Carl Hart: Legalize All Drugs Now!
The controversial Columbia neuroscientist, Air Force vet, and author of Drug Use for Grown-Ups believes deeply in life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

In a world where drug legalization efforts are on the march and the pernicious effects of drug prohibition on criminal justice, education, foreign policy, and racial and ethnic communities are being scrutinized like never before, Columbia neuroscientist Carl Hart is breaking bold new ground on how we think about drug policy, substance use and abuse, and individual freedom.
"The Declaration of Independence guaranteed life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for all of us, as long as we don't disrupt anybody else's ability to do the same," says the author of Drug Use for Grown-Ups: Chasing Liberty in the Land of Fear. "That means we get to live our life as we choose, as we see fit. Taking drugs is a part of that for a lot of Americans."
He writes that his use of drugs—including heroin—helps him be a better person. "I do not have a drug-use problem," he declares. "Never have. Each day, I meet my parental, personal, and professional responsibilities. I pay my taxes, serve as a volunteer in my community…and contribute to the global community as an informed and engaged citizen."
Nick Gillespie talks with Hart about all that, his path-breaking research on addiction, why he turned from an ardent supporter of the drug war to one of its leading critics, elitism within the legalization movement, and how he talks with his kids and his students about responsible drug use.
This Reason Interview podcast was taped live on Monday, April 4, 2022, as part of the Reason Speakeasy series, held monthly in New York City. Go here for podcast and video versions of past events.
Today's sponsors include:
- The Novus Society at Donors Trust, which is helping Americans under 40 help create a freer, better world through targeted, effective philanthropy.
- Better Help, which offers affordable, online private therapy with licensed professionals anywhere in the United States. Reason Interview listeners get 10 percent off their first month. Start talking to a therapist within 48 hours by going here.
Editor's Note: As of February 29, 2024, commenting privileges on reason.com posts are limited to Reason Plus subscribers. Past commenters are grandfathered in for a temporary period. Subscribe here to preserve your ability to comment. Your Reason Plus subscription also gives you an ad-free version of reason.com, along with full access to the digital edition and archives of Reason magazine. We request that comments be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment and ban commenters for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
“Obviously, we’ll have an age requirement,” he says, “and we may have to have a competency requirement for these drugs, like a driver’s licence. You may have to take a test or an exam in order to get the licence for permission to purchase individual drugs such as heroin, MDMA, cocaine.”
I’m not sure how that would play out in the real world, but there’s a great deal to respect and admire in Hart’s outspoken stand. He is taking on an orthodoxy, one that involves a multibillion industry of law enforcement and incarceration and that can be a lonely place to be.
These are the magical details at the end of the appendix which you'll find at the back of your packets. We won't be covering those in today's symposium, but we recommend you take time at home to read them, and consider how you might address them. Anyway, moving on...
FIX YOUR ITALICS TAGS, REASON!
My comment:
These are the magical details at the end of the appendix which you'll find at the back of your packets. We won't be covering those in today's symposium, but we recommend you take time at home to read them, and consider how you might address them. Anyway, moving on...
Whew, I saw that pro-liberty talk and thought, whose impersonating Dianne? Glad you cleared that up!
Farmers For Trump, UNITE!
Liberty is worship word.
You may not speak it.
Home income solution to enable everyone to work online and receive weekly payments to bank acc. Earn over $500 every day and get payouts every week straight to account bank. My last month of (res42) income was $30,390 and all I do is work up to 4 hours a day on my computer. Easy work and steady income are great with this job.
.
More information. >> https://dollarscash12.blogspot.com/
Nothing says "liberty" by recommending a driver's license for Heroin.
Fuck off, Shrike. Don't you have some drilling rigs to count?
Great idea, let's have a DMV to hand out drugs. Stand in 3 lines for a couple of hours. take a couple of tests, get your picture taken (badly) and everyone will be drug free eventually.
Uh, you do know you have to go DMV like once a lot of years and then you can drive as much as you want in between right? That's clearly a more liberty friendly approach than the current set up, but hey, Farmers for Trump Unite, amirite? True liberty focuses on the freedom to get government crop insurance or protect the local turkey shoot! Everything else is hippie Democrat nonsense (also 'woke!').
“Like once a lot of years”
Ok, you’re illiterate.
It's a common trope for internet trolls to respond to things with comments like 'you're wrong, I'm not surprised.' They don't offer arguments, they offer trolling.
Learn proper grammar you idiot!
Is it five words or less you're angry about?
The Farmer is a man of few words. He's got cows to milk!
It’s “He has cows to milk “
Groomer.
