Feds Want to Further Redact Drone Memo, CIA Goes Social, Oklahoma Repeals Common Core: P.M. Links

• 

  Defence Images

  The Justice Department is, predictably enough, asking the courts to redact more information from the drone memo that details the government's justification for assassinating American citizens overseas without a trial.

• The CIA has started an official Twitter account and Facebook page to provide more avenues to spit out talking points that aren't to be trusted.
• The Charles Koch Foundation and Koch Industries Inc. are donating $25 million to fund scholarships to the United Negro College Fund.
• Common Core education standards have been repealed in Oklahoma. The state will return to standards set in 2010 and develop new standards by 2016.
• Presidents Barack Obama and Vladimir Putin had a brief chat in France at a luncheon for the 70th anniversary of D-Day.
• John Meis, the student who disarmed the gunman who attacked Seattle Pacific University, killing one and injuring two others, is being hailed as a hero. Meis subdued the shooter with pepper spray as he was attempting to reload. 

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Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

The Charles Koch Foundation and Koch Industries Inc. are donating $25 million to fund scholarships to the United Negro College Fund.

Nice try, but NO ONE IS BUYING IT.

[Brandon]

Goddammit!

[Auric Demonocles]

This is obviously an attempt to literally buy blacks.

[Almanian!]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

*faints*

[Andrew S.]

I'm sure if you troll the HuffPo comments on their story on this you'd see somebody saying that.

(Not me. I'm not quite that much of a masochist.)

[Certified Public Asskicker]

I went to Wapo.

A lot of "mere pennies!" comments.

[Brett L]

Just because they scrabble for crumbs from their perceived TOP. MEN, they assume everyone does.

[Dances-with-Trolls]

A lot of "mere pennies!" comments

Truly. I'm sure that there are dozens of HuffPo commenters that have already donated more.

[GILMORE]

"Andrew S.|6.6.14 @ 4:39PM|#

I'm sure if you troll the HuffPo comments on their story..."

Its pretty bad even @ the WaPo

Paraphrasing - "they were surprised to find they they received no actual Negroes for their $25m"

[Ted S.]

A Koch is a tertible thing to waste.

(OK, I know that's not how the name is pronounced....)

[Sansos]

How do you pronounce the name, anyways, I've always called them Kocks, or is it Koke.

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

Rhymes with coke.

[C. Anacreon]

Nikki, you ought to be ashamed. It doesn't rhyme with coke, it is a homophone with coke!

[Mickey Rat]

She is the wurst.

[Ted S.]

Nikki, of course, would know about coke.

[Sansos]

Thanks Nikki you're the worst.

[SForza]

I knew a female Koch Fellow (they exist!) that pronounced it "cock." She loved her some cock fellowship.

[Rhywun]

I say it "kotch", as in Ed.

[R C Dean]

I thought it was pronounced "Hitler".

[Whahappan?]

OK, if we're going to go that route, I thought it was pronounced "throatwarbler mangrove."

[Red Rocks Rockin]

"OBVIOUSLY THEY'RE TRYING TO USE THEIR ILL-GOTTEN GAINS IN A WAY THAT THEY HOPE NO ONE WILL NOTICE THEIR EVIL DEALINGS!!"

/SWPL shitlib

[PD Scott]

There was a GA Public TV documentary on Margaret Mitchell last year that I found very interesting. One of the things she did after GWTW was secretly fund the education of black medical students.

I'm sure the Perpetually Outraged would just say she was acting out of guilt over her pro-slavery tome.

[BiMonSciFiCon]

The CIA has started an official Twitter account and Facebook page to provide more avenues to spit out talking points that aren't to be trusted.

Hopefully their sarcasm detective is well-tuned.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The NSA is finally going to know what the CIA is up to.

[Almanian!]

Their sarc detection works as well as Fast N Furious, so...let that be your guide.

[BiMonSciFiCon]

Detector* I got a bit sloppy trying to beat the wizard of the AM/PM links.

[Brandon]

John Meis, the student who disarmed the gunman who attacked Seattle Pacific University, killing one and injuring two others, is being hailed as a hero. Meis subdued the shooter with pepper spray as he was attempting to reload.

HuffPo is waiting until he reveals his political preferences before deciding his "hero" status.

[Almanian!]

Already read on the Tweeterz that he's an NRA "supporter" and has guns...maybe carries sometimes.... (but wasn't when he confronted the guy, cause he's all respectful of the rules, so he wasn't carrying on campus).

So - an evil Teathuglihadiracist Kochlover.

[PD Scott]

"Why, maybe he enticed the gunman on to campus so he could play hero!"

[MJGreen]

"Good thing he didn't bring his gun, or dozens more would've been shot!"

[Christophe]

Explains why he'd be carrying pepper spray:

Wants to be armed, wants to be law-abiding, gets the most effective weapon he's allowed to carry.

[thom]

I've been assured this kind of vigilante justice cannot be tolerated. He should have called the police and waited for them to come and defuse the situation. This is the kind of difficult situation that needs to be left to the professionals. Just because he got lucky this one time doesn't mean we should let him off the hook.

[Whahappan?]

Poe's law in action.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Meis subdued the shooter with pepper spray as he was attempting to reload.

Hope he was licensed to carry that.

[jesse.in.mb]

Presidents Barack Obama and Vladimir Putin had a brief chat in France at a luncheon for the 70th anniversary of D-Day.

