Empire AI

Plus: Adult activists, Fani Willis' love life, Catholic crackdown, and more...

Building the empire: New York Governor Kathy Hochul, a Democrat, seems to think that $275 million worth of state funds need to be directed toward AI research.

In her State of the State address, which will take place later today, Hochul is expected to announce the Empire AI program, which aims "to put New York at the forefront of the artificial intelligence landscape," per a flattering New York Times writeup. It will use $275 million in public funds, along with $125 million in private funds, for a total price tag of $400 million.

A physical center will be built upstate, which researchers taking part in the consortium will be permitted to access, and the state will make "its own cloud computing infrastructure rather than building on top of existing platforms like Amazon or Google," which would be "a logistically complicated endeavor that could also raise concerns about security and reliability," per the Times.

"Access to the computing resources that power AI systems is prohibitively expensive and difficult to obtain," says Hochul in a statement. "These resources are increasingly concentrated in the hands of large technology companies, who maintain outsized control of the AI development ecosystem. As a result, researchers, public interest organizations, and small companies are being left behind, which has enormous implications for AI safety and society at large." Empire AI will apparently fix this.

Color me skeptical. We're already in a massive AI arms race, in which companies—OpenAI, Anthropic, Microsoft, Google—are competing to corner ever-larger swaths of the market. You mean to tell me that New York state employees are going to oversee the construction of a new physical center and cloud computing architecture, that this project will be completed on time, and that this new facility will in any way be competitive instead of lagging far behind existing players?

Trump goes to court: Former President Donald Trump will return to federal court today, to face a three-judge panel at the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals. The judges will issue a ruling as to whether Trump has "presidential immunity" from the charges special counsel Jack Smith has leveled for Trump's alleged attempt at election subversion.

Trump's "decision to attend is simultaneously a bid to jack up the political intensity around his court proceedings—which he has used to drive fundraising and as a rallying cry to his base—as well as a recognition that this fight may be a decisive legal battle," reports Politico.

"Trump's lawyers have argued that the broad legal immunity presidents are widely presumed to enjoy while in office extends to criminal cases filed against them after they leave office," reports Politico. "They also contend that, because Trump was acquitted by the Senate after his 2021 impeachment over some of the same issues raised in the criminal case, he cannot be prosecuted"—a double jeopardy argument.

If immunity is not granted, a federal trial on election interference will take place. The decision could also be appealed to the Supreme Court.

---

Scenes from New York: Yesterday at 9:30 a.m., protesters shut down the Holland Tunnel, the Brooklyn Bridge, the Manhattan Bridge, and the Williamsburg Bridge, demanding a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas.

The New York City Police Department arrested 216 people and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey arrested 109.

"The point is disruption," one protester, named Mon Mohapatra, told Gothamist. "We were trying to cause gridlock and traffic back-ups throughout downtown Manhattan at the same time."

Angry NYC driver shoves Palestine protesters blocking the Williamsburg bridge during rush hour traffic this morning out of his way

"You're disrupting traffic idiots, you can't do that, it's against the law" pic.twitter.com/0bQLsAgUHN

— Elad Eliahu (@elaadeliahu) January 8, 2024

At what point do New Yorkers say enough? These people are unserious. They don't appear to have jobs or families or industrious things to do at 9:30 a.m. on a Monday. The widespread masking signals either an authentic yet irrational fear of COVID, a performative gesture, or an interest in ensuring other people can't identify who is in these viral videos. When they get arrested, do they ever actually get charged with anything? Do the consequences ever reach them?

Has adult activist—and I think we should call them that, because lots of people dabble in the theatrical arts while young, but it takes a special breed of do-nothing narcissists to do it as an adult—become an entirely separate aesthetic, distinct from its social justice warrior precursor form?

#HAPPENINGNOW Police Make MASS ARRESTS at Holland Tunnel entrance in Manhattan #NYC after pro-Palestinian protesters blocked it demanding "Ceasefire Now" pic.twitter.com/UMBDwY3tad

— Oliya Scootercaster ???? (@ScooterCasterNY) January 8, 2024

---

QUICK HITS

• Fascinating thread:

Weird thing I've been thinking about: Has the West passed Peak Agency, i.e. people's ability to not just legally but de facto make empowered decisions about their own lives?

(You might get different answers if you look at e.g. the median person vs the average person.)

— Nate Silver (@NateSilver538) January 8, 2024

• "District Attorney Fani Willis improperly hired an alleged romantic partner to prosecute Donald Trump and financially benefited from their relationship, according to a court motion filed Monday arguing the indictment was unconstitutional," reports The Atlanta Journal-Constitution.
• A child should not be "the basis of a commercial contract" said Pope Francis on Monday, who called for a worldwide ban "to prohibit this practice universally." Last year, he said that, though technology could be used to help with conception, "it is wrong to create test tube embryos and then suppress them, to trade in gametes and to resort to the practice of surrogate parenthood."
• "Substack has a Nazi problem" discourse has fallen apart:

Don't know if I'm the first to post this in its entirety, but here's the statement Substack sent Casey Newton. Newton and his team only found six Substack accounts to pass on to Substack. Substack will ban five of them. Zero paid subscribers, total. pic.twitter.com/YbsEvpK8qE

— Jesse Singal (@jessesingal) January 9, 2024

• Daniel Ortega's regime has, over the last few weeks, imprisoned more than a dozen priests as part of a brutal crackdown on Catholicism in Nicaragua.
• Incredible National Review headline: "Don't even think about driving one mile above the speed limit." The British busybodies provide a helpful preview if trying to understand what their American counterparts might go after next.
• "As authorities and journalists scrambled to uncover information about the shooter who opened fire at an Iowa school on Thursday, far-right figures zeroed in on the likelihood that the assailant was LGBTQ," writes Matt Lavietes for NBC News. (Unfortunately, I have thoughts on Lavietes' piece.)
• Yes:

What I don't believe: Joe Biden is going to shed ~30 net points with voters under 30 and lose GenZ to Trump

What I do believe: Young voters are pissed, they never liked Biden *that* much in the first place, and there has been a structural decline in young male support for Dems https://t.co/eOabF3ABgw

— Derek Thompson (@DKThomp) January 9, 2024

Comments

[Chumby]

Lucky Gabriel

The Minister of Education of France, Gabriel Attal, has assumed the position of Prime Minister, becoming the youngest head of government in the country's history at the age of 34.

- Eurasia & Multipolarity

[SharonaJoanne]

I get paid more than $120 to $130 every hour for working on the web. I found out about this activity 3 months prior and subsequent to joining this I have earned effectively $15k from this without having internet working abilities Copy underneath site to..
Check It—>>> http://Www.Smartcareer1.com

[TheReEncogitationer]

So bipolar only worse?
🙂
😉
Between the First World pole and the Third World pole, Individual Rights and Free-Market Capitalism is getting involuntary shock treatment it doesn't even need.

[Dillinger]

wasn't one of the King Louises a Ute?

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Louis XIV. Became king in 1643 at age 4, passed away in 1715 at age 76.

[Dillinger]

gracias. pre-dating French history apparently.

[TheReEncogitationer]

He made big barrels of cheese puffs? Oh, wait, that's Utz.
🙂
😉

[Malvolio]

Napoleon was 30 when he became First Consul.

[CE]

Alexander was 20 when he became king of Macedonia.

[Fist of Etiquette]

...demanding a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas.

I like to think of the IDF and Hamas completely unaware of what these fuckwits are doing.

[Idaho-Bob]

Exactly. I'm waiting for thew crowds to start throwing these MF of the bridges they are blocking.

[Minadin]

Drop them off at the nearest river by the shortest means.

[Anomalous]

Drop them in the river, let them swim to the sea.

[Rich]

"Careful what you ask for...."

[Moonrocks]

Wasn't there already a ceasefire that Hamas happily broke multiple times? Is that what they're protesting?

[A Thinking Mind]

If only they stop enough traffic in New York, the IDF and Hamas will be so moved by sympathy for those poor drivers that they will forget all their grievances and nobody will want to kill anyone else.

[JesseAz]

You have to realize in the world of oppressor/oppressed fundamentalists, the oppressed have no agency for their own actions and the fault always lies on the oppressor.

[n00bdragon]

The great part is that anytime you want to do something awful all you have to do is claim to be a victim and voila, "you left me no choice!"

[DesigNate]

That fully depends on where you fall on the victim totem pole.

[TheReEncogitationer]

More likely, Hamas is aware and laughing at us.

[Mike Parsons]

I fully support people's right to protest and say what they want, and I dont want the state to infringe upon their right to do so in any way...

However, I do think the state should just step out of the way and let the people who's rights they are infringing upon to get some old west style street justice.

There is WAY to much fuck around happening, with little to no finding out here. You block my freedom of movement, you get a single warning, then you become a speed bump. Its only fair.

[damikesc]

There are no RICO prosecutions...why?

[R Mac]

We no longer have a legitimate justice system.

[Agammamon]

>However, I do think the state should just step out of the way and let the people who’s rights they are infringing upon to get some old west style street justice.

They would only do this for the anti-semites, not the people the anti-semites are hurting.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Has the West passed Peak Agency, i.e. people's ability to not just legally but de facto make empowered decisions about their own lives?

Infantilization can be empowering in its own right.

[Moonrocks]

It's comforting, not empowering.

[Chumby]

Man Eat Dog World

The Parliament of the Republic of Korea adopted a bill banning the breeding and slaughter of dogs for the purpose of eating their meat, the Chosun Ilbo newspaper reported.

The bill also prohibits the distribution and sale of dog meat and food products made from it for commercial purposes. Killing a dog for the purpose of obtaining its meat can result in up to 3 years in prison or a fine of 30 million won ($22.8 thousand). Breeding and distributing meat is punishable by up to two years in prison or a fine of 20 million won ($15,200). The bill has a transition period of three years, during which penalties will not be applied.

- Intel Slava Z

[Idaho-Bob]

Pig protection not far behind.

[Minadin]

Slava Z? Oh noes, Jeff's going to claim it's Soviet disinfo.

[Chumby]

Prepare for a Salon-athon retort.

[Mother's Lament]

It doesn't happen until Reuters or AP said it does.

Related: If AP really didn’t know it shared space with Hamas, why trust its reporting?

[mtrueman]

"Killing a dog for the purpose of obtaining its meat can result in up to 3 years in prison or a fine of 30 million won ($22.8 thousand)."

Killing a dog to obtain its meat in Korea is a particularly brutal business. The dog is hung upside down and beaten to death with a baseball bat, thereby tenderizing the meat. Such meat is said to be tastier than that of 'humanely' slaughtered dogs.

[JesseAz]

Would you say there is a dog genocide?

[mtrueman]

I'd say that killing a dog for meat in Korea is a brutal business. It involves hanging it upside down and beating it to death to tenderize the meat. The practice is so horrific and shameful that Korea, an increasingly important actor on the world stage is taking steps to ban it.

[Chumby]

Not if the dog was engaging in insgrrrection.

[Ajsloss]

What if the dog is all bark and no bite? Should we judge it based on proximity to a fire extinguisher?

[Minadin]

Being all bark and no bite is definitely a dog-whistle evidence of insgrrection, if January 6 is our guide.

[Nazi-Chipping Warlock]

Nobody cares what mtrueman says.

[Idaho-Bob]

Killing a dog to obtain its meat in Korea is a particularly brutal business. The dog is hung upside down and beaten to death with a baseball bat, thereby tenderizing the meat. Such meat is said to be tastier than that of ‘humanely’ slaughtered dogs.

The beating and electrocution practice was outlawed in 2007. Hitting an animal in the head does not tenderize the meat. If you are suggesting the dogs are beaten all over, this practice would cause deep bruising and make the meat gelatinous. This is exactly what roadkill meat looks like.

The prior practice has been to slaughter the dogs by electrocution, though some were hung or beaten over the head before exsanguination. Such practices are illegal under the 2007 Animal Protection Act and have become increasingly rare.

[Sevo]

It's trueman:

mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
"Spouting nonsense is an end in itself."

[Minadin]

It's a grey box.

[mtrueman]

"The beating and electrocution practice was outlawed in 2007."

Apparently the Chosun Ilbo is telling us the butchering and distribution of dog meat in Korea is being banned. Whatever happened in 2007 didn't accomplish what the legislators intended. Earlier, you wrote:

"Pig protection not far behind."

Pig butchering is done in factory like conditions on an industrial scale. It's much more transparent than the practices of dog butchering which is artisanal in nature, and more difficult to enforce any laws.

[n00bdragon]

Ah, the good old salami-slice approach to getting what you want. Put enough pressure on the canine slaughterhouses that it becomes artisanal, then go after the small-time producers for not living up to mass production standards.

[mtrueman]

"Ah, the good old salami-slice approach to getting what you want. Put enough pressure on the canine slaughterhouses that it becomes artisanal,"

It was never anything other than an artisanal, or small scale, non-industrial business. Idaho-bob doesn't know what he's talking about.

[Idaho-Bob]

Why does anything have to be industrial? Oh yeah, so government can control it.

[mtrueman]

Economy of scale is the what informed internet commenter call it.

[Idaho-Bob]

Pig butchering is done in factory like conditions on an industrial scale. It’s much more transparent than the practices of dog butchering which is artisanal in nature, and more difficult to enforce any laws.

I butcher a pig at my house every year. While everything is sanitary and the slaughter is humane, I assure you it is not "factory-like conditions".

[mtrueman]

"I butcher a pig at my house every year. "

If you're fishing for compliments, try someone else. Someone who eats pork.

[JesseAz]

Well this explains a lot of your ignorance on Hamas.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

OK, so that typically would make you either Jewish or Muslim, as most other people eat pork (unless they're vegan/vegetarian or have an allergy).

[mtrueman]

Hindus, Buddhists, and 7th Day Adventists also avoid pork. It's not as unusual as you imagine. Tibetans avoid 7 types of animal flesh - pork and dog, of course, as well as elephant, monkey, cat, fish and certain birds. (Human remains are disposed of via 'sky burial' whereby the cadaver is taken to an isolated place and chopped into bite sized morsels and left for the birds to eat.)

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Ah, but you're missing out on belly bacon, side bacon (aka Canadian bacon), ham, roast pork, pulled pork, pork barbecue, and even a proper Cuban sandwich.

[mtrueman]

I'm also missing out on the supposed restorative and stamina enhancing qualities that Koreans attribute to dog meat. It's a sacrifice I can live with.

Koreans in the pork business earn their living raising and butchering pigs. And they do so at an industrial scale. The same is not true for people raising dogs for butchery. They typically earn the bulk of their living growing and selling rice. As a sideline, they may have a cage or two containing a few forlorn canines. It's artisanal, in other words.

[Commenter_XY]

Chinese restaurants around the US hardest hit....

[Ajsloss]

According to mtrueman, the dog is hardest hit.

[Fist of Etiquette]

District Attorney Fani Willis improperly hired an alleged romantic partner to prosecute Donald Trump and financially benefited from their relationship...

What a time to be alive.

[Social Justice is neither]

Look, professional improprieties/corruption are off limits as part of your private life if you fuck your co-conspirators. This has been true for Democrats since at least the '90s.

[A Thinking Mind]

Does it count as sexual relations if she just gave you a BJ? Asking for a friend from Arkansas.

[Gaear Grimsrud]

Depends on what the meaning of the word is is.

[Ajsloss]

Depends on what your definition of "jizz" is.

[Anomalous]

Eatin' ain't cheatin'.

[Ajsloss]

I saw a public wedding (in the party area of a minor league baseball park) during which the groom was wearing a t-shirt that had those words under a picture of Clinton.

[Foo_dd]

sounds classy.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Well, at least it was a ball park and not a pop up in a cafe where no one else knew WTF was going on.

https://thehill.com/changing-america/enrichment/arts-culture/4396473-couple-has-pop-up-wedding-at-indiana-coffee-shop-without-permission/

According to a Facebook post, a couple hosted a “pop-up wedding” at Mansion Society on New Year’s Eve without getting permission to do so from the business. In the Facebook post, Mansion Society’s team wrote that it planned to open the business as normal on Dec. 31.

However, the post said their plan for the day was disrupted when “a full bridal and groomsmen party, a wedding officiant and patrons” took over the coffee shop, scattering gifts and personal items like coats and purses throughout the establishment.

Mansion Society’s team wrote that it had “zero knowledge” of the wedding prior to its start. The wedding party consisted of 20-30 people, per the coffee shop’s Facebook post.

Wedding attendees blocked the coffee shop’s entrance, preventing other customers from coming in, and asked employees to take their coats and purses. Mansion Society management reported that the wedding party even blocked the business’ parking lot by “lining cars along the entrance valet style,” instead of using the designated spaces.

In a second Facebook post, the Mansion Society team wrote that they initially did not attempt to stop the wedding because their business is located near another wedding venue. At first, employees on duty that day believed the wedding party was stopping in for coffee before moving on to the actual venue.

The bride later emailed the coffee shop, a post from the shop shows, offering a $200 donation. In its Facebook post, Mansion Society wrote that it declined the $200 donation and asked for $500 — its normal weekend rate for private events and rentals.

Mansion Society wrote that the wedding lasted “more than 20 minutes,” and that an invoice was sent to the couple. As of this article’s publication, it is unknown if the couple paid the bill Mansion Society sent them.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Seems like they'd get a lot more traction actually suing the couple for damages plus attorney's fees, due to the blocking the entrance and parking lot of their business. I suspect the cost of the business they lost was a hell of a lot more than $500.

[Minadin]

1790's

[Mickey Rat]

I am shocked that this type of corruption occurred on such an upstanding DA's watch.

[Spiritus Mundi]

It is ok when balck people do it because of historic bias.

[TheReEncogitationer]

Who is this group of which you speak?

[JesseAz]

Fani Willis gas been using the Trump case to funnel between 600k to 1M to her lawyer boyfriend. Has taken trips with him funded by this arrangement. Lawyer boyfriend has never prosecuted felony cases prior and was likely appointed illegally.

https://www.ajc.com/politics/breaking-filing-alleges-improper-relationship-between-fulton-da-top-trump-prosecutor/A2N2OWCM7FFWJBQH2ORAK2BKMQ/?utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=tw-card

When a dem accuses you of corrupt acts, they are likely doing so themselves.

[Moonrocks]

The irony of using a corruption prosecution as a vehicle for corruption.

[Spiritus Mundi]

Seems like RICO charges are warranted.

