Coronavirus

The Evidence Cited by the CDC Does Not Show That Vaccinated and Unvaccinated COVID-19 Carriers Are Equally Likely To Transmit the Virus

That conclusion is not justified by the CDC's Provincetown data, and it is inconsistent with a new study from Singapore.

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Rochelle Walensky, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), has sent mixed messages about the likelihood that people vaccinated against COVID-19 will be infected by the delta variant of the coronavirus. While she has described so-called breakthrough infections as "rare" and this week reiterated the point that vaccinated people face a "far lower" infection risk than unvaccinated people, she also has offered an estimate implying the reverse: that vaccination somehow makes people more vulnerable to infection.

Walensky's statements about the likelihood that vaccinated carriers will transmit the virus likewise have been inconsistent, confusing, and sometimes stronger than the evidence supports. That evidence includes a new study that found viral loads in vaccinated and unvaccinated COVID-19 patients were initially similar but dropped faster in the vaccinated group.

"The breakthrough infections, as rare as they are, have the potential to forward transmit with the same capacity as an unvaccinated person," Walensky told reporters on July 27, the day the CDC issued new guidance recommending that vaccinated people resume wearing face masks in public places if they live in "areas of substantial or high transmission." That statement contradicted a "science brief" that the CDC published the same day.

"COVID-19 vaccines currently authorized in the United States have been shown to be effective against SARS-CoV-2 infections, including asymptomatic and symptomatic infection, severe disease, and death," the CDC said. "These findings, along with the early evidence for reduced viral load in vaccinated people who develop COVID-19, suggest that any associated transmission risk is likely to be substantially reduced in vaccinated people."

The brief cited "early data" from India and "unpublished data" from the United States suggesting that "breakthrough Delta infections are transmissible." But it did not say they were as transmissible as infections in unvaccinated people. Nor did the CDC's new mask advice. "Preliminary evidence suggests that fully vaccinated people who do become infected with the Delta variant can be infectious and can spread the virus to others," it said.

An article published in the CDC's Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR) on July 27 likewise did not back up Walensky's claim that vaccinated delta carriers have "the same capacity" to transmit the virus as unvaccinated carriers. "Emerging evidence suggests that fully vaccinated persons who do become infected with the Delta variant are at risk for transmitting it to others," it said, citing "unpublished data" from the CDC COVID-19 Response Team.

Three days later, we finally got a look at some of those data, reported in an MMWR article about a July outbreak in Provincetown, Massachusetts, that primarily involved the delta variant. The researchers reported that cycle threshold (Ct) values, which indicate the extent to which the nucleic acid targeted by a RT-PCR virus test has to be amplified before the fluorescent signal rises above the background level, "were similar among specimens from patients who were fully vaccinated and those who were not." But they cautioned that "Ct values obtained with SARS-CoV-2 qualitative RT-PCR diagnostic tests might provide a crude correlation to the amount of virus present in a sample and can also be affected by factors other than viral load." While the similar Ct values "might mean that the viral load of vaccinated and unvaccinated persons infected with SARS-CoV-2 is also similar," they said, "microbiological studies are required to confirm these findings."

Walensky disregarded that caveat in the press release the CDC issued when it published the Provincetown study, saying the researchers found "Delta infection resulted in similarly high SARS-CoV-2 viral loads in vaccinated and unvaccinated people." Still, she did not claim that vaccinated carriers were as infectious as unvaccinated carriers. "High viral loads suggest an increased risk of transmission and raised concern that, unlike with other variants, vaccinated people infected with Delta can transmit the virus," she said. "This finding is concerning and was a pivotal discovery leading to CDC's updated mask recommendation."

During a White House briefing on Monday, Walensky likewise did not say vaccinated and unvaccinated carriers are equally infectious. Citing the Provincetown outbreak, she said the "higher viral loads" associated with the delta variant "are seen not just in those who are unvaccinated and infected but also, and importantly, in the small proportion of those who are vaccinated and become infected." She said that indicates "vaccinated people can spread the virus if they get a breakthrough infection," although "the odds of them getting sick in the first place are far lower than [the odds for] those who are unvaccinated."

In addition to the issue of inferring viral loads from Ct values, the Provincetown study has other limitations. The authors note that "asymptomatic breakthrough infections might be underrepresented because of detection bias." Consistent with that possibility, 79 percent of the breakthrough infections described by the CDC involved "symptoms consistent with COVID-19." Those are the cases that tend to be identified, since people who are infected by the COVID-19 virus but don't develop noticeable symptoms are less likely to be tested.

Even if the viral loads in nasal samples from vaccinated and unvaccinated carriers in this study were indeed similar, that might not be true of asymptomatic infections, which is the crucial issue when it comes to precautions like face masks. "We already know symptomatic [carriers] can transmit" COVID-19, Harvard public health professor Joseph Allen notes. The "key question," he says, is whether asymptomatic breakthrough infections also spread the disease. Since vaccinated people infected by the coronavirus tend to have milder symptoms, it seems plausible that they are, on average, less infectious than unvaccinated carriers.

Another issue is whether viral loads in nasal samples are a good indicator of transmissibility. In symptomatic cases, Allen says, viral loads in the nose correspond with viral loads in the lungs, "where most aerosol [is] generated." But in asymptomatic cases, that is not true.

Allen also notes that the "unvaccinated" group in the Provincetown study included people who were partially vaccinated or whose vaccination status was unknown, which could have biased the results. And he questions whether the data from the Provincetown outbreak, which featured a "very specific set of circumstances," should have been used "as [a] basis to set national policy."

During the two-week period covered by the study, about 60,000 people were visiting Provincetown, which ordinarily has a population of 3,000. The CDC study says "persons with COVID-19 reported attending densely packed indoor and outdoor events at venues that included bars, restaurants, guest houses, and rental homes." In a New York Times opinion piece,

A preprint study from Singapore, which was posted the day after the CDC's Provincetown study, suggests that Walensky was right to retreat from her suggestion that vaccinated and unvaccinated people infected by the delta variant are equally likely to transmit it. The researchers looked at 218 patients who had been infected by delta, 84 of whom had received an mRNA vaccine, including 71 who were fully vaccinated. They found that Ct values "were similar between both vaccinated and unvaccinated groups at diagnosis, but viral loads decreased faster in vaccinated individuals," who showed "a robust serological response." A chart indicates that the Ct values in the two groups began to diverge within five days. That finding, the authors note, "has implications [for] secondary transmission and public health policy."

The vaccinated patients also "were significantly more likely to be asymptomatic" and, if not, had fewer and less severe symptoms. "The finding of diminished severity with B.1.617.2 [delta] infection in vaccinated individuals is reassuring and
corroborates emerging data from the United Kingdom," where researchers "have found that mRNA vaccination remains protective against symptomatic and severe disease," the authors say. They conclude that "the mRNA vaccines are highly effective at preventing symptomatic and severe COVID-19 associated with B.1.617.2 infection."

