That Study of Face Masks Does Not Show What the CDC Claims
The agency further undermines its credibility by desperately trying to back up conclusions it has already reached.

A new study published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) supposedly shows that wearing a face mask in public places dramatically reduces your risk of catching COVID-19. The CDC summed up the results in a widely shared graphic that says wearing a cloth mask "lowered the odds of testing positive" by 56 percent, while the risk reduction was 66 percent for surgical masks and 83 percent for N95 or KN95 respirators.
If you read the tiny footnotes, you will see that the result for cloth masks was not statistically significant. So even on its face, this study, which was published in the CDC's Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report on Friday, did not validate the protective effect of the most commonly used face coverings—a striking fact that the authors do not mention until the end of the sixth paragraph. And once you delve into the details of the study, it becomes clear that the results for surgical masks and N95s, while statistically significant, do not actually demonstrate a cause-and-effect relationship, contrary to the way the CDC is framing them.
That framing is part of a broader pattern. In 2020, the CDC went from dismissing the value of general mask wearing to describing it as "the most important, powerful public health tool we have." In September 2020, then–CDC Director Robert Redfield asserted, without any evidence, that masks were more effective at preventing infection than vaccines would prove to be. Even before the spread of the highly contagious omicron variant, Redfield's successor, Rochelle Walensky, implied the same thing, exaggerating the evidence supporting mask use in a way that made vaccination seem inferior.
The CDC consistently bends over backward to validate its recommendation that everyone, including children as young as 2, wear masks. It is thereby undermining its already damaged credibility by distorting what we actually know. In this case, the CDC is asserting a causal relationship without considering alternative explanations for the results it is touting.
The researchers identified 1,528 California residents who tested positive for COVID-19 between February 18 and December 1, 2021, then matched them to 1,511 California residents who tested negative. The "controls" were similar to the "cases" in terms of age group, sex, and the region of California where they lived but were not necessarily similar in other ways that could affect the odds of testing positive. That crucial point by itself means it is impossible to say whether masking accounts for the differences highlighted by the CDC.
The mask analysis was limited to 652 cases and 1,176 controls who "self-reported being in indoor public settings during the 2 weeks preceding testing and who reported no known contact with anyone with confirmed or suspected SARS-CoV-2 infection during this time." Overall, the subjects who said they "always" wore masks in indoor public settings were 56 percent less likely to have tested positive than the subjects who said they "never" wore masks. The comparison presented in the CDC's graphic is based on a subgroup of 534 subjects who "specified the type of face covering they typically used."
It seems obvious that people who "always" wear masks in indoor public places are more COVID-cautious than people who "never" do. While the researchers adjusted for vaccination, which unsurprisingly was more common among people who had tested negative, they "did not account for other preventive behaviors that could influence risk for acquiring infection." If mask wearers tend to avoid crowded spaces, spend less time indoors with strangers, and/or are more likely to keep their distance from other people—all of which are plausible—those precautions could partly or fully explain the differences that the CDC attributes to masking.
Data from the study reinforce the point that masking rates were not the only potentially relevant way in which subjects who tested negative differed from subjects who tested positive. While 78 percent of the COVID-positive subjects sought testing because they had symptoms consistent with the disease, that was the motivation for just 17 percent of the COVID-negative subjects. People in the latter group were nearly 50 percent more likely to say they had sought testing simply because they were curious about whether they had been infected—a motivation that suggests greater concern and caution. The COVID-negative subjects were nearly three times as likely to report that they were tested because they were undergoing a medical procedure, a prospect that may have made them especially keen to avoid infection.
While the possibility of systematic differences in "other preventive behaviors" is enough reason to be skeptical of the way the CDC is presenting these results, the study has several other problems.
When the researchers called people for interviews, just 13 percent of those who had tested positive and 9 percent of those who had tested negative answered the phone and agreed to participate. Those low participation rates make you wonder how representative the people interviewed by the researchers were.
The COVID-positive people who did not answer the phone may have been especially ill, for example, while the COVID-negative people who did participate may have been especially eager to discuss their experiences—perhaps because they had dodged the virus and attributed that outcome to precautions such as masking. The researchers note that "generalizability of this study is limited to persons seeking SARS-CoV-2 testing and who were willing to participate in a telephone interview, who might otherwise exercise other protective behaviors."
The fact that people knew their own test results may have introduced another bias. People who wore masks but nevertheless caught COVID-19 may have inferred that they were not as careful as they should have been, making them less likely to report that they "always" took that precaution. Conversely, people who tested negative may have retrospectively exaggerated the extent to which they wore masks.
