? A right to a life exception to abortion laws may also be deeply rooted in history, and thus protected under Dobbs's own substantive due process analysis. All state bans at the time of the Fourteenth Amendment's ratification—and since—made exceptions for abortions to prevent maternal death, or death or serious bodily injury. A few seem to have done so only by limiting bans to abortions done "without lawful justification" or the like, leaving the details to background criminal law principles. But most were explicit. And none was taken to ban abortion without a life exception. Indeed, the evidence for this history lies in Dobbs itself—in the appendix that reproduces dozens of statutory bans as of 1868. And as to the common law, the medico-legal writers cited here who argued that common law made abortion indictable at every stage—or who advocated statutory criminalization at every stage—also held that the common law had always included a life exception for every stage. If these statutory and common law exceptions suffice to establish a deeply rooted right—if we don't also need, say, treatises or court cases or other sources explaining that life exceptions were not an act of grace on the states' part, but required as a right—then Dobbs's (and Glucksberg's) own "deeply rooted in history" test would support an unenumerated right to a life exception.
C. Consistency with Dobbs's distinguishing of other unenumerated rights? Would these defenses of a guaranteed life exception contradict Dobbs's proposal to distinguish abortion from other unwritten rights based on third-party harms? (After all, don't maternal-life-saving abortions cause the same alleged third-party harm as other abortions?) No, there's no contradiction, if I'm right (at bullet 2 above) that Dobbs allows two paths to substantive-due-process protection. Abortion's third-party harm would block just one: it would prevent life-saving abortions from counting as "integral" to a "broader" deeply rooted right to privacy or autonomy. But a right to life-saving abortions could still be protected as itself deeply rooted. And everyone grants that there are unenumerated rights that don't sound in privacy or autonomy; Dobbs itself lists several.
D. Pandora's Box? Might recognizing a right to some exceptions open up the possibility of a right to non-life-saving abortions, and thus unravel Dobbs's rejection of a constitutional abortion right? After all, courts would have to determine the level of generality at which to define the historic tradition of allowing life exceptions. Maybe it was ultimately about, say, allowing abortions for pressing reasons. If so, it would sweep more broadly than medical emergencies.
While deciding how to define a deeply rooted right is often tricky, here it seems less tricky than almost ever. For one thing, in discerning the scope of the exception, we wouldn't have to interpret diffuse political practices ("states have often and in various ways respected people's ability to do X, so X must be a right"). We'd only be interpreting discrete legal texts—indeed, a small and sharply defined set of legal texts: the statutory abortion bans extant in 1868 and listed in Dobbs's appendix. And almost all the bans passed from 1828 to 1868 (and down to 1960) defined the exception at issue in highly determinate terms, listing only abortions needed to prevent the mother's death, or to prevent her death or serious bodily injury. Yet there have always been other pressing reasons to abort. The upshot (to quote Glucksberg's criteria of "deep-rootedness") is that "centuries of legal doctrine and practice" banning almost all abortions—together with states' "considered policy choices" to make only a narrow life (or life-and-serious-bodily-health) exception—reflect a specific judgment that there is no right to other abortions.
There's more evidence that this was the operative judgment. The Fourteenth Amendment's ratifying generation repeatedly expressed its conviction, in light of then-recent developments in the science of human embryogenesis, that abortion at any stage takes a human life. And it's a commonplace of our legal and philosophical traditions that private actions that result in someone's death are justified only to prevent another death or perhaps serious bodily injury, as per the right to self-defense. So it's no wonder that almost every state banning abortion reached the same normatively salient equilibrium point: that (fetal) life may be taken only in the process of preventing the loss of another (maternal) life (or serious bodily injury).
Indeed, an enduring view in our ethical and legal traditions would find a difference in kind, not degree, between life-saving and other procedures. On this view, it's not just that the benefits happen to trump the costs with life-saving abortions and those alone; it's that the act involves a different intent in life-saving cases. As the Supreme Court observed in Vacco v. Quill, which upheld a ban on assisted suicide, "[t]he law has long used actors' intent or purpose to distinguish between two acts that may have the same result." Thus, the "common law of homicide" has often distinguished "a person who knows that another person will be killed as a result of his conduct" from "a person who acts with the specific purpose of taking another's life." To support the legal relevance of intent for homicide law, Vacco cited, among other things, treatises from the same antebellum era in which states were passing the laws cited in Dobbs that banned abortions except to save the mother's life. Indeed, Vacco called intent-based distinctions "universal and persistent in mature systems of law" of all kinds. And Vacco held that such distinctions rationally explain the choice of an "overwhelming majority of state legislatures" to ban assisted suicide while allowing the "withdrawing or [. . . ] refusal of unwanted lifesaving medical treatment." A similar principle could rationally explain the choice of most states in the 1800s to ban all (other) abortions while allowing procedures needed to save the mother's life.
In both cases, the underlying ethical principle, emphasized for centuries in what Isaiah Berlin called "the central tradition of Western thought," has affirmed a crucial difference between (1) actions intended to cause an innocent's death (as an end or as a means to another goal), which were deemed always wrong; and (2) actions that had death as a foreseen side effect, which were permissible if done for proportionate reasons. States that considered the fetus an innocent life may well have seen maternal-health procedures as falling in category (2), and others in (1).
After all, with most* non-health-related abortions, part of the goal is to avoid the burdens of parenthood on the one hand, and of giving a child up for adoption on the other. And for that dual goal, fetal death is a necessary means; removal isn't enough. If the fetus survived, the procedure would have failed to achieve its goal. Contrast those abortions with urgent health interventions—e.g., removals of a cancerous uterus, or of part of a fallopian tube in an ectopic pregnancy. Here the end of saving the mother's life isn't advanced at all by fetal death. If the fetus survived along with the mother, the procedure would still have achieved its goal in full. So death is not a means but a side effect. And accepting even a person's death as a side effect of saving a life—even outside the abortion context—is thought justified by ethicists of many stripes.
If the states' historic policy choices were shaped by anything like this contrast, long salient in Western thought and law, then abortions to save the mother's life would not have seemed like abortions in the focal sense (so-called "direct abortions") at all. Indeed, those abortions naturally fall outside the definition of "abortion" "for legal purposes" that Professor Glanville Williams provides in his classic Textbook of Criminal Law: "feticide: the intentional destruction of the fetus in the womb, or any untimely delivery brought about with intent to cause the death of the fetus" (emphasis in original). Even today, distinguishing "direct" from "indirect" abortions based on whether there's lethal intent is part of bioethical discourse. And our related distinction between "therapeutic" and elective abortions captures a similar perceived qualitative difference.
