Reason Roundup

Republicans, Democrats Debate Whether Next Relief Bill Should Be $1 Trillion or $2 Trillion

Plus: Uber, Lyft threaten to suspend California operations following court decision; New Zealand reimposes lockdown measures in response to new COVID-19 cases; and Kamala Harris's hawkish foreign policy


Talks over another coronavirus relief package have stalled following House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's (D–Calif.) insistence that the White House agree to at least $2 trillion in new spending as a precondition of continued negotiations.

Senate Republicans have introduced a $1 trillion relief bill; a not insubstantial sum that is nevertheless short of the $3.5 trillion measure House Democrats passed back in May.

"Democrats have compromised. Repeatedly, we have made clear to the Administration that we are willing to come down $1 trillion if they will come up $1 trillion," Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D–N.Y.) said in a joint statement released Wednesday evening. "We have again made clear to the Administration that we are willing to resume negotiations once they start to take this process seriously."

U.S. Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin issued a statement of his own blaming Pelosi, who he says "made clear that she was unwilling to meet to continue negotiations unless we agreed in advance to her proposal, costing at least $2 trillion," Mnuchin added that "the Administration is willing to move forward with legislation that allows for substantial funds for schools, child care, food, vaccines, hospitals, PPP for small businesses, rental assistance, broadband, airports, state and local government assistance, and liability protection for universities, schools, and businesses."

Helping to hold things up is White House Chief of Staff and former House Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows, who The Wall Street Journal reports is taking a tougher line on additional spending measures.

Senate Republicans' $1 trillion proposal includes calls for another round of $1,200 stimulus checks, $150 billion in aid to state and local governments, a $200 weekly unemployment benefit, as well as a few pet defense projects.

Democrats' $3 trillion proposal would instead provide a $600 unemployment bonus, plus close to $1 trillion in aid to state and local governments. It also includes $175 billion in assistance to homeowners and renters.

President Donald Trump signed an executive memorandum on Saturday that taps $44 billion of already-appropriated disaster relief funding to create a new $400 unemployment bonus, of which $100 would have to be provided by state governments.

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R–Ky.) is reportedly urging Democrats and the White House to come to a deal. Up to 20 senate Republicans are reportedly a no vote on any new relief funding, meaning McConnell will need every Democratic vote he can get.

Regardless of what passes, it is remarkable that the lower-bound proposal on the table is a $1 trillion relief effort that comes just months after the passage of the $2.3 trillion CARES Act.


Rideshare giants Uber and Lyft both say they may have to pause service in California due to a court decision from earlier this week requiring them to treat drivers on their platforms as employees.

"If the court doesn't reconsider, then in California, it's hard to believe we'll be able to switch our model to full-time employment quickly," said Uber CEO Dara Khosrowshahi Wednesday during an MSNBC interview.

Lyft President John Zimmer said the same thing during a quarterly earnings call with investors on Wednesday.

On Monday, a San Francisco Superior Court judge ruled that California's infamous A.B. 5 labor law forbids rideshare companies from classifying drivers as independent contractors, meaning these companies must provide benefits like health insurance and sick pay.

An internal Uber assessment found that this would require the company to raise prices by 20-111 percent in California, with less densely populated areas seeing larger price hikes.

Lyft, Uber, and delivery businesses like Doordash and Instacart, are backing a state ballot initiative that would exempt workers using their apps from the requirements of A.B. 5.


New Zealand is reimposing lockdown restrictions in the city of Auckland after a rash of new COVID-19 cases. Most businesses and schools in the city must now close. Restaurants and bars can offer take-out only.

The island nation had gone more than 100 days without any community spread, reports NPR.

The new cases appear to have spread in a workplace setting, reports Science. One New Zealand public health professor speculates the cases are the result of some sort of screening failure at the border.


  • The U.S. State Department might require Chinese government-funded Confucian institutes on college campuses to register as foreign agents.
  • Instagram's answer to social media app Tik Tok is reportedly a "dud."
  • The Trump administration is considering whether it can cut taxes without Congress.
  • You thought 2021 was going to be better? Think again.
  • Socialist publication In These Times has a series of pieces on Sen. Kamala Harris' (D–Calif.) surprising foreign policy hawkishness.
  • Republicans and Democrats near agreement on further reforms to the Paycheck Protection Program, which has provided loans to distressed small businesses during the pandemic.
  • Life got you down? Perhaps thinking about death will make you feel better.
  • The six podcast genders:

NEXT: Brickbat: Surely You Can't Be Serious

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  1. New Zealand is reimposing lockdown restrictions in the city of Auckland after a rash of new COVID-19 cases.

    Hey, Antifa, I have something you might want to look at.

    1. “A rash of new cases”. There’s 14 new cases. Fourteen. Not fourteen thousand or fourteen hundred, four. teen. How the hell are these delicate little snowflakes able to survive everyday life?

      1. And almost all related to a single family who had a foreign family member in quarantine.

        1. I quit working at shoprite and now I make $65-85 per/h. How? I’m working online! My work didn’t exactly make me happy so I decided to take a chance on something new…SAz after 4 years it was so hard to quit my day job but now I couldn’t be happier.

          Here’s what I do……..► Cash Mony System

      2. How can you trivialize this deadly new outbreak?

        An outbreak that, at current mortality estimates, could easily cost as many as 0.04 human lives?

        Heartless bastard.

      3. But think of the virtue signaling points, and how high they can score on the Pussy Meter.

    2. I thought New Zealand had closed its borders to anyone traveling? Apollo’s Arrow strikes again.

      Even the most drastic measures do not eradicate this virus. If you think you can knock it to zero, just look at New Zealand- an Island nation that had locked the entire country down- to see that it is a pipe dream.

      1. What was that old pandemic game where fucking Madagascar always locked down before you could infect it.. .

        1. That’s why you evolved your dead to float….

        2. You mean Risk?

      2. The suppression theory is cruel and tramples civil liberties. NZ and Australia are retards beyond belief.

      3. As I pointed out the other day, Vietnam did it too, and ended up with a more powerful strain to contend with.

        The Gen-X pols who are largely running the show now are demonstrating that they aren’t fit to run a lemonade stand, much less a complex society.

        1. The failure and stupidity and doubling down on the retard is spectacularly pathetic.

        2. are you sure you are getting the country right? I just looked it up and they have 20 deaths.

          1. Yeah, I’m sure–they totally locked down and got praise for it, only to see a strain three times as strong as the initial one manifest itself late last month.

            People seem to forget that, prior to vaccines, viruses still managed to make people sick and die even when societies tried to quarantine. And this is a fucking coronavirus, so there is no vaccine that will be mostly effective because these things constantly mutate.

        3. Where are you getting that this is driven by Gen X pols? The vast majority of governors, senators, and congressional critters with power are Baby Boomers. Newsom and Whitmer are smack in the middle of Gen X – but Cuomo, Inslee, Fauci, Trump, Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, are the ‘me’ generation.

          You know who is GenX? DeSantis and Kemp.

          1. The Senators and Congresscritters aren’t the ones implementing these silly mask mandates and lockdown actions.

        4. and yet they require a permit for anyone to actually operate a lemonade stand

      4. locking down the whole country just made them sitting ducks, with no population immunity. now they have to worry about even one carrier getting through and lighting the viral match on dry kindling. you can’t ban tourists forever when your economy relies on them. going broke and starving to death is bad for your health too.

        1. …you can’t ban tourists forever when your economy relies on them.

          Tell that to the Governor of Colorado.

        2. It was kind of annoying when I see all the Facebook posts “See New Zealand did it, why can’t we? Hurr America bad durr”

          Like it should come as a surprise that an Island country that has a smaller population than South Carolina would have an easy time containing a virus. It was only a matter of time before something slipped through once they start allowing the midget enthusiasts back to visit the country.

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  2. Instagram’s answer to social media app Tik Tok is reportedly a “dud.”

    You let people post short videos. How difficult is that?

    1. But does it have a catchy name?

    2. But does it come with free Chinese take-away for each post?

      1. An hour later you want to post again.

    3. Is that why the DNC gave AOC one minute for her speech?

      1. Hey! She’s like, all smart, and stuff.

  3. The Trump administration is considering whether it can cut taxes without Congress.

    Can it cut spending without Congress? Maybe look into that.

    1. seeing as he was impeached for not spending money fast enough in Ukraine…

      1. A tad inaccurate recap of what actually happened.

        1. Nope…

        2. No. That was the substance of the complaint. The motivation of the complaint and the motivation of the payment scheduling are locked up inside someone’s head.

        3. JesseAz kinda left out the bit about using the funds in attempted extortion of the Ukrainian government to provide a personal political favor.

            1. Mr. Brown .. oh, never mind…

          1. investigating political corruption by an American citizen in their country is hardly a personal favor, it’s taking the moral high ground

            1. Trump didn’t investigate anything.

              1. The president doesn’t investigate anything. Although maybe there could be a TV detective show a about a US president who investigates crimes in his spare time.

                No, the AG is the one who gets investigations started. It’s tough though, when entrenched democrats attack and obstruct the AG at every turn. Of course, this is to cover their tracks.