University of California, San Francisco, epidemiologist Vinay Prasad, who discusses these and other weaknesses of the study in a recent Substack post, also notes that the purported effects described by the CDC are "implausibly large." Last September, a report on a randomized trial in Bangladesh described an 11 percent reduction in the risk of symptomatic infection among villagers who wore surgical masks. Now the CDC is claiming that surgical masks "lowered the odds of testing positive" by 66 percent—an effect six times as large. Walensky, meanwhile, has averred that wearing a mask "reduc[es] your chance of infection by more than 80 percent," although the CDC cited no evidence to support that startling claim.
"The paper is entirely, irredeemably flawed," Prasad concludes. "Its flaws are so evident that it should not have been published [or] promoted. When an issue is deeply polarizing, publishing bad science helps no one. It cannot convince skeptics, proponents don't need convincing, and it deepens mistrust in institutions."
Prasad has long been skeptical that general masking, especially with cloth coverings, has an important effect on virus transmission. He co-authored a recent review of the literature that described the evidence supporting the CDC's recommendations as weak:
Facemask efficacy is based primarily on observational studies that are subject to confounding and on mechanistic studies that rely on surrogate endpoints (such as droplet dispersion) as proxies for disease transmission. The available clinical evidence of facemask efficacy is of low quality and the best available clinical evidence has mostly failed to show efficacy, with fourteen of sixteen identified randomized controlled trials comparing face masks to no mask controls failing to find statistically significant benefit in the intent-to-treat populations. Of sixteen quantitative meta-analyses, eight were equivocal or critical as to whether evidence supports a public recommendation of masks, and the remaining eight supported a public mask intervention on limited evidence primarily on the basis of the precautionary principle. Although weak evidence should not preclude precautionary actions in the face of unprecedented events such as the COVID-19 pandemic, ethical principles require that the strength of the evidence and best estimates of amount of benefit be truthfully communicated to the public.
In his Substack post, Prasad laments that the CDC has not sponsored any randomized controlled trials to verify the effectiveness of face masks, which he calls "a catastrophic research failure," especially when it comes to "universal masking" in K–12 schools and day care centers. Even if you find the existing evidence more persuasive than Prasad does, the CDC's lily gilding is troubling. The agency has flagrantly failed to make sure that information on this subject is "truthfully communicated to the public."
While "well-fitting face masks and respirators effectively filter virus-sized particles in laboratory conditions," the authors of the California case-control study note, "few studies have assessed their real-world effectiveness in preventing acquisition of SARS-CoV-2 infection." Given this study's severe limitations (eight of which the researchers explicitly note), it does not do much to fill that gap. The CDC nevertheless claims the study shows that "consistently wearing a comfortable, well-fitting face mask or respirator in indoor public settings protects against acquisition of SARS-CoV-2 infection."
Both this study and the Bangladesh trial suggest that cloth masks are not effective in real-world settings—or at least that their benefits are not big enough to generate statistically significant results. But even on that point, the CDC, which only recently acknowledged that N95s are more effective than cloth masks, is maddeningly evasive. The CDC concedes that "a respirator offers the best protection," which is not quite the same as admitting that cloth masks may provide little or no protection against infection, especially by omicron.
The CDC's handling of this study has implications that extend beyond the empirical question of how well masks work. In this case and others, the agency has proven that it cannot be trusted to act as an honest broker of scientific information. The result is that Americans are increasingly skeptical of anything the CDC says, even when it is sensible and well-grounded. While the CDC's desperate attempts to back up conclusions it has already reached may be aimed at protecting its reputation and credibility, they have the opposite effect.
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The CDC maskerades as a public health organization.
I think their cover is shot now.
I make 85 dollars each hour for working an online job at home. KLA03 I never thought I could do it but my best friend makes 10000 bucks every month working this job and she recommended me to learn more about it. The potential with this is endless.
For more detail …. http://rb.gy/u603ti
Sullum is the author of two critically acclaimed books:
1. Saying Yes: In Defense of Drug Use and
2. For Your Own Good: The Anti-Smoking Crusade and the Tyranny of Public Health
So the guy that says drugs are smoking are OK says masks don't work and we trust HIM over the world's health experts on infectious diseases?
"Reason" is an oxymoron. Not helpful to your cause. Just wear a mask. Do the right thing. Sometimes its smart to LISTEN to the AUTHORITIES. Stop signs are government madated restrictions on personal liberties, and obeying them is common sense. So too with vaccination and mask mandates. Stay in your lane please!
Stop signs are government madated restrictions on personal liberties
Please kill yourself. You are too stupid to live.
Run one in front of a cop and see how quick authority falls on you.
