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Free Speech

A Government Veto on Speech at the Supreme Court

Murthy v. Missouri challenges government efforts to suppress dissenting viewpoints on social media.

Thomas W. Hazlett | 6.26.2024 9:55 AM

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Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh and Joe Biden | PAT BENIC/UPI/Newscom
(PAT BENIC/UPI/Newscom)

UPDATE: The Court has issued a 6–3 decision in Murthy v. Missouri, holding that the plaintiffs lack standing.

A case pending at the U.S. Supreme Court stems from the efforts a multitude of federal agencies made to remove certain viewpoints from public view. In other words, they sought to abridge freedom of speech—you know, that thing that the First Amendment explicitly bans.

The case, Murthy v. Missouri (formerly Missouri v. Biden), may support or overturn the 5th Circuit's ruling that the government violated the First Amendment to reduce the circulation of viewpoints that various agencies believed noxious. This included, the court noted in its decision, controversies surrounding the "COVID-19 lab-leak theory, pandemic lockdowns, vaccine side-effects, election fraud, and the Hunter Biden laptop story."

In many cases, the speech that offended the government has proven demonstrably true—the high social cost of school closings, for example, or the provenance of Hunter Biden's laptop. But the central problem is that the government sought, and often succeeded, in blocking free expression. Rather than engage in free and open debate, the government sought to squash it.

Speakers who were targeted for silencing—such as Jay Bhattacharya, a Stanford professor of medicine and economics—sued the government. The primary evidence came from caches of correspondence revealing government administrators cajoling, berating, swearing at, and arguably threatening (with policy sanctions) executives at Twitter, Facebook, Google, Microsoft, and Spotify.

A Louisiana judge issued extensive injunctions that barred a variety of officials and agencies from "meeting with social-media companies for the purpose of…pressuring or inducing in any manner the removal, deletion, suppression or reduction of content containing protected free speech." This was largely upheld on appeal, and the Supreme Court accepted a review, with a hearing held this past March.

During oral arguments, the government suggested that these officials merely "sought to mitigate the hazards of online misinformation" by "calling attention to content" that violated the "platforms' policies." A pro-government amicus brief by the Brennan Center argued that "communications by government officials—even emphatic ones—are an exercise of the government's prerogative to voice its own views and are consistent with the First Amendment as long as the ultimate decision regards content rests with the platforms themselves."

Yet the principal deputy solicitor general, representing the federal government, readily conceded that officials do not enjoy First Amendment protection for such speech, only the ability to inform the public as part of their job-related duties. The constitutional protection of free speech lies with the speakers (who in this case were targeted and suppressed) and the public (who would benefit from having unfettered access to differing viewpoints).

Regrettably, the justices seemed to identify with the state. Justice Brett Kavanaugh, recalling his years serving in George W. Bush's White House, commented: "It's probably not uncommon for government officials to protest an upcoming story on surveillance or detention policy and say, you know, if you run that, it's going to harm the war effort and put Americans at…risk." Justice Elena Kagan chimed in: "I've had some experience encouraging press to suppress their own speech. 'You just wrote a bad editorial. Here are the five reasons you shouldn't write another one'….This happens literally thousands of times a day in the federal government."

Buttressing the claim that it was standard operating procedure for government officials to complain was the fact that many times the platform executives had cooperated with the government, endorsed a "partnership," and appeared to welcome state influence.

But if the state is victorious in this suit, the genius of the First Amendment will be collateral damage.

"The purpose of the Constitution and Bill of Rights…was to take government off the backs of people," wrote Justice William O. Douglas in Schneider v. Smith. "The First Amendment's ban against Congress 'abridging' freedom of speech [creates] a preserve where the views of the individual are made inviolate." Law professor Lucas Powe—once a clerk for Douglas—expanded: "Our traditions are clear. A fair press, as determined by a government mechanism, is not a free press. A free press may be fair; we hope it will not be irresponsible; but…for the press to serve as a check on the government it must be free to gather and report information about government and those who do or would govern."

The evidence in Murthy shows that the U.S. government actively monitors online discussions, targets speech that breaks no laws, and then aggressively requests that the speech's distribution be reduced or labeled as dubious or false. Government officials are free to make such points in open debate, but a Truth Squad operating behind the scenes violates the spirit and letter of the Constitution.

The Institute for Free Speech recommends a clarifying bright-line rule: "The government violates the First Amendment whenever it requests the removal of lawful political speech. There is no need to determine whether the request is 'coercive.'"

Private owners of media platforms enjoy First Amendment rights, and they are indeed constitutionally protected in determining whether to agree with one side or the other in moderating platform discussions. But when public resources are used to banish rival opinions, a constitutional boundary is crossed. 