[JesseAz]

Looks like the prosecutor in question was also in contact with WH lawyers.

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/georgia-trump-prosecutor-accused-secret-disqualifying-romance-da-fani-willis

Phil Holloway ✈️
@PhilHollowayEsq
·
Follow
Replying to @PhilHollowayEsq
It literally says “conf with White House Counsel” in May of 2022
.
This is Fulton DA Fani Willis lead prosecutor in the Trump case billing taxpayers $2000 to talk to Joe Biden’s White House about prosecuting Biden’s political opponent

So a prosecution meeting with the WH to go after his most likely political opponent..

[HorseConch]

Do you really think Fani or anyone whow would hit that are nearly smart enough to do this on their own? The problem with having a bunch of DEI hires doing the dirty work is that there's always a trail. Of course nobody bothers to look.

[DesigNate]

That’s just a coincidence.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

Talking about the weather.

[Social Justice is neither]

I'm sure they were just talking about their grandkids. Nothing to see here folks.

[Malvolio]

Is Trump complaining that the prosecutor is incompetent? Does he have any standing to raise that objection? And if he does, still, why would he?

[Fist of Etiquette]

...to trade in gametes and to resort to the practice of surrogate parenthood.

THE CHILDREN BORN OF THAT ARE DEMONS, WHETHER THEY ARE GINGERS OR NOT.

[mad.casual]

After the whole “Hate the sin, not the sinner.” thing I was worried The Pope was going soft on The Church’s “Genocide The Gays” policy.

#FuckingCatholics #ScienceDeniers

[n00bdragon]

Good thing I don't need the permission of some shriveled old man in Rome to avail myself of modern medical science.

Observing a certain segment of people get super mad about IVF and surrogacy is pretty funny. I'm pretty sure it's people in the die-hard anti-abortion crowd trying to square the circle of cognitive dissonance around their very tortured set of beliefs. They generally seem to know very little about IVF or surrogacy and just want everyone to know that "they care, a lot" about ALL embryos.

[mad.casual]

I’m pretty sure it’s people in the die-hard anti-abortion crowd trying to square the circle of cognitive dissonance around their very tortured set of beliefs.

Hey Mr. "I wish I had a fancy hat too" IVF Pope. You do realize that the just like unpersoning and killing fetuses en masse has implications outside just birth, the buying and selling of proto-humans could have implications outside birth as well, right? That, fertilizing and losing your own eggs/sperm in your own reproductive endeavor is one thing, but paying others to carry the babies you can't have and/or buying embryos carries implications that you don't have to be a religious nut to portend.

[n00bdragon]

I can only speak from my own experience.

My wife and I have spent a lot of time in IVF clinics over the last five years for what started out as me being diagnosed as infertile and then strongly coming to suspect that both of our bodies were the problem. Luckily I suppose all of our embryos have been created between the two of us. Once they are made, the doctors have assured us, there is nothing wrong with them. Still, even with all the ones that we've created we've experienced a string of miscarriages and are now down to our last few embryos and have resorted to using a surrogate. Our surrogate is a nice woman from a nearby town who, for reasons I cannot fully understand, just likes being pregnant. This will be her third surrogacy and sixth delivery overall. She likes to maintain ties with the children she has given birth to and travels frequently to see them. She has gotten paid and is getting paid well for what she does, but to her it's about more than just the money (though the money certainly helps her out and she has her own personal reasons for needing more than a dual-income provides).

It's been my general experience that IVF clinics generally cater to two different types of people: Happy gay couples and sad straight couples. The elusive Strong Independent Woman Executive who is working on her career and can't be bothered with having a baby is not one of them. The gay couples seem to be most excited about the opportunity to have a child that shares genetics with at least one of the parents. Not being gay, I can't really speak to the appeal of that for the non-genetically involved parent, but for the genetically involved parent I can quite understand how important that is (even if I do think to myself "If you wanted a child so bad, why did you marry someone of the same sex?"). For the sad straight couples, it's not a place you wanted to go to, it's a place you ended up at.

The best analogy I've heard is that fertility is like a staircase. At the very top step, you're a newly wedded couple who have promised everlasting fidelity to each other and you're excited to start your lives together and you break-in the new double-size bed in the way that horny young people do. If you're lucky, the kids just happen, that's great. If it doesn't, you take a step down... to still romantic but regularly scheduled sex. You think yourself "gee, this a lot harder than I thought it would be." But marriage is worth it, and lots of people around you have experienced this so you tough it out, and if you're lucky, the kids still happen, that's great. If it doesn't, you take a step down, to the kind of sex that is no longer fun. This is when you start talking to doctors and they'll recommend you fancy lubricants and uncomfortable sex positions and one or both people start to feel like a machine that is expected to put out. You probably know at least one person who has gone through this and they'll tell you "this is a lot harder than it's actually supposed to be" so you tough it out, and if you're lucky, the kids may actually happen, that's great. Eventually, one or both of you will get diagnosed infertile... and you take a step down the stairs. The doctors will point at something and tell you that it just can't happen in the normal way. The only way is IVF. They'll hit you up with these fancy presentations. You go to an orientation and everything. It's very slick; and the doctors will tell you "oh, it's a 90% chance of success". IVF is bulletproof. They'll tell you that most infertility is because of genetic abnormalities and IVF screens for that, once you have your golden embryo you just implant it and bang, zoom, you have a kid. But wait, there's more! Modern health insurance plans offer cover IVF, so it's not even expensive they say. It's a really nice sales pitch. Like with all sales pitches though, its only partially true.

IVF consists of two main parts, both of which are very unpleasant for the woman and extremely expensive. The first part is generating eggs. During a woman's normal menstrual cycle her ovaries begin developing a large number of eggs. Eventually, the most developed of these eggs will begin producing a hormone that suppresses the others. Those eggs die off permanently as the one remaining egg develops and is eventually released into the uterus. During IVF, she takes daily injections which are both very painful and eyewateringly expensive (think buying a cheap car) to keep her body from suppressing the growth of the extra eggs (this also leads to very uncomfortable bloating sensations). At the height of her cycle, she undergoes anesthesia and doctors poke a hole into her ovaries to suck out the ripe eggs with a tube. At the same time, the man jerks off in a cup and a laboratory tech will sift through the semen to manually select suitable looking sperm and inject them into each of the eggs. The embryos are then gestated for a few days to see if they begin developing (only about half or less of the original egg count will usually take). Once they're about 100 cells, a small genetic sample is taken from what is effectively the egg shell (not the actual embryo) and the embryo is frozen. At this point most people will run basic chromosomal count testing on their embryos. This is also very expensive (about 5 grand) and is used to weed out embryos with non-normal chromosome counts, as the chances of these developing in a uterus are very low and are obviously defective. This selection isn't exactly rare either. It's entirely normal for a woman to lose 50% of her embryos in this process. At the parents' option (and for an extra fee), further genetic testing can be done (usually for rare and specific genetic disorders the parents are aware that they carry and may not wish to risk passing on). Once all this is said and done, a woman in her late 30s or early 40s will be fortunate to have a single viable embryo. Younger healthier women can probably expect more than a couple though. Keep in mind that a lot of the statistics around fertility suffer massive selection bias because the sorts of couples who seek out IVF are often suffering from various fertility issues to begin with, so in this sense the "sad straight couples" often end up with worse results from their overall sicker/older bodies while the "happy gay couples" tend to beat the odds with their healthier/younger bodies, but every couple's experience is different. Also worth pointing out, everything up until now is referred to in the terminology as a "cycle". An IVF cycle consists of one egg retrieval and any number of following transfers, even zero. Personally, I strongly believe this is an absolutely horrible terminology to use that muddies the waters terribly when talking about IVF and its success. A woman who goes through one retrieval and ten transfers has not gone through the same amount of medical rigamarole as a woman who had one retrieval and no transfers, but this is the terminology as it is used. Either way, now you have some amount of frozen embryos which are signed off and certified genetically "normal", probably more than zero, but probably less than ten. Once the woman has recovered from this extremely invasive surgery, it's time to do more drugs (that are also expensive, but not as much as much as the retrieval drugs, this whole process will only set you back about as much as a trip to Disneyland) which are also painful. <uch more painful than the retrieval drugs, because they involve daily injections with a huge needle right in the ass, every day, from a month before the transfer up until the end of the first trimester should be so lucky to get pregnant. The "surgery", if you can even call it that, is much less invasive for the transfer. You don't even need sedation. There's a lot of paperwork to sign, confirming whose embryo is about to be stuck in whom, and then basically prop the woman up on her back, stick a catheter all the way up her hoo ha, and deposit the egg. That's it. Wham, bam, thank you ma'am. It takes like ten minutes, tops. She continues taking the butt shots every day for two weeks until she can start seeing results in a pregnancy test. They call her in for a blood test, and measure the hormone levels being produced by the embryo, if it looks good (not at all guaranteed, this is all a gamble) she keeps going to six weeks when they do an ultrasound for a heartbeat (also a gamble, no guarantees on this one), and then shortly thereafter she gets discharged to her ob/gyn as a normal pregnancy and stops special medications at the end of the first trimester. From this point onwards, complications and miscarriages are rare (but not impossible!) and it's more or less a normal pregnancy (with all the attendant risks that assumes).

That was probably a lot to take in, but that's how IVF actually works, including all the stuff they don't tell you. It's a lot of money for what is essentially a gamble, but can you really put a price on your own flesh and blood? As the expression goes "thank god, its only money." If it doesn't work the first time, the doctors will tell you, like any good street hustler, that it was just your poor luck and you should try again. And again. And again. They'll go forward with this seemingly any number of times as long as you and your partner are willing to cough up the dough and keep suffering the medications. Eventually, you may decide that you simply cannot do this any more, or you suspect the doctors are not analyzing the woman's uterus closely enough and must be missing something. For any number of reasons you might take that last step down, to surrogacy. This is the very bottom of the fertility staircase. You are now in the dark basement of how-to-have-kids, and you may look up the staircase and wonder how you got here and the answer is that every little step didn't seem like that much, but now you're looking to pay $100,000+ for the opportunity to take a chance to roll the dice on sticking your pie in a strange woman's oven for the desperate chance to have a kid. Maybe it is immoral. Maybe it is an affront to nature. Maybe. But I guarantee you, as someone who has stood at the bottom of that staircase, it changes your perspective. You can't accurately judge the decisions of a person like that in that situation. Simplistic moral frameworks have long since broken down and you'll be confronted with a very complicated understanding of what counts as a human, what it means to be alive, to be a parent, to be a child. All this stuff will be swirling around inside your head but the only constant, like a lighthouse in a storm, is that you want to be a parent and that you want to have a child. You can judge me if you want, but I really don't care. If my child is born from this, it's worth it. My conscience is clean. I would rather my child exist than not exist and there's nothing violating the NAP going on, so aside from that I don't really care about anyone's human dignity or god's approval or weird ideas about who counts as the "true" parents of a child are (the contracts are extremely explicit in this regard, there is no ambiguity, it's mine, the child of my wife and myself, and no one else).

I realize your post was probably not meant as a serious inquiry, but you got a serious reply anyway. I hope when you read it you can understand the level of care that went into it. I know you're a reasonable person and I hope that it can shed some light on a topic you might not be familiar with, and I hope it can allow you some empathy towards people you might not have previously understood well.

[mad.casual]

I can only speak from my own experience.

Ah, so never having been The Pope, you can't know whether he was specifically condemning Mr. and Mrs. n00bdragon (for whom you have no trouble speaking on behalf of both parts and more) or whether he was indicting the culture that is progressively grinding up more and more babies because it's inconvenient inhumane to all the feminist-studies, would-be-author baristas out there and other people treating parenthood less like a gift and more like an Amazon Wish List.

I'd ask whom, between Britain (Lassez-faire), France (case-by-case), and Switzerland (outright ban) has the most NAP-observant and/or not-too-Christian-zealot-y approach to "savior siblings", but you've made it pretty clear that you can't think past your own dick.

[n00bdragon]

Sir, I hope you have the day your attitude deserves.

[mamabug]

I can appreciate your personal experience (I have also been through the fertility struggle and my husband was adopted so has experience on the other end). However, there are just as many (if not more) stories on the other end which puts question to whether the system actively propagates harm and exploitation to the most vulnerable involved in the transaction (the surrogates and the babies) to the extent that it far outweighs benefits realized by the contracting couple.

I'm highly skeptical that it does. I put this in the same category as medically assisted suicide - on paper it may be possible for it to be thoroughly ethical and in line with a libertarian philosophy of personal freedom, but in practice it is impossible to implement with any appropriate level of safeguards against exploitation and abuse.

[mad.casual]

My old school libertarian philosophy ([glances left-then-right and leans in] I know people who were infertile before IVF and were essentially told "Suck it up."), if you pushed the fat man off the overpass and he got hit by the train you were still guilty even if you stopped the train and saved lives.

But since that assessment was created by a woman without a funny hat rather than The Pope, I presume that, somehow, makes libertarians insufficiently Christian and Evil and, therefor, more rational.

[n00bdragon]

I am very skeptical of the "more stories on the other end" argument, because I'm not a part of them. Neither I nor anyone I'm involved with is harming anyone. Neither I nor anyone around me is exploiting or being exploited or harmed. So why should we stop because someone somewhere might possibly be doing something bad? The people who are doing bad things should stop doing bad things. Also, I want to zero in on one particular statement here so apologies if I'm reading into this way more than I should "it far outweighs benefits realized by the contracting couple". This is just baffling to me; benefits according to whom? This is the life or death of their child. Perhaps it would be "better" in some plane of ethics for my children to be grown in the womb of their own mother, but given my wife's medical history of miscarriages that is almost certainly condemning them to do death. I'd rather give them a life they can live to be ashamed of (if they choose to let it bother them at all) then none at all. There is very little in terms of "risks" that I see as outweighing the very life of that child. If I were a woman (with a history of uncomplicated pregnancies) I would probably not offer myself up as a surrogate, but who am I to judge the people who do? And I'm not so full of pride as to turn down their offer to help.

I see this as the fundamental opposite of something like "medically" assisted suicide. MAS is offensive because it's not medicine. Medicine heals people. It makes them more whole. It is a restorative, curative, or assistive process that makes their lives better (the very opposite of harm). Killing people is harming them, straight up. There's no other way to slice that. Assisted Reproduction on the other hand is doing the very opposite of that, it is preventing death and creating life. Are there ethical dangers? Of course. There are ethical dangers in almost all areas of medicine, where a knowledgeable class of people exercises judgement (and effectively, power) over the very lives of less knowledgeable people. The point is not to ignore those ethical concerns, they are real; but confront them and purposefully avoid them. A lot of effort by a lot of people went into screening the surrogate we work with to make sure she's not being exploited or harmed, and screening my wife and I to make sure we're on the up and up. It may surprise you that the surrogates themselves are the ones primarily in control of the arrangement. I can't speak for all surrogacy services, but through the one we work with, she chose to work with my wife and I, not the other way around.

[JesseAz]

Found where sarc and Jeff are getting their trump Hitler talking points. New Republic is out describing out Trump support is the same as the growth of the SS. Justified lawfare against conservatives. Even calla trump voters insurgents.

https://newrepublic.com/article/177796/polls-republicans-trump-maga-fascism

My favorite part, and Jeff is guilty is the continued use of trump using the word vermin as proof he is Hitler. This despite the corporate media calling trump and conservatives vermin for years.

https://twitter.com/0rf/status/1732746683274932259

[sarcasmic]

Never read New Republic, sorry. Though now that you mention it there are parallels between the rise of red hats and brown shirts.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Yeah I don't read New Republic either.

I just know history and recognize these types of dehumanization tactics when they occur. It becomes easier to justify horrible treatment against a group of people when those people are not regarded as fully human in the first place.

And to the extent that some left-wingers are using the same tactic on YOU and your team, you should be concerned about it too. Oh look, there's a bunch of people calling you vermin. Do you think that makes it easier for them to later justify violating your rights and depriving you of your liberty?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Again with the faux outrage about "dehumanization" which you are perfectly willing to engage in yourself.

[JesseAz]

I mean I even provided jeff the evidence of his talking point regarding dehumanization. His preferred media is rampant with it according to his arguments. Yet he demands we only use those sources.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

EVEN IF TRUE - is the dehumanization wrong when it occurs? Yes or no?

[Agammamon]

No.

At some point you have to accept that the Democrats don't see you as human - and thus you no longer have an obligation to.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

And why can't you just address the topic:

Is it wrong if left-wingers dehumanize you? If so, why is that? Is it because it makes it easier for them later on to justify depriving you of your liberties, because they don't regard you as having equal stature as them under the law?

[sarcasmic]

They won't address the topic because you're not a human and thus not worthy of an honest conversation.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Of course. I've asked repeatedly here if they would be willing to condemn what Trump said regardless of what anyone else might have said. You are the only one willing to do that, no one else is. Either they deflect or they outright support Trump in calling illegal immigrants "vermin" and "poisoning the blood of America".

They are totally fine with the dehumanization tactic because I suspect they don't truly regard illegal immigrants as human beings with the same moral stature as themselves. They really are pests to them.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

You've been told several times, but for some reason, you want conflate things and turn him into TrumpHitler.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

You pointedly have not.

And are you just stupid, or what? It is possible to believe he's not 'literal Hitler' and still condemn his words as coming from the Hitler style guide.

[Mother's Lament]

1. Trump calls Nazi's and Marxist's vermin.

2. Jeff is horrified that Trump called Nazi's and Marxist's "vermin" and posts about it like it was a bad thing.

3. Conclusion: Jeff is a Nazi or a Marxist.

[sarcasmic]

1. Trump dehumanizes people you despise.

2. jeff objects to the dehumanizing of people.

3. Conclusion: jeff isn't human.

[JesseAz]

Can you prove item 2 as Jeff has never said a word about the corporate media he shills for dehumanizing people prior? He has defended Biden's red speech. I can probably think of more examples.

Basically, prove your bald assertion. Jeff's being horrified seems awfully selective.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Number 2 is patently false.

[Mother's Lament]

1. Trump dehumanizes people you despise.

You're right Sarckles, I do despise "Marxists, fascists and communists". I guess you don't.

It actually explains why I've never seen you or Jeff attack Misek when he starts his Protocols of the Elders of Zion shit.

[sarcasmic]

It has been proven over and over that they will defend literally anything Trump says.