Did you think that was clever?
They are traffic LAWS not governor whims
I agree that we must be selective about whom we listen to, but poisoning the well as you have is a rather sleazy tactic. Telling people just to do something you want them to do without offering reasons is hardly a contribution to discourse. Yes, sometimes listening to authorities is a good thing, but the whole point here is determining when they are trustworthy. By default, there exists a presumption of trust toward authorities within their respective domains of competence for at least purely practical reasons, but when evidence shows that these authorities are untrustworthy, then we would be irrational in trusting them. We might still determine that it is better to obey (not every hill is worth dying on), but our disposition is changed.
A good skill is being able to determine who is an authority with integrity and competence, and not a careerist or some timecube rando on the internet.
You're hilarious. All you need is a hashtag (#trustthescience, for example, or #fauciwasright), and it would be perfect OBL stuff.
Yay for driveby morons.
U literally have NO common sense. As Faucci told 60-min. 2-yrs ago; "Wearing a mask may make u feel better, but they do NOTHING in combating the spread of a virus". Then..., 2-weeks later the millions of dollars sent to Marketing, Advertising and Psychological think tanks kicks in.... Which SAID; Americans will need a visual that "something is wrong". AS..., they won't SEE anything wrong in thier actual reality. Grow up dude.... U literally have the intellectual depth of a two week old mud puddle.
The Phucko Knows
After only brief membership I’m almost shocked to see a rational, reasoned observation such as yours. Thank you, JIM 7. Most seem to post un-reasoned (and uncivil) declarations that betray a firmly held, religion-of-Trump agenda.
As to the anti-mask message that pervades this story, it is entirely possible - for the specific reasons cited - that data is skewed by behavior of subjects in both masked and unmasked camps, HOWEVER, that obviously doesn’t invalidate the conclusion. While merely an empirical observation, my friend’s unmasked extended family lost 12 members to COVID last year. She, happily, is vaxxed, masked, and healthy.
I have no mortality comparison with masked acquaintances as my only close friend to die of COVID caught it after he prematurely stopped wearing a mask. I can testify that it is the ugliest, saddest, most horrific experience watching one you care about (via Zoom) struggling for EVERY SINGLE BREATH the last couple days he’s alive, and the disbelieving expression of “How could I have been so F-ing STUPID?!?”
"After only brief membership I’m almost shocked to see a rational, reasoned observation such as yours. Thank you, JIM 7. Most seem to post un-reasoned (and uncivil) declarations that betray a firmly held, religion-of-Trump agenda."
Since YOUR head is already up your ass, stuff your TSDS up there to keep it company.
Oh, and fuck off and die, slaver.
Oh, wow! I believe every word of that! Not.
This far into the covidiocy I still don't know a single persons who has died of he dreaded covid, all by itself. My mother-in-law dies a few days short of 95. They didn't even try to classify her death at home to covid. She was 95. A sister-in-law died with it. Met the clinical definition of morbidly obese, and was being treated for other URIs with antibiotics right up until her death in the hospital. She was classified by the hospital as a covid death. It was death with covid. It was possibly a contributing factor, but not the cause. And a friend with advanced Parkinson's who deteriorated rapidly in his last few months. I think the health authorities classified him as a covid death.
And that's it. One of my sons recently had it- in the free state of Florida, not the Dictatorship of New York. No masks, no vaccine. Doctor prescribed the full IMASK+ protocol, an independently owned compounding pharmacy filled the prescription since the major chains won't touch them, and an hour after the first pill he started feeling better. Now fully recovered. Two of my sons in NY had it earlier on and were prescribed the standard treatment- go home and if you start to get worse go to the ER, where we may or may not admit you, but we're still not going to do anything until you get bad enough to be on a ventilator. We think- can't be sure- my wife had it in February 2020 when the "experts" told us it wasn't here . Yet, she had all the symptoms. Including the signature loss of taste and smell. To which I always hear "Well flu can do that." And in 66 years of living I've never known anyone with flu and those symptoms- but for a temporary deadening of smell due to mucus buildup.
All the measures ordered by dictatorial governors, mayors, school administrators, and recommended by Dr. Fraudci have been for one reason and one reason alone- control. They have never been about health.
My Vitamin D blood level is 60 ng/ml. Making my chances of dying from the dreaded covid essentially zero. I take other supplements and have other health measures I practice to lessen my chance of getting it. And they don't include masking, vaccination, or social distancing. Multiple close exposures, including a coworker who a year into the covidiocy came to work not realizing that complete loss of smell and taste was a covid symptom. A vaccinated coworker. Yes, there are people not educated yet to that simple fact.