Alas, the U.S. has failed this test before. In the long-running error that allowed the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to regulate broadcast TV and radio content under policies like the Fairness Doctrine, rules were not explicitly stated and the public was rarely informed. Instead, the commission engaged in what was known as "regulation by raised eyebrow." If a broadcaster did not refrain from engaging in controversial programming, as determined by FCC bureaucrats (perhaps acting on congressional or White House requests), it would risk costly challenges to its operating license. The raised eyebrow threatened free speech by transmitting political demands without a paper trail.

The First Amendment did not allow this form of government control with respect to newspapers, or even in the case of franchised cable TV operators, but the government seized a loophole in over-the-air transmission supposedly based on the "physical scarcity" of the radio spectrum. If applied today, this bogus justification for content regulation would absurdly allow the FCC to force The New York Times to give free editorial columns to critics, given that most subscribers receive the digital edition delivered via radio waves (Wi-Fi, 4G, 5G).

In the key legal test of the Fairness Doctrine, 1969's Red Lion Broadcasting Co. v. FCC, the Supreme Court recognized the lethality of subtle threats. While the Court allowed the Fairness Doctrine to stand, rejecting the First Amendment challenge to end it (which finally did happen via a Reagan-era FCC), it observed that a chilling effect could be triggered by rules requiring free (unpaid) equal time for opposing views: If broadcasters would consequently "eliminate their coverage of controversial issues, the purposes of the [fairness] doctrine would be stifled." Yet the Court dismissed the harm as merely speculative. 

The Court was wrong: the case was, in fact, brought as part of a Kennedy-Johnson campaign aimed at filing Fairness Doctrine complaints to "harass and intimidate" anti-Administration broadcasters, as revealed in Fred Friendly's 1975 book, "The Good Guys, the Bad Guys, and the First Amendment."

Whatever one's views of the efficacy of COVID-19 vaccines, it is clear that many people (experts included) have changed their minds about them. It is well to recall that in October 2020, for example, MSNBC hosts denounced the Trump administration for rushing the Moderna and Pfizer shots to the public. The network appears to view things differently now. This should surprise no one. What would be shocking would be a situation where any group, including government experts, never let their understanding of the truth evolve. That's one reason freedom of debate is key.

Consider one of the most colossal censorship errors ever made in a free, democratic republic. In 1934, Winston Churchill's speech condemning "the danger of ignoring German rearmament" aired over the national radio system, the BBC. Churchill was then silenced—for six years the BBC barred his appearance. Only in 1940, when Hitler was marching through Europe, World War II had come to England's doorstep, and Winston Churchill was prime minister would his anti-Hitler message again be heard on the nation's airwaves. Whatever the chances that Churchill's plan of a tough-minded, preemptive move to block Adolf Hitler may have averted the "gathering storm," the tens of millions who died in the horrors of World War II would never know.

By suppressing his speech, the BBC's censors—the disinformation board of its time—likely contributed to carnage. In lieu of saving face for officials running the policy show, the lower-risk path would be to let competing viewpoints bloom. It's the profound gift of a rule prohibiting government's veto power over free speech.

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NEXT: Maybe New Yorkers Don't Want Bowman Progressivism

Thomas W. Hazlett is Hugh H. Macaulay Endowed Professor of Economics at Clemson University. His most recent book is The Political Spectrum: The Tumultuous Liberation of Wireless Technology, from Herbert Hoover to the Smart Phone (Yale University Press).

Free SpeechSupreme CourtFirst AmendmentFairness DoctrineCoercionSocial Media
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  1. Gaear Grimsrud   11 months ago

    Update. Scotus chicken shits boot the plaintiffs on standing. No ruling on the merits.

    1. Yuno Hoo   11 months ago

      This "standing" business has to change. Something, something, "petition the Government for a redress of grievances".

      1. Rob Misek   11 months ago

        Free speech is the ONLY thing between us and complete fascist totalitarianism.

        1. Zeb   11 months ago

          Says the retard Nazi who thinks lying should be criminalized.

          1. Rob Misek   11 months ago

            Hey fuckwit, criminalizing lying and 1a aren’t mutually exclusive.

            Do you think that laws against the criminal use of guns violate 2a?

            1. B G   11 months ago

              "Hey fuckwit, criminalizing lying and 1a aren’t mutually exclusive.

              Do you think that laws against the criminal use of guns violate 2a?"

              Laws against the criminal use of guns make a crime of the harm done, not the tools used. Same with laws against fraud, libel, and perjury.