NEXT: Prosecutors Tried To Seize $57K From This Man's Safe Deposit Box Because He Sold Bongs Without a Permit

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193 responses to “The Evidence Cited by the CDC Does Not Show That Vaccinated and Unvaccinated COVID-19 Carriers Are Equally Likely To Transmit the Virus

  1. The CDC has very little credibility anymore. Lying and incompetence tend to do that.

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    2. Then why do you worship Trump? Lying and incompetence is why you have such a hard on for him I thought?

      1. Then why do you worship Trump? Lying and incompetence is why you have such a hard on for him I thought?

        You ask these idiotic questions because your head is full of conspiracy theories and propaganda.

      2. Trump was incompetent except for the economy, lifting minorities out of poverty, the border, foreign policy, world peace, justice reform, taxes……….you know……. everything ol joe is so good at. You do realize most of what the left’s ally the fake news media called lies has been proven to be facts and what they told you to believe was lies. Have you began to realize how badly you were played when they breathlessly excited you with all the crimes Trump is going to be indicted on? After nearly 5 years you probably still believe it and are still breathlessly and eagerly waiting. Sad.

      3. Trump is coming back, and it ain’t MAGA anymore, bitch!
        It’s Trump’s ARMY, antifa bitch, and it’s the FUCKENING!!!

    3. “CDC.. Lying” – Mark Flaccid

      Can you provide a list of CDC lies?

      Nope? Didn’t think so.

      You be a stupid boy.

      1. The quality control on these fifty centers has gone really downhill

        1. I blame Biden’s inflation, 50 cents doesn’t get you nearly as much anymore.

      2. The virus did not come from the Wuhan lab. No funding for gain of function research. Masks do more harm then good. Cloth masks protect you from infection. The vaccines will protect you from spreading the virus. What this article points out.

    4. “CDC… Lying” – Mark Flaccid

      Can you provide a list of CDC lies?
      Nope… Didn’t think so.

      You be a stupid boy…

      1. I’m not gonna provide a list, but the cdc does lie.

        https://www.axios.com/cdc-lab-coronavirus-contaminated-6dc9726d-dea3-423f-b5ad-eb7b1e44c2e2.html

        As you can see from the above, they locked a federal investigator out for 24 hours, then when they let him in, he found their Covid tests to be infected with… you guessed it….Covid.

        Oh and gfy for ever thinking a gov agency has ever been honest you tightly coiled pile of dog shit.

    5. The CDC is not incompetent; they have simply become a political agency used to advance the political interests of Democrats.

  2. This article feels like a rerun. I guess if you like a particular show it us worth watching it over and over again.

    1. I think it’s worth reiterating that the CDC are a bunch of lying sacks of shit who are misrepresenting data from a single flawed study in order to justify additional power grabs and keep the public in fear.

      1. “CDC are a bunch of lying sacks of shit” – Asshole

        LOL… Retardo boy… How much of your own dung did you consume for breakfast?

    2. Same error of omission in this article as others: Provincetown is a gay tourist attraction, where HIV proliferates. These are the least healthy people to be around and they behave in depraved ways.

  3. Speaking of vaxed vs unvaxed as separate classes is totalitarian bullshit.
    Fuck you, Americans believe in unalienable rights regardless of vax obedience.

    1. ^ this

      These supposed libertarians keep going at this as a “best case scenario for allowing me my freedoms IF I get the vaccine”.

      This is absolute bullshit. The premise should be “what is best for personal freedom” full fucking stop.

      This little bitch attitude of “hey, I’m cool! I did the thing you wanted so I can have access to more things than those dirty unvaxxed!” perspective is expected from lefty outlets, but embarrassing from a supposed libertarian outfit.

      1. How about just doing the right the thing because it is the right thing? Getting vaccinated reduces the speed at which the virus can mutate by reducing the number of available hosts for the virus to mutate in. Thus, the fastest way out of this cycle is to just do the right thing.

        Yes, you have the right to be an asshole –clearly. Doesn’t mean you should or have to be. Doesn’t mean other private entities can’t tell you to fuck off for being an asshole. Expect a lot more of that.

        Afraid of a little needle? You know, Trump got the vaccine. You don’t have to do and believe everything that Tucker Carlson tells you to.

        https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/prevention-cures/566115-trump-slammed-by-his-own-former-hhs-secretary

        1. I got the vaccine, little bitch. I just respect personal freedom

          1. I just happen to be able to hold 2 ideas in my head at once, not subject to the talking points from one team.

            I got the vaccine, as I believe it will lower my incidence of getting the virus or having a more significant infection. Also I take care of Covid patients.

            But I respect a person who is at a lower risk to make a risk/benefit calculation for themselves, and value a free country.

            Sorry this level of thinking is above you and you can only parrot DNC talking points, you scared little bitch. Best stay in your house if its too much for you.

            1. Good for you. As I said right up top, I also acknowledge that people have a right to make this decision.

        2. You (your masters, that is) don’t get to define what “the right thing” is for everyone else, you progressive bitch.

          1. I am progressive to you because I acknowledge factual reality.

            And I acknowledged your and everyone else’s right to be an asshole, just as private businesses and even public assets like schools and city properties have long established rights to bar you from their properties. Which they will soon be doing, I have little doubt.

            I also have little doubt that you and the rest of the freedumb fighters will be crying about imagined rights to those private services and places when that comes to pass.

            1. Youre progressive because you support Authoritarian outcomes. You don’t decry or fight actions such or even negatively denounce Biden’s latest actions. You still push leftist narrative conspiracy theories even after CNN drops them.

            2. You’re the asshole, and progressivism is all about believing the government should tell individuals what “the right thing” to do is for the collective.

            3. Because the vaccine in all likelihood is a source of mind control to continue to keep NPCs like you asleep. I’m not getting the vaccine because I believe in and want to retain my individuality, freedom and right to choose. Those are things you lost when you became a part of the hivemind.

        3. Shut up you autistic woman. Already got COVID so I’ll let natural antibodies so what it has done forever.

          1. And now you’re way more protected than the jabbed. In fact, for the good of all of us, the jabbed should still get covid to make sure they can’t spread covid in the future. It’s the only way to really be sure. And they want to be sure they aren’t spreading covid, right?!?!?!

        4. Getting vaccinated reduces the speed at which the virus can mutate by reducing the number of available hosts for the virus to mutate in.
          Unproven.
          Also, you do know antibiotics promote new antibiotic resistant strains, right?
          Same mechanism at play with a virus.