    2. Was any federal employee laid off or furloughed during the Pandemic? No one was flying. I know that the TSA Pre-Check application I made for my daughter has never been processed. No one was going to the DMV. Interstate crime was down.

      Why weren’t we shutting these people down?

      1. You know exactly why.

        1. Because the most important thing about a government job is a government paycheck?

      2. Because if we furlough government employees who aren’t working, we’ll be just like Somalia.

        1. Hey now! Furloughed, with pay. How can we expect our heroic civil servants to sacrifice even a penny for free time off?

      3. It seems like most government jobs could be done remotely. Computers don’t care where they’re located…

        1. They could be done remotely, but that would require granting remote access to legacy databases that can barely talk to their own workstations.

          Do you really want the DMV trolls to have access from home? What could go wrong?

          1. Could more go wrong than currently can go wrong? I’ve always assumed that any information the government has on me is out there for anyone to see.

      4. every California government job was deemed essential. and yet the DMV never answers their phone. Gov. Tiresome did dock their pay 10 percent, but 90 percent pay is pretty good for paid leave.

        1. 10% temporary pay cut to not have to work at all? I’d take that deal, but I have real job in the private sector.

  4. You thought 2021 was going to be better? Think again.

    With the Dems in power, love guns are going to be confiscated anyway.

    1. Love guns? So they’re finally going to forcibly transition men.

      1. But seriously, the Dems won’t win in 2020. It’s no use worrying about what they won’t be able to do.

      2. No, forcibly translation women who happen to have been born in a man’s body. You may need some re-education.

    2. Lorena Bobbitt, please call the DNC.

    3. This is my rifle, this is my gun,
      This one is for fighting,
      This one is for fun.

      1. And the first thing that Puritans go after is fun.

  5. Republicans and Democrats near agreement on further reforms to the Paycheck Protection Program…

    Are there any horses left in that barn?

  6. “Once Again, Kamala Harris’ Record as a Prosecutor Was Less Than Progressive”

    —-C.J. Ciaramella

    Being a progressive is about using the coercive power of government to force people to make sacrifices for the greater good–as progressives see it. Support for the police is, thus, integral to what it means to be progressive–whether we’re talking about using the police state to force people to buy insurance they don’t want or using it to force people to stop drinking large servings of sugary soft drinks. There isn’t anything fundamentally less than progressive about Harris’ support for the police, and the police continue to be a dominant force in the politics of progressive cities–from New York to Chicago and San Francisco.

    The social justice warriors and the press have gone insane during a pandemic driven economic collapse, but that doesn’t make Kamala Harris’ support for the police state any less progressive than it was before the pandemic. And it should be noted that the data we’ve seen suggests that everyone from 80% of the African-American community (cited by Gillespie courtesy of Gallup) to suburban white women who are buying guns for the first time en masse–neither typically progressive group appears to be in favor of reducing the role of the police in our society.

    Just because anti-fa and the news media have decided that apologizing for the police is less than progressive this summer doesn’t make it so. Actually, it appears that both anti-fa and the news media are delusional on that point right now. Whether its anti-fa “protesting” through vandalism, looting, arson, and antagonizing the police or the news media’s support for these activities by pretending they amount to mere protesting rather than riots, the general public–progressive or otherwise–does not support them. How delusional must they be if they believe that you’re less than progressive if you want to distance yourself from rioting?

    The issue here isn’t that Kamala Harris ls less than progressive because of her support for the police. The issue is delusional people in the news media who imagine that support for the police is less than progressive. And we shouldn’t fall under their influence. On the one hand, we know the news media is completely full of bias and shit. On the other hand, subconsciously or otherwise, we seem to internalize their narrative and make it our own. Nothing is the way it is just because the news media says so, and that includes what progressive voters really think about the police and what it means to be a progressive.

    P.S. If the city charter committee in Minneapolis hadn’t pulled the referendum on defunding the police from the November ballot, the progressive voters of Minneapolis probably would have voted against it.

    1. Selective application of an overly broad legal code (overcharging the harmless and undercharging legit threats to their community), for the purpose of social engineering and centralizing political power, is the essence of progressivism.

      1. Exactly. The media didn’t just get out in front of the American people. They got way too far ahead of progressives, too.

        Meanwhile, Ciaramella seems to be dreaming about what being a progressive is. Some people want progressive politicians to be libertarians so badly, they start hallucinating. Apologizing for the police is less than progressive–are they kidding?!

        Progressivism is an authoritarian movement founded on state police power and forced sacrifice. Everything they are is some flavor of that from the individual mandate for Medicaid expansion to their arguments for state action on global warming. Forced sacrifice in a police state isn’t just what they do. It’s who they are, and that’s who they’ve been for a very long time.

        Here’s a song about Jerry Brown from 40 years ago:

        1. I met the DK’s after a show about 18 years ago. Jello Biafra wasn’t in the band at the time, (Brandon Cruz?) but I asked the guitar player, east bay ray, about this song specifically. I wondered what he thought about the contrast of painting moonbeam as a dangerous fascist with the W/Cheney gang in charge of the country.

          He pretty much shrugged and said something along the line of “seemed prudent at the time”. And then 2 chicks started putting on a show in an adjacent room. Good times.

      2. Cue the Proggies to poison the thread by characterizing this demonstrable policy (i.e. yesterday’s links re Portland) as nothing more than a viscous alt-right conspiracy theory. And somehow make it about Trump.

      3. You must be talking about snatching children away and indefinitely detaining people who’s only crime was crossing an imaginary line, while Jared Kushner roams free to sell out our national security to whomever will help him with his 666 5th Ave. $1B misadventure.

        1. Kushner worked for Obama?

        2. What about the CPS?

        3. Pedo Jeffy doesn’t believe in sovereign borders or private property. Makes sense, as he is a global Marxist.

          He does believe in importing child rapists from other countries. He said so in these very forums last year. NAMBLA appears to have gone global too.

    2. Makes you wonder how they’re going to grab up all the guns without the police.

      1. A big magnet?

        1. Must be why they outlawed plastic guns.

        2. Magnets are racist! They are black, do the heavy lifting and they are stuck to white refrigerators; a master slave dynamic if I have ever seen one.

      2. Beto seemed to think we’d all just hand them over voluntarily, which means he may be the one Texan who has literally never spoken to a gun owner.

        1. Everyone on Team “Disarm Everyone” who happens to own a firearm regardless will turn theirs in.

          Some portion of the people on Team “Let People Own Guns” will turn theirs in with a minimum of fuss.

          Some portion of the people on Team “Let People Own Guns” will make a large fuss.

          1. Looks like you even fundamentally misunderstand.

            Many gun owners don’t view this as someone “letting” us do anything. This isn’t XBox privileges that can be taken away for poor grades, it is a fundamental human right.

      3. They’ll form a committee with a catchy name to do it.

    3. Antifa et. al. aren’t protesting the police. They’re protesting the fact that they don’t control the police.

      1. Also, I wouldn’t underestimate how much suburban soccer Moms support law and order. Throw in their desire to see a woman in power and to signal to others that they aren’t racist and Harris might be the perfect candidate to pull them in. Since they also vote more than most (all?) other demographics, I think Harris may end up being a great choice for Biden.

        Of course, I also thought Trump would lose to Clinton, so what do I know?

        1. That’s what I’m saying about suburban women.

          The reason they’re buying guns (and that’s just the tip of the iceberg), is probably because they’re afraid of losing the protection of the police. There were two spikes in sales: 1) when the pandemic originally broke out and 2) when the riots broke out. That latter batch appears to be first time gun buyers with women making up some 40% of that latter spike in sales.

  7. Senate Republicans have introduced a $1 trillion relief bill…

    What’s left of the GOP is going to have such a hangover next year.

    1. A trillion here, a trillion there, pretty soon you’re talking about real money.

      1. What’s $1 trillion amongst friends?

      2. Just the opposite. At this point, those trillions are pretend money, because we don’t have it.

  8. we are willing to come down $1 trillion if they will come up $1 trillion

    LOL we’re fucking doomed.

    1. It’s not real money.

      1. That means it’s even worse.

        1. Also, Shhhh! Don’t tell anyone.

          1. try ignoring it. it will go away.

    2. Two burglars fighting over division of the loot.

    3. A perfectly reasonable compromise?

      1. I see they have been reading up on the Donald Trump/My Kindergartner strategy of negotiation.

        Me: You get one cookie.
        Her: I want 10 cookies. But I am willing to compromise at 5.

        1. this guy gets it

        2. Interesting observation about childish negotiating strategies. I have noticed that when kids reach the age where they start understanding numerical representation, they have an upper limit. I spent some time with a 3 year-old and noticed that when I would say ‘OK, 1 more time’, he would counter with ‘5 more times’. But he couldn’t count to 5, 3 was the limit of his ability. 5 was ‘some number bigger than I can count to’ meaning that 5 actually meant ‘as many times as I want’.

          Clearly, when a person can say, ‘we are willing to come down $1 trillion if they will come up $1 trillion’ with a straight face, the 1 trillion is beyond the upper limit of her understanding. What she is really saying is, ‘I will ask for as much as I want and you can’t stop me’.