[JesseAz]

You mean that we actually read/listen to what Trump says instead of lying about it and them claiming we are just quoting an article?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

“Is it wrong if left-wingers dehumanize you?”

No. They do it all the time. Who cares?

This discussion has been had before.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Why is it not wrong for left-wingers to dehumanize you? You don't think that dehumanization will make it easier for them to take away your liberties in the future?

Your tribe already acts as if it is an oppressed minority. Why would you be comfortable with seeing your tribe dehumanized?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"Why is it not wrong for left-wingers to dehumanize you?"

It's called having a thick skin Jeff. Also called being a grown-up.

They have already taken away my liberties in the present. I don't care about the name-calling (which you also engage in Jeff, stop fucking pretending that you don't).

Grow a thicker skin.

"Your tribe already acts as if it is an oppressed minority. Why would you be comfortable with seeing your tribe dehumanized?"

This is projection of the first order.

[Mother's Lament]

What Trump said: “We pledge to you that we will root out the communists, Marxists, fascists and the radical left thugs that live like vermin within the confines of our country"

Which one of these is Jeff identifying with since he's horribly upset about being called "vermin"?

Fascists are indeed a minority.

[JesseAz]

How much would he weigh with a thicker skin?????

[n00bdragon]

Why is it not wrong for left-wingers to dehumanize you?

“The surest way to work up a crusade in favor of some good cause is to promise people they will have a chance of maltreating someone. To be able to destroy with good conscience, to be able to behave badly and call your bad behavior 'righteous indignation' — this is the height of psychological luxury, the most delicious of moral treats.”
--Aldous Huxley

To believe that your enemy no longer sees you as human is critical to believing that they, themselves, are not human, and thus justify your own excesses.

[Social Justice is neither]

Summer of Love 2020 surely showed us that. But please, continue telling everyone that leftists are all sunshine and rainbows and the assaults and executions for party affiliation were all hoaxes.

[DesigNate]

““We pledge to you that we will root out the communists, Marxists, fascists, and the radical left thugs that live like vermin within the confines of our country," he told a New Hampshire crowd.”

https://www.npr.org/2023/11/17/1213746885/trump-vermin-hitler-immigration-authoritarian-republican-primary#:~:text=%22We%20pledge%20to%20you%20that,to%20authoritarianism%20in%20the%20speech.

Why don’t you hold people who espouse and support those murderous collectivist ideologies in contempt?

To answer your questions: they showed throughout 2020 and 2021 that they are more than willing to curb stomp everyone’s rights whether or not they dehumanize them first. So them calling anyone names is just icing on the cake so to speak.

[Nobartium]

Leftist have never cared about rights or property.

Nothing they do regarding usage of language changes that.

[Agammamon]

And which group is doing the dehumanizing?

Oh yeah, the Democrats.

'YT people'

'Toxic masculinity'

'Magadiots'

'Deplorables'

'domestic terrorists'

'Republicans pounce'

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Don't forget "up against the wall mother fucker" one of their slogans from the 60's.

[JesseAz]

Even in the article I linked they call them insurgents due to their beliefs. Jeff doesn’t care about word usage unless he can use it to attack his enemies.

Both him and sarc freely call people bigots and racists as well for daring to not want an invasion over the border at a cost of 10s of billions a year

[Jefferson Paul]

The most obvious one is the banal slur, MAGAts, to sound like Maggots. Is it not dehumanizing to call someone a maggot? I don't seem to have ever heard you, Jeff, complain about the left "dehumanizing" MAGA Republicans like that. Perhaps you have been a vocal critic of it. If so, please cite a few occasions where that drew your ire anywhere close to your Trump screed over "vermin."

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

I just know history and recognize these types of dehumanization tactics when they occur.

Wait, between 2016 and 2020, Democratic politicians got angry with any other Democratic politician that would sit down with Trump and openly declare they were "humanizing" Trump and his supporters. And the press was skeptical of anyone who "humanized" him, demanding a response which literally led public figures to say, "No, don't worry, I wasn't humanizing him!"

So... is dehumanization good or bad?

[EISTAU Gree-Vance]

“….,violating your rights…”

“Rights”? Illegals have no right to be here.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Justified lawfare against conservatives.

Based on that ZeroHedge debate that I watched on Jan. 6, I now know what your team regards as 'lawfare': it means applying the law to conservatives in the context of the current legal system, which you all regard as totally rigged. So prosecuting Jan. 6 defendants who committed real crimes is 'lawfare'. Your team has made a mockery of the term with your continued victimhood complex.

[sarcasmic]

"Lawfare" is the equivalent of a kid getting caught with his hands in the cookie jar saying he's innocent because his sister stole cookies and got away with it.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Should there be equal treatment under the law in a civilized country or no?

[sarcasmic]

If it means prosecuting Democrats, yes. If it means giving Trump a pass, no.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

If only one side is prosecuted, is it valid to complain about it?

[sarcasmic]

It's valid to bring it up, but at some point the constant whining and crying and bitching and moaning about how poor, poor Trump is the most victimy victim to ever strut down Victim Lane in Victomtown becomes utterly insufferable.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

The most victimy victim to ever strut down Victim Lane in Victomtown describes you very well.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Well, it is whine-o'clock somewhere.

[sarcasmic]

Great. Go there and whine about how Trump is such a victim and how everyone is sooooo unfair to the poor victim.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

It's about you, Sarc. For some reason, you seem rather fixated on the man, claiming anyone who defends anything he's ever done must be a Trumpista or Trump Cultist, or something along those lines. You claim this of people who adore him as well as people who merely see the double standards being applied to him, even though those people really cannot stand the man. You do it to those of us who are ambivalent regarding the man. Shit, Sarc, you even drag your own hatred of Trump into threads that have absolutely nothing to do with Trump in any way, shape, or form.

Has Trump done wrong? Maybe. Is he being held to a double standard by Democrats who would look the other way if a Democrat did the act? Yes. Therein lies the problem. They also seem to take particular issue with the man, and probably because apostasy is the worst crime one can do. He was a Democrat and turned against them. Remember that when you see people attacked by a left that has gone religious, that they save their most vicious attacks for those who've abandoned their "church".

Apostasy is the worst crime to them.

[sarcasmic]

You claim this of people who adore him as well as people who merely see the double standards being applied to him, even though those people really cannot stand the man.

There's a big difference between recognizing he's being treated unfairly, and saying that that unfairness makes him innocent of everything.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

There’s a big difference between recognizing he’s being treated unfairly, and saying that that unfairness makes him innocent of everything.

Then maybe it’s time you followed your own advice.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Has Trump done wrong? Maybe.

MAYBE? That is the best you can do? That type of equivocation is why you and your team are called Trump cultists. Even when the evidence is overwhelming and undeniable, after being browbeaten into taking a stand, the best you can do is offer a very weak equivocating "well, maybe he screwed up".

Why can't you just state, plainly and clearly, that Trump HAS done wrong?

[InsaneTrollLogic]

MAYBE? That is the best you can do? That type of equivocation is why you and your team are called Trump cultists.

Well, Jeffy, has he been convicted of anything in a criminal court of law? If not, then I have no confirmation one way or the other.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

You are attempting to weasel out of it and you know it. "Doing wrong" does not require a criminal conviction. You are free to pass judgment on him without requiring a criminal conviction yet you don't.

You just won't criticize him directly in public. So that makes you either a dishonest Trump cultist or a coward.'

Why don't we start with his "vermin" and "poisoning the blood" comments. Not illegal, not a crime, nor should it be. But, was it wrong for him to say? Yes or no?

[Mother's Lament]

"Why can’t you just state, plainly and clearly, that Trump HAS done wrong?"

Notice that Lying Jeffy will never actually tell you what he think's Trump has done wrong, except that somehow it's bad to call "communists, Marxists and fascists" "vermin.

[JesseAz]

Jeff is justifying the lawfare against Trump because he is fully convinced he is guilty. Investigating a man, not a crime.

[sarcasmic]

Why don’t we start with his “vermin” and “poisoning the blood” comments. Not illegal, not a crime, nor should it be. But, was it wrong for him to say? Yes or no?

You can be certain that if Biden said that about Trump supporters that he'd be having kittens.

[DesigNate]

“There’s a big difference between recognizing he’s being treated unfairly, and saying that that unfairness makes him innocent of everything.”

I call absolute bullshit on this continued claim of yours. Literally nobody is saying that his being treated unfairly proves his innocence. But I’m a big enough man to admit if I’m wrong if you prove it.

[DesigNate]

“You are free to pass judgment on him without requiring a criminal conviction…”

Well that’s a relief. I look forward to you not giving anyone grief over their judgements of Biden anymore.

[Mother's Lament]

Sarcasmic, when Trump said "vermin" he was referring to Communists, Fascists and Marxists who live like (not are) "vermin".

See: “We pledge to you that we will root out the communists, Marxists, fascists and the radical left thugs that live like vermin within the confines of our country”

Now why do you think that Jeff would be upset that Trump called fascists "vermin".

Do you disagree with Trump that "communists, Marxists, fascists and the radical left thugs live like vermin"?

Also, why are you pretending he was talking about Mexicans and Democrats? Do you think Mexicans and Democrats are "communists, Marxists, fascists", and so that must be who Trump was actually talking about?

[DesigNate]

“You can be certain that if Biden said that about Trump supporters that he’d be having kittens.”

Trump supporters aren’t a murderous ideology responsible for the pain, suffering, and death of 10’s of millions of people. Tha fuck kinda comparison is that.

[sarcasmic]

I'm getting exhausted watching you guys jump through hoops to justify everything Trump says.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Literally nobody is saying that his being treated unfairly proves his innocence.

What about the people around here who complain about Trump allegedly being treated unfairly, by trying to minimize or defend Trump's actions?

Again these two claims are different:

"Trump may have acted wrongly but he is being treated unfairly."

and

"Trump is being treated unfairly, why what he did wasn't all that bad after all!"

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Well that’s a relief. I look forward to you not giving anyone grief over their judgements of Biden anymore.

Look. I don't give people grief about their judgments of Biden when those judgments are based in FACT. I don't think he's been a terribly good president, I did not vote for him, I am not planning on voting for him, he's a walking corpse at this point. I take issue when the criticisms are simply ridiculous or flat wrong. Because I utterly despise this post-truth era that we are living in.

[DesigNate]

I guess I just think there is far more factual evidence of Biden corruption/wrong doing vs. so much manufactured outrage during Trump's administration.

*shrug*

[Mother's Lament]

"I’m getting exhausted watching you guys jump through hoops to justify everything"

You still haven't explained why you and Jeff think Trump calling "Marxists, fascists and Communists" vermin is wrong.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

It's a valid complaint, unless it involves trump. What truly matters is the personalities involved, not the facts.

-sarc

[sarcasmic]

That's what you call the incessant wailing about how Trump is such a poor, poor victim? Personalities?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

That's what I call your statement that you would rather be wrong than agree with someone you hate.

Yes, yes, I know that was not your exact words, but it was the substance.

[sarcasmic]

Coming from someone who would rather poke his eyeball out with a fork than express agreement with myself or jeff, that's pretty rich.

[Mother's Lament]

"than express agreement with myself or jeff"

Bertram doesn't like to lie, which is generally what agreeing with Jeff involves.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Sarc, somewhere below you made a post about gun registration – I agree with that post.

And I still have both my eyeballs.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

sarcasmic 33 mins ago
Coming from someone who would rather poke his eyeball out with a fork than express agreement with myself or jeff, that’s pretty rich.

Have you ever noticed that some of us don't criticize every comment you make. Maybe it's because you made a decent one we agree with. Yet, I know I still have both my eyes.

You, on the other hand, said this the other day,

https://reason.com/2024/01/03/harvards-affirmative-action-hire-gets-the-boot/?comments=true#comment-10382225

sarcasmic 5 days ago
I’m saying that some people are so despicable that I’d rather disagree with them then have something in common with them.

If we can agree with you, then why do you have such a hard time the other way 'round?

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Yes there should be equal treatment under the law.

That the treatment is not exactly equal does not excuse or justify the actual crimes were committed.

In other words there is a difference between:
"He committed acts of violence on Jan. 6 and he should be punished for his crimes but he is being treated unfairly by the courts"

and

"Even though he committed acts of violence on Jan. 6, the system is totally rigged and he should be pardoned for his crimes"

I see a lot more of the latter than the former.

[sarcasmic]

The latter is more like "Democrats are worse! Summer riots were worse! The election was stolen! That makes Trump innocent!"

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

That's not what I see here. I think jeff and sarc are projecting your own victim mentality onto others.

I don't give a fuck about trump generally, but I think the hypocrisy around riots and rioters by the left is very clear. To the left, rioters have nearly always been the good guys (Watts riots, LA riots, 2020 summer of love, CHAZ, occupy wall street, etc, etc, etc). And left wing politicians regularly make statements supportive of the rioters.

Until one of the few right wing riots occurs and all of a sudden leftists now deplore rioting and demand prosecution.

"It's different when we do it" is the rallying cry of the left.

[sarcasmic]

"Trump is innocent because they did it first" is the rallying cry of the right.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Keep the left from doing it, and you won't have to worry about the right doing it in response. One side being allowed to indulge in a double standard isn't any better for the stability of the US, but it's obviously beneficial for Our Democracy.

[sarcasmic]

Two wrongs make a right (winger)?

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

One side should allow itself to live under the other's anarcho-tyranny?

[sarcasmic]

Adopting the tactics of evil doesn't make you good.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

It's an existential issue, not a moral one. Especially if you don't actually believe in an afterlife.

[sarcasmic]

"We had to become evil to stop evil from winning."

[InsaneTrollLogic]

sarcasmic 3 mins ago
“We had to become evil to stop evil from winning.”

As in the Democrats need to destroy democracy to save democracy?

[sarcasmic]

The only people destroying democracy are those who refuse to accept the outcome if they don’t win, and then actively try to change it.

If you mean the primary ballots, I’m quite certain the Supremes will make the right choice and slap down ME and CO.

edit: cue up a long list of "whatabout" and "they did it first" statements to justify destroying democracy.

[DesigNate]

Sarc, you know both parties refuse to accept outcomes right? I mean, Stacy Abrams was still insisting she was governor all the way up until at least 2020. Shit, if I remember my history correctly, some people refused to accept that Lincoln had won.

And yet the Republic, and our democratic voting system, survives. (For now at least.)

(Edit: This isn't whataboutism or they did it first, just pointing out that it continues a long line of either party fighting against their losses)

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Sarc, you know both parties refuse to accept outcomes right?

Both sides grouse and complain about it. Only Trump however went too far in his ACTIONS to try to remain in power even when he lost.

Stacey Abrams didn't organize a rally and tell her supporters to "protest peacefully" at the Georgia state Capitol where a riot broke out trying to stop the transfer of power in Georgia.

Why can't you recognize the fact that what Trump did was DIFFERENT than what Stacey Abrams or Hillary Clinton or even Al Gore did when they lost their very close elections?

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Both sides grouse and complain about it. Only Trump however went too far in his ACTIONS to try to remain in power even when he lost.

And when it came time for Inauguration Day, what did Trump do? Did he hunker down in the Oval Office and refuse to budge? Were even any of the "R" keys from the keyboards missing? Please, Jeffy, tell us what Trump did that day, January 20, 2021.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

ONCE AGAIN you're proving my point that you are behaving like a Trump cultist here by refusing to condemn what he actually did. Instead you're making excuses for his behavior by trying to point out that well, since he didn't barricade himself in the White House on Jan. 20, then it's no big deal!

If you don't believe that Trump behaved worse than Stacey Abrams or Hillary Clinton or Al Gore then just say that, and defend your claim. At least then you'd be honest in your Trump cultism.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

OK, Jeffy, I get it, anyone who ever defends Trump in any way, shape, or form, or even insomuch as asks a question that would imply that maybe Trump isn't as bad as you think he is, is automatically a Trump Cultist in your eyes. You only want us to fully agree with you and never, even in the slightest, disagree. Your moniker is about as ironic as one can get around here as that's more of a collectivist statement, and not radical in the least.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

That’s not what I see here.

Then you're not paying attention. How many people here are comfortable calling the Jan. 6 defendants "political prisoners"? How many here support Trump's plan to pardon them all? I'm willing to bet an overwhelming majority.

REGARDLESS of what happened with the LA riots, BLM, CHAZ, etc., etc., should the Jan. 6 rioters be punished for their crimes? Yes or no?

If your answer is "no, because the BLM rioters escaped justice" (not really true, but that is what your team tends to believe), then you are making my point.

[damikesc]

How many of the protesters have received YEARS in jail for virtually nothing?

Biden BRAGS about how much jail time he has secured for them.

Meanwhile, lefties get little punishment --- which is frequently overturned regardless --- and get generous financial settlements with politically aligned cities.,

[chemjeff radical individualist]

REGARDLESS of what happened with the LA riots, BLM, CHAZ, etc., etc., should the Jan. 6 rioters be punished for their crimes? Yes or no?

[Mother's Lament]

Not until leftists are for the same "crimes" or worse, you dishonest weasel. You don't get to punish your political enemies but let all your pals go free.

See, shit like this is the reason I call you a Nazi.

[Mother's Lament]

And fuck your forced 'yes or no' dichotomies. They're as phony and contrived as you are.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Oh, and just so Bertram here is under no illusions about what you really think:

Do you regard the Jan. 6 defendants as "political prisoners"?
Do you support Trump's plan to pardon them all?

[Mother's Lament]

"Do you regard the Jan. 6 defendants as “political prisoners”?
Do you support Trump’s plan to pardon them all?"

Abso-fucking-lutely

[damikesc]

No. They should get the identical punishments. Lesser ones since they did dramatically less than the BLM protesters.

I do not know why you support a two tiered system...but I prefer an ACTUAL system of justice.

The 1/6 protesters are absolutely political prisoners who have been punished harshly for things the left does fairly routinely with scant repurcussions.

Yes, they should all be pardoned. Every last one of them. I do not get why Democrats have historically been so fond of multi-tiered "justice", but it is a recurring theme.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Here you go, Bertram, just as I said, a person on your team who thinks that the Jan. 6 defendants are "political prisoners" and should all be pardoned. Perhaps you'd like to take it up with him on why he's wrong.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Wrong place

[chemjeff radical individualist]

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

To the extent they committed crimes, and that can be proven, the answer is obviously yes, and you know it Jeff.