          1. Not true at all.

            1. God youre dumb.

              Antimicrobial resistance
              Language
              Download PDF
              Watch
              Edit
              Antimicrobial resistance (AMR) occurs when microbes evolve mechanisms that protect them from the effects of antimicrobials.[2] The term antibiotic resistance is a subset of AMR, as it applies to bacteria that become resistant to antibiotics.[2]

              https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimicrobial_resistance

          2. DoL is probably second to only white Mike in lack of scientific knowledge.

        5. Getting vaccinated reduces the speed at which the virus can mutate by reducing the number of available hosts for the virus to mutate in. Thus, the fastest way out of this cycle is to just do the right thing.

          Except we’re not actually seeing that now. Israel is imposing additional restrictions and is looking in to doing another lockdown despite their large vaccination numbers, Japan had such a massive outbreak the Olympics are being held in sparsely attended arenas, China’s about to get ass-raped by this variant, and South Korea’s talking about a so-called “delta-plus” variant in their country. Oh, and apparently the “gamma” or “omega” variant (whichever one they’re pimping now) is supposed to be even worse.

          Speaking as someone who got the shot, it’s pretty fucking obvious now that these people think they can outwit evolution on a virus that clearly has a high rate of variability, and that the vaccines themselves are largely therapeutic, not sterilizing. And if people who got the shot have to go back to wearing these fucking face diapers, what was the point of getting it to begin with? Given the data, I might as well have taken my chances with natural immunity, or at least waited until the Novavax version got released.

          1. China et al do not have the same access to the Pfizer and moderna vaccines that are particularly effective as we do in the states. The Chinese vaccine in particular is rather dubious. We here in the states with plentiful and effective vaccines should be thankful for being american and take full advantage of those.

            I doubt that we are headed for more lockdowns in the states, thanks to the majority of grown ups who got the shots. If everyone decided to die on this hill of vaccine rights, we’d be in a different boat, right along with China, etc.

            1. So you skipped Isreal because… oh yeah. You have no fucking clue about what you’re talking about. 85% vaccinated. Not the Chinese vaccine.

              Pick up a book on evolutionary biology next time.

            2. Vaccinate yourself with lead

            3. It doesn’t matter how many people you fucking vaccinate, DOL!

              Are you going to vaccinate all the dogs and cats? What about the deer? COVID is out in the wild, and if Delta Variant means you have to lock down again, then even if 85% of the country is vaccinated, we will still have to lock down for the next Variant. The virus isn’t going away, because it can keep tooling around in the wild population until it mutates to break through the latest vaccine.

              And here you are, in the face of that reality, saying “Just get the fucking jab”. Did you also scream, “Just bake the fucking cake?” Isn’t it odd that all these little tradeoffs you are happy to make are for preferences you already support and cost you little?

        6. Are you going to declare him guilty of blood libel of he doesn’t agree with you?

          1. That one is still pinging around in your head, eh? I hope you one day learn the capacity for growth.

            1. De Oppresso Liber
              August.1.2021 at 10:27 am
              Flag Comment Mute User

              And the (((Deep State))) is just another obvious iteration of the Jewish blood libel. The newest boogeyman for paranoid anti social types to fixate on instead of self reflection.

              I mean you said something so retarded even Jeff called you out on it. Lol.

              Do you understand how stupid you appear?

              What growth do I need? I’m not the one making idiotic comments like that or denying a large bureaucratic executive branch exists.

              1. Dude, that was THEE DAYS AGO GET OVER IT!!!

                1. Lol. Was never under it. Made me laugh my ass off that even Jeff called him out.

        7. DOL(t) still has no idea how selective pressure works.

          1. Fucking creationists.

        8. “How about just doing the right the thing because it is the right thing? ”

          If you were a libertarian you would understand that it ISN’T “THE” right thing. Is giving all your money to the guy on the street corner “the right thing”? Is housing a homeless person in your daughter’s bunk bed “the right thing”?

          No doubt, acts of charity are good. But when you call them “THE right thing to do”, you are implying a moral obligation. No one is obligated to expend effort, assume risk, or otherwise support another person. I am not obligated to decrease your risk of catching the coof any more than you are obligated to sit outside my house chasing stray dogs off my lawn. Should we come to some arrangement where we both agree to do so, fine. But it isn’t because it was “the right thing to do”.

          “Yes, you have the right to be an asshole –clearly.”

          Do you give the contents of your wallet to every pan-handler you meet? Why not? I mean, I guess you have the right to be an asshole. But that doesn’t mean you should or have to be. Just give him your credit cars already.

        9. Who cares about Trump. He was and is an idiot, and if you hadn’t noticed, he has been GONE for 7 months now (replaced by the dementia-in-chief), although CNN and their ilk keep trying to bring him back to save their abysmal ratings. I don’t care what Trump did or does.

          Instead, I’d rather you show me the long-term adverse event profile data for these vaccines.

          Oh, that’s right, such data doesn’t exist like it would for a normal vaccine because it hasn’t gone through the normal vetting process. But that always is the case for new experimental drugs.

        10. The “right thing” for you might not be the “right thing” for another individual.
          If I am a fit individual, maintain good health, good diet and have no comorbidities, a Covid infection won’t be a big deal – whether or not I am vaccinated. So any long term possible risk with the vaccine is not a risk I am willing to take.

        11. How about just doing the right the thing because it is the right thing?

          For over 100 yrs. keeping slaves in this country was the right thing to do.

          For 300 yrs. focibly converting crypto-Jews was the right thing to do.

          For decades we forcibly sterilized mentally feeble women, rape victims, and loose women in this country because it was the right thing to do.

          Millions in China starved to death within feet of full grain bins because Mao told the grain bin owners it was the right thing to do.

          Sometimes assholes use “It’s the right thing to do.” as a justification to be an asshole.

        12. Getting vaccinated reduces the speed at which the virus can mutate

          That’s an over-generalization. It may be true of some vaccines, but you have to look at each vaccine (for a particular virus) individually. What an imperfect vaccine (non-sterilizing, deployed in the middle of a pandemic) does is reduce the pool of hosts for its targeted strain. It then puts selective pressure on the mutants that are capable of escaping its protection, making them more prevalent. Hence the Delta variant, capable of dodging the narrow protection, became the dominant strain.

          If, one the other hand, this vaccine provided what natural post-infection immunity does — namely, nearly-perfect sterilizing immunity to the virus and its mutants — then yes, getting the vaccine would be “the fastest way out of this cycle” and “just [doing] the right thing”.

          If you have 30 minutes, listen to Dr. McCullough. He hasn’t landed on the “Disinformation Dozen” list (yet), so perhaps you might consider his professional opinion that runs counter to the mainstream narrative: https://www.bitchute.com/video/40aSXqhiGvlo/

        13. Getting vaccinated does not decrease the speed at which the virus mutates.

          However putting pressure on the virus with a narrowly tailored “vaccine” that doesn’t create an antibody response that kills the virus, only weakens it’s ability to bind so your body can do the rest which takes time, will put selective pressure on the virus to evolve beyond that.