Did Putin ride in shirtless, save some geese and generally cow Obama with his staged manliness?

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

So are you saying...you want Putin?

[jesse.in.mb]

I'm torn. I really dislike his nose, but subjugating him might be fun.

[Brandon]

I don't know that he's into fat chicks.

[Mad Scientist]

Oh no you di'nt!

[entropy_factor]

KA-BOOM

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

Yeah, I know what you mean. Well, I'll take him if you want. I'm sure he would take me horseback riding and shit like that. ROMANTISCH!

[jesse.in.mb]

Yeah, but he'll expect you to wear a Putin mask during sex.

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

I can make sacrifices. GGG and shit.

[Ted S.]

I was going to ask if that turned Jesse on, but this is why Nikki is the worst.

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

I think you mean "this is why jesse has terrible judgment." Putin is going to be CRAZY in bed.

[Brett L]

I'm going to suggest your hot/crazy line needs adjusting.

[jesse.in.mb]

^This

[Warty]

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/a.....imir_putin

[110 Lean]

Is the Internet the greatest thing ever or what?

[Rhywun]

It is when it isn't behind a register-wall. Harrumph.

[Red Rocks Rockin]

Why do think Obama was shown doing something resembling curls in the gym this week?

[jesse.in.mb]

Because he wanted to seem like a noodly effete intellectual compared to the brutish Putin?

[Rhywun]

"Mister Putin, I challenge you to fisticuffs!"

[Red Rocks Rockin]

All we need is Kerry Green to play the common love interest and we'd have an 80s teen flick on our hands.

[Brett L]

He was a good dog. This story made my eyes sweat.

"Toby stopped when he got to me and turned and faced right into the bear. It actually overran him and just kind of caught him in the hind end."

[Corning]

Wait so the dog agitated the bear then kited him to the man then fought the bear....

It seems to me if the dog was not there at all there would not have been a problem.

[Brett L]

Seems like the dog could have kept running...

[Bobarian]

The fact that there were bear cubs there meant Chris was pretty well fucked.

Toby did likely save him from a mauling, at the least.

[Warty]

Poor puppy, but he didn't have to die. Going out in bear country without the means to kill a bear seems pretty irresponsible to me, especially since these people knew there was a troublesome bear in the neighborhood.

[Brandon]

without the means to kill a bear...

How do you leave your fists at home?

[Warty]

I once chased off a bear that wanted my food by throwing rocks at it and mock-charging it. I sure fucking wished I had a pistol, though.

[wareagle]

you can chase them off by making noise in the mountains of NC, too, but those are brown bears who have figured out that humans are not usually going to hurt them. No grizzlies and even with the browns, the ones with cubs tend to be left alone.

[Warty]

Yeah, it was a pussy black bear and it didn't have any cubs. If either of those conditions were different, it could have been bad.

[Brandon]

You could've, you know, given him the food.

[Warty]

WHAT'S MINE IS MINE

[grrizzly]

Try chasing me off.

[Warty]

No, with grizzlies, you're supposed to curl into a ball and try not to scream too much. I don't fuck with animals of that type, thank you very much.

[jesse.in.mb]

How do you tell the difference between a black bear and a grizzly?

You bop it on the head and climb a tree. If it climbs up after you and mauls you it's a black bear, if it knocks the tree down and mauls you it's a grizzly.

[Brandon]

Also, grizzlies are brown.

[grrizzly]

Black bears can be brown too.

[robc]

Stealing jokes from Wizards of the Coast?

[jesse.in.mb]

Stealing jokes from Wizards of the Coast?

Wait, who?

If it was me, I did so unknowingly. Someone told me that in the '80s and I thought it was funny.

[Brett L]

With grizzlies, my plan is to shit myself and hope I smell too rotten to be food.

[jesse.in.mb]

Oddly that's what you're supposed to do if you're being raped and don't have a pistol, no?

[fish]

Bad news Brett....I once watched a bear dig through a garbage can at a campground I stayed at...the staff hadn't bothered to make the nightly trash run because it was the evening of their summer staff party...and thoroughly enjoy the contents of my two year olds diaper.

[gimmeasammich]

Actually Warty, with grizzlies there is only one way that it's done.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FEQKQXmoC4

[B.P.]

Browns and grizzlies are the same.

[Brandon]

Maybe you need to do more squats.

[110 Lean]

Fending off bear (@ 7:58)

[110 Lean]

I've seen this video many times and always feel bad for the bear, who no doubt is thinking, "Why are they throwing shit at me when I'm just doing what the directer told me to do?"

[Pope Jimbo]

That is the video they make you watch before they give you your entry permit to the BWCA isn't it?

We always watched that and laughed while telling the rookie in our group, that he was the bear private and it was his job to chuck shit at the bear.

[Warty]

That was the first thing we tried. It was not impressed by us waving our hands above our heads like idiots. Throwing the first rock at it made it think maybe it didn't want our beef jerky and dried apples after all, and when I charged at it, it decided it wanted to be someplace else.

[Brandon]

I'm sure SF could do something with this...

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

Warty had a pocket full of horse, fucked the shit out of bears, threw a knife into Heaven and could kill with a stare?

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

*horses

[Bobarian]

The old joke is, to defend from bear attack you should:

1. wear bells so the bears hear you coming and will not be surprised.