(*One can imagine non-life-saving abortions where fetal death is not a means. For example, if the goal is only to avoid the physical discomforts of pregnancy, evicting the fetus will suffice, whether it lives or dies. But even if states in 1868 would have seen such abortions as causing death only as a side effect, it is no surprise that they banned them anyway. If they regarded fetal life as anything like innocent human life, they would have countenanced fetal death as a side effect only for the most serious reasons—saving another from death or serious bodily harm.)
Even if it turns out that these ideas about intent didn't directly influence the antebellum generation's policy choices on abortion, the other points taken above confirm that any deeply rooted right to a life (or life-or-serious-health) exception would likely be stable and self-contained.
E. Doe v. Bolton. In fact, the history is such that any truly rooted right would be narrow enough to make clear that Doe v. Bolton's sweeping definition of a health exception, to include "emotional, psychological, familial" factors, does not reflect the constitutional requirement. (Another reason Doe would likely fall with Roe is that Doe was Roe's companion case, giving effect to Roe's much-critiqued (by both sides) focus on physicians' putative rights: Doe's health definition was meant to spell out the "medical judgment" that physicians had a right to exercise under Roe.)
F. Consistency with overturning Roe? Would reversing Roe eliminate any right to a life exception? No. While Roe said there was a right to life-saving abortions, that was no part of the basis for its outcome or, thus, its holding. It could not have been, since the law at issue in Roe already allowed abortion to save the mother's life—as the Court noted. (The Court faulted the law only for "sweep[ing] too broadly" by "mak[ing] no distinction" between early and late abortions and allowing abortions only to save the mother.) But if a life-exception right wasn't a holding in Roe, and rests on independent grounds (rational-basis review or pre-Roe historical practice), overturning Roe cannot eliminate it. Compare: Smith said that the Free Exercise Clause (a) forbids official discrimination based on religion, but (b) doesn't forbid incidental legal burdens on religion. Yet Smith didn't rest on point (a), and point (a) rests on grounds that are prior to Smith—the Free Exercise Clause and earlier precedents. For those reasons, if Fulton had said "Smith is overruled," no one would have thought Fulton was rejecting (a).
G. Would a caveat change anything? Has the draft opinion omitted a caveat about life exceptions because adding one would blunt the rhetorical force of Dobbs's arguments against a general abortion right? Suppose the draft were revised to say that "life-saving medical procedures aside, it's the case that for centuries leading right up to the mid-20th century, no legal text, no state case, no federal case, no legal treatise, and no academic article contained a whiff of support for a right to abortion; none; zero." If the original (which I've closely paraphrased) sounded to your ear devastating for Casey and Roe, I suspect the revision would, too. Setting aside "life-saving medical procedures" wouldn't be deflating because the possibility of a life exception was contextually salient to begin with, given the antebellum statutes that Dobbs itself relies on and lists in its appendix (and also, perhaps, because a life-exception right would protect less than 1% of abortions, and a 1% that is never banned anyway).
With or without an express caveat, Dobbs's holding would be clear: States could pass the sorts of laws reproduced in Dobbs's appendix, most of which forbade all abortions but those needed to prevent death, or death or serious bodily injury. That holding would be sweeping. But for better or worse, it would be no more sweeping than its rationale. If Dobbs's basis for upholding Mississippi's pre-viability ban is that (1) Roe and Casey had no legal basis to impose the normative judgment that until viability the interest in aborting outweighs the interest in guarding fetal life, and that (2) history leaves states free to assign these interests different weights, then Dobbs would be incoherent if it didn't overrule Roe and Casey and quite generally restore rational-basis review.
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Clingers can enthuse with respect to Dobbs as they wish, but the practical point is the over-under on how long a Dobbs decision along the lines preliminary written by Justice Alito would survive.
Roe lasted a half-century.
An over-under line on Dobbs seems right at nine years.
Barring a miracle, of course. Including a rapture, which is probably the conservatives’ best shot at maintaining Dobbs for as much as a decade.
The “over under” on Dobbs lasting is “until the end of the US”
Because Roe and Casey are both obviously garbage decisions (as we can see from the fact that no one’s made a legitimate legal argument against the Dobbs draft), and because the vast majority of Americans are going to discover that they’re quite happy in a post-Roe America
65% of Americans thing that 2nd trimester abortions (14 weeks on) should be illegal in most to all cases. That’s not “supports Roe”.
CA and NY will go “abortion uber alles”. Most of the rest of the US won’t, and the pro-abortion fanatics demanding that will lose enough elections that the rest will shut up about it.
Cling to Roe, Rev, it’s fun to laugh at you.
You keep laughing.
I, with the other members of the liberal-libertarian mainstream that has won the American culture war, will continue to shape our national progress against the wishes and efforts of bigoted, obsolete right-wingers (including you).
Until a better, younger American replaces you in our electorate, of course.
Open wider, clinger.
“I, with the other members of the liberal-libertarian mainstream that has won the American culture war”
You mean the ones who blocked the “don’t say gay” law?
The ones who beat Glenn Youngkin in VA
The ones who got Netflix to cancel and comedians who the trans whiners dont’ like?
The ones driving Disney’s stock price to ever higher levels?
Of, gee, you mean all those went the other way?
You really are stupid, aren’t you
Any other right-wing dumbasses want to join Greg in claiming that conservatives are winning (rather than getting stomped by their betters) in the culture war?
Step right up and stake your position, half-educated, superstitious, bigoted Republicans!
“half-educated, superstitious, bigoted”?
That would be the person who claims that people with penises become “women” whenever they say they feel that way.
Because who needs a science like biology when you have feelings?
“younger American replaces you”
Why have you dropped your talknig point about replacing and America which is, inter alia, too white?
Either you’ve suddenly developed a principled objection to racism, or something has happened which makes your talking point sound even more psycho than usual.
I guess Girgis wants a life exception, but that is not really the issue in Dobbs.
Kavanaugh and ACB got hard nips when Bush slaughtered innocent Muslim babies during shock and awe…so they should be open to allowing some exceptions to murder innocent Christian babies.
“Notre Dame Law School Professor”
Notre Dame weeps.
Why? As a discourse upon the law, this is cogent, articulate and substantiated by legal principles and precedents. Whether it reaches your preferred ethical outcome is irrelevant. That’s something for Ethics Professors to opine on, not law school profs.
Rossami — However cogent the OP may be as a discourse on law, it purports in part to be a discourse on history. As a history interpreter, Girgis is incompetent, like most lawyers.
For instance, lawyers, including Girgis, are inclined to look at statutes, and infer mistaken history from their passage and existence. Mere existence of laws tells too little about what people actually did, or even about any collective moral intent a society may have had.
