The Worst Part of Election 2016? Nothing Is Over on Tuesday, Nothing!
Whether Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump becomes president, American trust and confidence in government will keep dropping. And that's a big problem.
If you think that much of anything related to politics will be settled by Tuesday's election, here's some bad news for you: Nothing that matters is really over. Not even close.
There are at least three major issues that will still be facing the country when either President Clinton or President Trump gets sworn in next January. There's no reason to believe that these issues will resolve themselves any time soon. Or that Clinton or Trump, the two most-hated presidential candidates in modern history, are particularly willing or able to address them.

1. What about economic growth?
The United States has been out of recession for seven years, one of the longest economic expansions in American history. But the average rate of growth since 2009 has been around 2 percent, making this the weakest economic recovery since 1949.
Economic growth is essential to improving wealth and standards of living—and it helps to defuse all sorts of explosive political issues, from trade to immigration to welfare. But for all of the 21st century—under George Bush and Barack Obama—economic growth has been much lower than the post-war average, helping to fuel political polarization.
Neither Hillary Clinton nor Donald Trump has articulated a plan that will actually grow the economy. Clinton will jack up taxes and spending on everything, a sure-fire way to keep the economy puttering along. Trump will add $5 trillion-plus dollars to the national debt, which will also dampen growth. According to the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget, under Clinton's scenario, national debt held by the public will grow from 77 percent of GDP to 86 percent over the next decade. Under Trump's, it will increase to 105 percent. Robust economic growth is unlikely, to say the least, under such plans.
And if the American economy doesn't improve, don't expect much else too. Economic conditions don't dictate everything, but there's a lot less anger and resentment in a society where economic growth is strong.
2. Who will we bomb next?
Hillary Clinton is a hawk's hawk who has voted for, lobbied for, or taken credit for all of our military interventions in the 21st century. Despite such actions—of more accurately, because of such actions—the world is a bigger mess than ever. At times Donald Trump sounds like he would be a relative dove and at others, he sounds like a crazy man who will kill them all and let god take his own. At the very least, just like Hillary Clinton, he's promised to increase military spending, which will keep the deep-state dynamics of interventionism exactly as they are.
Neither of them has articulated a foreign policy that will reduce international terrorism or bring calm to hot spots in the Middle East, Eastern Europe, or Asia any time soon.

3. Whom can you trust?
Trust in many major American institutions is at or near historic lows—the media, religious organizations, labor, business—you name it.
That's especially when it comes to the two major political parties and government in general. Looking at surveys going back to 1958, Pew Research concludes,
Only 19% of Americans today say they can trust the government in Washington to do what is right "just about always" (3%) or "most of the time" (16%).
Even worse, millennials—Americans between about 18 and 35 years old—aren't just the biggest generation, they are the most skeptical and least-trusting.
Who can blame them—or us? The Iraq War was sold on bad information and prosecuted poorly; President Obama's claim that his health care reform would let you keep your doctor was Politifact's Lie of the Year; and we've learned that neither Democrats nor Republicans give a rat's ass about the government spying on us. Wikileaks and others have exposed Hillary Clinton as two-faced (at best) and Donald Trump is a serial scam artist and bully. Neither can address the massive and ongoing evacuation of trust and confidence in government and politics. If anything, they will likely pour gas on the dumpster fire.
For the entirety of the 21st century (and for much of the post-World War II era), America has been moving from a high-trust society to a low-trust one. That's really bad news, especially for those of us who want a government that spends less and does less. Paradoxically, people in low-trust countries turn to government in ever-higher numbers. In a cruel and unpredictable world, we want a protector, no matter how untrustworthy. Or we just want someone we think will make sure that we get most of our slice of what we think is a shrinking pie.