              The half-baked nonsense in your fever dream, would criminalize the words themselves (violating 1A), not to mention that your dipshit fascist enforcement plan would put the burden of proof in a criminal trial on the accused and use their own speech from before they were suspected of a crime as "evidence", which would violate the 4th, 5th, and 6th Amendments as well as centuries of legal precedents, and the core tenets of the structure of US Criminal law.

              We all get that you're still butthurt over the leaders of the cult in which you were raised (maybe even some of your direct relatives, even?) being put in prison due to the efforts of FBI undercover agents, but maybe you should avail yourself of some of the many deprogramming resources that are available in a free society instead of risking getting punched like your boss did if someone at the Whitefish Starbucks ever realizes who you're picking up all those "flat whites" for.

              1. Rob Misek   11 months ago

                I spelled it out and the fuckwits just can’t comprehend logic.

                ALL crimes are simply variations in behaviour that CIVILIZED societies deem harmful enough to make laws against.

                Are you following fuckwits?

                The constitution guarantees the right to bear arms. Yet the mere action of bearing arms is a crime in itself for felons.

                Still following? YOU ARE REFUTED

                Coercion describes the harm caused by lying. That’s EXACTLY why perjury and Fraud are crimes. Because they COMPEL people using the falsified authority of truth to act in the liars interest.

                Still following fuckwits?

                Lies rob us of our agency. That’s why lying should be criminalized.

                You’re a lying waste of skin. I’m not responding for your benefit. I’m sharing the truth with those who value it.

            2. Zeb   11 months ago

              Yes, actually they are mutually exclusive.

              And what world do you live in where you think that such a law would be made that wouldn't apply to Holocaust denying pieces of shit like you? You think you and your Stormfront buddies are going to be writing and enforcing those laws?

              A big part of the importance of 1A (and an important reason why it does protect lies) is that agents of the state cannot be trusted to be arbiters of the truth.

              1. Rob Misek   11 months ago

                It would take objective forensic analysis to prove that the bullshit ww2 holocaust occurred.

                Unfortunately that’s illegal in every nation where it allegedly occurred as presenting ANY evidence that refutes the Jew self serving fairytale is a crime punishable by imprisonment.

                So I’ve refuted the story told with correctly applied logic and science which none of you fuckwits has ever refuted.

                Besides by a kangaroo court, how could I be convicted of lying?

      2. n00bdragon   11 months ago

        You think you want a world where "standing" isn't necessary to sue someone, but I guarantee you that you don't. Standing is literally the determination of who has a grievance that can be redressed and who does not. If you don't have a grievance, you can't just petition the government to do whatever the fuck because you feel like it. Take it to the ballot box.

        1. Zeb   11 months ago

          In general, I think you are right. In the specific case of government violating a specifically enumerated constitutional right, I think it should be a little different. There has to be some way to stop government from doing illegal things. Preferably while they are happening and not years later.

    2. Zeb   11 months ago

      That's some bullshit. Everyone should always have standing to sue the government for basic constitutional violations.

  2. SMP0328   11 months ago

    6-3 decision that there was no standing. The standard used by the majority for determining standing is more exacting than any standard applied in any previous decision. Many cases where the Court found standing would have come differently under the standard used in this case. The majority clearly did not want to reach the merits and so it copped-out, breaking with precedent regarding standing in order to do so.

    Alito’s dissenting opinion fully explains how the Plaintiffs/Respondents unquestionably have standing and how the majority pulled this stricter standard for standing out of its ass. He also explains how the First Amendment was definitely violated by the Biden Administration.

    Murthy v. Missouri will go down as a cowardly decision based on the fears of at least Chief Justice Roberts and Justice Barrett. They have disgraced themselves today.

  3. Don't look at me!   11 months ago

    So much for the separation of powers. It’s all the same gang now.

  4. Dillinger   11 months ago

    >>Regrettably, the justices seemed to identify with the state.

    ya, like I said yesterday ... compromised

  5. Mickey Rat   11 months ago

    Is there any explanation in the article about why the Court denied the plaintiffs standing?

    The arguments of why you think the plaintiffs should have won is all well and good, and I agree with them, but SCOTUS punted and refused to decide the case on its merits. One can infer this is due to the efforts of this administration to intimidate and delegitimize the Court and threatened court packing for past rulings against the Democrat's preferred policies.

    1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

      The plaintiffs are NOT standing at ALL!!! They are all buried in one giant anonymous mass grave, all lying FLAT! Only their still-living relatives have "standing" (are still left standing), and they're all deadly scared to speak up, or to go and try to find the hidden mass graves (for proof), lest they, too, should be dragged into the "nacht und nebel" (night and fog, disappeared forever), along with all the OTHER millions of victims of our HORRIBLE speech police! (There's a knock at my door as I post this; they are coming for MEEEE now!)