Historians are trained to look instead at case results. That is the method to use if you want to claim legitimate historical analysis.
Alito avoids North American case results throughout most of his history review, from colonial times until now. Girigs does not criticize him for it.
Too bad, because North American common law practice prior to passage of anti-abortion statutes in the mid-19th century was lopsidedly on the side of tolerance for abortion—invalidating Alito’s analysis, and making him look lazy or historically ignorant at best, and dishonest in his analysis at worst.
Even in the mid-19th century—Alito’s most anti-abortion era, judged by the method of citing passage of laws—newspapers in major cities, and some medium-sized cities, openly advertised abortion services providers—some of whom continued to advertise regularly for decades. The budgets for some of those advertising clients have been estimated, and show that the most-established abortion providers must have been doing enormous business, just to afford the advertising they were doing.
By the too-often-misleading statute method of historical analysis, a lawyer 200 years hence will have no trouble informing readers that our present period was one in which drug abuse was uncommon, or non existent. The vast array of laws against drug abuse prove the point. See the problem?
Alito got the history utterly wrong. Girgis does not notice.
Can you explain why some evidence of non-enforcement of an “anti-abortion in X circumstance” law should be read as support for “a right to abort?” Surely non-enforcement of current laws in various “major cities, and some medium-sized cities” isn’t seen as generally supporting a right to perform the illegal activity. Sanctuary cities (of the common immigration or more pro-life type) and some cities refusing to prosecute violence associated with popular protests doesn’t somehow invalidate the laws covering those activities, right? I don’t see how cops letting some people smoke joints equals evidence that there was is a deeply rooted in history for a right to consume all currently banned/regulated drugs. I’d also suggest that using non-enforcement from mid-19th century and earlier is especially weak since police forces then were much different than our current police forces. They were decentralized but had no/limited cross-jurisdictional capability, corrupt, discriminatory by design, etc and later de facto police were paid for by the wealthy and business interests directly. (https://www.britannica.com/topic/police/English-and-American-policing-in-the-late-19th-century) Perhaps since IANAL I’m missing something. Thanks.
Cannon — Yes, you have missed the point, but no, not because you are not a lawyer. You missed it because you are not a historian.
A historian quite naturally concludes that when someone announces an enquiry into history and tradition, that will involve taking an interest in what actually happened in the past. Alito did not do that.
Alito obscured what actually happened, likely on purpose. Given that you have to be willfully negligent to miss salient evidence available in a one-button-press internet search, no benefit of the doubt is available to cover Alito’s omission. It is mendacity.
Your argument about “a right to abort,” is a historically irrelevant try to reframe the import of the history Alito had obliged himself to study. Prior to the founding era, history and tradition had less to say about any rights at all, and essentially nothing to say about rights for women in North America—which mostly went unrecognized even after the post-Civil War amendments.
Nevertheless—in the absence of enabling rights—day-to-day practice showed for two centuries the history and tradition of what later became the United States was to permit early-term abortions. It was not to outlaw them, nor to punish them. And the history and tradition was not to require a showing of any right to exercise that personal liberty. Respect for privacy alone did that. All that is firmly established in the historical record.
Alito’s advocacy has not been to find that history and tradition; it has not been to be guided by it; it has been to overturn it. Like you, he objects to the notion that a right was ever recognized, and like you, he goes farther, to insist a right IS NOW required to protect a private choice to have an abortion, even though no such right had been required previously.
Whatever else that might be, it is a startling reversal in the American concept of privacy. Do you join Alito to insist there is no right to privacy in the Constitution, nor in the nation’s history and tradition? If you do think that, what other personal freedoms protected by privacy will you join with Alito to overturn?
In his draft Dobbs decision Alito was not mistaken about this nation’s history; he lied about it. Whether or not legal principles say that ought to substantively constrain Alito’s otherwise arbitrary power to reach any result he prefers, perhaps only a lawyer can say.
It is within the power of anyone to offer an opinion on whether Alito’s method makes his draft decision legitimate. To me it does not. To me, Alito’s draft decision is an outrageous lie, and a threat to the notion that Americans have any privacy at all which the government is bound to respect. Nothing could be less legitimate.
Alito may or may not be right about the history (you don’t present compelling evidence) but I find your argument that abortion law history has to be ignored because of some non-enforcement no more solid after that long reply than in your earlier post. Is the list of anti-abortion laws at the end of the draft decision fake? If not it sure looks like they didn’t view abortion as a protected privacy right regardless of whether those laws were enforced reliably. It appears you think there is no other party involved in this “privacy” issue and thus it should be the woman’s decision alone (possibly with no restriction?). It appears that is not the legal tradition in the US in the past and also not the majority view now in the US or throughout the world. I find arguments that all private decisions would be at risk should something like this draft be announced difficult to credit since this is the only one that kills a developing person. I’m personally fine with first trimester abortion since, as someone trained in neuropsych, I think brain development not viability should determine the cutoff. Once the developing human life can experience pain (currently not known when this occurs but it is possible that when spinothalamic projections penetrate the subplate compartment in the developing brain that might be minimal architecture needed. This happens during weeks 12-16. Hormonal stress response to pain seen in older infants to adults can be seen at 18wks of development.) it is hard for me to see abortion as a privacy issue if it involves inflicting pain on another.
It would be nice if the SC ended the suspense and published the opinion.
Also, who leaked the draft opinion? Will we ever know?
Yep, and then they need to publish the opinions that allow guns in schools so grade schoolers can defend themselves during mass shootings!! Gun free zones are really open ranges for slaughtering innocents. We need grade schoolers locked and loaded!! “Well regulated” means trained to arms superior to Navy SEALs because these 18 year old suicidal nuts can generally outgun special operators.
Feel better?
My nips are hard.
Remember to keep an opaque covering on them.
Think smiley face pasties.
Who is going to protect those students from criminals?
The police?
The ones who sat around outside for 40 minutes, let’s who knows how many kids get killed?
And person who you can’t trust with a gun, shouldn’t be a school teacher. And just about every school teacher should be armed
But Sebastian disagrees, because he loves it when people get killed while waiting for help
Yep! Definitely only the police should have guns,a nd we shoudl rely on the government to provide for our safety!
http://ace.mu.nu/archives/399307.php
Cops Handcuffed Mother Who Was Trying to Enter School to Save Her Child, For “Interfering with an Active Investigation”
Yep! Because if you cannot hit a real rhetorical target, make up a strawman!
What’s the straw man I’m attacking? That the argument for “gun control” requires a belief that the police will protect us from criminals?