In the 2010 paper "Regulation and Distrust," Philippe Aghion, Yann Algan, Pierre Cahuc, and Andrei Shleifer use World Values Survey data to help explain what they call "one of the central puzzles in research on political beliefs: Why do people in countries with bad governments want more government intervention?" In "high-trust countries," most people have positive feelings about business and government and the general level of regulation is relatively low. In "low-trust countries," the opposite is true and citizens "support government regulation, fully recognizing that such regulation leads to corruption." In low-trust countries such as Russia and the former East Germany, for instance, around 90 percent and 80 percent of people favor wage controls. In Scandinavia, Great Britain, and North American countries, where there are higher levels of trust in the public and private sectors, less than half the population does. Aghion et al. find that increased regulation sows yet more distrust, which in turn engenders more regulation.
Of course, it doesn't have to be this way. Politicians and their ideological allies can actually start acting responsibly and putting forth serious plans for reducing the size, scope, and spending of government. Gary Johnson and Bill Weld did do precisely this—the two former governors spoke not of zero government but a smaller government that did fewer things more effectively—but they hardly set the electoral map on fire, regardless of what will certainly be a record showing for the Libertarian Party. Figures such as Sen. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) have refused to fall in line with tired and fading party loyalties by calling for a hearing on Supreme Court nominee Merrick Garland and voting for his party's candidate. Such characters are few and far between, but there are enough elected officials in each party to at least push, I don't know, an actual budget process forward.
Until the major parties start governing in the light of day and especially stop nominating candidates who are disliked by majorities of Americans, don't expect much to change. Except for things to get even nastier, at least until 2020.
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Actually, for a libertarian, that's not a problem. That's a good thing, and it's high time Americans understood that the government is not worth of either trust or confidence.
What I can never wrap my head around, is how so many people can be distrustful of the government, yet half and possibly even more than half the country leans Democrat, ie the more untrustworthy government people.
It's like eating from a bowl of shit. Complaining that you're eating shit. Then continuing to spoon the shit into your own mouth.
Maybe it's more like "government is crooked, let's make sure it's crooked on behalf of me and my buddies, otherwise it will be crooked against us."
ding ding ding
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I hope it's just a reflection of the two-party system and they would theoretically be in favor of limiting the expansion of government autonomy if they felt they had a real legitimate option stumping for those things that didn't repulse them on social issues.
No. it is tribal politics all the way down.
Note that the victim groups don't want freedom, they want their turn on top.
This is a zero sum game. It is enough to make me vote for the bad guy because I don't get to be the good guy.
s/crooked/coercive and intrusive
I think this is the end game for all coercive governments. The initial expansion is slow, but still there, because when it's small, any politician railing against Big Brother just comes off as a kook. Once government has expanded enough for people to recognize the problem, they also recognize it's too late to roll it back, so better to try to rig the system in their favor because everyone else is doing the same.
People distrust the government because the correct people aren't in charge. If the correct people (those who agree with me) are in charge, everything will be great.
But I wouldn't think that "the people who want to expand the corrupt government that I hate and can't trust" are the people who agree with me who I'd want in charge.
For decades, Republicans have largely ignored blacks, Hispanics, immigrants, and welfare recipients, and they have actively pushed out homosexuals and atheists. On the other hand, Republicans have kowtowed to the demands of Christian conservatives, and have not objected to the votes of some rather questionable groups. Those choices may have worked in the 80's, but demographics being what they are, they aren't working anymore.
Republicans need to kick the dwindling Christian conservatives (who are hostile to Republican values anyway) over to the Democrats, where they belong. And then Republicans need to actively court minorities of all stripes, focusing on traditional Republican values of individual liberties and personal responsibility.
You would think a libertarian writer would understand this.
Who's the "libertarian writer", Nick? lol
...The United States has been out of recession for seven years....
Nick actually believes this.
Does reason even pretend to be a libertarian sight at this point?
Libertarian doesn't mean the same thing it used to. I would advise against self-labeling as such. Might not be very healthy when the civil war gets crankin'.
I think the proper term is "classical liberal" or "Enlightenment liberal". The good thing is: that can't change. Kant put it pretty nicely:
I blame the Sherman Anti-Trust Act of 1890.
I blame the Liberals allowing the fucking progtards to steal the name.
