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IRS Steals $107,000 From Convenience Store Owner, Violating Its Own 'Structuring' Policy

The deposits were too small, so the government cleaned out his bank account.

Institute for JusticeInstitute for JusticeLast October, in response to the outrage provoked by "structuring" cases in which the government took people's money because their bank deposits were too small, the IRS said it would no longer do that unless there was evidence that the money came from an illegal source. In March the Justice Department announced a similar policy for seizures based on structuring, which entails making deposits of less than $10,000 with the intent of evading bank reporting requirements. Yet both the IRS and the DOJ are continuing to pursue the forfeiture of $107,000 that belongs to Lyndon McLellan, the owner of a convenience store in rural North Carolina, based on nothing but suspicion of structuring.

As in other structuring cases, McLellan lost his money because of well-intentioned but bad advice from a bank teller. The teller told McLellan's niece, who usually handled L&M Convenience Mart's deposits, she could save the bank burdensome paperwork by keeping the deposits below $10,000, the reporting threshold. Based on the resulting pattern of deposits, the IRS cleaned out McLellan's bank account a year ago, even though there was no evidence that the money came from anything other than his perfectly legal business, which combines a store with a gas station and restaurant. The Institute for Justice, which is suing the IRS and the DOJ on McLellan's behalf, notes that "the government filed its forfeiture complaint in December 2014, two months after the IRS announced it would not forfeit money in cases like this one." 

This is not the first time the IRS has seemed to violate its new policy, and the contradiction did not go unnoticed. On February 5, IRS Commissioner John Koskinen testified before the oversight subcommittee of the House Ways and Means Committee. Prior to the hearing, I.J. provided legislators with copies of the seizure affidavit and forfeiture complaint in McLellan's case. Without naming McLellan, Rep. George Holding (R-N.C.), a former U.S. attorney, asked Koskinen about the seizure:

Holding: Are you saying that under the new policy, you have to aver that we have probable cause to believe an illegal act is taking place other than the act of structuring?

Koskinen: Yes.

Holding: You sure about that?

Koskinen: That's what I'm advised by the people who run the Criminal Investigation Division.

Holding: The staff pulled for me a case from North Carolina, from my former prosecutorial district, after your policy change. And I've read through the affidavit and the associated documents. There's no allegation of illegal activity, other than the act of structuring...

Koskiken: If that case exists, it's not following the policy. 

Once Koskinen's position came to the attention of Steve West, the federal prosecutor handling the case, the government apologized and gave McLellan his money back. Just kidding. Actually, West was pissed off that someone had dared to share documents from the case with members of Congress. After McLellan and his accountant emailed West video of Holding's exchange with Koskinen, the prosecutor responded with a rebuke:

I'm a bit concerned. At your request, I provided you a copy of the application for seizure warrant, which remains under seal with the Court, and now it appears it has been made available to a congressional committee? I do not know who did that, and I am accusing no one, but it was not from our office and could only have come from your clients. That was certainly not my intent in making this available. Whoever made [the document] public may serve their own interest but will not help this particular case.

Your client needs to resolve this or litigate it. But publicity about it doesn't help. It just ratchets up feelings in the agency.

My offer is to return 50% of the money. The offer is good until March 30th COB.

I.J. notes that the rationale for filing seizure documents under seal is to avoid tipping off the owner, lest he take his money and run. But in this case, the seizure had already happened, and the government had provided the documents to McLellan. "Sealed filings are intended to promote legitimate law enforcement interests," I.J. says, "not to allow prosecutors to evade public scrutiny." And it's more than a little unseemly for a prosecutor to imply that the bad feelings caused by such scrutiny might affect the outcome of a case.

Innocent property owners, deprived of the funds they need to run their businesses and pay their lawyers, often end up accepting deals like the one McLellan was offered, figuring half a loaf is better than none. But McLellan, with pro bono help from I.J., is determined to fight. "It took me 13 years to save that much money," he says, "and it took fewer than 13 seconds for the government to take it away."

Here is I.J.'s video on the case:

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  • Scarecrow Repair||

    If he's offering 50% and allowing 18 days to accept, sounds like he's already running scared. I wonder what happened during those 18 days between him and his bosses? Probably discussing coverup more than ethics or promises.

  • Copernicus||

    I read somewhere that there's a $7billion easter egg just waiting for the IRS to pick up. Maybe better use of their time?

  • Sevo||

    "I read somewhere that there's a $7billion easter egg just waiting for the IRS to pick up. Maybe better use of their time?"

    Unless Buffett settled (it's from 2012), there may be more:
    "Warren Buffett Owes 1 Billion in Back Taxes"
    http://www.frontpagemag.com/20.....ack-taxes/

  • RealityBites||

    Buffet won't pay a cent, and never will. The IRS scum never go after the super rich parasites, rather they quickly drop to their knees and service them.

  • masitna||

    I make up to $90 an hour working from my home. My story is that I quit working at Walmart to work online and with a little effort I easily bring in around $40h to $86h… Someone was good to me by sharing this link with me, so now i am hoping i could help someone else out there by sharing this link... Try it, you won't regret it!......
    www.work-cash.com

  • RealityBites||

    Masitna prostitution is illegal, you should be careful posting your whore ads in public.

  • RealityBites||

    Since they obviously know the store owner is legit it is nothing more than a "treason for profit" protection scam.

    The criminal behavior obviously goes all the way to the top because the money they stole hasn't been returned.

  • Adam330||

    That US Attorney needs to get a subpoena from Rep.Holding.

  • croaker||

    That US Attorney needs to be put out in the middle of the town square on a short stake.

  • Marty Feldman's Eyes||

    My offer is to return 50% of the money. The offer is good until March 30th

    Ha. That's the kind of offer someone makes when they know they're not in the right and they're going to lose, but they hope to get something out of it anyway on the principal of hey, you've got nothing to lose by giving it a shot.

  • prolefeed||

    That could also be the offer from the POV of a statist trying to maximize their theft: "Hmmm, we own $107,000. Defending our money in court will cost us $20,000. That leaves $87,000 if we win. There's a 50% chance we lose and wind up down $20,000. Keeping anything above $33,500 in a settlement leaves us better off. Let's give an opening offer of us keeping $53,500 of our money, and settle for any amount between that and $33,500 we can wrangle."

  • John C. Randolph||

    Thank you for calling it what it is. I'm sick of seeing theft referred to as "confiscation".

    -jcr

  • Swiss Servator, Switzier!||

    I am sure if Comrade Lynch knew of this thing, it would be resolved immediately!

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    By extraditing Mclellan and Holding to Gitmo?

  • ||

    I'm so angry about this, I'm going to burn down some black people's homes and businesses.

    That'll teach 'em.

  • Almanian!||

    Jim, Jim, Jim.....

    *shakes head, but smiles....feeling guilty while doing so*

  • Florida Man||

    No. No. No. When blacks riot they burn black neighborhoods. Lynch is white, so you have to burn white neighborhoods. Of course you may get shot doing that.

  • PapayaSF||

    What good is white privilege if we have to burn down our own neighborhoods?

  • Harold Falcon||

    I'm sure there's some Korean grocery stores or some Indian convenience stores we can torch.

  • Migrant Log Picker||

    "Real Thugs", the movie.

  • John C. Randolph||

    Steve West is a criminal: he should be disbarred, serve a decade in prison, pay restitution to Mr. McLellan equal to double the amount of money he has stolen, and end his life starving to death on the streets, shunned by all who encounter him.

    -jcr

  • Moridin||

    I like your style.

  • Scruffy Nerfherder||

    This

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    You forgot the ass rape. He needs to get ass raped.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    That's your answer to everything.

  • C. Anacreon||

    Last night my 13-year-old son commented that one of his classmates was "butthurt" about something. My wife said "butthurt? what does that mean?"

    I just faintly smiled and changed the subject. No reason to go down that road.

  • Ted S.||

    You mean you didn't take that opportunity to have anal sex with your wife?

    /ducking

  • Robert||

    I thought it meant spanked, or just sore from uncomfortable chairs.

  • croaker||

    It serves to get the message across that you are no longer a member of civilized society.

  • Alan||

    You are far too kind, sir.

  • Juice||

    But publicity about it doesn't help. It just ratchets up feelings in the agency.

    Fuck your feelings and FUUUUUUUUCK YOUUUUUUUUU!

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    But publicity about it doesn't help. It just ratchets up feelings in the agency.

    Classic.

  • Pulseguy||

    As if that is a threat. They already stole all his money. What more do they think they can do to the guy?

  • croaker||

    Prosecute for a federal felony.

  • ||

    It just ratchets up feelings in the agency.

    Feelings of butthurt over their racket being publicly exposed?

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    This is what I've been saying about bad law enforcement. They act as though every law was written by them and if someone violates one, no matter how innocently, they have to take it personally.

    "How dare this guy not only break my law, but then he goes out and tells his representative in Congress? The balls on that criminal scum."

  • ||

    It's called rule of man, dude. It's people you're dealing with, not "laws". And you're dealing with people who gravitated to the position they're in specifically for the power and theft they get from it. Putting up a fight just makes them angry.

    At least he was stupid enough to let his mask slip and be honest about it. Thank Jeebus these people tend to be fucking stupid.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    This guy didn't even break a law.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    If the bank only reports deposits over 10k, how does the IRS even know about this?

    *Listens in earpiece*
    I'm getting reports that the IRS can view all transactions, making this law moot. Back to you, Kent Brockman.

  • np||

    Banks are required to file SARs (suspicious activity reports) and because there are criminal penalties for underfiling, they will just err on the side of overfiling. Most of it is automated, and part of algorithms used is to catch structuring.

  • ||

    That's even better. The feds get to outsource the cost of even more absurd law enforcement that would be prohibitive for them to do merely by, literally, forcing the banks to do it for them.

    The amount of money the government steals from us directly is staggering. The amount more they cost us through shit like this, through regulation, etc. is probably equally if not more staggering. If we were actually able to see true numbers on it, I think people wouldn't believe it, it would be so high.

  • Sevo||

    Episiarch|5.1.15 @ 6:46PM|#
    "That's even better. The feds get to outsource the cost of even more absurd law enforcement that would be prohibitive for them to do merely by, literally, forcing the banks to do it for them."

    Your bank deposits at work!

  • Grand Moff Serious Man||

    Dear Mr. United States Attorney,

    In response to your recent offer I humbly submit a counterproposal:

    First, you go fuck yourself. Second, you pay me my money back plus my legal fees plus an extra consideration for the anguish you have brought upon myself and my family by stealing our money in the first place and dragging us through a lengthy legal process.

    If you are unable to meet both conditions of my proposal I am willing to be gracious and settle for only condition two.

    Sincerely,

    Lynch McClellan

  • BiMonSciFiCon||

    +$107,000 (and then some).

  • John C. Randolph||

    dragging us through a lengthy legal process.

    Correction: It's not a legal process at all. Civil forfeiture is clearly prohibited by the fifth amendment.

    -jcr

  • Paul.||

    This.

  • Florida Man||

    I have a .32 tomcat. Where do I apply for executioner of these scumbags during the apocalypse/rebellion/revolution?

