Democrats' Proposed 'Billionaire Tax' Is Definitely a Wealth Tax, and It May Be Unconstitutional
Imposing a wealth tax may not even be among the enumerated powers of Congress.
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President Joe Biden got himself elected partly by opposing the billionaires' wealth tax proposed during the primary campaign by Sens. Elizabeth Warren (D–Mass.) and Bernie Sanders (I–Vt.). Now, in a reversal, Biden is preparing to embrace the idea.
It wouldn't be the first time that a presidential candidate's plans changed after getting elected. The shamelessness of the way that Biden has shifted on the issue, though, is something else. It risks undercutting Biden's claim to being a voice of moderation. It also may reinforce voter cynicism. How's democracy supposed to work if a politician, once elected, brazenly abandons one of the policy positions that won him the job?
Biden told wealthy donors during the campaign that they shouldn't expect a tax cut from him. "But! No punishment, either," he said.
That promise may not survive the Senate, which is readying what The New York Times describes as "a proposal by Senator Ron Wyden, an Oregon Democrat and the Finance Committee chairman, that would raise hundreds of billions of dollars with a wealth tax on just 600 to 700 people — America's billionaires." The Times reports that "under the proposal, people with $1 billion in assets or $100 million in income for three consecutive years would be brought into a new tax system. Initially, they would have to assess the current value of their tradable assets — like cash, stocks and bonds — and their value when they were purchased, then pay a one-time tax on them."
The Washington Post reports that "The plan would also set up a system for taxing assets that are not easily tradable, such as real estate," and that "billionaires would also be able to take deductions for any annual loss in value of those assets."
The constitutional challenges that such a plan would face are considerable.
The number of persons subject to such a tax is small enough that it could be subject to the Constitution's prohibition, in Article I, against a bill of attainder.
The 16th Amendment that gave Congress the power to tax income applies to income taxes, not wealth taxes. Imposing a wealth tax, then, may not even be among the enumerated powers of Congress. Hence the effort by Secretary of Treasury Janet Yellen to deny that the Biden-Wyden Wealth Tax even is a wealth tax. "I wouldn't call that a wealth tax," she said Sunday on CNN. Her colleagues among the congressional Democrats are more plainspoken. "We will probably have a wealth tax," House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D–Calif.) said.
A wealth tax could also violate the Fifth Amendment takings clause, the 14th Amendment's due process and equal protection clauses, and the Article I prohibition against ex post facto law. I understand that courts have ruled the ex post facto provision applies to criminal law, not tax rates. But the philosophical and moral point that laws should be predictable and prospective rather than arbitrary and retroactive applies. People took risks and structured businesses based on an understanding of tax law as it was. For non-billionaires, imagine how you'd feel if something the government had told you was tax-exempt—say, your past charitable contributions or mortgage interest, or accumulated gains in your retirement account—was suddenly going to be subject to taxes. It'd be like changing the rules of a baseball game not just mid-season, but mid-plate-appearance.
It's possible that Biden himself is secretly hoping that some future court strikes the billionaires tax down as unconstitutional. Unlike Warren and Sanders, Biden didn't really want to punish successful entrepreneurs. He does, though, want to push his spending plans through Congress, and if this is the only way to do that, it appears to be a price he would accept. If a court eventually blocks the tax, Biden would get what'd be for him politically the best of both worlds—the spending, but not the tax increase.
It reminds me a bit of when former President George W. Bush signed the McCain-Feingold Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act of 2002 into law. Substantial portions of it were later struck down by the Supreme Court as unconstitutional. Bush had signed the bill into law while saying, "Certain provisions present serious constitutional concerns….I also have reservations about the constitutionality of the broad ban on issue advertising."
The Constitution includes the wording of a presidential oath of office that says the president "will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States." A veto of the billionaires tax would let Biden keep his "no punishment" campaign promise—and would also honor his inauguration day oath.
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You guessed it. Fuck Joe Biden.
FJB
LGFJB
Fuck Joe Biden, Let's Go Brandon.
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Neighter is the income tax but it exists due to the fytw clause in the constitution
16th amendment gave them the right.
3 states didn't vote to ammend, and 3 other states voted no and congress changed it to a yes
The Law That Never Was.
2 states did not vote on the amendment, 4 states rejected it, and 42 out of the 48 ratified it, well above the 36 out of 48 necessary. You pretty much fail on every point, when 45 seconds of internets could have shown you the light. Sad.
Philander Knox maybe biggest liar in American history.
The Power, not the right. The Amendment usurped our individual rights.
The good news is America has a patriotic, pro American, pro U.S. Constitution Supreme Court now, something we didn't have for a few decades.
It's stupid even if it is constitutional.
They're killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.
Yeah, of all the "soak the rich" stuff, wealth taxes have the be the dumbest. It's like they think all our problems are caused by having a functioning economy, so we'd better do as much as we can to disrupt it.
This proposal ain't a wealth tax. They are being taxed on an annual change in the value of an asset with deductions for annual losses. It is actually the worst of all possible taxes. An attempt to pretend a wealth tax = an unrealized capital gains tax. No doubt a billionaire's tax accountant/lawyer actually suggested this. They'll be laughing all the way to the bank.
There is also SCOTUS decisions that say this isn’t constitutional.
Your argument is clownish. Call it what you like, it's another way for the gov't to take more money, and in this case, also punish financial success.
Can’t Build Back Better if you don’t disrupt the current system first.
Read the arguments in favor of passing the 16th Amendment; only the top 2% of earners would ever pay the income tax and the tax would be limited to 5%.
How'd that work out?
To take a page out of OBL's play book.
INE's First Law: They always want MORE.
It's possible that Biden himself is secretly hoping that some future court strikes the billionaires tax down as unconstitutional. Unlike Warren and Sanders, Biden didn't really want to punish successful entrepreneurs.
REASON GAVE BIDEN THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT! REASON VOTED FOR BIDEN! REASON HATES AMERICA! AAAUUUGGGHHH!!!
Such a sad white knight.
Dude, I think you've made your point.
He has no point. Sarcasmic only talks about issues, not about people. And he definitely never emotes pure hyperbole to do so.
All caps was excessive sarcasm?
(friendly-like) no, the 1498th time you did that back in August was excessive ...
fair enough
I'll le the guys I've got on mute say it. But it's fun to make fun of them!
Lol. Do you want me to post your back and forth below with jeff? Nobody here has said your hyperbolic bullshit. So youre projecting below with jeff.
You also claim to not talk about people just ideas. What gives?
Poor sarc. Chumby just muted him the other day, and sarc shit his drawers when he realized, but look at him go here.
It hurts him when he's muted for trolling, so he hopes that by telling everyone else they're muted he can punish them.
Excessive stupidity, asshole
Makes total sense to assume the person championing this bill REALLY does not want it to pass. Of course.
If you show up here to prove what an asshole lefty shits can be, you're doing great.
Poor pathetic drunken faggoty idiot.
It risks undercutting Biden's claim to being a voice of moderation.
I think that claim is dead, buried, and decomposed at this point.
He's a moderate Facist, like a "liberal" progressive
The Mussolini of the Democrats, compared to Bernie, Lizzie, and AOC and her squad.