          1 trillion is $3000 for every man, woman and child in the country. That is 20% of the average annual household income of $63K ($12K for 4 people). Of which those households are promised to get back less than 6% ($3400 for 2 parents 2 kids). Pelosi wanted to spend 3 times that for the same return to bail out (surprise, surprise!) her home state of California for something completely unrelated to the pandemic. She is counting on the $1 trillion being beyond most people’s ability to comprehend.

          Infantilizing the populace is another hallmark of the Progressive policy wonk.

          1. I am too lazy to look up the source now, but I recall some depressing studies of numeracy (or lack thereof) among average people, and you are essentially correct. Most people can understand small numbers, but struggle with big numbers. For them, a million, billion, and trillion really do mean the same thing.

            And if you want to get more depressed, look up studies about how dismal math skills are in the general population.

            1. “Math is…………!!!!!!”

              Oh, never mind. You know.

              1. Talking Barbie dolls used to say that.

            2. People would have a better understanding if the highest denomination used in government was a million. If instead of saying a trillion, they said a million, million that would probably catch at least some peoples’ attention. Compare that to the lifetime earnings of the average person – which, as near as I can tell, is around a couple of million at the most. It might be even better to express spending in terms of average lifetime earnings. A trillion dollars in spending could be expressed as around 500 million peoples’ lifetime earnings.

              1. A trillion dollars in spending could be expressed as around 500 million peoples’ lifetime earnings.

                500,000 people’s lifetime earnings (2M x .5M = 1 million millions). But I like the way you reinforced the underlying point!

                1. D’oh! (slaps head)

    4. It’s fine. We’re all insured, right?

      1. Reserve currency, baby!

        1. At least up until it isn’t the reserve currency.

    5. After all, they can always do another trillion or two a few months from now.

  9. The U.S. State Department might require Chinese government-funded Confucian institutes on college campuses to register as foreign agents.

    Confucius say, “Man who attend Chinese school get education in Communism, like every other college student.”

    1. That’s pretty much what the Confucius Institutes are for–communist indoctrination with a “China Numbah One!” twist.

      The one at Arizona State got shut down for basically acting like a foreign agent for the CCP.

      1. Cite?

        When I googled for stories on the nefarious activities of the CI at ASU, all I found was a bunch of innuendo.

        1. Your googling sucks donkey ass.

          ASU closes China-funded institute after Defense Department gives ultimatum
          Kyra Haas
          The Republic
          August 24, 2019

          Students returning to Arizona State University for the fall semester this week might notice something missing. ASU’s Confucius Institute, founded in 2007 and funded by the Chinese government, has closed.

          ASU joins at least 15 other universities in closing its Confucius Institute in the past 18 months. The programs have come under scrutiny, with lawmakers and others voicing concerns about possible Chinese propaganda or espionage.

          The Confucius Institute at ASU offered Chinese language and culture education, hosted academic conferences and partnered with a number of K-12 schools in Arizona to provide Chinese language programs.

          The National Defense Authorization Act for the 2019 fiscal year prohibits universities from hosting an institute while also receiving funding for Chinese language study from the U.S. Department of Defense.
          Long story short–don’t take government money if you don’t want to dance to the government’s tune.

          1. Saw that exact story. All it mentions are “concerns”. That’s innuendo.

            1. Those universities were completely free to tell the DoD to fuck off and keep them open; tuition charges are so high, losing that money for a single language program would hardly make a difference.

              Your concern-trolling is noted.

              1. TWK,

                Did it get shut down or not?

                1. If I understand correctly, yes it did. Apparently, because of DoD pressure over “concerns” that the CI might be engaging in something nefarious, not their being caught actually doing anything nefarious.

                  1. Yeah, the DoD always publishes all the evidence they have of foreign meddling so average people can read it at their leisure.

                    I hope for the people around you that you aren’t actually this stupid and you’re just trolling.

              2. Not concern trolling. Pointing out holes when commenters here post comments trying to further conservative narratives.

                1. Stay on top of it, WK. You’re doing very important work!


                  1. Thanks! I will.

                2. No, you’re concern trolling.

    1. That first photo looked like a Pink Floyd album cover. Just surreal. All it needed was some floating pig in the background. Though, since it’s the modern UK, they’ll just substitute in a police camera drone.

    2. How could that possibly be a profitable concert?

      1. Profit? Was that the point?

        1. Well, if you want more concerts, yeah.

      2. “On a normal day you can get 45,000 people in here, but our capacity for the gigs will be 2,500.

        5.5% of capacity. Either no profit or tickets were $1200 apiece. The view from the location they took that picture was pretty shitty.

        1. Frisco Texas drew 2500 for a soccer game yesterday. And booed their own team for kneeling during the national anthem.

      3. $500+ ticket?
        Exclusivity deal with MDMA vendor?
        $50 beers?

    3. how do you dance in one of those? no, gracias.

      1. You won’t get any dancing here, it’s illegal.

        1. is a physical compulsion. covered by ADA.

    4. You guys are having a really hard time understanding that most people do not want to risk killing their loved ones who happen to be over 65 just for an afternoon of entertainment.

      It’s a global mainstream opinion. Not saying your position of being willing to sacrifice anyone over 65 so you can really pack it in at a christian contemporary concert is wrong, but it is the minority view.

      1. >>most people do not want to risk killing their loved ones who happen to be over 65 just for an afternoon of entertainment

        lol. seriously lol. lololololololololol

      2. Did your parents have any kids that lived?

      3. I thought this was OBL, at first. Then I noticed there were no hashtags.

      4. Sure, ass hole. If we just lock down hard enough we will all live forever.

      5. Then don’t live in ny

    5. Box seats for everyone!

    6. Still don’t look like they could protect anyone from David Lee Roth.

    7. Those metal bits look like they’d be really dangerous in the mosh pit.

  10. “Up to 20 senate Republicans are reportedly a no vote on any new relief funding”

    “it is remarkable that the lower-bound proposal on the table is a $1 trillion relief effort”

    Sounds like the lower-bound is $0. Maybe an atta-boy/girl would be appropriate for those Senators.

    1. In other words, only 20 senators should be considered for reelection.

      1. Yup, stop spending my children’s money.

        1. Meh. They won’t need money. The socialist utopia will provide for them.

          1. I think my kids are of the wrong demographics… they’ll fall into the “from each his/her ability” category, rather than the “to each his/her need” category.

  11. Peaceful Protesters attacked Ronald McDonald House because nothing says social justice like scaring the shit out of kids with cancer.


    2. Enraging. Absolutely infuriating. I’m surprised at just how pissed off I got after watching that.

      That cop in the thread yesterday was inappropriate, given his position, but he wasn’t wrong.

    3. Looks like a test of the Broken Window Fallacy: Does breaking the window of a cancer patient stimulate their immune systems?

      1. Technically, while sometimes the cancer patient is there at the house, it is more likely that the patient is in the nearby hospital, and the family who flew in to get treatment are staying at the RMcDH

        1. Which is worse. Kids are resilient and often don’t fully understand what’s going on and can be distracted (personal experience, though the pain meds helped a lot with that). Parents and family members often end up more traumatized by the experience than their kid.

    4. They’re just peacefully protesting. Nothing to see here. Move along.

      1. They were protesting the Trump Administration that gave those kids cancer. Obviously.

  12. “Senate Republicans’ $1 trillion proposal includes calls for another round of $1,200 stimulus checks, $150 billion in aid to state and local governments, a $200 weekly unemployment benefit, as well as a few pet defense projects.

    Democrats’ $3 trillion proposal would instead provide a $600 unemployment bonus, plus close to $1 trillion in aid to state and local governments.”

    The difference between that $150 billion the Republicans want to spend and the $1 trillion the Democrats want to spend is huge–more so than the dollar difference between them. My understanding is that the $150 billion the Republicans are proposing would go specifically to help reopen schools and would be conditional on their reopening (they want working mothers back on the job). The $1 trillion in the Democrats’ bill for state and local government is just a bailout–especially for states with out of control pension obligations.

    1. “The $1 trillion in the Democrats’ bill for state and local government is just a bailout–especially for states with out of control pension obligations.”

      This is the most galling part. Profligate spenders need to be allowed to go down the tubes for the good of humanity.

    2. The $1 trillion in the Democrats’ bill for state and local government is just a bailout–especially for states with out of control pension obligations.

      Figures. “Never let a crisis go to waste” and all that. They’re just using COVID as an excuse to bail out blue states with idiotic pension obligations, nevermind that without actual pension reform they’ll just be bankrupt again in a couple of decades or less.


    A protest Tuesday started over a Chicago police-involved shooting and ended when Englewood residents pushed back. Expletives were dropped, and there was pushing and shoving, which forced the protesters to retreat.

    A caravan started on 64th and Cottage Grove, and the protesters eventually ended up in front of the 7th District police station, but it didn’t last long.

    “If you ain’t from Englewood, get the F*** out of here,” longtime neighborhood resident Darryl Smith told protesters….