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    You need a bigger gun for executions.

    See here:
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....rized.html

  • Florida Man||

    I was thinking of this guy.

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasily_Blokhin

    The lil Kim is a psycho.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    That was unpleasant reading for a Friday afternoon. You owe me several beers

  • Florida Man||

    Sure thing. What's a sixer of PBR cost nowadays?

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    That's mean.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    I SAID BEER

  • croaker||

    You don't need a gun at all. Rope is low tech, and effective. So is piano wire.

  • Cdr Lytton||

    You'd never get near Blokhin levels with a Tomcat.

  • carol||

    "The teller told McLellan's niece, who usually handled L&M Convenience Mart's deposits, she could save the bank burdensome paperwork by keeping the deposits below $10,000, the reporting threshold"

    After reading that sentence I am literally having chest pains. As the person who handle BSA for my credit union I can't believe that the teller could possibly be that stupid. Why the hell would she risk being arrested and fined just to avoid filing a CTR not to mention the additional penalties her employer faces because she didn't want to take five minutes out of her day to file a report? People never cease to amaze me. As a convenience store they could have avoided the CTR simply by being added to the bank's exempt list. People never cease to amaze me.

  • Florida Man||

    Now, I wonder if you are amazed by people?

  • Alan||

    I recently had to deal with some transactions in a small town in rural North Carolina. Good, kind people who could actually get what they need done - but it was obvious that none of them understood the government paperwork that was required. That was OK, because the people in the local government that oversaw things didn't understand it either, but knew everyone and made the badness go away. Fact is, they were simply too sensible to understand the government paperwork.

    But sometimes it results in conflicts when someone from another branch of government from out of town interferes with how things are done locally.

  • Alan||

    I recently had to deal with some transactions in a small town in rural North Carolina. Good, kind people who could actually get what they need done - but it was obvious that none of them understood the government paperwork that was required. That was OK, because the people in the local government that oversaw things didn't understand it either, but knew everyone and made the badness go away. Fact is, they were simply too sensible to understand the government paperwork.

    But sometimes it results in conflicts when someone from another branch of government from out of town interferes with how things are done locally.

  • Notorious G.K.C.||

    Are there enough lampposts in the country for all the Koskinens and Wests?

    Let's find out.

    /exaggerated for effect

  • ||

    Maybe not, but there's lots of trees.

  • Florida Man||

    Pikes. A Forrest of pikes.

  • Alan||

    I had been thinking fire, but perhaps you are right. Where is Vlad Țepeș when you need him?

  • ||

    I sell rope for that too.

  • Quincy, 12D||

    I can hook you up with some lube in bulk quantities if that's your thing.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    You sound like Francisco.

  • ||

    Who needs you Quincy? Amazon delivers straight to my door

    http://www.amazon.com/Passion-.....005MR3IVO/

  • SweatingGin||

    And Jesse leaves it in your amazon history like two years ago and I'm still mad about it.

  • Marty Feldman's Eyes||

    There's always defenestration.

  • C. Anacreon||

    Coincidence of the week: I was listening to "She Came in Through the Bathroom Window" when I read this.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    Stop it. That's wasteful. Sell them for parts, then sell the remainders for pig feed.

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    What will Syndey see with those parts...

  • Scruffy Nerfherder||

    God damn thieves. Only doing it because they can with no repercussions. They have no moral compunctions about ruining someone's financial future just to get a win on their record.

  • ||

    Government is like a clarion call for sociopaths. Everything about government incentivizes it being staffed by sociopaths. People should not be surprised when it turns out that the way-too-powerful government is staffed overwhelmingly with...sociopaths and other people who want power and don't give the tiniest shit who they have to fuck to get it.

    It amazes me that people are still surprised by this. I expect it at this point.

  • DEATFBIRSECIA||

    "Government is like a clarion call for sociopaths."

    A truer sentence won't be spoken today.

  • Akira||

    "But the government is US! Except when it does bad things; then it's because the racist Republicans have unjustly usurped our power. Or sometimes, corporations steal parts of the government from us. But otherwise, we ARE the government, and you have no right to complain about anything that we do to ourselves!"

    /prog

  • Rich||

    Koskinen: That's what I'm advised by the people who run the Criminal Investigation Division.

    The sleaziness and smugness of this guy is almost beyond belief.

  • ||

    Yeah, I never understood how it was decided that Koskinen was the right fit for the guy to take over at the IRS after the Lerner disaster. His smugness and complete lack of empathy were the complete opposite of what was needed for a person in his position trying to restore faith in this public of operations.

    Swing and a miss with this idiot.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    I thought he had just been there the longest?

  • GILMORE||

    actually, contra my comment below = he was head of Freddy Mac. he wasn't an IRS person who moved up through ranks. he was a professional head-scumbag.

  • C. Anacreon||

    You're doing a heckuva job, Kosky.

  • ||

    Do you actually think they have any candidates (senior enough candidates, of course, this is a bureaucracy) that aren't like that?

  • prolefeed||

    I doubt the ability to feel empathy is especially prevalent among the senior management at a government agency whose job it is to ruthlessly confiscate money that doesn't belong to them.

  • ||

    "Why do you want to work at the IRS?"

    "Well...you take people's money, right? Lots of it? And you're widely despised because you will completely ruin people over small things?"

    "Correct."

    "When can I start?"

    Yeah, their applicant pool must be wonderful.

  • ||

    Well, if they wanted the OPPOSITE of someone with empathy I would say "WELL DONE SIR."

  • croaker||

    Not since I resigned back in 1997, no.

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    The sleaziness and smugness of this guy is almost beyond belief.

    List of materials:

    1. Tar
    2. Feathers
    3. Rail

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    At least you're not advocating ass-raping anymore.

  • DEATFBIRSECIA||

  • John C. Randolph||

    You forgot pitchforks, axe handles, and rope.

    -jcr

  • C. Anacreon||

    If I had a rocket launcher, some sonofabitch would die.

  • Sevo||

    "List of materials:

    1. Tar
    2. Feathers
    3. Rail"

    Too expensive.
    There's a sewage treatment plant in every city where they can go for a swim. Doesn't cost a penny.

  • Derpetologist||

    OT: remember the guy who chewed out a Chick Fil A clerk on video and put it on YouTube? The video got him fired and he's been unemployed ever since:

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/...../70629290/

    He wrote a book about his troubles called A Million Dollar Cup of Water.

    Can't say I feel particularly sorry for him.

  • Derpetologist||

    The original video.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFdPBtxzT6k

    Smug and obnoxious doesn't even begin to describe it.

  • ||

    How can anyone be an asshole at Chick-Fil-A? Everyone there is always so pleasant. It even puts me in a good mood.

  • Trouser-Pod||

    Self-righteousness is a helluva drug...

  • PapayaSF||

    Politics is the manners-killer, as well as the mind-killer.

  • Warrren||

    Way way back when I worked at Domino's Pizza I got yelled at numerous times because of Tom Monahagn's stance on abortion.

    Why yell at me, dipwad? Take it up with him. I did mention to one group that his pro-life stance extended spending millions of his own money funding medicos to go to third-world hell-holes to help the people there. That actually leveled them out a bit, and they didn't bother me any more. Of course, if they were modern SJBs they would have kept right on yelling in my face.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Is that the guy who not only created his own SoCon college, but now is creating a SoCon town?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Yes, it is, looked him up. Will say though his rags to riches story is incredible.

    ""We'll own all commercial real estate," Mr. Monaghan declared, describing his vision. "That means we will be able to control what goes on there. You won't be able to buy a Playboy or Hustler magazine in Ave Maria Town. We're going to control the cable television that comes in the area. There is not going to be any pornographic television in Ave Maria Town. If you go to the drug store and you want to buy the pill or the condoms or contraception, you won't be able to get that in Ave Maria Town."

  • PapayaSF||

    Will he try to block internet access to porn? Good luck with that.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Don't they do this at local libraries?

  • PapayaSF||

    Porn filters are never perfect, and libraries have control over their own computers. That's different from a town, which can't control individual computers without filters, running BitTorrent, Tor, etc.

  • Juice||

  • John C. Randolph||

    First time I head the term "politically correct" was around 1983 or so. I was at a party in the Maryland suburbs, and I asked who was interested in calling for a pizza. Back then, Dominos made a decent product.

    So, as people were talking about what to order, some larval SJW takes it upon herself to proclaim that Domino's isn't "politically correct", and that I shouldn't give them my business. I asked her what she meant by that, and she smugly attempts to shame me for even asking the question, and eventually got around to something about Monaghan contributing to pro-life groups.

    I told her that one of the wonderful things about a market economy is that people can exchange goods and services for mutual benefit without subjecting each other to a fucking inquisition like they would in East Germany or North Korea. She was furious that I wouldn't comply. I told her to go fuck herself, and she got even angrier when none of us would let her bum a slice of the pizza when it arrived.

    -jcr

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    There's a great Seinfeld episode devoted to that.

    I had a similar experience with a CJW who expressed displeasure that a group of classmates were eating a box of girl scout cookies (the girl scouts had, at some time somewhere, some contact with planned Parenthood and therefore now have devil cookies or something).

  • Quincy, 12D||

  • Akira||

    WOW. I'm all for gay rights, but good god, that guy is a douche. Why the hell would he yell at the woman working the drive-thru window? Does he think that she personally decides where the company's donations go?

    I get the feeling that he's a "progressive". So in other words, he's probably demanding $15/hour for fast food workers one minute, then verbally abusing them the next. These people have got to be so mixed up in the brain.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Why the hell would he yell at the woman working the drive-thru window? ... he's probably demanding $15/hour for fast food workers one minute, then verbally abusing them the next.

    Why not? Michael Moore made millions doing such that.

  • ||

    Finally watched it. What a dick. This is the kind of guy who berates waiters. I wouldn't let him in my house.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Wait, are we for firing people for their political speech today?

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    We are for private companies firing people for their political speech always. Most of us, anyway. And this may be the most obnoxious thing you've posted here.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Oh no, should I be fired for it?

  • Slammer||

    Yes. You're outta here!! And you'd better not show your handle around here again or I 'll call the cops!

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Now I have to write a self pitying book, thanks a lot!

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    If you bring bad publicity to your company by your obnoxiousness, I couldn't really criticize them if they did fire you for it.

  • ||

    Bo if you read the link you will see even that prick realized his job loss wasn't due to his politics but to the condesending and smug way he spoke to the low paid girl trapped in the drive in window who felt compelled to smile at him in spite of his liberal asshole attitude.

    Some people might learn from that that being an insufferable prick isn't well though of.

    He claims 17 digital sales so far with the paperback coming out in a few weeks. Maybe it will be cancelled.

    I got a bunch of that schandenfruad, uh,, shaffenfreude, uh.. shakenfrau... whatever,.

    My google is broke but you know what I mean.

  • Warrren||

    Skittlebrau?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Of course he's contrite now, but his judgment wasn't great throughout, right?

  • ||

    He wrote a book about his troubles called A Million Dollar Cup of Water"


    I can only hope that no one ever buys a copy of it.