          Which is exactly what we’re seeing. The vaccine only targeted a single specific protein, the spike S protein. That means the virus only needs to mutate one protein to evade, or at least weaken, the vaccine response. And that’s exactly what we see in delta and the emerging lambda variant. Mutations at the spike protein and almost nowhere else.

          In reality it’s leaky vaccines and the immunocompromised (who fail to clear the virus quickly whether Vax or not) that are the petri dishes and biological whip lashers that will push the virus to evolve.

        14. Getting vaccinated reduces the speed at which the virus can mutate by reducing the number of available hosts for the virus to mutate in.

          That’s like saying “widespread use of antibiotics reduces the speed at which bacteria can mutate by reducing the number of available hosts for the bacteria to mutate in”. That kind of reasoning is, of course, nonsense. Widespread vaccination may well select for “resistant” mutations in viruses, just like antibiotics do in bacteria. This is even more likely given that the COVID vaccines are so ineffective at preventing replication.

          Yes, you have the right to be an asshole –clearly. Doesn’t mean you should or have to be.

          You have a right to be the gullible, ignorant fool you are. Doesn’t mean you should or have to be.

        15. Getting vaccinated created the delta variant. The current vaccines are leaky.

          Nearly everything said about the vaccine has turned out to be false.
          Vaccine will keep you from getting covid
          Vaccine will keep your from getting sick
          Vaccine will keep you from get killed
          Vaccine will keep you from spreading the virus
          Vaccine will stay in the injection site
          Spike proteins are safe
          Lipids will disappear quickly
          Vaccine effects are long lasting.

    2. I dream that one day we will not judge people on the color of their skin, but by the content of their vaccination card.

      1. Heh! Very nice. 🙂

    3. “Speaking of vaxed vs unvaxed as separate classes is totalitarian bullshit.
      Fuck you, Americans believe in unalienable rights regardless of vax obedience.”

      Rest assured, NARDZ, if other places follow New York City’s example re “vaccine passports,” we will all be “one” class again, and not in a good way, either.

    4. “vaxed vs unvaxed as separate classes is totalitarian bullshit.” – Farting Nards

      You have been eating far too much of your own dung.

  4. I will never feel shame about this.

  5. The CDC and by proxy the Biden administration has lost a lot of credibility over this.

    1. On the other hand, to be sure, the Biden administration never had any credibility. The CDC last had credibility the year it was officially created.

    2. Can’t lose what you never had…

    3. “CDC and by proxy the Biden administration has lost a lot of credibility” – Chumblie Blumblie

      You gots your PHD from the univerzite of Fumblie Wumblie. So you be done knows what you is be spoked like.

      The world is laughing at you exceptionally LOW IQ.

      1. It’s PhD, genius.

  6. >>has sent mixed messages about the likelihood that people vaccinated against COVID-19 will be infected by the delta variant of the coronavirus

    also, what day will the “because it’s total bullshit” conclusion be reached and written about?

  7. Other than giving ammo to Karens for wearing masks, it is not clear what the point the CDC is trying to make. It’s obviously not following science, but then most in public health can’t or won’t do science because they are professional hysterics first

    1. ” it is not clear what the point the CDC is trying to make.” – NoVaDickless

      Only because you are too stupid to understand what the CDC actually says.

      The Willfully ignorant like you are the most deserving of COVID death.

  8. Unimportant, the shitweasel Biden admin wants to keep the fear ginned up until the next election. CNN and other bootlicking collaborators with the treasonous dems will keep beating the drum.

    1. It really is amazing you can say “treasonous” with a straight face given the events of 1/6 urged on and later downplayed by rightwing fuckheads (of which there are many apparently.)

      1. >>urged on

        made a fucking killing on Shakedown t-shirts and posters

      2. Sorry should he have said “treasonous, insurrectionist, secessionist, white supremacist, terrorist, anarchist, fascists” ?!?!

        Sometimes I forget how much I have to catch the vapors over 1/6

      3. If you want to see what a real “insurrection” looks like, you ought to go to the countries like Colombia, South Africa, etc. where they are actually having them….looks nothing like what a bunch of MAGA-fueled dimwits did on 6 January.

        1. “looks nothing like what a bunch of MAGA-fueled dimwits did on 6 January.” = MVP

          Coming to a city near you.

          The world is laughing at AmeriKKKa.

          1. Oh, I realize social unrest is coming, and the big question is will it be an “insurrection” or a “mostly peaceful protest” (as they burn my house down being a minority white guy in a black neighborhood.)

            America is a shit hole, and neither political party gives a damn. (Unless you’re a billionaire, then they hang on your every word.)

      4. given the events of 1/6

        LARPing at the Capitol and protesting to have votes audited and elections conform to the law is now “treasonous”?

  9. The media and govt have really squeezed this COVID thing for all it had to give. Between the mass panic and sheep-like behavior they clearly demonstrated their power over the weak.

    I feel like this will be a turning point people look back on. What a corrupt govt/media can do when they know they can control people like puppets (or desire it as much as possible). People will look back at the flip flops, the incorrect guidance, the public shamings, the panic, the attempt (hopefully failed) to divide society on a virus with a <1% fatality rate that is mostly an issue for those who are very sick already and have multiple comorbidities, that live 1 medical condition away from deaths door all time.

    And that they almost never….seriously almost never…said to the public: "you know the best thing for you would be to lose some weight, exercise daily, get healthy amounts of vit C, vit D, and really all vitamins, eat better, and take care of yourself/your health conditions". But they didnt do that. They said "stay inside, lockdown, wear a mask, govt will send you a relief check…stay at home order Uber eats."

    Its almost like they really didnt want to help people but rather make sure they were good lazy little cattle. Delicious, Kobe beef.

    1. Its almost like they really didnt want to help people…..
      They only want to further their own cause.

    2. There’s no way back from this without violence

    3. I wish I shared your turning point optimism, Jimbo.

      I get how a public health official overreacts. Especially early on, when they were all out there steppin and fetchin like their heads were on fire and their asses were catching. But the remarkable politicization, including (especially) the mainstream press and alternative social media outlets, is beyond the pale.

      Really, someone should be keeping the government (not Trump, all officials) feet to the fire on getting proper data, presenting reasonable explanations, and the like. Instead, early on, it was all orange man bad stuff and Democrat governors good. Then the gaslighting began.

      They’ll gaslight again. And the people who want to hear it will believe the revised version as though it was the whole truth all along. Most people just want to fit in and media/education/deepstate people are pretty good at herding the sheep.