Some people think Libertarians are some kind of Nazis. They don't know history and don't see Liberty in the name.
Umm did you read the whole article? Specifically this line:
The trouble is that for persons other than the few most libertarian, that distrust & lack of confidence tends to make things worse for all.
Well, there's nothing else to it then. We should bomb Russia and get it over with quickly. It was nice knowing you, World.
On the contrary. I have decided to make popcorn.
If Russia overruns Easter Europe, that really falls on Eastern Europe. Not our half assed politicians.
Don't worry, our half-assed politicians will get us involved somehow. Keeping the troops dying for the last 15 years is not going to continue itself.
This is why I plan to be drunk on Tuesday night.
"Whether Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump becomes president, American trust and confidence in government will keep dropping"
Mr. Gillespie, I hope Americans lose their trust and confidence in government.
The big risk is that if we elect Hillary Clinton, the American people will lose faith in the rule of law. Why would anyone have faith in the rule of law if Hillary Clinton can accept money from foreign governments while she's the Secretary of State--and still be elected President?
Nothing undermines the rule of law like someone who blatantly makes a mockery of the rule of law--and gets elected to be the executive anyway. That is the very means by which republics have become tyrannies throughout history.
When people lose their faith in the rule of law, they start looking for strongmen to protect their interests. If average Americans can't depend on the rule of law, if our leaders can't even be held responsible for flaunting the rule of law by the voters, then there's no point in pushing for higher minded principles on free speech, free markets, the Second Amendment, free trade, crony capitalism, etc. Politics just becomes a question of might makes right.
You know, Ken, I would tell you to stop posting the same thing over and over, except that I agree with you, and don't understand why more people don't understand the danger that this corruption represents.
I appreciate that.
I wouldn't keep repeating it if it weren't so important for people to understand, and there's only one more day!
Also, Nick Gillespie keeps saying some of the same things--especially about why we shouldn't vote for Trump, etc.
He keeps asking the same rhetorical questions--and my rhetorical answers remain the same.
Rewarding a politician who disregards the rule of law with the legitimacy of elections is how republics transform into tyrannies. That's the means by which that happens.
Julius Caesar crosses the Rubicon, and everyone applauds but Cato.
The Roman senate kept meeting for another 600 years. We won't know when we've officially become an empire. We'll continue on with elections and the trappings of our democracy long after we've stopped functioning as a Republic of laws. It's just that historians hundreds of years from now looking back will say, "Oh, that time Clinton's legitimacy no longer depended on following the rule of law--maybe that's a good spot to draw the line between republic and empire".
Some people refuse to look at the long term consequences. We can survive a buffoon for 4 years. Electing Clinton takes us down the path where the "law" becomes something to be ignored when inconvenient and to be respected only when it proves a useful cudgel to beat your opponents over the head with.
Why would the American people have faith in the rule of law? Why have they ever had faith in the rule of law? Our government violates what is supposed to be the highest law of the land with utter impunity. Are politicians put in prison or even punished at all when they violate the Constitution? No. There is extremely little rule of law, much like there is no representative republic.
It isn't like being pregnant.
Imagine if the only practical way to achieve libertarian goals were through a libertarian dictator.
If "libertarian dictator" seems like an impossible contradiction, then you're starting to understand the problem I'm pointing out. Our best, reasonable hope becoming like some version of Pinochet is what we want to avoid.
To whatever extent the American people support the rule of law, that is the extent of the foundation upon which we can be libertarian. Yeah, to whatever extent, it has been popular at various time to undermine certain rights with the law.
We don't want to lose that foundation to erosion, but this is fundamentally worse than that.. Giving Hillary Clinton an election win after she trashed the rule of law--and everyone knows it--is effectively giving her a mandate to ignore the rule of law.
We're not talking about abusing people's rights through eminent domain.
We're no longer talking about what the laws should be.
We're talking about whether they should apply to our rulers.
Isn't applying the law to our rulers the very linchpin of our rights? "Congress shall make no law" is an important part of the First Amendment--for instance.