    It wasn't the cup of water that he might be claiming that cost him a million dollars. It was his smug condesending attitude

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    Apparently it sold 17 copies.

  • John C. Randolph||

    That's hilarious. He probably made less than a penny an hour for the time he spent writing his "poor me" book.

    -jcr

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    If expressing your views to strangers in a smug, condescending way warranted being fired this forum alone would produce a spike in unemployment.

    To me, while he was a bit much he didn't insult, curse or raise his voice, and so didn't deserve to be fired.

  • Contrarian P||

    And when you start your own company, your opinion on who deserves firing will matter.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    He filmed himself being smug, condescending and insulting and uploaded it to Youtube. He didn't post something on an anonymous comment board. The fact that he thought doing so was worthwhile alone would cause me to question his competence to make any kind of reasonable decisions for my company.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Taping and putting up the affair was his worst offense. But seriously, if this had been a 2nd Amendment stalwart who did something similar at a chain with bad gun policy he'd be feted as a hero by many here.

  • ||

    No, taping and putting up the affair wasn't his worst offense Bo. doing it was his worst offense.

    Taping and putting it up was just what got him fired.

    You can tell much about a man's charater by the way he treats "the little people" who can't fight back at him.

    Treating a low paid person trapped in a drive in window like shit just because you can and you know they can't fight back without possibly losing their jobs is the sign of a piece of shit asshole who deserved to lose his job .

    I feel for his kids being on food stamps but if his wife has charater she will divorce the prick and find her kids a better role model.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Again, it's not like he cursed her or yelled at her. He actually told her she was better than where she worked iirc.

    The other day I posted some sites by 2nd Amendment advocates for boycotts of chains that had anti gun policies. In the comments of one were posts by people who said they purposefully went into places like Waffle House, sat at a booth, and when the employee came to take their order they gave a speile about how they were disappointed by the policy and were going to take their business elsewhere.

    Somehow I bet if they were fired for doing that there'd be a different reaction among our more right leaning commenters here...

  • Derpetologist||

    I hereby state for posterity that pro-gun people who hassle clerks over their employers' policies are rude morons.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Don't be such a delicate flower. Employees get 'hassled' if by that you mean having someone lecture them politely about the dumbest things, all the time. I'm betting that young woman laughed about this guy on his soapbox the moment he pulled away.

  • Derpetologist||

    Forget the politics of it. He filmed himself being rude to someone who did nothing to deserve it. That is epic stupidity.

    And no, I don't think a pro-gun person who did something similar would be celebrated here. It would be unlikely to happen anyway because pro-gun people are smart enough to realize that the clerk is not responsible for the policy.

    Your but-what-about game is getting old. Try something else.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Can you give me the time in the video where he's being 'rude?'

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    You really are that retarded, aren't you?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    You're not going to go 'the whole tape is rude!!!' I hope.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    The first half was smug and self righteous. The second half was rude.
    Happy?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    My you're precise!

  • Derpetologist||

    Did you catch the part where he said "I don't know how you live with yourself and work here..."?

    I'd call that rude.

    https://youtu.be/VFdPBtxzT6k?t=1m50s

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I guess you're more delicate than that, because I wouldn't think that rude if you directed it at me. I'd think you were upset at my employer and full of yourself, but rude?

  • Derpetologist||

    If you aren't playing dumb, you are really bad at reading between the lines.

    When you tell someone "I don't know how you live with yourself and work here", you are implicitly telling them: this is a bad company and you are a bad person for working here.

    Insults are usually not as explicit as "your music is bad and you should feel bad".

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "this is a bad company and you are a bad person for working here."

    But given he explicitly tells her she's better than where she works I'd take that more as he's trying to convince her her employer is bad, not her.

    If I told you 'you're girlfriend is just mean, evil mean, you could do better. I don't know how you can live with yourself sticking with her' you'd take that as insulting you rather than your girl? I wouldn't.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    But look, it's pointless to argue about the lines that strike us differently as crossing into rude. I'll rest at the idea that if he'd cursed her, yelled at her or personally insulted her then we'd all agree that's rude. As rude goes if his behavior was so it's pretty mildly so in comparison, and so I don't think firing was deserved. But as they say, YMMV.

  • Contrarian P||

    If it's pointless to argue about it, why do you keep doing it to the point of absurdity?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    You're pathetic in your tribalism. It's not like I'm arguing by myself here.

  • Contrarian P||

    No, you really are arguing by yourself. That sad thing is you can't see that. The fact that you throw out terms (tribalism) that you don't appear to understand doesn't help. You state that it's pointless to argue about the threshold for calling someone rude, right after you have been doing just that for many posts. Pointing out your logical inconsistency isn't tribalism, sorry.

    I read your comments and it more often than not appears that you have some pathologic need to have the last word, carrying on posting way after there's nothing further to be discussed. If there's a thread that goes on forever and ever, it's more likely than not that you'll have about a hundred comments in it, typically directed against multiple people (as seen above). Seriously, man, learn to let things go that don't matter. You'll be a better person and much more well liked for it.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    It's pure tribalism. You're not bothered when Derp answers me over and over, but my answering him is a sign of pathology. You're just signalling you're one of the boys with no other principle in sight.

  • Contrarian P||

    You are the one who stated that arguing was pointless, not him. If he has no self awareness and continues arguing, that's nowhere near as bad as you realizing that you're doing something stupid but continuing right on doing it, then doubling down by flinging silly accusations against someone who points out your obvious fail. And yes, realizing that you are engaged in futility for literally no reason but doing it anyway is pathological. Do you get a prize for winning these online jousts of yours?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    And how many replies did I make to him after that comment?

  • Contrarian P||

    He didn't reply to you. I have no doubt whatsoever that had he done so, you would have gone right on. You did carry on arguing below about the same subject with Playa Manhattan after you posted that comment, so my point stands. And by the way, thanks for proving it.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "He didn't reply to you. "

    And I stopped to him.

    "You did carry on arguing below about the same subject with Playa Manhattan after you posted that comment"

    You mean the one where he barged in to say my position showed I wasn't a human being?

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    Yep, Bo. Everybody hates you and it's absolutely their shortcoming, not yours.

    Serious question...

    Can you name 3 regulars here that don't despise you?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    So you can add them to some list?

    I get along with lots of people here. Just downthread you can find me and several posters having a polite discussion with some disagreement even (!) about federalism. No one is insulting anyone, just talking about things that matter to libertarians.

    But just look at your question. It doesn't strike you as 'schoolyard?' Nobody likes you here!!! Please Francis.

    But more importantly, of course just showing up here and disagreeing with people will get a lot of people to hate you. If you went on any site that leaned differently than you do and you said the same things you said here regularly, you'd have lots of regulars there irrationally angry at you. Would that be some kind of sign something is wrong with you? Please.

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    Bo, it's been made perfectly clear to you on hundreds of occasions...

    You aren't despised for your positions. You are despised for how you interact with people.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Why don't you answer this part Francis:

    "If you went on any site that leaned differently than you do and you said the same things you said here regularly, you'd have lots of regulars there irrationally angry at you. Would that be some kind of sign something is wrong with you?"

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    Not an apt analogy.

    A. I wouldn't go to a site to play contrarian, simply so I can argue, as you obviously do.

    B. We've already established it's not your positions. It's your complete inability to interact with people socially and your utter lack of self awareness in this area.

    C. There is no one here that's "irrationally" angry with you. Everyone here who hates you has very rational reasons for doing so.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    A. Most of the disagreements I have with people here are instances where I'm defending a Reason writer from some commenter who is disagreeing with them. So who's the contrarian there?

    B. & C. Swoosh!

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    And this is why you don't qualify as a human being. This is why nobody likes you. This is so obvious to anybody that has a human soul.

    A rich white (MALE!) prick upset about a corporate policy goes and berates a (FEMALE!) low level drive through cashier about it. To make himself feel righteous.

    Not that the labels actually matter, but tell me more about feminism please, "Bo".

    You throw around the term "sociopath" very loosely. Here's the litmus test. This video right here. Care to reevaluate your position?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    This guy talks to the young woman with tons more politeness and respect than the way you and your 'buds' here talk to people all the time. And I love your pathetic attempt to try to do some feminist judo: it's always funny when people try to use an idea that's so foreign to them, one they know through the caricatures they make of it daily, to try to throw it at someone who actually takes it somewhat seriously. You're as funny getting on a high horse than a monkey with a hat on it doing the same.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    I (and my buds, as you put it) talk disrespectfully to people who fucking deserve it. Does she? A yes or no will do.

    Does a young woman who is just trying to do her entry level job deserve to be insulted and heckled by a smug ass rich dude and then have to suffer the consequences and unwanted publicity of having that man putting the video put on the internet? Did you hear her say that she was uncomfortable being filmed? Did you?

    This is why your schtick is tired. This is how you've been filtered by 75% of the readers here. This shit is SO obvious to anyone with a working brain. You look at that video and don't see a problem with it, even though there is a very obvious power imbalance between those two people. Do you think you might be a little bit biased? Maybe just a little?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "I (and my buds, as you put it) talk disrespectfully to people who fucking deserve it."

    Wow, talk about self-righteousness as a drug!

    "a very obvious power imbalance between those two people"

    Again, you sound just like the SJW's you supposedly mock. When you were a teenager didn't you ever work a service job? People will come by, RICH and OLDER people even (gasp!), and lecture you as a captive audience on things. My experience is that rather than being scared by such an evil 'power imbalance' tend to laugh their tails off with their other young co-workers at the uptightness of the customer.

    Let's talk about your schtick and how it really conflicts with mine. You're angry and arrogant, and the internet draws people like yourself to come on comment boards and heap two minute hates on people you read about in two paragraph news story. You're better than them and you can vent on them, it's like why people love watching shows like Judge Joe Brown. And nothing ruins that high like someone who shows up whose not angry, not looking to insult someone they don't know based on a brief story, who suggests that perhaps, just perhaps, life is more complex than the easy, angry narrative that internet news sources thrive on.

    So I can look at a guy like this and say 'seems full of himself, sure, but he doesn't curse or yell at the girl, seems a bit much to focus ire at him or to cheer his firing.' But that's what you really hate, someone whose not as petty and angry as yourself.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    Dude, I'm rich, but I'm not old. But I haven't forgotten where I came from. That's how empathy works. To me, it's quite obvious: never treat strangers like that.

    The only possible conclusion is that you agree with that guy's actions, because the ends justify the means. Just admit that you hate Chick-Fil-A. It's so easy. Just say it.

    But Bo, I have a serious question for you. You like coming to Reason, and I don't have any right to stop you. None. But I sure feel compelled to convince you to leave, based on your behavior. But I'm not sure I have all of the facts that I need to make such a determination.

    I had a beef with another commenter, and I was pretty harsh, and then some things came to light of which I was previously unaware. My irritation turned to guilt.

    Bo, am I dealing with a full deck here, or am I being unfair to you? You are obviously intelligent, but lack a certain social awareness. Should I hold you accountable, or is it out of your control? This isn't meant to be insulting, I just want reliable information.