News flash: people aren’t going to give up their right to self defense in exchange for cops who sit back and let them be raped / murdered
Greg J, people who object that mass school shootings are uncommon have a point. It is a point which invalidates the notion of arming teachers as a counter measure. By that means you would put hundreds of thousands of private guns into the schools, where their presence would be an additional hazard in itself, and a statistically imposing one.
The result would deliver more gun deaths and injuries than could be prevented—keeping in mind, especially, that armed teachers would never be likely to do better than the armed police officers who already fail so often to provide much protection. Arming teachers is lunacy as a means to defend schools from mass shootings.
Stephan, I have to point out that when I was school age, you’d routinely find guns in schools. We had rifle ranges, hunting classes, and during deer season the students old enough to drive had guns in their cars for hunting.
These school shootings were none the less very rare at the time.
Thus we know for a fact that the mere presence of guns in schools, by itself, does not cause shootings. Maybe we should become more curious about what DOES cause them?
Hi Brett – may I ask how old you are and where you grew up? I’m just wondering. I’m 63 and grew up in a small town in Ohio. Guns weren’t permitted in our school and we had no classes related to them. While I’m sure there are some schools that had such classes and allowed guns in the school, I’d be surprised that if we surveyed all schools back then we’d find that it was “routine.”
Yes, Bellmore, I get that you romanticize the notion of armed citizen guardians—people of prowess greater than mere police officers, who alone can restore the nation to peace and justice.
But my concern is steadfast Ms. Gribble, who on the only day in the last 13 years when she failed to conceal her piece from the students, suffered the misfortune to let it fall into the hands of Chucky, the budding 4th grade psychopath. Because who else but hyper-alert, hyper-aggressive Chucky would be the first to get to it?
You style yourself an engineer, Brett. Can you figure out how many such incidents might result annually from such once-in-thirteen years inadvertence among 3.5 million public school teachers? My quick-and-dirty calculation puts the number blessedly short of 300,000 incidents per year, but maybe still too high, at well more than 1,000 out-of-control guns per day in classrooms nationwide. Of course, by knocking the percentage of armed teachers down to 10%, you could pare that down to only 100+ out-of-control guns per day—a big improvement!
What does your intuition tell you about the risk of that, compared to the risk you are trying to counter? Less risk? Or more risk? Have you remembered to control for the fact that valiant Ms. Gribble cannot be assumed always to be successful in defending her students? And in fact, she is at least as likely as an armed police officer to fall victim before saving anyone at all?
With your mixture of sharp reasoning, plus sky-high quotient of unexamined assumptions, you remain a remarkable commenter. I have a suggestion. Check each sentence you write. Every time you write a sentence which asserts anything substantive at all, ask yourself, “How do I know that?” Pay particular attention when you find yourself writing stuff like, “point out,” “thus,” “know for a fact,” or, “cause.” Good luck. And try to remember how dangerous it can be when some everyday routine you rely on to manage your gun gets interrupted by happenstance.
“But my concern is steadfast Ms. Gribble, who on the only day in the last 13 years when she failed to conceal her piece from the students, suffered the misfortune to let it fall into the hands of Chucky, the budding 4th grade psychopath. Because who else but hyper-alert, hyper-aggressive Chucky would be the first to get to it? ”
WTF are you talking about?
And why is it that you can never provide links for any of your claims? is it because you make them all up?
https://crimeresearch.org/2019/05/major-new-research-on-school-safety-schools-that-allow-teachers-to-carry-guns-havent-seen-school-shootings-during-school-hours/
After the Columbine school shooting 20 years ago, one of the more significant changes in how we protect students has been the advance of legislation that allows teachers to carry guns at schools. There are two obvious questions: Does letting teachers carry create dangers? Might they deter attackers? Twenty states currently allow teachers and staff to carry guns to varying degrees on school property, so we don’t need to guess how the policy would work. There has yet to be a single case of someone being wounded or killed from a shooting, let alone a mass public shooting, between 6 AM and midnight at a school that lets teachers carry guns. Fears of teachers carrying guns in terms of such problems as students obtaining teachers guns have not occurred at all, and there was only one accidental discharge outside of school hours with no one was really harmed.
Link includes links to the paper, and the data.
This, BTW, is what SJL never does: me providing a link to back up my claims
Greg J, people who object that mass school shootings are uncommon have a point. It is a point which invalidates the notion of arming teachers as a counter measure
Then it equally invalidates imposing gun rights restrictions on law abiding citizens.
So glad we can both agree that there’s no legitimate grounds for passing any “gun control” laws.
The result would deliver more gun deaths and injuries than could be prevented
Really?
So, how many illegitimate “gun deaths” have been caused by armed teachers, in America, in the last 10 years?
0?
keeping in mind, especially, that armed teachers would never be likely to do better than the armed police officers
Are you really that stupid?
The armed teachers are already there. Which means they can provide protection immediately, rather than an hour+ later, after multiple victims have been shot / bled out who would have been saved by an immediate response.
THis is now answered above. And yes, the answer is that there’s not been even ONE person accidentally or criminally killed by teacher carrying a gun at a public school, and there’s 20 States that allow such carry
IANAL and I think anti-abortion laws are incapable of consistent enforcement, but I appreciate this article; clarifies a lot of the legal quibbling I like to make so much fun of.
“IANAL and I think anti-abortion laws are incapable of consistent enforcement”
Just about all laws are incapable of consistent enforcement.
Look up statistics on police case clearance rates. These rates are based only on whether an arrest was made.
The US national average clearance rate for murder is only 60%. And it drops rapidly as you move to less serious crimes. The clearance rate for many property crimes is below 20%.
No, I mean like speeding laws, where not only are very few people even given a ticket, traffic courts are a joke. Or insider trading. Or lemonade stands and business permits. I’m sure you could figure out a few more if you put your brain to it and didn’t just jump to the first knee-jerk snark that came to mind.
There are far too many problems with anti-abortion laws to ever be properly enforced.
You set up an abortion clinic, it gets shut down and you get arrested. Exasctly what part of that is supposed to be difficult?
How do you tell miscarriages from self-abortion? I have read that something like 1/3 of pregnancies end in miscarriages. A woman buys a pregnancy test, tells friends and co-workers she’s pregnant … and months later, nothing. Abortion or miscarriage?
As bad a recipe for crap enforcement as poppy seeds and birth drug testing, or parents jailed for child abuse when kids get bruises.
Try thinking about potential problems. The law is not known for its clear-cut objectivity.
So, we agree that they can get rid of all the abortion clinics?
That anyone who tries to sell abortificants “on the street” can get caught, arrested, convicted, and thrown in jail?
I’ve long thought that Roe was too specific and that the Texas law could or should have been overturned on something like this:
And then turning it back to the states to figure out. I think in a while a consensus would have emerged on the basis of the things we see in the polling now, abortions generally available with some restrictions. In the intervening years the positions on both sides have hardened to the point where no one seems willing to compromise.