Jim, stuff your head up your ass.
So, just misinformation?
Maybe they will eventually cough up the facts.
Sick joke.
A bunch of hacks.
Never, ever forget George Carlin's first rule.
Bring note cards to look up the punchline to your own jokes? Near end Carlin was sad to watch
No dispute there. Even performances I loved growing up are utterly unwatchable now.
But he gave us the first rule. Never forget.
Guess we have a new science reporter....Bailey? Oh, Bailey? Looks like LoS replaced you.
Hah. Science reporter indeed.
Science Sock!
Several take downs of that paper have hit twitter in the last 4-5 days. Most of them have similar complaints, all valid AFAIK.
Going from twitter to a magazine like Reason in a few days has to be a record.
"all valid AFAIK."
Ah, that's good then, valid as far as you know.
Good enough for me, saves me having to think or anything.
Or just wear your mask; no reason to think about that either.
"The CDC summed up the results in a widely shared graphic that says wearing a cloth mask "lowered the odds of testing positive" by 56 percent, while the risk reduction was 66 percent for surgical masks and 83 percent for N95 or KN95 respirators."
And that is all most news sources are going to report, and all most Americans are going to hear. IOW, "settled science."
Never mind that Walensky and Company are promoting a false sense of security [at best] and encouraging people to engage in stupid and self injurious behaviors.
This is nothing to sneeze at.
Come on CDC, say it but don't spray it.
Psay it, don't pspray it, with Miss Information at the lectern.
That's what's most maddening to me about the mask debate. Masks aren't just neutral. They cause actual harm and if they are somewhere between useless and slightly marginally effective, then they are just encouraging people to engage in more risky behaviors because of a false sense of security. There is no virtue in promoting masks as doing something they don't. The only reason for it is psychological manipulation.
And yet it appears that the CDC has doubled down on this cultish behavior. It is absolutely atrocious.
Won't someone rid me of this troublesome CDC?
Remember Wallensky crying on TV?
This was during the period when covid was in rapid decline, the vaccine was prevalent and weeks away from availability for anyone who wanted it, and going into the period where Delta wasn't around and covid numbers were the lowest since the start.
Anyone who is that panicked, at that stage, either has bad data or is entirely not rational. Neither of which is a good look for a leader granted the kind of power ceded to the CDC. But, considering that, how could we expect better?
Yet look at what we have here: a total 180 on the covid narrative
https://simulationcommander.substack.com/p/the-change-in-the-wind-is-obvious
Last year it was ‘Neanderthal thinking’ to lift mask restrictions. This year it’s ‘the right step.’
What changed, I wonder? (Poll numbers)
I don't remember where, but a poll last week, or two weeks back, said 70% of people think it's time to just get on with life.
Most people expected they were getting the 'rona now that Omnicron is everywhere, too. Or someone else they knew would. And oh, well.
That said, the same poll said that while we should just get on with it, about half still said more restrictions should be in place, which is a little counterintuitive. I wonder if the same poll, done now that the peak has passed for most of us, would lower that half still wanting more masking.
I hope you're right. I bet they have real problems with the independents polling numbers for the election this fall and are desperate for any sort of a win.
That's been the trouble from the start. Every measure is pushed in terms of its (possible) positive effects, with little thought to the possible negative effects. Lockdowns, sure, that will stop the virus, and the fact that inflicts major suffering and health problems is just ignored.
Real life does not work that way. There are always tradeoffs. Sometimes they are worth it, sometimes not, but to go on as though there are no downsides, ever, is foolish.
And as "Elvis is Real" points out, once you yield to the authorities decisions regarding your personal risk, you've become a puppet.
"The result is that Americans are increasingly skeptical of anything the CDC says, even when it is sensible and well-grounded."
We don't have enough information to support that conclusion. The CDC would first have to say something sensible and well-grounded.
+^
+ ^
When you've lost Slate.com:
When experts or agencies deliver information to the public that they consider possibly or definitively false to further a larger, often well-meaning agenda, they are telling what is called a noble lie. Although the teller’s intentions may be pure—for example, a feeling of urgency that behavioral change is needed among the lay public—the consequences can undermine not only those intentions but also public trust in experts and science. During the first year of COVID-19, leaders were faced with an unknown disease amid a politically sensitive election in the era of social media, and the preconditions for noble lies became especially fertile. Not surprisingly, we witnessed several examples. More than anything, these examples illustrate the destructive potential of such lies.