"It also may reinforce voter cynicism."
Yeah, that ship done sailed. About 9 months ago. Maybe sooner.
...maybe schooner?
#chumby
More accurately, exposes it, as most of his campaign promises, as a lie.
Isn't property tax a wealth tax? Pay up or we're taking your house. Sounds like a wealth tax to me.
Seriously though, while I can understand the emotional appeal to this idea to those who are poisoned by envy, as a practical matter it makes no sense. Like property tax, a wealth tax means that if what's left of your taxed income doesn't cover the taxes on what you own, you need to sell some stuff to pay the tax. Well, who's going to buy it, knowing they'll have to sell it next year to pay their tax bill? This will destroy wealth, and like the income tax that originally targeted the rich, it will apply to everyone before long. Got a 401K? Pay taxes on it. Can't afford it? We're taking it.
Sadly I think this will get popular support because most people think it will never apply to them.
Did you pay your federal property tax? I paid mine. All $0 of it.
BOTH SIDES!
How do you take that as both sides?
I'm thinking you're just an attack troll who isn't interested in exchanging ideas. If so just let me know. I'll put you on permamute and never read or reply again.
I double dog dare you to mute me. TWICE! ONCE FOR EACH SIDE!
Nah... You haven't insulted my family.
You said "let me know. I’ll put you on permamute and never read or reply again."
I've let you know several times. GO AHEAD. You have my permission.
Cheering for you ABC. Get muted.
*zoidberg voice* What an honor!
Since sarc hasn’t muted you, can you ask him exactly how many people he actually has muted please?
I want him to list out his full list to see if I'm still no. 1.
Anyway, by your request, you have joined those who have.
Whats reason like only having discussions with other leftists? I'm guessing like daily beast or wapo? Just with grey boxes in between?
Big news at Reason.com!
I wouldn’t do that. I don’t really be¡wife you have a family. But I DO believe you actually did spend the weekend with really COOL DUDES at a HALF million dollar lake house.
If it actually does destroy wealth that would be seen as mission accomplished by many. To them the only way to raise everyone up (everyone being their chosen people) is to lower the bar considerably.
The chants of billionaires shouldn't exist are just for shadowing the chants that millionaires shouldn't axist before private wealth shouldn't exist.
Well yeah, mission accomplished! When we ALL live in tiny little hovels made out of our little-spittle and what meager dust we can gather... THEN we will all, at least and at last, be more EQUAL!
But I think it is an illusion... In our little-spittle-and-dust hovels, we will BRAG about who has 2 more square feet of hovel than the next guy! (And Biden will tax us some more).
"Better to be equally poor than unequally rich." -The Socialist Credo
A better motto is "for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."
What? Just the one side? What about the Rethuglicans?????
Except for the Party members, of course.
They should be rewarded for their sacrifice to the cause.
Ever heard of a federal property tax? Yeah, me neither.
The sad thing is that this is flagrantly unconstitutional and they give zero shits. Like the eviction thing a few months back. The constitution isn’t gonna stop these folks from their business.
So we’ve got these totalitarian clowns in one side, while the other side wants to re-elect Triumph the Insult Dog. Of this great countries are made. Or something.
Of this great countries are made. Or something.
It's said that people elect the people they deserve. That's a sad commentary on society.
Did sarcasmic really not understand the difference between federal and state taxes?!?
Jesse, do you really need to ask the question?
I knew he was ill informed about basically everything... but that's like grade school understanding of the government.
"I knew he was ill informed about basically everything… but that’s like grade school understanding of the government."
It may have been at one time, but not anymore ...
Yes, property tax is a kind of wealth tax. As others point out, it is not something that exists on the federal level. But it's still worth thinking about.
I think for local government it makes sense. Who owns what is already a matter of public record, so it doesn't have the privacy implications a broader wealth tax would.
I'm vehemently opposed to property taxes. John actually agreed with me. It amounts to paying rent to the town. You don't own your property. You think you do? Stop paying rent and see what happens.
Yeah, that is a problem with property tax that has bothered me a lot as well. I'm not sure what's better, though. Small towns can't really do a sales tax effectively. And I want the locals to know about my income and other assets even less than I want the feds to.
Best might be to make local government into some voluntary thing akin to HOAs (which I also can't stand). But the odds of that happening aren't great.
I dunno man. We need government because people suck, but governments suck because they're run by people. People who use force against us. Well that's not something most people want to pay for, which is why we're forced to through taxes.
And like the non-president on the $100 bill said, two things are certain in live: death and taxes.
Property taxes are repugnant to me. I've known people who had to sell the family home because they couldn't afford the taxes.
But how else government to be funded?
User fees and donations.
Maybe a lottery.
Before the income tax amendment, tariffs on foreign trade largely funded the federal government.
State and local governments have essentially always relied on property taxes, but there were huge (in some cases total) exemptions at the beginning, especially during western migration.
I don't share your disdain for property taxes. I think a legitimate government as a much better claim to a share of the property they defend from foreign invaders than the claim they make to the (current) fruits of your labor. Of course, that's not what property taxes are used for in the U.S. today, but I mean in the abstract.
My question was rhetorical. With effective government we generally don't have to worry about being robbed, mugged or killed, except from the people who are tasked with protecting us from being robbed, mugged or killed.
There is no good answer.
There are many places where there is no effective government. They are predominantly run by democrats. Places like the south side of Chicago, Baltimore. NYC, etc..
Your property taxes also pay for police, fire, water, roads, etc. So yes, it is a payment for services rendered for a large portion of it.
Yeah, that's why I don't reject it entirely. It does largely go to services people actually use. But local government can be just as infested with busy-bodies who want to spend your money on stuff they like.
Lost my interest after the 2nd paragraph. Same bullshit for another 4 years. Donkey or elephant....they all break promises and everyone hates them for it.
You obviously don't read the comments. Donkey is evil and Elephant is "merely" authoritarian. If you don't vote for authoritarians then you support evil.
Stuff you can't make up: sarcasmic's ability to make stuff up.
So you've never read any of Ken's essays. Good to know.
So you don't respond to individual comments, just to the world at large about everything anyone has ever posted?
I DOUBLE DOG DARE YOU TO MUTE ME!
Just like a proggie. Instead of just ignoring me, as anyone with a modicum of will power can already do, you rely on someone else to do the dirty work, and still haven't got the guts to do it.
Dude, as long as you're willing to have conversations about ideas without making it personal, then I won't put you on mute.
Because I like conversations about ideas, especially if I disagree with the person.
Or you you can be an asshole.
Your choice. Conversationalist, or asshole?
Asshole to you. MUTE ME. You said to let you know. I'M LETTING YOU KNOW.
Reminder, Sarcasmic doesn't talk about people, only about ideas.
If you see no distinction in autocratic abuses and outright Marxism between the GOP and the DNC at this point, you’re an even bigger drunken idiot than I thought.
When did the elephant go after wealth for taxation?
They didn’t. They just slavishly back a megalomaniacal imbecile who surrendered control of two of the three branches of government.
Wait, a single person votes for all members of Congress?!? Is that what we are going with now?
You'd think a man with such power would never be impeached.
