Florida Is Shunning the People Who Helped Build It
The state can thank immigrants for much of its recent economic success, but now they're getting the cold shoulder.

In 1980, Florida experienced an immigration restrictionist's worst nightmare: a huge, rapid, and unauthorized influx of largely unskilled migrants.
That event was the Mariel boatlift, a mass migration that followed Cuban dictator Fidel Castro's April 1980 announcement that Cubans wishing to leave the country could do so. In just six months, 125,000 Cuban immigrants arrived in Florida, half of them settling in Miami.
"Observers in Miami at the time of the Boatlift noted the strain caused by the Mariel immigration," wrote University of California, Berkeley, labor economist David Card in his highly influential (and contentious) 1990 paper on the boatlift. "Widespread joblessness of refugees throughout the summer of 1980 contributed to a perception that labor market opportunities for less-skilled natives were threatened by the Mariel immigrants." The boatlift increased Miami's labor force by a staggering 7 percent.
Politicians feared the worst. Bob Graham, who was then Florida's Democratic governor, told Congress that his state could not "subsidize…undesirables." With Florida communities forced to handle "an unduly harsh burden," he said, the federal government needed to "take responsibility for expelling those individuals now."
In retrospect, what didn't happen to the labor market is one of the biggest lessons from the boatlift. It "had virtually no effect on the wage rates of less-skilled non-Cuban workers," Card found, and virtually none on their unemployment rates either. "Rather, the data analysis suggests a remarkably rapid absorption of the Mariel immigrants into the Miami labor force."
There's a broad reason for this: The economy isn't a fixed pie. As immigrants begin to consume in a new place, jobs will arise to address the increased demand. There's a Florida-specific reason, too: "In the two decades before the Mariel Boatlift Miami had absorbed a continuing flow of Cubans, and in the years since the Boatlift it has continued to receive large numbers of Nicaraguans and other Central Americans," wrote Card. "Thus, the Mariel immigration can be seen as part of a long-run pattern that distinguishes Miami from most other American cities."
The Marielitos integrated into their new communities, founded businesses, and transformed local economies. The "long-run pattern" of welcoming that Card identified has continued not just in Miami, where 58.1 percent of residents are foreign-born, but across Florida. Immigrants have become a major force in the state. More than one in five residents is an immigrant; per 2022 data from the Florida Policy Institute, 77 percent of immigrant Floridians have been in the state for a decade or more.
Florida's population growth has outpaced the national growth rate every year since the 2000s, and it became the country's fastest-growing state in 2022, largely fueled by domestic and international migration. Its economic growth has also outpaced that of the U.S., with real gross domestic product growth coming in at 91.3 percent over 1997–2022, compared to the national rate of 73.6 percent.
It's no coincidence that Florida's economy has boomed as its population has grown. But now Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis and other immigration restrictionists are embracing policies that aim to keep foreign migrants out, even as they hail the economic growth that newcomers have helped create. If they succeed in shutting the state's doors, they could very well stifle the force that has powered so much of Florida's success.
Boomtown
The Mariel boatlift rocked South Florida in many ways; some observers have noted that property crime and murder rates went up. (Others, such as Reason Contributing Editor Glenn Garvin, cast doubt on the connection.) But looking back on the boatlift in a 2016 interview with El Nuevo Herald, César Odio, who was an assistant city manager in Miami during Mariel, said the chaos helped prepare the area for future migration events. The newcomers mostly became valuable community members: "On balance, Odio and other former officials said, Miami and Miami-Dade benefited from Mariel because the majority of the refugees went on to become successful citizens," wrote El Nuevo Herald's Alfonso Chardy.
Another wave of Cuban migrants arrived in South Florida in 1994, numbering around 35,000. Florida was one of the country's top destinations for immigrants throughout the 1990s—and not at the expense of economic growth. "During the 1990s, Florida has been topped only by Texas in the number of jobs created," Stanley K. Smith, director of the University of Florida's Bureau of Economic and Business Research, said in August 1999. Despite a recession in the early 1990s, property values and tax revenue soared.
Immigrant population growth was more than double native-born population growth in the early 2000s. Foreign newcomers primarily worked in critical sectors such as "agriculture, services, construction, wholesale trade, transportation and warehousing," and manufacturing, according to a 2007 paper by Florida International University's Research Institute on Social and Economic Policy. From 2000 to 2005, immigrants received less in public assistance than nonimmigrants did, and they comprised a larger share of the self-employed. Construction jobs for Latinos were more numerous in the South than in other parts of the country between 2003 and 2006. Meanwhile, "the rate of housing supply per capita nearly doubled" in Florida relative to the 1990s, according to a 2012 Federal Reserve Bank of New York study.