Noble lies—small untruths—yield unpredictable outcomes. Nietzsche once wrote, “Not that you lied to me, but that I no longer believe you, has shaken me.” Public health messaging is predicated on trust, which overcomes the enormous complexity of the scientific literature, creating an opportunity to communicate initiatives effectively. Still, violation of this trust renders the communication unreliable. When trust is shattered, messaging is no longer clear and straightforward, and instead results in the audience trying to reverse-engineer the statement based on their view of the speaker’s intent. Simply put, noble lies can rob confidence from the public, leading to confusion, a loss of credibility, conspiracy theories, and obfuscated policy.
Noble lies are a trap. We cannot predict the public’s behavior, and loss of trust is devastating. The general population is far too skeptical to blindly follow the advice of experts, and far too intelligent to be easily duped.
Slate? Really?
Wow. That's outta far left field.
Did Slate support masks?
Tbh, I don't read them the past few years unless someone links a particularly slanted take.
I would phrase it this way: lying undermines your credibility and trustworthiness and as a result people will conclude that you are less trustworthy *because* you have demonstrated that to be the case. There is no such thing as a noble lie. That is an oxymoron, even if the end was good. No evil may be committed so that good may come. Worse, lying is intrinsically evil meaning there is no situation where lying is in fact good because it entails the perversion of the faculty of speech, and all perversion of our faculties is evil.
We are not always bound to speak the truth (such as when someone is not entitled to certain information or may wish us or others harm), and we may in certain circumstances employ mental reservation, but lying is never morally licit.
Drawing on Josef Pieper, such lying is coercive. This much is obvious. The CDC wanted to control the populace through deception to achieve an end it concluded was good. As a result, it has undermined the previous trust of the public.
"...The CDC wanted to control the populace through deception to achieve an end it concluded was good. As a result, it has undermined the previous trust of the public."
Further, it suggests that the prior trust may well have been in error, and that government agencies in general may also not be trustworthy.
That Study of Face Masks Does Not Show What the CDC Claims
The CDC needs to be penalized 15 yards. And ejected.
10-minute major and a multi-crisis suspension?
Crossing sports metaphors is a line fault.
Something something collapsing the scrum.
Use it or lose it.
A touchdown equaling 5 points is nothing at all like 2+2=5.
Crossing streams is good?
re-re-repost of Vinay Prasad who's a published medical researcher tears this study a new one-- in a very calm, collected manner.
My favorite takeaway is where he takes an aside to talk about the "the mask protects others" fallacy.
"Your mask protects me, my mask protects you, but your mask doesn't protect you, my mask doesn't protect me."
straight to the substack if people don't want to you tube:
https://vinayprasadmdmph.substack.com/p/mask-studies-reach-a-new-scientific
And he SHOULD shred the masks protect others crap. Everyone should. It's as wrong as wrong gets. I bitched in another thread with you though. Just wish more credentialed experts had the huevos to actually say it.
Of course, 99, you can see me but I can't see myself.
"Wearing a cloth mask (aOR = 0.44; 95% CI = 0.17–1.17) was associated with lower adjusted odds of a positive test compared with never wearing a face covering but was not statistically significant." from this CDC study is huge! How embarrassing.
I like Prasad being critical, but I'm not convinced that the aersol airborne route is a primary or even possible transmission route. He cites the Restaurant Study, Choir Study in the document above. But these each have huge holes. WHO's John Conly has powerpoint on skepticism of aersol transmission.
Restaurant study: diners went to the restroom after one other, touched things, DID come within social distancing when going back to their tables contrary to Prasad's note. Choir study: snacks were shared, mingling. Organ study: infected organist went in first, opened door (fomite surface transmission). The authors admit this if you read their peer reviews.
I have an informal Powerpoint where I break this down in the Appendix if anyone wants to debate or help explain what I'm missing (Slide 38): tinyurl.com/horgresearch
"Your mask protects me, my mask protects you, but your mask doesn't protect you, my mask doesn't protect me."
Also known as a Jeffy-22.
What I find remarkable is how little difference in case/hospitalization/death rates there are based on the public health response. Even if masks are a "facial decoration", you would think they would still do something. If blue state public health officials had, instead of mandating masks, required that employees slap their customers as they walked in the door, you'd think that would discourage enough people from making non-essential trips that you would see a difference in COVID spread. The fact that masks may be less effective than slaps tells me that pubic health officials have so oversold the effectiveness of masks that risk compensation (people engaging in riskier behaviors because they brought they are protected) is cancelling our whatever benefit masks may provide (including the discomfort of the mask discouraging people from going out).
I think that is probably true. Now, even the die-hard mask wearers are pretty much going about their business as usual, not worrying about distancing or other measures that they might have early on. They've really been convinced that they are some kind of magic shield. All else being equal, masks probably do something more than absolutely nothing in reducing transmission of respiratory viruses. But all else is not equal and masks have become such a bizarre social phenomenon that I'm pretty sure the net effect is negative.