Your assumption is that the arguments against abortion are about the potential lives of the unborn rather than other motives for which this is a proxy. Decades ago, there was a lot more discussion about how women shouldn’t have premarital sex and a bunch of other morality-based arguments. The gist of these was that anti-abortion (and anti-birth control) laws were needed to ensure there were consequences for immoral behavior. This is full on “Moral Majority” stuff. Fast forward and the marketing has gotten better but you can see the truth of the so-called “pro-life” movement in the way they show a complete lack of concern for what happens to the child after they’re born. Heck, they aren’t even willing to accept background checks for guns if it might reduce the number of children killed each year by AR-15s. They de-fund school lunch programs and other safety nets for children in poor families. It’s never been about the children but about punishing other people who do not share their religious beliefs.
Where is your evidence that the people claiming to be concerned about the lives of the unborn are lying?
Even if you were correct that people “decades ago” that you’ve never met and cannot name had the secret motive to punish other ‘immoral behavior’, rather than to prevent the specific ‘immoral behavior’ of abortion, what proof do you have that different people now (‘decades’ later) have the same secret motives?
Have you develop time-travelling telepathy and not told anyone before?
The standard articulated in the draft Dobbs opinion for when to recognize fundamental rights is the Bowers v. Hardwick standard. Gucksberg merely repeated it. Moreover, the draft opinion specifically repudiates language added in Casey that was used as the basis for Lawrence.
It would be disingenuous to apply the Bowers standard and not expect to reach the Bowers result.
Gorsuch and Roberts’ opinions in Bostock suggest that that may not the wnd of the story. Perhaps O’Conner’s concurrence in Lawrence on equal protection grounds might be revived.
But the opinion strongly suggests that so far as the Due Process clause is concerned, everything that followed from overruling Bowers is up for grabs and likely out the door.
It is not a “Bowers standard.” Glucksberg never cited Bowers, and the standard long predates Bowers.
But the opinion strongly suggests that so far as the Due Process clause is concerned, everything that followed from overruling Bowers is up for grabs and likely out the door.
Which is fine, because it should be.
What part of “the Constitution does not enshrine the beliefs of 21st century leftists, if you want your positions to win, you’re going to have to win elections on them” are you unclear on?
The part where people who disagree with you are allowed to have a vote?
Remember that thought when your betters enlarge the Court and relegate the clingers on that bench to authorship of bitter, seething, increasingly desperate dissents.
When are you bozos going to do that, Rev?
You’re getting wiped out in the House and Senate in November.
You think Manchin is going to agree to pack the Courts between now and Jan 6 2023
I realize the Left’s pattern is “we made a bad problem, so lets nuke all the existing rules to make it worse”, but you’re really reaching new levels of stupidity here
Insofar as at least one Supreme Court seat is concerned, the “Left” did win the election that should have controlled that seat. We’ve won every single presidential popular vote for decades other than Bush II’s re-election. We didn’t attempt to overturn a presidential election by force. If we want our positions to win, based on the GOP’s wins in recent decades, we need to throw out tradition, embrace gerrymandering and anti-voting campaigns, and find a few good scapegoats to really demonize and whip up empty moral frenzy over.
“The part where people who disagree with you are allowed to have a vote?”
Tell me you didn’t type that with a straight face.
Except that “the Right” also won the election that controlled that Supreme Court seat, because the Senate is require to provide “advice and consent“.
So why does “the Left” “own” the seat and not “the Right”?
Also, the Left has only won a majority of the Presidential votes in 3 of the last 11 elections, while Republicans have won it 4 times. Do you think this means the Republicans are more popular and have better positions? Or, rather, why do you think that means anything at all?
“Insofar as at least one Supreme Court seat is concerned, the “Left” did win the election that should have controlled that seat.”
Bzzt, wrong.
The left lost the 2014 Senate elections, which meant, just as withe the 1986 elections and Bork, that the Senate had a complete right to reject the president’s nominee.
The worst, most pathetic and terminally stupid thing about the Left, is you idiots complete inability to understand that actions have consequences
Before Bork, teh rule was “any qualified nominee should be approved”.
Post Bork, and post the Estrada filibuster, the rule is “the Senate can do anything they think they can get away with”.
Go cry yourself a river about Garland. Have fun. I’ll have fun laughing at you. Because it’s always fun seeing the Left get screwed over by their own “new rules”
We’ve won every single presidential popular vote for decades other than Bush II’s re-election.
Even if true (it isn’t), who gives a shit? Wow, that’s so special, you “won” a metric no one was competing on!
All that proves is that you’re morons.
We didn’t attempt to overturn a presidential election by force.
In 2000, you attempted to steal a Presidential election by having criminal “judges” rewrite FL election law, and keep on rewriting it until you got a rewrite that gave you the “win”.
In 2016 you attempted to steal the Presidential election by faking up a hoax “collusion” between Russia and Trump, adn in 2017 and 2018 Democrat apparatchiks tried to cripple the legitimate President with an illegitimate “investigation”.
In 2020 you engaged in massive violence all summer long in a bit of domestic terrorism and threat as to what would happen if you weren’t allowed to steal the election by having members of the Left illegally rewrite election laws
AS for Jan 6, if that had been a Republican attempt to overthrow teh election with violence, there would have been hundreds of dead DC cops and members of Congress. The fact that none of the protesters brought guns shows it wasn’t anything like an insurrection.
If we want our positions to win, based on the GOP’s wins in recent decades, we need to throw out tradition, embrace gerrymandering
Are you an ignoramus or a liar? The Democrats are and were the Party of gerrymandering. You’re just butthurt whiners who are upset that the first two years of the Obama Admin were so bad they finally let the GOP beat the Democrat gerrymanders, take over many State Legislatures, and then return the favor
anti-voting campaigns
You mean, “attempts to stop vote fraud and illegal voting”?
No, if that happened you’d lose a lot more races
find a few good scapegoats to really demonize and whip up empty moral frenzy over.
Oh, you mean like Nick Sandman and the “Covington Kids”?
Are you for real? That’s the Democrat Party MO for the last 50 years.
I’m impressed with your strong sense of projection. Your complete and utter stupidity, OTOH, is pathetic
Greg claims the half-educated racists, the superstitious gay-bathers, the misogynistic incels, the backwater immigrant-haters, and the disaffected clingers are the future of America. He figures conservatives have turned the half-century tide of the culture war — not just slowed it, or stopped it, but actually reversed it. He thinks right-wing positions are goin to undo all of this damned liberal-libertarian progress of more than a half-century. School prayed and creationism coming back. Uppity blacks, gays, and women put back in their places. The white majority will be preserved. Harvard and Yale will be overtaken by right-wing religious schools. Mississippi, Wyoming, West Virginia,, and Oklahoma will overtake California, New York, and Illinois as our leading states. Old-timely religion will make a comeback. No more persecution of white, downscale, heterosexual, superstitious, backwater males.