"Although its share has declined in recent decades, net migration still accounts for more than 80% of Florida's population growth," explained Smith and his colleague Scott Cody in a 2010 report. Florida's immigrant population growth clocked in at 8.4 percent from 2010 to 2014, compared to a national rate of 5.8 percent. About 68 percent of Florida's immigrant population was working-aged, compared to just 48 percent of the native-born population, according to a 2014 New American Economy paper—making foreign-born residents 38.7 percent more likely to work than natives.
In 1990, the Migration Policy Institute reports, Florida was home to 1.66 million immigrants, who made up 12.9 percent of the total state population; by 2021, they numbered 4.6 million, or 21.2 percent. These days, only California, New Jersey, and New York have a higher immigrant share of the population.
Florida's Hispanic voters are increasingly voting Republican, and people who naturalized as U.S. citizens after fleeing authoritarian regimes such as Cuba and Venezuela represent important voting blocs for the right. Recent domestic transplants—e.g., those who moved to Florida during the pandemic—have also skewed Republican. Against this backdrop, Florida narrowly elected DeSantis governor in 2018 and overwhelmingly reelected him in 2022.
Florida Falls Short
"If you have folks who are inclined to think Florida is a good place [to settle], our message to them is we are not a sanctuary state," DeSantis said at a 2022 press conference.
The governor, who now is running for president, has made no secret of his hardline stance on immigration: His campaign's economic agenda argues that a "fair labor market" requires "securing the border, enforcing our laws," and "limiting unskilled immigration." Far from seeing undocumented immigrants as people with valuable skills and economic potential, DeSantis regards them as "threats" and a "burden" to taxpayers.
But DeSantis isn't against all migrants. "Florida ranks #1 in the nation for attracting and developing [a] skilled workforce," bragged a November 2022 press release from DeSantis' office. Shortly before he launched his presidential run, the governor boasted that Florida is "the fastest-growing state in the nation," ranking "number one for net in-migration." His campaign trail pitch to make America Florida relies on many of the same tactics that drew hundreds of thousands of people to his state during the pandemic.
While he boasts about American workers flocking to Florida, DeSantis won't admit the benefits of foreigners doing the same.
That line of thinking fueled his decision to fly dozens of migrants who were "trying to come to Florida" from San Antonio, Texas, to Martha's Vineyard, Massachusetts. "At a news conference," The Washington Post reported, "DeSantis said his program was insulating Florida against the costs of absorbing new immigrants." His 2023–2024 budget called for an additional $12 million for migrant transport "to protect Floridians against the harms resulting from illegal immigration."
The move was a controversial and legally dubious use of state funds. It siphoned cash from tax coffers that DeSantis has bragged were filled by American migrants fleeing blue localities. It also sent willing workers away from the state: A few migrants stayed in Martha's Vineyard and found jobs in landscaping and painting.
DeSantis sent an even stronger signal when he signed Senate Bill 1718, a harsh immigration crackdown bill, into law last May. Its measures have limited protections and rights for undocumented immigrants, barring localities from issuing them ID cards and making it a felony for Floridians to knowingly transport people who are undocumented into the state. Those policies are bad enough, putting roughly 772,000 undocumented Floridians at risk. But the bill's most visible damage has come from the measure most closely tied to the state economy: E-Verify.
That federal system checks the immigration status of hired workers, subjecting employers to a time-consuming and costly compliance process. The benefits aren't clear, but the downsides are: It punishes employers for their hiring practices, strips jobs from immigrants who want to work, and forces both foreign-born and native-born workers to get yet another permission slip to live their lives. DeSantis' E-Verify mandate means that all Florida employers—even private ones—with 25 or more workers must certify that those workers are all legally present in the country. Noncompliant employers face fines of $1,000 per day.
Viral videos quickly emerged showing construction sites that had gone silent, seemingly empty of undocumented workers who might be punished under the new measures. More than 300,000 immigrants worked in Florida's construction sector as of 2018—and according to a New American Economy analysis, 17 percent of the entire construction work force was undocumented as of 2014. It's difficult to estimate how many undocumented immigrants left Florida because they feared S.B. 1718's consequences. But even before the bill formally took effect, news outlets reported that migrants were seeking greener pastures.
If Florida ends up driving away immigrant workers, it could expect staffing shortages in some of the sectors that are most important to its continued growth. Immigrants make up 49 percent of farming, fishing, and forestry occupations, according to an American Immigration Council analysis of 2018 Census Bureau data. About 38 percent of construction and extraction workers are immigrants. Immigrants fill 35 percent of health care support roles, which are critical as the state faces a staggering aging crisis.