I realize you're worried about folks grooming your cows, but hey, you can have them for yourself my Farmer For Trump champion.
Enjoy your fate, pedo.
Lol, pathetic!
You know what's pathetic, Shrike? A pedophile troll who runs a dozen sockpuppets just to spam Open Societies agitprop here.
It's just a yellow star. Where's the "inconvenience"?
The unfortunate economic reality is that our current progressive social welfare state socializes the risks and costs of drug use. Those risks and costs include low productivity, disability, mental illness, and homelessness. And as long as those costs are socialized, ultimately, the state ends up regulating and restricting drug use, there isn't really much of a choice.
Drug prohibition is another example of a policy that can ultimately only be addressed in combination: we can legalize drugs only if we abolish disability and medical coverage (at least for drug-related issues). Just like we can open borders only if we abolish most social spending (welfare, public education, etc.).
People who want to legalize drugs and open borders without adopting the related libertarian policies requiring personal responsibility aren't libertarians; such people are simply fools.
"I'd like to endorse liberty, but, but, but!"
Farmers For Trump, Unite!
I give you an A+ for not misspelling
anything this time.
Lol, this from the guy allergic to paragraphs!
Go, Farmer, Go!
More perfect spelling.
That’s a gold star!
I know you're focused on manure spreading, but maybe *try* a paragraph?
You spelled “paragraph”
Correctly!
And yet, you can't make one. Too distracted by...your goats?
Paragraphs are for homo’s
I am endorsing liberty: "end drug prohibition and stop socializing the cost of drug use".
You are endorsing authoritarianism: "end drug prohibition and keep expropriating people to pay for the costs".
That's not a reasonable definition of authoritarianism. By that logic, road construction is authoritarian because driving is legal but it is "expropriating people to pay for the costs".
I engaged in liberty last night. Where should I submit my bill?
I would submit it to whoever you libertied with. Make sure you itemize if you libertied together more than once.
Farmers For Trump, Unite!
This. Again. Yawn.
No one on in power believes you own your own body. Not one.
Legalize drugs!
Decriminalize unhoused people!
Support common sense gun control!
Open all borders!
Support children's right to explore their gender / sexuality!
Vote Democrat (if there is no viable Libertarian candidate)!
One out of six is nothing to be ashamed of.
Uh, yeah. It's amazing the extent the Farmers For Trump have infested this site's comments. Why do they hang out at a libertarian site when they hate it so much?
It’s a corporate-fascist website.
That’s why you like it.
It's mighty strange that a 'corporate fascist website' would be pushing broad drug legalization.
But hey, if you *don't* like it, why are you here so much?
You have to keep the proles in line somehow.
You knew that though.
Letting them enjoy themselves with drugs is kinda rarely how corporate managers want to keep their proles in line. It's sad when Farmers for Trump try to pass themselves off as libertarians, kind of like color blind people coming out of the dressing room with 'hey, this is great, amirite?'
So in addition to everything else, you are also illiterate.
I’m not surprised.
It's a common trope for internet trolls to respond to things with comments like 'you're wrong, I'm not surprised.' They don't offer arguments, they offer trolling.
It’s a common trope for idiots to try to deflect questions they’re too stupid to answer.
Stop talking about yourself that way, 'Madman!' I'm sure you're a valuable person to...well,...maybe,..your mom? Is she out now?
How about you, Queen Amalthea? Who are you, a pot growing, greedy, entitled, privileged drug addict "valuable" to? Do let us know!
"Who are you, a pot growing, greedy, entitled, privileged drug addict "valuable" to?"
Shrike's the only one feeding and watering the kids he's got chained up in his basement, so they sorta depend on him I guess.
I don't see that as sad, I think they are on the right track.
It's way better than when fascists like you pretend to be libertarians in order to sabotage libertarianism.
^
As long as we provide them needle exchanges, safe injection sites and for the love of Mary, don't move that tent you set up on the front steps of the school!
"Hey man, all I need is my electric guitar... and uh, a place to plug it in... can I use your outlet man? Don't harsh my mellow by saying 'no', broheim!"
I'm going to have to find that quote, but one of the greatest on this subject was "The left has a teenager's perception of liberty: Stay out of my room, respect my privacy and hey, when's dinner?"
Letting them enjoy themselves with drugs is kinda rarely how corporate managers want to keep their proles in line.
Even most farmers have read Brave New World.
One excerpt for you:
The service had begun. The dedicated soma tablets were placed in the centre of the table. The loving cup of strawberry ice-cream soma was passed from hand to hand and, with the formula, “I drink to my annihilation,” twelve times quaffed.
Youre really struggling this week shrike. Is everything okay? Next door neighbors with their young kids move away?