  • ||

    Bo and intelligent shouldn't be used in the same sentence. He's a gov-sucking troll that wants to argue in bad faith, use straw men and badger people that engage in serious debate. He's the human equivalent of a turd that refuses to go down with the second flush.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "He's a gov-sucking troll"

    If you can find one instance where I took a position advocating more government, then bring it forth. Otherwise, you should stop making up things to impress your friends here.

  • ||

    It's not about advocating for "more" government, it's accepting that government in its current iteration that's enough to make my stomach turn. And the same goes for most people here, dumbass.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    If I had my druthers we'd have a government smaller than the Articles of Confederation would yield.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I eat at Chik-Fil-A all the time. I get the Spicy Deluxe, extra pickles, with pepperjack, and smother it with hot sauce. They're breakfast is great (I actually like their sausage biscuits the best.) They've got a great, almost incredible business model. There's no fast food place I can think of with as good of consistent customer service as them. So, no, I've got no 'beef' with them.

    I honestly don't see his behavior as as bad as you do. People honestly disagree over whether someone's behavior crossed a line into 'rude' all the time. You use words like 'berate' which I take at it's meaning of 'to yell or criticize someone in a loud or angry way' and I look at that tape and say 'this guy is a bit much, and yes, taping her when she says she's uncomfortable is rude, but he's not yelling at her, being loud with her or even criticizing HER, he's complaining about company policy, which is really, really normal and not at all scarring to anyone who's worked at a place like that.'

    But look, you're not 'seriously' asking anything. You're last paragraph shows that, well, that or either a lack of self and social awareness that might explain why a person (even a 'rich' person like you! [who gets on the internet and anonymously talks about how 'rich' they are?]) would spend so much time with, and be wracked with such concern over the, well being of with this 'internet family' than his actual one.

  • ||

    I eat at Chik-Fil-A all the time

    You're a regular Rosa Parks.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I sit in the back actually.

  • ||

    You probably do because you think it atones for some past sin of a grandfather you never met, dumbass.

    And you probably post about it on Twitter thinking it will score you some SJW ass at the next (non-Greek) social gathering.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    No, because the booths up front are near the lines, the trash receptacles and the condiment bar.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    First of all, I question your taste for not getting their house sauce. It's almost like you've never been there before.

    The guy in the video is taking out his rage on the wrong person. Do you come home and kick your dog (or alleged Jewish girlfriend) in the face if you've had a bad day at school? And then do you say it was "just a bit much"?

    And this is just another checkmark in the "yes" column for me in regards to your probable social/mental disorders. You have a string of non-sensical phrases whenever you're confronted for your shitty behavior. Apparently, one of them is to accuse people of family neglect whenever they criticize you. Which is prima facia retarded. There are so many other things you can say that would be more insulting, but because you're so selfish and insecure, you haven't bothered to learn what they are. So you come back with "gamergate" "teenage girls" etc etc.

    And I'm not talking anonymously here. Probably 50% of the commenters here know who I am in real life. I'm not bragging about my net worth. I'm making it clear that I understand both sides, and the rich asshole is in the wrong. Objectively wrong.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    What you fail to understand here, "Bo", is that there are wonderful people commenting here, most of whom are incredibly accomplished. But that doesn't really matter; what matters is ideas and behavior. People are here to learn from one another. One of the most respected commenters here was a Navy vet who died in a homeless shelter (RIP), and I learned a lot from him. You, on the other hand, are here for the wrong reasons. You have major insecurities, and your misguided self-therapy is rabble rousing here. There is an incredible resource sitting right in front of you, and you piss on it. That is why I hate you.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "There is an incredible resource sitting right in front of you,...That is why I hate you."

    In all seriousness (you like that?), there is something sad and wrong with you to be so emotionally involved in an online political chatroom that you'd say these things. Reason's interesting, and I actually do learn a thing or two and have fun expressing myself here, but 'incredible resource?' Again, self righteousness can be a powerful drug!

    And I don't hate you, you're just a guy who types stuff on a board I happen to come to. Spend some time with your wife and kids guy, I bet they'd appreciate it, and you'd find an actual incredible resource there, and one not ginning up hatred at strangers.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Chik-fil-a sauce is nasty.

    I accuse you of family neglect because you spend so much time here and you claim to have a family. When do you spend time with them? When I come on here in the mornings, you're there. Evenings, ditto. And into the nights. Especially since you took it upon yourself to police the community making it safe from contrarians like me.

    And yes, what this fellow did is exactly like kicking a dog or woman in the face. And you accuse me of dishonest, emotionally laden argumentation. Sheesh.

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    And yes, what this fellow did is...

    Textbook.

  • Trouser-Pod||

    Now, hold on, there. If Bo is saying he wouldn't have fired this guy, I'm thinking we should all clamor for employment in his company.

    I mean, if you can go to fast food establishment with the sole intent of harassing a worker there for nothing other than a single fact about the owner's political stance on one subject (and how you think it affects his/her company), do nothing other than order a free item to get them to serve you (and give you access to their personnel), be as smug and condescending as you can muster, AND record the interaction and post it on the internet's largest video sharing service-and not lose your job, per what Bo has said...

    'Cause, really...why would any current or potential customers be turned off by that behavior? Why would they ever question his perceptions or competency?

    Shit, we should all be so fortunate!

  • Sevo||

    WIH do some people engage this steaming pile of shit? Do you really think this time will be different? Do you think YOU are the one smart enough to correct his mendacity?
    Man, there are some people here who I know are bright and competent and then they go and try to prove the otherwise by engaging the asshole known as Bo.
    Oh, and Bo? Fuck off.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    It's a process, Sevo. All will be revealed in due time.

  • ||

    He's like the broke back mountain commenter.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    If I were ever, ever to think that being on the receiving end of vitriol here were my problem, I can always thank Sevo for reliably showing up and joining in. Because there is no more wretched, angry, psychopathic person than Sevo. On a very late night thread months ago I saw him just over-the-top curse and savage a half dozen posters because, I kid you not, they questioned his assertion that Jesus was not a historical figure. When Sevo is considered normal and he thinks you're a jerk, you're doing something correct, no doubt.

  • ||

    Time is a flat circle, Sevo.

  • Los Doyers||

    THAT'S MY IP.

  • Suellington||

    How do you filter people here? Serious question. I would like to do so.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    Reasonable: For Chrome.

  • Francisco d'Anconia||

    If you are using Chrome, download the "Reasonable" app and hit "filter" next to the offender's name. There are similar apps for Firefox and there is a more universal app through Grease Monkey called Greasonable (sp?). You also get a bunch of cool functions that, once you have, you won't be able to live without.

  • Suellington||

    Thanks. I am on the I device though so unfortunately no go with chrome and Firefox. I miss Firefox.

  • prolefeed||

    Bo Cara Esq.|5.1.15 @ 7:44PM|#

    If expressing your views to strangers in a smug, condescending way warranted being fired this forum alone would produce a spike in unemployment.

    If by "your views" you meant "Bo Cara's views" and by "spike" you mean, "a rise of one person", then sure.

  • John C. Randolph||

    Cry me a million dollar cup of water.

    -jcr

  • Karl Hungus||

    OT: remember the guy who chewed out a Chick Fil A clerk on video and put it on YouTube? The video got him fired and he's been unemployed ever since:

    You know what would be super-awesome? If Chick-fil-A offered him a job.. Nothing fancy, mind you, but maybe evening shift at the drive-thru window.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    +1

  • Derpetologist||

    That...is BRILLIANT!

    His apology video is full of weasel goodness:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la7hQR_Y6cQ

  • Karl Hungus||

    Apology Tour '15!

    I imagine losing your job and being publicly humiliated in one feel swoop is bad enough. I imagine the pain is compounded when the job you lost paid 200 grand a year. Those aren't easy to come by.

  • Derpetologist||

    Aside from the holy roller nonsense, I really liked this comment:

    When you compare this guys situation with the owners of Memories Pizza in IN, you can clearly see the difference between selfless Conservative Christians and selfish Liberal Elitists. When one of our brothers or sisters in Christ are attacked by the Devil (white-liberals), we rally around them in order to build them back up. We raised almost a million dollars to help them through their hour of need. When this trendy, elitist douche bag martyred himself for the Devil's cause, not a single white-liberal elitist stepped up to help him out, and none ever will. Choose your friends, wisely.
  • Karl Hungus||

    Aside from the holy roller nonsense, I really liked this comment:

    His overarching point, that liberal elitists are only looking out for Number One, is spot on. But yeah, the holy roller stuff kinda dampened it for me, too.

  • Derpetologist||

    You'd think Bill Maher or someone like that would give the guy some money to help him out. He took one on the chin for his team and they abandoned him.

  • Karl Hungus||

    I just read a story yesterday that Suge Knight is hoping that his pal Floyd Mayweather will post his $10 million bond for him after he wins the fight tomorrow night. I think this is a more likely bet than some Hollywood liberal pitching in to get this douchebag back on his feet.

    There's no "i" in "team," but when you stop to think about it there's no "we" in "liberal," either.

  • C. Anacreon||

    We raised almost a million dollars to help them through their hour of need.

    Well, that's their opinion. According to a prog friend, everyone who donated to that pizza place's gofundme was a gay-hating bigot, not supportive people who were trying to help out small religious businesses that got caught sideways in the crusade.

    And apparently, gofundme will now take down any crowdfunding that's done to support businesses hurt because of not wishing to bake cakes/pizzas/etc for gay weddings. They dropped the crowdfunding for the bakery in Oregon who were fined $135,000 by the state for not wanting to bake a gay wedding cake.

  • PapayaSF||

    As someone suggested earlier, this is a great opportunity for Glenn Beck or someone to set up a competing site that does allow such crowdfunding.

  • Porque Pig||

    If the Memories Pizza people had gone to a gay wedding, screamed at them telling them they wouldn't make pizza for them, and then posted the video of this event to YouTube, they wouldn't have gotten a dime from conservatives or anyone else.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    I like pork on my pizza. Fuck, you really shit the bed last night. Tough day at work?

  • Viscount Irish, Slayer of Huns||

    I feel sorry for his kids and wife.

  • Paul.||

    This is the special kind of reaming you get with an income tax.

  • ||

    That's the bad kind of reaming, right? Not the good kind?

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    Did you read about any fracking fluid? No, you didn't. Question answered.

  • GILMORE||

    Koskinen is certainly a contender for biggest douchebag on the planet.

    I guess that's a plus when you're bucking for promotion at IRS

  • Trouser-Pod||

    bucking for promotion

    +1 pederast Hanrahan

  • Warrren||

    The income tax, lynchpin of the progressive ideal.

    Without the money generated by it they could not pay for most of the idiocy they dream up. Plus it allows them to control through fear a whole nation of people and destroy whoever they wish.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Why do looters attack local stores?

    If you said 'because they're close and looters, being impulsive, target the easiest target, well of course you're wrong. Here's Slate to tell you the real answer:

    " To me, the riots reflect fury not just at the police, but at the constraints of the ghetto’s retail economy, where the poor pay more. As I see it, the indignity of being roughed up by the cops is of a piece with not being able to afford to shop in your own neighborhood."

    http://www.slate.com/articles/.....ainst.html

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Burning and looting area stores is the sure way to bring those local prices down that 2.5%!