As he campaigned for a second term as governor, DeSantis ran on the state's economic progress and attractiveness to newcomers, ostensibly forged under his watch. He's done the same as a presidential hopeful. But much of what he's running on predates him—and could be wiped away if the government keeps clamping down on immigration.
Is the Miracle Over?
Some of Florida's hard-liner politicians have begun to realize just how difficult life can be without undocumented immigrants.
S.B. 1718 "is 100 percent supposed to scare you," conceded state Rep. Rick Roth (R–West Palm Beach) in June. Though Roth voted for the bill, he came to see "unintended consequences" among Florida's immigrant workers. "Farmers are mad as hell….We are losing employees that are already starting to move to Georgia and other states." Roth urged the audience to "talk to all your other people" to clarify what the bill actually does.
The law wasn't set to take effect for another month. But the looming threat was enough to scare away immigrant residents, and the reality of a state without immigrants was enough to scare restrictionist politicians.
If Florida keeps up its crackdown, there's no telling where the damage will end. Jobs are already going unfilled: "Florida has 68 available workers for every 100 open jobs," found a September U.S. Chamber of Commerce report. Immigrant workers have been important players in post-hurricane reconstruction, but a summer 2023 survey by Resilience Force, a nonprofit that advocates for immigrant disaster workers, found that more than half of its 2,000 members wouldn't go to Florida to assist with hurricane relief. The Florida Policy Institute estimated in April that the E-Verify mandate alone could cost the state economy $12.6 billion in a single year. None of those numbers capture the lost small-business employees, community members, and parents simply trying to provide for their families.
Florida will gain an estimated 4 million residents by 2030. To sustain that growth, it'll need strong agriculture, construction, and health care sectors—all currently disproportionately staffed by immigrants. The boom isn't likely to continue without them.
Florida has already shown it can handle the most chaotic of migration events and come out of them stronger. "Mariel was very bad in the beginning, but it was very good in the end," former Miami Mayor Maurice Ferré told El Nuevo Herald in 2016. "The vast majority of these people were honest, decent, hard working, industrious people…who are now doctors, bankers, entrepreneurs and who really uplifted the community."
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Because 1980 is exactly the same as 2023; the Mariel immigrants are just like the hordes invading the southern border today; and exploiting illegal aliens for cheap/slave labor is a good thing; Fiona is right.
Fiona is too stupid to realize her closing quote kills her argument as the unrelenting hordes of migration she demands others accept mean it's always the beginning and always bad.
There is stupidity noted - try a mirror
This article is pointless. It is painfully obvious that legal immigration needs to be improved. But allowing massive numbers of unknown persons from unknown places into the USA in any state is idiotic by any standard. To equate this with an anti immigration stance is shallow. Of course we benefit from immigration DUH. Spend your literary efforts on the need for Congress to put on big boy and girl pants and reform immigration. As to the Mariel boat lift……..did this author experience it. If not you should not attempt to address the experience. It was a mess.
Most Cubans were at least mostly European, unlike the Aztecs coming in from Mexico.
There was once a policy that allowed Cubans in if they made it. Obama killed that.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/01/12/obama-ends-wet-foot-dry-foot-policy-cubans/96505172/
What is this, #HateFloridaWeek?
For some reason they're really spooked by DeSantis.
OK started adopting some of the college anti-DEI stuff implemented by Rufo when he was appointed by DeSantis so they have to jump in and start back up with the anti-DeSantis articles again lest he overtake Haley.
You'll have noticed a theme in their coverage of the last few presidential elections - always why a Republican candidate is bad, never why the Democratic ones are, and articles about how they're going to be 'reluctantly' voting Democrat this election.
This is because, IMHO, once David Koch passed away, Charles took a hard left turn. This was evident in 2020 when every Reason staffer stated, if not voting for Jo Jurgensen, they were voting for Biden. What I find most ironic, Reason staffers still appear on Fox News regularly (Nick and Robbie, mostly), but unsure if they appear on CNN/MSNBC (don't watch those channels).
The tenuous alliance between conservatives and libertarians was based upon shared support for economic liberty. Now that Republicans are the party of trade wars and economic protectionism, conservatives and libertarians no longer have much in common. It's not so much that libertarians took a hard left turn. Rather Republicans turned their backs on economic liberty.
And the Democrats?
They've always been opposed to economic liberty while giving lip service to personal liberty, which conservatives have always opposed.
And this is why Reason keeps ignoring the Democrats - and why you keep supporting them?