      STOP POSTING NOW, I'm warning ye!!!!

      1. Mickey Rat   11 months ago

        You are defending a censorious, autocratic executive administration, one might even say a budding dictatorship, which applies the law according to double standards.

        Yes, that is just so amusing.

        1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

          WAAAAHHH!!!! THEY TOOK DOWN MY POST!!!!

          All of the "victims" can post RIGHT HERE AT REASON, or at Parler, or at Truth Social, and have 3 or 5 people read their posts... But NOOOOO, they HAVE to bend the BIG GUYS to their will... They're not happy that "the market has spoken" (people read what they want to read, and don't read what they don't want to read), and so Parler and Truth Social (and former Twitter AKA "X" now too) are all market failures.

          WAAAAHHH!!!! THEY WON'T READ MY POSTS AT PARLER!!!

          The funniest part of shit all, is that the Demon-Craps only have ONE really valid threat, and that is to try to take down Section 230, so that they can "get" you... And sore-in-the-cunt cuntservaturds AGREE, BY AND LARGE!!! Take down S-230, so that we can pussy-grab the enemy, who will NEVER think of pussy-grabbing us right back!

        2. Fire up the Woodchippers! (5-30 Banana Republic Day)   11 months ago

          I see those grey boxes are appearing again. That means it’s time to leave some feces lying around after filling it with rat poison. Then let things play out.

    2. Sometimes a Great Notion   11 months ago

      Article III’s “case or controversy” requirement is “fundamental” to the “proper role” of the Judiciary. Raines v. Byrd, 521 U. S. 811, 818. A proper case or controversy exists only when at least one plain­tiff “establish[es] that [she] ha[s] standing to sue,” ibid.—i.e., that she has suffered, or will suffer, an injury that is “concrete, particularized, and actual or imminent; fairly traceable to the challenged action; and redressable by a favorable ruling,” Clapper v. Amnesty Int’l USA, 568 U. S. 398, 409. Here, the plaintiffs’ theories of standing depend on the platforms’ actions—yet the plaintiffs do not seek to enjoin the plat­forms from restricting any posts or accounts. Instead, they seek to enjoin the Government agencies and officials from pressuring or en­couraging the platforms to suppress protected speech in the future.

      - From the decision. Link provided in article update.

  6. Dillinger   11 months ago

    >>The Court has issued a 6–3 decision in Murthy v. Missouri

    a. not has issued just issued.
    b. Alito, Thomas & Gorsuch in the dissent is telling.

    1. Mickey Rat   11 months ago

      We are aware which Justices have integrity.

      1. Dillinger   11 months ago

        seriously what the fuck seventh grade chick did Comey-Barrett turn into?

  7. Mickey Rat   11 months ago

    Lack of standing SCOTUS rulings are really frustrating when it is an issue you want a clear ruling on, is it not? It is different when it is your ix being gored.

    1. SMP0328   11 months ago

      Perhaps the Constitution should be amended to expand Article III standing. This decision reminds me of the Newdow decision from about 20 years ago. The Supreme Court seems to find a lack of standing when it is uncomfortable with the merits of a case and a lower court decision in that case.

      1. Á àß äẞç ãþÇđ âÞ¢Đæ ǎB€Ðëf ảhf   11 months ago

        Ima gonna guess this standing goes far beyond Article III and is mostly court-made, like qualified immunity, the commerce clause, and every other travesty of government boot licking.

        I bet Congress could fix this with a damned simple law. Of course they never will; Congress is most competent at passing the buck to the executive, the courts, and agencies.

        1. SMP0328   11 months ago

          I brought up amending the Constitution because the Court says that standing is based on Article III, so it probably wouldn't permit Congress to expand it by a mere statute.

          1. Á àß äẞç ãþÇđ âÞ¢Đæ ǎB€Ðëf ảhf   11 months ago

            Congress can already change standing, like saying certain cases have to be heard or can' be heard. IANAL and don't know of any by name, but I have read of Congress changing standing for specific kinds of cases or plaintiffs.

            They like to call it Article III standing, but I'd bet a paycheck it's only their interpretation of Article III. I bet it's the same twisted logic that created Qualified Immunity and Absolute Immunity.

          2. Zeb   11 months ago

            There's no clear statement in Article III regarding standing for a case like this as far as I can see. This is exactly the sort of place where congress can and should clarify things.