2. Carry pepper spray to chase off bears who get close.

3. Look for bear sign. Black bears leave prints about the size of a human hand. Their scat consists of berries and vegetation. Grizzlies leave prints bigger than your foot.

Their scat has a peppery odor and will have bells in it.

[Mad Scientist]

I haven't heard that one in a while. Love it!

[Fist of Etiquette]

I watched my dog chase a bear into the woods once. He charged at the bear full speed and it became apparent to me he wasn't stopping no matter how much I yelled at him, and the bear just stood there until it realized the same thing. It took off and dove into the woods with the dog in its heels. No cubs so I guess the bear didn't see the point of a fight. I don't know what the dog was thinking. The bear wasn't small.

[PD Scott]

"You see? We keep telling you dogs are nigh unstoppable killing machines and you call us puppy murderers! Clearly your dog was on PCP! Stop resisting!"
/law enforcement professional

[Ted S.]

My last dog was terrified of bears. If I tried to take her for a walk and there was a bear further up the trail, she's stop and wouldn't move at all.

And then there was the cairn terrier my parents had that would have chased after anything.

[Fist of Etiquette]

On the adjoining land my cousin owns had a giant pit that he would toss refuse from his business into, and I would use to get rid of my trash also. (We would burn it and then haul away for scrap the metal that was left.) Anyway, the day the dog chased the bear, he and I had made the walk to the pit to toss my trash in, when I spot a huge bear on the opposite side munching on someone else's trash. Not wanting to make the walk all the way back still holding my trashbags, I eased up to throwing distance and tossed more in for him to eat. He didn't care that I was there.

The dog was sniffing around the pit and had no idea there was a bear 15 feet away. On the walk back was the other bear that he did see.

[BiMonSciFiCon]

John Meis, the student who disarmed the gunman who attacked Seattle Pacific University, killing one and injuring two others, is being hailed as a hero. Meis subdued the shooter with pepper spray as he was attempting to reload.

Progressives everywhere are torn. On the one hand, he didn't have a gun. On the other, he didn't wait for the cops to show up, and he prevented a shooting which they could have politicized.

[Auric Demonocles]

Imagine how awful it would have been if it's been a gun instead of pepper spray!

[fish]

....and he prevented a shooting which they could have politicized.

There is no greater crime.....

[Brandon]

Presidents Barack Obama and Vladimir Putin had a brief chat in France at a luncheon for the 70th anniversary of D-Day.

"This would be a great gig if it weren't for those damn citizens."

"Totally."

[Brett L]

"Hey, Vlad, what do you think of D-Day??

"You were lucky to be fighting Germans and not Finns."

[Bobarian]

"Hey, Vlad, what do you think of D-Day??"

You lost 3000 soldiers in one day? We called that a good day on the Eastern Front.

[C. Anacreon]

"Vlad, this World War II stuff makes me think, did you ever picture yourself as being on the show Hogan's Heroes?

I see you as being Colonel Klink, amiright?

You'd think I might picture myself as Kinchloe the microphone guy, but no, I would probably be more like Corporal LeBeau. You know, the little Frenchie who was also a good cook."

[Fist of Etiquette]

The Charles Koch Foundation and Koch Industries Inc. are donating $25 million to fund scholarships to the United Negro College Fund.

Yeah, they would donate to something with that word in it.

[Brett L]

Holy Fuck! Auburn women so drunk she sleeps through train running over her.

That's right, 22-year-old Lynsey Horne of Salem, Alabama, the woman that police found, was sound asleep on the railroad tracks, apparently unaware that a train had passed over her.

[Certified Public Asskicker]

Ms. Horne was only so lucky, however. As AL.com reports, she was arrested and charged with public intoxication and disorderly conduct, the disorderly conduct because of the disruption she caused

She's lucky to be alive, so the state can fuck with her.

[Brandon]

I wonder if this is really Alabama?

"Sleep Woman Ran Over By Train"

Yep.

[Max Power]

I sometimes think when people get hit by trains it's got to be some kind of natural selection thing. If you get hit by a train (and didn't have your foot stuck in the tracks or something) maybe it's better that you're out of the gene pool.

[Brett L]

She got missed by the train. Does fitting between the rails and the train with room to spare count as an evolutionary advantage?

[Max Power]

Ah, I read running over her as running her over. If you're dumb enough to fall asleep on train tracks, something else will probably take you out sooner or later.

[Brandon]

From the one picture I've seen, I'm gonna say...yes. Evolutionarily advantaged. Although that can be hard to determine at 22 without seeing pictures of the mom.

[Bobarian]

Well in Alabama, a 22 yr old without kids is considered an old maid.

She's old enough to be a grammaw.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The Justice Department is, predictably enough, asking the courts to redact more information from the drone memo that details the government's justification for assassinating American citizens overseas without a trial.

They own stock in black magic markers.

[Almanian!]

NOT FIRST! AGAIN!

*nailed it*

[jesse.in.mb]

Have we claimed Al yet?

If no, dibs.

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

Done.

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

You two really are dividing us all up!

*looks for escape route*

[jesse.in.mb]

Please, you know you want to go to camp jesse. I make delicious baked goods.

[Brandon]

Hey Scott, can you delete all the comments above this?

[Warty]

The amazing thing about all these chickenshit mass shooters is how easily they give up when someone, anyone, shows any resistance at all. It's just too bad the guy didn't have a pistol or he might have been able to take him down before he stopped to reload. Of all the days for Epi not to be on campus trying to date-rape college chicks.