And this is why Reason keeps ignoring the Democrats - and why you keep supporting them?
I think that's why many libertarians are "leaning left". It's because they're not going to get support for economic liberty from either party, so they settle for the party that says it supports personal liberty.
Democratic Party doesn't even say it supports personal liberty.
In fact, its openly hostile to personal liberty. You want to get married and have a family - DNC hates you. You want to work? DNC hates you.
What "personal liberty" does the DNC champion? The freedom not to get the Fauci Ouchie? Oh, wait a minute on that. The freedom not to wear a useless face diaper? Oh, wait another minute on that. The freedom to pursue your own happiness? No, unless you want to mutilate your genitalia. The freedom to be left the hell alone? No, they don't even support that. So what "personal freedoms" do they support?
The freedom to reproduce at public expense?
How about the freedom not to be forced to reproduce at public expense?
kulcher war
I didn't say "champion". Quite the opposite.
Weed and weird sex stuff, I guess. But most of the left is now openly hostile to free speech, and any restriction on government emergency powers and all in on public health authoritarianism. And I'd say that despite the trade stuff, which I'm not wild about, the right is a lot better on personal economic liberty.
Broadly speaking, the freedom to not conform to some stereotypical idea of a 'typical American'.
Instead you must conform to radical (and racist) anti-racism ideology and acknowledge that men in dresses are actually women.
The tenuous alliance between conservatives and libertarians
The alliance between conservatives and libertarians is not tenuous. When libertarians want to get elected they run on the Republican ticket.
The leftists that pretend to be libertarian don't. as you know since you're one of them.
Well I'm a pretty terrible leftist then, because I support economic liberty and I don't support Democrats.
No, you support democrats. You drunkenly defend them here every day.
So stop with your bullshit, pussy.
When libertarians ran on the Republican ticket they do so on a platform of freedom, usually of the economic nature. You won't see many libertarians do that now because the GOP is now hostile to the concept.
But conservatives ALWAYS supported enslaving women and robbing and shooting teenagers over plant leaves. Looking back at old platforms, the Dems were NEVER in favor or legalizing anything until Gary's 4 million spoiler votes slapped Clinton's snout out of the trough. Yet dumb teenagers imagined back in 1972 that McGovern would snap his fingers and narcs would quit kicking in doors. Smarter folks created the libertarian party which DID demand repeal, and a Gentleman's Agreement to never say Libertarian took effect. So secret was the LP that I attended YAF as the only findable meetings that didn't want to ban electric power.
I don't find it ironic they are on Fox News. Fox took a turn to the Left a decade ago too.
What a retarded headline. People who show up with their hands out aren't the people who have been working here for decades to help build infrastructure. That is part of the issue.
Yeah, today's "immigrants" are sitting in their free hotel rooms bitching about the free food.
Yeah, the people who helped build it have been there for decades. What a silly, collectivist way to look at it.
Yup. Fiona needs to hang out with the young Liz more than the old Liz.
Fiona's special pleading for terrorist importation and borderless anarchy bring to mind Kennan's "Long Telegram" explaining Russia. If the State Department were to charter flights to bring Hamas, Isis and Black September vets to NYC, charter boats to pick up illiterate convicts from all points south of Brownsville and dump them in Alabama, I'll bet $20 Fiona finds some study or crayon report "proving" that's not enough and that a nativist plot is discriminating against countries made poor by exportation of DEA agents with guns.
So straight propaganda it is.
Hey Fiona, how many of them are you paying for directly?
"Zero."
The answer is zero.
This is kind of an obscure way to say Eric Adams is a lying whiny weasel.
(just for the record, the single occurrence of the word "illegal" in in a DeSantis quote)
If these people are so valuable and beneficial, isn't it immoral and short-sighted for us to take them away from the struggling countries they're fleeing?
Are you trying to deny a liberal their cheap gardener? What kind of fascist are you?
The economy isn't a fixed pie.
BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WHAT'S THAT FIONA? I CAN'T HEAR YOU! THE DEBT IS SKY HIGH?! PRINT MONEY TILL WE DIE?! LET THEM ALL EAT FROM THE BOTTOMLESS PIE?! WHAT?
BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Fiona told us sending immigrants to blue areas was a dumb stunt that totally backfired on the people behind it. Because, you see, in just 24 hours Martha's Vineyard proved for all time that Democrats aren't NIMBY hypocrites.
Imagine how ridiculous Fiona felt when the Democratic mayor of Democratic stronghold NYC warned that unchecked immigration would "destroy" his city.