  8. Thoritsu   11 months ago

    WTF - Guess we have to look elsewhere to find which justices are compromise, big government scum, like Roberts, and which ones read the Constitution. Maybe the NYT will actually explain, with the opposite spin.

  9. sarcasmic   11 months ago

    Did a little digging and it appears the Court said the plaintiffs lack standing because they can't prove actual harm.

    Meaning it's ok to disregard the Constitution as long as nobody gets hurt.

    WTF?

    1. JFree   11 months ago

      That’s always been the case. Maybe the moron brigade here will understand that if the people want to protect the Constitution, their power to do so rests with their vote and their representation. Not a few careerist judges who have spent their lives polishing the states dingleberries. And not some sky God who will ensure that we worship even the parts of the Constitution that are 'victimless' if violated.

      Of course, we’ve spent well over a century reducing the power of the people to affect representation in favor of increasing the power of mass media to affect representation. So don’t hold your breath

      1. Á àß äẞç ãþÇđ âÞ¢Đæ ǎB€Ðëf ảhf   11 months ago

        Maybe the moron in question is you, not understanding how voters have almost no say in anything. Please, kind sir, would you explain how voters have any choice in this matter? How could voters have done anything to force Congress to force the courts to punish government when government does wrong?

        1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

          Voters COULD actually vote Libertarian! It's not against the law, you know! But most of them won't, because the REAL libertarians won't support self-righteous pussy-grabbing by "both sides"! Self-righteous power-hungry voters gotta be self-righteous power-hungry voters, so we're getting twat we (collectively) deserve! STOP yer pussy-grabbing first, and THEN try to persuade others to also stop!

          1. Á àß äẞç ãþÇđ âÞ¢Đæ ǎB€Ðëf ảhf   11 months ago

            They could write in Mickey Mouse for all the good it would do. They could reel off the 12 days of Christmas while standing on a watermelon, or hum Yankee Doodle in the checkout line. Got any other bright ideas?

            1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

              STOP yer pussy-grabbing first, and THEN try to persuade others to also stop!

              That's the key part!

              In more detail...

              Hey conservatives!!! How about a “Grand Compromise”? Y’all give up your “abortion boners”, in exchange for lib-tards giving up their “gun boners”?

              “Team R” politician: “The debt is too large, and government is too powerful. If you elect ME, I will FIX that budget-balance problem SOON! But, first things first! THOSE PEOPLE OVER THERE ARE GETTING ABORTIONS!!! We must make the liberals CRY for their sins! AFTER we fix that RIGHT AWAY, we’ll get you your budget balanced and low taxes!”

              “Team D” politician: “The debt is too large, and I’ll get that fixed soon, I promise you, if you elect ME! First, the more important stuff, though: THOSE PEOPLE OVER THERE ARE OWNING GUNS!!! We must PROTECT the American People from guns and gun-nuts!!! AFTER we fix that RIGHT AWAY, we’ll get our budgets balanced!”

              And then we gripe and gripe as Government Almighty grows and grows, and our freedoms shrink and shrink. And somehow, the budget never DOES get balanced!

              Now LISTEN UP for the summary: Parasites and politicians (but I repeat myself) PUSSY GRAB US ALL by grabbing us by… Guess what… by our excessive self-righteousness, tribalism, the “rush to judge” others, and the urge to PUNISH-PUNISH-PUNISH those “wrong” others! Let’s all STOP being such fools, and STOP allowing the politicians OF BOTH SIDES from constantly pussy-grabbing us all, right in our urge to… Pussy-grab the “enemies”, which is actually ALL OF US (and our freedoms and our independence, our ability to do what we want, without getting micro-managed by parasites)!!!

              Shorter and sweeter: The pussy-grabbers are actually pussy-grabber-grabbers, grabbing us all in our pussy-grabbers. Let us all (as best as we can) AMPUTATE our OWN nearly-useless-anyways pussy-grabbers, and the pussy-grabber-grabbers will NOT be able to abuse us all NEARLY ass much ass these assholes are doing right now!

              1. JFree   11 months ago

                Trying to convince 50%+1 of Americans to support an ideology is just playing the manipulators game. That’s why they froze the size of Congress in 1912. Back then it took an average of 22,000 votes to win a critter election (19 million votes for 435 seats * 50.1%). Today it’s 122,000 votes (106 million votes for 435 seats * 50.1%).

                You wanna win that game? It ain’t gonna be done via the sort of face-to-face retail politics that could be done in 1912. It takes the pollster, donors, top-down consultants, party/media institutions to play the wholesale politics game. Libertarians don’t have that and never will. Ideology is not part of that game.