    “A lot of people saying the looting started because of Englewood. We are tired of Englewood getting a black eye, those people were opportunist,” Smith said.

    He says he’s not buying it and he and other Englewood residents had wanted the protesters from Black Lives Matter Chicago, Good Kids Mad City and other groups to leave.

    BLM has made protests synonymous with rioting and looting. They have only themselves to blame for people not wanting BLM protests in their neighborhoods and towns.

    1. But they don’t care because this was all about the election and Trump and they don’t give a fuck about actual black lives, because that’s not what Soros pays them for.

    2. That’s good to hear. This shit will stop when the only neighborhoods that BLM can burn down are the ones they themselves came from.

    3. Englewood is an exceptionally dangerous neighborhood of Chicago. Tops in total casualties so far this year, and #2 in fatalities, per heyjackass. I’m surprised the residents limited themselves to pushing and shoving.

    4. “BLM and the other associated groups have a First Amendment right to demonstrate lawfully and peacefully. Others do not have the right to disrupt peaceful demonstrations or chase people out of neighborhoods simply because they don’t like them.”

      This literally happens all.the.time. It’s called counter-protesting.

      1. And it’s unconstitutional if the protestors are being peaceful. We are losing track of who was being violent in this story.

        1. Yeah, it’s not like there was a big fucking riot a couple nights ago or anything.

          These assholes gave up their constitutional rights when they turned the protests into a property destruction exercise. Now they’re going to get their shit pushed in by people who don’t want them around.

          With any luck, it will be like Fort Collins where the Antifucks got chased out, then choked out, then arrested for disturbing the peace.

          1. “These assholes” = collectivist thinking. There is no evidence that the protestors in this story, who were being peaceful, had any association with rioters.

            1. Shove your self-righteousness up your ass.

            2. Now do cops.

              1. What do you want to know about them?

        2. That doesn’t alter the fact that it happens all the time and nobody does anything to stop it. It’s doubtful whether the violence down at Charlottesville would have happened without the “unconstitutional” counter-protestors.

          1. Maybe so.

        3. So ONLY BLM has speech rights? Is that how it works?

      2. in colleges they just call it inciting violence when a mob chases you out, and it’s your fault

        1. In your opinion, are colleges who call it that way correct in their thinking?

  14. What’s up, Peanuts?

    We have two suckass Big Gov parties that both want to spend trillions we don’t have and will be taxed for later.

    One is filled with Aborto–Freaks, rednecks, and Bible Beaters and the other has the cancel culture PC retards in it.

    It is like we need a third party of limited powers. Or something like that.

    1. If those are you big problems, you’re not paying attention.

    2. Aborto–Freaks, rednecks, and Bible Beaters

      Baby-killing and hating on the proletariat and their beliefs is important work in Nuttplug’s world.
      Sooo progressive.

    3. You could try a political narrative that didn’t pass it’s sell-by date in 2006.

      1. “2006.”

        ‘Too old.’

        1. If this comment system had a like button, I’d risk going to hell for clicking it on this one.

    4. Don’t you have a kid to diddle, turd?

    5. Jesus this is creepy and pathetic. Hope you’re having fun ‘#2’ because you’re fooling no one with the possible exception of mongoloid retards like Sevo and John. Serious question- why are Drumpf-tards here so obsessed with me?

    6. Nothing you wrote should be all that controversial when posted in the comments section of a libertarian website, but here we are.


    If you’re interested in an alternative perspective to the Atlantic council/global socialist narrative

    1. On a side note, if we can’t enact ranked voting here, can we at least add the “against all candidates” option?

      1. Isn’t that option labeled “Jo Jorgensen”?

      2. Over 4% of voters chose the “against all candidates” option.

        WTF? I love Belarus now.

        1. It probably would be 95%, but I’m sure they’re all told that “against all candidates” is actually a vote for the guy you REALLY don’t want. Sound familiar?

  16. So far the gun control measure loved the most by the left, Universal Background Checks, has had zero convictions in the year since passage in New Mexico.

    Using the narrative that there is no voting fraud because there are very few convictions… I believe this means there are no illegal gun sales ever.

    1. Speaking of which… NYT somehow manages to blame the US for illegal gun sales and crime in Britain.

      1. We probably caused slavery in the UK, too.

    2. I guarantee the blue collar people out in the sticks are blatantly ignoring the law. That law was passed to soothe fee-fees in Albuquerque and Santa Fe.

      1. “soothe ‘fee-fees’ in Albuquerque and Santa Fe.”

        Urban Dictionary has some…different…definitions for fee-fee than what I think you meant.

      2. Yes it is an absolutely un-enforceable law. Unless the state has a record of you owning a gun, and then at some point they find it owned by someone else, they can never charge you short of you walking up and asking to be put in cuffs.

        RRWP, I am not in Colorado any more, but have there been any arrests since they implemented UBC 4 or 5 years ago?

        1. I haven’t heard of any, and from Armslist traffic I can tell you there are a lot of people here who don’t seem to think breaking that law is a tremendous risk. Outside of Denver and Boulder I don’t think there are any police departments in the state interested in enforcing it, I know my Sheriff isn’t.

          I know of one case of someone violating the magazine ban and getting charged, but he was arrested for some violent crime and the mag charge was just an add-on.

  17. Voters reject the D.A. who charged Officer Rolfe with murder charges in the Rayshard Brooks incident.

    1. Stealing six figures from a local nonprofit—allegedly—might’ve had something to do with it.

  18. How many times have I argued that there will never be a time when the government is so flush with cash that they decide to cut spending? Who here believes that if California, Illinois, and New York state only raised taxes and had more revenue to spend, that they would spend less? These governments will only cut spending when they have no other option–no tax increases, no bailouts, no option but to cut spending. These opportunities to cut spending present themselves during recessions, and guess what’s happening to spending at the state and municipal level right now?

    “State and local governments reduced spending at a 5.6% annual rate in the second quarter as they laid off workers and pulled back on services to offset plunging tax revenues. More cuts are on the way.

    Moody’s Analytics estimates that without additional federal aid, state and local budget shortfalls will total roughly $500 billion over the next two fiscal years. That would shave more than 3 percentage points off U.S. gross domestic product and cost more than 4 million jobs, said Dan White, head of fiscal policy research at Moody’s.

    Talks in Congress on another economic relief package have stalled, with assistance for state and local governments among the sticking points. Democrats are pushing for $950 billion.

    Republican leaders, who didn’t include aid for cities and states in their initial plan, have offered $150 billion. They cite concerns about growing U.S. deficits and debt, and they say some state budget woes predate the pandemic.

    President Trump, in a tweet on Monday, suggested Democrats “only wanted BAILOUT MONEY for Democrat run states and cities that are failing badly.”


    The time for libertarians to stand up for smaller government and against spending is right fucking now, and the way to do it is to support President Trump. Anybody who doesn’t want to starve bloated state governments of cash so that they need to lay off government employees if it means they have to support Trump are not principled fiscal conservatives. Being principled means you stand by your principles even when it’s hard to do so. Refusing to make the government smaller if it means supporting Trump is the opposite of being principled. It means you’re a phony fiscal conservative.

    1. It doesn’t really work to starve the beast at the federal level since the feds can just print their own money. That states, however, cannot do that. They have to live within their means. So, refusing to raise taxes will at some point force them to cut spending.

      1. Not if I send them a huge stack of cash I don’t have!! /UncleSam

        1. Right, this has been my thought on the whole ‘Heroes’ package. All of the Gov folks at the Fed level have rewarded their pals with the first two packages, now the state Gov folks want their cut to ensure they can reward their pals too.
          All good fun. Let the peasants eat cake.

      2. The states may not be able to print money, but they have been able to get the feds to do it for them when they’re willing to kiss the ring. Before this whole corona “crisis” is over, there will be state bailouts. Set your watch by it.

        1. If the feds bail them out, then it is the feds spending the money. yes, the feds can always bail them out. But I think that is unlikely as long as the Democrats don’t control both Congress and the White House.

      3. Printing their own money has a cost, too, in terms of inflation. It’s hard to “enjoy” the negative consequences of that would-be inflation when the rest of the world scoops up our debt and helps keep interest rates so low. It looks like the treasury market is finally starting to see some higher rates with all the spending we’ve been doing, but up until last week, the consensus seemed to be that we might be following Germany into negative interest rates on our ten year notes. In other words, up until last week, they seemed to be spending without any negative consequences on interest rates.

        Regardless, there are still negative consequences to “printing” money at the federal level, especially in terms of inflation, expectations of the future by businesses, etc.–even if the negative consequences are delayed. At some point, the world will become saturated with U.S. dollar denominated debt despite us being the prettiest horse in the glue factory. And when we reach that point, we will see double digit inflation again. When we have to refinance our debt at 10% rather than 1%, that interest expense will crowd out other spending, and the larger the amount of debt we’ve floated, the harsher the consequences of our past deficit spending will be.