Call me cynical, but wanna know what I'm beginning to suspect? I wonder if Charles Koch has such an obvious financial interest in loose borders, that Koch-funded hacks can't be trusted to write honestly about immigration. 🙁
Just this weekend California and NYC were saying they had to cut government due to costs for illegals. Not cut spending mind you, just services to citizens to pay for non citizens.
You mean sending illegals to blue areas. Illegals aren’t immigrants. They’re illegals.
Why does it matter if Democrats are hypocrites?
Farmers are mad as hell
The class which has historically benefited from slave labor is mad?
We are on the right track.
They may even start a civil war over it.
What's the big deal?
I get all my food from the grocery store, not farmers.
Democrats actually say that.
Editors here use food trucks and delivery services. Farms and grocery stores thus avoided.
Asking employers to follow state and federal law does not constitute giving a cold shoulder.
I don't know how old the writer is,or his research skills But most of us remember the mass export of Cuban murderers, perverts, and drug dealers to Florida under Jimmy Carter about 40 years ago.
The word immigrant covers grannies and psychopaths, more precision please
Fiona attended the University of Arizona, graduating with a bachelor’s degree in political science. At Arizona, she was a member of Phi Beta Kappa and received an award from the Honors College for her photojournalism work on the U.S.-Mexico border.
So not stupid, just giving an opinion.
Look, just because Florida doesn't want to give the current crop of illegal aliens $9000 in free rent, cell phones, play stations, hotel rooms, etc. doesn't mean they're giving them the "cold shoulder".
Seeing how migrants--"always a net positive"--are bankrupting Chicago, NYC, etc., Florida is trying to be more prudent with taxpayer dollars and letting those sanctuary cities and states put THEIR money where THEIR mouth is.
P.S. knew who wrote this just from the headline. One trick pony and she's not at all good at the one trick she has.
Fiona is pretty solid at turning tricks. Especially on ponies.
Sooner or later, you just run out of room.
Martha’s Vineyard did.
If you don't hate immigrants then you're a leftist.
If you inconvience an undocumented alien in any way, including not providing them with free food and shelter, you are far right, apparently.
If you're far-right you better not treat people without papers like human beings, or you'll get kicked of the tribe.
It is thright who treats them like human beings who are responsible for their choices. The Left speaks of them as some sort of migratory animal, like a spawning salmon who have no real choice in their movements.
By Left I assume you mean libertarians, because the attitude in these comments is anyone who doesn't want to round up illegals like cattle is a leftist.
Well, there are a certain type of libertarian who tends to be a simplistic utopianist on the subject of immigration who seems to think that suggesting there are any downsides to open borders and that there should be a means to regulate the influx as being mean. These are unserious people who should be ignored.
What about the defenders of the draconian immigration system who openly deride and mock anyone who suggests there are upsides to immigration? Seems pretty simplistic to me, yet they are treated as the only serious people in the comments.
Ooooh, our “draconian” immigration system.
Do you ever not lie, you alcoholic faggot?
https://reason.org/wp-content/uploads/files/a87d1550853898a9b306ef458f116079.pdf
That ‘draconian’ system that naturalizes over a million people per year? Is that the one you’re talking about, you drunken, lying pussy piece of shit?
Comments like that make JesseAz hard.
That’s your fantasy, not mine. I’ve often said you have some kind of homosexual fixation on Jesse. When the other hobos line up to plow your rectum, you likely pretend it’s Jesse doing it.
Now fuck off pussy, adults are trying to have a conversation here.
The US has one of the highest rates of legal immigration in the world. The US immigration system is draconian compared to what, exactly?
Compared to our own history. You've seen that chart before right?
The one I posted a couple comment up. Maybe draconian isn't the right word. But neither is free, logical, fair, just, simple, understandable, reasonable, or speedy.
Sarcaholic is a fucking moron. Why are you wasting your time responding to him?
RDS hit pieces with him so far down in the polls...hmmm.
An undocumented person who happens to be in Florida is, by definition, not a Floridian. It makes one an illegal alien who happens to be in Florida, emphasis on the alien part.
And if "immigrants" built Florida, it was the ones who came in the past, not the ones who are coming now, and overwhelming our ability to integrate them.
No no no no. Fiona is wrong. What libertarians ought to support is to 'secure the border'. But this can't happen unless there is first a cultural shift in the attitudes of people towards immigrants. Right now too many Americans are welcoming and friendly towards immigrants, believing in the pablum of America as a "nation of immigrants" and the socialist Statue of Liberty "give me your tired your poor" crapola. That has to change. It should be our job as libertarians to change cultural attitudes towards immigrants among Americans so that instead of being welcoming and friendly towards them, Americans should be fearful and bigoted towards them. Ideally, Americans ought to have a greater tendency to fear an immigrant as a criminal and a rapist, rather than to treat the immigrant with compassion and respect. Of course since most people don't wear their immigration papers on their sleeve, what this means in practice is widespread bigotry towards people who don't look and act like 'typical Americans' even if they are citizens or legal residents. That's an unfortunate but necessary side-effect of this cultural shift that has to happen in order to get our borders under control.