  • See Double You||

    Those store owners could have lowered their prices to a living price had they not wasted it on profits.

    /Slate

  • Warrren||

    And all that money wasted on advertising!

  • PapayaSF||

    "How dare you charge higher prices simply because you have to pay more in taxes, being in the city, and have to pay more in insurance? We'll show you, by raising your insurance rates!!"

  • Porque Pig||

    Insurance usually doesn't cover damage from riots.

  • PapayaSF||

  • See Double You||

    Is there any reason for you, Tulpa, to be the constant contrarian?

  • tarran||

    Deep rooted inferiority complex would be my guess.

  • HeteroPatriarch||

    You already poisoned the well in this thread, fuckhead.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    You can get over it I'd bet, if you try.

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    You just don't get it.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I notice you have a linked handle now. What spurred that big change?

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    Follow the link. Some people have really bad taste, but that's not my problem. I can't remember how you put it exactly, but "I'm just here to state my position".

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    And I don't mean that question in a rude way, so please don't be upset about it...

  • Plàya Manhattan.||

    I'm upset that people think Chipotle is good.

  • SweatingGin||

  • Akira||

    My god... I made a few snarky comments about how the progs would probably try to blame the riots on corporations, but I was just joking. Now it's reality. Holy fuck.

  • Porque Pig||

    Why do looters attack local stores?

    Think globally, act locally.

  • Sevo||

    Porque Pig|5.1.15 @ 9:40PM|#
    "Why do looters attack local stores?
    Think globally, act locally."

    Oh, good!
    Both insufferable assholes in one thread!

  • See Double You||

    Think globally, act locally.

    I actually liked that one.

  • PapayaSF||

    OT: Al Sharpton’s latest bright idea: Have the Justice Department ‘take over policing in this country’

    Clearly there will be perfect justice if the Department of Justice runs all police departments!

  • Warrren||

    It's like the TSA only they can come into your house!

    Fantastic idea, Al!

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Given how awful many local agencies are I can't say there might not be net loss there.

  • ||

    See there, I was just thinking about making a joke about you loving the idea because you hate federalism like all progs. Then I decided "Nah, even Bo couldn't honestly believe this is a good idea." See what I get for giving you the benefit of the doubt?

  • Warrren||

    The opposite of a warm tingly feeling?

  • Jordan||

    I believe he was joking.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I've always been up front that I'm not the 'states rights' kind of libertarian. Local and state governments are as likely to be the enemies of liberty as the Feds. In fact, since incorporation of the BOR the federal courts v state/local governments are where freedom has found the most significant victories.

  • See Double You||

    I agree with you, Bo, to a certain extent, but I think you're playing with fire.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Don't get me wrong, I see the theory of why state and local is generally better. Voting with your feet and such. But the Founders seemed also right when they wrote about national attitudes often being better than local prejudices and extremes.

  • See Double You||

    But the Founders seemed also right when they wrote about national attitudes often being better than local prejudices and extremes.

    And they were no doubt correct. If anything, the States' police power is quite a scary one, and I'm happy the Fourteenth Amendment was passed, in part, to curb its abuses. But the ever-increasing scope of the federal government's role in traditional State-power realms should, at most, be met with guarded optimism.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I agree. It's a Scylla and Charbydis kind of thing.

  • Jordan||

    I thought it was like Syphilis and Chlamydia.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Equally bad way to sail.

  • See Double You||

    Yes. I think we could also agree that federalism (and its opposite) is, to we libertarians, merely a means and not an end; the end being, of course, liberty.

    Whichever achieves this best is what I want, and, admittedly, it is not always clear which choice it should be.

  • ||

    SDY: I agree completely with your first paragraph. The only thing I would add to your second is "long term". The Nazgul might give you what you want today, but that's no guarantee that the issue has been resolved. They may rule that a state can't do x but that doesn't mean Congress can't. And they defer to Congress much more than to state legislatures(for completely predictable reasons).

    I'll also add this.The most despotic regimes of any era have been the ones where power was centralized. Places where power was spread out have generally enjoyed much more freedom.

  • ||

    Problem is, the way most people view are current system, the check on power between the central and more local governments only goes one way. So the SCOTUS has the ability to invalidate state or local laws, but states can't stop federal over reach.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I agree in this way, I'm fine with a powerful federal court system enforcing prohibitions on states, but what we also need is a federal court system that takes the idea of enumerated powers of the federal government seriously as well.

  • ||

    Then what you want is the federal government to limit its own power. Which is about as likely as me shooting a unicorn in my bathroom.

  • Private FUQ||

    Amazingly all they would have to do is actually follow the constitution we already have but since they can't seem to follow it I'm not seeing how giving the feds more power locally is in any way a good idea.

  • Notorious G.K.C.||

    I once shot a unicorn in my pajamas...what it was doing in my pajamas I don't know.

  • Juice||

    but states can't stop federal over reach.

    They can and have.

  • Viscount Irish, Slayer of Huns||

    Given how awful many local agencies are I can't say there might not be net loss there.

    You have to be fucking kidding me, Bo. A lot of the problems with local agencies are actually the result of federal government policy incentivizing their behavior. The feds outlawed drugs and launched The WOD after all, the DEA, ICE, and the FBI engage in some of the worst policing abuses, and if you try to centralize the duties currently carried out by local police agencies over a nation as large and diverse as the US, you're going to end up with massive inefficiencies, even beyond those currently extant in local police departments.

    The only benefit I can see is that there's not that much collective bargaining at the Federal level so it might lessen the power of the cop unions. Other than that, it's all bad.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    You act like no states did or would have outlawed these things sans the feds doing it. And the feds restrain a lot of what they would be doing that would be pretty bad.

  • ||

    How enthusiastic would states be about drug laws if they had to pay the full cost of enforcement themselves? Tyranny gets real expensive when you can't print your own money.

  • SweatingGin||

    Keep going! think smaller!

    How enthusiastic would the individual be to pay for drug enforcement?!? Readers digest at $12 / year? OR the terrorize druggies fund?

  • Jordan||

    Yet both the IRS and the DOJ are continuing to pursue the forfeiture of $107,000 that belongs to Lyndon McLellan, the owner of a convenience store in rural North Carolina, based on nothing but suspicion of structuring.

    Maybe american socialist can reassure Mr. McLellan that his property rights only serve to benefit the wealthy anyway. Better that money goes to its rightful owners at the U.S. Treasury.

  • Warrren||

    Render unto Seizure...

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    That's a good one. Gonna have to seize it.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    That is a good one, yes.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    OT: So that rioter kid got $500,000 bail for misdemeanors and the 6 cops charged w/ felonies? Four get $350,000 and two get $250,000.

  • ||

    There's no double standard. Don't be ridiculous.

  • Warrren||

    Higher bail amounts would have just been piling on.

  • sarcasmic||

    At least they were charged. Be thankful for small miracles.

  • ||

    Who is most likely to skip bail and not show up for court ?

    That is the purpose of varying bail amounts I thought ?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I'd argue both of these bail amounts are ridiculously high. Those cops aren't going to flee, and that kid's offense to bail ratio is absurd.

  • Porque Pig||

    Sounds like an 8th Amendment case for Bronco Bama's administration to pursue.

    Oh, wait.

  • Notorious G.K.C.||

    "WASHINGTON — The lead attorney representing the Obama administration admitted before the U.S. Supreme Court on Tuesday that if the court were to rule in favor of making same-sex marriage a constitutional right, it would create a religious liberty "issue" for faith-based schools and institutions, who could be at risk of losing their tax-exempt statuses....

    "Justice Samuel Alito followed up and asked a pointed question regarding whether religious schools could have their tax-exempt status revoked for not providing same-sex couples with housing. Alito referenced the 1983 Bob Jones University Supreme Court case, which ruled that the Internal Revenue Service could revoke the school's tax-exempt status for refusing to accommodate interracial married couples with housing....

    ""You know, I don't think I can answer that question without knowing more specifics but it's certainly going to be an issue," Verrilli stated. "I ­­ I don't deny that. I don't deny that, Justice Alito. It is, it is going to be an issue.""

    http://www.christianpost.com/n.....t8h6kTd.99

  • Porque Pig||

    What on earth does the Obama administration have to do with this case, anyway? Isn't it between the states and the gay couples?

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Amicus curiae.

  • Porque Pig||

    Really? I know third parties can file briefs to the court, but didn't realize they get precious oral argument time before the court.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I think the plaintiffs asked that their allotted time be divided and part given to the feds.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    I'm guessing it's only because it's the Executive sticking his nose in. From SCOTUS Blog:

    Argued. For petitioners on Question 1: Mary L. Bonauto, Boston, Mass.; and Donald B. Verrilli, Jr., Solicitor General, Department of Justice, Washington, D. C. (for United States, as amicus curiae.) For respondents on Question 1: John J. Bursch, Special Assistant Attorney General, Lansing, Mich. For petitioners on Question 2: Douglas Hallward-Driemeier, Washington, D. C. For respondents on Question 2: Joseph F. Whalen, Associate Solicitor General, Nashville, Tenn.
  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Some comments from Townhall.com's article on the Baltimore cops being charged:

    not like furguson at all. much much worse. ferguson used a grand jury which found no probable cause to indite. they have now moved past that construct. you can bet the word came down from the white house to immediately get the black female s.a. to move forward with this. they were caught off guard in ferguson but not in baltimore.

    every white cop working in any city with dems and blacks in charge needs to quit today. tens of thousands of them. work three part time jobs in wyoming

    That was quick! How long did this "investigation" take? Two days? How much would like to bet that all the D.A. staff attorneys, as well as D.A. Mosby herself, is black? Anything to railroad some cops.

    More appeasements at the expense of these officers, Illegal arrest?? please, How long will this BS continue until the backlash crushes these parasites and stops this BS once and for all. What about the witness who saw this AH bouncing off the van walls trying to hurt himself? what about the rights of these police officers?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

  • ||

    It's really too bad that policeone comments are no longer visible to non-members. The Thin Blue Line must be frothing with rage.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    For those who might be interested, a National Institute for Justice research paper on police attitudes on abuse of authority.

    Sample: In trying to understand why incidents involving force escalate to the level of excessive force, the authors asked officers in the sample a series of questions about their attitudes toward the use of force and the behavior of fellow officers. Responses show that most police officers in the United States disapprove of the use of excessive force. Nonetheless, a substantial minority believed that officers should be permitted to use more force than the law currently permits and found it acceptable to sometimes use more force than permitted by the laws that govern them.8 The officers revealed these beliefs in responses to several questions (see exhibit 1). More than 30 percent of the sample agreed or strongly agreed that police officers are not permitted to use as much force as is often necessary when making arrests. Almost 25 percent agreed or strongly agreed that, to control a person who is physically assaulting an officer, it is sometimes acceptable for the officer to use more force than legally allowable. Moreover, more than 40 percent agreed or strongly agreed that always following the rules is incompatible with getting their job done.

