We Don't Need Terrorism Laws When Murder Is Already Illegal
The government has given itself special powers to deal with crimes that it could already prosecute.

New York state prosecutors announced on Tuesday that they were charging Luigi Mangione, the alleged killer of United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson, with murder "in furtherance of terrorism." The law that they are citing, which was passed a week after the attacks of September 11, 2001, increases penalties for violent crimes meant to "intimidate or coerce a civilian population," "influence the policy of a unit of government by intimidation or coercion," or "affect the conduct of a unit of government by murder, assassination or kidnapping."
Killing and kidnapping, of course, are already illegal. Thompson's murderer would have gone to prison for a very long time, with or without terrorism laws. A few decades ago, authorities had all the power they needed to investigate and prosecute violent crimes. But the wave of counterterrorism laws, which began in the 1990s and ramped up after 9/11, has allowed the government to create a new realm of special crimes.
Terrorism enhancements, like hate crime enhancements, increase the penalties for certain crimes simply because the motive is politically controversial. Other counterterrorism laws allow the government to treat unpopular First Amendment activities—like talking to unsavory foreign rebel groups, or animal rights activism—as if they were associated with heinous crimes.
The first counterterrorism laws in the United States were concerned with foreign policy and immigration. The Export Administration Act of 1979 allowed the U.S. State Department to designate certain countries as "state sponsors of terrorism," which subjected them to certain kinds of economic sanctions. The 1990 amendments to the Immigration and Nationality Act allowed authorities to ban any foreigner who "has engaged in a terrorist activity" or "is likely to engage after entry in any terrorist activity" in the United States.
But criminal law continued to treat terrorist crimes like regular crimes. Ramzi Yousef, who killed six people at the World Trade Center in 1993 and plotted to blow up several airliners, was thrown into solitary confinement for life. Timothy McVeigh, who killed 168 people at the Oklahoma City federal building in 1995, was executed. There didn't have to be any special laws for political violence, because the normal laws against murder and explosives use were enough.
After the Oklahoma City bombing, however, Congress passed the Antiterrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996. The Clinton administration and its supporters, including the Anti-Defamation League, originally wanted a broad law to crack down on both foreign and domestic terrorism, but Republicans pushed back due to worries about expanding the power of federal law enforcement. As a compromise, the final law banned "material support" for foreign terrorist organizations, meaning that there would be no legal definition of "domestic terrorism."
But even the ban on supporting foreign terrorists encroached on "activities that would ordinarily be considered constitutionally protected," according to a February 2024 study by the Center for Constitutional Rights. The definition of "material support" is vague, and the definition of a "foreign terrorist organization" is completely up to the discretion of the U.S. State Department.
In a 2010 case, Holder v. Humanitarian Law Project, the Supreme Court ruled that even teaching terrorists to lay down their arms could be considered a form of support. The Humanitarian Law Project, a group of American activists, had wanted to provide human rights and international law classes to rebels in Turkey and Sri Lanka—the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) and the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam, respectively—in order to encourage them to take a more peaceful route.
Because the PKK and the Tamil Tigers were considered terrorists, the Humanitarian Law Project sued the U.S. government for the right to engage with them, arguing that the "material support" ban was unconstitutionally vague. Chief Justice John Roberts responded that any act coordinated with a terrorist group, even a speech act, "frees up other resources within the organization that may be put to violent ends," "helps lend legitimacy to foreign terrorist groups" and strains "the United States' relationships with its allies."
Associate Justice Stephen Breyer, dissenting from the decision, stated that "money given for a charitable purpose might free up other money used to buy arms," but the same principle doesn't apply to "advocacy of political ideas and lawful means of achieving political ends," which "is the kind of activity to which the First Amendment ordinarily offers its strongest protection."
In 2022, the U.S. Treasury even tried to use counterterrorism sanctions to stop American researchers in Lebanon from even listening to designated foreign terrorists speak, arguing that "the provision of a platform for [the sanctioned individuals] to speak" was considered a "service." Threatened with a lawsuit, the Treasury backed down.