Then, once this cultural shift has occurred, then there will be the public support for the harsh measures that are truly needed to secure the border once and for all. Of course the wall has to be built, that is a given. But then the use of deadly force by the wall's defenders against the immigrant invaders needed will not generate the howls of outrage that it otherwise would - look at what happened with Trump's relatively mild 'family separation' policy after all! The public will be more likely to support cutting off ALL welfare for immigrants, even life-saving medical care, and if that means the illegals suffer and die, then who gives a shit, they don't belong here anyway. That ought to be the reaction, instead of bleeding-heart sympathy. We won't need an intrusive police state enforcing immigration law, because citizens will happily enforce immigration law on behalf of the state without complaint - turning in an illegal to be deported will be akin to turning in a serial rapist or murderer, regarded as an act of heroism and patriotism, not collaboration. Sure we will have a 'papieren bitte' regime, but no one will complain about it, because that will be regarded as our patriotic duty to guard against the 'illegal menace'. That should be our libertarian goal. Create the conditions necessary to facilitate the mass deportation and expulsion of illegals without needing the intrusions of liberty that would otherwise be required.
Sadly that is what many truly believe, though they won't come out and say it.
I am waiting for them to all tell me that it is just a giant strawman, while they go back to their bigoted stereotypes about immigrants lounging around on welfare while stealing jerbs.
They're already busy with that in the lynks.
I figured it wouldn’t long before you weighed in on this subject.
Yeah Jeff, we already know that you’re very generous with other people’s money. Signal some more.
Yawn.
I know that charity and goodwill means seeing a man in need and inviting him into my home for food and shelter. If the same man crawls through an open window and helps himself to the contents of my pantry and trashes my home, then calling the police and hoping he goes to jail is not a crime against humanity.
Anyone, no matter what race or original nationality, who comes to this country legally; who strives for citizenship; who embraces our language & culture while respecting their own traditions; who wants to help keep this country the best in the world--I welcome him with open arms and call him a fellow American.
Those who sneak into this country illegally; who break immigration, employment, tax, zoning and even basic traffic laws on a daily basis; who reject our culture and retreat into barrios and ethnic enclaves; who demand taxpayer-funded social services not even available to citizens in good standing--I have little sympathy for them and their "plight".
I know that charity and goodwill means seeing a man in need and inviting him into my home for food and shelter. If the same man crawls through an open window and helps himself to the contents of my pantry and trashes my home, then calling the police and hoping he goes to jail is not a crime against humanity.
I understand what you are saying, you don't want to reward people whom you think are breaking the rules. However, here is a better analogy which better reflects the reality of our current immigration system.
You insist that you are a kind and decent and caring and generous person who is willing to help a man who is genuinely in need, but only if that man follows the rules. Okay, fair enough. But, the rules say that the man must wait in line for up to *30 years* before he can receive the help you are willing to offer him.
So from the desperate man's point of view, he can be forgiven for thinking your gesture of generosity is an empty promise, a cruel joke.
Part of the issue here is that THE RULES THEMSELVES ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM. The reason why there are so many people seeking asylum is because it is a legal loophole around the insane quota rules that have a wait time of up to 30 years.
Yes the immigrants ought to follow the rules. But the rules can't be ridiculous, either. Ridiculous stupid rules can't be enforced and leads to the situation that we currently have.
Yes the immigrants ought to follow the rules. But the rules can’t be ridiculous, either. Ridiculous stupid rules can’t be enforced and leads to the situation that we currently have.
One thing I've found is that those who defend treating illegals like animals rarely if ever say the rules are the problem.
If the rules are the problem the solution is to change the rules not to simply ignore and break the rules. If you don't have the votes to change the rules tough luck.
I find the defenders of the current immigration system who pour hate on illegals behave very similarly to how leftists do when they justify high taxes and pour hate on people who avoid them. They both have this attitude of "Well it sucked for these people who followed the rules, so it should suck for everyone!"
Good point, but before the 1907 prohibitionism craze disguised as healthy food inspection, South Americans lived happily with legal plant leaves, cacti, mushrooms--even beer and wine! Thousands of pages in the Google News archives attest to this in varied languages. But American corporations (artificial people not in the federal constitution) forming cartels abroad plus religious fanatic prohibitionists waving guns and naval artillery created fascist caudillos that make lots of trade and production illegal. So folks flee, just as they fled America in the dry 1920s.