        Staving the beast may not be the total solution to deficit spending at the federal level, but it’s still part of the solution. Just like at the state level, the federal government will never be so flush with tax revenue that they decide not to spend it. Hell, Keynes even argued that the reason government spending is the solution to the consumers’ marginal propensity to save during recessions is because the government can be relied on to spend every penny they get. Depriving them of tax revenue, therefore, does reduce spending lower than it would be if they had more of our money to spend–even if they spend more next year than they did this year. They won’t cut spending until they have no other option, too, and depriving them of tax revenue does limit their options.

        If they won’t cut spending until we deprive them of the ability to raise more money in taxes, then cutting their revenue with tax cuts is a necessary step to make them cut spending, too.

        1. I am not saying printing money is a good thing. It isn’t. I am just saying the feds can and will do it.

          1. Yeah, I’m just saying that starving the beast may not be the total solution to federal spending because of what you pointed out, but it’s still part of the solution.

        2. You’re right about all of the consequences of printing money. The problem is, they clearly don’t care.

          1. They will care!

            Someday, nobody knows when, we’ll fall off the edge of that cliff.

            When we’re forced to cut programs indiscriminately because the world markets won’t finance our debt at rates low enough that our ability to tax can cover, they’ll care.

            They’ll decide to buy fire insurance–once the kitchen is in flames.

            1. Then they can rule the ashes. From the only buildings left standing. The fortresses that they bought with the money they stole from us.

              1. Yep. They’ve already stolen the actual wealth right out from under us, now they are printing the money they will use to buy the wreckage of the small businesses they drove under.

            2. I have had serious arguments with people I otherwise intellectually respect that this can never happen. Because I guess America is guaranteed to be the Reserve Currency forever, via magic perhaps.

    2. But libertarians have to prove they’re independent thinkers by having the exact same opinions regarding orangemanbad as the MSM/left

      1. Very good point. Libertarians should abandon their stances and principles when yucky people start agreeing with them. Like when the left started coming around to police reform ideas that libertarians have been supporting for decades. Libertarians should have immediately abandoned those ideas and sided with Republicans because it’s better than appearing to align with leftist scum. Right?

        1. Yes, the left is totes on board with libertarian style police reforms.
          Good call.
          Super useful

          1. Talk about missing the point. Though I suspect it is intentional being that you openly advocate murdering people with the ‘wrong’ politics.

        2. So you’re saying when your own actions and adherence to principles give power to people who want to destroy you, you should work toward your own destruction anyway.

          Genius take.

          1. If your principles lead to your extinction, you need new principles.

          2. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, until the battle is over and now they’re enemy again.

            1. sarcasmic, that was Tulpa. It’s been nearly a month since you and I asked the Reason IT folks to fix the handle spoofing exploit and they haven’t done anything yet.

          3. Hi, Tulpa. I didn’t post the above comment, by the way.

    3. Yes! All 14 true libertarians come forth and hold up the light of liberty that all may see!

      This time, it shall be different! This time the people will hear us!

    4. Your argument for supporting Trump is remarkably unconvincing.

      1. Your rebuttal is so persuasive, it completely changed my mind!

    5. Isn’t Trump trying to spend a huge chunk of money by executive order? Isn’t his party proposing spending $1 trillion more than they have already spent this year?

    6. California was flush with cash in 2019 and 2018 and 2017. The state was booming. They spent it all, and the CalPERS slush fund was still underwater. Now tax revenues are down 40 percent or so thanks to Gov. Tiresome, and they want a federal bailout.

    7. “Support the most spendingest president in history for fiscal austerity!”

      I hope the trumpian double speak is at peak. I don’t know how much more ridiculous this can get.

      1. “Math is racist!”

        That’s how. You guys always find a way.

        1. I don’t believe math is racist, nor have I ever voted for anyone who does.

          I do believe that supporting the biggest spending president in probably everyone reading this’s lifetime is pretty farcical, though.

          1. I ain’t supporting no politician. I do believe that pretending he’s doing it all on his own, and worse, that you wouldn’t be bitching about austerity if he vetoed stimulus is pretty farcical, though.

  19. Democrats and Media continue to have an effect at scaring Americans in regards to Covid (no it is not novel).

    Remember, the polling shows the average american believes 30 million people have died in the US of Covid.

  20. Quick, someone arrest Roger Stone:

    137 documents from @WikiLeaks
    on newly announced Vice Presidential Running Mate Kamala Harris

  21. “a comprehensive guide to podcasts”

    A blue check guide to podcasts

    There are thousands of podcasts in different industries. Not just media and politics

    1. Now that you brought it up, that comic supposed to be funny?
      It wasn’t.

  22. The Babylon Bee
    Chicago Weatherman Predicts Another Huge Murder Front This Weekend

    Is it funny when it’s true?

  23. New Zealand is reimposing lockdown restrictions in the city of Auckland after a rash of new COVID-19 cases. Most businesses and schools in the city must now close. Restaurants and bars can offer take-out only.

    From the article: 14 new Covid-19 cases reported

    That is the new definition of Rash? It is more likely people stop being tested since they didn’t want to be the ones to break the streak.

    1. New Zealand got that streak by being an island and shutting down travel, quarantining anyone who came in. Unless you’re going to do that literally forever, you’re just delaying the inevitable. At some point you’re going to let someone into the country and they’re going to infect other people.

  24. The Trump administration is considering whether it can cut taxes without Congress.</i?

    Call it a penalRebate. It will pass by Roberts easily.

  25. Democrats once again bitching about Republicans refusal to compromise when what they’re offering is a punch in the face and they’re complaining that we won’t accept a kick in the nuts. The problem is that the GOP lets the Dems frame the discussion because they’re only too happy to go along with the Dems proposals, they just don’t want to take any responsibility for it. They’re much happier being the loyal opposition than providing any leadership.

    1. Shooter is a repeat felon. Gun control certainly stopped him from getting a gun.

      Guy did, I think, a total of six months confinement for his myriad of prior offenses.

    2. Media is Ignoring It

      Duh. How’s reporting on that going to help elect Biden?

      1. You mean Harris via Biden.

    1. that just cannot be real

      1. Toobin said Shrill and Nasty were sexist terms. The thread dumps showing the media using Shrill against the GOP in many headlines was hilarious. Then the tweet thread showing Trump uses Nasty more against men than women was also hilarious.

        Liberals don’t even try to reason, they just castigate.

        1. Sometimes they smirk. Smirking works too.

          Well, unless you are accosted by a drum-weilding crazy person. Then smirking is violent and oppressive.

          1. True, but it can also make you a billionaire…

            1. Highest paid person by WaPo.

        2. shrill is. nasty is generic.

    2. Cripes, never underestimate the left’s capacity to call things sexist and racist.

      1. In fairness, they did come out in force for days leading up to the announcement warning that whatever criticism was leveled against the nominee was, it would definitely be both racist and sexist.

      2. Unless it’s a woman of color that dares to criticize the war machine. Then they’re a foreign asset to the left.

  26. Debate Whether Next Relief Bill Should Be $1 Trillion or $2 Trillion

    “What difference at this point does it make?”

  27. > Republicans, Democrats Debate Whether Next Relief Bill Should Be $1 Trillion or $2 Trillion

    Lube up!

    1. They will compromise at 3 trillion.

      1. or $2 trillion in 3 easy installments of $1 trillion

        1. Do I get anything extra if I call in the next 15 minutes?

          1. An extra $50 billion donated to the needy multinational bank of your choice (as long as it’s one of the big three.)

  28. The CDC has a report of Excess Deaths that they have been filling out.

    If you drill into the data, you find two interesting things.

    1) New York seems to be (with several spot checks) the only state whose Reported COVID deaths (see worldometers, 33,000) undercount the number of Excess Deaths reported by the CDC (37,000 – 41,000). New York is undercounting COVID deaths by 15 – 20%.

    2) If you drill into the data, you find that most of the “Excess Deaths” come from two places:
    a) Deaths classified as caused by Dimentia and Diabetes.
    b) “Predicted Excess Deaths”- which is where the CDC looks at how many morgues have reported in, and then extrapolates how many deaths there will have been if the remainder report in. There has been a large spike of these predicted deaths in the last 4 weeks- a spike that hasn’t been reported anywhere.

    It is HIGHLY likely that those Dementia and Diabetes deaths are misclassifications of elderly people who died from COVID.

    The predicted excess deaths is suspicious, but could be an artifact of modeling. Nevertheless, if it is true, then it means all the noise about Florida and Georgia is failing to mention with glorious New York.

    Now if I were a crazy guy, I’d suggest that Cuomo and his lackeys misclassified the deaths of all the old people he killed, and they are intentionally slow-playing recent deaths to avoid being mixed into the news about a spike. But I am not crazy, so it must just be a coincidence, right? Right?

    1. I wonder if some of the excess deaths are caused by the psychological effects of nursing homes being effectively run as prisons for months now. I can’t help but think that people deprived of contact with their families are not more likely to give up and die than they would be otherwise.

      1. I’m certain that some of them were caused by the media pumping fear through the TV 24/7. Remember the reports of “mysterious” heart attack victims dying at home?

    2. New York has over 30k deaths from covid on the books.

      Everywhere in the world reports 45-65% of deaths from covid are from nursing homes / assisted living facilities. Most are closer to 60 rather than lower.

