Robert F. Kennedy Jr.: COVID, Ukraine, Bitcoin, Guns, Free Speech, and More

The environmentalist and anti-vaccine activist talks about his presidential run and whether he'd jail climate change skeptics.

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Robert F. Kennedy Jr.: COVID, Ukraine, Bitcoin, Guns, Free Speech, and More

This is the audio version of The Reason Livestream, which takes place every Thursday at 1 p.m. Eastern.

The guest for this week's livestream was Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the environmentalist and anti-vaccine activist who is running for the Democratic presidential nomination. My colleague Zach Weissmueller and I talked with him about the war in Ukraine, COVID-19 policy, gun rights, bitcoin, pardoning Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Ross Ulbricht, and much more.

To watch the video version, go here.

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Comments

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

The politician with a coherent world view wants to get us into WWIII. So that's who I'm reluctantly voting for.

[Mother's Lament]

Watch the video at 12:00

RFK Jr. was saying the US establishment wanted the Ukraine war and deliberately fucked up the deal between Putin and Zelenskyy by sending Boris Johnson.
As he starts to talk about the agreement with Gorbachev and then Yeltsin not to move NATO east, Gillespie gets visibly agitated and switches the topic to fucking gas stoves.

Unbelievable.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

There was a tiny part of me that wanted to think you had over-interpreted this. You didn’t. Yeah, Reason is not a serious magazine any more– if they ever were. Possibly I thought they were because I was younger when I came here, and they were as serious as I was back then.

From my own perspective, as RFK Jr is very possibly a candidate that will get my vote in 2024, I think that he should be hammered on all contentious issues, and I don’t believe in soft-balling politicians. For instance, I think he should be hammered relentlessly on his quip about jailing climate deniers.

But after listening to his rather eloquent speech he made at Porcfest and his remarks about individual liberty, the importance of the Bill of Rights- and how “the constitution wasn’t written for easy times, it was written for hard times” in regards to the use of emergencies to suspend rights, I came off impressed. And specifically, those remarks are in direct opposition to his remarks about jailing climate deniers. I suspect that COVID caused him (like many others, including myself) to take a new, fresh look at just how dangerous government can be, especially when there’s a convergence of interest.

[Mother's Lament]

I never thought that I'd support a Democrat, a Kennedy and a global warmist, but he's looking like the best choice out of both sides of the aisle.

I really, really want to like DeSantis but I think I see a little bit of establishment neocon in him, and sometimes it feels like he's just playing the role of an anti-establishmentarian.

[Nazi-Chipping Warlock]

Not that the CIA will let him become president.

[Gaear Grimsrud]

I voted for Trump in 2020 because was the closest I'd seen to a libertarian in the white house in my lifetime. But I'm liking this guy more as time goes by. He is on the right side of several issues that are important to me. He is not only anti war he has a very deep understanding of how the war party operates. Trump is also anti war but he hasn't spent decades learning how the establishment actually works which leads him to trust the wrong people. RFK has also been a powerful voice in opposition to the whole Covid scam and again he knows who the bad guys are. Trump was mostly anti lockdown but he got rolled by people like Fauci and Birks. Trump got blindsided by the deep state. RFK comes right out and tells us that the CIA assassinated JFK. He doesn't pander to anyone and he won't take a position on a subject he hasn't researched. There are issues I disagree with him on but I'd rather take my chances with an old school liberal than the current alternatives. I'm going to pull a Democrat ballot in the primary and vote for him. I don't expect he'll be on the ballot for the general unless he runs as an independent so I'll probably vote Republican which will probably be Trump. If I bother to vote at all. Living in Illinois it doesn't really matter.

[deesine]

we're so close, so ditto.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

But after listening to his rather eloquent speech he made at Porcfest and his remarks about individual liberty, the importance of the Bill of Rights- and how “the constitution wasn’t written for easy times, it was written for hard times” in regards to the use of emergencies to suspend rights, I came off impressed. And specifically, those remarks are in direct opposition to his remarks about jailing climate deniers. I suspect that COVID caused him (like many others, including myself) to take a new, fresh look at just how dangerous government can be, especially when there’s a convergence of interest.

In this *very same podcast*, he reiterates his support for the statement that corporations who go against the "public interest" should be subject to the "corporate death penalty". And he cited APPROVINGLY when New York State applied the "corporate death penalty" to the Tobacco Institute in the 1990s for spreading disinformation.