Fatfuck, you and the drunk pussy should run off together and fuck each other. Go far away.
Neither of you have anything to contribute outside of your thoroughly discredited cliche, hackneyed talking points. It’s all just lying, open borders bullshit.
" Okay, fair enough. But, the rules say that the man must wait in line for up to *30 years* before he can receive the help you are willing to offer him."
Do they?
Then how is it that I know so many for whom it took less than that?
Some from Mexico, some from Cuba, some from the UK, some from Africa. All green carded quick, and naturalized shortly thereafter. Only one on a work visa and one on a student visa.
As with the death penalty, the left has created a web of lies around immigration that doesn't bear scrutiny.
You do realize that "up to *30 years*" means 30 is the maximum, not the average, right?
According to this chart it takes six to twenty eight. Not quite 30, but close enough.
Unless the chart is a "web of lies."
https://reason.org/wp-content/uploads/files/a87d1550853898a9b306ef458f116079.pdf
The rules are a byzantine mess. The actual wait time depends on the type of visa, what country the migrant is immigrating from, whether the migrant has family already in the country or not, whether there is a sponsor, etc. Read sarcasmic's link.
Here is the current Visa Bulletin from the State Department:
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/visa-bulletin/2024/visa-bulletin-for-december-2023.html
Note the first table: under visa category F3, country Mexico. The date is "22MAR98". What this means is, the people who are "waiting in line" in category F3, from Mexico, those who applied on or before March 22, 1998, are JUST NOW getting their application reviewed. That is how bad it is.
Now, this is a worst-case scenario, yes. But it exists, and it is real, and it is not a lie.
If you scroll further down, you will see other visa categories, and their priority dates. Some of them have a "C" entry, meaning "current". Meaning, that there is no line - anyone eligible for that category can apply right away. Oh, terrific! But these are generally reserved for people who (a) are of high ability, or (b) have lots of money.
So the fact that some visa categories have absurdly long wait times, while other visa categories have no line at all, just adds to the perception that the whole thing is a rigged game - those with connections and money can "game the system" and move to the front of the line, while ordinary people have to spend years and years "waiting in line".
"The rules are a byzantine mess. ""
Are they? Try migrating to somewhere else and you will realize that the US has some of the most lenient rules in the world.
They are. That other countries also have a slightly less byzantine mess of an immigration system doesn't justify our mess.
https://www.cato.org/commentary/america-has-legal-immigration-problem
So . . . why isn't this happening in NYC, Chicago, Boulder, and across Texas?
>"Mariel was very bad in the beginning, but it was very good in the end,"
But . . . it *had an end*. This allowed the 'bad in the beginning' to transform.
There was an end to the huge influx. We have a continuing influx and have had for decades, getting even larger now. How long does it take to become 'very good in the end' when the beginning never stops? How long do we have to tolerate 'it was very bad in the beginning' before we get the good ending?
Everything is always equal. Therefore, if immigrants were ever good, then immigrants are always good. Nothing is ever allowed to be different depending on different circumstances.
Oranges equal apples!
I had a pound of pulled pork for dinner last night and it was good. From now on, I'm going to eat (checks math) ~10 lbs. of pulled pork every night because it's invariably better.
Fatfuck Groomer Jeffy approves.
Dude. 10 lbs of chopped tire recycling is not only just as good, but even better, because there's more.
That can't possibly be true, because everyone says immigrants without papers are all uneducated welfare leeches.
edit is still broken
That's the opinion of a racist Democrat ex-mayor with an ax to grind, not a statistical fact.
And while there have been individual success stories, Marielitos have been doing economically worse than other Hispanics and other Cuban Americans, and Cuban Americans are doing worse than average Americans.
As opposed to what? A racist Republican with an ax to grind against immigrants?
Is there anything in between?
As opposed to what? A racist Republican with an ax to grind against immigrants?
As opposed to facts, which I then give you in the next sentence.
That is, Ferre is cherry-picking individual success stories to support a false narrative, when in reality Marielitos (and Cuban immigrants since 1980 in general) have been anything but economic success stories.
Marielitos have been doing economically worse than other Hispanics and other Cuban Americans
What is your evidence for this claim?
The boatlift increased Miami's labor force by a staggering 7 percent.
A 7 percent alteration of the labor force is staggering but, the fact that the 7 percent represents less than approximately 10% of the overall numbers seen today every year is just... meh. The next boat could completely wipe out the 7% gain and increase the dote by far more, but let's focus on the cherries we picked rather than some sort of even minimally coherent policy of balancing spending and growth.