Mind you, the current (P)resident has done more to warrant impeachment than his predecessor did and he has exactly zero chance of it ever happening.
No. A single person (and his representatives) told Georgia Republican not to vote in two very tight senate run off elections. So they didn’t. If not for that dipshit nobody would have to worry about all this bullshit because we’d be saved by gridlock.
But the Republican Stacie Abrahams couldn’t admit he lost, so here we are.
You do know that Trump and his representatives campaigned multiple times in Ga for the run of elections right? sometimes you have to skip the narratives of the media.
Here is one of a few.
https://www.npr.org/2021/01/05/953471880/in-georgia-trump-campaigns-for-2-gop-senate-runoff-candidates
Did he have people in Georgia telling Republicans there was no point in voting because it would be stolen anyway? Yes he did.
No he didnt. Lin had been fired wa before that and Powell was never his people.
He's doing it now, and his surrogates (regardless of their official affiliation) did it then. But that's probably not the margin; that was provided by Trump actively campaigning against his own party's negotiated relief package in the weeks leading up to the election.
Regardless, the whole incident just showed what an undisciplined incompetent the man is. I was done with Trump the morning of 1/6 on account of it, and his reaction to the riot only cemented that judgement. Really, you can't keep your goddamned mouth shut for two fucking weeks?
Seriously, if the guy was one long false flag op by the Democratic party then I don't think anything would have been handled differently.
Bevis is an absolute fucking moron who's obsessed with his own inadequacy.
"It's only going to be applied to the ultra-wealthy!!!"
Yeah. Just like the income tax, right?
That’s the way it always starts.
With inflation, soon we will all be billionaires!
People out here fall for it every freaking time.
Correct.
Not counting the war related income tax of the great freedom fighter A. Lincoln, we have:
In 1894, Democrats in Congress passed the Wilson-Gorman tariff, which imposed the first peacetime income tax. The rate was 2% on income over $4,000, which meant fewer than 10% of households would pay any.
See. Just the rich. Nothing to worry about, we're moderates. There is no way this tax will impact the ordinary worker.
Now it’s only paid by 50%…
The rest pay through excessive federal borrowing, which devalues the money for which they aren’t paying federal taxes. It’s just a shell game to delude the poor into thinking they’re really getting a free lunch.
Democrats really are Ming the most loathsome creatures in the world.
‘Among’
I dunno, I kinda liked the Flash Gordon reference.
"Ming the Most Loathsome" was second cousin of the Merciless.
"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
Nope, don't see wealth as one of the allowable forms of federal tax. It is not an income tax. It is not apportioned among states (focus is on individuals). So nope, not constitutional.
So what?
I just find it funny people still call it a question when it is so obviously not by just straight textual reading. And the fact that Reason also promotes the "open question" is astounding.
Well, just look at how hard it is to understand "shall not be infringed".
Or this little gem:
"and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Hard to read this to allow vans full of computers and box after box of every file in the place.
Breaking, Democrats killed the wealth tax and pivoted - - lowered the capital gains and income tax to five million and above, because the constitution:-). I have no idea what the percentage at the margin they’re scheming. I don’t want to know.
Lightning speed of how they went from a billion to five million.
Bernie had the bill text ready to go.
I thought he set it at 8 million though, so it would be a little more than he has since he's not "the rich".
Warren had it set at 30 million I think, or a little more than she has since she's not "the rich".
This is pretty much the dumbest idea in the whole Bidentopia plan.
Unfortunately, I bet 70% would say "strongly support" in a survey. (If the survey didn't connect it to Biden.)
And since when did enumerated powers matter?
"Congress has the power to tax, promote the general welfare, and regulate commerce."
As far as they're concerned, that's the entire Constitution. Unlimited power. If nothing in the Bill of Rights says they can't, then they can.
You must be a Rethuglican.
You must be a troll.
Then ignore me, even if you have to rely on Reason to do it for you. GO AHEAD.
So tell me what you want what you really really want....
I really want to watch you cowardly refuse to mute me, after telling me to let you know when to mute me.
Have it your way.
And thus ends another episode of “Poor sarc and his Magical Mute Button.”
you forgot the "overriding government interest" exception to the Bill of Rights limitations.
How about the "if anyone gets sick" exception?
Here’s a 1920 SCOTUS decision that deems wealth taxes to be unconstitutional.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eisner_v._Macomber
How about a boomer tax and an octogenarian tax. You guys have lived long lives and should pay your share.
They will when they die, and most of their assets are taken by the government while their kids are lefts with jack.
Seriously I know more than a few boomer families who inherited zippo because taxes and medical bills ate up everything that had been accumulated over 80+ years. Three hundred grand in surgery in the last year or two of life is common. The only winners are the hospitals.
You are not wrong.
So why support another tax? Shouldn't parents be allowed to pass wealth to their children?
Just offering alternatives. I don't actually want any of it.
Fair enough.
Seriously you don't because that is an impossibility unless medial costs take 100%. Do you even know how actuarial analysis is done? Debts are removed from assets fucking idiot. And since death taxes are capped at 50% it literally can't take the rest of the assets on death moron. The only case where what you say happens is where outstanding debt > assets.
I'm not for the inheritance tax but I am for understanding how shit works. Try learning before making a damn fool of yourself.
In response to this:
They will when they die, and most of their assets are taken by the government while their kids are lefts with jack.
because taxes and medical bills ate up everything
The only winners are the hospitals.
Spoken like someone that's never seen a hospital's balance sheet.
8-12% average profit margins, much higher than many industries/sectors
taxed on income while you're young and working, taxed on wealth and spending when you're old and retired. sounds about right.
I agree.
How could you not?
Not a problem. Roberts will say its an unconstitutional tax and then vote to let it stand after a last minute turnaround.
At the point you're going after a wealth tax, while also asking for the banking records of every poor person in the country, shouldn't you feel obligated to come and admit that you want to control every single dollar in the country?
Hey come on man, gotta ride herd on all them milk cows! Need EVERY penny to pay for this bullshit!
So much for MMT.
Right; sounds like happy talk, but they all know it's smoke and mirrors.
The Constitution...says the president "will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."
By my count this is at least the third time Biden has bragged about shitting on the Constitution. How many hookers does he need to pee on him before impeachment is on the table?
I know it.
Especially when he said “Then, I have an Article II, where I have to the right to do whatever I want as president.”
Absolutely shameful.
Amusing how you lambaste Trump for talking about doing bad things to excuse Biden ACTUALLY doing bad things.
Very amusing, honestly.
He always attacks the party in power. That is what he has said for years. Unless that party is the DNC. Then he will attack the party out of power in case they ever come back into power. Or something.
Especially when the thing Trump was talking about -- surprise! -- he had full authority because of Article II.
Say what? I was just quoting a president saying he doesn't give a shit about the Constitution. Ohhh, I get it. Wrong team.
Can you cite the unconstitutional actions? THe eviction moratorium was based on a very strained reading of powers, but was not definitively labeled unconstitutional when he did it.
Dude said Biden bragged about shitting on the Constitution. I quoted Trump saying he can do whatever he wants. Full stop.
Anything else will be read as team, team, team. Go girl. Or quit while you're behind.