Oh, but he didn't call it "spreading disinformation", he called it "spreading lies about the danger of tobacco". So when it's disinformation that he objects to, then the government can use force to silence it; but if it's disinformation that he doesn't object to, like his nonsense about vaccines, then it's a total outrage if and when government force is used against that.

And he did all of that in this very same podcast where you state that "hey, maybe he learned his lesson about government tyranny due to all the COVID nonsense." No, no he didn't. He is still the left-wing authoritarian asshole nut that he was when he was demanding that the Koch brothers be thrown in jail.

Except he said some words about COVID lockdowns that make you swoon, so you ignore all of that.

He is doing what every politician does: He is Monday-morning quarterbacking the decisions of those who were in charge at the time, and claiming "if I had been in charge, things would have been totally different". Sure, sure they would have. Whatever man. In Spring 2020, EVERY SINGLE GOVERNOR ordered a state of emergency as a result of COVID. EVEN SOUTH DAKOTA, which was the only state to never issued a lockdown or mask mandate, even they ordered schools closed and students go to remote learning. I do not believe for one moment that if he had been in charge on any level, he would have done anything different than the rest of the governors did at the time.

So let's review:

In 2020, you put all your principles aside and voted for Trump, because it was so important to you to "stop the left".

And now in 2024, you are poised to put all your principles aside and vote for RFK Jr., who supports some not just batshit insane nonsense, but also authoritarian left-wing nonsense such as single-payer health care and climate crisis nonsense, in order to - what, signal your opposition to the war in Ukraine and your opposition to COVID lockdowns?

So what are the principles that you are willing to stand up for, anyway? That you aren't willing to let a smooth-talking demagogue, whether it is Trump or RFK, talk you out of?

[creech]

He shoots. He scores!

[VULGAR MADMAN]

He’s never scored.

[Mother's Lament]

Not only did he miss the basket but he was playing a different game.

[Mother's Lament]

"In 2020, you put all your principles aside and voted for Trump, because it was so important to you to “stop the left”. And now in 2024, you are poised to put all your principles aside and vote for RFK Jr."

Paul's never once said he voted for Trump to “stop the left”, you deceitful piece of garbage, and it looks pretty clear to me that he's going with a Kennedy and a Democrat this time exactly because he's sticking with his principles.

In fact, based on your rant I'm pretty sure you have no clue what principles even are.

[Mother's Lament]

Have I ever told you how disgusting and repellent, I find you Jeff? I really should do it a lot more.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Don't worry, ML, in a few months when the chattering demagogues of the right-wing infotainment complex have moved on to The Next Big Thing, you'll have completely forgotten about RFK, claim you never really supported him anyway, and then call me names.

[VULGAR MADMAN]

“The next big thing” is what you asshoes are plotting right now.

[Mother's Lament]

Isn't that what you claimed about Trump?

Say, speaking of The Next Big Thing, how's Biden working out for you?

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Maybe Diane/Paul can speak for her/himself.

[VULGAR MADMAN]

Maybe you can stick an M80 up your butt.

[Mother's Lament]

Sure he can, but I still want to take a shot at you regardless. Have I ever told you how disgusting and repellent I find you, Jeff?

[Mother's Lament]

"smooth-talking demagogue... RFK"

Oh wow!

[Mother's Lament]

"RFK Jr., who supports some not just batshit insane nonsense, but also authoritarian left-wing nonsense such as single-payer health care and climate crisis nonsense"

I'm saving this quote for when Jeff's boss at the fifty-cent factory tells him to shill here for global warming and single-payer health care.

[Nazi-Chipping Warlock]

So... next week?

[mtrueman]

"So when it’s disinformation that he objects to, then the government can use force to silence it"

Fraud has long been illegal, and there are penalties against it.

" I do not believe for one moment that if he had been in charge on any level, he would have done anything different than the rest of the governors did at the time."

Sounds like you have nothing to fear from him.

"In 2020, you put all your principles aside and voted for Trump, because it was so important to you to “stop the left”.

There was a lot of overlap between Trump (a New York Democrat) and Sanders (a Vermont independent) on economic and trade policy.

"So what are the principles that you are willing to stand up for, anyway? "

An antiwar stance is the most important thing to look for in a president. The rest is opera.

[Nazi-Chipping Warlock]

I do want to know if he just had a cold for this, or if there's something wrong with him. He sounds like hell.