But the points made here about unequal treatment are valid and obvious. The left is only concerned with prosecuting their enemies.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

To the extent they committed crimes, and that can be proven, the answer is obviously yes, and you know it Jeff.

Well then we agree. But there are a lot of people on your tribe who now believe the answer is "no, because the whole system is rigged".

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"Well then we agree."

No we don't. This is just your pose.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

We agree that the Jan. 6 defendants should be punished for their crimes. damikesc above does not. Perhaps you can have a chat with him about it.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"They should get the identical punishments. Lesser ones since they did dramatically less than the BLM protesters."

That is what damiksec said. Not sure if he's actually in my tribe though, and don't care.

[damikesc]

I never said no punishment. But to pretend they are not political prisoners is to ignore reality.

Give them the actual sentence for trespass. Which is NOT "years".

[chemjeff radical individualist]

"Yes, they should all be pardoned. Every last one of them." --damikesc

[damikesc]

"“Yes, they should all be pardoned. Every last one of them.”"

They have been in jail --- well save the one guy who was on video telling people to go into the Capitol the night before and the day of --- for fucking YEARS!

Yes, they should be pardoned. They have been victims of a horrific miscarriage of justice.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"If your answer is “no, because the BLM rioters escaped justice” (not really true, but that is what your team tends to believe)"

Jeff can you elaborate on the part in parentheses?

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Records rebut claims of unequal treatment of Jan. 6 rioters

https://apnews.com/article/records-rebut-claims-jan-6-rioters-55adf4d46aff57b91af2fdd3345dace8

An Associated Press review of court documents in more than 300 federal cases stemming from the protests sparked by George Floyd’s death last year shows that dozens of people charged have been convicted of serious crimes and sent to prison.

The AP found that more than 120 defendants across the United States have pleaded guilty or were convicted at trial of federal crimes including rioting, arson and conspiracy. More than 70 defendants who’ve been sentenced so far have gotten an average of about 27 months behind bars. At least 10 received prison terms of five years or more.

And that is just federal charges. Most of the crimes committed are prosecuted at the state and local level, not federal crimes.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Over 10,000 protesters arrested at BLM rallies

https://apnews.com/article/american-protests-us-news-arrests-minnesota-burglary-bb2404f9b13c8b53b94c73f818f6a0b7

[Mother's Lament]

How many of those were charged Lying Jeffy? How many of those were jailed for months without charges, Lying Jeffy?
How many of those went to jail for "parading", Lying Jeffy?

We all know the fucking answer. I can't believe that you'd use hard evidence of two tiered justice to try to pretend that there isn't any evidence of two-tiered justice.

You're such fucking garbage.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

The info in these articles seems to indicate that most of the charges were dropped. They are all old articles, so no info that I saw on which those guys are still in jail.

If anything, these articles seem to support the unfair treatment for BLM vs J6 position.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

The people who committed nonviolent crimes like "interfering with a police officer" were arrested and their charges were dropped (mostly).

Likewise, for the Jan. 6 protesters, the ones whose only crime was trespassing on the front lawn were not even arrested, let alone charged.

I would also note that there is something more substantive about trying to subvert the peaceful transfer of power, vs. an ordinary riot in downtown Portland.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"I would also note that there is something more substantive about trying to subvert the peaceful transfer of power, vs. an ordinary riot in downtown Portland."

Let's be honest - this is your real view, when you get down past all your obfuscations and dodges.

J6 people should be prosecuted because "insurrection", BLM people shouldn't because "ordinary riot"

[damikesc]

Oh, it is different when people YOU support do it.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

J6 people should be prosecuted because “insurrection”, BLM people shouldn’t because “ordinary riot”

No - my view is that all crime should be prosecuted. But how they are prosecuted, and the standards of justice that ought to be applied, depend very strongly on the relevant details and specifics of each case. And the details that are relevant include not just the physical acts of violence associated with the crime, but the underlying motivations and mens rea. So for example a man who kills another man in self-defense should be treated differently than a man who kills another man in the course of an armed robbery even if both result in a man dead.

It is the same here. The BLM riots were never about trying to stop the peaceful transfer of power. That was the Jan. 6 riots. For that reason alone, one would expect a different treatment between the two groups.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

In Portland: Over 1,000 arrests alone.

https://www.koin.com/news/protests/policing-portlands-protests-1000-arrests-handful-of-prosecutions/

There the prosecutor decided not to prosecute all of them because evidently he just couldn't handle them all. If you go to the story you'll see a nice graphic which illustrates that the vast majority of people arrested were for nonviolent crimes such as "interfering with a police officer". So this is completely consistent with those on Jan. 6 NOT being prosecuted for merely trespassing at the Capitol.

[Mother's Lament]

Again. How many of those were charged Lying Jeffy? How many of those were jailed for months without charges, Lying Jeffy?
How many of those went to jail for “parading”, Lying Jeffy?

And again, I can’t believe that you’d use hard evidence of two tiered justice to try to pretend that there isn’t any evidence of two-tiered justice.

[damikesc]

Where they bombed and held a courthouse under siege for MONTHS? Firebombing it and trying to kill the people inside. ACTUALLY trying to kill them, mind you, not what you think happened on 1/6.

You're really comparing that?

And how many are in jail NOW?

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

I see you skipped the "handful of prosecutions" part.

[Zeb]

I have always said that those who did actual violence should be punished. However, I think pardoning them all would be preferable to pardoning none.

[DesigNate]

This was pretty much my response before the page reloaded and I lost my comment.

Stupid mobile browser.

[JesseAz]

Less than 30% of those charged and convicted committed any violence or vandalism.

Jeff and Sarc refuse to call out the Biden DoJ over that fact. Then they blame others for pointing out the number of VIOLENT BLM protestors who got little or no jail time.

It is pretty amazing watching those two.

[Jefferson Paul]

Unless he's changed course, I've heard Trump say, repeatedly, that he'd pardon all of the non-violent protesters. He's said that he won't say he'll pardon everyone, as some did commit acts of violence and don't deserve a pardon. It's convenient that you misstate Trump's words as a blanket pardon for all.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

That the treatment is not exactly equal does not excuse or justify the actual crimes were committed.

Once more, with feeling:

If the Optimates weren't so corrupt in the first place, putting a dictator in charge to straighten things out wouldn't be seen as an appealing option.

Of course, we don't have to even go back that far; that's basically how Putin came to be in charge of Russia, after Yeltsin's alcoholism and incompetence destroyed whatever credibility the country's nascent democracy had. The US really should have picked a puppet who wasn't an absolute slobbo drunkard.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Of course coming from a "utilitarian nationalist" such as yourself, of course you justify pardoning the Jan. 6 rioters. It serves the greater good, right?

[damikesc]

If they are STILL in jail in 2025 for "parading" and the like --- they fucking well should be pardoned.

How many BLM rioters are in jail right now?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

How many BLM rioters are in jail right now?

This seems a fair question, surely there are some?

[JesseAz]

Even the NY lawyers who fire bombed a cop car got under 2 years.

The guy who killed someone setting the building on fire got less time than PB and many others.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Yeah, that is my read of the situation. Waiting for jeff or sarc or somebody to counter that.

[sarcasmic]

What is your point, other than to say the J6 people deserve no punishment because blah blah blah leftists democrats riots blah blah blah?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Sarc - As stated above - those who were violent, should be prosecuted.

[sarcasmic]

Sarc – As stated above – those who were violent, should be prosecuted.

Would you consider smashing windows and breaking down barricades to be violence?

[DesigNate]

Smashing windows yes, obviously.

The barriers one is a little harder in my mind, as some of the videos clearly show the Capitol Police firing tear gas and other munitions into the crowd prior to them doing anything, resulting in the crowd surging forward. So I would say if you intentionally broke a barrier down, yes that's violence. If you just moved it out of the way or knocked it over as you were pushed from behind, not so much.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Pretty much what designate said.

[JesseAz]

Anyone else notice that Sarc refuses to address the point of political discrepancy in prosecutions and instead goes right to creating strawman arguments? Because his argument is so unprincipled and validates what others accuse him of.

Sarc, less than a quarter of the J6 protestors who have served jail time committed any violence or vandalism and you keep defending it and even mocking them. You mocked someone for getting nearly 5 years for putting their feet on Pelosi's desk.

Why do you keep lying about the arguments of others?

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

If the left wants to start charging people who were just standing around outside the building, or throw Trump supporters in jail for the crime of simply supporting him, I'm hardly going to take that kind loaded question seriously.

But I do note how, once again, you come to the defense of your left-liberal establishment allies.

[Zeb]

Who is saying that people who committed actual violence on Jan 6 shouldn't be punished?

[sarcasmic]

Why else would someone bring up people not being punished for the summer riots whenever J6 is mentioned?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

To illustrate the hypocrisy perhaps?

[sarcasmic]

Even after the point has been made seventeen million times?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Yeah, when the same issue comes up day after day, the same points will be made day after day.

Sarc, you make repetitive posts all the time.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Okay fine, they're hypocrites. Now what? Don't punish the Jan. 6 rioters? Oh wait, no, you think they should be punished. Fine, they should be punished but everyone's a hypocrite? Is that the point you want to get across?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Maybe start applying the same rules to everyone?

[Zeb]

I find it an interesting and informative comparison to make.

[DesigNate]

Nobody. Nobody is saying that. But god forbid you try to compare the two situations to exhibit the hypocrisy and unequal treatment.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

They're not comparable. One was trying to subvert the peaceful transfer of power, the other was not.

Besides, even if you do prove that everyone involved is a flaming hypocrite - so what? Does that mean that the Jan. 6 rioters should not be punished?

[Zeb]

But also: they are comparable. Both were political protest based on a highly contentious factual basis where some minority of the protesters turned to violence.

[DesigNate]

Violence is violence and property damage is property damage, so they are comparable. Again, punish the people that actually committed violence/property damage. Trespass on public property really shouldn't be a thing. And it definitely shouldn't carry multi-year sentencing.

Exposing the hypocrisy allows everyone to know that we have a two-tiered justice system and who is okay with that. Getting upset that people, especially on a libertarian website, have a problem with governmental hypocrisy and a two-tiered justice system seems like the wrong place to be putting your anger/frustration.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Yes, violence is violence. But for example, violence in self-defense is rightfully regarded differently than violence in the course of aggression. They both result in harm and damage, but with different consequences and different moral contexts.

In that same light, violence to try to stop the peaceful transfer of power ought to be regarded differently than violence in other contexts. The former violence is far more dangerous to the Republic than, say, a random petty theft. The BLM riots, as destructive as they were, were never about trying to oust Trump or install someone else as president. Even in the one case where political authority was actually challenged - in so called CHAZ/CHOP - that little ridiculous experiment was never about trying to change who was president for EVERYONE, only about resisting the state's authority over THEMSELVES.

So the violence is one thing, the moral significance of the violence is something else entirely.

Exposing the hypocrisy allows everyone to know that we have a two-tiered justice system and who is okay with that.

By 'two-tiered justice system' I assume you mean a case where different people under very similar circumstances receive very different treatment, based on qualities irrelevant to the cases such as race or income or political beliefs. I think we can all object to that. But what I think a lot of people (perhaps you, I am not sure) are complaining about is that they think the BLM and J6 cases are 'two-tiered' because they think the two situations ought to be regarded as directly comparable, but the judicial results do not show this. What I am trying to get across is that the two shouldn't be regarded as comparable because the *moral significance* of the violence was much different even if the acts of violence were the same or even worse with BLM. So it is not 'two-tiered' to advocate for different standards of justice for different cases when the details really are different. That is the case here IMO.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"What I am trying to get across is that the two shouldn’t be regarded as comparable because the *moral significance* of the violence was much different even if the acts of violence were the same or even worse with BLM."

Where is this codified in the US Legal system?

All of this is just your cover for - When it's your side, it's different.

[Zeb]

I'd say that is exactly what makes it two-tiered. It doesn't matter whose protest was more virtuous. Political protest is political protest and violence is violence. The law should be blind to whether or not one or both of these protest movements was wrong or misguided.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Obviously they are comparable jeff.

Yes there are specific cases of violence on J6, but from what I can tell, there was a great deal more violence committed during the floyd riots and other left wing riots than on J6 (Building set on fire, business destroyed, looting, vehicles burned, etc). They also went on a lot longer, and happened in more places. Also Dem politicians supported and egged on those riots.

[JesseAz]

BLM riots results in 26 deaths and over 2B in damage. J6 wasn't even in the same ballpark. I bet if you added all the BLM convictions together it would be under 50 years total. Biden BRAGGED about over 800 years for J6 protestors.

Sarc and Jeff defend this.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

You should go listen to the ZeroHedge debate on Jan. 6. Here it is:

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/zerohedge-live-debate-was-january-6-manufactured-crisis

There, the paranoid side of the debate (the Alex Jones crowd) explicitly argued that even if they committed real crimes, they should not be prosecuted or punished because it is all taking place within the context of a 'rigged system'. And of course Trump wants to pardon them all.

So yes there are people really saying that the Jan. 6 rioters should not be punished.

[Zeb]

Yes, yes, I know that such people exist. But I see few people here making that argument. I don't think there are nearly as many Trump true believers here as you seem to think.

[DesigNate]

I tried to listen to it. Like I said the other day, Alex Jones seems exactly how I would expect SQRLSY to debate. Couldn't make it more than a couple minutes with that insufferable blowhard.

Also what Zeb said.

[Jefferson Paul]

You keep making the claim that Trump said he'd pardon all of the rioters. This is false. I've pointed out above that he's said he would pardon all of the non-violent protesters. He even said this as well in response to the question of why he didn't pardon all of the Jan 6-ers before he left office (of his own accord). It wasn't enough time to vet everyone that was being rounded up (and those would would be rounded up after Jan 20, 2021) to know who was non-violent and who was violent.

Stop saying he said he'd pardon all of the rioters. If I'm wrong, and he has said that, please cite the source.

[Agammamon]

Is it or is it not wrong to steal cookies?

If its wrong - why was the sister allowed to get away with it?

[Anomalous]

"Democrat" contains the word "rat" therefore they are vermin. QED

[Fist of Etiquette]

"Substack has a Nazi problem" discourse has fallen apart...

Even so, you know who else was a Nazi?

[Moonrocks]

Arnold Schwarzenegger's father?

[Minadin]

Soros?

[Vernon Depner]

Thomas the Tank Engine?

[Gaear Grimsrud]

That dude that got a standing ovation from Fidel Jr.?

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Rob Misek?

[Sevo]

Soros.

[TheReEncogitationer]

Kurt Waldheim? (Hence, Herr Misek's love for the U.N.)

[JesseAz]

Despite USSC university case saying race based decisions are not constitutional from a government standpoint, Biden administration is pressuring corporations to make race based hiring and promotion decisions. But at least Biden recognizes the Constitution, just ask sarc.

https://justthenews.com/government/federal-agencies/feds-quietly-prod-businesses-use-race-hiring-promotion-dei-regimes

[sarcasmic]

So talking shit about people while not responding directly is your new schtick? If it means you not replying to my posts, I'll take it.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"talking shit about people while not responding directly"

You do this here all the time guy.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Sarc seems to have yet to learn about what the pot called the kettle.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

Um

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Self awareness isn't Sarc's superpower.

[JesseAz]

My main point at the moment is to expose you and Jeff as the unprincipled hacks you both are. Making you rage like this is an added benefit.

What so you want me to respond to? I’ve posted your comment about Joe many times. You keep denying you made the post. Not much else to say than to continue pointing out what an unprincipled piece of shit you are.

My hope is you see the dozen other people pointing out the same and you eventually realize it isnt just me who notices your unprincipled bullshit.

But youre inability for self realization makes my hope doubtful.

[sarcasmic]

Making you rage like this is an added benefit.

Sorry, didn't happen.

What so you want me to respond to?

I said "If it means you not replying to my posts, I’ll take it."

This is why you're such a lying shit. You read that and think I want you to respond. I don't.

[JesseAz]

You've responded to me multiple times today dumdum =)

But since you're so insistent, I'm back to responding to you and calling out your hypocrisy and lack of principles. Shouldn't have looked a gift horse in the mouth I guess.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

The irony.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Newton and his team only found six Substack accounts to pass on to Substack. Substack will ban five of them. Zero paid subscribers, total.

I don't want to live in a world where we can't even be bothered to do the work of inventing new Nazi threats out of whole cloth on the intellectual dark web.

[Social Justice is neither]

This is the true Nazi threat, not enough supply to meet demand. Same for racism and sexism.

[Stuck in California]

Some years ago I overheard a college kid talking his (all white) friends about how "they" won't hire cops "Unless they're in the KKK". No exaggeration. He was serious about this. He went on like this for a while, getting more racist and agitated the whole time, before I told him to leave. He was so agitated he didn't realize how loud or obnoxious he was getting, not that he cared.

Piqued my curiosity. So, I looked up how many people were in the KKK. Depending on who is guessing, the numbers are like 3000-8000. Total. That was a decade ago, I bet it's less now.

Always annoys me, but the data don't have to back the narrative. People believe what they want to believe, even if the entire army of online nazis only numbers in the single digits.

[A Thinking Mind]

Zero paid subscribers? So people did Not See anything?

[Ajsloss]

Zing!

[Spiritus Mundi]

This is what happens when the narrative encounters reality.

[Fist of Etiquette]

...as part of a brutal crackdown on Catholicism in Nicaragua.

Their savior was a Jew, you know.

[Fats of Fury]

Daniel Ortega, John Kerry's best bud.

[JesseAz]

LGBT ally who shot 3 at Iowa school was a fan of columbine, even used songs from those shooters.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12937119/Iowa-gunman-Dylan-Butler-social-media-posts-discord-Perry-school.html

The video was accompanied by the song 'Stray Bullet' by KMFDM, the same song used on the website of one of the shooters of the notorious Columbine High School massacre.
.
The Discord account also appeared to post about the shooting moments before Butler opened fire.
.
'I'm f***ing nervous, I'm the bathroom gearing up,' the user wrote, according to screenshots seen by the outlet.
.
'There's a n----- in the bathroom, I need him to leave so I can assemble my guns' the account wrote two minutes later.
.
'The user was also part of a chatroom dedicated to discussing school shootings called "School Massacres Discussion,"' a Discord user who saw the user in the chat told NBC.

Thank goodness nobody here was pushing the corporate media narrative that this kid was bullied. They would look silly.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Why are you defending bullies?

-sarcasmic

[Rich]

Would someone *kindly* explain why these clowns insist on social-mediaing their intentions/actions?