You quoted Trump referring to the part of the Constitution that gave him authority to do something. That’s the opposite of saying “This is unconstitutional but I’m going to do it anyway.”
He knows what this is about. He used his Sqrsly sock to deny it for months when direct quotes about what the discussion was about were handed to him. The discussion that comment came form came in regards to firing executive branch members.
This is unconstitutional but I’m going to do it anyway.”
Only SleepyJoe can say things like that.
So when do the press start treating Biden like Trump, since it’s so both sides?
Did your straw man come with a hat?
sarc mad his monopoly on strawmen is a failure.
"Dude said Biden bragged about shitting on the Constitution. I quoted Trump saying he can do whatever he wants. Full stop."
Biden HAS shat on it. Trump did not. Try and keep up.
What was he using Article II to justify?
Trump was literally talking about Article II right to fire political appointees in the Executive Branch. Which he is 100% correct in stating. His comment was taken out of context and used by Sarcasmic/Sqrsly for years as an attack on him because they are idiots.
I knew that. Wanted to see if he’d acknowledge it.
Surprise! he did not.
"Anything"
Unmuted you just to watch you blatantly lie about what the quote was. He was talking about firing Mueller dummy. But nice to just double down on a media lie.
That's right. Trump gets the benefit of the doubt in your book. Quelle surprise.
Lol. Reading the full transcript os the benefit of the doubt moron? I thought you wanted honest conversations. Yet you defend a single out-of context quote surrounded by discussions of firing executive branch members.
Were you projecting below?
Sorry.
"whatever I want"
There we go.
Just admit you’re wrong. You so obviously beclown yourself with these shrill denials when you are so obviously caught. Is this kind of shit why those really COOL DUDES don’t invite you back to their HALF million dollar lake house?
>>It risks undercutting Biden's claim to being a voice of moderation.
Ira did you type this with a straight face?
I'm thinking a rather grimaced one, as when you use every fucking muscle in your face to stifle laughter. That kind.
That grimace lasted the whole article.
You read the whole article?
Article? Is there a link?
https://libertariantranslator.wordpress.com/who-is-hank-phillips/
Ranking POTUS' from worst:
1. Harding/ A Johson
2. Buchanan [gets credit for Civil War, even though Linconln started it]
3. Hoover [gets credit for The Depression, rightfully or not]
4. Nixon [yeah, he resigned]
5. Carter [for obvious reasons]
6. Grant [good general, if you liked Yankees, otherwise sucked]
7. Obama
Where will FJB fit in?
No FDR or Wilson? Glenn Beck disapproves of this list.
Shitty list from a dolt. Big surprise.
Keep a handle on your drinking, dear. It's gonna be a long year.
Buchanan successfully avoided a civil war, so he should be near the top of the list, not the bottom. Historians like wars though. Strong leadership!
Yes, I've asked a number of Buchanan detractors what he "should have done." Not one of them had anything to say that wasn't essentially "kick the can down the road" (which is just about what actually happened).
Instapundit, today:
"100 YEARS AGO, Warren Harding gave an address on racial equality in Birmingham, Alabama.
Related: This Presidential Speech on Race Shocked the Nation…in 1921: Ninety-five years ago today, Warren G. Harding traveled deep into the heart of Klan country and delivered a sermon on civil rights that was decades ahead of its time. Coming after the deeply racist and segregationist Woodrow Wilson, Harding was an underappreciated figure. But the press didn’t like him because he was a Republican."
Harding banned from social media of the day; pamphleteers.
While Wilson gave us WW1, the income tax, and the Federal Reserve.
My bad; he should be second worst after the Harding/Johnson split.
Carter worse than GWB?
How is Pierce not high on that list?
Besides Johnson and Buchanan, I'm not sure any of those make the 7 worst on any Historian list.
Most recent list i've seen (as ranked by historians): https://www.c-span.org/presidentsurvey2021/?page=overall
Listing from worst:
Buchanan
(Andrew) Johnson
Pierce
Trump
(William Henry) Harrison
Tyler
Fillmore
Hoover is only 9th worst. Nixon is 14th worst. I'm not sure how Carter manages only 19th worst (he should be worse than Nixon in any fair assessment). Grant is 25th worst (which means he's in the best half of presidents).
Not that the list is perfect. Obama ranks unreasonably well, i'm not sure why. But then, I'd rate Wilson, LBJ, FDR, and JFK all significantly worse. (Seriously, what did JFK actually accomplish to be rated 8th best besides cause women to swoon? Surely historians should be more serious than that.)
James K. Polk is seriously underrated.
Any list that doesn’t include FDR or Wilson in the top 5 are fucking trash.
I'm not sure how Carter manages only 19th worst
Obama ranks unreasonably well, i'm not sure why
I'd rate Wilson, LBJ, FDR, and JFK all significantly worse
/checks partisan identification of the Professorate
Surely historians should be more serious than that
I think I've detected a flaw in your reasoning.
Why is Harding #1? The thinking on him has changed, that he was actually a pretty successful president reining in Wlison's excesses.
Also, there is Millard Fillmore and Andrew Johnson.
“Buchanan [gets credit for Civil War, even though Lincolnln[sic] started it]”
The bastard southerners started it when they seceded to protect and expand slavery. Also firing on Fort Sumter.
“Grant [good general, if you liked Yankees…”
As opposed to cousin fucking traitor Confederates? You southerners are so backwards and ignorant. You live in the anus of America. Having pride in being from the south just shows how inbred you are.
No wonder Trump is so popular in the south. Treason is in their DNA.
billionaires would also be able to take deductions for any annual loss in value of those assets.
Oh FFS. So it looks like billionaires have managed to buy the pols. This is NOT a wealth tax. It is a monstrous tax loophole that will be used to eliminate all income taxes paid by billionaires.
I guess it doesn't surprise me. Most people don't know the difference between a balance sheet and an income or cash flow statement. So they don't know the difference between wealth and income.
Apparently you don't know that difference either.
Am I the only person alive who remembers why Proposition 13 passed in California?
All the confiscation will do is enrich accountants and lawyers in the appraisal scams.
"How's democracy supposed to work if a politician, once elected, brazenly abandons one of the policy positions that won him the job?"
Oh, I guess we'll just ignore "drain the swamp", "lock her up", "build the wall", etc. huh?
C'mon- any pretense is fucking gone. Stop acting outraged you dingus.
Moreover, I find you being upset at this pretty fucking funny considering how much it annoys you versus, oh, I don't know...the insurrection on 1/6?
If you want an attack on democracy, why not start there genius?
"Moreover, I find you being upset at this pretty fucking funny considering how much it annoys you versus, oh, I don’t know…the insurrection on 1/6?"
Number of charges involving insurrection? Zero.
I had no idea that parading without a permit was the deathblow to democracy.
Minimal property damage... They needed to talr better notes from the Summer of Love.
"...the insurrection..."
Shitfordinner is so stupid, he can't spell "protest".
You’re a worthless Marxist propagandist. Ideally, you should commit suicide. It would be very good if all marxists killed themselves p, and ended the horrors that they bring with their evil.
Biden has a bit of a habit of shitting on the Constitution.
