Reason.tv: Occupy LA - The Pro-Government Protesters?

Los Angeles became the first city to officially endorse the Occupy movement when its city council unanimously passed a resolution affirming the group's right to camp out on lawns in front of city hall. The council members had glowing words for the movement.

"These are things worthy of protest. And I thank you for speaking out and helping move the debate forward," said City Councilman Paul Koretz.

Many of the protesters had similarly positive words for their local politicians, as well as local law enforcement. Reason.tv was on the scene to ask protesters about their general attitudes towards government power.  Is Occupy Los Angeles (and Occupy Wall Street) simply a pro-government movement, or is there room for libertarian sentiment within it?

The answer is… well, it's complicated. While we spoke to a few small government libertarians at the event, others eschewed anti-government rhetoric and said that criticism of the Federal Reserve is a libertarian "pet issue" distracting from the real matter at hand: economic justice. 

The Occupy movement remains politically diverse and difficult to pigeonhole, and many of its members seem proud to remain fiercely independent, saying they will not allow politicians or unions to co-opt their movement. 

Produced by Zach Weissmueller and Tim Cavanaugh.  Shot by Paul Detrick and Tracy Oppenheimer. Edited by Weissmueller. About 5 minutes long.

Go to reason.tv for downloadable versions and subscribe to Reason.tv's YouTube channel  for automatic notifications when new material goes live.

Comments

[Hugh Akston]

I'll say it again: politicians have no interest in co-opting this movement. Neither side wants to alienate their corporate donors by siding too strongly with anti-corporate protestors.

And Team Blue knows that the Occupados will drop their marble in the Obama jar next November, so who cares what they do between now and then?

[Paul]

I'm not sure what you mean. Define "co-opting". If you mean, put their money where their mouth is? Ie, do more than pay lip service? Maybe, time will tell. But here in the uber-progressive west, Politicians are falling all over themselves to align with the OWS.

[Hugh Akston]

Co-opting in this case means adorning yourself with OWS rhetoric to get (re)elected, then back to business as usual once you get sworn in.

But if you're a politician, I suppose it makes sense to say "yeah I support those brave protesters" before you go off to have a power lunch with a 1%er. It's not like they will actually accomplish anything anyway.

[Joshua Corning]

Neither side wants to alienate their corporate donors by siding too strongly with anti-corporate protestors.

I am just waiting for the iTunes Occupy Wallstreet music downloads and the mass produced t-shirts to come out.

One thing you got to love about corporations and what they co-opt; they just don't give a fuck.

[Joshua Corning]

Neither side wants to alienate their corporate donors by siding too strongly with anti-corporate protestors.

Obama seemed to have no trouble bitching about Wall Street and bailing them out.

he also had no trouble subsidizing GE so that that they ended up paying no taxes while complaining about the rich not paying their fair share.

he further had no problem giving the insurance company a huge windfall by requiring everyone to buy their product with ObamaCare while complaining about insurance company profits.

Your claim is easily dismissed with recent historical facts.

[Paul]

Your claim is easily dismissed with recent historical facts.

Wha?! Did you even grok the meaning of Hugh's post? Obama may pay lip-service to anti-corporate protesters, but he never actually alienated the corporations themselves.

That's how Obama can get away with bitching about fat-cat bonuses on TV, while wiring the company 40 billion dollars from a back-office when the cameras are off.

[Tulpa]

Maybe not, but the unions sure as hell do.

[Hedley Lamarr]

Shut up, you Teutonic twat!

[Jordan]

criticism of the Federal Reserve is a libertarian "pet issue" distracting from the real matter at hand: economic justice.

Useful idiot protester is useful idiot. Good luck with your economic justice supporting an institution that only exists to prop up bankers and the wealthy and to devalue people's savings.

[Eduard van Haalen]

All this talk about medical marijuana is simply a libertarian pet issue distracting from the real issue of government abuse of power.

[Federal Dog]

"Good luck with your economic justice supporting an institution that only exists to prop up bankers and the wealthy and to devalue people's savings."

Do you honestly think these people have any clue what the federal reserve is?

[Joshua Corning]

OT bonus Friday funny.

Go to drudge and see all the people making the same hand gesture.

Be quick that site changes quickly and often.

[Seb Vettel]

Clearly they are just copying my style
http://www.enciclopedia.com.pt.....x323,0.jpg

[#OccupyMTrachetenberg'sVagina]

We demand she be hotter than she turned out!!!!!

[S']

its mainly 0 supporters - a put up job - lets get some OT for the boys in blue - and something for the SEIU thugs to keep in practice with since 2012 isnt that far away.

[?]

Neither side wants to alienate their corporate donors by siding too strongly with anti-corporate protestors.

Right...?

One side and its "corporate donors" know that "anti-corporate" "protestors" are polymorphously malicious fucktard tools begging to be put to any use they're told?as long as they think they're hurting somebody. Which is why the "movement" is wholly owned and operated by that side. So yeah, that side won't bother to "co-opt" it.