    4. The media and govt have really squeezed this COVID thing for all it had to give

      I’m afraid they’ve only just begun

    5. There are only 615,000 dead AmeriKKKans. Not nearly enough in the eyes of Republicans/Libertarians.

      “The media and govt have really squeezed this COVID thing for all it had to give.” – JimBoBrainless

      1. You’re projecting – stop it.

  10. That would be great news if true. Regardless, the ammo for getting the vaccine is overwhelming as is.

    1. If you are fat or old, yup.

    2. Maybe not, if you’re open to critical-thinking and willing to consider disconfirming evidence: https://www.bitchute.com/video/40aSXqhiGvlo/

    3. If you ignore the lack of long-term data for potential adverse events. Not saying it isn’t safe, it may well prove out that way, but there is simply no data.

      I am considering the Novavax product, which is in Phase 3 trials now – uses 1986 technology. Although I will still want to do more research on it. Because relying on a dishonest, self-serving piece of shit like Anthony Fauci to give me advice on vaccines is like asking Jeffry Dahmer to babysit my kids.

      1. J&J’s vaccine is old and reliable tech from the 90s.

    4. Regardless, the ammo for getting the vaccine is overwhelming as is.

      For an experimental, unapproved vaccine using novel antigens and adjuvants for which the manufacturer disclaims liability? For a vaccine that offers imperfect protection against a virus with about the same risk as a flu epidemic? For a vaccine that probably has 1-2 orders of magnitude higher risk of serious side effects or death than other vaccines? I don’t think so.

      Don’t get me wrong: I’m not “anti-vax”, and I’m not even “anti-COVID vaccine”. But the case for the COVID vaccine is certainly not “overwhelming”; it’s at best a careful balancing of risks and benefits.

  11. Knowing the circumstances behind these important data that the CDC is relying upon, I have decided my personal public policy.

    I think, regardless of vaccination status, I won’t spend all night partying and carousing with gay men, dancing in overcrowded basement clubs, and generally carrying on in that manner with tens of thousands of strangers.

    This is probably good advice for those who are risk averse. I’m afraid I’ll just have to make this sacrifice for the “public good”. But that’s about as far as I think these data tell me I should go.

  12. Fuck the CDC but Sullum expects us to take a preprint study out of Singapore as credible evidence? This very publication has reported that the majority of biological and medical studies are rife with fraud and/or can’t be replicated.

    1. “Fuck the CDC” – TooStupidToDrive

      Get off the crack, LOSER.

  13. https://twitter.com/JordanSchachtel/status/1422932790790721538?s=19

    In September, 2019 (just before COVID detected), The Gates Foundation made a $55MM pre-IPO equity investment into BioNtech. The company had never brought a single product to market. The Gates equity in BioNtech is now valued at over $1.1 Billion Dollars.

    A nice little 20x.

    The Gates network also has substantial equity in Moderna, which has also done a 20x over the last year. Prior to COVID, Moderna, like BioNtech, had never brought a product to market.

    1. Pure coincidence.

  14. Watching the cluster that has been created because of the politicization of the vaccines and COVID is just fascinating at this point.

    You have the conflict in the media who always want to be fear merchants, but who also smugly mock people who don’t get vaccinated. They can’t decide whether to hype that the Delta variant will kill us all or that vaccines actually work.

    Watching try to navigate these two conflicting narratives has been hysterical.

    1. >>whether to hype that the Delta variant will kill us all or that vaccines actually work.

      similar boat as “yes that boy is now a girl but fuck no shehe cannot run track with my daughter.”

      1. “similar boat as “yes that boy is now a girl but fuck no shehe cannot run track with my daughter.”” – Dicklinger

        You be speeklie englie KKKomrad?

    2. Truth is usually somewhere between the extremes. Yes, the vaccines work. Just not quite as well as they were sold to work.

      1. But…but…Mr. Biden said if you get these vaccines you won’t get COVID.

        And they didn’t cancel his YouTube channel for spreading false medical information.

        So it must be true.

        1. “Mr. Biden said if you get these vaccines you won’t get COVID.” – VMPissy

          Sorry, he never said that. Why are you lying about it?

          You be a stupid boy.

          1. He absolutely said it you PoS. Saw the video just a few days ago.

            Must suck to worship someone who is clearly sliding into dementia.

            And I hate Trump too, so disavow that notion.

      2. Thank you. A refreshing take.

      3. BS, the vaccines work way better than almost anyone was predicting. It is sad that not a single second was spent celebrating the incredible achievements of these innovative companies. The moment they were announced it was just another thing for partisan-politics-addicted losers to whine and complain about.

        1. I think bringing new drugs and vaccines to market quickly, even with the limited testing COVID vaccines had, is a good thing. But let’s not celebrate the skipping of the usual FDA hurdles as an “incredible achievement of innovative companies”. The mRNA and adenovirus vaccine technologies have been around for decades. All that changed was that political circumstances allowed these companies to skip the usual hurdles.

          And what us “partisan losers” (partisan for who?) are complaining about is not that these vaccines were brought to market quickly, but that people are trying to bully or coerce people into taking them.

          I mean, for most drugs, the FDA is overly cautious and prevents people from getting them even if they are willing to take the risk, but for COVID vaccines, the government is now trying to force us to accept risks that the FDA would never accept for other drugs. All for bogus political reasons.

          How about “my body, my choice”? How about I determine what risk/benefit tradeoffs I want to make for drugs?

  15. Same old shit…”There’s a variant coming! The sky is falling!” Then a few months later, “There’s another variant coming! The sky is falling!” Rinse, repeat ad infinitum, ad nauseam. The CDC and the Biden regime lost credibility a very long time ago. Can’t believe a single thing they say anymore. Far as the vaccine goes, I respect individual decisions. A person’s body, a person’s choice. And remember, 1,200,000 Americans die every year of cancer and heart problems, yet we don’t push oppressive measures on our people and damage our country to stop the spread of those diseases.

      1. Ever hear this one before?
        It’s almost like there’s scripted talking points, from on high “health” officials to lowly Reason trolls to follow…

        “If we don’t crush the outbreak to the point of getting the overwhelming proportion of the population vaccinated, then what will happen is the virus will continue to smolder through the fall into the winter, giving it ample chance to get a variant which, quite frankly, we’re very lucky that the vaccines that we have now do very well against the variants — particularly against severe illness,” he said, adding “We’re very fortunate that that’s the case. There could be a variant that’s lingering out there that can push aside delta.”

        “If another one comes along that has an equally high capability of transmitting but also is much more severe, then we could really be in trouble,” Fauci continued. “People who are not getting vaccinated mistakenly think it’s only about them. But it isn’t. It’s about everybody else, also.”

        1. Not mentioned is that if future variants are going to be so dangerous, we WANT people to catch delta, which isn’t very dangerous at all.

          1. Yes. Exactly. Get the natural immunity and the rest of the variants can most likely fuck-off.

          2. New variants being more deadly would be a break from the normal evolutionary path of these things.

            Killing your host before it can transmit to other hosts is not a good survival strategy for a virus. What makes sense is becoming more transmissible while also becoming less deadly. This obviously isn’t a decision a virus is actively making, it’s natural selection at work; the variants that kill their host really fast aren’t going to be as successful as the ones who don’t and over time that will lead to the more deadly variants getting out-competed.