But, yes, being unable to fire federal employees due to asinine laws is the exact same thing. Or not building a wall that Democrats fought tooth and nail to not fund.
Plus, we all know it’s Tony anyway.
Disinvestment in the U.S. and global economy as billionaires decide big risks aren’t worth it. What are the consequences of that?
Yesterday I linked a Bloomberg article from last week on disinvestment in fossil fuels. Incidentally, the climate rhetoric, along with investors pulling out of fossil fuels due to global government bans and risk of bans is starting a free fall in food transport that ends up as mass starvation in underdeveloped countries. A REAL crisis.
Socialists are the same today as they’ve always been. Always ends up in starvation and misery.
Not just the socialists, you're pretty heavy on the Peter Principle at this level. Most pols are completely incompetent, even if their intentions aren't shitty.
Stealing from one person = crime.
Stealing from 100 million people = taxation.
Stealing from 750 people = gray area.
Stealing material from one person = plagiarism
Stealing material from many people = research
Lie once = untrustworthy person
Lie many times = politician
Well, let's be frank. Doing something constitutionally dodgy against the people best equipped to fight it is generally considered idiotic.
Maybe not when the courts will find almost any challenger "doesn't have standing to contest this legislation."
"Unlike Warren and Sanders, Biden didn't really want to punish successful entrepreneurs."
Not sure what, outside of hope, you base this assumption upon.
His actions do not trump what he says?
the projection is strong in Mr. Stoll.
"Say it ain't so, Joe".
Folks, we are not even a year removed from the greatest presidency ever. Where's a the badass capitalism, low prices and all around awesomeness we were promised would happen once the rich people and the multinational corporations got their taxes cut? The Trump tax cut was supposed to unleash a new golden age. Where is it?
It did.
Then Democrats decided to shut down economies wholesale and, well, there are few things Socialists cannot fuck up.
DJIA hit another record high today.
Well, then Sloppy Joe took the reins and you can see how that's going.
As Obama is fond of saying, “never underestimate Joe’s ability to fuck things up”.
Even you can't be this fucking stupid.
Well, that's not surprising. They were going to get around to some version of a wealth tax at some point. The "millionaires and billionaires" represent just too much money for them to refuse to try to purloin. As always the problem is the spending. There is just too much spending.
Shut up you communist! You voted for Biden! You want a wealth tax! You hate America! You hate freedom! You're an evil person with evil motives! You want mandates! If you disagree when someone accuses you otherwise then you're a liar! Liar! Liar!
I think that covers most of the usual responses. See if anyone has anything left.
Let's try this:
Jesse: You want !
Me: No I don't. I have nowhere expressed support for .
Jesse: Yes you do! You are lying when you say you don't!
Can you put your tax rant in bear in trunk Form?
By the way, it is ironic that you say it is the spending when I have quotes from you justifying increased taxes to pay for increased spending... do you want to deny them? Or just have me post them Jeff?
I have no doubt you have quotes that dishonestly represent a conversation involving myself.
Ha Ha funny stuff.
I have said that IF spending is going to be high, then it would be better to have current taxes pay for the spending, rather than borrowing to pay for it, since borrowing represents future taxation, with interest, from nonconsenting future taxpayers.
I have never said that I favor high spending or that I favor high taxes as an affirmative good. Only that it is a lesser of two evils in that particular scenario.
But Jesse of course is going to say that I affirmatively favor high taxes as a general principle because he is a dishonest shit.
Hey. Congrats. You decided to be honest for once. And no. Increased taxation is not justified as it only begets more spending dummy.
So, Jesse, IF spending is to remain high, how do you think it should be paid for? With increased borrowing? If so, why do you think this is a fair solution to the future taxpayers who will end up paying for current spending without their consent?
So cut spending.
So cut spending.
I agree! That's the superior answer.
But IF spending is to remain high, what is the least bad option?
Hey Jeff. Are you too stupid to realize that the thing stopping Manchin and sinema from passing the 3.5T in spending is largely due to them not wanting to increase taxes?
Your sophist conditional is retarded. Let me throw one back to you.
When has increased taxes ever led to reduced spending?
If they held taxes and stopped spending the deficit would clear out in about a decade moron. Assuming nominal gdp growth.
Taxation is not the fucking problem. Tax revenue increased after tax cuts. Youre just rationalizing increased spending dummy.
Baseline budget spending growth is currently pegged to around 3.6% yearly growth. Increasing taxes won't have any long term effect as growth is pegged higher than gdp growth dummy.
Youre just a fucking moron.
Cut spending growth*
Your sophist conditional is retarded.
Not even you believe that. "Spending remaining high" is pretty close to the current situation that we find ourselves in, since neither team is willing to do anything serious about spending. In fact YOUR conditional below implicitly acknowledges the reality of spending likely remaining high.
If they held taxes and stopped spending the deficit would clear out in about a decade moron. Assuming nominal gdp growth.
So, in that decade's worth of time, the cumulative deficits would be paid for by borrowing, no? Which would eventually be paid back by future taxpayers, with interest, nonconsensually, right? So explain, IF spending is to remain high, why you support this option as a lesser of two evils rather than increasing taxes on current taxpayers and not passing on this cost to future taxpayers as a lesser of two evils.
Youre just rationalizing increased spending dummy.
No, that is you projecting your beliefs onto me because you cannot accept reality. You think I have some hidden position that I refuse to state because I'm such a liar, when the reality is, you cannot accept the reality of what I actually do believe.
The proposed draconian tax hikes and new taxes won’t cover the current spending, let alone new spending they want. We have to cut spending.
Actually, Republicans are okay (not great or even good, but ok) at cutting spending…when there’s a Democrat in the White House.
Of course they get called all kinds of stupid names and blamed for every societal I’ll when they do it, but they usually try.
This entire conversation belies the fact that most Republican and Democrat politicians are now-Keynesian morons.
Lol. Dishonest cunt.
So no quotes then?
Sure.
I have said that IF spending is going to be high, then it would be better to have current taxes pay for the spending, rather than borrowing to pay for it, since borrowing represents future taxation, with interest, from nonconsenting future taxpayers.
You already fucking admitted it dumbass.
And, right on cue, you left out the rest of the post where I clearly state that I don't affirmatively favor high taxes as a general principle, only that in this particular case, I believe it is a lesser evil. As I said, you dishonestly represent my position in an argument.
Cutting spending is a far lesser evil.
Cutting spending is a far lesser evil.
I agree! Which is what I stated above.
I do like watching you pretend yo deny what you just fucking said. You justify higher taxes to ho along with higher spending. Full stop.
No, not "full stop". That is your lie.
"I do like watching you pretend yo deny what you just fucking said. You justify higher taxes to ho along with higher spending. Full stop."
jeff is so fucking stupid, and probably drunk that he can't remember which lie he posted 15 minutes ago.
Why anyone attempts to engage the stupid shit is a mystery to me.
I don’t know that Jeffy is a drunk. Being morbidly obese, he may have developed diabetes that is untreated or poorly treated. If so, the insulin spikes ensuing from him gorging only bon-bone washed down with Yoo Hoo and Mountain Dew Ultra might put him into a cognitive stupor. Given his weak baseline cognition, this would severely impair him to Biden levels of confusion and idiocy.