Illusion of Control. People just have to believe that there's something they can do to influence the situation for the better.
Did you know that that button on the pole at the intersection that says "Push For Green Light" isn't connected to anything?
Or that many elevators' "Close Door" buttons are likewise not connected to anything?
Illusion of Control. Make the poor sap think they did something to move it along, and they'll sit more patiently and create less fuss.
That's all masks are. They provide hope for rubes.
The funny thing is that the 4 unvaccinated seniors I know (part of the ~2% of the population that represents about half of hospitalizations) are all super into masks. If masking didn't give a sense of control, I wonder whether they would have made different decisions (whether vaccination or staying home).
"Did you know that that button on the pole at the intersection that says "Push For Green Light" isn't connected to anything?"
In my town they are. In the mornings (when all the lights are set to respond to sensors in the streets) they get you a green light. During the day, they don't speed up the light change, but ensure that you have enough time to get across.
Same here.
I'm so glad they got over the "no touch" thing. During that year the lights in town were set to work as though the button is pressed every cycle. You would wait the full length of a pedestrian crossing, morning, noon, or night. Now you only get stuck waiting after the button is pressed.
I'm convinced closed door buttons on most elevators do nothing, though.
The "slaps in the face" precaution may have other, non-medical benefits though. If only for me.
Some things to write on your surgical mask before going out:
THIS MASK DOESN'T WORK
NOT EFFECTIVE
COVID VENTS (w/arrows to each side)
FAKE RISK REDUCER
TRUE BELIEVER
BRANCH COVIDIAN
“VAXXED”
THIS THING LEAKS
I AM A PUSSY
YES I SMOKE CRACK
BONG HITS 4 FAUCI
LET’S MAKE BELIEVE
PRETEND IT WORKS
I’M ALSO WEARING A CONDOM!
SAFETY THEATER
4 DECORATION ONLY
PLAGUE - STAY BACK
NOT A ROBBER
RE-USED 700 X
RUSE 4 U
OMICRON - PASS IT ON!
FEVER? MORE COWBELL
NOT VAXXED, BUT CIRCUMCISED!
FAUCI DIAPER
SCIENCE!
"I'M WITH STUPID"?
THIS MASK ALSO PREVENTS TIGERS
TALISMASK
Wow, that's a lot.
How big of a mask am I supposed to wear?
I don't think I could get all those on my mask.
F*CK THE POPE!
FARTS SPREAD COVID
I <3 BEANS
"If you can smell a fart, you can catch Covid"
My favorite is the mesh screen and face shield combo. They're not even trying to be funny, which makes it even better.
Meanwhile, we really need good research into possible links between bacterial respiratory illnesses like pneumonia and folk wearing the same mask for multiple days.
Or we could just let people wear a mask or not at their option.
Well he won a gold for his quotes at least
https://www.espn.com/olympics/figureskating/story/_/id/33237327/american-figure-skater-vincent-zhou-announces-withdrawal-olympics-due-positive-covid-19-test
I see china has figured out how to ensure they bring home ALL the golds.
I wish I saw this statement as a joke.
I don't. Alas, I wouldn't put that kind of shit past Xi's China.
Through tears, Zhou spoke to his younger self and encouraged himself to be proud of his accomplishments despite this setback.
This is after he talks about how much he isolated himself and the depression that set in from it. Perhaps he should tell his younger self to stop being a bitch and enjoy life, and not listen to the looses that are terrified of the wuflu
Idiot should have gone out and gotten the virus during the last 20 months so he would have been cleared to participate.
Somebody read the report. Phila. schools are abandoning cloth masks; students (using the term loosely) will now have to wear N95 and surgical type masks. Next, homeschooling in "bubble boy" tents.
Whatever health expectations or hopes people had for masks are no longer important. Now the mask is a powerful symbol. It tells leaders how compliant the people are, and which people resist. It tells peers (and betters) how subservient you are. It signals a personal level of fear. And it lets people know which tribe you anxiously hope to belong to.
I am conflicted because I like the anonymity and some people just look better with most of their face covered in a bag.
I'm looking at Table 3 in the study. For the people who have "None" as the mask type, 24 tested positive and 11 tested negative. For the people who wore respirators, 10 tested positive and 21 tested negative. The numbers for the cloth and surgical were at least in the low three digits, but those are still being compared to the "None" category to get the supposed risk reduction. Aren't they embarrassed to take such sparse data and claim *any* effect, let alone an exact percentage?