The decision of who counts as a terrorist is an arbitrary, political decision that is nearly impossible to challenge in court. The PKK is on the terrorist list, but it has never killed Americans, and American troops fight alongside its Syrian Kurdish allies. The Mojahedin-e Khalq, an Iranian guerrilla organization that has killed Americans, was taken off the terrorist list after U.S. politicians decided they wanted to use it to overthrow Iran's government. The State Department has designated neo-Nazis in Russia as terrorists but refuses to do the same for neo-Nazis in Ukraine. And so on.
Meanwhile, counterterrorism began to be used as a cudgel against animal rights activists. In the late 1980s and early 1990s, the FBI began to raise the alarm about "ecoterrorism," and several states capitalized on those fears to pass "ag-gag" laws making it illegal to film inside farms or laboratories without the owner's consent. When People for Ethical Treatment of Animals managed to film pigs being mistreated at an Iowa farm, the owner described it as "the 9/11 event of animal care."
In 1989, the House Committee on Agriculture considered a federal bill to protect farms and laboratories from protesters—but the Department of Justice testified against it, arguing that the laws on the books were enough to deal with vandalism and threats. In 2006, Congress passed the Animal Enterprise Terrorism Act, which increased penalties for conspiring to commit violence, theft, vandalism, or "intimidation" against facilities with animals.
As for New York's post-9/11 terrorism enhancement, it was first used in 2007 against gangsters who had a gunfight in a church and killed a 10-year-old girl. Rather than fighting religious extremists and political militants, the counterterrorism law was used to throw the book at particularly notorious criminals for a particularly heinous crime. Michael Balboni, one of the authors of the counterterrorism bill, called the antigang prosecution an "unanticipated application" of his law.
New York prosecutors have also used a provision in the law against "terroristic threats" to slap felony charges onto what would normally be misdemeanors "such as aggravated harassment, disorderly conduct, and falsely reporting an incident," Brooklyn Law School professor Louis Jim wrote in 2010. A combination of "prosecutorial discretion, statutory vagueness, and the pressure to prosecute terrorism cases leads to the potential for prosecutorial abuse," he added.
Murder is bad enough. The government should punish murderers, deter serious death threats, and break up conspiracies to kill civilians. Creating a special category for political violence isn't necessary to accomplish these things. What counterterrorism laws do accomplish is allowing politicians to grandstand on public fears—and increase their own power in the process.
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""to slap felony charges onto what would normally be misdemeanors""
New York prosecutors you say. Where have I seen that before.
Yeah, I don't really get it. It's about the most open-and-shut murder 1 conviction you could possibly hope for. It's New York, so he won't get his Breathing License revoked, but dude has zero chance of leaving prison ever. Why bother stacking charges? Is this just a make-work project for state lawyers now?
They have to look tough so the political donors and elites don't get scared. A few years in jail after a prolonged basic murder trial doesn't send the message to not fuck with the elites.
You can put the death penalty on the table with a federal charge. I think that's their angle.
To me, these kind of enhancements are more for the actions and charges they bring against others once they go through his socials and emails. or just to look tough while knowing the enhancement is meaningless.
These "terrorism" laws are usually Federal charges. They allow the FBI and DOJ to stick their noses into what would normally be a State matter. it's the same with the so called "hate crimes". They also have the added benefit of adding "double jeopardy" without having actual "double jeopardy".
I agree that "hate crime" charges are more about PR that justice.
How was this terrorism? I guess to people who don't know what a woman is, maybe this makes sense.
Mangione appears not to have been motivated by: a personal grudge, the thrill of killing someone, having had a bad day.
He apparently was motivated by: the wish to intimidate people to abolish the concept of health insurance and do...well, whatever he fantasizes would be better. In our society, those are decisions that are left to the free market, and to some extent, political decisions by elected officials.
How is his attempt to compel economic and political outcomes with bullets not terrorism?
How is his attempt to compel economic and political outcomes with bullets not terrorism?
If someone breaks into my home and I attempt to compel an economic outcome favorable to myself with bullets, is that terrorism?
Terrorism has nothing to do with economic outcomes, the law they used to charge him states it's when somebody "with intent to intimidate or coerce a civilian population, influence the policy of a
unit of government by intimidation or coercion, or affect the conduct of a unit of government by murder, assassination or kidnapping, he or she commits a specified offense.", which is what it seems like the goal was.