End non-consensual welfare.
If it is consensual, it is called charity.
And since that is a religious concept, it is actually illegal in many jurisdictions.
(what first amendment?)
The state can thank immigrants for much of its recent economic success, but now they're getting the cold shoulder.
Translation: "Gimme those cheap second class citizens who work without costly regulations or labor demands! The South's economy would collapse without slave labor!" Ah, Fiona, you are such a Democrat.
Meanwhile, imagine how much better Florida would have been doing if it had built its economy not on cheap third world labor, but on a skilled and educated labor force.
"Immigrants" are not all the same.
Illegal immigrants are not allowed to work. Therefore, they distort the economy by their very definition.
Either they work under the table, meaning that employers who follow employment law, pay taxes, and go through all the other hassles of doing things legally are at a severe disadvantage, or they don't work and have to live off of handouts of some variety.
This also disproportionately hurts the poorer people, BTW. The only problem with "shortages" of workers in industries like construction is that they've been underpaying for decades because they can just hire cash labor at the Home Despot rather than offer a better job with benefits and possibly a future (training to a trade, maybe) to someone legally allowed to work.
DeSantis must be resurging in the polls. It's the only explanation for all these Reason articles about Florida again.
Florida blah blah fucking blah Florida blah blah fucking blah…
Florida relied on slave labor long after emancipation - into the 21st Century. Without immigrants, Florida's industry would die - yet Trump notes they are "poisoning the blood" and DeSantis with the GOP continue to spread such hate.
Trump notes that Democrats are poisoning the blood, not immigrants. Read his words in context.
Progressive liberal’s entire political action arsenal is based on telling some identity group they ought to be offended and scared by what republicans/conservatives/right wingers have supposedly said about them. They’re literally that kid at recess who lies so they can watch two people fight, just for shits and giggles. (Or in this case, to get power over both).
While her arguments sound good SUPERFICIALLY,
Liberals are very good at crafting propaganda that (IF it were true) puts lipstick on a pig.
Essentially they want us to remove all barriers to entry and citizenship. So, when billions of the world’s poor show up on our shores, we must take them in, feed-clothe-medicate them, because that’s good for us (REALLY?).
They want taxpayers to fund unlimited welfare (at a time when the U.S. deficit and spending are driving our economy over the edge.
For fuck's sake, what is this collectivist idiocy doing in Reason?
Just because two groups of people with no individuals in common can both be given the same label does not mean you can legitimately reason about the two groups as if they were the same people. Florida is not shunning "the immigrants who helped build it". They're shunning a group of entirely different individuals.
Seriously, this is the exact same nonsense that drives genocidal atrocities. The whole "They massacred us in 1840, so we're going to massacre them today!" as if any of the us or them in 1840 are around today.
^ This
And note that these populations are not even statistically the same.
Cuban Americans who came here right after the Cuban revolution were very successful because those were free market capitalists and business owners who fled communism.
Cubans who have been coming since about the time of the boatlift have been performing worse than Hispanics in general, and much worse than the average American, because they are communist-educated economic refugees with few useful skills.
Mariel boatlift - 125,000 vs. the 200,000 every month coming across the border now. This piece is either intentional lying or or a terrible case of confirmation bias. If I want this type of reporting, I will go to Fox News or MSNBC.
>either intentional lying or or a terrible case of confirmation bias.
¿Por que no los dos?
300,000
See? Paying Fiona to ignore reality à la Greta Thornburg with a communo-anarchist twist is not bringing us any credit or credibility. Packing the former LP with Army Of God race-suicide MAGAts only made matters worse. Reason was a voice of reason and the LP was championing individual rights--even for women--pregnant women no less! I cannot witness this latest engineered infiltration by anarco-crackpots as anything other than a bipartisan kleptocracy attack on the libertarian democratic action that formed the party in 1972.
Just go eat a whole shopping cart full of festering dog cocks, Fiona.
CA got invaded worse so what's their excuse?
I deal with immigration documents all the time. Girl-bulliers and superstitious prohibitionists have made the Americas poor and hateful for over a century. Only the LP, High Times and Reason accomplish anything to right these entrenched wrongs. But just now thousands of uninspected religious berkerkers snuck past borders into Israel, killed and kidnapped people and blew stuff up. And the looter media, like Fiona, is acting like none of that ever happened. Just now the screen assured me that Mohammedan Gaza--the same folks who cheered and applauded--is the victim of unprovoked surprise attacks launched from Israel, no reason given. Small wonder the issues are unclear!