            The idea that new variants are becoming more deadly needs some serious evidence to back it up, it flies in the face of everything we know about viruses.

    1. So murdering 1.2 million AmeriKKKans is a good thing.

      “And remember, 1,200,000 Americans die every year of cancer and heart problems,” – Otis the Elevator

      1. So murdering 1.2 million AmeriKKKans is a good thing.

        No doubt that’s what conspiracy theorists, bigots and fascists like you believe.

  16. Covid-19 survival rates by age per the CDC
    0-19 years 99.997%
    29-49 years 99.98%
    50-69 years 99.5%
    70+years 94.6%
    Even these statistics probably exaggerate the risk due to all of the perverse incentives in the reporting process. The variant is proving to be even less dangerous as death rates remain flat and very low. You’d think a libertarian publication would be citing these facts on a daily basis. Instead we get the irrelevant bullshit posted above.
    And by the way, fuck you Jacob,

    1. Deaths no longer work. So reason continues to use the new narrative switch for infection rates.

      1. And PERCENTAGE CHANGES to the infection rates. “Up X% since Y!” But then you look and it’s gone up from 4 cases to 6.

    2. “Covid-19 survival rates by age per the CDC”

      615,000 dead AmeriKKKans.

      Libertarians/Republicans demand more.

    3. I don’t know why people focus only on death rates. Even spending a few weeks at home with Covid sucks and can leave you with longer term consequences.

      Hospitals are very good at treating severe and moderate cases now so fewer people die but a week in the ICU is no picnic.

      This is a very serious disease. For a lot of people it is a few days of feeling crappy but for others it is total misery.

      The odds of dying from breast cancer is only 2.6% now but if you could prevent it with some kind of vaccine I’m sure near every woman would take it (this is actually what Moderna and others were working on then they developed the mRNA technology)

      1. Vaccines help everyone and should be taken, even by people like me that had symptomatic covid. It is a no brainer. Masks? The CDC explained how it only helps reduce serious covid by 1-5%. Using cherry picked evidence to argue for masks. The mask thing has gone off the reservation and loss track of all sense of what makes sense. Most people get covid from friends and family at home. Here is the CDC mask study: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7006e2.htm?s_cid=mm7006e2_w

  17. Editor-In-Chief Of Europe’s Top Newspaper Apologizes For Fear-Driven COVID Coverage
    https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/editor-chief-germanys-top-newspaper-apologizes-fear-driven-covid-coverage
    “To the millions of children in this country for whom our society is responsible, I want to express here what neither our government nor our Chancellor dares to tell you. We ask you to forgive us,” he said.
    “Forgive us for this policy which, for a year and a half, has made you victims of violence, neglect, isolation, and loneliness.”
    “We persuaded our children that they were going to murder their grandma if they dared to be what they are, children. Or if they met their friends. None of this has been scientifically proven.”
    “When a state steals the rights of a child, it must prove that by doing so it protects him against concrete and imminent danger. This proof has never been provided. It has been replaced by propaganda presenting the child as a vector of the pandemic.”
    Reichelt noted how moderate voices who attempted to offer calmer perspectives on the pandemic “were never invited to the expert table” and urged viewers “don’t believe this lie,” when encountering alarmist proclamations from the government.
    The journalist called on authorities to open schools and sports halls instead of polling stations, warning that those who imposed brutal lockdown measures, “will have on their conscience and will leave in the history books, a multitude of innocent souls.”

    1. Only Hitler wouldn’t lock his population down…

      Oh wait, that somehow doesn’t seem to work. Only Hitler would let the unvaccinated… no, that doesn’t work either.

      Only Hitler refuse to separate “desirables” and “undesirab…” wait, that’s still not working. So, who’s Hitler in this scenario?

      1. Are we talking Hitler the historical figure or literal Hitler? One of them is dead and the other one left office a few months ago.

        1. Right, so… the one who refused to separate “desirables” from “undesirables”. But, that doesn’t seem very Hitler-like. I guess Literal Hitler really is much worse that Historical Hitler.

          1. To be fair Mexico wasn’t sending us their best.

            1. “To be fair Mexico wasn’t sending us their best.”

              How much of that wall did Mexico pay for?

            2. Mexico isn’t sending us anything. The migrants are people coming of their own free will. They are not sent or exported.

  18. Just don’t do a youtube video or tweet this, because it’ll get you banned.

    1. Diane, you are such a coward.

  19. Rand Paul Calls NIH Director “Stupid” After Call To Wear Masks At Home
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/watch-rand-paul-calls-nih-director-stupid-after-call-wear-masks-home
    “There is no science to defend putting your kids in masks or parents wearing masks—no science whatsoever,” Paul emphasised, adding “If there were, we would be wearing masks for years and years because for kids, the death rate is about the same as the seasonal flu. It may be less than the seasonal flu.”

    The Senator continued, “So, is Francis Collins proposing that because the flu is with us forever that parents should be wearing masks around their kids that have the flu? It is absolutely and utterly without scientific evidence!”

    Going on to speak regarding the government fear mongering over the Delta (or Indian) variant of the virus, Paul said “Now, they’re all freaking out right now about the Delta variant. One thing is—in all likelihood true—it is more transmissible, significantly more transmissible, but guess what? Every bit of evidence shows that it’s less deadly—significantly less deadly.”
    “Public Health England looked at 92,000 people. If you were vaccinated and under 50, there were no deaths. If you were unvaccinated and under 50, .08%—still very, very small. So, it’s not an argument for not getting vaccinated. It’s an argument for not getting hysterical over the Delta variant,” Paul further urged.

    Rand Paul has done more to promote liberty in the last four days than Reason has done in the last four years.

    1. “Rand Paul has done more to promote liberty in the last four days than Reason has done in the last four years.” – GearOfPutz

      Reason exists to distribute pro-corporat – anti-democratic – pro-fascist propaganda.

      1. Hahahahahahaha

    2. “One thing is—in all likelihood true—it is more transmissible, significantly more transmissible, but guess what? Every bit of evidence shows that it’s less deadly—significantly less deadly.”

      As an M.D. Paul should know that his claim is the worst kind of cherry-picking,. Some would call it lying.

  20. Ever since I got the jab all I want to do is eat brains. Braaiins! BRAINSSZ!

    1. Maybe your hunger is telling you are missing something vital.

    2. “Ever since I got the jab all I want to do is eat brains. Braaiins! BRAINSSZ!”

      Brains seem to be in short supply these days, if the “ruling class” is any indication. So, good luck with that.