  • Notorious G.K.C.||

    "a substantial minority"

    Plus, I would guess, some cops who agree with the substantial minority but won't acknowledge it to some nosy researcher.

  • Viscount Irish, Slayer of Huns||

    Plus, I would guess, some cops who agree with the substantial minority but won't acknowledge it to some nosy researcher.

    I'd also guess a lot of cops who don't agree themselves would nonetheless protect cops who engaged in the behavior they might be uncomfortable with. One cop engages in police brutality and the rest, even if they wouldn't engage in that brutality themselves, protect him out of a misplaced sense of 'cop loyalty.'

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    More than 80 percent of police surveyed reported that they do not accept the “code of silence” (i.e., keeping quiet in the face of misconduct by others) as an essential part of the mutual trust necessary to good policing (see exhibit 3). However, about one-quarter (24.9 percent) of the sample agreed or strongly agreed that whistle blowing is not worth it, more than two-thirds (67.4 percent) reported that police officers who report incidents of misconduct are likely to be given a “cold shoulder” by fellow officers, and a majority (52.4 percent) agreed or strongly agreed that it is not unusual for police officers to “turn a blind eye” to other officers’ improper conduct (exhibit 3). A surprising 6 in 10 (61 percent) indicated that police officers do not always report even serious criminal violations that involve the abuse of authority by fellow officers.9

  • ||

    No, not so surprising.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "always following the rules is incompatible with getting their job done."

    The problem is they don't see their job as following the Constitution, even though they swear an oath to do it. And worse, the public doesn't see this as a fundamental part of the job. How many cop shows and movies present 'the rules' as a silly, technical inconvenience whose only function is to hamstring the 'good guys' from taking evil bad guys off the streets? I'm appalled by the casual way even more thoughtful crime shows like Justified or Longmire seem to revel in having their main characters 'get over' the constitutional rights of citizens.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Cop shows should be free to rape, torture, and pillage as far as I'm concerned. Entertainment has no business being constrained by the timid. And, I say this as an anti-authoritarian.

    How about Bo get over the shows? Real people with real minds don't look at shows for their ethical and moral development. Shows are supposed to fuck up real-world. Shows are supposed to bend all the rules- even those fucking hideous police rules all o' us Libertarians KNOW should exist to keep in the scroungy badged bastards.

    Real life is the problem, man. Not shows. Fuck shows.

  • SweatingGin||

    I just watched The Running Man too.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I watched that in the 70's. In my head. Years before that motherfucking steroid bitch even produced it. Doesn't matter. I still eat sandwiches and yawn at little fairies riding caterpillars in my garden.

  • Robert||

    Moreover, more than 40 percent agreed or strongly agreed that always following the rules is incompatible with getting their job done.


    Most jobs, the percentage would be higher.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Nothing about the fucking IRS is intelligent, meaningful, or fucking great. My fingers really don't fukcing want to waste their fucking treads on a governmental digression of putrid emptiness called the IRS. So fuck me. This thread, however, is so fucking interesting I'm almost likely mad admitting it and I'm not entirely sure why: http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/985738/posts

    Cities are globs. Globs are bubbling collections. Bubbling collections are hurricanes of the dead and the living all blasting subliminal stories lost in the nether of breezes. And within these millions of stories are millions of minds and egos also lost in the blizzard of clockworks.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    Nice piece calling out conservatives by Conor Friedersdorf

    America has just endured another riot. And just as the L.A. riots could not be understood apart from both the beating of Rodney King and the decades of policing that shaped the relationship between the LAPD and the black community, Monday's riot in Baltimore, Maryland cannot be understood apart from both the death of Freddie Gray and years of misbehavior by Baltimore's police department.

    Why do so few conservatives grant that?

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Conservatives only riot when their biblical rights are infringed upon and luckily this hasn't happened yet because conservatives have millions of rounds and ammo and black people just have rocks.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I don't know, you don't have to be a conservative to think the riots and the police behavior are bad things, neither justifying the other.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    And both of which are rife with silly collectivism. The police abuse the innocent and the guilty they come across, and then some of the innocent and some of the guilty go out and attack...shopowners and other people in their neighborhoods.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Rioters abuse rarely and occasionally. Police abuse as a favorite pastime all week long while the ethical and wonderful ones who would never do such a thing watch. What the fuck pills are you on this evening? I want those.

  • SweatingGin||

    Soma?

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Carisoprodol with Clonazepam creates strange dreams.

  • SweatingGin||

    I was more suggesting he was on Soma.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Gin does sweat from the pores also if you dance hard enough. Just an ob.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Fuck that. Crowds boil over when fevered and pitched. Crowds are the organs of variegated society. Mass collective responses are the symptoms of social sickness or optimal social health (which has never been witnessed since these fuckers crawled out of the fucking soup too many years ago).

  • Ted S.||

    Why do so few liberals grant that the problem goes far beyond race?

    It's maddening how TEAM BE RULED think there are only two valid opinions on the issue, depending upon which half of the TEAM you're in.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Fucking tired of black privilege. Fucking weary with the race bullshit. I can't even watch the goddamn tube and I'm one of these rare Libertarian whores who actually fucking believes a race problem still exists in this country. Problem is, the fucking baseline of resisting totalitarian cabals like police unions thugs and intermingled political cum corruption parties has degraded into normal people smashed into the bushes while the privileged minority earns the sacred spot of liberty? Fuck that. HUMANS earn that. Doesn't fucking matter if your ass is white or black. Liberty doesn't respect your fucking skin color or creed.

  • Viscount Irish, Slayer of Huns||

    It's a mixture of issues. Three of the police officers charged were black, so the primary issue is really police abuses.

    I think what essentially happens is this: Cops fuck with people who can't fight back, particularly the poor. The poor are disproportionately black in this country, particularly in the cities where you have the largest and most congested police presences. It's therefore very difficult to separate out racism from classism and I think classism is a more accurate representation of what police abuses are related to than racism. After all, cops love fucking with poor whites too, poor whites are just lucky enough to generally live in rural areas with smaller police presences.

    That said, I think there is probably a racial component since blacks are more likely to engage in criminal activities partially due to low incomes, partially due to culture, partially due to a thousand reasons. So when racism comes into it it's probably the result of cops treat black people with less deference out of racial assumptions that black people are probably committing more crimes.

    So there's definitely racism and classism mixed up with the general issue of cop thuggery and the carte blanch granted to them by their overpowered unions.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    If you've ever been to a ghetto it is very easy to think your ass is amazing and godlike. Nothing makes a man or woman more powerful than going into the dusty bricks of and weedy front lawns of black fucks when you have a badge on your chest. Even Jesus doesn't understand that power. Which is why (if the bitch even exists) he is even shedding tears over that poor black man with the smashed spine.

  • Viscount Irish, Slayer of Huns||

    That's a good point. Middle class cops with their decent pensions go into ghettos and feel superior to the people they're supposed to be 'protecting and serving.' So you end up with police abuse based on seeing the locals as lower on the hierarchy than yourself.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    People who ride Beemers into ghettos feel this all the time when they buy cocaine from 22 year-olds. I hate this side of drugs, but a lot of rich people get off on this aspect. Not me. Slumming is for fucking rich deadbeats. Get your drugs fair and square. Problem is society is designed oddly.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    So there's definitely racism and classism mixed up with the general issue of cop thuggery

    From the piece: When Ed [Burns] and I reported “The Corner,” it became clear that the most brutal cops in our sector of the Western District were black. The guys who would really kick your ass without thinking twice were black officers. If I had to guess and put a name on it, I’d say that at some point, the drug war was as much a function of class and social control as it was of racism.

    The two agendas are inextricably linked, and where one picks up and the other ends is hard to say. But when you have African-American officers beating the dog-piss out of people they’re supposed to be policing, and there isn't a white guy in the equation on a street level, it's pretty remarkable. But in some ways they were empowered… You take out your nightstick and you’re white and you start hitting somebody, it has a completely different dynamic than if you were a black officer. It was simply safer to be brutal if you were black, and I didn't know quite what to do with that fact other than report it. It was as disturbing a dynamic as I could imagine. Something had been removed from the equation that gave white officers — however brutal they wanted to be, or however brutal they thought the moment required — it gave them pause before pulling out a nightstick and going at it. Some African American officers seemed to feel no such pause.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I don't get why you care.

    I mean, the cops are usually unassailable in politics. It's really only in libertarian circles that they're not feted as heroes most of the time. The GOP certainly loves, loves the cops.

    The left is now criticizing the police. They are criticizing them over many of the same events we are. They want some of the same solutions. So why in the world, looking past the Right's love of the same, should we focus on the fact that their motivation is somewhat different?

  • Porque Pig||

    My offer is to return 50% of the money.

    So either he's rewarding a criminal enterprise with $53,500 in ill-gotten gains, or he's stealing $53,500 from an innocent person with no due process.

  • ||

    When you've lost Tulpa...

  • Porque Pig||

    They lost me a long time ago.

  • Sevo||

    Porque Pig|5.1.15 @ 9:52PM|#
    "They lost me a long time ago."

    No, asshole, you claimed to have left.

  • ||

    Is anyone else super creeped out by its attempts to emulate human language?

    You're as funny getting on a high horse than a monkey with a hat on it doing the same.

    There has to be an explanation for this kind of bizarre stilted constructions. ESL? Homeschooling in a cult compound? Nonfunctional autism?

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Huh? What are you talking about?

  • ||

    My vote is for "pathetic college student with zero real-life expericnce that parrots his professors".

  • ||

    You know, morons.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Is this a Bo thing?

  • ||

    Yes. It's attempting to pass the Turing test.

  • Sevo||

    I didn't think Turing required it to emulate that pedantic piece of shit you avoid at every gathering.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Sevo's angry outbursts really tend toward the scatological. That's a Tourrette's thing, isn't it?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "Well, that shitpile shows up"

    "that pedantic piece of shit"

    "this steaming pile of shit"

  • Sevo||

    Bo Cara Esq.|5.1.15 @ 10:20PM|#
    "Well, that shitpile shows up"
    "that pedantic piece of shit"
    "this steaming pile of shit"

    Piece of shit can read!
    Fuck off, piece of shit.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    OK, so taking my leave. But again, Sevo is the best proof I can have for my argument upthread. That this so obviously, angry, deranged person is one of the boys here demonstrates to me all I need that the norm here is what's pretty messed up.

  • Sevo||

    Bo Cara Esq.|5.1.15 @ 10:49PM|#
    "OK, so taking my leave."

    Shitpile promises to leave! Again.
    With comments on why someone else has a problem identifying shitpile as shitpile! What a surprise!
    Anyhow, I have a parting gift: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rW9-FOLG-iA

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Every man in this thread should smash his cock juice to Turing at least once occasionally... because Turings brains might actually momentarily the sweet folds of the pink valleys once and here and then... I do cum to Turing occassionallistically and perhaps this thing should not be sent hither into tha yons... but so let this be said... I also jack off to the Aleph.

  • Sevo||

    Well, that shitpile shows up and otherwise intelligent people converse with him, encouraging him until, yep, Bo does Bo.
    And then the second of our cast of insufferable twits shows up, with the same result.
    So I'm guessing there might be more than one cause.