"Dude, are you masturbating?"
"No I'm co-opting my hand and penis LOL."

And the other side also knows who's whose, so they won't bother, either. It's not their dick to jerk.

[Pro Libertate]

Anyone who is pro-government right now is a complete idiot. Or has a vested interest in the government continuing to take us off the cliff.

[Paul]

I don't know why Cavanaugh posted a question mark after the post title. It should be a period or at least an explanation point. They're absolutely pro-government. As I said yesterday:

"And that's the feeling I get from OWS, government isn't big enough, doesn't go far enough, isn't nationalizing enough, isn't bailing out enough or is bailing out the "wrong" people-- not that bailouts as a concept are wrong, that the social welfare net isn't big and expansive enough, more free healthcare, more free schools, more free access to everything-- and in every sense, the word 'free' means "government-provided"."

This OWS movement is shockingly pro-government. And what's worse, in the case of both L.A. and Seattle (not widely reported) they're not only pro-government, but they're actually (dare I say 'literally') begging for the recognition of the state.

I don't care what anyone says, protesting is much different than it was in the 60s. It's much more... European now.

[Hugh Akston]

I don't care what anyone says, protesting is much different than it was in the 60s. It's much more... European now.

Yeah, this feels a lot more like a French greve generale after the government tries to raise the working week to 31 hours than it does a Civil Rights march against Jim Crow laws.

[Paul]

greve generale

I like that. And it kind of sums it up. It's a list of grievances like what prisoners would strike against. Prisoners don't demand their freedom, they demand more TV privileges, more comfortable uniforms, better food.

Fuck me, that's it. We've essentially admitted we're prisoners of our own progressive, liberal governments. We don't demand release or the walls be torn down, we're just demanding better conditions. Great, now I'm really depressed.

[Tulpa]

We?

[Libertarian2]

I love this analogy. Kudos.

[mad libertarian guy]

^^THIS^^

They aren't "protesting", but petitioning the government to take more shit from productive people and transfer it to them.

They're nothing but a bunch of pussies who are looking to have armed thugs in government doing their stealing for them.

[Tulpa]

To some extent this is true, but their opposition to the bailouts definitely doesn't fit that mold.

[Jeffersonian]

If they were truly upset about things like TARP, they'd be rallying around the party that voted most heavily against it: Republicans (and actually had a strong majority against TARP in the House).

[Federal Dog]

They are in no way opposed to bailouts.

On the contrary: They are openly demanding that we pay all school debts they ran up in full for them.

[Lanceman]

Looks to me like the blind leading the stupid.

The overwhelming majority of these dumbfucks will be voting 'rat next year.

Fucking smelly, lazy vermin.

[Joshua Corning]

I don't know why Cavanaugh posted a question mark after the post title.

Cuz Mr blind man there are many anti-government protesters in the fucking video...

[Paul]

Cuz Mr blind man there are many anti-government protesters in the fucking video...

No there aren't.

First interviewee: Incoherent

00:59 The government recognition is a vibrant expression of 1st amendment rights/We've got a great relationship with the LA PD.

1:09 Very happy about "support from government.
1:14 "It's great we're working with the government"

1:31 Libertarian doesn't trust government

1:37 Not anti politics or politician

1:50 doesn't want government co-opting message

2:01 Refers to others' anti-fed message-- not interested in that-- only interested in "economic justice"

2:17 Zionist jews, not the federal government control the banks. Run Jews out of the country.

3:15 stand up to corporations, more regulation needed

4:02 Person holding sign "Obama Lied"

It wasn't in any way hotbed of people distrustful of government or even protesting it. I only counted to interviewees/statements specifically not trusting or demanding "less government".

And, going well beyond the Reason video, almost everything I hear from street interviews demands more government and explicitly craves government recognition.

[Federal Dog]

Fucking idiots do not even grasp that they have already been assimilated.

[I am the 0.000000003246%]

Can't wait to see LA city council unanimously pass a resolution affirming the Tea Party's right to camp out on lawns in front of city hall.

[mad libertarian guy]

Dude. I LOLed so hard I about passed out.

[Tulpa]

I know, seriously?

Some commenters have pointed to the difference in coverage in the news of this thing compared to TP. Why not test it explicitly? Why doesn't the TP launch an "occupation" drive and see how the media reacts?

[Lanceman]

Because we like to shower and even if some of us are unemployed, we like to be productive.

[Tan]

"the difference in coverage in the news of this thing compared to TP."

The OWS folk can appear on camera when protesting corporate welfare in 2011 while the TP are nowhere to be seen?

Oh you must have meant the coverage of TP back when they had the same principles, before it became a wholly managed PR exercise of News Corporation.

[BigT]

Just because a few clowns jumped out in front of the parade does NOT mean that the many Tea Partiers are not still anti-govt, pro-freedom. Note that the rallies have died down since the 2010 election when quite a few TPers were elected. Pandering to the TP does not mean the TP has been co-opted, it means they have become a force to be reckoned with.