Jesse: I want to be allowed to grow hemp on my farm, but those hippies shouldn't be allowed to grow it! Makes 'em hallucinate, like I do with glue...
Ok, groomer.
Lol, every accusation is a confession with these Farmers for Trump (hey, that sheep looks kinda nice, huh Vulgar Madman?).
Laugh while you can.
It’ll be over for your kind soon enough.
Forget Farmers for Trump Unite, Sociopaths Unite!
I’m surprised you spelled that properly.
Thank Jesus for autocorrect I guess.
Go, Sociopath, go!
Spoken like the sociopath you are, Queen Amalthea.
Welcome to California.
I wonder how much it costs to advertise with Reason this way.
You know, how you get multiple articles in a week pretending to be news and commentary that are really just plugs for your book.
This one strikes me as worse than the usual 3-for-1 splurge. Isn't this like the 4th or 5th version of this same interview?
How nice for him. But he is hardly typical and other people do have a drug use problem. They end up on disability, homeless on the street, in mental hospitals, or in low-end jobs. Given our social welfare state, tax payers have to foot the bill for their drug use problem.
Get rid of the social welfare state and all drugs can be legalized. As long as we have a social welfare state, the state also will necessarily set drug policy of one form or another in an attempt to minimize the cost resulting from drug use.
Let's be clear here: given his bio, the guy has been living at taxpayer expense for his entire life, so I wouldn't exactly call him a shining example of someone who has made a net positive contribution to society.
Statists use this cover all the time: "we can't allow personal freedom regarding wearing seat belts, helmets, etc., etc., because of the welfare system where we have to pay for those who do liberty."
Fuck you, slaver.
You found a role model?
How nice.
That's not a "cover", that's the explicit program of progressivism: a nanny state that protects you and covers you. I don't agree with it, but at least it's internally somewhat consistent.
You, Queen Amalthea, on the other hand, are an ignorant, greedy, entitled prick and a useful idiot for people trying to "burn it all down".
Fuck you, Queen Amalthea: you are the handmaiden of slavers, out of greed and ignorance.
+1
"How nice for him. But he is hardly typical and other people do have a drug use problem. They end up on disability, homeless on the street, in mental hospitals, or in low-end jobs. Given our social welfare state, taxpayers have to foot the bill for their drug use problem."
Maybe. He may not be typical, but he's hardly a rare case either. I've met plenty of functional drug users who've never suffered from the issues you listed. Moreover, many of the problems you've listed have only been exacerbated by the War on Drugs.
"Get rid of the social welfare state and all drugs can be legalized. As long as we have a social welfare state, the state also will necessarily set drug policy of one form or another in an attempt to minimize the cost resulting from drug use."
Agree that we should get rid of the social welfare state. But I think you give far too much credit to our politicians. Many of them are not all that interested in minimizing the costs of drug use (maybe in their own families). But they are certainly interested in benefiting from a "War" on Drugs, from using the fear of drug use to get elected. To the benefit of increasing funding to police budgets, government programs, and even some foreign intervention. That and of course it's a continued justification for shredding our fourth amendment rights (among others). The politicians' ability to get away with some of these things has declined, because of the War on Drugs' failure. But I would be skeptical of any "new" attempts to "minimize" the costs of drug use, particularly going in the direction of criminalization.
Therefore while I agree we need to cut back/end government welfare programs alongside ending our War on Drugs. I don't think that justifies continuing the War on Drugs until we end government welfare. I certainly wouldn't vote against any decrim/legalization efforts just because we haven't ended government welfare. If anything continued criminalization of drug users will only lead to more homelessness and more government spending.
After reading the first several dozen pages of Carl Hart's book, I threw it out because it was dull, boring and basically about himself (as he used the word "I" in every other sentence).
Obama had another son?
https://twitter.com/aginnt/status/1514418113512714246?t=FEiZmFzVTT-9vOQ7uFVlvg&s=19
The prison colony called Australia is actually overwhelmed with heart issues and not COVID. I wonder what is causing that…
[Link]
I agree.
Legalize all drugs.
Treat people like adults instead of a bunch of three year olds.
Sane people get tired of government nannies telling what they should do or not do.
And even if someone like Saint George the Floyd overdoses, so what?
It's one less idiot on the planet using up our precious oxygen.
I concur. Make all narcotics legal. Instead of treating people like a bunch of three-year-olds, act like adults. Normal people weary of having government nannies tell them what to do and what not to do. And what does it matter if someone like Saint George the Floyd overdoses? One less idiot polluting our planet's limited supply of oxygen. Medical Coding Services