      New York famously ordered that nursing home patients who were covid positive must be accepted onto their nursing home.

      New York reports some 6,000 deaths in such facilities.

      33% of New York’s 30k deaths would be 10,000. So even if they had reported nearly double the number of nursing home deaths they did, it would still be half of the expected number, which should be over 20k.

      And that is without adjusting expectations for the policy of forcing nursing homes to accept covid patients.

      1. “Everywhere in the world reports 45-65% of deaths from covid are from nursing homes / assisted living facilities. Most are closer to 60 rather than lower.”

        Yes we know for a fact that New York has elected to only report a death as “Long Term Care” if the person died at the facility. If they died at the hospital, then they are just reported as another COVID death.

        But this is even worse- people are not being reported as COVID deaths. Go to the “Change in Number of Deaths by Cause” dashboard and you will see all these Non-respiratory deaths are up by 60 – 100% every week since the pandemic began in New York. Not New York City (which is pulled out of the numbers) but New York as a whole.

        1. All this.


    Portland Antifa mayor candidate cannot bring herself to condemn attempted murder and violent riots.

    Ladies and Gentleman, you 2020 Democratic Party. This is who they are.

    1. They’ve been demonic since the days of slavery and the Trail of Tears.

      1. That old trope? Everyone knows that those Democrats were actually Republicans. And the Republicans who opposed them were actually democrats.

        Except FDR. He is both. The new deal was Democrat, but the internment camps were Republican.

  30. As much as I love tax cuts, having the president do it all in his authority is wrong. It’s up to congress to legislate, and the executive to sign off or veto. The president can cajole and hector congress all he wants, but he doesn’t get to cut taxes all on his own.

    The man is incredibly ancient. Maybe he’ll be reelected, but eventually he won’t be in office any more. Eventually there will be a tax and spend Democrat in the White House. DO YOU WANT THAT DEMOCRAT TO BE ABLE TO RAISE TAXES WITHOUT CONGRESS? Get your heads out of the sand and realize that such power will Make America Fucked Again. MAFA. All power that you hand to Trump is also being given to the next Democrat president.

    1. Congress did legislate. They, and by they I mean democrats, passed a bill under Clinton allowing the Executive to postpone collection of taxes or debts during an emergency, which Covid has been declared.

      So your initial assertion seems to be completely wrong.

      Also with the 300 a month unemployment, the WH is claiming it is from the 150 billion Congress authorized previously in Cares #2 act.

      1. The Secretary of the Treasury is hereby directed to use his authority pursuant to 26 U.S.C. 7508A to defer the withholding, deposit, and payment of the tax imposed by 26 U.S.C. 3101(a), and so much of the tax imposed by 26 U.S.C. 3201 as is attributable to the rate in effect under 26 U.S.C. 3101(a), on wages or compensation, as applicable, paid during the period of September 1, 2020, through December 31, 2020, subject to the following conditions:

        Those are the acts he utilized for the Payroll Tax Order. Feel free to go yell at Congress.

    2. I’m not sure this is all by his authority. It appears that Congress has ceded a lot of their authority to the president. That isn’t as it should be and may not even be constitutional, but I’m not sure this is all by the president’s authority.

      “WASHINGTON—President Trump’s gambit to defer Social Security payroll taxes for the rest of the year and pressure Congress into forgiving them is turning into a logistical challenge . . . .

      “We’ll be terminating the payroll tax after I hopefully get elected,” he said at the White House on Wednesday, following two similar comments during the weekend about making payroll tax cuts permanent.

      In that example, President Trump isn’t eliminating the social security payroll tax by his own authority. He’s using his authority to defer the collection of the tax. By his own admission, if we want that to become a permanent feature of the law, we’ll need to reelect him and he’ll need to eliminate the social security payroll tax by getting a bill through Congress.

      Incidentally, this is an excellent reason for a libertarian to vote for President Trump. President Trump is the only president I’m aware of who fought for a bill to slash spending on a socialist wealth redistribution entitlement program (Medicaid by $772 billion). Now he’s the only president to fight for and partially eliminate the elimination of a payroll tax that funds another socialist wealth redistribution entitlement program like Social Security.

      Am I dreaming?

    3. I agree with you in principle, but I don’t think there’s anything stopping the next tax and spend Democrat president from doing it whether or not Trump does it. For example, can you tell me which Republican president went around Congress to legislate immigration reform as he saw fit, explicitly stating his intention to ignore Congress in doing so, before Obama pen-and-phoned DACA?

      No, Trump shouldn’t be using executive orders as an end run around constitutional limitations on his authority, but saying that he’s paving the way for Democrats to do it too isn’t a very convincing argument.

      1. Dubya going to war in Iraq despite public opinion being lukewarm about it, at best, appears to have been the breaking point for the Dems. Their actions since then have the hallmarks of a collective decision that they’d basically do whatever they felt like once they gained power again, and felt quite confident in doing so because they knew their media allies would be running cover for their actions.

        It’s pretty fruitless to complain at this point about a Republican not following the political Marquis of Queensbury rules. The Dems and the media have made it known for quite some time that Calvinball is now the norm, and expecting Republicans to not adjust to that environment smacks of sheer obtuseness and naivete.

    4. something both sides should take to heart.

  31. I agree that it is wrong. But conceptually it is no different than what Obama did with DACA. Hey, if Obama wants to selectively enforce immigration law, Trump can selectively enforce tax law.

    In an ideal world, Congress would see that and slap the President down for this and do the same to a Democrat who tried it. Sadly, we don’t live in that world. We live in a world were Democrats are going to continue to exercise power in the way that Obama did and likely more so no matter what Trump does. So, the choices are just live by those new rules or have the Republicans live by the old rules and Democrats by the new ones. Given the choice of two bad options, I think both sides living by the same rules is better. Maybe being the victim of this will bring the Dems to their senses. I doubt it but there is a chance. One thing is for sure, if the Republicans live by the old rules, the Democrats will never reconsider living by the new ones when they are in power.

    1. Hey, if Obama wants to selectively enforce immigration law, Trump can selectively enforce tax law.

      Flashback to 2010…

      Tony: “Hey, if Bush wants to selectively enforce immigration law, Obama can selectively enforce tax law.”

      1. Flash back to this year: USSC “If Trump wants to enforce immigration law as written, he can’t. Because Obama didn’t. “

        1. Which has what to do with Trump supporters using arguments that Obama supporters used, with the only difference being that Obama supporters said “Bush did it first!” while the Trump supporters say “Obama did it first!”?

          1. It has to do with the Supreme Court telling Tony and his flexible logic, “hold my beer!”

          2. Here is what you don’t get… You’re merely defending hypocrisy.

            The payroll tax, as this thread is discussing, is held much closer to legal as they utilized existing law. Trump didn’t go around for 3 years saying he didn’t have the power to do something, and then do it, like Obama did.

            You’re just rationalizing your one sided hatred at this point.

            The fact is that ACA is not upheld by any constitutional nor legislative standard (why Roberts ignored that question in his last ruling and instead applied a higher standard to repeal an EO than issue one).

            The Payroll tax explicitly held up at least a legislative standard, even if some don’t agree it is constitutional. Then again, the only way to argue it is unconstitutional is to believe taxing is spending. You wouldn’t be dumb enough to believe that would you?

            I left out the Unemployment Benefits in this argument as I don’t think they have a legislative nor a constitutional backing. However, WH did state they are using funds already passed this year in the 2nd relief bill who everyone admits had basically no standards or regulations written into it. But I’ll let lawyers argue that one.

            1. Hatred? Seriously?

              I’m just mocking you, John, and all the other Trump sycophants who, like the Obama sycophants during his term, justified what he did by saying the previous guy did it first.

              That’s all.

              No hatred.

              Just amusement, at your expense.

              1. You come off as incredibly stupid most of the time, FYI, so I’m glad at least you get a chuckle

                1. I’m getting another chuckle from the fact that you’re so stupid that you think you’re superior to me when you’re too stupid to see my point. And you think that makes me stupid? Haaaa ha ha ha ha ha!

                  1. Fuck off Tulpa.

                2. Disagree. sarcasmic comes off pretty intelligent most of the time.

                  1. stupid people call smart people stupid to get a “No I’m Really Smart!” reaction.

          3. Again, Trump isn’t repealing the payroll tax.

            He’s deferring it.

            As things stand, you will still owe that money eventually.

            He’s saying that if you want to get rid of it permanently, you’ll need to vote for him so he can fight to get a bill through Congress that would get rid of it.

            Come to think of it, that is like DACA.

            It really is.

            DACA is a deferment, too. And the reason Obama implemented DACA is because Congress decided not to act.

            Trump deferred payroll taxes because Congress chose not to act.

            What Trump is doing is wrong for the same reason.

            I don’t want an emperor–not even a libertarian one. That being said, if I have to pick an emperor, I’d rather have a capitalist emperor than a socialist emperor. Wouldn’t you?

            I don’t want Pinochet or Stalin, but if I had to pick one . . . I’d rather oppose Pinochet and not have to suffer Stalin’s socialism.