Do any of the other right-wingers who follow this blog want to join Greg out on that fantasy-rotted limb?
“The white majority will be preserved.”
I thought you’d given up on that white-replacement stuff after that communist used it to justify murder.
“The white majority will be preserved”
According to pretty much all the polling, Hispanics are supporting the GOP more than the Dems this year
Also according to all teh recent polling, blacks are moving towards the GOP.
Majority? No. But if blacks go 70 – 30 Dem rather than 90 – 10, you all are completely screwed
And what makes you think Asians are going to continue to support the Party that always wants to discriminate against them?
Admirably well written, clear and well argued. Which doesn’t make it right, of course, but it’s a good start.
On this key point, he’s right on the mark. The fact that third-party harm is a rational, arguable position to take is exactly why this should never have been short-circuited by the courts in the first place.
In the paragraph that starts “A. Rational Basis?”, the author posits a dichotomy that, I think, does not really exist. Yes, there are cases where a pre-viability threat to the mother’s life means the fetus will definitely die either way but those extreme cases are quite rare. Far more common is the situation where the threatened but not guaranteed to be fatal if the pregnancy is preserved.
What do you do when it’s only a 50% chance that Mom will die without the abortion? Is a 50% chance of losing both of them worth the 100% chance of losing just the fetus? What if it’s only a 10% chance? A 1% chance? A tenth of 1% but Mom’s really, really afraid? Where do you draw the line? Rational basis is so toothless a review that I don’t see it as a credible obstacle to hypothetical bans on “life-saving” abortions.
I’ll also note that this approach puts us back in the messiness of setting a legal standard based on viability – an ever-changing “standard” dependent on the then-current state of technology.
What’s the usual standard for self defense ? If you shoot someone who’s posing a 50-50 risk to your life, is that OK ? Or if the someone is posing a 100% risk of chopping off your leg ? Does it make a difference if the someone is not responsible for their actions – eg has been wickedly pumped full of some crazy making drug by a third party ?
Applying a “stand your ground” approach to the “life of the mother” exceptions.
An excellent, thorough review of the issues involved. Clear even to those of us who aren’t trained in the law. Thank you.
DaveM — The history part is baloney. Girgis doesn’t know the first thing about how to think systematically about the past, so he was unable to discern that Alito did not do it. See my comment upthread for more.
There is no right to privacy or I would be allowed to cook meth in my garage for personal consumption.
Or grow weed.
Or cut the barrel off my rifle.
Justice Alito’s attempt to cabin his reasoning to abortion rights cases will likely prove to be as insincere and meaningless as then-Judge Kavanaugh’s confirmation hearing testimony that Roe v. Wade is settled law.
Every constitutional right sounding in the substantive due process interests in privacy, personal autonomy and/or bodily integrity is at risk. It is sophistry to claim otherwise.
Only only better Americans enlarge the Court and demonstrate to obsolete conservatives the cost of overplaying a weak hand in the culture war.
I feel like Alito could have saved a lot of the reader’s time if he would have framed the right in question correctly. Instead of asking whether the Constitution protects a right to an abortion, he should have asked what the Roe Court asked, whether the Constitution protects a woman’s right, to terminate her pregnancy (“This right of privacy … is broad enough to encompass a woman’s decision whether or not to terminate her pregnancy”). That would make the conclusion from the common law investigation pretty obvious, since women had few, if any, legal rights during the time of Bracton, Hale, Blackstone, and the Founding. That might be due to their general lack of political power during the period.
The right to terminate one’s pregnancy is, as a result of biology, a right enjoyed by females. I think its pretty certain that you’re not going to find any evidence of such a female right in the common law. Let this be a lesson to women (and minorities) moving forward. If you’re going to argue that a right is deeply rooted in our Nation’s history, then it better be a right that white men could also exercise.
Straight white men. But yeah, truth.
Blew my mind when I learned that my mother–college educated, former military officer and Vietnam veteran–couldn’t get credit after her divorce because she didn’t have a husband.
Women could not use the front door of the club at which my law firm conducted business meetings early in my career, Volokh Conspiracy fans monitored that door to ensure only men used it.
This is why conservatives are doomed in modern America. The “good old days” these bigoted jerks want to revive were illusory. A fairy tale, like some of the other rubbish they believe
You’re saying you collaborated with sexists?
“No, man, it was the bouncers, they were the ones excluding the women from our building. It wasn’t *my* fault.”
I think its pretty certain that you’re not going to find any evidence of such a female right in the common law.
Not sure what you mean by, “find such a female right in the common law.” It is strongly proved in the North American common law that women were routinely permitted pre-quickening abortions without fear of adverse legal consequence. That is a well-established historical consensus. Alito cites almost nothing to the contrary.
It is strongly proved in the North American common law that women were routinely permitted pre-quickening abortions without fear of adverse legal consequence.
No. Girgis explains the difference between unlawful and criminal. The common law was that a woman could not be convicted of a pre-quickening abortion because quickening was necessary evidence that there was a live child that had been killed. An extracted dead fetus was not sufficient evidence of killing, because it could have been dead already in utero.
The situation is analagous to murder, where in some places and at some times, the authorities could not prove murder without a body. So if you murdered someone, but managed to dispose of the body successfully, you couldn’t be convicted of murder (though they might be able to get you on something else.)
This is not a case of you being permitted by law to murder people, so long as you dispose of the body successfully, it’s a case of the rules of evidence providing you with a solid defense.
“From this angle, Griswold is different because preventing conception does no direct harm to a third party, or a third being of any kind. It only prevents the partners’ gametes from joining.”
Depending on the law, this is incorrect. Any law that specifies fertilization (as a bill currently in the Louisiana state house would do) by definition would ban conventional birth control pills and IUDs because they prevent implantation. Plan B-esque pills do not- there were theories that they did, but later studies have shown that they don’t- but it’s not hard to imagine a court saying that the belief that they prevent implantation is sufficient rational basis to ban Plan B, as well.