[Corning]

Pacific is a private school way above Epi's class...

He cruses the UW campus for tail.

[Warty]

Chloroform is the great leveler. UH OH RAPE JOKE

[db]

The fact that "time to.reload" is time enough to attack.and.stop.the shooter is proof that these shooters.have no.real.experience.with guns and practicing. I.can reload a semi pistol in about 1.2 seconds if there is.a.mag on.my belt. A revolver takes.me about 2.5, but with.skill, one.can reload.a.wheelgun in the.same.time.or.less than a semi.

[Notorious G.K.C.]

Here's the subhead on the Seattle shooting article:

"Unlike other recent mass shootings, the assailant at Seattle Pacific University was not armed with semi-automatic weapons. The time to reload gave college senior Jon Meis a critical opening to take down the gunman and prevent additional deaths."

[Almanian!]

Yes, it's always the "reloading" that trips them up!

Nothing but single-shot weapons are good enough for American subje....er....citizens!

[Mad Scientist]

This is where Hollywood's endless magazine has brought us.

[MJGreen]

Perfected by The Walking Dead season 2, when a shotgun is shown firing 20+ times in succession.

[Warty]

Jesus Christ. "I'm a reporter! I don't know anything about this subject! That means I'm completely qualified to write analyses about this subject!"

I thought everyone knew that Australia banned pump-actions for the same reason they banned semi-autos. Apparently not.

[Michael]

Wow, semi-auto weapons don't need to be reloaded? That's because they have the thing that goes up, right?

[Sudden]

You don't have a belt-feed mechanism for your Glock 34? Psh, amateur

[Sansos]

Is this article implying that semi-autos can pull bullets from the ?ther?
That's pants on head retarded.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Priceless, semi-automatic =/= high capacity magazines. Interchangeable boogeymen.

[Corning]

his friends paint a portrait of a studious, athletic, and gentle young man with deep Christian faith

oh oh.

[Ted S.]

Sounds like a definition of Obama, or at least the way his sycophants describe him.

[Brandon]

Hey, can *you* curl 35-kg dumbbells?

[Corning]

err the christian in this case was the Hero who stopped the shooter.

I am wondering if the shooter was anti-christian.

I knew Pacific was a "Christan" school...but i thought it might have been like Noterdame which isn't really Christan and not really filled with christians...sounds like Pacific was.

[110 Lean]

Argentina appoints new secretary of 'national thought'
Cristina Kirchner appoints 'national thought' secretary, promoting criticism of the fascist overtones of the post

[Winston]

A Peronist having fascist overtones? Who woulda thunk?

[C. Anacreon]

Unpossible. I was told if only women were in charge of all countries, we'd all live together in harmony.

[Notorious G.K.C.]

"The 56-year-old trained philosopher"

"Back off - I've got a categorical imperative and I'm not afraid to use it!"

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

"Now let me correct you on a couple things, okay? Aristotle was not Belgian! The central message of Buddhism is not "Every man for himself!" And the London Underground is not a political movement! Those are all mistakes"

[Medical Physics Guy]

+1 stutter

[Corning]

The central message of Buddhism is not "Every man for himself!"

Zen Buddhism?

Also isn't Nirvana an individual goal not a community or social goal?

[Auric Demonocles]

Off for a weekend hike bright and early. I hope these new boots are broken in (though I will of course be bringing my running shoes in case).

[Ted S.]

Lucky you. I have to spend half the weekend driving to and from Massachusetts for a family gathering at my sister's place.

[Auric Demonocles]

I am going to spend about 5 hours driving across Massachusetts, if that makes it any better.

[grrizzly]

How can you spend driving five hours across Massachusetts? It takes less than 2.5 hours to drive through the entire MassPike.

[Auric Demonocles]

I've got to get home, too.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

More on Ireland's Catholic (Government Supported!) Homes for Fallen Women

"The discovery of a grave containing the remains of as many as 800 babies at a former home for unmarried mothers in Ireland is yet another problem for the Irish Catholic Church. The mother and baby home at Tuam in County Galway was run by the nuns of the Sisters of Bon Secours and operated between 1925 and 1961. It took in thousands of women who had committed the "mortal sin" of unwed pregnancy, delivered their babies and was charged with caring for them...

The warped code of honour behind the decades of silence had been inculcated by an all-powerful Catholic Church. For much of the late 20th century, the Irish civil authorities were in thrall to the hierarchy; Archbishop John Charles McQuaid threatened pulpit denunciations if the government contradicted his policies. So the state connived in the mother and baby homes, paying the nuns at Tuam and all the other homes a per capita rate for every inmate...

It is true that pregnant girls would have been shunned by their families and left with no one to turn to. But the fact is that the church itself had created the problem by the stigma it attached to unmarried sex ? and by its refusal to allow contraception or sex education in any form."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....g/?hpid=z2

[Notorious G.K.C.]

So much derp...

"the "mortal sin" of unwed pregnancy"

Yes, being pregnant is a mortal sin to these benighted Catholics. If fornication or adultery doesn't result in pregnancy, or if there's an abortion, the Church is like, "well, she's not pregnant, so no problem!"

"It is true that pregnant girls would have been shunned by their families and left with no one to turn to. But the fact is that the church itself had created the problem by the stigma it attached to unmarried sex"

Without the Church's intervention, families would have had an easygoing attitude toward out-of-wedlock pregnancies, just like among the Confucians of China!