            1. But do you acknowledge that by accepting the “I have to pick” choice given you by the two-party system, you are settling. You are giving in to low expectations for your government.

              1. Turd Sandwich or Giant Douche? Hmmmmmm. Nope. I choose none of the above. Voting is for chumps.

                1. Me, too. There is no way I would ever vote for a Democrat or Republican.

                  1. I voted for McCain. There. I said it. I felt dirty afterwards. Like I’d gone down on a hooker or something. First and last time I voted for a D or R. Makes my skin crawl to think about it. Gross.

                    1. The last time I voted for President was when I voted for President Bush in 2000. He campaigned on replacing the welfare state with private charity. What’s not to like about that from a libertarian perspective?

                      A president is like a box of chocolates.

                    2. OK… just need a minute before I can talk to you…

                    3. So, wait, Ken, all that you wrote above about “if I had to pick one” was hypothetical? Good to know.

            2. All I’m saying is that when Obama did questionable shit, and Reason called him on it, his supporters bleated “BUSH DID IT FIRST! BUSH DID IT MORE! REASON IS A CONSERVATIVE RAG BECAUSE BUSH DID IT FIRST!”

              Now Trump supporters are doing the exact same thing, except now OBAMA DID IT FIRST. It is sadly hilarious to watch.

              1. One of the most memorable things Reason did was that photo where they morphed Bush’s face and Obama’s face together. The article was about how Obama was more or less just like Bush in way too many ways. They were right about that.

                That was a different crew. That was the crew that held an “Everybody Draw Mohammed” contest. Can you imagine them doing something that unwoke today?

                Has Reason been principled on DACA? If there’s been a principled argument from them against DACA on constitutional grounds, I haven’t seen it. I’ve seen it begrudgingly tacked onto arguments in support of DACA. That’s about it.

                Reason has moved hard to the left. We had a split in the commentariat around here where a lot of principled libertarians left in no small part because Reason’s coverage of the election in 2016 was so biased against President Trump. Their coverage has remained anti-Trump ever since, and I think a lot of people here are reacting to that–especially with an election in three months.

                It’s crunch time.

                About this time four years ago, ENB posted an article about a porn start who did gang bang videos but joined a Gloria Allred lawsuit against candidate Trump because he greeted her with a kiss on the cheek without asking permission first–and she was supposedly traumatized by the experience.

                The coverage hasn’t diverged from being anti-Trump since, and you can’t expect that not to provoke a reaction. You don’t get to troll people and then complain because they react to the trollling, and I think there’s a lot of that going on here, especially in morning links.

                1. “The coverage hasn’t diverged from being anti-Trump since, and you can’t expect that not to provoke a reaction. You don’t get to troll people and then complain because they react to the trollling, and I think there’s a lot of that going on here, especially in morning links.

                  This is a pretty good assessment, right here.

                  Personally, I find the whole situation pretty entertaining.

                2. fair enough

                3. Reason hasn’t gone anti-Trump. There are two factors that may make it seem that way:

                  – The Trump administration is currently in power. Reason is going to write a lot more about the current administration.
                  – Donald Trump is an especially vile, cretinous person. He does a lot of things deserving criticism.

                  Also, there are straight-up conservatives commenting here.
                  Not saying you, but some here.

                  1. (Hit’n’run) is a blog that seems to allow the writers a fair amount of independence and leeway. I think it’s fair to say that some of the writers have a pronounced and definite “anti-trump” bent (ENB, Boehm, Dhalmia). Other’s seem less antagonistic and just cynical in general (Gillespie, De Rugy, Slade).

                    Yeah, there’s conservatives here, and liberals, and whacko’s, and comedians. It’s why I like this place, a lot of diversity… I just try not to get too caught up in any bullshit.

              2. Reason didn’t call him on it. Reason said it was great. They loved DACA. So stop fucking lying and pretending reason called him on it. They didn’t.

                Second, which part of “this is wrong” did you not understand? He shouldn’t be able to do it. But since Obama did and his not doing it will never deter any future Democrat, then he can do it. If you don’t like that, blame Obama.

                I am sorry, you are not so stupid that you don’t understand that. You are just dishonest and refuse to and pretend I am saying something I am clearly not/.

                1. “But since Obama did and his not doing it will never deter any future Democrat, then he can do it. If you don’t like that, blame Obama.”

                  You prove my point.

                2. Reason wrote several articles criticizing Obama’s use of executive order.

    2. willing to consider both in interest of immediate tax relief.

  32. An internal Uber assessment found that this would require the company to raise prices by 20-111 percent in California, with less densely populated areas seeing larger price hikes.

    “Less densely populated areas.” IOW, the more rural parts of the state that haven’t gone full retard yet. Figures.


    “Trump saying clearly on Fox why he won’t fund USPS. ‘Now they need that money in order to make the post office work so it can take all of these millions and millions of ballots…But if they don’t get those two items that means you can’t have universal mail-in voting…‘“

    1. Do you know which branch authorizes funding? Just curious.

      1. Do you know who leads the Republican Party, which controls the Senate?

        1. That’s not the question. Which branch authorizes funding?

          1. JesseAz wasn’t really asking. He was deflecting from engaging the main point of my comment, which is that the chief executive of our country, which has a constitutionally mandated post office which plays a vital role in our elections, went on TV and confessed he doesn’t want the post office to handle mail-in voting well, for partisan reasons.

            1. No. You’re the one deflecting for refusing to answer and pretending that it’s the president.

    2. It is a silly complaint and a silly line of reasoning. The post office does not need any additional resources to handle a few tens of millions of pieces of mail.

      They handle 427 million pieces of mail every day. Much much more during the Christmas rush.

      Did anyone freak out that the post office would crumble if they had to process all of the tax returns? No.

      This whole thing is stupid from the jump. If the post office needs another bailout, it has nothing to do with ballot handling.

      1. Trump is, to White Knight’s chagrin, again using the D’s own bs argument against them

        1. Trump is publicly admitting he does not want mail-in voting to work.

          1. Because the post office isn’t getting a massive infusion of cash to handle an increase well within annual fluctuations?
            You’re becoming nonsensical.

            1. The main point has nothing to do with whether he increases funding or not. He blatantly admitted on TV that he doesn’t want the post office to handle mail-in voting well because he believes post office dysfunction will benefit his party.

          2. No one wants mail-in voting to work. They all know that no matter the outcome, the losing team will call shenanigans, claim the whole thing is illegitimate and use it to drive a deeper wedge among the populace. The Democrats and Trump want to make sure there’s a period of unrest and uncertainty leading to the results. The only losers from mail-in voting will be those silly 320 million rubes that get whipped up into a frenzy against one another over it. Who really cares about them?

      2. And my mail volume is way down, as bankrupt retailers aren’t bombarding us with ad pieces

        1. and all my bills are online, and the last letter I got was sometime around 1990.

  34. The free market in action….

    My sons’ private school, after touting for months that they’re ready to open (with a huge set of very expensive, likely overkill protocols), announced approximately 18 seconds after our worthless governor issued his latest “recommendation” that schools should not open until at least the beginning of October.

    Unhappy parents barraged the board of trustees, who then had an emergency meeting last night.

    The result? School is opening as originally planned.

    1. our more expensive private school – westminister academy – made their last minute “no, we are not opening” switch a couple of days ago.

      I figured all the other private schools would fall like dominoes. So far, they have not.

      Accountability to parents. Interesting concept.

      1. Accountability to parents is the number 2 reason we went private.

        What seems to have bothered most people, including the board, is that every parent was polled, twice, so we could tell them our preferences. We overwhelmingly wanted a return to in-person school. The first was a comprehensive questionnaire. The second, 4 or 5 weeks later, and in the midst of the media and government barrage of concern over more positive tests, while leaving out most of the pertinent information, was more of a “things have changed and we just want to make sure” type thing. Again we overwhelmingly said we want to go back. The school also had a virtual option that one could freely move between. No one was forced to send their kids to school if they were uncomfortable with it.

        Then on Monday Governor Fuckstick made his “recommendation”, and before the press conference was even over, administration had issued a letter that was clearly ready to go beforehand.

        But administration did it without consulting the board. The board found out the same time everyone else did, and they weren’t having that shit. Especially not after having woken up to a couple hundred emails blasting them.

      2. My kids public school is shut down. But the private “After School Care”, that is in a bunch of portable buildings on the school grounds remains open.

        Kids are literally going to go to the school, walking by the classrooms where teachers are cowering in fear, to the private “full day” care. They will then sit down with Chrome Books that I had to buy, and log onto zoom calls with these teachers who are sitting in in empty classrooms 150 feet away from them.

        1. That’s just plain fucked.

          Teachers, once again proving their mid-wit status.

          1. It’s not because they’re stupid mid-wits (they certainly are that, but that’s not the motivation.) It’s once in a generation leverage for the teacher’s union.

            Give us everything we want (more money and benefits, less hours and accountability) and we’ll “risk our lives” to educate (indoctrinate and babysit) your younglings.

  35. >>U.S. Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin issued a statement of his own

    begging for help in finding suitable eyewear.

  36. You guys may not believe this. But it turns out that disrespecting the national anthem isn’t universally popular with American sports fans.