Yes, but this is all based on the pro-abortion medics 1965 political redefinition of “contraception” – precisely to move “conception” linguistically from fertilisation to implantation. Prior to this, contraception simply, and universally, meant the obvious – preventing conception, which was, simply and universally, synonymous with fertiisation :
“In 1959, Dr. Bent Boving suggested that the word “conception” should be associated with the process of implantation instead of fertilization. Some thought was given to possible societal consequences, as evidenced by Boving’s statement that “the social advantage of being considered to prevent conception rather than to destroy an established pregnancy could depend on something so simple as a prudent habit of speech.” In 1965, the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG) adopted Boving’s definition: “conception is the implantation of a fertilized ovum.
So Girgis’s description is quite right if you use the traditional, non-political, up until 1965 uncontroversial, meaning of conception and contraception.
It is only wrong if you use the pro abortion medics “habit of speech” which was specifically, and explicitly admitted to be , a wheeze to move anti-implantation abortions into the “contraception” box, so as to deceive the public about what is really going on.
Of course though the new meaning of “conception” and “contraception” is now commonly used in medical circles, no biologist entertains the idea for a moment. For a biologist, unconcerned with winning the abortion language wars, conception is fertilisation, period. Implanatation has nothing to do with it, not least because implantation is a mammalian eccentricty and doesn’t happen in the rest of the animal kingdom.
Plan B-esque pills do not- there were theories that they did, but later studies have shown that they don’t- but it’s not hard to imagine a court saying that the belief that they prevent implantation is sufficient rational basis to ban Plan B, as well.
Indeed, because these studies are by no means conclusive.
Whether there is always a whiff or a stench of hypocrisy in the abortion debate is everyone’s guess.
Like in the Alito draft, I can’t help but I get the definite feeling that the arguments offered here are against abortion per se, not against remanding the legalization or illegalization of abortion to the legislative branch.
Prof. Adler at least never pretends to do so whereas Alito certainly does. Can anybody explain to me why Prof. Adler’s arguments could not be used by abortion opponents to judicially impede any attempt by state or federal legislatures to legalize abortion? And wouldn’t that imply the need for a for all practical purposes impossible Constitutional Amendment for a woman’s right to choose?
The second screaming absence in his discussion are exceptions for rape and incest. I always felt that within the Alito/Adler thinking, not allowing any such exceptions is only consistent.
If a woman’s right to choose has no place in the abortion debate why should the idea — revulsive to many, yours truly included — that it is inconceivable for a woman to bear a child conceived in rape or incest? After all, in the vein of the Adler/Alito argument the fetus certainly must not lose her right to life just because of the circumstances of its conception. So why is that never publicly assumed?
As a non-lawyer I admit to my prejudice that the law is basically conservative and protecting established interests. As a non-citizen I wonder about the tendency in the US to seek help from a sort of uber-legislature (SCOTUS) to resolve political problems. I am convinced that what is politically desirable is definitely distinct from what is legal — although many in the US seem to readily confound the two. I am aware of the dangers of tyrranical majorities AND minorities but trying to circumvent legislative gridlock by political maneuvering in SCOTUS is not the way to run a country.
A difficulty with this line of argument is the analogy to war. Extraterritorial aliens are not “persons” within the meaning of the Bill of Rights. They lack constitutional rights. It is lawful to kill them. That’s what war is. And Congress need not punish citizens killing foreigners. A case a couple of years ago involving a border patrol agent who killed a Mexican teenager illustrates this fact. The teenager’s family lost in Supreme Court. The agent’s action was lawful, not covered by any statute or constitutional remedy.
This does not, however, mean there is an individual constitutional right for US citizens to kill foreigners on the other side of the border.
However, the arguemnts against the existence of a right to kill foreigners outside US territory also does not imply that the Constitution prohibits such behavior. Nothing in the constitution outlaws waging war on foreieners. Nothing permits courts to review wars for the percived justice of their justifications. Nothing in the constitution even requires Congress even to outlaw shooting across the border and hitting foreigners there.
Despite the fact that there are sound reasons justifying limiting war to just causes, criminalizing shooting across the border, etc., nothing in the Constitution requires that government take any action to prevent citizens from killing foreigners across the border if they want to.
Abortion is no different. There may perhaps be good reasons to prohibit it. But government isn’t required to do so. Because fetuses, exactly like foreigners, lack constitutional personhood status, the way the constitution handles killing them is, in the absence of Roe, pretty much the same. Just as government can spend money to wage war and actively kill foreigners, it can spend money to fund abortions if it wants.
I get the definite feeling that the arguments offered here are against abortion per se, not against remanding the legalization or illegalization of abortion to the legislative branch.
You are mistaken. The arguments address the question of whether the Due Process Clause entrenches a right to abortion. This has nothing to do with whether and when abortion is a good thing.
Prof. Adler at least never pretends to do so..
Indeed not, for he states explicitly that he is reproducing a memo by Professor Sherif Girgis.
Can anybody explain to me why Prof. Adler’s arguments could not be used by abortion opponents to judicially impede any attempt by state or federal legislatures to legalize abortion?
Because Girgis is arguing that Alito’s arguments that the Due Process Clause of the Federal Constitution does not provide a right to abortion, are not too shabby. There are many many things that the Due Process Clause does not provide a right to. Such as the right to a place at a free public school. But nothing in the Due Process Clause prevents a State Legislature, or State Constitution, from providing such a right.
And wouldn’t that imply the need for a for all practical purposes impossible Constitutional Amendment for a woman’s right to choose?
No. See above. Though if you wish to enshrine a federal constitutional right to abortion, secure against legislative acts by Congress or State Legislatures, then you would indeed need a Contitutional Amendment. Or you could go the Roe route, and get the Supreme Court to conjure one of of thin air. Though as we may see, that might be less durable than the hard road of an actual Constitutional Amendment.
The second screaming absence in his discussion are exceptions for rape and incest.
I kinda missed a section on global warming and Covid masking policy. But I simmered down and remembered that the guy was explicitly only writing about a particular aspect, leading him to ignore irrelevant aspects.
As to the particulars of the rape argument, they are complicated. But I think the main point is that the pro-choice arguments about “my body my choice” and the outrage of being forced to house an univited guest for 9 months are stronger when the guest is truly uninvited. And correspondingly weaker when it’s invited. Somewhat analagous to what you do with a road accident victim. You see one lying beside the road as you drive by, not your fault. Would it be kind and humane to stop and offer help ? Sure. Should the government punish you if you don’t ? Well opinions will differ. But if you knocked the guy down yourself, that’s on you. You own that. I’m lookin at you Teddy.
but trying to circumvent legislative gridlock by political maneuvering in SCOTUS is not the way to run a country.
In which case you will be delighted if Alito’s opinion becomes the actual majority opinion. For in a sentence it says “This is none of our business.”
The “#2 Distinguishing other rights” section strikes me as a valiant but flawed effort to cork the logical hole in the Dobbs dike.