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Millennial/Zoomer culture of oversharing everything.

[Rich]

Thanks, but whence did this arise? Is it "I have no privacy anyway, so I might as well be proactive", or what?

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

*looks up invention of Facebook*

About then.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Social media and smartphones, beginning with the iPhone. Prior to that, the idea was that if you were going to play around online, you needed to maintain your anonymity as much as possible. That's why so many internet messenger and comment boards allowed you to use a screenname rather than your real name, so it would be harder for malicious actors to target you.

MySpace and then especially Facebook changed that, particularly when you could access those sites from a computer that you carried around in your pocket that demanded constant interaction all day. It's not an accident that the security state's front men, Peter Thiel and Jim Breyer, sunk angel investment into Facebook and gave Zuck access to cutting-edge interface and data mining tech.

[Stuck in California]

Gonna' give a slightly different perspective.

Before the Facebook, my neices and nephews (Older millennials) were blogging and oversharing like mad. Basically online diaries.

We (I'm youngest, so Gen X sneaking up on boomer) thought they were insane. There's some shit that's nobody's business. But the kids didn't see it like that and were even encouraged to write online by teachers. Kids were already VERY online, both in videogames and various chats, before the industry of narcissism really started.

The Facebook turbocharged that shit, but even My Space in 2005ish was catching the trend, not leading it.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

For likes. Duh.

[Moonrocks]

Anticipating their 15 minutes of fame.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

This is why a lot of the school shootings that have taken place since April 1999 can be laid at the feet of the journoscum who established the "Columbine killers were bullied" narrative. They basically created heroes for nerds that said being picked on at school justified opening fire on the student body. That's why Butler posted that same dumb KMFDM song.

This narrative was set up because most journoscum are left-wing geeks who hate anyone that is stronger than them (their passive-aggressive behavior tends to invite such bullying in the first place), and they jumped at the chance to blame the school's "jock culture" for creating an environment that provoked the killers. Pretty much the entire football team got slagged as bullies by these assholes.

Just as a reminder for the commentariat, the investigation showed that bullying was not the reason for the Columbine shooting, as the Trench Coat Mafia were a bunch of assholes, themselves. What it revealed was that Harris was a sociopath, and Klebold was ultimately an easily-led follower who went along with his friend. They didn't target their supposed tormentors like the Hoffschneider brothers, they targeted a bunch of randos they hardly knew, including a black kid, Isaiah Shoels, that they deliberately shot because of his skin color.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Also, the Columbine deaths would have been a lot worse if those idiots had actually known how to rig explosives. The propane bombs they built would have caved in the floor of the cafeteria, above the library, and killed hundreds if they had gone off.

[damikesc]

Yeah, their incompetence actually saved a lot of lives.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Now YOUR bullying them!

[sarcasmic]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12941627/Trump-economy-crash-Biden-election.html

Trump says he WANTS economy to crash in next 12 months so that it hurts Biden's election chances

Ain't that nice of him.

[A Thinking Mind]

Is that a mischaracterization? Possibly.

Yes, it’s a self serving thing for Trump to want. But he also thinks the economy absolutely is going to crash, and he thinks it better it happens soon so he can put in his remedies. I, personally, don’t trust Trump to have appropriate remedies because he has a tendency to overcorrect and I think we’d get a Trump New Deal just as shitty as the last one. But he obviously disagrees and thinks he can fix the economy, so he’s eager to put those solutions in place.

[Mother's Lament]

Here's what Trump said. He didn't say he hoped for a crash, but that he expected one and he hopes it happens sooner than later.

'When there's a crash, I hope it's going to be during these next 12 months, because I don't want to be Herbert Hoover,' Trump said. 'The one president - I just don't want to be Herbert Hoover.'

Is Sarcasmic mischaracterizing things? Absolutely.

Is he lying? Possibly not. I bet sarcasmic never got past the headline before running here to troll. He pulled a Buttplug and never actually read his link.

[sarcasmic]

Me mischaracterizing? All I did was quote an article. You don't like it, take it up with them.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"Me mischaracterizing?"

Yes.

[Sevo]

"Lying" works, too.

[Mother's Lament]

"Me mischaracterizing?"

Yes, and deliberately from the looks of it.

[Mother's Lament]

"All I did was quote an article."

Also, you didn't "quote the article". You quoted the headline. If you'd actually have read the article you would have realized that the headline was wrong.

[JesseAz]

His two idols here are shrike and Jeff. Yet he claims he isnt a leftist. Has picked up many of their behaviors.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Me mischaracterizing?

Yes, Alfred E. Nitwit, you.

[Sevo]

'...I bet sarcasmic never got past the headline before running here to troll...."

Further, the steaming pile of lying lefty shit was hoping others would be as lazy and stupid as he is.

[Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2]

Fatass Donnie is truly a sociopathic piece of shit. He only cares about his electoral chances.

Take the 3.7% UE, 4.9% GDP growth, and record markets and shove it up your bloated diaper-ridden ass, Donnie.

[Sevo]

turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.

[JesseAz]

Shrike still arguing inflation and government spending growing GDP is a good thing I see.

[Sevo]

He is a slimy, stupid pile of shit, ain't he?

[Spiritus Mundi]

It is ok when your team does it.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/bill-maher-recession-get-rid-trump/

[sarcasmic]

Like I give a fuck what that ass says.

[Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2]

When did Bill Maher become the spokesman for Democrats?

The GOP party leader and nominee wants an economic crash now so he won't be blamed for it if he becomes president again.

Fatass is truly some vile human rot.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

I look forward to chemjeff pretending to be offended by SBP’s dehumanizing language above.

[sarcasmic]

Last thing I heard about the guy was that he was claiming to be a libertarian, which I thought was a sad joke.

[Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2]

Bill Maher was politically independent and smokes pot back in his 'Politically Incorrect' days. He was a natural for the libertarian side even when he supported McCain for President.

Then the GOP went apeshit crazy because of the black dude and he began to side with Democrats without joining up. Trump just accelerated the crazy.

[Sevo]

turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides

[Sevo]

turd lies. turd lies when he knows he’s lying. turd lies when we know he’s lying. turd lies when he knows that we know he’s lying.
turd lies. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit and a pederast besides.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

OK, Sarc, here's the actual quote from the article:

'When there's a crash, I hope it's going to be during these next 12 months, because I don't want to be Herbert Hoover,' Trump said. 'The one president - I just don't want to be Herbert Hoover.'

'We have an economy that is incredible,' the former President said. 'We have an economy that is so fragile. And the only reason it's running now is it's running off the fumes of what we did - what the Trump administration did. It's just running off the fumes.'

'So what we will be doing is we will be drilling, we will be reducing energy, that will bring down inflation, that will bring down interest rates,' Trump said, referring to the Keystone XL Pipeline, a proposed pipeline between Alberta, Canada and Nebraska.

Gee, I can't blame him for not wanting to be the next Herbert Hoover. Hoover was in office for six months and then got the Great Depression tossed at him.

[sarcasmic]

Take it up with the headline writer, not me.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

So now you're claiming to be merely a messenger?

[sarcasmic]

You're saying that I wrote the article and the headline?

[InsaneTrollLogic]

1. You chose the story to post here using your own selection bias.

2. You did comment on it: "Ain’t that nice of him."

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

You quoted the headline, and then said - Ain’t that nice of him.
I think a reasonable person can infer from that, that you agree and are basically supportive of the quote and the article.

So if there is mischaracterization in the article, why is it unfair to say that you are also mischaracterizing?

When you go around doing this, and then say "Hey all I did was quote an article" - you're being disingenuous. And then you whine when people call you out on it. You did the same thing in the Iowa shooting discussion the other day.

From what I can tell, hat's pretty much your MO in most of your commenting on this board.

[sarcasmic]

‘When there’s a crash, I hope it’s going to be during these next 12 months...'

Ain't that nice of him.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Yeah, that's your same post again...

Not sure why. Maybe this was tulpa?

[sarcasmic]

Did Trump say those words? Why yes, he did.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

And you deliberately took them out of the sentence and out of the context.

‘When there’s a crash, I hope it’s going to be during these next 12 months, because I don’t want to be Herbert Hoover,’ Trump said. ‘The one president – I just don’t want to be Herbert Hoover.’

This is why people say you’re disingenuous and have a serious case of TDS.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

You used the ellipses to hide the other part of the statement, even though other people have already posted it. Further evidence that your instinct is to be disingenuous wherever possible.

[VinniUSMC]

ITL is saying that you uncritically shared the article as though it was obviously truth. "Ain’t that nice of him."

Though, no one expects you to be capable of critical thought, so at least you've got that going for you.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Gee, I can’t blame him for not wanting to be the next Herbert Hoover.

See, there you go. This type of shit is why you're called a Trump cultist. You deflect from the main criticism of Trump here - which is Trump saying that he WANTS to have a crash within the next 12 months (when Biden is in charge). You can't bring yourself to criticize what Trump said AT ALL, and you instead try to justify him and give him the benefit of the doubt.

If you don't want to be called a Trump cultist, then don't do this shit.

[VinniUSMC]

See, there you go. This type of shit is why you're called a Lefty shit. You gladly run with the mischaracterization presented in the article in order to "expose Trump" or some nonsense. What he said was clearly that he expects a crash, and hopes it doesn't happen on his watch. Exactly as ITL said. You can't bring yourself to critically analyze what Trump said AT ALL, and instead choke all over sarcasmic's dick rather than ever give Trump even a cunt hair's worth of benefit of the doubt.

If you don't want to be called a Leftist shit, then don't be you. Fatass cuntjeff run-of-the-mill statist.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Trump said:
‘When there’s a crash, I hope it’s going to be during these next 12 months, because I don’t want to be Herbert Hoover,’ Trump said. ‘The one president – I just don’t want to be Herbert Hoover.’

He wants there to be an economic crash in the next 12 months. That's what he said. If any other politician said that, he/she would be pilloried for "rooting against America". But not Trump!

give Trump even a cunt hair’s worth of benefit of the doubt

LOL you and your team give Trump the INFINITE benefit of the doubt. He is like the Pope - totally infallible. Nothing he ever says is EVER wrong!

We can go with this comment on "wanting a crash", or we can go with his "vermin" comment, or his "poisoning the blood" comment, or talk about his comment about wanting to be a dictator "just for one day", or even go back to his "fine people on both sides" comment, or all of the other shit that he says. You and your team NEVER hold him accountable for ANY of it. Is he not responsible for what he says?

[Mother's Lament]

He wants there to be an economic crash in the next 12 months. That’s what he said.

That's clearly not what he said, you lying fuck. Everyone can read the the full quote ITL posted here. Who the hell do you think your tricking?

We don't call you "Lying Jeffy" for nothing.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Oh look, here's ML to defend Trump and call me a Nazi.
Fuck off ML

[InsaneTrollLogic]

He did neither, but merely to call you a "lying fuck". However, if you want someone here to call you a Nazi right now, I can arrange that, Nazi.

[Mother's Lament]

My mistake Jeffy, mea culpa.

Let me fix that: "That’s clearly not what he said, you fat fucking Nazi"

There, all better.

[DesigNate]

Holy disingenuous bullshit Batman.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

I am more correct than you care to admit. Even among the people who claim not to be "Trump cultists", they always find a reason to justify and excuse his most egregious utterances.

[DesigNate]

Maybe people wouldn't feel a need to argue with y'all if you didn't automatically attribute the worst possible meaning to whatever he said? Or, like in this thread, continue to attribute something to his quote that anyone reading it could tell you that's not what it means when you string that sentence of words together?

[VinniUSMC]

I am more correct than you care to admit.

You are exactly as correct as I care to admit. Zero.

[VinniUSMC]

Is he not responsible for what he says?

Trump is responsible for what he says, but not for what dishonest Leftist shits like you say that he said.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Gee, Jeffy, do you want to be the next Herbert Hoover? I sure as fuck wouldn't want to be. Hell, I'm sure Biden is hoping to stave off this coming recession so he's not viewed as a Herbert Hoover.

Disingenuous ass.

[JesseAz]

To be fair, the ice cream parlor already calls Jeff The Hoover.

[HorseConch]

Hoover did get his fat ass stuck in the bath tub. Jeffy can probably relate.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

That was William Howard Taft.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

I don't want to be the next Herbert Hoover. I also don't want an economic collapse. I don't even know why he would even bring it up.

Why is Trump even talking about Herbert Hoover and economic crashes?

[DesigNate]

Because, as his quote clearly states, he expects there to be one?

[But SkyNet is a Private Company]

See, there you go, this type of shit is why you are called Trump Deranged and a dishonest POS.

I’d say stop doing that, but lol

[JesseAz]

Stop reading actual primary evidence. Narratives are far more truthful.

/sarcasmic

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

I've seen automobile YouTubers talking about how it's likely to happen anyway, because they're starting to see a steep rise in repos on car loans. This is related to the rise in escrow payments on mortgages due to the spike in home prices, as well as people living on credit cards because of inflation.

At some point, something's going to give, and it will probably be when the Fed lowers interest rates later this year.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Also, I've noticed that gasoline and diesel prices were down over the Christmas and New Year holiday season. A season where people normally do a lot of traveling. Typically, gas prices go up by quite a bit prior to the season, but not this season.

Falling gas prices are nice, but they can portend a major recession if they don't rise normally for a typical traveling season.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Yeah, I remember when gas prices dropped below $1 in the late 90s
(in Denver I believe it got down to 89 or 90 cents a gallon for about 2-3 weeks) and being a bit freaked out about it because the price at that point was far below cost. Turned out it took until 2000 for the dotcom bubble to finally pop, but gas was ridiculously cheap during that time, and it looks like we may be rhyming history again.

[HorseConch]

They yield curve has fluctuated between heavily inverted and inverted for about a year now. In the past, any inversion of significance has portended a recession. I'm sure this time is way different.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

That's ok. Biden wants as many Ukrainians to be thrown into the meat grinder to buy time for the next election.

[JesseAz]

Julie Kelly
@julie_kelly2
Mind-blowing.
@RepClayHiggins
says "well over 200" FBI assets were involved in Jan 6 including some dressed as Trump supporters inside the building leading people to key locations in the Capitol.
.
Higgins is a former LEO and veteran--no chance he's making this up.
(Link to video)

https://twitter.com/julie_kelly2/status/1743744595257614503

Interview says they had agents dressed as trump supporters already in the Capitol before the protest turned violent, making sure to let individuals in and encouraging them to enter the building.

[Mother's Lament]

Look at the guys caught on camera breaking windows or pulling out glass and then never getting charged or mentioned in their media, and you know exactly who the feds were.

https://twitter.com/FordFischer/status/1630234937063350273

[JesseAz]

All those officers casually strolling around shows how violent that day was.

[HorseConch]

Like Pearl Harbor and 9/11 squared.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Like this?

(12/7 + 9/11) * (12/7 + 9/11) = 1/6 ?

No wonder they're morons. The math is worse than 2 + 2 = 5.

[mamabug]

Now I want that t-shirt

[JesseAz]

NBC News
@NBCNews
The Biden administration is asking Mexico to help curb the huge flow of migrants into the U.S., as Biden runs out of options to fix a problem that is hurting his polling.

[damikesc]

He could always tell AMLO that if he does nothing, we will view Mexico as assisting with an invasion of the USA and will be treated accordingly for doing so.

[JesseAz]

They don't appear to have jobs or families or industrious things to do at 9:30 a.m. on a Monday.

Theybhave a job. They get paid to protest.any left groups fund these individuals. From Tides to Soros. They are paid to disrupt.

[Krokko]

Reminds me that I want to buy this for protest clearing... A main AND a side plow!

http://www.rufusranch.com/the%20pickle.html

[Sevo]

When there were protests at Mickey D's for higher M/W a couple of years ago, most of the protesters were SEIU members. The interviewer took a while to find an employee.

[Fist of Etiquette]

As authorities and journalists scrambled to uncover information about the shooter who opened fire at an Iowa school on Thursday, far-right figures zeroed in on the likelihood that the assailant was LGBTQ...

It's always unfortunate when it's not a Tea Party member.

[n00bdragon]

As school shootings go it's incredible for its ability to fit every single narrative at once. For those on the left wing, it's a prime example of the angry white male killer and toxic masculinity. For those on the right wing, it's the mask slipping from the dangerous homosexual invasion and America's moral decline.

No one seems interested in mourning a despicable attack against children or questioning how so many red flags got missed. Who's got time for that when we have narratives to craft?

[JesseAz]

Daniel Ortega's regime has, over the last few weeks, imprisoned more than a dozen priests as part of a brutal crackdown on Catholicism in Nicaragua.

Joe and Merrick laugh at what a light weight Ortega is.

[Fist of Etiquette]

New York Governor Kathy Hochul, a Democrat, seems to think that $275 million worth of state funds need to be directed toward AI research.

Someone has secret Skynet investments.

[damikesc]

How could one devoid of intelligence decide what AI to fund?

[Chinny Chin Chin]

These people are unserious. They don't appear to have jobs or families or industrious things to do at 9:30 a.m. on a Monday.

But enough about Reason commenters...

[Ajsloss]

It's Tuesday, my good sir.

[JesseAz]

Non fast food employment has these devices called computers that allow one access to the web.

Sorry you dont have that at your place of employment.

[Quicktown Brix]

My coworkers keep telling me these computers apparently can do work stuff too.

[JesseAz]

(Unfortunately, I have thoughts on Lavietes' piece.)

Hinest question... did KMW not let you post your own tweet in the roundup directly?

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

Needs more unhinged to be a Hihnest question. Snort.

[JesseAz]

Fair.

[Dillinger]

and zero bold?

[JesseAz]

One of the best weeks on the site was when I made his list. Never made the website list though, believe just his user profile list.

[(Impeach Robert L. Peters) Weigel's Cock Ring]

It has been days now and still no mention by Reason of the rather incredible story about how Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin was hospitalized and out of commission for the better part of 100 hours to start the new year and ourso-called "president" Joe Biden had absolutely no idea.

Austin (or someone in his family) quite obviously didn't feel compelled to get the message to Sleepy Joe because he (they) know that Sleepy Joe isn't really the president making the actual decisions. Whoever they did notify, THAT person is in fact the real current president. And I think we all know damn well who that nefarious individual running things from the shadows is.

[Mother's Lament]

Are you ready for his forth term? It's coming whether the voters want it or not.