"We're 95% sure that the cloth mask is somewhere between 83% effective and negative 17% effective" doesn't quite have the same impact as "56% effective".
Even the surgical mask has a 95% confidence interval of 87% effective to 10% effective - and that's assuming you trust their methodology and assumptions! There's a huge difference between those numbers, and it's irresponsible to take that and proclaim they're 66% effective.
Welcome to government science. The EPA has been pulling these stunts for decades. They literally write the book on how to perform testing and data quality requirements, and then ignore all of their own rules when it's their time. Insufficient data, extrapolation beyond test points, and even throwing out data that doesn't fit the preconceived conclusions.
I have read many EPA studies of such poor quality that I could expect to be arrested if I had attempted to submit them.
And yet some states (one fittingly lead by a convicted grifter for a governor) are renewing their mask mandates... which more and more people are ignoring everywhere.
The CDC having burned all their trust capital on this farce reminds me of a bored shepherd who similarly lost the trust of his town, and subsequently was ignored when the wolf actually came to eat his flock.
Only problem being that we're the sheep in this situation.
My wife works as the Director of Anesthesia at a mid-sized hospital (270 beds). The hospital mandated vaccinations, and anyone who didn't comply was terminated. In August, every single staff member in the maternity ward contracted Covid, from single patient, IN SPITE of mandatory wearing of full PPE suitable for a highly-aerosolized environment. If that PPE didn't work, a fucking cloth mask or the procedural masks businesses pass out isn't going to either. It's all bullshit.
If we can't keep the bug out of nursing homes, hospitals, and jails, what chance do we have to keep it out of the general population?
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Reason is promoting misinformation*, now.
*Misinformation being what goes against the government narrative, not necessarily something untrue.
They're promoting the narrative of these guys.
Libertarians
While ostensibly championing the same thing as the above group ('Muh Freedums, Muh Liburties') their reasons are solely economic. These are ppl that have no regard for life or the greater good so long as they can profit, and see any mitigation efforts as impediments to that.
These are the same ppl that would send little kids into coal mines and textile mills and love Ayn Rand and her 'Virtue of Selfishness' Many of the lockdown protests were organized and funded by the Koch's and others itching to get ppl back to work (infections and deaths be damned) to keep their stock portfolios up.
They also are the biggest promoters of the 'herd immunity' w/o a vaccine first being available. Remember, YOUR life means nothing to them.
^Parody or stupidity?
Well, B Tucker, you’re partly right; *your* life means nothing to me. As long as I don’t cause you physical harm, or steal from you, why *should* your life mean anything to me?
Wait, I thought the Party Line was "masks don't protect you but protect others from being infected by you". Now they're claiming that masks do protect you?
Christ on a crutch, they change their story every time they change their socks. But they can't understand why they have no credibility?
I honestly don't understand why any studies at all are required at this point. We already know from two years of directly observing hundreds of millions of people in the US that these non-medical interventions make no difference in case rates or deaths. Compare any two states you like, compare the most face-masked one to the least, and show me that one state was significantly better than the other over an entire seasonal cycle. You can't. What you will see are outbreaks, primarily tied to seasons, or to the introduction of new strains. And those outbreaks break out ALL OVER in time.
Think, people. We have the truth literally in front of our faces now, we don't need it "explained" to us. There's no mystery about it. It's like colds and the flu.
Another case of people failing to update their beliefs based on new information. Early on people could plausibly claim that we just don't know. Now it's fucking obvious (and has been for some time). Lockdowns, mask mandatess, forced business closures all make no significant difference to how the virus plays out over the long term.
You left out one important thing we also now know in light of Omicron.
The cold has worse outcomes. I’ve known more people who tested positive between Dec 1 2021 and today, than between April 2020 and Dec 1 2021. And the 2 people I know who had the common cold in the last 2 months were far sicker than anyone I knew who’d gotten covid.
Covid is now endemic. It’s here to stay. And it’s now just like every other cold floating around. Only not as bad.
Yep! Early on I was gung-ho about getting data to prove NPIs don't work. All the data is clear but the 'leaders' weren't interested in any of it. That's when I realized it's all about politics.
It is instructive to contrast the CDC's mask pushing based on little more than "it can't hurt and might help" initially followed by a handful of weak studies with the pushback against treatments like HCQ and Ivermectin.
Whatever it is, it isn't science.
Yet when refugees are coming to America, they get IVR because 'it can't hurt and might help'.
And yet we continue to mask, with no end in sight.