                So play a different game. Personally I don’t think its gonna be possible to change the size of Congress except maybe as a last step. Meaning elections are useless. The opportunity is Congressional STAFF. Those were just in their infancy in 1910. Only Senators had a stenographer, a messenger, and an assistant clerk. Committees had just started having professional staff – but that means that only committee chairs (not newly elected critters) had the ability to control the work of Congress. Even more so now.

                Today – there are at least 13,000 DC based staff. More in district. All accountable only to incumbents not constituents. And imo vulnerable to the process by which they are selected since they are not an enumerated constitutional office and they are not elected. And FFS the critters have so entrenched them that staffers are now beginning to unionize because the critters stay around for decades until they pass seats to their spawn.

                I think it would be easy for a challenger to gain an electoral advantage by saying they would do the staff work of the job via a randomly selected ‘district assembly’. That is not trying to sell an ideology because by definition that assembly would tend to represent everyone via the law of large numbers. And it changes the game.

                1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

                  Anti-self-righteousness isn't an ideology... It's just plain common sense and benevolence! But try to explain THAT to those addicted to power piggery and to... self-righteousness!!! This struggle is ass old ass the human race, and I sure wish that I had a "fix"!

                  -Looking for my next "fix"!

        2. JFree   11 months ago

          Please, kind sir, would you explain how voters have any choice in this matter?

          a) Stop voting the way the manipulators want you to vote. It is not Congress that re-elects 90-95% of incumbent critters with a decades-long congress approval rating that approximates child molesters.
          b)Even if you don't have the power (yet) to actually change the tilt of the playing field in the election, you have the power to completely fuck with the 'predictability' of those manipulators. Pollsters, consultants, donors need predictability in order to spend tons of money messaging and manipulating. In particular, they need division in order to conquer. Stop playing that game. That means interact with other Americans directly not via online/media channels
          c)Grab your nuts and be a citizen not a subject. And no that does not mean stroking the barrel of your gun. If that's the outcome - you've already lost the divide/conquer game.

      2. Fire up the Woodchippers! (5-30 Banana Republic Day)   11 months ago

        With the way you democrats cheat, it’s going to come down to torches and pitchforks.

    2. Mickey Rat   11 months ago

      The Bill of Rights only offers protection if there is the will to demand the government abide by it. If that will does not exist, then those marks on paper mean little. If you lose a culture of free speech in society, then you lose free speech.

    3. Moderation4ever   11 months ago

      Maybe the solution is for lawyer taking cases to SCOTUS do a better job of meeting the standing requirement. Standing seems to be pretty straight forward so why are lawyers having trouble?

      1. Dillinger   11 months ago

        becomes subjective when all issues are political

        1. Moderation4ever   11 months ago

          I don't think this case is as subjective as you might think. First the plaintiffs were suing a third party for a perceived injury by a second party. The second party was private and could do as they pleased. The first amendment applies to government not to private entities. It is also unclear if what remedy the court could apply because one function of government is to provide people with information. Can you set up a clear line of when government information is acceptable and when it is not.

      2. Á àß äẞç ãþÇđ âÞ¢Đæ ǎB€Ðëf ảhf   11 months ago

        Because courts and Congress don't want to rock the government gravy train that pays them.

    4. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

      "Meaning it’s ok to disregard the Constitution as long as nobody gets hurt."

      Well yeah, don't punish anyone for victimless crimes! No victim, no crime, sounds good to me! The "victims" of FacePoooo (and others who take down their posts) can come and post here, at Parler, at Truth Social, etc.! I just hope the Government Almighty under Trump won't go and FORCE me to read the lies at Parler, at Truth Social, etc.!

      1. But SkyNet is a Private Company   11 months ago

        You mean , like, writing “Legal Fees” on a check memo and check register?

        1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

          Yes, I would recommend that ass beating the snot out of writing "illegal fees" in that them thar said spots, which is latently and blatantly inviting "the heat" to come and investigate and then beat you! NEVER 'fess up on your checks, "for illegal drugs", or you will get yourself AND yer drug dealer busted!!! ("A wild fling with Spermy Daniels" will be an OK annotation, ass long ass the funds cum from the right spots, by the way, AND your wife doesn't divorce you for shit.) ALSO do not write "for a non-prescribed cheap plastic flute"!!!!

          To find precise details on what NOT to do, to avoid the flute police, please see http://www.churchofsqrls.com/DONT_DO_THIS/ … This has been a pubic service, courtesy of the Church of SQRLS!

          1. But SkyNet is a Private Company   11 months ago

            So, you are completely full of shit and without principle.
            As always

            1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

              So you just LOVE begging for permission to blow upon a cheap plastic flute? Go right ahead and LOVE your slavery, but please STOP criticizing those who do NOT want your slavery! Go join Scientology; they'll be happy to enslave you all day every day!