  • Ted S.||

    Do a page search for the text Warty quoted.

  • ||

    I don't listen to hip hop.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Do a page search for the text Warty quoted.

    My fascr blocks all things Bo-related. I have no desire to disable it to peek into that thread. I'll just say that the syntax doesn't strike me as something that would occur from crosslinguistic negative transfer. More likely it's just a verbatim transcription of how they would construct the utterance orally.

  • ||

    So then...I don't want to be cruel to autistic people, but...autism?

  • Heroic Mulatto||

  • SweatingGin||

    so... invert the tachyon emitter?

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    invert the tachyon emitter?

    I don't think it works that way.

  • SweatingGin||

    neither does that link

  • Heroic Mulatto||

  • SweatingGin||

    ....zzzzzz...

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I enjoyed this display of Mulatto empress.

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    So... people write like they talk. Where's my grant?

  • Sevo||

    NotAnotherSkippy|5.2.15 @ 12:03AM|#
    "So... people write like they talk. Where's my grant?"

    Got no info on that, but re: Musk's "new" battery. AFAIK, it looks like a composite of smaller cells with some cooling, no?

  • Ted S.||

    ESL?

    When I have to write to my relatives in Germany, I often wonder how stilted my German is.

  • ||

    Was hast du für große Augen? Dass ich dich besser sehen kann.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    You know who else...?

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    "There has to be an explanation for this kind of bizarre stilted constructions. ESL? Homeschooling in a cult compound? Nonfunctional autism?"

    I would have thought you'd go with 'too many squats!'

  • Sevo||

    Isn't this cute? Piece of shit wants to know why he is recognized as such!
    First take: Stupidity and dishonesty, with a huge helping of ego mania.
    Yeah, that pretty much explains it.

  • ||

    Plus, there's no way in hell that he does squats.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Squats should be eaten by demons and archangels crying to fuck the gods with gigantic planet phallic symbols penned by Egyptian whores with brains the size of the biggest catfish in Arkansass.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Why would you even put that term in my night? Sir? Squats? Squats are for those horrible snivveling gods of muscles who exercisalate 6 days per week per month per year since you were 12. Those 3 guys you know who you HATE? (and kind of love becuase their FUCKING thighs...are.um.well. FUCKING ....awesome?) TOO much TMI here, bros? TOO much tmi?

  • SweatingGin||

    there's no need to squat... on the astral plane!!!

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Gin, tell me about your last fuck, love. As you thrust your fat cock onto and into the screaming delicacy beneath you did she or he grab your flab or musclulaturations?

  • SweatingGin||

  • Porque Pig||

    Sounds like racism to me.

  • Sevo||

    Porque Pig|5.1.15 @ 10:26PM|#
    "Sounds like racism to me."

    You two need a room. Fuck off with shitpile.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I think all these people here would be funnier than the little monkey with a hat on because I'm fucking tired of monkeys. Period. Fuck monkeys. I do, however, think these threads full of artistic geniuses and rainbow shots.

  • Viscount Irish, Slayer of Huns||

    ^ American hero.

  • ||

    Did you just fucking say that monkeys aren't funny???

  • Heroic Mulatto||

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Don't even start the Warty fucking engine of words. Just climb that mountain and watch the sun set silently nursing your favorite fucking vagina and a huge blunt. No one asked to release the Wart. I sure fucking didn't.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Even tho. I love the Wart. And that fucking Mulatto. and The Irish is a kilted son of a fucking gun and all these assorted super bitches texting all the diamonds. I swear to fucking Jesus budda punk... life is supraexcellacious when life is smooth on the orbits.

  • ||

    Poetry, too. You can't have mountains and blunts with no poems, brah.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I love poets but I fucking suk at poetration. Oooh.. well...hmm.... I like my fat white cock sliding into black alien women from certain planets that has yet to be discovered but poetration as a dude fucking around the great Reason threads. Fuck it. Nah... I cavort with gods.... and I am a buzzy bee with teeny tiny wings just enjoying his honey proclivities with in the fields of Reason pollen and effulgent rays bursting from the sun cock....

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    black alien women from certain planets that has yet to be discovered


    Yeah, I'm going to parse that as Guinan.

  • SweatingGin||

    what a cop-out of a character...

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I read these documents because the sliding elongated slurred integrated lasers of right slide bar thought is inebriating. The great minds elucidate and drabble the comet stones of mental quasars on my own mental net.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    If you get high and fucking dribble drabble the right scrolls on the great brain fountain spew it can be canimated into coms that divert and insert. Not detracting but enhancing. I truly never want to fuck with my bros and sisters here in the inward brain. But if you get fucked up enough and scroll fast enough a strange picture elicits.

    Man, I'm wondering if I got too fucked up to guquick to night... never mind.

  • SweatingGin||

    Buckle up. It's cyborg time.

  • Slammer||

    This is the way the fucking world ends. Look at this fucking shit we're in man. Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm fucking splitting, Jack

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Dears, what the fuck is happening to us. Our devices are become like noodles. A complex fucking fuck to dissect all the plastic universes and the goddamn supposed dojos of corp brilliance are really shitty cheese because these unnerving recollections of an old mom's shop will never translate into modern world because the fucking modern world is a fucking puke bear. FUCK puke bears.

    I need to smash tons of fucking monkeys in this bitchy face....

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Pianos that cry stilts are awesome? If you mod your facials.... the tones actually make you fucking crawl on the goddamn crapettes.... Dude just try this one time.... My recipe is thusoh shit... I told myself not to do this. fuck. I should just crawl on t.he. key notifications... no recipes no guilt.... I feel better... tho this recipe is awesom for feeling notes in the back your skulll and your knuckles float in fear

  • PapayaSF||

    Anyone want to fact-check this amusing meme?


    The "Evil" Koch Foundations
    2013 charitable distributions: $7,542,598
    2013 managerial overhead: $487,213

    The "Benevolent" Clinton Foundation
    2013 charitable distributions: $8,865,052
    2013 "managerial overhead": $84,684,494

    (But again, why does the left so often seem to have the best graphic design skills? The typography and overall design are amateurish. Even the writing is heavy-handed.)

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Why do these brilliants love the lord so? Did Jesus grant them their bullion?

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Why do the Koch bloods hate fucking cock smashing butts in love?

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Are the fucking BILLIONS in the KOCH accountamoa really all dat fuckin Liberty? Nah.... Fuckin Kochs play the fucking concerts with their playa manhattans and papayas and eps and swissymongols and A!'s and all the other brain dollars.

    Fuck the Kochs and their fucking bullion... FUCK FOX and their feux red eye and FUCK CNN and... well.. cnn is a Marx dynasty aside from the single envelope of occasional centric abuse by cops because said cops abuse those fucking poor ass black fucks... aside from dis... CNN is Stasi like Fox is fascist...

  • croaker||

    I wonder what Steve West would do with a congressional subpoena and a threat of contempt of Congress?

  • Agile Cyborg||

    FUCK the Kochs. These boys are refinery richies.... sailing on yachts with paid whores... Thank you, sirs... Whores should be paid fairlamosa,,,, I do NOT fucking believe our lovely ladies should spread their hot legs for less than tons of bucks.... that said...

    How is Koch lineage a piano beethoven stroke while a picasso brush slips?

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I have cummed to the aleph. Prob should throw this fuck all into these rebel throne vibrations.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    The ghetto is actually very otherwoldo.

    It hurts. Black teens hurt me often when I was young. I did nothing to them. No one will ever talk about the hurt black young men put on the artistic white boy in their midst. I fought back often but you never win. Black teens will always be more powerful than you. The poor white boy in the ghetto. No one cares. The conservatives amplify him and the blacks hate him. Neither is correctoma. I love black culture. I understand that most white are uncomfortable with ghetto expression but I see a modulated cry in that world and when tupac sings to me I actually get it.... As an alpha male white boy tho I will not be disrespected so I was abused at times to test me in the ghetto and I caught these strange gangs looking at each other while they tested me and I actually passed... real thugs have a code... fake thugs are the real losers. Very few people know this.... Deep shit I'm pulling from my youth... man, deep fucking tunes, brother. I hated being raised in the inner city... But I loved a couple of blacks deeply and I jacked off to several hot black girls since first grade... The inner city is complex. Very fucking beethoven like. The tunes played on those broken bricks is only disceribile for those accustomed to the sounds of old anguish.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    My heart is running very deep tonight... I need to release myself from this very special group of great men and women and offer my thoughts into a notepad... I love you all deeply. I love the thread gods and the rare goddess... I have letters to fling into quiet voids... peace out, loves

  • Derpetologist||

    Oh dear. It appears I unleashed the Bo and it went on a rampage.

    Time for some new Agile Cyborg Facts!

    -The 1977 blackout was caused when Agile Cyborg turned on all his lava lamps.

    -Agile Cyborg once competed in an air guitar contest. The result was the Tunguska Explosion.

    -Agile Cyborg created both the Nazca Lines and the Face on Mars during a cocaine binge.

    -Agile Cyborg once pissed in the Amazon rain forest. This is reason we have poison dart frogs.

  • SweatingGin||

    Agile Cyborg once went into a convenience store and said "Give me a bottle of anything! and a Glazed Donut! To Go!"

  • Sevo||

    And they did and said "GO"!

  • Notorious G.K.C.||

    That must be a hoity-toity convenience store where they'll take your order.

  • SweatingGin||

    Damn, you're old

  • Derpetologist||

    -Agile Cyborg once played a game of frisbee in the desert. It became known as the Roswell Incident.

    -Agile Cyborg was interviewed by Ripley's Believe It or Not. The organization has since changed its name to Holy Shit!

    -Agile Cyborg went for a swim in the Bermuda Triangle. It vanished without a trace.

  • Derpetologist||

    -Never make a voodoo doll of Agile Cyborg. It will come to life and raid your liquor cabinet.

    -Agile Cyborg can read any horoscope he wants. The stars will realign to make it true.

    -Agile Cyborg went to get his palm read. A team of gypsies are still working on it.

  • Derpetologist||

    *is still working on it

    The subject of a sentence is never in a prepositional phrase.

  • SweatingGin||

    -Never make a voodoo doll of Agile Cyborg. It will come to life and raid your liquor acid cabinet.

    Ahem.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Never sweat A Gin god.... your body won't fukin need drugs.... the Gin god sweat will be like spore cocaine ... and your fukin body will float into the rapture and jesus will pull your ass over cuz it was labeled by le' angels as SweatGin float and Jesus will grab your penis and pull it while Jesus left stroked your fucking balls and then you cum on Jesus... sorry, FUCKING john.... I love my boy but I am an apostachio and I love my thread gods....

  • SweatingGin||

    It's a scotch kind of night. Drinking campires, neat.

    That's Lagavulin 16 year.

    Also out of homemade (red) wine.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Never ever fuck with the goddamn browser in this fucking goddam site or it will fucking go apple on your sploodge ass...

    So play this lovely video in a NEW tab on MUTE!!!!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZp3xEdQc38
    And play this video in a NEW tab https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOcW9gZv68A on "NON" mute... while you watch the first fuckin vidalope...