You're talking about whether various laws and leaders have violated our rights in the past.
I'm talking about the process by which a leader violating our rights becomes irrelevant. That happens when we reward a leader with an election win despite publicly undermining the rule of law.
Welcome to the real world.
Politics is not primarily about rational decision making, morality, justice, democracy, liberty, or the rule of law.
What's playing out right now is the product of a combination of factors: the Internet, the US political system, rapid technological change, etc. If you want to nudge politics in one direction or another in the future, appealing to "the rule of law" just isn't going to cut it.
Hugo Chavez wasn't so dangerous just because he was an authoritarian socialist who flaunted the rule of law. He was dangerous because he was an authoritarian who flaunted the rule of law--and won elections despite flaunting the rule of law anyway.
Now, not even the people who opposed him want to replace his successor with the rule of law anymore. They just want a strongman who isn't a socialist ideologue and better suits their preferences.
If Hillary Clinton wins on Tuesday, we're in for some big changes.
I may be wrong, but my hope is as follows. When Americans start seeing government as being faithless wrt the rule of law, they take a different approach than the Venezuelans. There is a strong tradition of personal autonomy in the U.S. I personally will do as I have always done. I will largely ignore government. (easy for me to do, as I live way way way out in the sticks) Even the leftiest lefty in the U.S. is more personally autonomous than your average Venezuelan. My hope is than the more transparently corrupt our government is, the more Americans turn away from said government. Libertarian Moment or some such.
+1 Galt's Gulch
I agree with you on your above post to ken. I would be tired of hearing about it if it weren't so damn correct.
+1 Galt's Gulch
Kinda makes me smile. I have a huge (catholic style huge) family, we own quite a bit of land and livestock, and quite an arsenal to defend it with.
Earlier this week, I made the case in historical terms.
This is how it happened in ancient Rome.
This is how it happened under Bismark.
This is how it happened under Putin.
This is how it happened in Venezuela.
This is what is happening the Philippines with Duerte.
At some point, we have to start suspecting these results are cross cultural and consistent throughout history. You give someone the legitimacy of an election after they disregard the rule of law, and you've basically given them a mandate to disregard the rule of law.
Hillary will have executive privilege, the power to pardon, direct control of the Department of Justice, the bully pulpit, and the sympathy of the media. Her undermining the rule of law shouldn't surprise anyone.
I don't think there's anything about our tradition or culture that protects us from this. It just hasn't really happened here before--that a President has been elected despite and after having disregarded the rule of law.
Teapot Dome didn't become public knowledge until after Harding's death. I have a hard time imagining him being reelected after that came to light, but, regardless, he died before that could happen.
Nixon resigned, but what if he'd been reelected after Watergate became common knowledge?
This hasn't happened in the U.S. before, but everywhere it does happen, we tend to see the same results--cross culturally and throughout history. It's new territory for us, but it's the same as it ever was.
You are probably correct. I only hold put hope that after tuesday, maybe America is different. This country is different than any other founded. Most Americans, even stupendously retarded socialists/leftists/commies/etc, still have an idea of what personal freedom is. I would like to think that the amount of freedom we all collectively enjoy in this country has given our population an anti blatant tyranny gene than will show up at the polls sooner rather than later. Perhaps, a truly transparently corruptt government will inflame that gene.
maybe not, but hopefully so.
It's happened in cities in the US plenty, & even some whole states occasionally.
Unfortunately, it's more likely there will be a minority who will want to do as you say, but the majority will not allow it.
Sorry to be a pedant, but it's "flouted."
But it's so much fun to visualize someone "flaunting the constitution".
Please learn the difference between flaunt and flout.
flaunt
verb
display (something) ostentatiously, especially in order to provoke envy or admiration or to show defiance.
"newly rich consumers eager to flaunt their prosperity"
synonyms: show off, display ostentatiously, make a (great) show of, put on show/display, parade;
flout
verb
openly disregard (a rule, law or convention).