All of the Minitrue's mask studies are silly social profiling polls. Every single one of them. They might as well just hire Gallup to conduct them over the phone. Conversely, all the actually scientific, peer-reviewed studies that isolate controls and variables show that masks do almost nothing to reduce transmission of airborne pathogens. Not even N95s. Some such studies even suggest the increase of unintended adverse consequences of wearing masks. Uncle Sam is a Clown. And 90% of The People are his sock puppets, complete with sock!
Remember when the CDC told everyone that masks don't work and that they should stop buying them up from medical suppliers and stop wearing them all the time everywhere?
I too remember March 2020.
Clearly the CDC is a failed agency that is best ignored. It has no credibility left and really should be shut down just to save the confusion and misinformation it has continuously spread.
The surgeons who operated on me wore masks, can you imagine? What fools. I should have come to Reason.com and the GOP for my surgeries
+1
Reason tanked as a legit outlet for opinion.
Hahahahahahahahaha
Stop dude... U r showing your ignorance. Surgery and mask r to protect the person who's gutted open from getting saliva or any other crap from getting from surgeons mouth into an open wound. NOT TO STOP DOCTOR FROM GIVING THE PATIENT..., a cold. U have the intellectual depth of a two week old mud puddle.
The Phucko Knows
Or perhaps a random handful of dirt.
Look up the The Respiratory Protection Effectiveness Clinical Trial. It ran from 2012 to 2015, involving around 3,000 health care workers at outpatient clinics at several sites around the USA.
The CDC was testing the efficacy of surgical and N95 masks VS respirators.
Turns out they don't do much. I found one site that listed all the viruses and other nasties found in the nasal swabs taken from test participants. Influenza, coronaviruses, rhinoviruses, noroviruses, other viruses and more.
With that data in hand, there should have been none of this mess with promoting and requiring surgical or N95 masks with covid.
Neither is designed or intended to be a defense VS viruses, coming in or going out. Surgical masks are used to protect against incidental contact of body fluid droplets that may carry bacteria and/or viruses, but they all leak around the sides, and since most respiratory viruses can be airborne individually without needing to "hitch a ride" in snot or saliva, they can be sucked or blown right through either type of mask, nevermind slipping past the edges.
At least the manufacturers of the masks have the sense to print on the boxes that they don't protect the wearer against viruses. Their butts are covered so they can't be sued by relatives of someone who died of the covid pneumonia despite wearing a mask all the time.
sorry CDC fellas, you peddled WAY too much bullshit over the last two years to have even a smidgen of credibility. your mendacious sophistry and blather have destroyed any hope you have of being taken seriously
In this case and others, the agency has proven that it cannot be trusted to act as an honest broker of scientific information.
Where has this Sullum been for the last two fucking years? Glad to know that TDS is not always terminal.
You would think with all these public health experts here on this thread the CDC should be able to find one?
I mean, who are these qualified people that crunch the numbers and tabulate results? what do they know?
My opinion counts for more than their collective knowledge based on being in their field for years, I mean, I can just guess and get a better answer, an answer that I like.
/s
Sad how far Jacob and Reason have fallen.
They used to be so good I subscribed to their mail edition.
Now they're just Big money shills the of likes of AIER and Rational Ground.
The CDC study is indeed a correlational study that can't prove anything in terms of cause and effect, but let's not pretend that vaccines are anything but even worse than masks at preventing covid infection.
Is it too much to ask that the idiots that try to troll here not be lazy appeal-to-authority logical fallacy motherfuckers?
The CDC Lies.
The CDC is a political propaganda arm of WHO, CCP, and the Biden Administration.
Why would anyone believe them?
If the data don’t agree with the narrative, change the data. This passes for ‘science’ in the 21st Century.
The Bangladesh mask "study" is a joke, supposedly a randomized, controlled study of the mask behavior and consequences for 340,000 people scattered through 600 rural villages, over a period of several months. Imagine how well-documented the behavior and Covid-19 status of those 340,000 people was over a period of several months, and how well "controlled" the study was. How do you measure the mask behavior over 24 hours per day, 7 days per week? How do you assess and account for social distancing practices? Prior infections and natural immunity? Variations in living conditions, including crowded apartments and shared bathrooms and crowded houses and shared water supplies in rural Bangladesh? Asymptomatic infections? Whether people wear the mask properly, and for how many hours a day?How do you even identify and keep track of 340,000 people scattered over 600 villages?
Answer: it is not possible. It is a bad joke.
When CDC Director Robert Redfield testified before the Senate on September 16, 2020 that if we wore masks for "6, 8, 10, 12 weeks", we'd bring this pandemic under control, was he incompetent or was he just lying?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VmAFl7c8Bs
How does one explain his comments?