[Moonrocks]

Apparently, even the deputy secretary didn't know that she was acting as secretary until halfway through her vacation (she didn't bother cancelling the other half). This isn't even a story about Sleepy Joe not being in charge, this is a story about incompetence in the regime.

[damikesc]

It's not like this is the first time under Biden a Cabinet Secretary was MIA during a period where they might be needed to make some choices and the like.

[Sevo]

"...and our so-called “president” Joe Biden had absolutely no idea..."

Can we just add that to the list?

[rbike]

He was transitioning. He just wanted to fit in better.

[soldiermedic76]

It fits a pattern, set by Obama, or cutting the DoD/Pentagon out of foreign policy and security issues, often even bypassing the SecDef and Joint Chiefs and having people like Trapper giving orders directly to the guys in the field, without notifying or utilizing the correct (and legally required) chain of command. The fact that with proxy wars in two different (actually three of we treat the Red Sea as another front) fronts, no one noticed the SecDef was unreachable for four days shows how little the current DC establishment follows the chain of command, or values input from the Pentagon on military and security measures. No fan of the Pentagon bureaucracy but the chain of command exists for a reason.

[A Cynical Asshole]

Fani Willis' love life

*Barf*

Damn you for putting that in my head.

[HorseConch]

Rechargable devices likely discharge just from being in her presence. The other end of that deal would not be considered lucky, but incredibly tough might be accurate.

[Mother's Lament]

"At what point do New Yorkers say enough? These people are unserious. They don't appear to have jobs or families or industrious things to do at 9:30 a.m. on a Monday. The widespread masking signals either an authentic yet irrational fear of COVID, a performative gesture, or an interest in ensuring other people can't identify who is in these viral videos. When they get arrested, do they ever actually get charged with anything? Do the consequences ever reach them?"

Literally the anti-ENB. I love Liz.

[Spiritus Mundi]

Charges? It wasn't like they were parading or anything serious.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

The masking is actually to prevent identification. It's why Antifa does the same thing.

Of course, this shit doesn't actually work because the FBI can do forensic analysis on cell phone signals and has state of the art facial recognition software that renders masking pointless. But these people get away with this shit because the left-liberal establishment allows them to do so.

[Sevo]

How about we start the year with a heaping helping of the politics of envy?

"Which San Francisco CEOs are taking home the most money? We break it down"
https://www.sfchronicle.com/

Pay-walled, but you get the point.

[DaveH]

Since Liz took over this daily task, I find myself increasingly lost. It would be very helpful if coverage included just a little more context for those of us who are not 24/7 addicts of current events and trends.

[JesseAz]

She includes links in her writeups...

[Dillinger]

I know I saw a Complaints tab somewhere.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

I admit it's tough to follow when the subject briefly strays away from Ron DeSantis and Florida.

[HorseConch]

Or whores and abortion.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

We always have ENB articles for that.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

It's a roundup and a jumping off point. Hence, the links. Like in your name.

[A Cynical Asshole]

Statements like this make me "go a big rubbery one:"

lots of people dabble in the theatrical arts while young, but it takes a special breed of do-nothing narcissists to do it as an adult

Also, things like this is why new Liz is much better than ENB. No dissembling, no ham-fisted "boaf sidez," no "to be sures." Just straight up no bullshit honest opinion. Even if I disagree (which I don't in this case) I can still respect that.

[Mike Parsons]

Ya, with ENB there would have been a lot of "to be sure, its a noble cause they are standing for, even if some of their tactics are controversial"

Its a fucking breath of fresh air to get someone based doing the round up. Sometimes its nice to know other people also can tell the sky is blue and water, wet

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Well, now this is interesting. Looks like the Fulton County, Georgia DA is in a bit of hot water.

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/georgia-trump-prosecutor-accused-secret-disqualifying-romance-da-fani-willis

Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis hired her secret lover to serve as special prosecutor in the Georgia racketeering case against Donald Trump and 18 other defendants, according to a Monday filing on behalf of Mike Roman, a defendant who led election day operations for the 2020 Trump campaign:

The prosecutor is Nathan Wade, a private attorney in the midst of a divorce who "has little to no experience trying felony cases, much less complex RICO actions," according to the 127-page filing which seeks to have the charges against Roman dropped and both Willis and Wade disqualified from further participation in the case.

According to the complaint, Wade has raked in at least $653,000 and upwards of $1 million for handling the high-profile case. By virtue of their relationship, that pile of taxpayer money benefits Willis, as they've traveled together to Florida, the Caribbean and Napa Valley, California, adding that Wade has also bought tickets for the pair to travel on Norwegian and Royal Caribbean cruise ships.

In addition to his $250 hourly rate, Wade has also billed Fulton County for thousands of dollars in air travel and hotel stays, according to invoices attached to the filing. He categorized them as interview and research trips.

The Trump filing also alleges that Willis contracted with Wade contract without proper approval, as such a move requires a vote by the Fulton County Board of Commissioners. Roman's lawyer, Ashleigh Merchant tells the Wall Street Journal her search of board meeting minutes found no indication his appointment was ever discussed, much less voted upon.

The timing of the transaction was rich: Wade filed for divorce the very day after his first contract with Willis began. The divorce is still pending, and Wade managed to have the proceedings sealed -- for now. Merchant is asking for them to be unsealed.

[CindyF]

I'm looking forward to the article here at Reason explaining how the sealing of documents in this divorce case is proper due to the possible political interest in the matter. I'm assuming the pretzel logic will include the narrative that Wade's divorce case is one with national security implications and the sealing of case is necessary in order to prevent an insurrection.

Of course, its more likely this instance of the sealing of documents will be ignored in favor of an article on the sealing of a defamation case in Podunk, IA.

[HorseConch]

Trump couldn't make a phone call with a foreign leader without it being leaked, but they can do whatever the fuck they want on the People's dime because they are on the right side of the fight.

[Sevo]

"...Trump couldn’t make a phone call with a foreign leader without it being leaked,..."

Pretty sure he had already been elected when turd (here) and CNN griped that he was in contact with Putin.
Shame on a POTUS for getting involved in foreign policy!

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Gosh, this sounds familiar:

SANTA FE, N.M. (AP) — A corruption trial for a former high-ranking Democratic state legislator and Albuquerque public school administrator has been scheduled for January.
Court records show the trial of Sheryl Williams Stapleton will begin Jan. 2, 2024. She is charged with 28 counts, including racketeering, money laundering, fraud, bribery and other allegations which became public in 2021.
The state attorney general’s office told the Santa Fe New Mexican that delays to the trial have been due to changes in judge assignments, as three judges have rescued themselves from the case. Defense attorneys and prosecutors also sought more time to review documents related to the case...Authorities spent months investigating Williams Stapleton’s activities at the school district after concerns were raised that she allegedly had been channeling money to personal or business-related accounts through a kickback scheme.
The investigation primarily focused on her relationship with Washington, D.C.-based Robotics Management Learning System LLC, which had been providing online learning materials to the district.
An investigation found Robotics Management listed only a post office box in Albuquerque and was not registered to do business in New Mexico.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

"If he wasn't so fucking greedy, he'd have been harder to spot. But in the end, they're all greedy."

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Yep. There’s a reason why jail time is a job hazard for the Chicago City Council. They just convicted another one last month.

https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/news/ed-burke-racketeering-bribery-trial-verdict/

Former Chicago Ald. Ed Burke has been found guilty of 13 of 14 counts, including racketeering conspiracy, after a six-week federal trial for scheming to use his political clout at City Hall to pressure people into hiring his private property tax law firm.

He was convicted of all four schemes involving the Old Post Office in downtown Chicago, a Burger King restaurant in his ward, a Binny's Beverage Depot store, and the Field Museum.

"He didn't think anybody was listening," Miller said. "Obviously, he didn't learn anything from [former Governor Rod] Blagojevich, or [former Governor] George Ryan, or all the other aldermen that have been convicted in this building and sent to the penitentiary."

Since 1976, approximately 2,100 federal corruption trials have occurred in the U.S. for public officials, and about 1,800 of those have been in the Chicago area. Burke now joins that seemingly neverending list.

Asked why political corruption seems to continue unabated in Chicago, despite multiple federal investigations leading to significant convictions against former aldermen, state lawmakers, judges, and even governors, U.S. Attorney Morris Pasquale said, "that's the $64,000 question."

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

God, I can't believe that old fuck had been in office since 1969. There's Congressional members who haven't been around that long; an old bastard like Chuck Grassley only started in 1981.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Yep. He's been an alderman since before Joe Biden told his first lie in the Senate.

[Fats of Fury]

Burke's been doing corrupt things for over 50 years but the Fed only took notice after he took up Trump's real estate appeal. There are plain brown envelopes delivered to City Hall weekly for the alderman to divvy up, They are the price for doing business with the city or county. If the FBI wasn't so busy ginning up kidnapping plots or harassing Catholics they could have all 50 aldermen under indictment and possibly Mayor Sleestak as well.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Imagine that, gun owners don't want to submit to an anti-2A state law registry.

https://www.thecentersquare.com/illinois/article_13b7dc76-ae75-11ee-8d11-2fcfd2e574cb.html

No matter how you slice it, the compliance rate for Illinois’ gun ban registry is in the single digits, according to a gun dealer group.

A year ago this week, Illinois Gov. J.B. Pritzker enacted the ban on certain semi-automatic firearms, magazines and attachments. The measure included a registration requirement for the now banned guns purchased before the law went into effect. Last month, Pritzker explained the purpose for the registry.

“You want to make sure that you know where those very, very deadly weapons are, who owns them, when and if a crime is committed with one of them,” Pritzker said.

But the most recent numbers of those that registered before the Jan. 1 deadline is 1.22% of the total number of Firearm Owners ID card holders.

Dan Eldridge of Federal Firearms Licensees of Illinois said other estimates of those who actually own the now-banned guns may bring the compliance rate to somewhere between 4% and 8%.

ISP has also said firearms bought during a six-day injunction last year are illegal. Eldridge said that adds to the concerns around the law.

“So they said they can’t change the law and then they changed the law with respect to leaving the registration window open,” Eldridge said. “Which is it? It’s just completely incoherent how they’re behaving.”

[sarcasmic]

"Registration will never be used for confiscation."

- every government that confiscated weapons from its people

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

I agree with this post.

[sarcasmic]

Good for you. Have a cookie.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Well you said I would rather stab myself in the eye than agree with you.

This post was free of the typical obfuscation and victimhood, AND you didn't even mention trump. Pretty rare.

[HorseConch]

It's always the same party pushing the same shit. Whether under the guise of public health or scary pictures of "weapons of war". when their "solutions" never fix the problem they proffess to address, it's clear they are never acting in good faith.

[Idaho-Bob]

“You want to make sure that you know where those very, very deadly weapons are, who owns them, when and if a crime is committed with one of them,” Pritzker said.

Anyone want to explain this to me? I've read it a half dozen times.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Basically, our fatfuck of a governor is a gun-grabbing fascist.

[n00bdragon]

I always cringe whenever I see an article use the word "semi-automatic". Automatic firearms are already largely illegal and never relevant to the discussions at hand. It's a useless word that exists only to scare the reader.

[Idaho-Bob]

I always cringe whenever I see an article use the word “semi-automatic”. Automatic firearms are already largely illegal and never relevant to the discussions at hand. It’s a useless word that exists only to scare the reader.

Assault weapon
high caliber
gun violence
ghost gun
common sense gun laws
Gun safety laws

Feel free to add your own useless scary words

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Well, if those poor gun owners hadn't lost them in an epidemic of tragic boating accidents, they'd have more people on the list.

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

I just can't wait for the AI Pope to lead the Holy See. Can't be worse than the Nazi or Commie Popes.

[mamabug]

IDK, an AI pope trained on actual council decisions and writings of the church fathers might be an improvement on the guy there now.

[soldiermedic76]

Pope Francis, causing more Catholics to question their faith than Martin Luther.

[I, Woodchipper]

"District Attorney Fani Willis improperly hired an alleged romantic partner to prosecute Donald Trump and financially benefited from their relationship, according to a court motion filed Monday arguing the indictment was unconstitutional," reports The Atlanta Journal-Constitution.

They are doing all the corruption they are warning you about others doing.

[HorseConch]

Only they are doing way more of it. When they go after Trump's people for getting untaxed perks, it is done with his money, not money confiscated from taxpayers by gunpoint.

[I, Woodchipper]

"As authorities and journalists scrambled to uncover information about the shooter who opened fire at an Iowa school on Thursday, far-right figures zeroed in on the likelihood that the assailant was LGBTQ," writes Matt Lavietes for NBC News.

And... yes, he was. Tranny violence is the biggest terrorist threat we face today but keep going on about white supremacy ADL/FBI/Whitehouse.

[Mike Parsons]

they are also statistically the greatest threat to their own lives as well

might as well be walking time bombs

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Tranny violence is the biggest terrorist threat we face today

delusional

[damikesc]

Per capita...it's not even close.

[Mother's Lament]

What other group has a higher percentage of school shooters, Lying Jeffy?

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

Straight white men.

[JesseAz]

I was assured over the weekend he was bullied and this justified his actions. Can't remember which poster said this..

[A Thinking Mind]

Tranny violence is the biggest terrorist threat we face today but keep going on about white supremacy ADL/FBI/Whitehouse.

Erm...that's a bold statement. Just reporting that this shooter was gender fluid, or whatever, is different than claiming that the most dangerous thing in the entire country is the possibility of a Transexual mass shooting.

Mass, untargeted shootings (so basically, mass shootings that aren't gang violence or family deletion) are ridiculously, exceedingly rare. People living in Iowa are more likely to be eaten by a shark than die via mass shooting.

I think the bigger story, if there is one here, is that the media is playing political football over this. When it's a white male, that's almost immediately released information, but if they're female, or non-white, or non-cis, suddenly the media is comfortable waiting for days to release any information on the shooter. I find that flexible relationship with truth and information more of a social issue because it's so prevalent compared to the tiny, rare instances of mass shootings.

[rbike]

I want a cite on this Iowa shark eating thing. I live in Iowa specifically to avoid sharks. I'm not worried about mass shootings though, but I sleep soundly knowing that I am at the top of the food chain in my environment.

[soldiermedic76]

They have caught bull sharks as far north as Minnesota. Just saying.

[I, Woodchipper]

What I don't believe: Joe Biden is going to shed ~30 net points with voters under 30 and lose GenZ to Trump

Genz doesnt vote. The youth vote never matters and has never mattered and basically never will.

[Mike Parsons]

There are a good amount of millenial guys though, that went along with voting against Trump in 20 but are not happy with the "adults" who are back in charge. (I work with a lot of them)

The feminization and weakening of society in the name of faux empathy and faux tolerance is wearing thin on a lot of guys that will probably vote for anyone not a dem the next election. Something about watching your demented confused president licking the boots of a mentally ill tranny just doesnt sit well with many.

[Sevo]

In SF, you can now publicly criticize Breed, Newsom and droolin' Joe, and get agreement. The only question remaining has to do with the 'agreeers' agreeing because, perhaps, the three are not stupid enough.

[HorseConch]

I know a lot of harcore, life-long, boomer democrats who would never vote republican. They hate the world we live in, but absolutely refuse to admit what the problem is. The younger generations aren't nearly as married to a political party as the ones that have been devoted voters for 50 years+.

[A Thinking Mind]

There's a different flavor to the supposed feminization of guys that's happened in the past decade or so. Thirty years ago, or so, it was telling guys that it's okay to be sensitive, to be diligent about caring about others' feelings, that you don't always have to view everything as a competition. I think that's a perfectly fine message since it's about being more cultural open-minded. It's saying that masculinity doesn't require following specific cultural signifiers.

The conversation now is that masculinity is evil and toxic. That's not about being open-minded, it's about pointing out that this specific behavior and mindset is wrong. That wanting to compete, to win, those are wrong, evil ways and men are genetically predisposed to these attitudes and men are bad. It's so much worse. It's absolute craziest "Kill All Men" attitude from the insane feminists in the 80s just being accepted into the Overton window, and practically being adopted as the standard.

[Mike Parsons]

Taking some schadenfreude in watching videos of confused feminists wondering why they aren't attracted to the male feminists but end up being attracted to the Chad, or realizing "hey, it kind of sucks paying for dinner and drinks, and would it kill a guy to open a door for me?!"

[I, Woodchipper]

yeah those really make me laugh every time.

"why do i like MEN and not soyboys? I"ve been told I should like the soyboys"

[soldiermedic76]

I want to tell everyone of them 'evolution baby' Hominids evolved so that women will be attracted to the best hunter/warrior who can provide for them and protect them and their offspring. Evolution/biology doesn't change because of something you learned in a graduate seminar.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

That shift started taking place around the early 2000s when third-wave feminists started taking prominent positions in media and political punditry. I think Amanda Marcotte was the first one to actually use the term “toxic masculinity” on a regular basis on internet media, and that phrase comes right out of feminist academic literature from the 1980s-onward.

As I’ve said before, what academia is felching itself about becomes mainstreamed ~20 years later.

[Foo_dd]

"The youth vote never matters and has never mattered and basically never will."

you might have missed the last 6 yrs....... i expect this will become true again at some point in the future.... when Trump is no longer part of the picture, because hatred of him really does mobilize this typically low turnout group.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Depends on what's considered the "youth vote." It usually includes 18-29s, but notably doesn't segregate the 18-21 demographic, when these voters are in the full capture of university leftism.

18-24, per Statista, has never gone above 50% since 1964, and the general upward trend started in 2000, not 2020.

[Minadin]

In her State of the State address

I can only imagine Kamala orating a speech such as this:

"The State of the State is what I'm about to state" she stated.

[Dillinger]

and in so stating I have stated what I came to state about the state of the State.

[I, Woodchipper]

We are here today, on the state of the union date, to be here for the state of the union address, which will be addressed to us here on this date.

[mtrueman]

"Has adult activist—and I think we should call them that, because lots of people dabble in the theatrical arts while young, but it takes a special breed of do-nothing narcissists to do it as an adult—become an entirely separate aesthetic, distinct from its social justice warrior precursor form?"

The biggest peace movement to emerge in America for decades and Reason can only insult and belittle those who participate. Was Reason also so dismissive of those who took to the streets to protest the war in Iraq? Are there any 'Libertarian' publications out there which are supportive of the peace movement?