Killing a CEO won't change corporate policies, but it might get some politicians to try to enact laws to regulate them.
'We Don't Need Terrorism Laws When Murder Is Already Illegal'
Ha! But like pseudo-racist hate crimes, we need to make some murders double-illegal. That will make mean people think twice. Get it?
What you appear not to get is it WILL NOT deter anyone willing to commit the crime.
Whoosh!
How about all those synonyms for plain old theft? Burglary, robbery, embezzlement, conversion, shoplifting, yada yada yada.
How about "Don't hurt people and don't take their stuff", and charge for the amount stolen, the ancillary damages done, the time and resources to investigate and prosecute, and by golly, throw in all the intangible harm for loss of companionship, pain and suffering, future income, and there you are. If you can't pay for it, time in jail, or turn you over to the victims to have their way with you.
There's too many damned laws.
“If you can't pay for it, time in jail, or turn you over to the victims to have their way with you.”
Trump said he could commit murder in downtown NYC in broad daylight and get away with it. Under a system like what you’re describing he really could, because he could afford to pay for the damages.
He didn't say he would get away with it. He said he would not lose political support. A very different thing--and an obvious hyperbolic comment on the intensity of his political support.
Man got along with ten for a very long time - - - - - - - - -
People deserve extra punishment for what they were thinking when they committed the crime. Duh. 1984 is a manual, not a warning.
All true but it is a way around Bragg and the other Soros DA's.
But was it a hate terrorism? We can tripple amplify the charges!
Good point.
Terrorism enhancements, like hate crime enhancements, increase the penalties for certain crimes simply because the motive is politically controversial.
So what? You might be thinking that because motive isn't required to prove murder (only intent is), that it therefore has no bearing on the subject. But you'd be wrong.
Motive plays a huge part of the analysis. As does the nature of the victim. The "malice" in malice aforesight isn't a static quality that's the same in ever murder, and the victim may be particularly vulnerable. Both of those things can - and should - affect how we regard the nature of the murder, and how we then respond to it.
Neutering a consideration of motive is how the pro-abortion crowd - like the pro-scumbag UHC killer crowd (and every genocidal/eugenic culture in history) - rationalize a murder. They lionize the motive. They dehumanize the victim.
For example:
"Women deserve bodily autonomy."
"The healthcare industry is corrupt."
"It is for the glory of the Fatherland."
For example:
"They're not really people."
"They deserve it."
"Their inferior genetics are threatening our racial purity."
So, when we talk about terrorism enhancements, how is that really any different than an enhancement based on a particular cruelty, or an abuse of trust, or following a history of violence. How is it different than when a murderer selects a particularly soft target (like a school or hospital)? Or, for that matter, what about mitigating circumstances? The wife who shoots her husband after hearing his intent to molest their child, for example.
It's not to imply that one murder is "better" or "worse" than another - it's about the goals of deterrence. Obviously we want to deter ALL murder. But we especially want to deter murder for especially heinous reasons/circumstances, or against especially vulnerable populations. (This is, incidentally, why "hate crimes" make no sense - because they don't elevate the penalties for EITHER of those reasons. That is exclusively political.)
Terrorism enhancements are applied to murder for both those reasons. Terrorists are cowards who meticulously prey on the unsuspecting and innocent, with the explicit goal of sowing fear among those they didn't kill. That's a far different scenario than some bangers getting fatally into it with other bangers.
As far as it applies to the scumbag at hand, I'm not sure I agree that terrorism enhancements are appropriate, but it may be the only really viable alternative to a revenge murder enhancement. The book needs to be thrown at this scumbag - if for no other reason than sending a message to all the sociopaths supporting/defending his murder - for that deterrent effect.
For the singular purpose of discouraging people from rationalizing his murder as somehow "acceptable," the way abortionists and eugenicists have so successfully done over the years.
So, when we talk about terrorism enhancements, how is that really any different than an enhancement based on a particular cruelty, or an abuse of trust, or following a history of violence. How is it different than when a murderer selects a particularly soft target (like a school or hospital)? Or, for that matter, what about mitigating circumstances?
Because, one-way ratchet, terrorism enhancements are written into the law while mitigating circumstances are just judicial/attorney discretion.