Keep in mind, this is the guy who professed in this very comment section that he is totes ok with allowing convicted sexual predators, up to and including child mo,esters. unlimited entry into the US.
Stupid angle bracket tags. Let's try this.
Jesse: You want X!
Me: No I don’t. I have nowhere expressed support for X.
Jesse: Yes you do! You are lying when you say you don’t!
That's why he was the first one I put on mute.
As I've said many times, he expects me to defend things I never said nor did.
He is not honest. He doesn't pretend to be. He is entertained by watching you dance like a puppet on his strings as he accuses you of this to make you defend yourself with that.
Stop dancing.
No, he IS honest. You’re not. You twist things around when you’re called on your bullshit.
Obsessive much?
It's because I pointed out how stupid his analogy was as usual. And now he's creating strawman arguments to try to "win".
I bet you anything Sarcasmic is defending him even though he claims to never talk about people, just ideas.
Not a strawman. That is literally your position, where "X" is "government mask mandates".
You literally believe that I favor government mask mandates even though nowhere have I ever supported such a thing, because you think I am lying about my "true beliefs". You will not accept the truth and instead project your own caricature onto me. That is what you continually do.
Cry more.
Multiple people called you out on your inferences from your analogy yesterday dummy.
And at one point I posted roughly a dozen times of you saying "if you don't voluntarily wear masks the government will make you." I also have quotes of you just recently stating of people don't voluntarily provide services or charity the government has the right to force people to participate through government programs.
Your lies are there for everybody dumbass. You always couch it as "do this or government is justified."
Youre an authoritarian. And a damn liar.
And at one point I posted roughly a dozen times of you saying “if you don’t voluntarily wear masks the government will make you.”
Jesse, do you understand the difference between an observation and a prediction, and a statement of affirmative support?
If enough people behave like assholes, sooner or later, based on prior patterns of behavior, the government will eventually step in to force people to "behave". That is not an endorsement of this use of government force. That is an observation and a prediction. But you dishonestly claim that making a prediction is equivalent to endorsing the result. Because, once again, you are convinced that I am something that I am not, and you cannot admit the truth.
I also have quotes of you just recently stating of people don’t voluntarily provide services or charity the government has the right to force people to participate through government programs.
"Just recently"? I haven't even been around for the past few weeks or so.
You always couch it as “do this or government is justified.”
No, Jesse. I say things like "if you don't do X, government will likely step in and do Y". And you dishonestly claim that I said "I want government to do Y". That isn't true.
You do this consistently, and not just to me. You do this to people that aren't the "correct" sort of libertarian that you think libertarians ought to be - basically Team Red acolytes who like to smoke pot, or who once criticized Trump for something, but otherwise despise and loathe and have utter contempt for everyone and everybody on Team Blue. And when we don't do that, because in your tiny little tribalistic mind, that means we are actually on Team Blue ourselves, and you go hunting for rhetorical ammunition to 'prove' you are right, by dishonestly representing conversations to support your bias. You are simply wrong, Jesse, and moreover, you have to live to learn with the fact that there are different types of libertarians out there, and they are not all right-wing-adjacent basically Republicans in all but name.
STOP DANCING!
Eve sarc thinks you are dancing. Lol. Thats all you do jeff.
Oh no no I will not let you rewrite history in this way.
He's not rewriting anything. He's a fucking liar, and everyone knows it. You are embarrassing yourself by dancing to his jig.
Okay, I'll stop now.
Lol. No. It was directly a threat retard. Your sophistry is so tiresome.
An actual libertarian stops at any forcing by authority for doing an action. You play games as to how it can be rationalized. There is no justification period. Yet you offer it up and lie about it constantly.
Remember your 3 months of defending 2+2=5 despite it not being true no matter which base? You defend the actions of the left through your rationalizations then 50 posts in say you didn't mean it after being called out. That is your pattern.
And this is your bullshit jeff:
No, Jesse. I say things like “if you don’t do X, government will likely step in and do Y”. And you dishonestly claim that I said “I want government to do Y”. That isn’t true.
You do this for 50 posts in response to telling you Y is never justified then after 50 posts go "oh, I never supported Y."
It is pure fucking sophistry. You use the threat of forcing Y to argue AGAINST people saying Y is not justified. Like you do with your claims that anyone not wearing a mask is out to kill people.
Youre just a dishonest shit.
Commentariat: masks mandates are never justified.
Jeff: but if you dont do it government will make you.
C: no it is never justified. Stop threatening us with government overreach.
Jeff: but if you don't government will make you.
C: no it is never justified.
Jeff: you are morally obligated to protect me from my own increased risks from obesity.
C: look fucker. Mandates are not justified.
Jeff: i never said they were!
Thats you in a nutshell Jeff.
An actual libertarian stops at any forcing by authority for doing an action.
That is a gross oversimplification. For example, if you are trespassing on my property, I have every right to force you to leave my property, and that is fully justifiable from a libertarian perspective.
You play games as to how it can be rationalized.
What you call "playing games", is actually, using one's brain to think about issues and principles abstractly, without resorting to knee-jerk black-white reactionary responses. You want comforting easy simplistic answers. The real world is complex. Actually, Volokh in a recent post said it pretty well:
I think human affairs are complicated things—as my father likes to quote, "Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made." We all come at this with some general principles, but, to offer another quote, "General propositions do not decide concrete cases," in part because there are so many things we want at once and so many opportunities for good general principles to conflict.
For instance, I want liberty (often including privacy) and security; indeed, security is often another term from liberty from private misconduct (or liberty from foreign governments). These aren't always consistent, but I can't tell you that one should always trump the other. (That's why the Fourth Amendment, for instance, bans unreasonable searches and seizures rather than banning all searches and seizures; that's why the Constitution tries to create a limited government, but does create a government.) I support private property rights, subject to some limitations, and can't easily capture all the limitations into one formula.
https://reason.com/volokh/2021/10/25/never-took-that-libertarian-loyalty-oath/
I broadly agree with this. Do you?
Commentariat: masks mandates are never justified.
Oh no no I will not let you rewrite history in this way.
There were many commenters who were arguing that not only were GOVERNMENT mask mandates not justified, but PRIVATE PROPERTY mask mandates weren't justified either, wearing masks AT ALL wasn't justified because they supposedly "didn't work", along with a bunch of paranoid drivel about how masks were some deliberate tool by the government to enforce social conformity. There were a LOT of arguments out there, and by no means did the commentariat have a unified opinion on the matter of masks.
And I don't agree that "mask mandates are never justified", because they are certainly justified on private property when the property owner declares it so by virtue of his/her property rights to decide what happens on his/her property.
And I don't agree that even for government mandates, that they are NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER justified. It ultimately depends on the circumstances and the nature of the disease. If it was weaponized airborne Ebola? Are you going to say then that these types of mandates are NEVER EVER EVER EVER justified?
But you cannot handle logical reasoning, nuance, abstractions and complex scenarios, you are mentally incapable of dealing with those, preferring instead to retreat to simplistic black-white thinking of NEVER JUSTIFIED, and anyone who says otherwise is a heretic who rightly belongs on Team Blue.