[Mike Parsons]

"The biggest peace movement to emerge in America"

Its not though. Its the same recycled disaffected marxist losers that were very concerned for Tibet, and Darfur, and whatever popular cause dujour was happening, but now they have been sufficiently wound up with decades of "colonizer/oppressor" rhetoric in uni such that they are willing to aimlessly destroy shit and burn it all down at the drop of a hat for literally anything.

Hamas is a shitstain, in a region that is a shithole, and they are getting whats coming to them. Blocking bridges in NY wont change that in the slightest.

Why do you think these same people havent been out in droves, daily, for years, protesting the concentration camps involving millions of muslims in China? Maybe its because it doesn't neatly fit into their indoctrinated frame work of "white people bad, brown people good" that the Israel Hamas war does?

Peace movement my dick, this is a violent uprising looking for an excuse to burn shit

[Sarah Palin's Buttplug 2]

Hamas is a shitstain, in a region that is a shithole, and they are getting whats coming to them.

Agree with you for once.

#FettermanSaysFuckYouToTlaib

[Sevo]

turd lies. That's not a surprise to anyone who reads his constant stream of bullshit.
But it's becoming obvious that as Misek is too stupid to understand the concepts of "evidence" or "relevance", the concept of "honesty" is simply beyond turd's ken.

[mtrueman]

Shitstains win wars. You war mongers have to understand that Hamas is due to come out of this conflict with unprecedented influence and prestige. Not just in Palestine, but the entire planet. The Muslim world is becoming more and more united as the war progresses. Shiite and Sunni, Arab, Turk, Persian, Pakistani, Indonesian, all uniting around Hamas. Israel? It has America, fragmenting and dividing almost as much as Israel herself.

[Sevo]

Assholes post antisemitic lies, asshole.

[damikesc]

...yet none of them want a thing to do with the Jordanians and their Hamas masters.

Weird.

You sound like a Nazi circa 1945, to let you know.

[mtrueman]

"yet none of them want a thing to do with the Jordanians and their Hamas masters."

They fear Hamas. Because they know that Hamas will have the moral authority to challenge them.

"You sound like a Nazi circa 1945, to let you know."

War is hell.

[Mike Parsons]

mtrueman : "War is hell" (for the Jews)

also mtrueman: "hey guys, can we all be nicer to the barbarians that breached borders, raped and murdered people, fire rockets non stop, and vow to continue doing the same until the Jews are gone?!?!"

Like you said, clown, war is hell. Your preferred mid east puppets will get theirs, by the same sword they (and you) live by

[damikesc]

They do not fear Hamas. They know the Jordanians in Gaza are like dogs who are not housebroken.

[n00bdragon]

Don't take a random poster on Reason.com's word for it: Just look at the situation at hand: Egypt isn't letting anyone from Gaza into it's country. It's not because Israel is threatening to bomb them, but because they don't like Hamas either.

There is no unified muslim world. There is a collection of predominately muslim countries, each with their own histories, idiosyncrasies, goals, fears, alliances, and enemies. A tremendous amount of sorting has gone on in the 1900s as colonialism died out.

[mtrueman]

"from Gaza into it’s country. It’s not because Israel"

Its country is what you mean. Possessive pronoun, no apostrophe.

It's not because... correct. A contraction of it is. Hence the apostrophe.

And really, it should be 'from Gaza into her country. Her is the correct pronoun for countries and ships.

"but because they don’t like Hamas either."

They don't like the Muslim Brotherhood, either, same as all the other pro American despots in the region. Thousands were massacred a few year back in an effort to disperse unarmed protestors. But the fact remains that the Palestinians are Israel's baby, and expecting outsiders like Egypt to step in and help Israel in ethnic cleansing is pie in the sky thinking.

[Jefferson Paul]

If you're going to be a dick and correct someone's grammar in a comments section, be sure not to make any mistakes while doing so.

Your second paragraph/line should have "its country" in quotations, as you are citing what someone said or meant to say.

[mtrueman]

"correct someone’s grammar in a comments section"

Their are plenty of grammatical errors I or others make and let pass. I'm a dick about spelling. I also do their/there/they're, than/then and other errors that trip up the semi-literate.

[Jefferson Paul]

"Their are plenty of grammatical errors I or others make..."

Now you use the wrong form of "there" to start that sentence, while mentioning how you're a dick about spelling, including "their/there/they're."

You should try to win arguments through merit, rather than feeling smug about your grammatical prowess (especially when you also make grammatical or spelling mistakes while correcting others).

[mtrueman]

saru mo ki kara ochiru

Monkeys also fall from trees. I am not perfect. Just a better speller than many here. I also provide top drawer quality commenting here on subjects that nobody else can come close to. Who, but me, has criticized Reason’s shameful and depraved war mongering? Which you ignore, focusing instead on quibbling over my occasional efforts to raise the standards of literacy here.
I do so when I find the comments I'm responding to are so imbecilic and cliche ridden, they don't deserve serious attention. Read carefully and you'll see it's true.

[Jefferson Paul]

I spot grammatical or spelling mistakes all the time from the comments. I don't correct people because it's an a-hole thing to do in a comments section. The reason I'm "picking" on you is because you seem to think fixing others' mistakes somehow wins you an argument. Then you make mistakes while correcting others' mistakes.

I don't post very often. I've been reading the articles and comments since 2020, but only made an account a few months ago to comment.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

You war mongers have to understand that Hamas is due to come out of this conflict with unprecedented influence and prestige. Not just in Palestine, but the entire planet.

Hamas already has influence in the State of Gaza. They enjoy widespread support from the people of Gaza. Hamas already has prestige in the West. Or is Academia not a thing in your world?

[mtrueman]

"Hamas already has prestige in the West. "

You ain't seen nothing yet. I hate to make predictions, but I suspect that Americans converting to Islam will also see a dramatic rise in the wake of this conflict.

[Mother's Lament]

And then the "m" in mtrueman can stand for "mullah".

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Heh. I always thought the "m" stood for "misconstrue", hence, "misconstrueman".

[HorseConch]

Good to see the already proven moron get even more moronic. Savages beheading and raping people is not going to lead to a wave of newly minted American muslims. Anyone that believes those animals are the party of peace and on the wrong side of things will never be a positive contributor to society. That's the talk of a loser looking for someone to follow that will never amount to Jack Squat. That sounds like an individual that will likely end up living in a van down by the river.

[mtrueman]

You're deluded to think that wars can be prosecuted without death and suffering. Or that people confined to 'the world's largest prison camp' will be kindly disposed to their warders if they manage to break out and escape their confinement. You've heard the words 'war is hell' before, I'm sure. Was it a joke to you? It isn't to me.

You've never heard of Vivian Silver, the 74 year old Israeli Canadian woman and renowned peace activist, have you? She was killed by ill trained and trigger happy IDF soldiers on Oct. 7th in her home at the Be'eri Kibbutz. A dead peace activist, or Nazi, if you prefer. I've made your day for you.

[Mother's Lament]

Except it wasn't actually a prison camp, and you forget (deliberately) that Gaza also has a border with Egypt which it was once a part of.

[mtrueman]

"Except it wasn’t actually a prison camp,"

It was and is a prison camp. Or concentration camp, if you prefer. The inmates are not free to come and go, and the warders determine what goes in, and what goes out. Anything connecting Gaza with the outside world, like an airport, was destroyed decades ago by the Israelis. You wouldn't be happy being born into and held by such a regime, would you? Yet it seems you think the residents of Gaza should happily accept their fate, even after the events of the Al Aqsa Flood showed the world their discontent.

[EISTAU Gree-Vance]

Yeah, apparently he’s a shitty speller too. See above.

[Sevo]

It stands for "asshole", but the stupid shit can't spell.

[mtrueman]

"Its not though. "

I disagree, but you are correct that it is more than simply a peace movement. It is also a movement against apartheid, which explains why so many white Americans oppose any ceasefire while the brown ones support it. Thanks for the clarification.

"Maybe its because it doesn’t neatly fit into their indoctrinated frame work of “white people bad, brown people good” that the Israel Hamas war does?"

The conflict is more about Jew vs. non Jew, than anything to do with skin tone. As an American, you naturally turn to skin tone as a lens to explain any conflict, the world over. You've had a blinkered education, and the media like Reason isn't doing anything to help enlighten you. If you look carefully at who is involved in the conflict you will find people of varying skin tones on either side.

[damikesc]

So, you buy into the "darker skin = victim" mentality.

Got it.

You are deeply unserious and not really worthy of serious responses on this topic.

[Mike Parsons]

"You are deeply unserious and not really worthy of serious responses on this topic."

^ this. mTrueman has always been a retarded shitlib on these boards, but it looks like hes drank the whole pitcher of kool aid now.

It would be about as fruitful as arguing with a gender studies major that "no...theres just men and women, you are mentally ill"

[mtrueman]

"So, you buy into the “darker skin = victim” mentality."

No, I don't. It's Mike Parsons who brought the skin color of the participants in the conflict into the conversation. I believe Jew/non Jew is a more accurate casting. Who do you agree with?

[VinniUSMC]

The conflict is more about Jew vs. non Jew

We know where you stand, hand-in-hand, with Herr Misek.

[Mike Parsons]

lmao

Keep talking. You are outing yourself as both a vapid shitlib clown as well as being in league with the Nazis.

I bet you have a nice Ukraine flag in the front yard right next to the BLM sign

[mtrueman]

"I bet you have a nice Ukraine flag in the front yard right next to the BLM sign"

You need to pay closer attention to my comments before putting any money on the line.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

Your comment about spouting nonsense is the most apropos here.

[mtrueman]

As long as you keep reading, I don't mind. I always appreciate substantive responses if you can manage it.

[TheReEncogitationer]

Ackshuyally, the Free Tibeters were protesting Communist China's occupation and the protesters of Darfur were protesting the Islamist regime in Sudan.

So they are hardly Marxist and I'm sure there is little Venn Diagram interlapping between Free Tibet and Darfur protesters and supporters of Hamas. I'm also sure the Free Tibeters also protest the cleansing of Uighurs in Red China.

Start again. With proper information. "Ignorant and free in a state of civilization never was and can never be."--Jefferson.

[mtrueman]

"Ackshuyally, the Free Tibeters were protesting Communist China’s occupation and the protesters of Darfur were protesting the Islamist regime in Sudan. "

It wasn't just the protestors who were demonstrating against China and Sudan, it was also the American government, and the establishment as a whole. They were on the same team, so to speak. That's the difference. Now you have Biden and Reason cheering on the destruction of Gaza while the demonstrators oppose it.

[Ajsloss]

Peace movement? Seems like they're making a lot of people angry, people who have absolutely nothing to do with what's going on half a world away.

[mtrueman]

"Seems like they’re making a lot of people angry,"

War is hell. They should be angry.

"people who have absolutely nothing to do with what’s going on half a world away."

Like it or not, they are complicit. They either vote war mongering politicians to power, pay taxes to fund the war, or both.

[Sevo]

mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
“Spouting nonsense is an end in itself.”
Especially if it’s about those damn Jews, right, you slimy pile of Nazi shit?

[Ajsloss]

That guy trying to drive to his daughter in NYC is not complicit. Get real.

[mtrueman]

"That guy trying to drive to his daughter in NYC is not complicit."

Did he vote for Biden? Does he pay taxes? Did he join the protestors at the barricades?

[Sevo]

"...The biggest peace movement to emerge in America for decades and Reason can only insult and belittle those who participate..."

mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
"Spouting nonsense is an end in itself."
Especially if it's about those damn Jews, right, you slimy pile of Nazi shit?

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

"Peace" meaning cease fire by the Israeli's so Hamas can slaughter them unopposed.

[mtrueman]

"“Peace” meaning cease fire by the Israeli’s"

It means more than that. It means releasing the hostages on both sides and dismantling apartheid. And that's only beginning.

[damikesc]

Hamas was violating the terms of the hostage exchange as it was.

Are you fucking retarded?

[mtrueman]

“Hamas was violating the terms of the hostage exchange as it was.”

Some 100 Israeli, Thai, Russian etc hostages have been returned. Every single one has been through the cooperation of Hamas. In 3 months of conflict, the Israeli military by itself hasn’t succeeded in freeing a single hostage. Three Israeli hostages, unarmed, half naked, speaking Hebrew and waving a white flag approached IDF soldiers and were gunned down and killed. The sad fact is that Israel needs Hamas, like it or not, if the safe return of the hostages is important to you, which I suspect it is not.

[VinniUSMC]

Are you fucking retarded?

He thinks dismantling "apartheid" is a thing, and that Israel is engaged in it. So, yes, the fucking Nazi shit is definitely fucking retarded.

[mtrueman]

You are more retarded than I am. You can't even muster an argument and have to resort to bluster and name calling.

[VinniUSMC]

Oh no, not "I know you are, but what am I?"

Fuck off, Nazi scum.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

He refers to Israel as "apartheid" so yes.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Are you fucking retarded?

Short answer, yes, misconstrueman is fucking retarded.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

" It means releasing the hostages on both sides and dismantling apartheid"

Is this part of the "Spouting nonsense is an end in itself” that you have been quoted as saying?

[But SkyNet is a Private Company]

“Hostages … on both sides”

Wholly fvck

[TheReEncogitationer]

They're not peaceful if they are blocking other's freedom of movement and vandalizing property and threatening the lives of Jews and others who oppose them!

Fuck Off, Watermelon Rickshaw Nazi Boy!

[mtrueman]

"They’re not peaceful "

Get yourself to Gaza is you want to see what 'not peaceful' looks like.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Well, of course it's "not peaceful" when they keep shooting rockets across the border into Israel.

[Bertram Guilfoyle]

“Get yourself to Gaza”

How can we get you to take this advice? You could volunteer as a human shield.

Edit: Meant for mstrawman, obviously.

[DesigNate]

Watermelon Rickshaw made me chuckle.

[damikesc]

"The biggest peace movement"

Where?

The people demanding ANOTHER ceasefire for a group who violated the last ceasefire by mass killing of Isralies on 10/7?

[mtrueman]

"The people demanding ANOTHER ceasefire for a group who violated the last ceasefire by mass killing of Isralies on 10/7?"

If you think the hostages are going to be released safely without the cooperation of Hamas, I suggest you check out the record of the IDF's unilateral efforts. Zero results in over 3 months. You really don't give a shit about the safe return of the hostages though, I understand that.

[damikesc]

Yes, the people HOLDING hostages are not the bad guys for you.

[mtrueman]

Both sides are holding hostages. That hostage exchange a few weeks back was the clue.

[A Thinking Mind]

The biggest peace movement to emerge in America for decades

Gonna need a cite that these people are about "peace."

[Moonrocks]

From the river to the sea! kind of says it all.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

The biggest peace movement to emerge in America for decades and Reason can only insult and belittle those who participate. Was Reason also so dismissive of those who took to the streets to protest the war in Iraq? Are there any ‘Libertarian’ publications out there which are supportive of the peace movement?

You know how I know Liz Wolfe is killing it? Because suddenly Reason is a problem when she shows up.

[mtrueman]

"Because suddenly Reason is a problem when she shows up."

Reason used to have a semi-regular contributor who was against apartheid, land thievery, ethnic cleansing, collective punishment, indiscriminate massacre, and destruction of hospitals, schools, churches and infrastructure. It was years ago. His name was Sheldon Richman. They used to also feature a prominent Libertarian voice in congress, Justin Amash. Now it's war mongers wall to wall, with Liz 'killer' Wolfe leading the pack.

[Foo_dd]

peace movement? might want to tell them to stop chanting the slogans about the destruction of Israel, then.

[Zeb]

But surely they are just planning a peaceful march from the river to the sea to raise awareness.

[mtrueman]

" might want to tell them to stop chanting the slogans about the destruction of Israel, then."

I doubt that would change anything. Israel seems intent on self destruction, and Americans refraining from slogans you don't want to hear isn't about to change that.

We have some interesting historical precedents you likely aren't familiar with. Let's go back to 1973. Egypt launches a surprise attack on Israel to recover the Sinai territories lost in the 1967 war. As a result of this war, Israel underwent profound changes. It gave PM Golda Meir the heave ho, and went from essentially a one party state to a multi party state. I don't know what changes are in store for Israel as a result of the current conflict, I suspect Israel will undergo even more profound change.

[mad.casual]

You mean to tell me that New York state employees are going to oversee the construction of a new physical center and cloud computing architecture, that this project will be completed on time, and that this new facility will in any way be competitive instead of lagging far behind existing players?

The Sub-80-IQ AIs have to come from somewhere.

[Minadin]

And they might STILL replace your average government worker / journalist.

[mad.casual]

Angry NYC driver shoves Palestine protesters blocking the Williamsburg bridge during rush hour traffic this morning out of his way

Angry NYC driver? [sideways glance] All I see is a mostly peaceful Red SUV.

[Agammamon]

> You mean to tell me that New York state employees are going to oversee the construction of a new physical center and cloud computing architecture, that this project will be completed on time, and that this new facility will in any way be competitive instead of lagging far behind existing players?

To save money, they plan to stock it with used hardware they can buy on the cheap after an AWS hardware refresh;)

[Agammamon]

>"The point is disruption," one protester, named Mon Mohapatra, told Gothamist. "We were trying to cause gridlock and traffic back-ups throughout downtown Manhattan at the same time."

Just run them over.

[damikesc]

Sounds A LOT like a group violating RICO laws...

[Vernon Depner]

Just run them over.

It would only take one or two instances of that to send the message and stop it.

[Agammamon]

>A child should not be "the basis of a commercial contract" said Pope Francis on Monday, who called for a worldwide ban "to prohibit this practice universally." Last year, he said that, though technology could be used to help with conception, "it is wrong to create test tube embryos and then suppress them, to trade in gametes and to resort to the practice of surrogate parenthood."

Amazingly enough - I kinda agree with the Commie-Pope.

Yes, I know that a lot of this is done for people who can't have children on their own. But we're reaching a point where we can edit genes at will and . . . given the crazy shit people do to themselves, we're gonna start seeing horrors beyond human comprehension once they can do it to their children.

Maybe some things shouldn't be commoditized?

[mad.casual]

we’re gonna start seeing horrors beyond human comprehension once they can do it to their children... and their children's children... and their grandchildren's children...

FIFY.

Imagine the genetic equivalent of Pottenger's Cats.