    3. Libertarians tell me that their dung tastes sweeter.

  21. In June, Americans overwhelmingly thought that the worst of the pandemic was in the past, but now the numbers have completely changed…
    In a dramatic shift from last month, more Americans now say the coronavirus situation in the U.S. is getting worse (45%) rather than better (40%). In June, a record 89% said the situation was getting better, while only 3% said it was getting worse.
    I can’t remember the last time I saw poll numbers move that much in such a short period of time.
    The Gallup survey also found that a whopping 42 percent of all Americans anticipate that “societal disruptions related to COVID-19” will continue to be around beyond the beginning of the new year…
    Americans now expect societal disruptions related to COVID-19 to persist at least through the end of the year, or longer. Whereas in June, nearly half of Americans expected COVID-related disruptions in society to last only a few more weeks or months, now just 17% believe they will end by then.
    Instead, 41% expect the COVID-19 disruptions to persist through the end of the year, and 42% — up from 17% in June — believe they will stretch into 2022.
    https://www.zerohedge.com/personal-finance/3-new-polls-show-theyre-going-need-pump-out-much-bigger-doses-hopiumh into 2022.
    Looks like all of the pants shitting alarmists at Reason are winning the war on reason.

    1. “Americans overwhelmingly thought ” – Retard Gear

      AmeriKKKans have proved themselves to be incapable of thinking.

      You might as well be polling a box of nails, or a random number generator set on stupid.

      AmeriKKKa is dying of terminal RepublCancer, and the world is dying of laughter. Especially Putin.

      1. AmeriKKKans have proved themselves to be incapable of thinking.

        Says the man who hasn’t been able to display a single coherent thought in any of his comments.

  22. Sweden: Despite Variants, No Lockdowns, No Daily COVID Deaths
    https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/sweden-despite-variants-no-lockdowns-no-daily-covid-deaths

    What’s happening? According to an as-yet unpublished but online study by two Svenske researchers, it appears the country has reached that Holy Grail of Covid called “herd immunity.” That means a level where those already protected are significantly guarding those without exposure. Mind, they say, it’s not all from Covid-19 per se but possibly in great part to “pre-immunity” from other infections. Four coronaviruses are known to cause colds, but the researchers actually don’t even mention that. It’s just that previous exposure to something seems to be providing natural inoculation. And it shouldn’t be as unique to Sweden as Ingrid Bergman.
    Mind, the current figures are just a snapshot. Did the country pay an awful price en route to the apparent herd immunity?
    Well, certainly the Swedish death rate is higher than its Nordic neighbors Norway, Denmark, and Finland. Those are the comparisons you’ll hear. But it’s well below the rates for larger-population European countries including Belgium, Italy, the U.K., Romania, Spain, France, and Portugal. The U.S., too.
    Sweden’s chief epidemiologist Anders Tegnell, who caught absolute hell, feels vindicated.
    “Locking down is saving time,” he said last year. “It’s not solving anything.” In essence the country “front-loaded” its deaths and decreased those deaths later on.

    1. According to an as-yet unpublished but online study by two Svenske researchers, it appears the country has reached that Holy Grail of Covid called “herd immunity.” That means a level where those already protected are significantly guarding those without exposure. Mind, they say, it’s not all from Covid-19 per se but possibly in great part to “pre-immunity” from other infections.

      Golly. Let’s completely ignore that as of today, Sweden has vaccinated 79% of their population once (that is higher than any state), and 53% twice. The latter going up by 1% per day.

      But hey I’m sure the real herd immunity has nothing to do with any of that but is actually because of antibodies against entirely different coronaviruses that have been around for years. So that the unvax here can continue to wallow in their utter politicized stupidity.

      1. Sweden has vaccinated 79% of their population once (that is higher than any state), and 53% twice.

        Sweden has forcibly vaccinated 79% of it’s population or 79% of it’s population chose to get vaccinated? Considering their initial adversity to lockdowns, in spite of WHO and CDC recommendations, it seems like the latter. Weird how when you don’t point a gun at people they don’t take offense to you.

      2. …wallow in their utter politicized stupidity

        Which is precisely what you’re choosing to do. Yes, prior infection from earlier coronaviruses does indeed contribute to herd immunity. The immune system is more than just antibodies. If you thought critically about immunology, you’d admit that. It has nothing to do with politics, but perhaps it does for you.

        1. We just don’t know how much that immunity conferred from other viruses might be

      3. Mike Shittwin, is that you?

    2. “Sweden: Despite Variants, No Lockdowns, No Daily COVID Deaths” – RichTard GearBoy

      European socialists are vastly smarter than AmeriKKKans.

      Canada’s performance is even better than that of Sweden with currently 1/16th the number of cases as AmeriKKKa.

      The world is laughing.

      1. Cases. Lol.

      2. When we compare the size of populations and population density, it is the world that is laughing at you

    3. Let’s look more closely at Sweden versus Norway
      Deaths per million: Sweden – 25,100 Norway – 10,800
      Daily proxy CFR: Sweden – 0.25% Norway – 0.175%
      Patterns of infection: 70% correlation adjusted for absolute rate
      Vaccinations: Sweden: Through July 29, as a proportion of total population, ~40 percent are fully vaccinated and ~61 percent have received at least one dose. That puts Sweden below the EU average, (source:Our World in Data)
      Norway: lags behind Sweden

      If Sweden has achieved herd resistance, so has Norway having paid have the number of deaths but greater economic losses.

      1. My error in the above post concerning deaths per million
        The correct numbers are
        Cases per million: Sweden – 108K and Norway – 25.5K
        Deaths per million; Sweden – 1438 and Norway – 147

  23. https://twitter.com/disclosetv/status/1422942000706465794?s=19

    NEW – Pfizer #COVID19 vaccine linked to rare cases of eye inflammation, according to a multi-center Israeli study published by the peer-reviewed ophthalmology journal Retina (JPost) [link]

    1. “Pfizer #COVID19 vaccine linked to rare cases of eye inflammation” – FartingNardz.

      LOL…. Eye inflammation.. Hahahahahaha

      What next? Hangnails?

  24. The point is to stop the virus circulating and generating new variants. Pity the government can’t really do what it takes because it squandered all public trust.

    1. The point is to stop the virus circulating..
      Can’t be done.

      1. Can’t be done.

        They couldn’t even keep it in the lab that created it.

      2. Probably not; would take an approach like Australia or NZ. Except they’re fucking it up too by not vaccinating fast enough.

        1. https://www.wsj.com/articles/zero-covid-coronavirus-pandemic-lockdowns-china-australia-new-zealand-11628101945

          Eradication of Covid Is a Dangerous and Expensive Fantasy

          While the eradication of smallpox—a virus 100 times as deadly as Covid—was an impressive feat, it shouldn’t be used as a precedent for Covid. For one thing, unlike smallpox, which was carried only by humans, SARS-CoV-2 is also carried by animals, which some hypothesize can spread the disease to humans. We will need to rid ourselves of dogs, cats, mink, bats and more to get to zero.