I stand by what I wrote this morning: you are a simplistic thinker who cannot handle abstract arguments and therefore you are insecure in your abilities in this area, so you try to shout down and prevent these discussions from taking place. Because only then will your weakness and insecurity not become manifest for all to see.
And by the way. The three statements "Government should not mandate Y", "Individuals should do Y without a mandate", and "Y is never justified" are three completely different statements. Do you even realize this?
Jeff, the masks mandates weren’t “justified” from either party (as in: they were stupid, useless, and arbitrary as all hell), but one of those groups had the right to do it if they so chose (even though we think it’s stupid and useless).
That’s the position most commenters took.
Lying Jeffy going full squirrel.
Backpedaling sophist shitweasel.
They really don't "represent just too much money." Going after billionaires is worth far too little revenue to sustain existing programs, let alone their ambitions. The reason they say it is because it polls better than "Mom and Dad lose their retirement" - which is the actual minimum cost needed for any one of the Democrats' (currently several) utopian projects.
I agree the problem is the spending, but what whining about 'ionaires is about is messaging. It's worth recognizing their tactic for what it is.
The proposal I saw was a capital gains tax.
It relies on mark to market rather than sale of the assets.
It’s dumb but not for the reasons highlighted here b
I agree. It seems like a capital gains tax on unrealized income. Or like the old retained earnings tax on corporate profits.
Unrealized income, is not, in fact, income. Paper gains are vapor. No one with a lick of sense should regard it as anything more than a guess until the asset is sold and the gains (or losses) realized.
And (especially the first year after implementation, when years or decades of gains are going to be taxed) the victims of this tax will all be selling a significant percentage of their assets to pay the tax. Which will cause the value of those assets to crater, for everyone, not just billionaires. There goes your 401k balance.
Feature, for the people who want more control.
This was the problem with mark to market pricing. Hasn't stopped them thusfar...
Agree 100%.
This proposal is a total scam precisely because it isn't actually a wealth tax. It's just a giant tax loophole for billionaires.
Next recession or financial crisis when the stock market plummets, the 10% of folks who own 80% of stock equity will be able to create a massive tax loss carryforward without even needing to sell stocks. For the 2009 bear, that means roughly $9 trillion in tax losses for that group - with no change in ownership/control - and with the ability to shelter that amount of income in future years.
Assuming Ira Stoll is bought and paid for by his donor class - this entire article is nothing but Brer Rabbit. Please don't throw me in the briar patch.
Not to mention that this mechanism will create both the means and motivation to rig the asset markets - to 'paint the tape' and manipulate asset prices for purposes of creating tax losses.
Edit - The 2009 tax losses for that 10% would have been $16 trillion. Rinse and repeat once every 6-10 years and hey presto - the tax loss carryforwards will shelter all possible income streams for those wealthy enough to sustain massive losses purely on paper.
JFree seems to be suggesting one of the ways by which the tax incomes will fall far below predictions.
Let's not waste time; those folks hire people who are FAR more intelligent than droolin' Joe or the congress-critters.
Looking at the relative incomes, it becomes obvious who is gonna win; if congress critters could make that amount of money, you think they'd still be in congress?
Not.
On.
Your.
Life!
Years from now:
NYSE conducts annual shut down on December 31 and reports all stock prices at par value.
Trading resumes January 1 at market prices.
Lol.
"It's possible that Biden himself is secretly hoping that some future court strikes the billionaires tax down as unconstitutional."
This is where we need actual consequences to start happening, yes?
As counter-productive as this tax would be, I don't see how it would be unconstitutional.
Oh and this:
It wouldn't be the first time that a presidential candidate's plans changed after getting elected.
What's more horrifying, the times Biden has changed his plans post-election, or the times he hasn't?
Discuss.
There was a 1920 SCOTUS decision that says that it would be. I’ll link it gain,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eisner_v._Macomber
It's 420. Libertarian moment.
"Unlike Warren and Sanders, Biden didn't really want to punish successful entrepreneurs"
How do you know this? Are you God?
Plus, he apparently still hasn't figured out yet that Biden isn't even the real president and isn't calling any of these shots.
"Now, in a reversal, Biden is preparing to embrace the idea."
Ya know like not having the authority for vaccine mandates.
Biden is proving to be just as big of a LIAR during campaigning as Obama was. Say one thing; do the EXACT opposite.
What else would anyone expect from those who think STEALING with Gov-Gun-Forces is a good thing?
"Enumerated Powers".....
Ha ha ha ha ha ha!
He invoked enumerated powers.... Hilarious!
We don't even do " follow the legislative process " any more....
Enumerated powers... How quaint.
I don’t get it. How could you pay a tax on stocks? OK if it is an IRA or 401k it is deferred until you pull out money. If I do I need to pay income tax. That I get.
They go up and down every day. Anything like that until it is income. So a wage earner who invests already paid income tax on personal investment.
So now do rich people. They have other ways around it. We know that. Somehow I do not see the government closing loopholes here. Seems more like typical politics.
I do not get it. You are not going to close the gap this way.
"I don’t get it..."
Most of us here understand that.
Gosh darn it, don't be so hard on echo, he just cannot understand how leftists might act in a way that so overtly reveals their "what's yours is mine" attitude.
"close the gap this way"
Ref: China - Who has 10x the gap the USA does but we are catching up because politicians use GUNS to steal from citizens and make a gap.
Who wins with heavy taxes? Those who *create* market goods just JACK-UP their prices and those who pay for those market goods just have to pay MORE. Taxing the rich does nothing to close wealth gaps. Where does all that TAX go? Into Government crony companies who don't have to supply market goods because they FORCE citizens to pay them by GUN point.
The closest the USA could ever hope for "closing the gap" and NOT put everyone but the most Gov-Gun-Toting elite into poverty is to undo Crony Socialism. i.e. Get the Gov-Guns away from citizens.
As-if the growing gap with every new socialistic measure wasn't a clue...
Gov-Guns =/= Wealth.
It is always fine to pay taxes. but when it comes to giving facilities to your people, why there are so many issues.
All we want is to facilitate us with proper facilities that are worth our taxes.
https://mepcobillspk.wixsite.com/mepco/post/mepco-bill-payment
The use of Gov-Gun-Forces will never "facilitate" proper facilities.
Because "proper" is defined differently by each INDIVIDUAL - not by [WE] mobs packing GUNS!
Government is nothing but a monopoly on Gun-Force.
That monopoly doesn't *create* ANYTHING but FORCE.
Let's Go Brandon!
100% unconstitutional, on its face.
It is a property taking without just compensation and would be smacked down in court instantaneously.
Go ahead, Joe. Make my day. 377 days to midterms.
“ It risks undercutting Biden's claim to being a voice of moderation.‘
That’s fucking hilarious!
"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
An asset is not income. The proposal is unconstitutional out of the gate.
Realized gains are income. Unrealized gains are not.
Look you numbnut Democrats, any progressive tax already IS a wealthy tax. Stop acting like the wealthy are illegally evading taxes. They are not. Hell, even a flat tax is a wealth tax. The more you make the more you pay. I mean, duh. Learn some math you lefties!