    5. n00bdragon   11 months ago

      I would say "Welcome to law 101" but really, this is "Welcome to law for non-lawyers". You can't sue if you can't prove you were wronged in some particular way by the defendant in particular AND you can demonstrate how successfully suing will redress your grievance.

      1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

        "They took down my post and Hurt My Precious Baby Feelings" is the best that the whiners and crybabies can cum up with, and their "remedy" is either $$$MILLIONS from FacePooo and the like, or... Pubic (Government Almighty) ownershit of FacePooo etc, which = = MARXISM by any name!

        1. Zeb   11 months ago

          They harmed you and me by not allowing us to see the full range of discourse on certain topics. That's where the real harm lies.

          1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

            Yes, Parler DID do that! Can we get Government Almighty to PUNISH them, and will it do any good?

            https://www.techdirt.com/2020/06/29/as-predicted-parler-is-banning-users-it-doesnt-like/

            As Predicted: Parler Is Banning Users It Doesn't Like

          2. Moderation4ever   11 months ago

            But the limitations were set by private companies not the government. The government did advise the private companies on information that the government felt was false. It is a function of government to advise the public, that include internet media companies when they ask. The fact is there was plenty of discussion and discourse, what you object to is that false information was called out for what it was.

            1. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

              Yes, this! What WHINING conservatives object to is that "the market has spoken", and people have voted with their on-line feet, and fled AWAY from the cesspools and liars like "Parler" and "Truth Social", and have WILLINGLY gone to the likes of FacePooo, etc., which try to fence OUT the lies!!! And conservatives object to the free market! If ye don't like sites that willingly take inputs from government... Go someplace else! Enjoy your echo chambers elsewhere!

            2. Truthfulness   11 months ago

              The government did advise the private companies on information that the government felt was false.

              And this precisely is what violated the First Amendment. You and SQRLSY One left that out.

              It is a function of government to advise the public, that include internet media companies when they ask.

              No, it is not. The government is not a teacher or moral arbitrator, nor should it. The only powers it has is to prevent the loss of freedom of speech.

              The fact is there was plenty of discussion and discourse, what you object to is that false information was called out for what it was.

              On the contrary, much of what the government labeled false turned out to be true:

              – The Russia hoax, including the Steele dossier
              – The failure of the lockdowns
              – The efficiency of the COVID vaccines
              – The Wuhan lab leak
              – The Hunter Biden laptop story
              – The follies of global warming alarmism

              Of course we have a right to call them out. Why do you two support censorship by the government?

              1. Moderation4ever   11 months ago

                If you go on any government web site from local to national, you will find information that the government provides to people. This includes things like information to assist farmers, assist small businesses, provide health information. There are literally thousands of pieces if information provided by the government.

                As for your list, that you believe things to be false does not in fact make them so. I think if you spent more time actually studying the facts instead of going to conspiracy web sites you would find better answers.

              2. SQRLSY One   11 months ago

                – The efficiency of the COVID vaccines (picking just one).

                https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/united-states-rates-of-covid-19-deaths-by-vaccination-status?country=~All+ages
                Just LOOK at the interactive graph right at the top of this link!!!! COVID deaths among the unvaccinated VASTLY outnumbered, and still outnumber, the deaths among the vaccinated!!!

                Bleevers will BLEEVE, regardless of WHAT the data says, shit seems to me!

  10. sparkstable   11 months ago

    IANAL so someone please help me with this...

    Once SCOTUS takes a case aren't they sort of admitting that it is, in fact, a case and thus the parties to it have standing?

    Otherwise they shouldn't be taking the case in the first place. Unlike other levels of court, they have discretion on what cases to hear. There should never be an issue of standing at SCOTUS unless the case is actually about standing itself.

    Did the state argue that the plaintiffs did not have standing at lower levels? If all of the courts below SCOTUS decided that standing was settled and the decisions were based on other issues, then what prompted SCOTUS to take the case in the first place?

    1. SMP0328   11 months ago

      The Supremes can take a case to determine if a lower federal court was right to have found a plaintiff had standing.

      1. sparkstable   11 months ago

        But wouldn't that require standing to be a question in dispute in the lower rulings?

        Otherwise, SCOTUS can only comment on the specific question before it... meaning what case they took up, right?

        Did they take this case up as an issue of standing or as an issue for 1A violations? If the former, ok, fine... but then why did everyone treat the case as if it were the latter? And if they did take it up on the latter point, doesn't that make the former point not really justiciable since that isn't the question they are deciding?