          For another, the smallpox vaccine is incredibly effective at preventing infection and severe disease, even after exposure to disease, with protection lasting five to 10 years. The Covid vaccines are far less effective at preventing spread.

          And smallpox eradication required a concerted global effort lasting decades and unprecedented cooperation among nations. Nothing like this is possible today, especially if it requires a perpetual lockdown in every country on earth. That’s simply too much to ask, especially of poor countries, where lockdowns have proved devastatingly harmful to public health. If even one nonhuman reservoir or a single country or region that fails to adopt the program, zero-Covid would fail.

          1. I agree with that but it can be controlled to a great extent within a population. Measles in the US for example.

            1. The MMR vaccine is far more effective than the COVID vaccine, and the measles virus behaves completely differently from SARS-CoV-2.

    2. The Orange Clown initiated that cycle of degeneration from the word “go.”

    3. The point is to stop the virus circulating and generating new variants.

      And if you think COVID vaccines do that, I have a bridge to sell you.

      COVID vaccines protect you from serious disease from COVID; that’s all.

  25. So, the vaccine is just therapeutic? No thanks

    1. It works like every other vaccine.

  26. In the Social Security Act is a clause called Section 1881A, under which the president, in the face of a national medical emergency, can extend Medicare coverage to anyone he deems necessary.

    Mr. Biden has not done this, so one would assume he sees no national medical emergency.

    Or he’s a dementia addled dimwit.

    1. Medicare already pays additional funds to providers to compensate for Covid. That started over a year ago when Trump was president. It is the basis for the wing nut conspiracy theory that doctors and hospitals were faking death certificates.

      1. The sad thing is, echospinner doesn’t even get paid for this.
        He’s such a servile simp for the left all on his own accord, and wants people to think he’s knowledgeable. Unfortunately he isn’t, and it’s quite obvious. Doing data entry for a healthcare corporation does not make one a doctor.

  27. The unpublished foreign study involved the faulty Chinese vaccine. The CDC Just admitted that their PCR test was faulty. Apparently, for one thing, since they didn’t have enough SARS-CoV-2 samples, they augmented with common flu strains (or something like that). This was compounded by running too many cycles, to the point that in some cases, it wasn’t clear what they were detecting.

    Finally, there is evidence that much of what was spread in P Town was not through the air, but rather through “deep kissing” of strangers, or was even sexually transmitted. Moreover, despite the ages involved, there appears to have been significantly more immune compromised individuals involved (and a hire vaccinated rate too). Yes. Along with higher STD levels, and esp of long controlled HIV. Yes, we are talking the demographic with, by far, the highest HIV rate in the country, possibly because it became too politically correct to contact trace like was done with other STDs. It was Bear Week in P Town. It was almost as unrepresentative a situation as they could have found, if they had gone looking.

    1. You can say Provincetown was filled with HIV positive gays who engaged in depravity and that antiviral medications was also widely in use.

      The CDC failed to note which vaccines may have been in use.

      It was the least careful among the most medically compromised. It didn’t represent Americans in general.

      1. Amazing bigotry here.
        We should have realized it. COVID-19 is all the fault of disease addled gays.

        1. Not in the least. Nobody cares what gays do, esp with each other. I prefer if they would keep it behind closed doors, but I prefer if straight couples do the same.

          My point was that it was highly unrepresentative. Masking policy shouldn’t be made on the basis of COVID-19 likely passed by making out with total strangers. Similarly, the feds shouldn’t be making policy as to the effectiveness of immune responses to vaccines, when a significant percentage of those potentially involved in the outbreak may have been immune system compromised through STDs, most notably, in that community, long term HIV drug maintenance. I am happy that gays can now survive for decades on the drugs that have been developed for HIV. We all know people who didn’t survive. But the reality is that these drugs suppress or compromise immune systems, and the question at hand is the interaction among an average immune system, the vaccines, and the virus. These vaccines don’t directly trigger human immune systems, but rather sensitize them to the special ACE2 receptor proteins in the SARS-CoV-2 spike, and then let the immune system develop the required antibodies, etc. It is likely that immune suppressed individuals, for whatever reason, may not be as capable as the general public doing that. The problem here is that it is likely that there were an excess number of immune suppressed people in that community at that time, and without more, and esp here, some quantization of the quality of community’s immune systems, then any decisions made based on the assumption that their immune systems were statistically normally robust, would seem to suggest significant over estimation of the contagiousness of the virus, or underperformance of the vaccines.

          Short story – don’t make policy decisions based on data that is liable to be unrepresentative. The Indian study is likely unrepresentative because of the source of the vaccine, and the Provincetown infections may be a result of an immune suppressed or compromised population.

      2. None of that matters.

        WERE THEY WEARING MASKS?

        That’s all that matters.

  28. It’s simple. The CDC and the Biden administration have politicized COVID-19, do not have a clue what they are doing and don’t care.

    1. I don’t think the federal government should be doing anything at this point. They bought us the vaccines. The rest is up to us.

      1. Pfizer, Moderna, and Johnson and Johnson – big evil corporations – brought us the vaccines. The government didn’t even do that (although arguably they assisted significantly in the rollout).

    2. “The CDC and the Biden administration have politicized COVID-19”
      As if the orange Clown didn’t even chance he could manufacture

  29. That is just all wrong.

    The CDC withdrew their emergency use application to the FDA for their older RT PCR test in favor of another test which can test for both Covid and Influenza at the same time. That is because they are difficult to distinguish clinically and this test would give clinicians more information.

    They never changed the recommended number of cycles. That is a flat out lie. They recommended that labs report a number which reflects the point at which the test becomes positive. Again to give more information.

    PCR testing has a very high specificity around 98% for Covid. So that means it will correctly identify the disease 98% of the time.

    Just to correct the record.

    1. Reply to Bruce

  30. “Since vaccinated people infected by the coronavirus tend to have milder symptoms, it seems plausible that they are, on average, less infectious than unvaccinated carriers.”
    That statement is an unjustified leap of “logic.”

  31. Just wondering why are the vaccine cards on little cheap easily duplicated or faked pieces of cardboard?

    Why didn’t they use some kind of secure cards with RFID or at least magnetic stripe and a QR code?

    Personally I don’t like the idea of vaccine passports but I’m just wondering why someone at CDC didn’t make sure the vaccine cards were a little more secure in order to prepare for possible vaccine checks/passports since it seems that’s the path that they wanted us on?

    Was that just stupidity on the CDC’s part or was there some other reason?

  32. Walensky’s quotes must always be checked against data … the CDC has lost its inherent credibility:

    https://www.linkedin.com/posts/aritrachtenberg_cdc-995-of-covid-19-deaths-are-from-unvaccinated-activity-6827587853942308864-COl7

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