"these same companies still flout basic ethical practices"
synonyms: defy, refuse to obey, disobey, break, violate, fail to comply with, fail to observe, contravene, infringe, breach, commit a breach of, transgress against; More
"Please learn the difference between flaunt and flout."
Blow it out your ass.
Kim Jong-un won with 100%. He's not above the law, he is the law.
and a God. Don't forget that.
+1 Judge Dredd
I'm going to Austin TX this week. I've never been before -- any recommendations (for things downtown especially, near convention center).
Get drunk and goad a hobo into a knife fight.
I think he was looking for something more specific to Austin. Have the hobo dress up like Stevie Ray Vaughn.
Franklin for BBQ (the wait "should" be less than the hideous 4-5 hours it is on weekends.) LA Bbq if you don't feel like waiting that long.
Casino El Camino on 6th used to make a hell of a hamburger. Fun gothy bar to drink in while you wait for the burger.
I've liked Austin Beer Garden Brewing company and Jester King. Blue Owl Brewing is great for sour beer. Silly vending policy---they don't do by the glass pours, it's some Byzantine club membership thing or other. Beer is tasty though. Really though, there are about thirty or so breweries in Austin. Hard to find a bad one.
I've liked the art museum at UT; I think it's the Ransom. Decent modern art selection.
"Whom" can you trust?
Seriously?
Your Fillipna maid.
It's accusative.
It could have been "[Whom] will we bomb next?" too.
SJW has fit over pro-Israel sign on store window:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnE1YULrqxY
That store owner is fucking awesome. If I knew where he was and was anywhere near him I'd make sure to shop there.
I guaran-damn-tee you that the woman has never once stepped foot inside that store before.
I like the part where Princess Smartphone decreed that that Israel is guilty of genocide. Yes, Israel waged such a horrible genocide on the 700,000 Palestinians in 1947 that there are only 4.5 million left today.
oh my god, that chick sounded exactly like the woman I am currently datiing. Same college she used to teach at, too. Holy shit, that's it, time for the break.
?I don't care if you don't want to shop here. I've been here since 1986. Lots of people have decided that over the years. That's their prerogative.
?Wow. Like just wow. You don't care? That's like really sad and pathetic and says a lot about you, like you're just omg I can't even.
?Touch?. I'll take down the sign.
Here, enjoy some more bathos from Clinton:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hCIVB1xDhk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2h-42YsYWZM
I hate you for linking to this. The Story of Us video actually includes the Supreme's allowing gay marriage as if Hillary had anything to do with it.
"The Story of Us video actually includes the Supreme's allowing gay marriage as if Hillary had anything to do with it."
But surely you're not implying that Clinton is being dishonest!
[discreetly pushes the Independent Thought Alarm button]
Who likes funny pictures?
The problem with that is that it's still not OK to refuse service based on religion. So, Christians want to be able to discriminate with impunity while enjoying the protection of anti-discrimination laws.
I hope Trump wins. But if not I'm rioting with the Trumpkins - it might be our last chance before Hitlary sics her police state goons on us.
Jill Stein approves this message.
Hilary's ad claiming that you should vote for her because Trump degrades women seems to ignore the fact that she and Huma are the definition of enablers.
It is Hillary's team that shares computers with pedophiles and belittles the victims of sexual assault.
Wtf is wrong with people?
Truth =/= the whole truth =/= nothing but the truth.
Of course, Hillary doesn't spend much time with the first two, and ANY politician spends a LOT of doing the opposite of three.
ARRGGG The Broncos are just stinking up the place, bad. Also, fuck whoever becomes president, they are going to be either a crook or a conman, a liar or a dissembler, a totalitarian or an authoritarian. What difference, at this point, does it make?
I don't think Trump is smart enough to really screw things up and there will be a lot of resistance to anything very dopy.
I'm going to miss Biden:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Jf17Yo7hBM
Ah, memes
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I never believed for a second that anything would change after the election. But for whatever reason, when I say or write my opinion, it's equated with the destruction of democracy itself, or discouraging people from voting. Are the other people who have left comments on this article doing the same by simply commenting? No.