        1. n00bdragon   11 months ago

          You can read the ruling linked in the first sentence of the article. These questions are addressed in the second paragraph of the decision: The District Court issued an injunction. The government appealed to the Fifth Circuit that the plaintiffs didn't have standing (among other appeals). The Fifth Circuit partially reversed and partially upheld the district court and ruled that the plaintiffs did have standing. The government appealed to the supreme court, which decided that the plaintiffs did not, after all, have standing.

  11. JFree   11 months ago

    Those last two paragraphs turn the article into a mess that bluntly looks more like Godwin rule.

    'Censorship' is not the decision by the BBC to editorially control its own platform. The article is not challenging the existence of a government platform (eg the GPO or franking privilege of Congress) to transmit its own info. That may well be a valid topic for an article but it is NOT the actual topic of the article here.

    The censorship of the BBC was about pressuring alternative outlets. Its actions to ensure monopoly. That is what would be comparable to the COVID pressure but it had shit to do with politics then The 1A may exist to ensure free speech in political/public stuff - but political stuff is NOT why alternative media platforms exist. Those are always a loss leader. Indeed that is why soft pressure by govt can work. Because pressure re politics doesn't challenge the important stuff - the ad-based revenue model that is driven by large companies.

    The BBC didn't plant some stake in the ground re standing up to the Nazis early. But nor did the free wheeling broadcasting environment in the US. So the author is just invoking the Nazis and appeasement as lazy sloppy 'analysis'

  12. JesseAz (5-30 Banana Republic Day)   11 months ago

    Again. Who has standing if states do not have standing? Courts have also dismissed users of social media who were canceled.

    Wish the court would just admit they don't care about executive overreach.

    1A cases are turning into 2A cases. Once a decade slapdowns of bad executive actions for them to ignore the next decade.

  13. Quo Usque Tandem   11 months ago

    I wonder how many Americans would support a US equivalent to Pravda, so long as their narrative gets promoted [and anyone else's gets banned]? I estimating at least 49.9%, and rising.

    1. sarcasmic   11 months ago

      MSNBC is Democrat Pravda and FOX News is Republican Pravda. So we’ve already got two.

      1. SMP0328   11 months ago

        I would put CNN alongside MSNBC and Newsmax TV alongside FOX News.

        1. Fire up the Woodchippers! (5-30 Banana Republic Day)   11 months ago

          You also out all of network news and nearly every national newspaper along with MSNBC.

  14. TJJ2000   11 months ago

    I'm baffled at such an obvious Constitutional Violation being dismissed. The only excuse I can see for SCOTUS to dismiss due to standing is the name of the case; Why did it go from Biden to Missouri? It should be Murthy v. the entity doing the arm-twisting violation of the 1st Amendment.

  15. Diarrheality   11 months ago

    So, individual rights are just dandy, excepted those rights anathema to the whims of the state. Got it. Seems little of our republic remains that isn’t helmed by the morally rudderless.

  16. Gaear Grimsrud   11 months ago

    Meanwhile even as SCOTUS shrugs Musk will not block CNN livestreams of the presidential debate. We really don't deserve this guy.
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/dmca-does-not-apply-musk-says-x-will-not-remove-cnn-debate-streams-footage
    The public has a right to see Presidential debates however they would like. DMCA does not apply.

  17. B G   11 months ago

    The CNN coverage on this decision would be comical if it weren't so chilling.

    In their take, the majority "dealt a blow to attempts to allow the conservative 5th Circuit to rule nationwide". You'd think they'd never described the makeup of the USSC as being a 6-3 "Conservative Majority", and might wonder why they've never published the phrase "liberal 9th Circuit" as if the 5th is the only Circuit which trends toward a particular ideology as opposed to "impartially" backing the Dem Party Line at nearly every opportunity.

  18. CindyF   11 months ago

    Just think if the media hadn't suppressed information on Covid, the vaccines, and alternative treatments. Ivermectin might have earlier been promoted as a treatment (studies have shown it is effective if used early) and fewer people might be suffering from vaccine injuries.

    Physicians are baffled at the increases in cancer and now wondering if Covid could cause aggressive cancers. It couldn't possibly be the vaccines so no need to look there for an answer. It MUST be Covid!

  19. CindyF   11 months ago

    "Consider one of the most colossal censorship errors ever made in a free, democratic republic. In 1934, Winston Churchill's speech condemning "the danger of ignoring German rearmament" aired over the national radio system, the BBC. Churchill was then silenced—for six years the BBC barred his appearance."

    So censorship has a history of creating history. Safe and effective!

    Well, effective at least.

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