If you think the wealthy should pay more, that's fine. But continually acting like they are not is stupid.
What the wealthy have that the most of the middle and lower classes do not, are fancy loopholes that Democrats (and both sides Republicans) have written into the tax code. So if you think they aren't paying thier "fair" share, step one would be tax code simplification.
Which is one reason I have advocated a flat income tax for the longest time. A straight 10% with only a single $50.000 deduction. No other deductions or credits.
90% of what the federal government does is unconstitutional. You think they're gonna stop here with a wealth tax? It's a clear violation of the 4th, 5th and 14th amendments. But then again, so is the 16th amendment. And it's not like the FDA, CDC, FAA, dept of education or any of these other agencies are legal as enumerated powers under the 10th amendment, but here they are.
^EXACTLY THIS
BTW, we already have wealth taxes in this country. If you are paying property taxes on your house based on how much it's worth instead of how much it costs to protect it via police and the local fire department, it's a wealth tax.
Also, capital gains taxes are wealth taxes unless there is 0 inflation. If you made 10% return on an investment this year when inflation is 2%, 8% is actual capital gains that are taxed, the remaining 2% was not a real return but you are paying capital gains on it anyway, so yes, it's a wealth tax. Now that inflation is actually 10%, the government will make a killing off these non inflation adjusted capital gains taxes/wealth taxes.
Well not quite. Property taxes are a tax on property, which may correlate somewhat to wealth but is not itself wealth. Plenty of poor own their own homes, after all.
But more important, capital gains are taxed because they are income. The capital is not taxed, the gains are taxed. Which is why this whole thing blew up into a brouhaha, because unrealized capital gains are not income. It's a tax on merely having an investment. No other first world nation in the world does this, not even the leftie ones. Yes it's what the leftie domestic tards are always whining about, that the rich aren't paying. They want to tax billionaires on their existing wealth, rather than their income via capital gains and investment returns.
To put it another way, it would be as if the lefties wanted to tax YOUR retirement savings based on its current value, every year, year after year. That someone happens to be a billionaire should not matter, but the left (and much of the right) are obsessed with billionaires, not realizing that most of their wealth is tied up in investments.
The Democrats are going to destroy investing. Why the hell should the wealthy invest if it's not going to earn significantly more than the tax rate? They won't. Or at least won't invest in ways that the US government can get to. This is going to be a major jobs destroyer as investments equals jobs
I disagree that property isn't wealth. According to Merriam-Webster: abundance of valuable material possessions or resources. I'd think houses definitely constitute valuable material possessions. Wealth can be plain liquid money, investments or property.
But yes, this will be a disaster in the making as CEOs, entrepreneurs, etc... gradually go Galt and realize there is little reason left to work hard, take risks, etc...
The net effect of pretty much all Democrat financial plans are to disincentivize work, in this case at the top. On the low end, hugely generous welfare benefits take out the incentive to work as putting in an honest 40 hours a week will yield little to no increases in material quality of life relative to being completely reliant on welfare. On the top end, insanely high levels of effective taxation reduce any incentive to work harder as again, it yields little increase in material quality of life. You disincentivize people of all walks and income levels enough and production is stunted and shortages start, which is exactly where we are right now.
The inflation we are facing is 2 pronged. First from widespread shortages of good from god awful fiscal policy disincentivizing production. Second from god awful monetary policy increasing the money supply in order to pay for the god awful fiscal policies. God help us.
The states have the power to tax property.
The federal government does not.
Capital gains taxes are taxes on income, not property.
Property certainly is wealth, but it is NOT income, and the feds can only tax income.
And finally, people are already going Galt left and right. I certainly did. Where do you think all the "missing workers" went?
Neither was an income tax, but that doesn’t stop libertarians from staying dumb on income while vociferously denouncing tariffs.
Only one of these was constitutional at the federal level…
THIS is getting reason to write that sleepy Joe MAY not be the president of moderation like he said? Have they not been following him from literally day one in office???
Unconstitutional? Please!
What is constitutional is NOT what some citizens, armed with a little booklet form of the document may proclaim from their soapbox. It's NOT what some pundit might commit to print, even in the present publication. And, in fact, such decisions are often not even final when issued by a federal judge, being conditional on decisions of higher courts and only dispositive when agreed to by multiple levels of courts or by five citizens on the supreme court.
While it may have required an amendment to make the income tax constitutional, such actions seem today to be beyond the pale of practical national action. And the ways of modern interpretations, the selective use of the incorporation doctrine, and many of the considerations of a "living" constitution have made amendments pretty much superfluous.
Correction --- "considerations of a 'living' constitution have made" ... the very definition/existance of the USA fall at the mercy of National Socialism (Nazism).
Any 2-Year old can read the Constitution and tell you Democratic Nazism (i.e. IGNORANCE of the USA) is not just government as usual but an invading take-over force of the USA itself.
So.... FU and your foreign Nazi-Supporting mob. You've taken the most successful and free Nation and are turning it into shambles.
Because that's what Nazi's do...........
Taxes on incomes were permitted by the broad and inclusive taxing powers granted to Congress.
It was only a very poorly reasoned decision by SCOTUS in Pollock v. Farmers Loan & Trust Co. that made taxes on incomes illegal unless they were apportioned. Mr. Pollock somehow convinced the Justices that a tax on the income he derived from the use of his property was the same as a tax on the property itself, merely because of his ownership, meaning that taxes on incomes would have to be apportioned. This is of course absurd and that idea has been rejected ever since.
The immediate response by Congress to this horrible SCOTUS decision was to push thru the 16th Amendment, the purpose of which was to nullify the Pollock decision and once more separate, for purposes of taxation, incomes from the property from which the income was derived.
That is all the 16th Amendment did, and it is now essentially superfluous because the Pollock decision has been overruled piecemeal and no longer has any force at all.
The question often arises, "How can wages and salaries be taxed as if they are incomes?"
The answer is, they can't, for the simple reason that a tax on wages or salaries is a Direct tax that must be apportioned, while a tax on incomes derived from the use of property is an indirect tax than must be uniform.
Claims that the now superfluous 16th Amendment somehow removed the Constitutional limitations on the taxing power are specious nonsense. It did not, nor was it ever intended to.
Stoking class envy and racial discord is part and parcel of the Democrats' agenda.
Is a wealth tax just another name for a direct tax? How is that related to an income tax? Find out at https://howyoubecomeliable.com
This, in a way, is irrelevant to the wealth tax; but, if Biden is re-elected "Hunger Strike" by Temple of The Dog will replace Our national anthem.
The simplest, and strongest reason that the "billionaire tax" will be unconstitutional if levied is that it will be a Direct tax that is not apportioned.
Harsh but true.
This doesn't have shit to do with a 'wealth tax'. What you seem to be pissed about is your fear that you will lose some of the homeowner teat-sucking welfare that has distorted investment so that people are dependent on tapping their mortgage refi ATM to earn an income stream.
That welfare - and the NIMBYism that results when homeowners become dependent on every increasing home prices - is the DIRECT cause of young people not being able to afford to move out of their parents basement and the decline in economic mobility. It is feudal rentiership not free markets.