[Brett L]

Just, don't. He already had a 100+ post fight about this in the AM Links. Its like John and MNG all over again.

[Ted S.]

You know, you can just ignore the bastards and scroll past the wall of text.

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

Amen.

[Corning]

I think it has more to do with the Irish then with being Catholics.

Not as if the Celts weren't killing babies before Patrick came along.

And it is not as if Catholics world wide are killing babies of unwed moms.

[Sansos]

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the whole catholic church being against the killing of infants thing really old, like the founding of Christianity old?

[Winston]

You guys are all a bunch of chicken-eating bundles of sticks.

[jesse.in.mb]

Villainy of the highest order!

Pool repairman makes grab for Nikki's tiara!

[Brett L]

"This video has been removed by the user"

[jesse.in.mb]

Damn it. It's a man giving a squirrel CPR.

[jesse.in.mb]

Alternate link.

[Brett L]

No mouth-to-mouth?

[trshmnster the terrible]

No, but you get a good reenactment around 1:15

[Winston]

"Villiany" others peasants. Stop it!

[Ted S.]

He wasn't posting about "Villiany".

[Winston]

Curse your pedantry and my spelling!

[Ted S.]

You're just jealous that the pool boy isn't making a grab for you. Or something like that. :-p

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

That squirrel would later destroy comment threads in two separate posts. I hope that pool guy is happy!

[Coeus]

"Skeptics" have solved the gun crisis.

We had another terrible person armed with a gun swagger into a peaceable place here in the Pacific Northwest, and he callously killed one person and wounded three others at Seattle Pacific University before he was stopped. The student who stopped him used a can of mace to do so. That was brilliant: why don't we endorse the use of non-lethal weaponry by our citizens? There's no need for guns. The whole NRA/gun-fondler argument for the necessity of self-defense is taken care of by weapons that don't kill people.

And the comments are priceless.

[BiMonSciFiCon]

When someone with a gun is 30 feet away from me, what I really want is some pepper spray.

SMRT take

[Brett L]

I've noticed that many people who are loud and proud of being capital-S "Skeptics" are skeptical about precisely the wrong things.

[BiMonSciFiCon]

I used to read phryngula (spelled wrong, but I'm not clicking his site to find out) and listen to the Skeptics Guide to the Universe until I realized they're skeptical about everything except for those things they want to be true politically.

For example, Steven Novella's review of Good Calories, Bad Calories was just awful. It didn't engage the science, it didn't address the problems with the studies that Taubes identifies, etc. But Dr. Novella didn't want to believe anything else, so he said that Taubes was engaging in "special pleading", which, as far as I can tell, he wasn't.

Also, PZ Myers seems like a horrible human being. Toxic is a word that comes to mind.

[Warty]

Bully also comes to mind.

[Sansos]

Does he play League?

[The Last American Hero]

They're skeptical about everything but global warming.

[Coeus]

They're skeptical about everything but global warming.

Also "TOP MEN" and secondhand smoke.

[Fr?ulein Nikki]

Dude I read it later in the day and didn't comment, but the skepchick thing you posted yesterday was a fucking horrorshow. The one about Texas Open Carry. It's like someone was all, "how can I be worse than PG Myers" and actually succeeded at it.

[Coeus]

It was actually the female half of a couple that one of the skepchicks was swinging with who started it. The skepchick jumped on with the one about fucking a gun. Clicked on her twitter and scanned the tweets. That was a buttload of crazy. She got drunk and stupid enough about it that the couple dumped her and sent her home to her husband (poor guy) and the skepchicks dropped her. How crazy do you have to be before those loonies cut ties?

[PD Scott]

So, in addition to "No Guns On Premises" signs, include a "If You Do Bring A Gun Only Shoot People If They're Within Ten Feet/Three Meters Of You" sign.

That'll fix it.

[Brett L]

All due respect to Mr. Meis, again for handling the situation with the materials at hand, but just how in the fuck would the Charles Whitman (Texas Tower shooter) situation be handled with pepper spray?

[PD Scott]

Pepper spray equipped drones operated by fully trained police officers, of course.

[PD Scott]

Don't you know by now how much it hurts them when you disturb their comforting fantasies with brutal facts, Brett?

[Brett L]

I'm a software guy with some time as an engineer. I have pretty much told someone that the pony they want is actually a fable that will never exist in the real world every day of my professional life. I'm starting to enjoy it.

[gimmeasammich]

Something I learned a while ago is that if the sales guys ever want to hear someone tell them "no" that they should come talk to the engineers.

[The Last American Hero]

Actually they should talk to the accountants. The engineers are usually supremely confident that the only thing holding them back from inventing a portable fusion generator is their lack of a budget and that WOW raid their guild has planned for the weekend.

[Christophe]

This may explain the Engineer/Libertarian overlap.

[Whahappan?]

Well duh, if only the NRA would allow common sense laws against gun violence, we wouldn't have to worry about people like Charles Whitman!

[Corning]

A gun can be non-lethal.

One shot from regular (not hollow point) 9mm round probably would not kill you.

[PD Scott]

Depending on where it hit you, how far away it was fired, etc. 9mm FMJ to the temple will kill you quite thoroughly.

[Warty]

I believe that more people have died from .22LR wounds than any other caliber.

[Corning]

Really?

How does that work?