[Federal Dog]

The last thing fiscal protestors look to do is occupy anything. They are looking to free themselves from illiberal, uneducated, and greedy government functionaries.

[Jeffersonian]

Cue the Twilight Zone theme

["Loot your neighbor's savings"]

.....but probably not much protest over Obama's latest invasion of an African country. Uganda, threat to the USA!

[Progressive Fucktard]

Why protest invasions and shit when their is some wacko teabagger who is trying to hold out on us?

[Yeah,,,,]

...bitterly clinging to a 401K plan.

[Abersouth]

Love the choice of music for this piece.

And was that Lebowski in the government hall? Or his brother? Awesome gut.

[Joshua Corning]

I love LA.

WE LOVE IT!!!

[Joshua Corning]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBOQiMxwk1o

[John Goodman]

Shut the fuck up, Donny!

[R C Dean]

A more disgusting spectacle than this mutual tongue-bath of parasites, half-wits, useful idiots, and cynical tools I would not care to encounter. Outside of a SugarFree post, anyway.

[Gojira]

I agree, but I think we all need to remember: if push ever really comes to shove, there's more of these people (who want something for nothing from the gov't teat) than there are of us.

I think I'll stay put in Texas for awhile yet.

[Paul]

I think I'll stay put in Texas for awhile yet.

So you're occupying Texas?

[A fan]

We got guns.

[Joshua Corning]

http://www.arlingtoncardinal.c.....ations.jpg

So why hasn't anyone made a "And Not a Single Fuck Was Given That Day" inspirational poster of this yet?

[Proprietrist]

Surely the LA City Council can't find some obscure code violation they're committing? Nah. Let's go find some house with too many trees and put a lien on their property.

[Paul]

McGinn in Seattle is straddling the fence so hard, his nuts are going to be bruised. He's speechifying to the protesters, siding with them, fist-pumping and telling them to fight, while at the same time asking them to move out of West Lake Park, but please move to City Hall where we've got free donuts potty facilities and a masseusse.

[Sudden]

You can give people $100,000 worth of education in dramatic arts, but you sure as shit can't give people a brain.

[XM]

I'm genuinely curious as to why the Reason interviewer did NOT challenge the notion that the government "deregulated" the banks and other lending institutions. Reason used to be breathless in its proclamation that George Bush indeed INCREASED regulation in general.

When the red head complains that the banks made bad loan, she should have been corrected on the SPOT. The banks financed her expensive education and spread easy money around the very people trying to occupy random places that doesn't even come close to striking at the heart of Wall Street.

If you like getting welfare checks and financial assistance from the government, then you also like the banks approving you for easy loans or credit cards even when you don't have a viable income. But unlike government you actually have to pay back the bank. Ooops, there goes the economy.

[Tulpa]

They don't need a repeat of the disastrous reason.tv Matt Damon interview.

[Jeffersonian]

Wait, are you saying the $150,000 put into that MA in Post Modern Feminist LitCrit isn't going to pay off big? I thought Feministing was hiring these days?

[hmm]

Conveying truth with symbols motherfucka, that's what I do.

[sevo]

"Los Angeles became the first city to officially endorse the Occupy movement.."

SF did the same with the 'homeless movement' some years back; 'officially' allowing bums to live in the park opposite the city hall.
It lasted about a year or so until it attracted bums from near and far, the park became a cesspool and a number of the bums decided *their* violence was superior to the city's.
Then it ended, dispersing newly increased population of bums into the surrounding neighborhoods, to the 'delight' of those trying to live there.

[James Anderson Merritt]

Two words: Occupy Congress. Just sayin'

[They can't do that....]

....that's GOVERNMENT Property.....oh wait.......

[dave y.]

The main question is there room for Libertarian in OWS, the answer is NO!

The libertarian party no longer cares for liberty of the individual, unless the individual is a business owner!
the problem with our economy is very simple!
we have to many MORONS that own businesses that have no idea how to make a profit, they are either to busy trying to close the BIG deal and miss on the great number of small deals that could have made MORE money with a little bit more work, and then there are those that can't sell to save their lives and give the farm away on evedry sale, and these are the MAIN reasons that workers are paid less then a living wage, and why our economy is failing, MORONS don't make money, they waste time and pretend ttheir good at what they do!
this is also the main problem in most Corporations and why they have had to do such stupid things, because the hire morons, and they do that because MORONS don't ask questions and comment on how the BOSS has no idea of what hes talking about, their called "YES MEN"!
the MAIN cause of economic problems is stupidity, and this Nation has allowed the MORONS to take over, simply because they call them selves GOOD CHRISTIANS, and the reason the are good christians is that they are VERY IGNORANT of the REAL WORLD!
Now I would like one of you to explain how a true moron makes a good business leader, because that is what the christian right and the libertarians think is progress, giving those from the shallow end of the genetic pool the power to tell others how they should live, extremely un- american!