    Be as fucked up as this motherfuker. That also might assist... maybe... who the fuck eve knows any more.

  • SweatingGin||

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Eddie is a lovely slave...

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I want to be a naked fucking goddamn blonde.. I FUCKING naked FUCKING blonde writhing my hot curves to a goddamn fucking croon jesus!! Someone on this internet save my fucking lost soul you goddamn gods!!

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I want to be a vagina in the mouth of englebert humperdink... I want my face lips sucked by the croon booms. I want my ass smashed in the lips of the fucking dodos and dead apes and those fucking velver revolvers those godamn dudes songed about... you FUCKING WHORES let US LIVE in PAIN AND LOVE!!!!!

  • SweatingGin||

    You need to calm down, man.

    Maybe on a cruise.

    Maybe on the Edmund Fitzgerald

  • Agile Cyborg||

    When your brilliant ass was layin on a fucking blanket with your chicka munga and when you both at too much rooster one night and you fuckin romantikally took her into the sort of voids Gins like and you accidentally flicked at a star.... I am on that fucking star, man... Never tell me to cruise down. Never.... I shine on your love life you fucking pussy fucker!

  • SweatingGin||

    Sometimes I have no idea what you're saying Agile.
    And sometimes I feel like it's a sin when I feel like I'm winning when I'm losing again

  • Agile Cyborg||

    So you think this a cute bullshit, Gin? you know his song is built with musculature right? If your face imagines a fucking GL song your body tenses and contracts like a non-orgasm until it actually orgasms and your penis spits tons of children onto your fucking bellybutton when not necessarily expected. Happened to me once and maybe a couple of times more....

  • SweatingGin||

    Everything is bullshit, AC. if you could read my mind it wouldn't be so bad.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I want to have my asshole eat millions of hot living things. I want my asshole to suck in all the great vivacious living creatures and this penis castle will release dwarf dark imaginations because drak matter is imaginatoms.... the verse out there isn't real... we are all dead. none of us are alive. this is a hypnoatomic false realization.... not good for panics and generalizal disorders types but we aren't alove... these breathers are in dreams.... man, get lucid..

    fuck do you even know how fucked up this is? bros?.... dudes on pills do..... I am fuckd up supra deep and even I should be careful... cuz anxiety can be cracked with shit like this... oh LOOK NOTORIOUS GKC shows upalo.... fuck that fake rapper whore... tho I do love him like I love all the whores in this transcendant fucking state.

  • SweatingGin||

    I'll drink some Lagavulin to that.

    It's pretty fucked, yea.

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg once visited the Astral Plane. He was upgraded to first class and got a tour of the cockpit.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I can fuck you my love Derp Logistic up for months on end... call me... recovery will take fucking months and lights and living will be like sheen tastic bling. No, don't call me.... I love fucked up and maybe this should be its own arena... tho, you can sleep and your body will float in a million designs for hours? yea... not good,,, but I like it.... My wife makes my hot ass sleep down stairs in the designs and in the morning she wraps her thighs around my dreams and in her soft lady clouds my penis screams joy into her body and she shrieks and claws with a certain calculus I can't but notice with shocked love.

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg once fist-bumped Charlie Sheen. Astronomers refer to this event as The Big Bang.

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg once built a sand castle. It became known as the lost city of Atlantis.

  • SweatingGin||

    Oh very fancy trying to bring back prog friday like that...

    it gets to sandcastle virtues less than a minute in

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg's bucket list includes high-fiving a yeti, fist-bumping the Loch Ness monster, and never losing his pants again.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    My fingers have a numero uno that would make your lovely heart of poems cry like a tiny little special human child.

  • Derpetologist||

    Geologists have speculated that Agile Cyborg's coolness may have caused the last ice age, which happened right after he put a baseball hat on backwards.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I want to crack scientist of derp skull with my fat cock. Smashing my dick into his brilliant brain and blowingz this sperm deep into his broken skull filling his broken skull with my jizz. I broke the head of the amazin derp god with my fat cock sperms.... he was killed by my cock jizz assaultz so I hope the apparitions of Derpelogistics can arise?

  • SweatingGin||

    You're drunk agile, let me call you a taxi

  • Agile Cyborg||

    So boomarific you lovely slut.... Man, why does my face love these thread gods and yet I do'n'tot need even a fucki'ng godd'amn motheru'fuclking taxi!!! I am in thaw glacieros' will live in the keys of shades of slims sleeking shaka slacks streamos...

    I LOVE GIN,, i get fuckd up on gin alway and with some great pills gin makes a halloweeny
    space and fingtips are noisawaya

  • SweatingGin||

    God damn, man. You are like the bridge in PANAMA

    I can barely see the... agile...

  • Agile Cyborg||

    Is derp god dead? becaus of agile cum?

  • SweatingGin||

    I just missed an agile dev conf.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    SwayGina modachus is a ninga mongus in the slight booze where arms connect inthe old allay.... and notes stream and hinder and hander the manliness because fuck you modern society we LIKE to FUCKING lick those sweet loving tinder lips of the spread legs and those fucking ass feels while the lovely woman lies back on her pillows trusting the boy to love her body and my tongues flick your valleys monster woman. your math curves are a calculus to my tongue and then I must slide my tongue into your belly while my hands slut your butt rreaching deep within playing with your poophole and vagin canyouns and your entire body is not lost with out our thread lovers......

    I will kiss my lovers shoulders like breasts ..I strip her dress from her shoulders and I sink my mouth onto her curves... I eat her shoulders like I eat an entire fucking bear... I eat your shoulders, baby... I eat you.. I lick your back,, i lick your tongue like an old slave lost forever who just found food and I eat your tits like alien sex monsters, I lick your skin like a saviour I lick your entire curves like the deepest blizzard..... I love my tongue on your body lover... I want to smash your skin with my tongue I want my tongue to be like a fucking grizzly attacking your fucking body lover....

  • SweatingGin||

    You and me, agile, so deep within you.

    (and another entry for "bring back prog rock friday")

  • Derpetologist||

    The FCC has asked Agile Cyborg to avoid heights. His brainwaves have caused damage similar to solar flares.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    The rivens arise, lova derp king. The swords beneath break and my love jabs you like an arrow of Indian chieftains.... and the hells lifts squaring breathing love... This notes offers my love DerpKang and LovGin bicomets of kisses and loves... I will rainbow into myself and be thankful we hav not reeled into dark beyoung... the lights lead us... and when I release myself from your special ways I have new trips to gone.... but my place of thoughts with carry you with us...

  • SweatingGin||

    I know what's wrong! You're in the gaze of the Necromancer and his dread power!

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg once visited a haunted house. The ghosts filed a lawsuit for unfair competition.

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg once had an out-of-body experience. His body immediately filed for a restraining order.

  • Agile Cyborg||

    I must vanish into the cries of the stars, loves... I need to travel the deep my special lovers..... love my step chats, the great Derp god and Sway Gin.... I must leave for this time I am floating further deep and my fingers are lost I love you

  • SweatingGin||

    good night cyborg

  • Butts Wagner||

    Agile cyborg, you are a God among men. May the breath of ten thousand pegasii with the wind of ten thousand wings be warmed by the nostril flares of ten thousand dragons and praised by ten thousand fauns be your destiny.

  • Derpetologist||

    Freddy Kruger recently died of insomnia. Someone told him about Agile Cyborg.

  • SweatingGin||

    Sounds like he needed some... Dream Warriors

  • Derpetologist||

    Scientists once tried to examine Agile Cyborg with an EKG. The machine immediately sprouted arms and legs and began singing Hello! Ma Baby.

  • SweatingGin||

  • Derpetologist||

    Don't even need to watch. I was just about to make a reference to that movie.

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg once wore a tinfoil hat. The fire department was called to extinguish the blaze.

  • Derpetologist||

    Agile Cyborg used to work the drive thru at a fast food place. This inspired the lyrics for both Inna Godda Davida and Louie Louie.

  • Derpetologist||

    The Thing tried assimilate Agile Cyborg. The entity has since been known as Steve Buscemi.

  • Derpetologist||

    The Borg tried to assimilate Agile Cyborg. They all began singing Domo Arigato, Mr. Roboto and danced themselves to death.

  • Suellington||

    The guy was surely a dick but he really does not compare to some customers. They are out there. He may even be one of the super dicks that plague every single person they have do something for them. Those people really are a bummer. I had the worst customer experience of my life a couple years back with some crazed lawyer screaming and threatening me in his house after a difficult job.

  • RightofCenter||

    Just in case you see this: IFH, what's the deal with your PM putting furriners in jail for 3 years and fining them $125k for the heinous crime of buying a house? I was working out and not able to hear any of the story. I just read the footer while they played the same clips about 10 times. Oh, then they found out Kate's in labor (labour) and played about 40 straight minutes of the same 4 or 5 Kate/Harry clips while presumably saying nothing important.

    Any recs on what to do during my 3-day, rainy layover in Sydney?

  • Winston||

    Huh so I was reading that plenty of anti-war libertarians are pretty fond of Harry Elmer Barnes and ignore his holocaust denialism. His own Wikipedia page links to a fawning obit by Murray Rothbard. His Wikipedia page includes such interesting comments such as Hitler being the most reasonable leader before WWII.

    And when Mark Ames accused Reason of publishing a "Holocaust Denialism" issue Gillespie had this to say:

    the inclusion of contributors such as James J. Martin, who would go on to join the editorial board of the contemptible denialist outfit the Institute of Historical Review, is embarrassing.

    When James J. Martin died Doherty posted this: http://reason.com/blog/2004/04.....martin-rip

    In trying to judge the motive and conduct of the Allies more objectively than did nationalist propaganda, Martin did slide distressingly into downplaying the crimes of the Axis. In later years his World War II revisionism shifted into Holocaust revisionism, and he joined the editorial board for the Institute for Historical Review. This sort of unsavory association will in the eyes of many discredit all his work, but it ought not.

    And in the comments Jeff Riggenbach denies that Martin was a Holocaust denier and that the IHR is a holocaust denial outfit.

  • Alan||

    Prosecutor Steve West is a good argument for the death penalty, and particularly for burning at the stake.

  • SamJoHan88||

    Wow man thats really messed up dude. Seriously.

    www.AnonGO.tk

  • SamJoHan88||

    Wow man thats really messed up dude. Seriously.

    www.AnonGO.tk

  • gphx||

    'Your client needs to resolve this or litigate it. But publicity about it doesn't help. It just ratchets up feelings in the agency'.

    Ratchets up feelings. So the outcome of a case is based not upon the law but the feelings of the IRS. Just like how many people end up going to jail or being injured by police for no reason other than the officer feeling as if he weren't shown enough 'respect'.

  • RealityBites||

    "Treason for Profit" can't expect anything else from parasitic psychopaths that run the agency. The criminal behavior starts at the top and goes to the bottom of the cesspool. No different than the DEA criminals that stole 16K from the kid going to LA to make a music video. Show us your papers or we will shoot you and by the way we will take anything you have of value for ourselves.

    Only traitors and psychopaths wage war on fellow citizens.... its long past time for some personal karma visits.

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