This is the one stopped-clock take for Reason this week or whatever. If the law is sufficient to execute Tim McVeigh, it's sufficient to handle Luigi. Handing Bragg extra special power to prosecute Luigi is handing him extra special power to prosecute anyone else he doesn't like.
That said, and potentially to your point, two weeks from now when a governor says "Death row juries, by law not hearing any new facts or evidence, should only require a 9/3 split decision. It shouldn't be harder to execute someone who killed 20 kids after their conviction than it was to convict them in the first place." and Reason freaks out, it will be obvious that Reason isn't actually advocating for the clear, understood, and objective 'letter of the law' justice. That this rational take isn't a principled stance but, quite the opposite, a stalking horse and that they're actually advocating on behalf of politically favorable or expedient criminals. Just like they did with Hunter Biden.
Because, one-way ratchet, terrorism enhancements are written into the law while mitigating circumstances are just judicial/attorney discretion.
Why would you want mitigating circumstances written into the law? That would just encourage people to frame murders in "mitigating" ways.
Think of it like when Sweden decided that nobody under the age of 15 can be held criminally liable for anything, and no penalties imposed on them. Well, organized crime and gangs immediately capitalized on this, started recruiting and grooming teenage assassins and daylight robbers and so forth.
Or heck, think of any movie where a bad guy commits a murder, but then stages it to look like he was the innocent victim taking fire and responding with self-defense.
The point is, there's a reason why it only ratchets one-way. It makes the consideration of particularly heinous murders an automatic ("we're not going to tolerate murder, and we're especially not going to tolerate murders when they're especially egregious"), while forcing the consideration of "mitigating" circumstances to require some analysis as to whether they actually are mitigated.
That's not unreasonable.
that they're actually advocating on behalf of politically favorable or expedient criminals
Oh, obviously.
My point is more to the social effect this nutjob is having on a certain demographic of people, as they lionize him as an antihero. That need to be nipped in the bud. And if contriving extra special reasons to throw the book at him help in that capacity, then I see the value in doing so.
Disagree
If we are merely talking about the fact of it and not how it is implemented, then yes we do need this.
So if HAMAS says
"
territories under Israeli control. Its Covenant is a comprehensive
manifesto comprised of 36 separate articles, all of which promote the basic HAMAS goal of destroying the State of Israel through Jihad (Islamic Holy War). "
So if you are in HAMAS you are complicit in murder --and I don't see how any ordinary law about murder does anything about this.
=============
Relatedly, the Nuremberg TRials
The most common defense at the Nuremberg Trials was that defendants were only following orders from superiors, known as the 'Superior Orders' defense, which was ultimately not accepted by the tribunal.
Remember too the Nuremberg judges on the distinction between death even in war and HAMAS type killing
"A city is bombed for tactical purposes… it inevitably happens that nonmilitary persons are killed. This is an incident, a grave incident to be sure, but an unavoidable corollary of battle action. The civilians are not individualized. The bomb falls, it is aimed at the railroad yards, houses along the tracks are hit and many of their occupants killed. But that is entirely different, both in fact and in law, from an armed force marching up to these same railroad tracks, entering those houses abutting thereon, dragging out the men, women and children and shooting them."
Democrats always lie and gaslight.
They want us to accept the Biden coup d’etat wasn’t a coupe bc it lacked some tiny element to fit their strained definition of “coup d’etat”.
Yet this politically motivated assassin, who wanted to make political change through violent action, somehow isn’t a terrorist? BS
Fry that fucker.
I've been saying this at least since 9/11. I get separating military law from other law, but making a new class for terrorism eludes me.
"The government has given itself special powers to deal with crimes that it could already prosecute."
Indeed. Multiplied by 1,000,000,000,000,000 Times.
If only they would've stuck-to ONLY ensuring Individual Liberty and Justice for all.
I think you slipped a decimal place, it's actually 10,000,000,000,000,000
I think you can make an argument for enhancing penalties for "terrorism" based on the notion that terrorism is intended to intimidate a much wider circle of people than just the victim.
That said, I'm not really sure this rises to the same level as bombing an airplane, but it seems that the perpetrator intended to "send a message."