    “There was a smattering of boos when players from FC Dallas and Nashville SC collectively took a knee during the national anthem before their Major League Soccer game on Wednesday in Frisco, Texas.

    Dallas defender Reggie Cannon said he was disgusted by the boos at Toyota Stadium when players and officials kneeled to call attention to racial injustice . . . . “You can’t even have support from your own fans in your own stadium,” Cannon said. “It’s baffling to me”.

    Some people watch the news media–and believe what they see! It’s baffling to me.

    If Joe Biden and Kamala Harris were at sporting event on national television, what do you think they’d do during the national anthem?

    If Joe Biden and Kamala Harris are sent to the White House, will they take a knee to protest racial injustice during a funeral at Arlington for one of our fallen heroes? Are they planning to act like the Westboro Baptist Church? If not, they should say so just to clarify their position.

    1. Standing for the national anthem is supposed to be a ritual of national solidarity. We have been told it is a player’s right to protest this ritual with another ritual of kneeling. Now players are complaining that fans are not in solidarity with their ritual. They do not like the fans protesting their protest. It is a fascinating example of cognitive dissonance.

    2. Texas rarely lets me down.

    3. Someone is baffled why disrespecting the flag and the country and the people who have served it might be booed? I read one “news” article which actually stated matter-of-factly that kneeling during the anthem is a “patriotic gesture”. No, it’s an anti-patriotic gesture, which is why it originally made an effective protest and got Kaepernick run out of the NFL. But now it’s so watered down that journalists question why US Air Force veteran Popovich didn’t kneel during the national anthem.

      1. They’re delusional. ESPN is a social justice mouthpiece. They think reality changes depending on how they frame it–along with a little intimidation. Wouldn’t want us to call you a racist, would you?

        American sports fans boo athletes for disrespecting the national anthem anyway.

        It was like this in Orwell’s Nineteen Eighty-Four:

        “The proles are freer and less intimidated than the middle-class Outer Party: they are subject to certain levels of monitoring but are not expected to be particularly patriotic. They lack telescreens in their own homes and often jeer at the telescreens that they see.

        ESPN doesn’t control reality.

        If they think disrespecting the national anthem or the flag is popular, they’re delusional. And the proles are jeering. It’s gonna hurt the media and the sports teams eventually, too. The boos would have been louder if there had been more people in the stands.

        1. The ratings have been terrible too.

          In a time where we’re all locked inside most of the time and people are dying for something, ANYTHING to watch and talk about, they somehow managed to make sports unappealing.

          Most of America isn’t really politically engaged. That’s why we have the famous 60% in the middle of undecided people, and why most of them don’t turn up on election day. They don’t think about politics outside of election season because politics do not interest them, politics only serves to introduce unneeded drama into their lives. They want to eat nachos, drink beer and watch dudes smack a ball 500 feet, which is a fine way to spend an afternoon. Athletes and ESPN took something these people liked and polluted it with politics, and now they’re surprised they’re getting booed and people are turning off their TVs.

          1. ya all this.

      2. love the escaped-irony of the paid-to-kick-ball FC Dallas player who was “pissed off” about the booing because systemic racism

        1. Player should be glad he gets paid to play a sport as shitty as soccer.

          And how DARE he criticize the fans’ protests. Unlike him, they PAID to be there and, to me, have far more of a right to express dissatisfaction.

    4. Interesting fact – here in Phoenix, our soccer team recently took a knee during a moment of silence before the anthem. Seems like a smart compromise.

      Too bad the other sports leagues cannot figure this out. As a former sports fan, I’ve pretty much stop watching sports. NBA is completely lost me, NFL is lost and even MLB is losing my attention. I vote with my dollars and none of these leagues will get my vote any longer.

      What these idiot players don’t understand is yes, kneeling during the national anthem is disrespectful to our country. Additionally, fans watch sports to escape political non-sense, not get preached at my illiterate, selfish, spoiled professional athletes. For the same reasons I don’t need to get preached at by HollyWeird.

      1. “kneeling during the national anthem is disrespectful to our country.”

        What’s amazing to me is that the left has consistently claimed that something is offensive if someone is offended by it. So when someone says something they didn’t think was racist, but the mob says it was racist, well that person is now a racist.

        Yet they also say that no one should be offended by someone kneeling during the anthem. That it’s not disrespectful to the flag or the people who fought for it. I thought no one had a right to tell me what I was allowed to be offended by? Or does that only apply to the Redskins and Chiefs?

        1. It’s Calvinball. Whatever rules are convenient at the moment are the rules.

      2. Watching sports in this environment is completely fucking lame. The whole culture of professional sports hinges on audience participation as a form of community bonding. That shit hasn’t changed since the days of the Roman gladiators.

        What’s going on now is like watching a bunch of super highly-skilled rec leagues. Without the cheering crowds to reinforce community loyalties, it’s much harder to invest oneself in the outcomes. The NBA becoming a vehicle for promoting black nationalism isn’t even the worse thing about the games, although it’s probably the most obnoxious. They’re spending billions to pander to 15% of the population, plus a contingent of self-loathing white people who think parroting the slogans makes them honorary POCs.

        1. I get the impression that major sports leagues, but especially the NBA and the NFL resent being tied to the fandoms of particular cities and regions as it limits their global appeal. They do realize at some level that it is regional pride that is the foundation of their business, but they like that fact less and less.

          1. Both the NBA and NFL are desperate to expand to include overseas franchises, and I’d concur that they seem to resent having franchises tied to playing a bunch of games in specific locations. Their ideal operating model seems to be something like the Harlem Globetrotters/Washington Generals, where they’d be a traveling league with no actual “home” games to speak of.

            This whole thing with Disney sponsoring the “bubble” is a dream come true for the NBA because they don’t have to obligate their teams to perform half their games at the home location. They play the games in this soulless, sanitized environment with no crowd interaction, and don’t have to worry about the vagaries of arena deals or franchises skipping from one place to another. It’s not the “Los Angeles Lakers” or “Denver Nuggets” anymore, for example, except as a concept.

            1. Theoretically, in a playing environment like this, they could have as many franchises as the TV money would cover, put their names through a location/nickname randomizer, and sell merchandise to gullible consoooooooomers looking for the novelty of a random team name.

          2. Just six months ago the NBA was sucking off China with regards to the Hong Kong situation (which China stole while nobody was paying attention).

      3. +1

        To some extent, we live vicariously through the players. I think football is partially has such an appeal because it even lets ol’ timers imagine what play they would call, who they would start as quarterback, etc. if they were the coach.

        I won’t pay a premium to watch a player, team, or league that disrespects the things I care about, and I don’t think people want to live vicariously through players, teams, or leagues that disrespect the things fans care about.

        Financially, they’ll have a hard time this year because of the pandemic, but it won’t just be because of the pandemic. They’re hurting their brands. Sports usually brings us together as a nation. The wealthy, the poor, the elite at Harvard, the rednecks of Arkansas, they’re all watching the same sports and rooting for or against the same teams. They’re just dividing us now. If they ran an advertisement disrespecting the flag or the national anthem, it would alienate fans, and this is alienating fans more than that would.


    Back in the People’s Democratic Republic of New Zealand, they’re getting ready for a nice long lockdown (3 weeks is the new 3 days)… and making people enter “government-managed quarantine,” which doesn’t sound like forcibly separating them from their families at all.

  38. So… I’ve come to terms with the concept of printing infinite amounts of money. My assets aren’t in cash, so it doesn’t really matter how many dollars are circulating. The value of my investments will reprice accordingly.

    Printing money is the only politically viable way to tax the middle class. The hope is that they won’t do it so fast that it triggers inflation that completely outstrips the deflationary pressures of increased productivity and technological advancement.

    It’s basically a wealth and wage tax on people whose savings are cash and wages are stagnant. Sucks to be them.

    But it’s crazy that the political winds will support a political decision to turn down $1T in pursuit of $3T. How is it not the political answer to take $1T now, and then wait and see if we need the next $1T? I don’t understand people. It’s why I’m not a politician.

    1. >>come to terms with the concept of printing infinite amounts of money

      really the only way to sleep at nite in peace.

    2. meanwhile the long-term CDs that used to pay 3 percent are renewable at 1 percent, in the face of an inflation time bomb. And people wonder why the stock market is up.

    3. Think of all the happy people who are net debtors.

      1. Yep. Inflation helps those who are in debt, and nobody in more in debt than the USG. They are simply going to inflate it away, along with your savings and labor.

  39. Biden has unintentionally revealed that he takes black voters for granted. This is him doubling down on it. If you’re black you have to vote for Harris, even if she embodies everything you’re currently protesting against.

  40. How about 0 trillion dollars?

    1. Now that’s just crazy talk.

  41. I wonder if Stefan Halper ever took an Uber or a Lyft to meet with his handlers. I wonder if Steven Schrage ever made a Tik Tom. Maybe if they had, Reason might mention them and the plot to overthrow our democracy using the police state

    1. Reason is providing you with this comment section, where you could post some explanation of and links to what you’re talking about.

      1. Fvck off, simpleton

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