[TheReEncogitationer]

Yeah, we will see horrors like ending Cancer, HIV/AIDS, Diabetes, Heart Diseases, Osteoporosis, Tay-Sachs, Sickle Cell Anemia (unless you’re taking an African safari, then Sickle Cell can be temporarily implanted to fight Malaria and Sleeping Sickness and then removed when you get home,) and every other inherited disease and affliction!

The horror!…The horror!…

And people who want to have children and who are mentally and financially able to care for them will be able to have children! Isn’t that what The Church wanted in the first place???

And the only people I see wanting to “suppress” anything is Big Papa Francis The Talking Mule and his minions in The Vatican!

Fuck Big Papa and The Vatican! Let them live like the rest of us and then say their stupid Papal Bull-Shit!

[Mother's Lament]

we will see horrors like ending Cancer, HIV/AIDS, Diabetes, Heart Diseases, Osteoporosis, Tay-Sachs, Sickle Cell Anemia

Most of what we know about hypothermia treatment came from experiments that the Nazi's ran on prisoners, and much of what we know about infection processes came from the Japanese unit that did the same.

[Minadin]

So, Fauci's in good company, then.

[TheReEncogitationer]

I'm sure people when they encountered Kilimanjaro and the Swiss Alps had the sense that bodies freeze when unclothed and that the Earth literally sucks the heat out of the body even on mild nights if the body doesn't have a Foot of insulation in between as a buffer.

And people had some idea about infection when they threw the bodies of Bubonic Plague victims over castle walls and sent Smallpox-infected blankets to tribes that were in their way.

And when they found this out, they trasmitted this information to their neighbors and from generation to generation and all long before the Nazis and Hirohito.

So what does sadistic torture and slow murder have to do with rational, scientific medicine between consenting persons that actually saves and improves human lives?

[Vernon Depner]

Illegal aliens—here to do the jobs Americans won't.

[Agammamon]

Oh - you think that's all people will do. That's cute.

You've seen the shit parents do right now with gender. But sure, all that will happen is the good stuff.

[TheReEncogitationer]

So you're going the acts of sicko parents keep you from taking treatment to cure life-destroying hereditary diseases and conditions?

Well, Bye! Means more for the rest of us and the wait gets shorter.

[Zeb]

Yeah, maybe it shouldn't. But if the tech becomes easy and available, people will do it.

[Agammamon]

I know. I'm not saying that government should start shooting people over it.

I am saying that people will do horrible things with it. Because they'll classify what they're doing it to as 'not human'. Brave New World is a utopia compared to what can be done if you're sufficiently nihilistic.

[mad.casual]

Yeah, I'm a little confused on how I'm in the minority that reads "Creating a life via IVF is good unless you do so to subjugate them or use them as commodities" is anything except 100% solid libertarian gold.

We all knew funding GOF research in the loose regulatory environment of China was A Bad Idea™ on several levels, well before it was done. Saying as much wasn't an indictment of the technology, nor was it an affirmation of the laws against it or a forbidding of the casting into Hell those who irredeemably fucked around and found out.

[TheReEncogitationer]

"Loose regulatory environment of China"??? It's a Totalitarian Communist State!

Any bio-weaponry made there exists because it is mandatory from Emperor Xi.

Again, what are you babbling about?

[Rich]

"Don't even think about driving one mile above the speed limit."

Waiting for pilot program to monitor times of turnpike entry and exit for automatic speeding ticket.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

It's been done in the past, IIRC, on the New York State Thruway. The toll tickets were stamped with a time and a date, and there, if you got to your exit significantly faster than the time allowed for the speed limit, you could get a speeding ticket there. No current toll authority is willing to do this as drivers would abandon their roads in droves.

[Dillinger]

would have had fun attempting to average out the speeds.

[Minadin]

We used to see people pulled over prior to the toll booths on the Kansas turnpike, waiting for it to be safe to cross per their time stamp without getting a ticket.

[Dillinger]

the worst part about the Kansas turnpike was all the Oklahoma fans also headed south on Sunday morning.

[Foo_dd]

been done in the past, but it runs into the same "face your accuser" problem as the cameras. they do, however, revoke people's fast pass accounts for it.

[VinniUSMC]

Waiting for pilot program to monitor times of turnpike entry and exit for automatic speeding ticket.

This is common in Korea. Lot's of the time, just before the "end" line, there will be lines of cars parked running down the timer.

[Dillinger]

>>"to put New York at the forefront of the artificial intelligence landscape,"

any reason skynet doesn't hit New York first?

[Agammamon]

Because the New York Skynet will amount to anything except a massive graft project.

[Dillinger]

>>"Don't even think about driving one mile above the speed limit."

if I'm one mile above the speed limit I'm pulling into the garage.

[Dillinger]

>>Yesterday at 9:30 a.m., protesters shut down the Holland Tunnel, the Brooklyn Bridge, the Manhattan Bridge, and the Williamsburg Bridge

eroding empathies for those voluntarily in NYC

[Dillinger]

>>(Unfortunately, I have thoughts on Lavietes' piece.)

I fail to see the unfortune lol.

[Dillinger]

>>A child should not be "the basis of a commercial contract"

relatively certain "fine I'll have your child but you have to take care of me financially for the next 40 years" is how I got dragged across the finish line lol

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

Trump's "decision to attend is simultaneously a bid to jack up the political intensity around his court proceedings—which he has used to drive fundraising and as a rallying cry to his base—as well as a recognition that this fight may be a decisive legal battle," reports Politico.

Wait, what? Say what you will about the legitimacy of the charges and various prosecutions of Trump, but now the media's take is that if Trump attends his own show trial, he's guilty of riling up his base and using it as a cynical ploy to drive fundraising and polls?

The media has lost its fucking mind.

[Dillinger]

"T Plays Ball In Court System, Wins Anyway" lost at the Politico staff meeting.

[A Thinking Mind]

That's not something I can even dispute, though. Trump is absolutely turning these court cases into a re-election campaign, to his benefit. He'd be an idiot if he wasn't running on the substance of the cases and charges against him.

[Agammamon]

The *lack* of substance of the cases and charges against him.

I've never seen anyone so scrutinized, never seen the feds take so many bites at the apple, and the man still walks free - he must truly be the only honest person in DC.

[Zeb]

Yeah, maybe they should have thought of that before setting up these show trials during the election campaign.

[soldiermedic76]

CNN and them are all a twitter because the defendant doesn't "usually" go to the appeals hearings, like he committed some crime by attending when it's not considered the norm. Me personally, I'm demanding to be in any court case that I'm involved in. I want to be present. That's my right as an American citizen. Fuck if it's not the norm, it should be.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

Angry NYC driver shoves Palestine protesters blocking the Williamsburg bridge during rush hour traffic this morning out of his way

“You’re disrupting traffic idiots, you can’t do that, it’s against the law”

I guess this guy just moved there. Must not have been present during the BLM protest/5th Avenue banner days.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

At what point do New Yorkers say enough? These people are unserious. They don't appear to have jobs or families or industrious things to do at 9:30 a.m. on a Monday. The widespread masking signals either an authentic yet irrational fear of COVID, a performative gesture, or an interest in ensuring other people can't identify who is in these viral videos. When they get arrested, do they ever actually get charged with anything? Do the consequences ever reach them?

Tough questions. In Seattle, almost every left wing protest ends in near 100% release without charges, then eventually paid by the city.

[Moonrocks]

Contrast the treatment of protests that the establishment endorses and those it doesn't.

[Dillinger]

did this administration Dave its Secretary of Defense?

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

Incredible National Review headline: "Don't even think about driving one mile above the speed limit." The British busybodies provide a helpful preview if trying to understand what their American counterparts might go after next.

I always thought the British police were too busy standing by during Just Stop Oil protests, or arresting Lawrence Fox.

Fun fact: Lawrence Fox was arrested by no less than six officers, and while driving to the station, there was a stabbing that the officers declined to respond to as they were busy with Mr. Fox.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

What I do believe: Young voters are pissed, they never liked Biden *that* much in the first place, and there has been a structural decline in young male support for Dems

Wait a minute. Hold it. Stop. Hold on. Stop right there. Just a cotton-picking minute. We were initially told that young women were moving to the left, and young men were moving to the right. Then, in a series of emergency follow-up articles, we were told that there was no need to panic, young men weren’t moving to the right. Now we’re being re-told that young men are (agreeing to disagree, beep boop) not remaining on the left.

[Mother's Lament]

They want their people to panic and give them more money, but they don't want young men to think that the right is now where all the cool and cutting edge people hang out.

It's a delicate balance.

[Agammamon]

Recent polls have shown that young men have increased their support for the Democratic Party from 40% to 30%;)

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

The "young men identifying as Republican" trend notably started ticking up after Trump was elected. While correlation isn't causation, I suspect the leftist misandry, especially against white men, and the Wokeism that turbocharged after he took office has been a significant cause of this shift.

I wouldn't be surprised to see a pretty large gender gap in the 2024 elections, as men seem to be fed up with the HBIC/girlboss crap and critical race theory being pushed in politics, academia, and mass media.

[Mike Parsons]

This is the sentiment that I am seeing a lot of in folks talking at work.

[Mike Parsons]

Ill add to this, since you brought up mass media, we have a soyboy bugman at work who also considers himself to be a "star wars nerd". And we had a really funny moment the other day.

Someone was listening to a clip complaining about that Pakistani female activist they hired to direct the next StarWars tentpole movie. The line about her saying "its about time we give a woman a chance to tell the story of a galaxy far far away" and even he perked up and said "I mean, im all for different people getting their shot, but didn't we already do that?"

To which we all answered an emphatic yes of fucking course we did, Kathleen Kennedy turned the entire sequel trilogy into a mix of fourth wave feminism, Mary-Sue self insert fan fic writing of the highest degree, de-sexualized everyone, made the "good" men pathetic followers in the friend zone, made the previous generation of good men (heroes) into deadbeats before killing them, and filled it with "the force is female" girl bossery...so yes of fucking course we already did this.

The fact that even left of center normies like him are noticing though, is what was notable to me.

The other notable phenomenon that has occurred and lead us here, is the reversal of the old "politics is downstream of culture" relationship. (Pop) Culture is very much now straight up DNC political talking points. They have fully merged, and a lot of normies are getting tired of being beaten over the head with "cis white men bad" propaganda in literally every form of online entertainment

[Mother's Lament]

Empire Strikes Back was cowritten by a woman 43 years ago, but sexism, amirite?

[Dillinger]

>>notably started ticking up after Trump was elected

Reagan too. stark difference in outward maleness between those two and Carter/Biden ... not so much in other elections

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Funny how two unapologetic American nationalists ended up getting a lot of support from American men the last 45 years.

[mad.casual]

Who could've possibly foreseen that chasing men away from the woke misandry to Nikki "Lady Dick" Haley would've turned out to be a tactical error?

[Diane Reynolds (Paul. they/them)]

critical race theory being pushed in politics, academia, and mass media.

And in your HR department trainings.

[Minadin]

It's funny, but some of our more recent HR click-through video quizzes have shifted to what is NOT actually harassment.

I'm not sure if that's because it's a much shorter list, or to re-train the recent-grads that the real world isn't campus.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

The department trainings take their cue from academia. It's why so many of them take their cue from shit that Peggy McIntosh, Robin DiAngelo, Derrick Bell, and Kimberle Crenshaw have written.

[Mickey Rat]

This is a trend that predates Trump. However, it has been exacerbated since 2016 as the Left has been more openly abandoning the concept of equality under law requiring official colorblind policies.

I either have to conclude that they want an expressly white nationalist movement or that they are setting up the conditions for making one out of abject stupidity.

[mad.casual]

Hasn’t the media been portraying straight white men as a threat for years? Remember when the APA claimed “traditional masculinity” is “psychologically harmful”?

As I near aging out, white men, ages 25-45, of average to above average intelligence (details wrt sexual deviancy/proclivities conspicuously, and with detriment to the investigation and society at large omitted) has been a thing since well before I aged into the demographic.

With regard to the manifesto and 'traditional masculinity', I used to work with a Colombian forensic pathologist who was lamenting that her brother always claiming racial profiling as an excuse for getting into trouble. I said I could sympathize citing the above statistic. She replied that I couldn't be a serial killer because whenever you see it on the news the neighbors and coworkers are always surprised. If the FBI came around asking questions about bodies her reply would be, "Yup. He probably did it and some of them probably did something to deserve it."

[Longtobefree]

"You mean to tell me that New York state employees are going to oversee the construction of a new physical center and cloud computing architecture, that this project will be completed on time, and that this new facility will in any way be competitive instead of lagging far behind existing players?"

Yep.
It is the only way to assure complete control by the right people.

[Fats of Fury]

They're contracting with Hoyt-Clagwell to build the hardware

[HorseConch]

They would never do this in America, I'm sure. That damn reporter and his assault microphone.

https://twitter.com/ChayaRaichik10/status/1744527850433290687

[mad.casual]

Random people bumping into you on the street and then arresting you for assault seems way more Gestapo-esque than when Trump was suppressing free speech and violating peoples’ rights by sending Federal Agents to a protest that had set a courthouse on fire and they were “disappearing” people in unmarked vehicles.

Maybe they released the guy within a couple hours and it's a bit of a wash but, still, he was on a street and clearly just asking questions and not just "mistakenly caught up in" a group of rioters, arsonists, and looters.

[damikesc]

On the scene report of the Epps sentencing:

Could not have been more of a fix if they tried.

https://twitter.com/NotRadix/status/1744763728543772845

Some highlights:

1) "The prosecutor praised Epps "de-escalation tactics" and had a whole slide show for it entitled "Attempts to De-escalate."

Both Judge Boasberg and the prosecutor both claimed "he never tried to go into the Capitol."

2) The prosecutor claimed Ray Epps case was a "unique and complicated case," I don't see how.

I also don't see any other J6 defendant getting this type of special treatment where a prosecutor claims their case is "unique."

3) Epps and his lawyers along with the government and Judge Boasberg all agreed Ray Epps was the victim of "widespread conspiracy theories."

4) The DOJ themselves admitted they were giving Epps a "significant break."

5) The prosecutor argued "6 months is the appropriate sentence."

The prosecution then proceeded to praise Epps - claiming he actually SUPPORTED LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS that day.

Note: The PROSECUTOR was saying this.

6) Epps lawyer claimed people called Epps a "boomer" on January 5 when Epps was recorded on video urging rally attendees to go into the Capitol the next day. Baked Alaska and others started changing "fed fed fed," but Epps lawyer claimed Epps was trying to "de-escalate" and that "Baked Alaska and others didn't listen to him [Epps]."

7) Epps lawyer made the claim Epps "just said we should go down to the Capitol," and claimed he never told people to go in - the government did not dispute this claim.

We have seen video evidence that contradicts this though.

8) Then Ray Epps lawyer made an ASTOUNDING ADMISSION: he claims that after reviewing footage of Epps and his conduct the government made a FORMAL DECISION IN 2021 NOT TO CHARGE EPPS WITH ANYTHING.

He then claims Epps is being unfairly treated now with the government giving his a misdemeanor show charge.

9) Judge Boasberg claimed Epps initial conduct "probably warranted jail time," but then cited his extensive cooperation with the government, J6 farce Committee, etc and other "mitigating factors" to give Epps a sentence of 12 months probation and NO TRAVEL RESTRICTIONS.

He then called January 6 an "insurrection," and he slammed "conspiracy theorists," who claimed the FBI was involved. Judge Boasberg says more important than Epps conduct on January 6 was "what happened after," and he cited Epps and his wife as "victims" of these conspiracy theories and "harassment," which he claims is at a level he hasn't "seen before."

[HorseConch]

I'm surprised he hasn't bankrupted Tucker and countless others for them "defaming" him yet.

[Mother's Lament]

They're not even hiding the fact that it's all a gigantic fiddle, anymore. Literally rubbing our noses in it.

[mad.casual]

I mean, logic would rather dictate that if Epps isn’t guilty T is even less so, but logic also dictates that objective metrics of degrees of participation got nothing to do with subsquent findings of guilt or innocence.

[DesigNate]

"You mean to tell me that New York state employees are going to oversee the construction of a new physical center and cloud computing architecture, that this project will be completed on time, and that this new facility will in any way be competitive instead of lagging far behind existing players?"

Everyone was sitting around thinking Bezos, Musk, or Zuckerberg were going to be the evil geniuses to create SkyNet, but it turns out it was NY State all along.

[soldiermedic76]

I'm imagining anything the Government creates, AI wise, is going to be more along the lines of Marvin rather than Skynet, especially New York. Note: yes Marvin was an android but an android with AI.

[LIBertrans]

Lizard Wolfe has found her tribe. Only in NY can passable female impersonators be found to block traffic in support of mohammedan Black September female-enslavers. Hamas jihadists are as surprised as Robert Dear that their deadly attacks on the one place women have rights as individuals triggered unequal yet apposite reprisal force. It looks a lot like evolution in action, and the driver uncowed by social pressure is clearly the fittest survivor.

[InsaneTrollLogic]

Pissy that the Roundup isn't so much libertine now as actual libertarian, Hank?

[Mother's Lament]

Poor Hank, I guess these "emancipated" women just aren't turning out like he hoped.

[EISTAU Gree-Vance]

Hail to the mother fuckin victors, bitches.

That is all.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

That's right! Go Blue! And that school down south can suck it!

[LIBertrans]

Argentina's Virgin Birther version of Hitler's Pius Pacelli claims to know more about women, individual rights and voluntary exchanges than women voters. This is good. With any luck women voters will now rid us of mystics aping Anthony Comstock, Teedy Roosevelt, W. Gamaliel Harding, Hoover, Billy Sunday, Nixon-Wallace-Reagan-BushBush et ilk. Unelected clerics like Long Dong, Palito, Gorbasuch, KKKavanaugh, Mutterkreuz Mom and Rome's current Caudillo de Dios won't be missed.

[Mother's Lament]

Hank's a necromancer and he's trying to summon the dark gods to give him immortality with the above incantation.

[Its_Not_Inevitable]

Thanks for the translation!

[Sevo]

BTW. the guvner should take lessons from grease-bag Newsom; her profile is probably not her best image and Newsom would NEVER allow a photo from other than his best quarter!
It's all he's got as qualification for CA governor.

[NOYB2]

Hochul looks creepy no matter what direction you photograph her from.

[NOYB2]

Has the West passed Peak Agency, i.e. people’s ability to not just legally but de facto make empowered decisions about their own lives?

Don't blame the people for natural responses to policy and government action: if you socialize the cost of most personal decisions, then that is the natural consequence.