In the past, I've voted in certain elections and have chosen not to vote in others. I've chosen not to vote in this one. It is still my right, isn't it? I've never heard that choosing not to vote is a form of sedition.
Where have all the anti-war democrats gone?
Gone to support WarBama and now Clinton
every one
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1) Economic growth that the US enjoyed the last 100 years was a product of two things - the massive increase in technology that saw a breathtaking increase in productivity per person, and the fact after 1945, pretty much the whole "advanced" world had just blown itself to pieces - except, that is, for the US. We've always been a bit of a boorish and cloddish lot, but for several decades we were the only game in town. We couldn't help but be at the top of the heap despite ourselves. Technological advances simply can't return the same level of incremental growth that it used to, and the rest of the world has long caught up on competing against us and our market share eroded.
2) Why are we dropping bombs? See #1. Particularly in terms of the Welfare/Warfare cycle, as we've made ever increasing promises to be paid "next Tuesday".
3)You get nothin' for nothin'
Tell me who can you trust
We got what you want
And you got the lust
If you want blood, you got it
If you want blood, you got it, and See #2
We should not be dropping bombs on the Middle East. We need to drop bombs on Europe and China and any other competitors. This would solve two problems. First, we eliminate the competition. Second, we create a great deal of demand. The economy would be booming for decades. /prog logic
Ok, why is any of this a surprise? No election, no revolution, no bureaucratic brainstorm, no coronation will ever bring about a long term solution to the concatenation of problems that is human society. It. Just. Isn't. POSSIBLE.
Shrillary and Trump may be selling the idea that it is; most politicians do.In my adult life I think I have seen one Presidential candidate who understood that he was going to get four to eight years during which he could maybe solve some problems in the short term, set some others up for possible solution later, and that he would accomplish one half the square root of fuck all if he tried to fix everything. That man was Ronald Reagan, and he is notable in that he is also the only President I can recall who did't appear to age thirty years in his short term in office.
Unless we choose to commit mass suicide and leave the earth to the cockroaches, there are going to be problems, always.
RE: The Worst Part of Election 2016? Nothing Is Over on Tuesday, Nothing!
The worst part of the election of 2016 is that either a socialist slaver or a fascist is going to be president.
1. What recovery? The books are cooked and the fix is in. Labor participation, welfare of all types, and real wealth production are all headed in the wrong direction.
2. Hillary will certainly do her best to get us in a shooting war with Russia. Other bombing will continue with zeal regardless of figurehead.
3. Trust? Hillary doesn't even know the meaning of the word, except as a thing to con people out of. Trump? The jury is still out.
I was hoping that Trump could disrupt the bureaucracy in DC and totally shake things up, forcing wherever possible, term limits, other rice bowl bureaucracy collusion. My own small effort to try to minimize bureaucracy is contained in this blog, although I sometimes deviate from outsourcing. : http://bit.ly/1oAQrs1
A sad, but I think unfortunately an all to accurate picture.
"Trust in government is a problem" - you kiddin' me?!
I trust that when Clinton wins that she will:
- use the Federal Government to target her enemies like the Democrats did using the IRS against the Tea Party.
- continue the practice of Pay to Play she and Bill have mastered
- give our tax money to her friends like Obama did with the Green Energy Scams
- will use the bully pulpit to beat Republicans and conservatives will a will media to cheer her on.
- She will continue to lie to us about what is going on, not be transparent.
"Figures such as Sen. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) have refused to fall in line with tired and fading party loyalties by calling for a hearing on Supreme Court nominee Merrick Garland and voting for his party's candidate."
Sorry Nick but Flake is just a political coward. He voted against increased background checks for gun purchases in 2013 and took heat for it. So this year he votes for "No Fly, No Buy". He's moved by political winds and can't be trusted beyond the next opinion poll.
As a libertarian, I don't think it's a problem at all that people don't trust government. In fact, I think it's a very good development.
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