Not doubting...just wondering why.

[PD Scott]

I've heard of kids dying from a BB to the heart. Some critical organs are just not all that tough.

[Warty]

The law of large numbers. Lots of criminals use cheap shitty .22 revolvers.

[Coeus]

Only friend of mine who was ever shot was killed by a 22 to the face.

[Warty]

Well that sucks.

Honestly, I'd rather take my chances with being shot in the face than the abdomen. There's a lot of bone to deflect the slug and a lot fewer big bleeders.

[Coeus]

I never got all the details, so i don't know if it happened in his case, but I've heard that the .22s don't usually exit the skull. They just bounce around inside.

(and I see Tundra down thread has heard this as well)

[Warty]

I've heard that too, but I doubt strongly that .22s are more lethal than larger calibers, or at least not with comparable ammunition. I could maybe see hollow point .22LR being as good as, say, military 9x17 FMJ, but I'd need to be convinced of that.

The lesson is: don't get shot.

[Coeus]

The lesson is: don't get shot.

It was ultimately avoidable. My friend just went nuts. It was a fucked up situation all around. He came home and found a guy kissing his wife goodbye on the front steps. Started beating the guy. The guy's friend was in the car down the street and came up and shot him when he wouldn't stop hitting the first guy. My friend died and the guy he was beating was in the hospital for 6 or 7 weeks. The guy who shot him went to jail for 20 years on a parole violation (possession of a gun), though the shooting was ruled justified.

[db]

Wow, that sucks.

[Ford Escort Cosworth]

I've read that .22 magnum is comparable to a .38. I've also read that a .38 is on the lower end of what you'd want to definitively incapacitate someone.

I also recall that the .22LR was responsible for the most deaths, and for the stated reason, quantity. I don't think anyone would say that a .45 is less lethal than a .22, for example.

[db]

You.mean 9x19, I assume.

[Warty]

No. 9x17.

[db]

Sorry, I assumed by your use of the word "military" you.meant 9mm para, which.is.9x19. 9x17 is .380 ACP, or 9mm Kurz, which is as far.as I.know not.in common military.use. it remains available in.some European.markets (Italy in particular) only.because it.is.not a "commonly used" military cartridge.

[jesse.in.mb]

You might have to apologize for getting in Dick Cheney's way though.

[GILMORE]

The 17 year old kid who murdered (execution-style) two english tourists a while back used a .22 revolver

Brits were notably pissed off that this story received no comment from Obama, who at the same time was speaking out about the 'tragedy' of Treyvon...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....ssion.html

[Rich]

the experience of having a potential murderer/rapist wandering my home while my wife and infant son slept is enough to make me reject your simplistic platitudes.

"A conservative is a liberal who has been mugged."

[SweatingGin]

Shatterface
6 June 2014 at 2:28 pm (UTC -5)
This wasn't a cop, it was a member of the public.

Endorsing the widespread carrying of 'non-lethal' weapons (i.e. weapons that only kill a minority of the time) on the slight chance you might encounter a spree killer and get close enough to spray him is still putting more weapons on the street.

Mace is useful for self-defence but also for incapacitating people for robbery or rape. If everyone is carrying it there's no way to establish criminal intent.

That's the one I was looking for! No, you can't have non-lethal weapons, it's still a weapon!

And bonus points for having an anarchist circle-A as his avatar and 1) drawing a distinction between cops and members of the public, 2) wanting to establish criminal intent based on possession of defensive weapons.

[Brett L]

wanting to establish criminal intent based on possession of defensive weapons

I think the point that weapons are tools, and therefore undergo no sudden transition from defensive to right-violating is poorly made, but correct. In the same way, hammers, chainsaws, and automobiles are similarly tools that may be used for productive ends or to injure or kill.

[SweatingGin]

I guess I don't see possession of a weapon as establishing criminal intent -- maybe based on some other crime at the same time...

Not a legal eagle, though.

[Christophe]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T.....Section_25

[Coeus]

Marcotte's joins in as well:

Which means that pepper spray now has a better track record in defeating a bad guy with a gun than good guys with guns do. This 2012 article in Mother Jones explains:

Not a single one of the 62 mass shootings we studied in our investigation has been stopped this way?even as the nation has been flooded with millions of additional firearms and a barrage of recent laws has made it easier than ever for ordinary citizens to carry them in public places, including bars, parks, and schools.

[Brett L]

Uh... what? How about the woman from the Luby's massacre whose parents were killed because she followed the Texas law at the time and left her gun in the car? Does that not count as a negative case? Sure is nice how if you start with a massaged dataset, you get what you want.

[Coeus]

I love the logic. Completely ignoring that if someone stops it, it doesn't become a mass shooting, so it's not in the data set.

[BiMonSciFiCon]

Yeah I thought that MJ study had been thoroughly debunked.

[Medical Physics Guy]

Tie.

[MJGreen]

Other obvious complication: shooters pick gun free zones. So more spaces are friendly to open or concealed carry; shooters simply go elsewhere.

And then there's the possibility that "mass shooters" get taken out before they can shoot en masse.

[Medical Physics Guy]

Um, what about would-have-been mass shootings that were never mass shootings because of someone else who was armed? I think there have been a few of those.

[Corning]

62 mass shootings we studied

how many single shootings did you study that involved killer shoots then gets shot by armed civilian?

Oh wait those would not be mass shootings then.

...