[Mother's Lament]

Some sort of disease affecting the nerves to the vocal cords called laryngeal dystonia.

[Nazi-Chipping Warlock]

Ah, well, there we go then.

[Mother's Lament]

23:00 Warhawk libertarians.

[Mother's Lament]

30:00 Kennedy is against government censorship in social media, wonders if some types should be regarded as common carriers. Weissmueller is horrified.

[Mother's Lament]

35:00 Kennedy explains the 'jail climate change skeptics' bit and a video clip was shown. I still don't agree with his stance but he didn't say what I was told.

[Mother's Lament]

42:00 Says he changed his opinions and faith in many of the narratives after witnessing the Covid excesses and power grab.

[Mother's Lament]

43:17 "If I'd known what I know now I'd never have made that speech... that statement."

[Mother's Lament]

48:00 RFK's still anti-nuclear power.

He should educate himself on Oliver Stone's excellent new pro-nuke power documentary.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt21376908/

[Nazi-Chipping Warlock]

That's a damned shame. If he was actually educated on the matter, maybe he'd change his mind.

Maybe someone can point out that it's the same people as the Covidians that are opposed to nuclear, and for reasons that have as much "science" behind them as Covid did.

Actually, now that I think about that statement, I guess Covid had a lot of science behind it, given that it was manufactured by scientists. You get the idea, though.

[mtrueman]

"Maybe someone can point out that it’s the same people as the Covidians that are opposed to nuclear,"

It's not that weird. The same people who oppose the government shielding the internet platforms from liability (sect. 230) support the nuclear industry being similarly shielded by the same government. I also learned from the interview that the pharmaceutical companies are also shielded.

[Mother's Lament]

52:00 Clarifies his stance on vaccines. RFK says he isn't against vaccination and vaccines as long as they work.
Weissmueller trots out "gotcha" charts, and is horrified by the plummeting acceptance rate for measles vaccines post-Covid. From pre-Covid 95% acceptance rate it's plummeted all the way down to 93% acceptance.
Weissmueller keeps bringing out the charts, doesn't seem to have understood them.

[mtrueman]

"Weissmueller keeps bringing out the charts, doesn’t seem to have understood them."

What I saw on the video posted earlier was Kennedy claiming that those who had been vaccinated and hadn't received boosters (if I recall) were counted among the 'unvaccinated' on the charts, which I thought was an astonishing claim that neither of the interviewers had any answer for, even though they outnumbered him two to one. Give Kennedy credit, in any case, for his stamina, patience and preparedness.

[Mother's Lament]

1:10:00 RFK Jr. tears into Gillespie for making characterizations of his beliefs based on what he read in the newspapers.

Weissmueller and Gillespie get snooty. This interview is going downhill. The libertarian masks are off and it's establishmentarians against a dangerous misinformation spouting kook. Somewhere Charles Koch is smiling.

[No Beret]

Did he 'clarify' his stance on the Assault Weapons Ban? Since two days ago on NewsNation he said he would sign it into law.
NOT veto.
NOT refuse to enforce if it passed without his signature.
He said he would sign if it passed Congress.

[mtrueman]

"He said he would sign if it passed Congress."

That seems clear to me. What part do you think needs clarification?

[No Beret]

Talk about a political answer!
15:00 Gillespie: "Would you ban so called assault weapons."
RFK Jr. "I'm not going to take away anybody's guns, if, if, if, there was a consensus where Democrats and Republicans voted a majority to do that I would sign the bill."

No difference at all between him and Biden.

[No Beret]

The AWB is gun grabbing commie BS.

[a.heroic.dose]

This guy is so full of shit, conflating the Magna Carta with the Carta Foresta, then accusing King John of privatizing land, like he doesn't understand feudalism and political horse-trading. William I brought the Norman custom of royal forests (think preserves) to England after he conquered it. Then he falls to fucking pieces when asked to name a secretary of state, like we're not entitled to know what he'd do with the fucking presidency if we gave it to him.

Smart move letting him vomit horseshit for an hour, btw.

[No Beret]

Ditto.

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[aajax]

This guy’s own family says he is a disinformation machine. He sounds good, but I take everything he says with a grain of salt.

[[e-mail]]

The interviewers are completely incapable of giving RFK the floor. They speak w such prejudice and don’t give this eloquent man to speak. I find it infuriating.