Alito admits fetuses lack Constitutional standing. The competing interests are women’s bodily autonomy and state’ power to govern. Girgis’s characterization of abortion as “lethal” in the article mis-frames the Dobbs issue. The *state* is the actor making a policy choice to view the embryo/fetus as a life equal or superior to the woman’s, and then weighing it against the woman’s right to self-determination. To do that, the state has to make a policy determination that the embryo *has* rights. Girgis is expressing his own policy preference.
But the issue is how far does a woman’s right to autonomy extend in the first place? Our Constitution expects them to have similar autonomy to men’s autonomy under the 9th, 14th, etc. Amendments. Alito doesn’t say states have an unfettered right to define embryos as living and therefore ignore traditional notions of individual autonomy… because that would read an anti-“lethality” power in the Constitution, which plainly does not exist. (And would probably lead to a balancing approach like Roe adopted in the first place.) Thus, Alito does not attempt to magnify the state’s interest in order to compete better with Roe privacy concerns. He has to stunt the woman’s autonomy right by rejecting the Roe privacy rationale. That would have been easier if Alito were in the first Court to rule; but he has to find a critical error in Roe in order to breach stare decisis. To do that, he has to prove too much.
tl;dr : “Preventing lethality” is not a Constitutional concept, even if Roe offered “viability” as a balancing point for individual and state interests. Bodily autonomy clearly is a Constitutional concept. Girgis can express a policy preference that invading bodily autonomy to prevent fetal deaths warrants state intervention even if we otherwise would not accept it (forced vasectomies, e.g.). But that policy idea cannot save Alito’s broken Constitutional rationale.
Girgis’s characterization of abortion as “lethal” in the article mis-frames the Dobbs issue.
Well, everyone prefers his own frame, and that which is not your own frame is a misframe. As you yourself claim.
The *state* is the actor making a policy choice to view the embryo/fetus as a life equal or superior to the woman’s, and then weighing it against the woman’s right to self-determination.
No, the state doesn’t have to value the fetus’s life as morally equal to or superior to the woman’s. It just has to value it sufficiently highly to justify (on a rational basis measure) the burden on the woman’s (stipulated) right. (Unless the state is going to go so far as banning abortions which are required to save the mother’s life, when something like equality might be required.)
If it is just banning elective abortions, which damage a woman’s interests considerably less than killing her, the state can value the fetus’s life at say one twentieth of the woman’s and perhaps still have a rational basis for interfering. Which is not to say that that’s the value that a state would put on a fetus’s life, it’s merely that your claim that equality of value is required to generate a rational basis for intervention is misconceived.
To do that, the state has to make a policy determination that the embryo *has* rights.
No, that is shot down directly by SCOTUS precedent. Strangely enough, the very precedent that you are puffing, as Girgis explains :
Crucially, abortion’s third-party impact can be weighty enough to set it apart from other privacy or autonomy rights even if the harmed “party,” the fetus, isn’t a “person” for purposes of the Fourteenth Amendment. In fact, Roe and Casey themselves taught that saving X’s life can be a compelling [sic] interest even if X isn’t a person; they said just that of viable fetuses. Under Roe and Casey, post-viability abortion bans were permitted (though they burden a right) because they serve a compelling interest—but not required, because the late-term fetus isn’t a constitutional person.
AFAIAC Roe is horse dung from start to finish, but if you would like it to remain bindng precedent, you’re gonna have to accept that it directly contradicts you.
This is somewhat better reasoned than Alito’s draft opinion, but doesn’t do much to save it.
First, yes, Alito’s opinion rests on historical errors regarding abortion in the common law, but it is more broadly ahistorical than that. There is a great deal of cherry-picking and dishonesty regarding the history of women’s rights and unenumerated rights in general. For example, sure, 30 states had abortion bans prior to Roe, as Alito states. What he conveniently fails to mention is that 40% of the public supported abortions rights. Compare this to another unenumerated rights decision from the same period – interracial marriage. When the Lovings were convicted, 31 states outlawed interracial marriage and only 4% of the public supported a right to interracial marriage. So, if Loving survives the test of legislative and public preference, surely does Roe.
Second, of course the authors of the 14th amendment weren’t thinking about abortion. Women didn’t have full property rights or financial independence until the 1970s. The fact that bodily autonomy rights for women weren’t top of mind a century prior is hardly relevant. Congratulations, you’ve discovered sexism existed in the 1800s. And? So what? Interpreting “liberty” though the lens of an institutionalized caste system makes zero sense.
Third, Alito engages in a gross misinterpreting of the politics and history of the abortion debate, arguing that Roe itself inflamed tensions. And that, by extension, giving southern states permission to oppress minority rights is somehow going to lower the temperature. Which is asinine. At no point in American history has that ever helped. Alito’s opinion fancies itself as Brown, while employing all the logic and outcomes of Plessy. It will perform no better than Plessy.
Fourth, much of Girgis’ argument rests on a implication of fetal personhood, despite the one unconvincing paragraph to dismiss it. There is a repeated equivalence between “fetal life” and a women’s bodily autonomy, as if a state can rationally assume the former has more worth than the latter. Which, it can’t. There’s no support for anything approach fetal personhood in the constitution or even everyday belief. Confronted with the choice between saving a batch of fertilized embryos or a single baby from a burning IVF clinic, any sane person will pick the baby, regardless of whatever lip service they give to “fetal life”.
Fifth, one of the most illogical parts of Alito’s opinion is his “critical moral question” doctrine, which is vague to the point of useless, along with his rejection of bodily autonomy rights more broadly, which has far reaching consequences if accepted. What social issue isn’t a “critical moral question”? Even if you attempt to use Alito’s reasoning and restrict the definition to issues involving fetal viability, that still includes contraception, IVF, drug use, forced sterilization, vaccination policy, and environmental regulation, gay rights, interracial marriage or anything that is, or has been historical framed, as concerning miscarriages, birth defects, stillbirths, or child welfare. Why rejection of a right to bodily autonomy is so dangerous should be obvious, regardless of whether you favor abortion rights or oppose police-enforced vaccination.
However, none of the above actually matters. If accepted, Alito’s interpretation would convert a constitutional right to a crime punishable by death overnight for a significant number of Americans. Simply because the political composition of the court changes.
That is bat shit insane. Truly. Imagine the court flips again and all of the sudden you can be executed for owning a gun, going to church, or expressing an unpopular political opinion. There is no universe in which that overcomes stare decisis.
You can believe Roe and Casey are flawed, because they surely were. But, that doesn’t mean Alito’s draft isn’t complete garbage. As a work of political fiction, it’s about average. As a piece of scholarship and reason from the highest court in the land, it’s embarrassingly detached from reality.