One thing i am skeptical of is all these mass shooters who shoot themselves. How easy would it be for a cop to shoot them then to cover it up? Or a civilian to shoot them and the cops to cover it up so the person stays out of the news and may have otherwise been made a criminal because the gun was not totally legal?

I may be being a bit tinfoil hat about this.

[Brandon]

You think if a cop shot a mass shooter he wouldn't want to take credit for it?

[Whahappan?]

Or that if a "civilian" who shot said mass shooter with a gun that wasn't totally legal wouldn't have the book thrown at him?

[B.P.]

Church mass shooting stopped by parishioner with gun...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2....._shootings

[Red Rocks Rockin]

Don't tell A Man, Duh about the Pearl High School shooting:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P.....l_shooting

Regardless, as Warty pointed out, these guys tend to fold pretty quick once they're confronted with any sort of violence, shooting or otherwise.

[The Late P Brooks]

John Meis, the student who disarmed the gunman who attacked Seattle Pacific University, killing one and injuring two others, is being hailed as a hero. Meis subdued the shooter with pepper spray as he was attempting to reload.

Vigilantism is no substitute for highly trained law enforcement professionals. Real cops would have laid down thousands of rounds of suppressive panic fire from cover. That kid doesn't know the first thing about OFFICER SAFETY.

[PD Scott]

It's disgusting how he made it home safely, making real cops look bad in the process.

[Rich]

to prevent damage to the government's ability to engage in confidential deliberations and to seek confidential legal advice.

WTF? *Somebody* has to see that shit, guys!

[Rufus J. Firefly]

"Presidents Barack Obama and Vladimir Putin had a brief chat in France at a luncheon for the 70th anniversary of D-Day."

Obama: Shout out to all those soldiers who fought on D-Day! Yeah, baby!

[Rich]

Presidents Barack Obama and Vladimir Putin had a brief chat

Probably the simultaneous uttering of "Fuck you, Mr. President."

[Auric Demonocles]

Oh perhaps "Let's talk again in November, when you have, ha, more freedom."

[Rich]

Beautiful.

[PD Scott]

Jobs ended or destroyed: US gun importer lays off 41, blames rules
A U.S. gun importer is blaming the White House for its laying off of 41 workers because the government blocked its plan to bring nearly $30 million worth of antique, American-made military rifles home from South Korea.
The White House's refusal to allow Century International Arms, of Vermont, to re-import the World War II-era M1 Garand rifles is an apparent result of new rules set up last summer concerning requests to ship military-grade firearms back into the United States.
"This importation was denied despite our explaining that the denial would harm the company and pointing out that there is no rational, gun-control reason to block the importation of these historic, 70-year-old firearms," the company said in a statement posted on its website Thursday.
...
Last month, Sen. Patrick Leahy of Vermont and Gov. Peter Shumlin sent Obama a letter asking him to allow Century Arms to import the guns.

[Warty]

Just when I thought I couldn't hate that fucker any more. I only have one fucking Garand, I need more.

[PD Scott]

Well, I'm not going to tell you to take a soldier hostage so you can negotiate a deal, but...

[Bobarian]

You could probably get 5, that way.

[Corning]

I asked around for a Rugar mini 14 and I get really weird looks from gun shopkeeps.

Is there something about carbines I don't know?

Maybe I just look like a crazy mass shooter and it doesn't matter what kind of rifle I ask for.

[Bobarian]

Are also asking for phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range?

[Bobarian]

Are 'you'

[Corning]

Hey just what you see pal.

[Brett L]

AT current gun prices, that's like what? 50 rifles?

[Brandon]

42 after taxes.

[GILMORE]

"en. Patrick Leahy of Vermont and Gov. Peter Shumlin sent Obama a letter asking him to allow"

Rule of Man, not of Law

Vaguely reminds me of how, on a Arab leader's birthday, you were allowed to grovel in front of him and ask favors

[Coeus]

Seattle police discover flaming bag of poop behind East Precinct

SEATTLE -- A quiet morning at the Seattle Police Department's East Precinct was interrupted Sunday when officers found a man burning a paper bag full of his own feces behind the building.

Officers were finishing up some paperwork at about 11 a.m. when someone alerted them to a fire in the alley outside, according to police.

When they went outside to investigate, officers found a man standing next to a burning paper bag in the alley just west of 12th Avenue and Pine Street.

After putting out the fire, police began questioning the 31-year-old man who was standing next to it. He quickly admitted to starting the blaze, saying he had "taken a (poop) and was trying to burn the (poop) away," according to police.

The man also pleaded ignorance that it was against the law to burn bags of feces behind police stations.

Officers arrested the man, who has not been named, and booked him into King County Jail for reckless burning. Police say a Seattle Fire Department crew "mercifully came and hosed down the alley."

I wonder what the statute is?

[GILMORE]

"The man also pleaded ignorance that it was against the law to burn bags of feces behind police stations."

I LOVE THIS GUY

"I swear, it seemed like the right place at the time!"

[Bobarian]

He got arrested because somebody went out and tried to stomp out the fire.

[B.P.]

These guys had the fire department come around and clean it up?

[Brandon]

Resource-wasting assholes.

[Whahappan?]

Meh, it's not their resources.

[jesse.in.mb]

Hugh Jackman, overly excited and bouncing like a kangaroo to drum up interest in the Tony awards (sorry bub, not gonna happen).

BUT he's in the shower for a bit of it, so, you're welcome.

[Medical Physics Guy]

Passing along to my Jackman-worshipping wife

[Winston]

"Jackman" is so misogynist and cisist. How about "Jackperson"? Or "Jackit"? Or "the Jacket"?

[C. Anacreon]

Doesn't Wolverine call all strangers "bub"?

[jesse.in.mb]

Yup. It was intentional. Good catch.

[Corning]

He calls Scott Summers 'bub' also...not just strangers.

[C. Anacreon]

I'd call Scott Summers 'bub' too. Stuck-up little whiny golden boy that he is.

[Corning]

Just cuz he got Jean instead of you does not make him a dick...

He just won, not his fault the rest of us lost.

[C. Anacreon]

Summers thinks he's so cool, with his Phi Gamma Delta sunglasses and classic jock look. What does he know of the smoldering torment of a little hirsute guy with a lupine sense of smell, adamantine skeleton and the inability to die?

[Corning]

Also golden boy?

He is an orphan.

[jesse.in.mb]

Think of how useful he'd be in the mines!

[robc]

Ive mentioned it before, but as Federal agencies go, the TTB is hands down the most user friendly.

Which is a damn low bar to clear, but still.

They just added a bunch of ingredients to the "traditional" list. As long as you brew with traditional ingredients, no formula approval was needed, only label approval. They have added most reasonable fruits and spices to the traditional list.

Previously, if you wanted to, say, make a wit beer with coriander and orange peel, you had to apply for the formula approval (~74 days) and then label approval (~17 days) before selling it. Now, for most reasonable ingredients, you can skip the formula approval.

[robc]

Honestly, the TTB is all about excise tax. Anything that makes the process of paying the tax easier is good for them.

They keep making changes that take other stuff off their plates. With nearly 3000 breweries, labels and formula approval were backing them up.

[B.P.]

They are very helpful to me on the telephone. Their online .pdf forms are poorly coded, though, and the label approvals are sometimes funny because someone there doesn't know the applicable federal law at times.

[Brandon]

WTF is the TTB?

[R C Dean]

IDK

[Winston]

Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade Bureau?

[Brett L]

He was.

[gimmeasammich]

Well, GW *was* six foot twenty and weighed a fucking ton.

This is the second reference to that song in the last couple of days. Was that you the other day that made the first reference? I think it was a discussion about which president was the manliest.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Is he a lab?

He is, with some boxer thrown in. Good dog but getting up in years now. The groundhog population is probably set to make a comeback.

[db]

Can someone.please.enlighten.me on the.source of.the George.Washington bear-fucking thing?

[jesse.in.mb]

Booze is expensive and plentiful. Musical choices haven't been made yet, but we are taking requests.

[gimmeasammich]

What kind of punk rock? Andy Dick in News Radio punk rock, or Fear, Dead Boys, X-Ray Spex punk? If it's the latter, I would respectfully like to join. Also I love baked goods.

[Auric Demonocles]

I think it was a discussion about which president was the manliest.

That was the discussion where it came up.... just like his like, thirty goddamn dicks.

[gimmeasammich]

Thought so. Work has been a little slow lately, so I've had lots of time to browse the comments.

[jesse.in.mb]

We need EDG to select the music, I'm thinking.

There is wisdom in this. Welcome to camp jesse, new administrative aide.

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

Hmmm....booze AND baked goods....dang.

[Mad Scientist]

When I get home from work and I'm dyin' of thirst
All I want is more beer
I run into the kitchen and I tear off my shirt
All I want is more beer
Open up a six pack I'll be downin' it first
All I want is more beer
I can open up and finish faster than you
All I want is more beer
Gonna kill a case or maybe two
All I want is more beer
If there was no more beer then what would we do
All I want is more beer

[gimmeasammich]

Oh man, now I'm excited! I saw the Descendents a couple of years ago in Chicago and it kicked ass. I'm looking forward to seeing them again soon. Possibly Riot Fest.

[Swiss Servator, CH yeah!]

I like beer 'cause it is good
I drink beer because I should
If there was a song to sing
I sing it and beer you bring

I drink beer when I am sad
'Cause the beer, it makes me glad
Now there's nothing left to say
So let's go drink beer

Beer is good!
Beer is good!
Beer is good!
And stuff!
Beer is good!
Beer is good!
Beer is good!
(Let's go drink some) Beer! (beer!)
Beer! (Beer!)
Beer! (Beer!)
Beer! (Beer!)
Beer! (Beer!) Beer! (Beer!)

When it's warm, it tastes real crappy
But cold beer will make me happy
When I throw up on the floor
I can go and drink some more

They say beer will make me dumb
It are go good with pizza
Now that we have drunk some beer
Let's go drive a car

Beer is good!
Beer is good!
Beer is good!
And stuff!
Beer is good!
Beer is good!
Beer is good!
(Let's go drink some) Beer! (beer!)
Beer! (Beer!)
Beer! (Beer!)
Beer! (Beer!)
Beer! (Beer!) Beer! (Beer!)

Uh, dude? I think you've had enough)
No!

Let's go drink some beer!

(I am drunk, drunk is me, I am drunk...wheee!) [x3]
(Belch!)

[db]

OK, a quick googling cleared.that up, and.I.have a new favorite.song.

[Mad Scientist]

No TV and no beer make Homer something something.

[gimmeasammich]

Go crazy?